tv Smerconish CNN June 27, 2015 6:00am-7:01am PDT
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going to miss you. so touching. >> me wrote the song because basically he's not going to remember. do stay here. "smerconish" is up for you next. >> we'll be back here at 10:00 eastern for the "cnn newsroom." stay with us we'll be back in an hour. i'm michael smerconish. welcome to the program. finally, a break through in the three-week manhunt for thescaped prisoners in new york. richard matt has been shot and killed and the search is intensifying for the other fugitive david sweat. on friday officials say that a team of agents from the federal customs and border protection agency found matt in the woods in malone new york after he fired a shot at the back of a camping trailer. officers heard him cough as he fled on foot and a federal agent killed him when matt arm would a shotgun, refused orders to put his hands up. and now more than 1,000 law enforcement officers are closing
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in on david sweat. law enforcement sources saying authorities believe he's contained in a perimeter set up around him. cnn's polo sandoval is live in malone new york with the very latest. polo was david sweat with richard matt when he was killed? >> you know michael, that is a very crucial question here for investigators and they can't really quite answer that yet. we told you or at least we reported earlier that there was a certain set of tracks located in and around the area where richard matt was shot by federal agents yesterday. but investigators aren't quite sure who they belong to. as they move forward with this manhunt if david sweat is hiding out in and around the wooded area you see behind me here in upstate new york they're confident they'll find them. moving forward with great caution as this man is a convicted cop killer and they are treating this man as armed, dangerous and even growing more desperate by the minute.
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>> i asked the question for obvious reasons because how can law enforcement believe they have guy number two incircled if they don't know whether he was with guy number one at the time they took out guy number one? >> what is interesting here. the closest thing from an explanation from officials is they don't have evidence to suggest that they left the queria and they don't have evidence to suggest that he is here. they have really this hardest piece of evidence and this confrontation also with richard matt that turned deadly for that escaped inmate. so now, investigators are working on that as this potential lead. just a few moments ago we witnessed this seemingly endless parade of patrols cars because they plan on saturating this area. not only to track down sweat. not many people staying home when the search shifted closer to this portion of upstate new york. officers determined to stay on
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the trail of this individual whether he's here in a neighboring state or policytentially left the country. >> what's the working theory as to why he would have fired on a civilian? >> that's another very critical question here, too. the reports that we're getting michael, is that this individual in some kind of recreational vehicle heard the shot and then noticed some kind of a bulletholebullet bullethole on that vehicle and then called authorities. which is yet to be explained though, is that if that shot actually came from richard matt. i think that is a critical piece of information that is missing. do investigators believe that it was actually richard matt that opened fire and, of course why that was, i think that is one of those very critical questions we'll be asking today as we expect to hear more from officials and, of course i expect to get more information here throughout the weekend. >> polo sandoval thanks for the report. i want to turn now to our focus on the hunt. joining me is retired chief
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deputy u.s. marshal and former member of u.s. marshal special operations group matthew fogg and cnn law norsement analyst and former fbi assistant director tom fuentes. tom, where richard matt was killed would seem to be confirmation of the total alliance that these two had on joyce mitchell on their escape. all the planning to get out of prison but it is clear their fate was in her hands for a pickup. >> i agree, michael. it looks like they didn't have a plan "b" or plan "c." we would have assumed that if it took a year to get out of that prison they would have had a, b, c in plans once they came up out of that manhole. that is surprising. >> matthew, it reminds me in several respects in the hunt for bin laden. is it a capture or kill mission?
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>> i think it is a capture mission. if they told matt to put his hands up and he had a gun in his hands, of course you're going to take evasive action because this man has been known to kill before. that would fall in line. my concern again, though are they together? my theory has been that they probably separated before now. that's my theory. but, again, they would have had to have killed him if he didn't comply knowing his background. >> matthew, i know no two of these cases are alike, but typically do you see fugitives who are in pairs splitting up or sticking together? >> well the major cases that went over the wall too, that i know of that i know him and him and cologne split up when they went over the wall and got away and i know the michael lucas case out of texas, those guys split up. they have known some prisoners to stay together and go on a crime spree. but normally if they really want to get away they split up. >> tom, of course two civilians
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have been charged in connection with the prison break. i'm wondering how their fate might be impacted by whether sweat is taken dead or alive. if he's taken alive, presumably he'd be able to offer law enforcement an explanation as to what transpired here and how they got out. >> yes, he could. a lot will be learned from him. even though people say he has no reason to talk. they can't plea bargain anything. already be in lock down 23 hours a day and all of that. however, these type of personalities are usually extremely narcissistic. this kind of sociopathology or psychopathology. it's all about them they're selfish and you can get them to talk just based on their ego to say, hey, you had this great plan. it was just unbelievable. you were able to get out of there. how did you do it? tell us your story and oftentimes people like this will tell you their story. if he's alive to tell it. >> you know tom, to your point of the narcissism involved with
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individuals like this. i have been wondering, will he take himself out and you may have just put your finger on the explanation to why he wouldn't. if he's in that wooded area and he knows his colleague was killed by law enforcement, he knows his days are numbered. >> i would think so. i think it will still play out. will it be suicide by cop? will he surrender? you know so many people over the years that said i'm never going to be taken alive. i'm going to shoot it out and then go along like little puppies when the police surround them. we just don't know. that will be his determination whether he walks away from this alive or dead. >> matthew, might the fact that we now have a dead body of guy number one assist the dogs in hunting for hunting for guy number two? is that cadaver a value of picking opscent assuming they were together? >> if the scent was on the guy, yeah. but, obviously, i don't know if that's what they have here. we have to realize that probably law enforcement is not giving us everything they got because
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there are a lot of sort of ambiguous things coming out of this thing that we cannot being on scene determine. but i would say to you, yeah. if there is a scent there. they would have picked it up. the other piece, too, if they catch this guy, one thing he will negotiate is that he will not be in the hole for the rest of his life. that's another reason he might talk and tell them more information if they catch him. >> tom, noted so many times this is a movie and how allegedly a correction's officer was compromised by one of these guys and traded him tools for certain of his paintings. how common do you think the behavior is not to this extent. not to this extreme, but behavior like this where individuals are cooped and corrupted by those that they are supposed to be protecting protecting meaning not to escape. >> i think it happens, you know on kind of a frequent basis. not that they're helping him escape but just this kind of
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relationship. you know it's not just the inmates that are locked up in this prison. it's the corrections officers also. it's the staff and other people. employees, handman and you name it that work in this facility. they have to work together. especially with budget cuts as the staff becomes more short-handed. they need to ensure peace in the valley with the inmates in there. and they will exchange favors and they will start to establish some kind of a trust even though crazy as that sounds a little bit of a trust relationship. >> matthew fogg final question. given your long tenure with the marshal service. do you worry, we're not the only ones. there are prisons all across the country that have television sets. there are prisoners watching this thing unfold. do you worry this is now going to be a motivater foreivater for other prisoners to try schemes like this? >> the bottom line a lot of prisons right now are a little upset because everything that they had is probably being
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scrutinized right now. i don't see it that way. when you talk about the millions of prisoners in this country and the number that actually go over the wall this is an anomaly. bottom line is you know that prison or all prisons right now are on special alert, check everything. but i agree with tom 100%. in these prisons, a lot of times guards have to work with these prisoners so sometimes you might let them dolittle things turn your head break the protocol. but you're not trying to think they are trying to escape like the woman that assisted these guys and getting hack saw blades. that's sort of like an anomaly guards trying to help somebody escape. >> matthew fogg tom fuentes, thank you, gentlemen. >> thank you, michael. believe it or not, there are people who are rooting for these bad guys. but why? >> we'll explore the psychology on why some people would side with killers. and the supreme court made history yesterday ruling that same-sex couples must be allowed to marry in all 50 states.
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welcome back. this week on my sirius xm program. i wondered if anyone in my audience were rooting for the two killers that escaped from a new york maximum security facility facility. that might seem crazy given richard matt and david sweat are two horrible low lives, convicted killers. well you might be surprised by what some callers had to say. listen to this one. >> deep down inside every time there is a news release saying we're so close, we've got dna. we know where they are. we're hot on their tail and then another few days go by. inside i sort of have this warm feeling that the authorities are just chasing their tails. a small part of me is pulling for the bad guys. >> several people also tweeted at me their support for the prisoners. joanna said ha ha unfortunately my husband and i in that group.
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quite odd considering he is a retired cop. lol can't explain. and ken tweeted and said i hope they are not caught and go on to live crime-free lives. what might make people root for killers? joining me now is psychologist dr. gail salts. hopefully not just a quirk to my audience. >> definitely not. i heard this from patients during the week and really what we're talking about is it's not people who truly want murderers to be free among us. it's a fantasy and an identification with people who are in prisoned. so we all can feel imprisoned in our lives in our jobs or maybe in our families. you are going through the grind and you retlitlate to the idea that you feel entrapped and you want to reescape. a mixed fantasy. not a person who killed and
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decapitated to be a person among us. but an idea that someone who is imprisoned like i feel could get away. could be free. could escape even if it's the wrong thing to do. >> i thought maybe when i was listening to those calls and when i was reading the tweets that it was like an you to authority. >> some people have a rivalry like you know, to the man. and the idea that these guys could be given it to the man, as it were definitely is a fantasy for some. so it depends on sort of your background. what's going on with you. why you might identify with these guys or identify with the idea that they could get away from or even make look foolish an authority figure. >> is part of it that i don't want to minimize what they've done. they're despicable and i hope frankly i hope guy number two gets what guy number one got. this is a good show and reminiscent of a lot of tv and movies. didn't we see this in "the
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fugitive fugitive" and i don't want it to end. >> art imitates art and art imitates life. it's thrilling. we all have that thrill in movies often watching the bad guys getting away or the escape or the chase. that is a very compelling you know rendition to see. so, we can be involved in that. it reminds us, even of nightmares. think about bad dreams we have. you're trying to run. you can't move. what's going on. it's the drama. so it takes out of it the what is the crime that actually happened? of course we also have fantasies of people getting punished for things they do. but with this stream is a very common stream of the idea of escape and then narrow escape. they're hiding in the woods. do we hear them cough? what happened in that moment? >> initially we were wondering, how could the woman, joyce mitchell allegedly have slept with one or both of these
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individuals? how could they be so persuasive? now, a second individual who was charged and he was apparently trading tools in return for the paintings of one of these guys. what does it say about their level of persuasion? >> pretty high. which, by the way, is not surprising. so as earlier in the show someone mentioned it's very common for people who are in prison who have committed these kinds of crimes to have sociopathy and part of that is a charm and an ability to manip manipulate and an ability to zero in on what you want and what you need and give it to you and they do that you know in a guilt-free remorseless way. >> you see these paintings that we're showing. so here's another question that i want to ask you. >> yes. >> apparently the guy who traded the tools, whose name escapes me then shipped a painting to a woman in florida who sold it for 2 grand on ebay. persuming the personat the person
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who did this knew -- it is like hitler's art. who wants to own this? >> it is like getting a little piece of evil. so we feel in our day-to-day lives, sometimes many of us feel powerless and the idea that we could own, but not be but own a little bit of something vicious or something evil. something that has power. that we kind of want at some level. we don't want to go out and murder somebody. but the fantasy of being that kind of powerful person who takes what they want who gets it all. who, you know has no regard for someone else. actually that that is a fantasy. now, you have to realize fantasy is different from action. completely different. >> you're still scaring me. you're still scaring me. some who are rooting for these guys and want to own their art. >> there is a difference between thought and action. we all have sometimes bad thoughts heinous thoughts.
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they might even be about a wish to have some power and to do something bad. but we are human beings and we don't act on them. some of us do act on them. that's why i'm back here talking to you about things that go on. but most of us are not going to act, especially if we could understand that thought. where it comes from. analyze it for ourselves and we have less of an urge to act on it. that's what i do in my office. that's very important. the separation of fantasy and thought. don't be frightened of those. >> i think whoever bought the painting needs your treatment. i hope they call you. >> not necessarily at all. maybe to vicariously enjoy that and keep that separate and live a very wonderful and upright life. >> appreciate your analysis. coming up, front pages all across the nation are reporting on yesterday's landmark supreme court ruling on same-sex marriage. famed weather man sam champion and his husband join me to talk about the historic decision, next.
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welcome back. celebrations ransh ss rang out among same-sex couples in the aftermath of a ruling that legalized same-sex marriage in all 50 states. justice anthony kennedy was the swing vote and delivered the majority opinion in what was a 5-4 ruling. famed weatherman sam champion has already called yesterday the second best day of his life, the first was the day that he married his husband. i'megeum ium eager to get his thoughts. sam champion is here with his husband, reuben. sam, earlier in your career you had to worry about the public finding out that you were gay. here you are today. you are on cnn with your husband. doesn't that say it all? >> it pretty much does say it all. yeah it does. the way you said it it kind of
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hurts to still hear it because there weren't gay people in television when i started television. i was afraid if people knew about my life that i wouldn't get the opportunity to do what i love to do. to succeed in this career. and at times it was difficult. and now it is not. >> reuben he said yesterday or yesterday in a tweet that it was the second best day of his life and that the first best day, most special day of his life was the day that he married you. >> that was really sweet. and i agree. that's what today is the second best day of my life too. such an important decision and we cannot forget so many people fight for us for so long time. to be able to be here today and talk to you. >> i remember sitting in my car. one of those great radio moments. you were explaining to howard stern what it was like to come out to your father and to have him be not so accepting. i remember the story. he was a big guy and a marine.
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>> career marine. >> might it have been easier for people in your position and might it be for people going forward for individuals in your position with this decision? because now there is the united states supreme court saying same-sex marriage is okay. >> yeah. i think because, again, we all know what we're taught. and i don't blame my father and the people of his generation who grew up believing what they learned. what i want is a new generation of americans to understand that there is no shame to be felt here. this isn't, we are no different from anyone else. we are people who have hopes and dreams and fears and we want to love and if you want a family you should be able to have a family. you should be able to live in this country happy. and i think that yeah i think this new generation will get that opportunity because of a day like this. >> you were able before he passed to put it all together. a time period went off the clock, not unlike others in your
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situation where you just weren't speaking. >> it's true. i kind of knew because he was a brilliant man and i told him that at the time. i said to him, i said you are a lot smarter than you sound right now. i know you'll figure this out. i don't really need to i got a family. at that time i had friends in new york. so i'll let you figure it out and you'll get back to me as soon as you do. and he kind of did. you know we had the talk. and, you know, we understood each other. and it was, that was a great day for me, as well. >> easier for two of you because you're a celebrity couple? >> not at all. >> that's funny. i don't think either one of us think of ourselves that way. >> first of all, we don't think of ourselves in that way. and i don't think it is easy. of course it's easier as a couple who live in new york or atlanta or miami than for a
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couple who live in little city of kansas or in a small town. for them it's really difficult because we cannot have that big city because we have -- >> we have a support group. we have a support group. in a big city you do. you have friends and people just like you. i come from paducah, kentucky, and proud of that and proud of the way i grew up. but it is a lonely place to be if you're different and not accepted. not paducah, in particular, i don't want to pick out any city. but middle america and small towns. can be a very lonely place if you're different. and if the community isn't accepting of that difference. >> we should acknowledge that everybody is celebrating today. some are still having a difficult time accepting this because to them this is not what marriage is supposed to be. >> i think there is a great deal of confusion on what the goals are here. the goals are this is still a country and should always be a country that respects religion
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and supports it. and in your religion you have the right to believe in worship as you believe. so this isn't a decision against religion. it truly is about equality under the law. it's equality in the world that we live in. in the states that we live in. these case physical you take time to look at them they're heartbreaking in what people have had to live through. for surviving spouses to not be listed on a death certificate, for two women who want to adopt four special needs babies that were abandoned or left surrendered at birth and not to be able to because the state of michigan doesn't recognize them as a married couple. these are real legal difficulties. these are hardships. we're not, this takes it beyond the point where everyone is waving a rainbow flag. this is real life real pain real hardship inflicted on real people and it just shouldn't be in america. >> to your point, sam, the lead plaintiff in this case whose name i still have difficulty
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pronouncing. justice kennedy to fulfill their mutual promise, it was difficult for arthur to move. so the couple were wed inside a medical transport plane as it remained on the tarmac in baltimore. when you hear details of a case like that i mean how can you argue with it? >> yeah. so my hope is that anyone who is in love has been in love understands love will be a person who will stand up and say, everyone deserves to feel that. if you love someone, hearing that story drives you, i mean just you can't take it. you just can't take it. no one should have to live like that. >> you know for me the argument ended when i recognized that there was no day in my life when i made a decision that i was interested in women. i imagine there was not a day in your life when you decided, i think i'll look for a guy like
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sam, right? >> you don't wake up one day and decide to be gay. that's just not an option. that is the whole point. it's not an option. you are who you are and i'm really glad today we can be ourselves in the country. now officially in the whole country. >> sam, did you have to play a role that wasn't honest or did you just not say nothing? did you have to hold yourself out on television as hetero heterosexual? >> i had to make a decision. my decision was not to talk about it at all. television was the work. i wasn't going to talk about my personal life. if an interviewer wanted to sit down and discuss it with me i would simply say something i'm sure we can say on cable that i would say, look i really only talk about sex with people i'm about to have sex with. unless i misunderstand this situation, we don't need to talk about sex. let's talk about what we're here
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to talk about. my work the forecast or something else. i was very direct with it and very aggressive because i felt like it was very unfair to have to carry that. to not be just judged solely on my work and my abilities, but to have to carry a label and to be judged for that. >> gentlemen, thank you so much for being here. really appreciate your time. >> thank you. >> thank you. coming up more reaction to the supreme court's historic reaction from the first openly gay governor in u.s. history. jim mcgreevey is about to join me to give his take. as charleston mourns the nine victims killed in the church massacre the debate over the confederate symbols isn't over. i'll speak to one man who says the flag is a war memorial and should continue to fly high.
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(whistle) (yells) taxi!!!! ♪ where to? west 76th street. from us the orange juice growers to you the orange juice lovers. enjoy florida's natural. welcome back. he was the nation's first openly gay governor and famously resigned from office in 2004 after coming out as gay. >> so my truth is that i am a gay american. and i am blessed to live in the greatest nation with the tradition of civil liberties, the greatest tradition of civil
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liberties in the world and a country which provides so much to its people. >> i want to get jim mcgreevey's take on yesterday's landmark supreme court decision. governor thank you so much for being here. >> good to be with you, michael. >> how might a decision like this have impacted your life had it have come decades ago? >> oh, it's a staggering decision. basically the nation is saying that i am created equal in the eyes of the law and the eyes of society. it's a major seat change, michael. what it says to young lgbt youth all across this country that you're equal in the eyes of the law and for many of us in the eyes of the church. and it's a powerful decision. the notion of equality. the notion of dignity. it's a word justice kennedy used again and again. >> your story is so well known and in your case you were actually married and then of course came the revelations. you announced to the country, as
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we just saw in the tape. i am a gay american. do you think it would have put you on a different path? a personal path that would have been different had the supreme court decades ago given this green light? >> sure. i mean i think that if that decision had been there as a young boy, i would never have made the decisions i did. frankly, i would have talked to my mother and father and asked them. i would have talked to a teacher and i would have talked to a person and authority. a local parish priest and frankly you looked all around and the government didn't recognize homosexualty. in fact it was labeled by the american medical association as an illness. there was no recognition of gay marriage. there was no support. there was no recognition by the state, the authority of the state. so when the united states supreme court, the highest law of the land recognizes gay marriage as being worthy of the recognition of the supreme court, it's a seat change not
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only in the eyes of the law, but what it does culturally, michael. >> you're so well known because 11 years ago you became the first openly gay governor in the history of the country. you're also an attorney. let me share something with you that justice scalia said. until the courts put an end to it we were witnessing one of the great exhibitions of american democracy on this issue. but now five justices have just concluded that every state was violating the constitution for 135 years. the time period between ratification of the 14th amendment and when massachusetts recognized same-sex marriage in 2003. what would be your response to justice scalia? >> my response would be that justice kennedy saw that within the 14th amendment there is this basic right of dignity and that gay marriage ought to be afforded the same equality as
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heterosexual marriage. if we know equality is equality why wait until the legislative process moves on? i mean if you extract justice scalia's argumentation to an awful conclusion then he might not have moved to address the questions of interracial marriage. i mean then he would have allowed the legislative process to play itself out on a whole host of issues involving civil rights involving women involving gays and involving african-americans. so i think what justice kennedy did was to show not only the seismic change in the american culture, but he, he dug deep into the law and that the law is a living breathing document. and that the court has a moral responsibility to lift america up to our better angels and that's what i believe he did when he embraced the notion of dignity inherent in the 14th amendment. >> finally, governor now you dedicated your life to prison ministry. i find it interesting that proponents of marriage being
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recognized only between a man and woman often invoke faith, invoke god. say he was the original arct tect of this being a union of only man and woman. you would say what to those folks? >> god bless them. i mean religion is so much a part of individual culture and in my faith. when pope francis says who am i to judge? i think the pope has moved us significantly beyond our own cultural moring se morings. michael, i didn't want to be gay at that point in my life. i wanted to be like every other kid on the playground and every other kid in boy scouts. it's a gift. it's who god made me to be. >> governor thank you for being here. >> thank you, michael. great day to celebrate. coming up, yesterday the president said the confederate flag must come down as an acknowledgment for which the confederacy fought slavery was wrong. my next guest begs to disagree.
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welcome back. pastor clementa pinckney was laid to rest yesterday. one of the nine victims gunned down at a historic black church in charleston. president obama who considered reverend pinckney a friend praised renewed efforts to remove the confederate flag in south carolina. >> removing the flag from this state's capital would not be an act of political correctness. not be an insult to the valor of confederate soldiers.
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simply would be an acknowledgment that the cause for which they fought. the cause of slavery was wrong. >> in the wake of the church massacres, there has been a major debate over the confederate flag a symbol embraced by the 21-year-old gunman. the confederate flag is still flying high despite being taken down earlier this morning by a woman who climbed the flag pole and tore it down. she and either man were then arrested. calls to remove it permanently, but many still support the flag and for what they believe it stands for. the former commander of sons of confederate veterans chapter. jeff, why do you think the flag should continue to fly? >> michael, it is a war memorial to over 25,000 men called to duty by their state to bear arms.
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they defended the state of south carolina and died as their state had asked them to do. >> the president yesterday, you just heard this clip said removal would not be an insult to the valor of the confederate troops but, rather, he sedan acknowledgement for the cause of which they were fighting was wrong. we have analyzed this and the flag has become such a focal point and a whipping post for so many things that i believe and i can't speak for the sons of confederate veterans but personally and for a good sense, i, with respect to my an sescestors would like to take a retrograde and step back and say, the feeding frenzy and all the controversy is doing more harm to the honor and dignity of that flag for those men, who were not slave owners. they were defending south
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carolina. cessation does not start war. these men stepped forward to defend 250 thousand southerners died in the cause for southern independence. perhaps as many as 450,000 union soldiers died and you continue to calculate, it is not unreasonable to say 1 million people were killed during that conflict that wasn't started by the confederacy. it has to be noted that folks are drawn by the lie repeated over and over. they begin to nlbelieve it. >> what is the lie? >> i'll give it to you. the flag is a symbol of hate
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racism and bigotry. fume was a very smart individual when he took over a floundering organization. he had to find something to sell. because black teen pregnancy and destruction of the black family structure or a disproportionate number of black men in jail and so on wasn't a very pleasant to sale item. he picked the flag and pointed at it. he says with all great amount of hate that is a symbol of hate, racism and bigotry that's what's gotten into the minds of folks. it is a soldier's flag. >> as you now know this transcends the flag. mitch mcconnell said that the statue of jefferson davis should come down in the kentucky state capital. house democrats discussed the relocation of most symbols in the united states capital. take our final minute together
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and tell us what you think about that. >> where is this going to go? the scenario is the flag is gone. couple kumbaya. slets a big celebration. oh my god, i drove by this state house and there is a monument. someone told me there are 25,000 soldiers underneath it. i was so pained and hurt and offended i had to take the rest of the day off. instead of bring it down the now rally cry will be move it out. once the confederate monument is moved away oh my god, we're going to see something behind the flag and the monument and it's another slaveowner and racist. it is george washington. are we to cleanse the entire american history. you can't take today's civil and religious and philosophical and legal train of thought and apply
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it to 1860. in 150 years, they are going to say about us can you believe those people in 2015 actually killed their own unborn children and they burned these fuels that polluted the air. i can't believe they did that kind of thing. well today is different. we're going to step back from the confederate flag and say, okay it is time to furl the flag so that these men aren't continually drug into some politically correct, liberal agenda of hate. >> jeff, thank you for being here. >> thank you very much michael. i'll show you one of the best parts of president obama's eulogy as he pays tribute to the nine victims.
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thank you so much for joining me. don't forget you can follow me on twitter if you can spell smerconish. i'll see you in two weeks. have a happy fourth of july. following three breaking news stories, police tightening in on one of the escapedily caners still on the loose in new york. swarming an area of new york hundred hunting david sweat, a day after officers shot and killed his partner, richard matt. the second story breaking now. more information coming out about the gunman responsible for killing dozens of tourists at a beach resort in tunisia. witnesses are revealing the moment the student pulled a weapon from behind an um brem
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