thanks for joining us. "a.c. 360" starts now. >> good evening, thanks for joining us tonight. yet another police officer shot and killed in the line of duty and right now, a massive manhunt under way for his killers. fox lake, illinois, police lieutenant charles joseph gliniewicz, friends called him joe. colleagues on the force called him g.i. joe. this morning just before 8:00 reradioed he was on foot chasing three suspects, one african-american, two white people. a few minutes later, the radio went down, back-up units came, his body was found. three days since a houston's sheriff became the 25th officer fallen this year. lieutenant gliniewicz became the next.

a quiet community an hour north of chicago became the focus of a manhunt that grew all day and continues as we speak. our ryan young joins us from fox lake. what's the latest on the search? >> reporter: anderson, this is a massive search. we've seen more officers come into the area. now we're about ten hours into the search and you can see officers moving behind me even as i'm talking. k-9 officers, officers on horseback, in atvs, in helicopters and even in boats. about a half mile from my location, an officer was responding to the area where there was a suspicious call for three men. when he arrived, he found the two men and the one black male all in the back of a business and then all of a sudden something happened, a shot was fired and officer gliniewicz was killed. he's a father of four, a married father of four, deep connections to this community. someone who's served in this area for some 32 years. there's obviously a lot of people here hurt by this. more than about 200 yards from where i'm standing, about 30

people have shown up with signs saying they support police officers all the while there's a massive contingent of officers spreading throughout this area to try to find the three people who they are looking for. in fact, we're told the woodline is so dense and there was a massive heat wave through this area today, a lot of officers are tired from obviously searching through the dense woodline area. this has been ongoing and everyone here has been talking about it. >> a couple of questions. first of all, do they have much of a description or at least have they talked about a description beyond just one african-american man, two white suspects as well? have they -- do they have more to go on? >> reporter: we've been pressing on that all day long. and you have to wonder whether or not they have more information and they're not sharing it with us. it took some time for them to confirm that the officer was dead. you have to believe they were telling the family first before we found out. maybe they have additional information about what these men look like. one has to wonder, does anyone

have a surveillance camera in the area, whether or not officers were able to go back to the businesses and ask them, can you search through your surveillance videos so we can see what these men look like? no information like that has been shared. but a dense woodline, maybe about half a mile away from here that would make it very hard for anyone to search through, especially with three individuals on the run. >> and you can understand with an ongoing manhunt, they wouldn't want to give out any information to tip their hat about what they know in terms of who they're looking for, of course, at a certain point, they might appeal for the public's help. we'll have to wait and see on that. in terms of the area, you talk about a woodline. can you describe this general area? what we're seeing looks like sort of a underbrush with a helicopter over it. but there must be -- is it residential as well? are there businesses? >> reporter: i had someone describe this to me and we actually saw it ourselves which makes it harder for officers. one, you have lakes in this area.

it's called the chain of lakes. and the lakes are connected all through the area. if they were able to get to a boat, that would make it hard for officers. there's a deep woodline that sometimes turns to marsh. parts of the search area are marsh. and then you have dense woodline. but this is a boating community. how many homes are here that have boats in the background and how many people could slip below a tarp line and be hiding in a boat? there's so many places for these men to hide. you can understand why they need all these officers. several neighborhoods have shut down with officers in camo and on top of the rail lines to make sure no one escapes. but it's almost like a needle in a haystack when no one knows what they're looking for. that's why the k-9 uniforms are so important. and we believe they've been able to get that officer's gun off him after he was shot and killed. >> so it's believed that whatever weapons they had, they

now also have the officer's weapon. is it clear, ryan -- the area you're in, it looks like there are some businesses there -- i can't tell if it's residential or businesses. but was the officer shot in an area where there are businesses and houses? in some of the other pictures, it looks almost rural. >> reporter: that's a great question. it's almost split up right on the dividing line here. this is where the businesses are. going back that direction about a half mile, it's all industrial. but then through a woodline, it makes a complete change. it goes residential. and it seems like that marsh line is what separates it so you can obviously understand why the men were able to either get on that train track or run through the woodline area and disappear into a neighborhood. we are on the major thoroughfare here. >> and we don't know how much of a head start they had. and how long it took officers to respond. ryan, appreciate it. we'll continue to check back in

with you. we are on for two hours as we follow this manhunt very closely. joining us now is former secret service agent, dan bongino and retired nypd detective harry hou houck. harry, what's law enforcement up against right now? you have, it seems, from what the police have said, you don't have a detailed description of these suspects. >> exactly. what's really interesting to me, anderson, is 12 hours now they're searching that area. they must have some kind of information that these guys still might be in the area. they had to have gotten there somehow. there has to be probably an abandoned vehicle somewhere that they had gotten there with that's still sitting there unless they did get in that car and get away. but i think there's some information that the police have that are basically saying that these guys are still in the area. they might have found the

vehicle that they got there with. i'm hoping that there's some kind of description for at least the clothing that these men were wearing and that they can check video in the stores, the gas stations and they would be able to possibly identify them and their vehicle. but this is a real tough thing here because we don't have much to go on. >> i also want to let ore viewers know, the images you are viewing, these are taped images, not live pictures. and we're intentionally doing that because we do not -- in the event the people who are on the run are next to a television are watching television, we obviously do not want to give any information out about current police positions, where police are currently searching. i hope as viewers you will understand our caution on that. matt, in terms of the difficulty of a church like this, there's no telling how long this could go on for when you have this variety of terrain. >> that's absolutely right. i started on a borderline urban area going into a rural area. we've seen organizations

galvanize their resources, k-9 uni units, there's information we don't have that law enforcement does have. physical evidence was recovered at the scene. there may have been people that saw something in and around the traffic stop and the officer did radio in some information when he initially made that stop. so law enforcement had something to go on. they're not releasing everything in the interest of operational security. and hopefully we'll get these people in custody. >> the hope, if they have the actual identities of these three, that makes the hunt that much easier because obviously then you not only go for the immediate surrounding area but you look into contacts. you look into family members and anyone else they may try to reach out to. >> sure. that contact network, that diagram of people they could reach out to. you can cast a net and it would be a lot easier over time to

distill down to a couple of different location where is these guys might be, anything from a credit card transaction to a phone call could help. but there are things working in law enforcement's favor right now. nightfall is law enforcement's friend. they have the equipment. these guys had no time to plan this. this wasn't some sophisticated prison break where a bag of equipment was waiting for them at the end of a long tunnel. they have night vision, they have forward-looking infrared, they can get thermal imaging out there. there's a good opportunity for law enforcement to leverage that nightfall and the lack of light to benefit them. another thing is their lack of planning in this. there seems to be an impulsively violent act, unlike the prison break in new york where they had some time. i don't think it was planned. these guys at some point are going to have to drink and eat and change clothes and they don't have any of that right now. >> harry, i think back to the most recent well-known manhunt is what happened in upstate new

york with the prison break. and law enforcement there set up a perimeter, tried to search that perimeter and move on to another area. would that be a similar technique deployed here or -- because there have got to be some buildings they're not able to search, buildings they can't get access to for whatever reasons. >> well, they're going to be looking for buildings that maybe have a sign of a break. and when they go through a family's house or something like that, they bring everybody out of the house and go in and check. we could have a hostage situation going on or something like that. but they'll be doing the same exact thing that they did up there in upstate new york. once they have an area completely searched, then they'll cordon that area off to make sure they can't make it back into that area and then move on and move forward. but like i said before, anderson, i think they have some clue that these guys might still be in the area. and i think that vehicle that -- i'm sure they had to have some type of vehicle to get there.

i'm sure they're not from the neighborhood. they might have found that vehicle. >> matt, in a case like this, when an officer is killed, the response from law enforcement, from all agencies is enormous. so they can't have had that much of a lead time in getting away, even if they had a vehicle, they couldn't have gotten necessarily all that far. >> you would think so. but you're absolutely right, anderson. the response from law enforcement in times like this is swift and immediate. there are hundreds of people involved with that manhunt from moment one. and some level of information or intelligence as we call it was put out at the very beginning and as harry just said, they wouldn't be there if we didn't have information that these guys are still in that area. >> the other good piece of news in terms of finding the suspects is that this is a relatively populated area, unlike upstate new york in the prison break. so the chance that somebody has seen something and may have already called in to police or could potentially call in to law enforcement, that also is

working in favor -- >> that is absolutely right. just because we don't have it doesn't mean they don't have it. >> right. dan, how effective are k-9 units in something like this? when you're in a residential or in an industrial area, i imagine that's obviously very different than in the area of the treeline and the marshes, which would probably be more effective. >> yeah, absolutely. the marsh line, the way scent works sit hovers close to the ground. moist air is -- the scent of a human being is a dog's best friend when they're trying to track. obviously a dog's nose because it's a four-legged animal is going to be close to the ground. when off marsh type environment where this incident looks to have originated, i have to imagine the dogs wouldn't have had a very difficult time picking up and tracking a scent. from what i know of tracking with using dogs, those scents

can last anywhere from five days to two weeks. this was immediate, anderson. the law enforcement response was nearly instantaneous. so if they're using dogs, which i assume they are, it shouldn't be that difficult for them to pick up a scent. and i think these guys' minutes are numbered out there on the lam. >> matt, appreciate you being with us. harry and dan as well. we want to tell you not just about the manhunt but about the officer who was killed, most importantly. you'll hear from a young man who is already planning on following in lieutenant gliniewicz's footsteps. he talks about the man he knew, the man who was his mentor and his friend. also tonight, we talked about the new york prison break. we'll look at what that and other manhunts can tell us about how this one might end, how long it may last. that and more as our extended "360" coverage continues.

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the day is ending north of chicago with three cop killers on the loose, a massive manhunt under way, communities on alert and on edge and a family, police lieutenant joe gliniewicz's family, is mourning. chelsea, you spoke with neighbors of the lieutenant. what are they saying about him? >> reporter: good evening, anderson. i spoke with neighbors and the general consensus from everyone

here is that he was just a great guy. he was generous, he would help you whenever you needed help and very proud to be a police officer, proud to be a u.s. army veteran. >> he served a long time on the force. one neighbor you spoke to saw him just this morning. >> reporter: yes. she said that she grew up with him. he had four boys. she grew up next door with the family. they would wave when they would see each other, a very friendly neighborhood, which describes the community pretty well. >> obviously -- this is kind of a violent crime that isn't something this community is necessarily used to. how worried are residents there right now? these guys are on the loose. >> reporter: yeah. residents are worried. but i will tell you this is actually our second police shooting in 11 months. we had one one county over where fortunately two officers survived an ambush by a gentleman who was then sentenced and is serving time in prison. so unfortunately they're used to seeing this. that doesn't mean they're not

scared. they're worried and they keep saying, this isn't supposed to happen here. overall, i would say they're just heartbroken. >> it's obviously an ongoing manhunt. chelsea, appreciate you joining us. in addition to being the father of four, lieutenant glen wits w gliniewicz was also a leader, working with high school students who might be interested in becoming law enforcement officers one day. one of those students, devon arbay joins us tonight. thank you for joining us. what can you tell us about lieutenant gliniewicz? what kind of a guy was he? >> lieutenant gliniewicz was a person who truly did care about his community. he was always involved with community events, village events, et cetera. he truly loved his job. he loved doing things for the explorers and it was a huge part of his life. he dedicated hundreds of thousands of hours swointo

bettering the fox lake community and the national explorers. >> the explorer post, what kind of a program is it? what kind of things did he do and you do? >> all police explorer posts are law enforcement posts throughout the nation. it's a program for youth across the country from ages 14 to 21 who are interested in the career of law enforcement. the program really teaches the explorers anything from law enforcement, traffic stop, first day training, building searches, domestic, et cetera. everything basically. and it will give them the opportunity to see if this is what it's like. events like this will truly alter the opinions of some. but for me, it truly makes myself want to become a police officer more and more and fulfill his important work and continue doing what he did. >> he was your mentor in the program? >> yes, that's correct. >> it's interesting. you clearly want to be a police officer. and this doesn't deter you in any way? >> absolutely not. it actually makes me want to become a police officer more

because of this. what happened today is unbelievable. i didn't think it was going to be him when i turned on the news. i figured it would be him apprehending the suspect, not the other way around. when i heard it, i was devastated. my school was in a lockdown. i immediately burst into tears. i couldn't believe what i was being told. it was heartbreaking for me, my explorers, the community, everyone. >> he had been on the force for a long time. did you get the sense that he loved being a police officer? >> oh, absolutely. he loved it. he truly loved it. going up through the ranks, he loved it. he really did. he loved his job, loved what he did. the people loved him. he's very well known throughout the community. what he did for the police department, the community, words cannot describe how much he loved that job. >> devan, sounds like you're going to make a great police officer. and i appreciate you coming on and talking about your friend

and mentor. thank you. >> thank you very much. just ahead, a closer look at what searchers are up against right now as this manhunt continues at this hour as well as how some of the most involved and memorable manhunts have played out right to the very end. toenail fungus? (crowd cheers) don't hide it... tackle it with fda-approved jublia! jublia is a prescription medicine proven to treat toenail fungus. use jublia as instructed by your doctor. once applied, jublia gets to the site of infection by going under... and around the nail. most common side effects include ingrown toenail, application-site redness, itching, swelling, burning or stinging, blisters, and pain. tackle it! ask your doctor if jublia is right for you. larger size available.

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we continue to follow this manhunt which is currently under way. late details in the illinois manhunt. quick reminder, we are deliberately being imprecise about the exact locations where police happen to be at any given moment. we're showing you taped images, not live pictures, in case fugitives happen to be watching, we don't want to give any current police movements. that said, it helps to see the broad scope of the search area and what law enforcement is up against. a very broad scope. cnn's tom foreman joins us with the big picture. >> let's look at the geography of this place. it takes a difference. it's up here to the north and west a little bit of chicago. probably take about an hour and a half to drive there. there are some geographic advantages for authorities here as they try to track them down. this is one of the chief ones

here. everything outside this line is water. so it's all water out there. you see how they started by having them at least somewhat hemmed in, depending on what you said earlier about how quickly they responded. then as you move into the site, you can see the other boundaries that exist here and the other challenges. almost all of this in this area is residential up in here. and it's residential over here and down here and so on, around we go. so that's a problem in the sense that if they get out into here, there are many places for them to hide in houses and garages. many places where they could be out here. but we've noticed all day that they have remained focused very much on the central marshy area here. remember, this road right up here is where the officer was, somewhere up in here when he first responded to this. down in this area is where he ultimately was found after he had been killed. so what have we seen around this

year? around the railroad tracks to see a long distance to see if anyone tries to across. also seen them in the middle working with helicopters, doing through that brush to see if anybody's hunkered down in there. and a big presence near all those businesses. in the end, anderson, again, we don't know what they know. but there has been so much emphasis on this area, as we continue to watch them head toward night and the sun is just setting there just now, you've got to believe the police have some reason to think that somehow these guys are still contained, by that water, by those houses. and i'm reminded of after the boston bombing, remember when the younger tsarnaev brother tried to escape there, even though he was in a very big city with many, many places to go, when everybody started looking and the police set up those barriers, it was not so easy for him to get away. we have to hope that police have some idea that they really are still there hemmed in by the

water, the houses and all the people looking right now. >> let's hope so, tom, appreciate it. there is no telling when or how this is going to end. but we can learn from past manhunts. e with want to show you how some similar manhunts have ended. randi kaye has that. >> reporter: christopher dorner on the run, in the middle of the night, dorner ambushes two officers sitting in their patrol car. one dies. dorner had been fired years earlier. >> of course he knows what he's doing. we trained him. >> reporter: search teams zero in on big bear mountain where they discover dornerdorner's burned-out shut. there's intense gunfire. dorner is surrounded. police light the cabin on fire.

then a single gunshot. later they find christopher dorner's charred remains. he shot himself, police say, ending the week-long manhunt. september of last year, corporal byron dixon shot dead and eric frein is on the run. investigators don't have a motive or any clear leads. >> he is a hunter. he is a woodsman and he is alleged to be a survivalist. that is a deadly cocktail. >> reporter: authorities have a message for him -- >> i want you to know one thing, eric, we are coming for you. >> reporter: up to 1,000 law enforcement joined the search, zeroing in on the woods near frein's family home. 48 days into the manhunt and frein is spotted by u.s. marshals. captured inside an abandoned airport hangar. he's pleaded not guilty and is awaiting trial. clinton correctional facility in dannemora, new york, is where

another manhunt begins, june 6th this year. convicted killers david sweat and richard matt escape in the middle of the night. >> there was a hole cut out of the back of the cell. >> reporter: after snaking their way through pipes and tunnels beneath the prison, they emerge from a manhole. checkpoints are set up around town and close to the canadian border. police also go door to door. >> state police have been by here without exaggeration probably 50 times in the last two or three days. >> reporter: they search from the air, too. >> we used the infrared camera to try to look down. >> reporter: still nothing but a few clues that they're still in the area until finally nearly three weeks in, they find richard matt, drunk and leaning against a tree about 20 miles from the prison. he refuses to drop his weapon and is shot dead. days later, a state police sergeant with a keen eye spots david sweat closing in on the canadian border. when sweat refuses to stop, the

sergeant, a trained marksman, drops to one knee and fires, hitting sweat twice. david sweat now back behind bars after a terrifying manhunt. randi kaye, cnn, new york. >> we'll continue to follow the manhunt. we're live through the 10:00 hour. coming up next, though, donald trump going on the record and calling himself a politician. he also responds to a new attack ad that jeb bush released today and shares his thoughts on relations between police and african-americans in america. all that in an interview with our don lemon who joins me ahead tonight. [ male announcer ] we know they're out there.

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welcome back. a day after donald trump attacked jeb bush on instagram, bush hit back releasing an attack ad online. in the web video, bush calls trump a fake conservative and uses trump's own words to paint him as a liberal new yorker. take a look. >> i lived in new york city and manhattan all my life. my views are a little bit different than if i lived in iowa. >> partial birth abortion?

>> i'm very pro choice. i am pro choice in every respect. and as far as it goes. >> as far as single payer, it works in canada. it works incredibly well in scotland. >> the fact is that 25% for high income people, it should be raised substantially. >> as you can imagine, donald trump had a few things to say about that ad. our don lemon interviewed the republican front-runner this afternoon. he joins me now. i want to get your overall thoughts about how he's doing. but what did he say particularly about the jeb bush ad? >> he basically said he was a democrat before he was a republican. and he and jeb bush, as you know, have been going back and forth. i think on anybody else, anderson, it might stick. but with donald trump, i'm not so sure. you've interviewed him numerous times. basically he said everyone in new york pretty much is a democrat. here he is. >> one other thing i'll say, he mentions the fact that i was at one point a democrat. well, in new york city,

everybody was a democrat practically. if you run for city council, if you run for political office, whoever wins the democrat primary is automatically -- there was almost no election because the republicans hardly exist in new york city. that's where i was. if you look at ronald reagan, he was a democrat -- he was actually a democrat with a very liberal -- or at least a pretty liberal bent and he became a republican with a somewhat conservative -- i wouldn't say very, but he was a conservative republican -- >> mr. trump, that's the first time i've ever heard of you refer to yourself as a politician. did you ever consider yourself -- >> i hate to do it. but i guess when you're running for office -- i hate the term politician as it relates to myself. i've only been a politician for three months. but i guess that's what i am right now unfortunately. >> were you democrat at that point? when you said that? >> well, at one point i was a

democrat. and for a period of time -- and over the years, as ronald reagan changed, i also changed. i became much more conservative. i also became a republican. >> what i found interesting is that he came out as a politician because as he's been saying, he is the non-politician person running for president of the united states. so basically he's saying, i've evolved over the years into this now conservative republican. >> and you've interviewed him a bunch of times. and you find he's different in interviews now. >> yes, he is different in interviews. in the beginning, you didn't know -- you still don't know what he's going to say. but he was a little bit more bombastic. but now he's calm. i'm not sure if he's growing into this running for president of the united states or if he's just indeed tired. >> yeah, trying to be presidential in a different way. he is a front-runner now which i wonder if he really believed he would be when he first got into

this. he's talked about he didn't want donor and he's been critical of those accepting big money from other candidates. you asked him about accepting donations for his campaign. let's listen. >> are you going to accept donations, large donations, small donations, if people want to give you money? >> no, the answer is no. i've told you that. wait a minute. small donations. people sending in $100 and $7 and $9 and -- we do accept that because they want to invest in the campaign. and it's relative peanuts. but they want to be a part of it. and i love that. that's not influence. that's not a lobbyist giving me $5 million where i turn down $5 million where they want to put in millions and millions of dollars. that's people that want to invest in the campaign. that, i happen to love. i think it's a really good thing and i think it's a really positive thing. it's a very small amount of money overall. but it's still that kind of money -- because i don't want to have a misunderstanding with you. i have a woman send $7 and a

long beautiful note. people send $100 and $200 and that kind of stuff i do like. i think it's a positive. and frankly i think it's insulting when they send in a check of $10 and $19 and if we send it back, we don't want your money. it's almost an insult to them. that kind of money we do accept and we like it because we think it's a positive for the campaign. >> it's interesting that he's using the term investing in his campaign. it's an interesting kind of way to spin it. it clearly is going to appeal to the people who are following him. you also talked to him about something he hasn't gone too much on the record about which is the relationship between law enforcement and minorities in this country. >> you've heard people say about -- especially the officer in dallas, the deputy who was shot -- in houston, rather, who was shot over the weekend that it had something to do with the climate in the country and whether black lives matter contributed to it. i wanted to get his thoughts specifically on it. here's what he said.

as we are doing this interview now, there has been a situation in illinois with police officers. there was the dallas police officer or sheriff's deputy who was killed last week. some have said that the climate in this country is lending to police officers being put into more danger. what do you make of that? do you believe that is true? >> oh, i think the police are in a terrible position. they're such great people. yes, you do have your bad apples every once in a while. but they're a tiny, tiny percentage. and what's happening with the police -- when you look at baltimore, a place i knew well and know well and you look at what happened on that first night, you covered it brilliantly. you saw what was going on. the police stood back -- you have to have law and order. you cannot have a situation where the police are afraid to talk to somebody because they're going to be fired, lose their pension, lose their life, lose their house. and what's happening now is the

police are some amazing people but they're afraid to act and they're afraid to do what's right. and people want protection. the people want the protection. so you see it more and more. and the respect is taken away from the police. and that's a very bad thing for the country and it's a very bad thing for security and safety. >> what i meant was the houston police officer, i misspoke. he didn't want to say specifically about black lives matter. he said there's no evidence now that it's directly related. he says it. but we should watch our language and we should watch the rhetoric because he believes police officers, as you heard, are in a terrible position right now and they need to be respected because they're in danger. >> you'll have the full interview tonight at 10:00 p.m. >> yes. >> i look forward to it. don, thanks so much. that's at 10:00 on don's show in about an hour and 15 minutes. time hasn't mellowed dick cheney. he slams president obama and hillary clinton and also weighs in on donald trump and the rest of the republican field, that in a moment.

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♪usic: "thunder clatter" by wild cub ♪ ♪ most weekends only last a couple of days. some last a lifetime. hampton. we go together. always get the lowest price, only when you book direct at hampton.com tonight, former vice president dick cheney is once again slamming president obama. mr. cheney has a new book out "exceptional," which he

co-authored with his daughter liz. jamie sat down recently with the cheneys. it's her first interview for cnn. >> thank you for joining us. a great addition to cnn. >> thank you. >> this is a fascinating interview. >> dick cheney, conservative hero to some people, darth vader to others. he was provocative, he is blunt. he goes -- we talked about everything from hillary clinton's e-mails. he is very harsh about that. we talked about the wild presidential campaign and donald trump and the whole republican field. but we started the interview with what he really thinks about the man he likes to go toe to toe with, president obama. i say president obama, you say? >> i say a president whose policies are doing lasting damage to the united states of america. >> reporter: the iran nuclear deal? >> terrible deal. definitely ought to be rejected

by the congress. >> reporter: should guantanamo stay open? >> yes. >> reporter: any regrets about going into iraq? >> no. >> reporter: no ri poapologies? >> no apologies. >> reporter: classic dick cheney, once again taking on president obama. this time with a new book co-authored with his daughter, liz, a former deputy assistant secretary of state. >> we wrote it because we're deeply concerned about the fact that we're in a world where the threats to the united states are increasing. chinese are on the march in southeast asia, russia on the march in europe, isis and the caliphate established in the middle east. the threats against the united states are as great as they were at the end of world war ii and this administration has rapidly diminished our military's capacity to meet those threats. >> reporter: how much damage do you think president obama's done? >> i think it's been devastating. he's strengthened our enemies

and our avdversarieadversaries. he's abandon ourd allies. his tendency and determination to apologize for the nation consistently and repeatedly around the world has been devastating. >> reporter: rate president obama for me. >> i think he's a man with a world view that doesn't fit reality, that he has a set of beliefs, an ideology, if you will, that doesn't equip him to deal with the kinds of problems that we're faced with today. in terms of trying to rank him as a president, it would be very low on the list of presidents. >> reporter: you think he's the worst president ever? >> well, certainly the worst in my lifetime. >> reporter: on president obama's watch, we got osama bin laden. he's used the drone program aggressively. there have been no major 9/11-style attacks on american soil. is it possible that even though you disagree with him that his foreign policy is keeping america safe?

>> one of the reasons we got osama bin laden is because of the enhanced interrogation program that we put in place and that he canceled. the drone program that he's used effectively was invented by george w. bush. >> reporter: liz, in the book you write that he wants to diminish america. >> he's done everything within his power to diminish us. he seems to think, for example, if he cuts our nuclear arsenal, he's said that will help us have the credibility to tell the iranians or the north koreans that they should limit their own nuclear ambitions. it's fantasy, it's dangerous and it's wrong. and the next president is going to have a heck of a job digging us out of this hole. >> reporter: you write that america is at a hinge point in history and it's vital voters carefully pick the next president. i know you're not endorsing anyone. but who do you think is the best person to turn things around? >> well, we have not endorsed anybody and don't plan to today, jamie.

>> reporter: i have to try. >> you have to. it's a legitimate question. but our concern really is the policy, the issues, the importance of having national security front and center in connection with the campaign. >> reporter: when you look at the republican field, are you confident that everyone out there could get the job done? >> i wouldn't go that far. but i think it's a good field. >> reporter: you want to tell me who you wouldn't be comfortable supporting? >> no, i don't think i'll do that. >> reporter: mr. cheney, you were jeb bush's father's secretary of defense. you were his brother's vice president. some people could wonder why it's just not natural for you to endorse jeb. >> well, i was happy to serve in those prior administrations. i've got great respect for both president bushs. they gave me great opportunity and i was happy to serve them. i also like jeb. he's a good man. he was a good governor in florida. i have not endorsed him for president.

i'll watch with interest how the campaign develops. >> reporter: six months ago, he was the presumptive front-runner. he's raised more than $100 million. why do you think he's struggling so? >> i can give you the same answer, jamie. i'm not going to get into the business of rating candidates or trying to analyze them or to do your job of analyzing how the candidates are doing. i'll pass. >> reporter: get your popcorn ready. it is the summer of donald trump, ladies and gentlemen. what do you think of donald trump? >> i don't know the man. i've never met him. >> reporter: watching this whole spectacle, what do you think? >> well, again, he's a candidate and i don't want to be in the business of rating candidates at this point, of grading them. i have not signed on with anybody and don't plan to today. >> reporter: you're not endorsing donald trump today? >> you can even -- that's a given. i'm not endorsing donald trump today. >> reporter: why do you think he's doing so well in the polls?

>> i've been surprised that he's done as well as he has. most of us have on the republican side. but he clearly is a major factor going forward. and we'll watch developments with interest. >> reporter: liz, why do you think he's doing so well in the polls, since the vice president is punting on this question -- >> hoping i'll dive in, right? no, i think that it's this notion that people are frustrated with a president who doesn't seem to believe in american greatness, american exceptionalism. i think people are frustrated with washington and donald trump is tapping into that. that's part of the general frustration out there. >> reporter: would you vote for him? >> i will support the nominee of my party, as i always have. that's very important. >> is it fair to say he doesn't think trump will be the nominee? >> he laughed when i said the name donald trump. i think like many republicans,

he is shocked this is the summer of donald trump. i don't think he thinks he's going to be the nominee. on the other hand, dick cheney is very disciplined. he is not going to get into the donald trump discussion. he just does not want to go there. >> is there anyone you think he might endorse? >> he says that there are a number of people in the field. i think it's interesting that he is not with jeb bush. if i had to guess, i think the person who on national security issues, which is what he's most interested in, focused on, i'd say marco rubio is the guy he's closest to. >> but he said he will support the nominee, whoever it is. >> exactly. >> we'll have the second part of jamie's interview in our next hour and then a conversation with ari fleischer and paul begala about what cheney has said. what do you focus on in that? >> in that, we'll get into hillary's e-mails. he's very harsh about that. there is a democrat who he likes

who he would like to get into the race. joe biden is dick cheney's man. >> not that he necessarily supports or agrees with biden but because it would make it more interesting? >> he's not endorsing joe biden. we talked about the spread of isis. he blames obama but we asked him, is there -- does bush/cheney bear some responsibility for isis? and then last but not least, he has a very dire prediction about another 9/11 attack on american soil. >> that's in our next hour. conversation with paul begala and ari fleischer. jamie, thank you. >> thank you. also in the next hour, debate about some of the claims that both cheneys have been making. that's between paul and ari who obviously worked in the bush administration. an update on the massive manhunt in northern illinois tonight for the three suspects wanted in connection with the killing of a police officer.

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