12:00 p.m. noon in milwaukee, and 1:00 p.m. here in washington, and wherever you are watching us from around the world, we thank you for joining us. we start at the campaign trail as the republican campaign candidates will get back to the work after wrapping up the fourth presidential debate last night. jeb bush is in iowa, and taking part in the town the hall later in this hour. athena jones is following the campaign, and several stops in iowa today t, and what have you heard are from the candidates so far about the debate, athena, last night? >> hi, wolf. we saw a confident governor bush this morning feeling good about the debate. he said that the moderators asked good question, and he e feels that he did well. he is also confident coming off of the endorsement announced of the campaign of bob dole, the former u.s. senator and rmer presidential candidate and veteran himself, and bob dole

was a veteran, himself, and he is going to be serving as the veterans chairman. we had a chance to catch up with jeb bush this morning, and talk talked about the performance of the debate and how he could do better? >> i thought it was fine. we did well, and talked about the issues that are important to people. we have to be thinking of who is the person to beat hillary clinton, ra rather than trying to get into the small differences of each campaign. the big difference is that hillary clinton is going to be double down on a failed economy and i have the leadership skills to help people rise up again. >> and so you heard him say that he is going to be focusing on the contrast of hillary clinton, and not mentioning other candidates. he did not try to attack marco rubio and that failed in the debate prior to that, but i have to tell you, wolf, talking to the various bush campaign staffers both this morning and

last night at a watch par i, all of them expressed satisfaction with how he did, and no major stumbles, and good moments. and the campaign has put together a highlight reel of him slamming hillary clinton and how the u.s. need s s to be a leaden the world and in the fight against isis, and the campaign is trying to raise money off of the governor's performance asking supporters to help build the momentum to keep him moving forward >> we will monitor his activities and of course, all of the candidates. and thank you, athena. and now, after the debate, tim miller is jeb bush's campaign manager, and tim, thank you very much for joining us. i want to see if you can clarify a couple of jeb bush's positions. we know that donald trump and john kasich battled seriously over trump's plan to deport 1 111 -- 11 million illegal

immigrants, and where does jeb bush stand closer to donald trump or governor kasich? >> well, he tried to distance himself in the donald trump so-called plan which is unrealistic, and it is not something to be implemented which is going to deport 500,000 people a month, and think about what kind of disruption that would be to society. governor bush wrote a book on immigration in 2012 that laid out his plan, and it is in the most simple form, secure the bortder and give people here who are here legally a path to status, and pay a fine and pay back taxes, and don't receive the government benefits and learn english, and allow them a path to legal status, and combining the two things is a conservative and real approach to this issue, because it is unaddressed too long. >> he is not going to be deporting these people, and give them the path to legal status to meet all of the conditions.

would they also have a path to citizenship? >> well, wolf, for the dream act kids, the folks who are brought in as minors they would, but you don't want to allow people to be able to jump in line in front of the folks who are waiting in line legally to have access to citizenship. that is why the path to earn legal status is a kon ser conse position, but it is one that could get through congress and get past so that we can resolve the issue unresolved under obama and for far too long. >> and there is also a pretty extensive exchange between rand paul and marco rubio on the intervention in the middle east. marco rubio being described by the critics as neoconser vatist, and rand paul as a isolationist, and where on the debate last night is he in getting involved more aggressive areally in syria and iraq? >> sure. i thought that one of jeb's best moments is when donald trump was talking about letting putin

basically run roughshod over the middle east, and having us get out of the way, and jeb interrupted dond t eed donald a look, we don't have to be the world's policeman, but we have to be a leader and not let putin or assad continue to gain influence to the greatest ally israel. he is showing leadership. he laid out a plan at the reagan library a couple of months ago with dealing with isis and assad which includes a no-fly zone, and more a forward leaning approach than what we have seen from this administration. what you saw from trump and rand paul, it is outside of the mainstream of the republican party and closer to what you would get from. >> clark: and -- from hillary clinton and bernie sanders. >> and last night, there is some at the minimum wage of $7.50, and wanting it to go up, and

where is jeb bush on raising the minimum wage? >> that didn't come around to jeb last night, and by the way, we loved that it was a substantive debate with the issues that you are following up on today, wolf, but when it comes to the minimum wage, jeb this it needs to be a state by state issue, and from the federal level, raising it could have adverse effects where with the economy, it would not make sense to have the same minimum wage and so we need a high growth strategy, and in jeb bush 2016.com, you will see people with high paying jobs and not fighting over to the minimum wage jobs, and that that needs to be a state issue. >> you heard that in "the new york times" there was an article with the super pac not directly connected to the campaign, and that super pac is going to be spending $20 million and at least a chunk of it attack ads

against marco rubio, and saying that this guy is not qualified to be qualified to be president of the united states, and so where do you stand on the super pac strategy? >> well, look, everybody in the race is going to be vetted. everybody's record and resume is going to be examined. that is certainly true for us. we have taken the incoming from the democrats more than anybody, and plenty of fellow republican candidate, and that happens in the campaign. those are decisions to be made by the superpac, but what we are focused on is what you saw last night with jeb, the guy with the best record and plans to take on hillary clinton, and the best message to how the conservative policies help real people. as part of the campaign, if there is a back and forth and differences between the other candidates, that is going to the happen, and whether, no matter who the candidate is, folks

should be ready for the record the to be examined, and we feel like jeb has the best record in the field, and he the best candidate to goup against hillary clinton, and that is where our focus is going to be. >> on the specific issue of abortion, what exemptions does he support? i know that he opposes abortion, but what about the life of the mother, the health of the mother, and rape and insist? >> well, look, jeb has the best pro life record main the field. his record in florida when it comes to the issue of protecting life from birth to death is really unfair legparalleled to governor in the country, and so he does support in the place of risk of life to mother and rape. and now, going forward, what is the strategy in the next few weeks? >> luckily for us, this the race is to be decided by the voters of new hampshire and iowa, and not the pundits on the show, wolf. we feel like we are getting progress there in the early

stat states. we had a bus tour in new hampshire where you could feel the momentum on the ground. as jeb is doing the campaigning that you need to do to earn the nomination. and so what we are going to focus on is that next week he has a big speech at the citadel to restore the strength of the military, and continue to talk about how he has the best plans to grow the economy, and help the middle-class, and downside washington with a balanced budget amendment line item veto. if you look at those plans and his record which is the most effective conservative record in the field, that is the best contrast the of hillary clinton, and that is what he laid out last night, and we have another debate coming up in a month. >> and he talked a lot about it hillary clinton, and so, let's play this clip and then we will discuss. >> sure. sglf hillary clinton has said that barack obama's policies gets an a, and really? 1 in 10 people are not working or given up altogether, and that

is not an a. 1 in 7 are living in poverty, and that is not an a. and 1 in 5 children are on food stam stamps. that is maybe the best that hillary clinton can do, but it is not the best that america can do >> and now, there are a lot of jobs created in the clinton administration, and in the obama administration and not so many jobs in the bush administration, and the unemployment is now at 5%. there are some positives to what is happening on the economy comparing today to what the situation was in 2008 and 2009. >> well i don't know if i could do a better job of answering the question like jeb, and that is one of the better moments of the debate, but if you had continued playing it, a lot of the jobs in the obama administration are down the pay scale, low income jobs. the middle-class has not gotten a raise in 15 yeerngs and the

workforce participation rate is lower than it was since before the reagan administration, and so sit is the lowest in 30 year. so, look, we can do better than the obama economy, and the sad 2% growth under president obama. hillary clinton doesn't think that we can. she thinks that we need to manage the decline, and what governor bush is going to be doing is putting in pro growth policies to allow more high-paying jobs to be created. >> tim miller is the communications director the, director for the bush campaign. thank you for joining us. >> thank you. we will look at the issues at the center of the clash, immigration, military spending, and will they find common ground? and soon, heading to egypt to get a first hand look at the wreckage of the metrojet that killed all 224 people on board, and ntsa is headed that there,

and we will have the latest of the investigation when we come back. clorox disinfecting products. because no one kills germs better than clorox.

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there were some pretty good one-liners and zingers in the latest presidential debate, and the event seemed to reinforce that there were no potential game-changers, but it did highlight some deep divisions in the party over key critical issue issues including immigration reform. >> we are a country of laws. we either have a country or we don't have a country. we are a country of laws. you have to go the out, and they will come back, but they have to go out, and hopefully they get back, but we have no choice if we are going to run our country properly and if we are going to be a country. >> anybody else comes over, they go back, but for the # 111 million people, come on, folks, we all know that you can't pick them up, and ship them back across the border.

it is a silly argument. it is not in the adult argument, and it makes no sense. >> 12 million illegal immigrants to send them back, 500,000 a month is just not possible. it is not embracing the american values, and it would tear communities apart, and it would send a signal that we are not the kind of country that i know that america is. and even having this conversation is sending a signal to the clinton campaign to do high fives. >> what you said is right, the democrats are laughing, because if the republicans join the party of amnesty like the democrats, we will lose. i understand when the mainstream media covers immigration, it does not see it as an economic issue, but i can tell you that for mill kwons of americans a alt home watching this, it is a very personal economic issue. -- millions of americans at home watching, this it is a very

personal economic issue. >> and now sh, the political commentators s.e. cup, and she is a conservative, and donna brazile is a democrat, and both very important observers for us, and there is a clear split of immigration reform among the presidential presidential candidates and would bit the trump side or the side that jeb bush has or that john kasich has, and which is more likely to attract the republican caucusgoers and the primary votes in the upcoming primary? >> well w people in milwaukee applauded for the john kasich and jeb bush prescription, as well as the ted cruz prescription. >> and not for donald trump? >> no, they didn't go for the donald trump, and he did not effectively land the punch the way that ted cruz did and the way that john kasich and jeb bush did for the other. in that room, he worked the least.

on actual policy for trump to be subscribing to the 1954 eisenhower operation wetback project, i was deeply inhumane and flawed and nobody has been able to prove that it actually had long lasting impact on a illegal immigration is deeply problematic for the future of the party. you can have a reasonable immigration reform, like jeb has, like john kasich has without amnesty, and they laid out the best message for the republican party going towards a general election. >> and donna, is jeb bush right when he says that the folks in the hillary clinton campaign were high fiving each other with some of donald trump's comments and ted cruz on immigration? >> well, for the 12 million americans who are here undocumented, they are relieved that the president obama is still in office and possibly a president clinton or sanders or o'malley will make sure that we

have comprehensive reform. when i listen to the republican debate, i think that they are not think thing of the futures but gaining what i call that tiny slice of the republican party that believes that we have to build a fence and somebody else will pay for it and all of our problems will go away. >> and let me say that the courts said that what obama is trying to do with immigration is not right. so we can't have a president obama executive action on immigration, and both sides need to come together to have a conversation, and that must include the republican voice, and whether you agree with them or not, ted cruz, marco rubio, they are in the senate, and john kasich is a governor, and we have to work together. >> and marco rubio also had a bill with his hands on it, and it is too hot with the republican, and they ruled in the 5th circuit 2-1, and the obama administration is going to appeal it to the supreme court. >> and if not, it is a hugesetback for the president who wanted to the do it unilaterally without going

through the process. >> with those dreamers and they parents. >> and yes, the clip of marco rubio and rand paul disagreeing on the intervention in the middle east. >> so, yes, i do want to rebuild the american military. i know that rand is a committed isolationist, and i'm not. i believe that the ud is the strongest place when the ud is the strongest. >> marco, marco, how is it conservative to add $11 trillion expenditure for the federal government that you are not paying for? and how is that conservative to add 1 trillion in military expenditures? you cannot be a conservative if you are going to be promoting new programs that you are not paying for. >> and serious disagreement there in terms of isolationist, and rabd pand paul says he is a noninterventionist, and neo conservative, and what do you

think resonates more? >> that is a great part of the debate, and one of the better moments when you got to see the clear division and passion among the candidates and i would like to see more of those moments are where they are representing their constituents. rand paul does represent a small part of the con ser servatives is not as big with marco or carly fiorina, and making sure that we have a lean but smart military that is aggressive, are regaining our position in the world. i think that, you know, more hearts and minds and that is evidenced by trump's bellicose rhetoric, and more hearts and minds of the republican party are with marco and with donald trump and carly fiorina. >> and you have heard hillary clinton's critics are from the left saying she is a neo conservative, and she supports a no-fly zone over syria and she

wants to be more involved in the, and she was one of the architects of the intervention in libya with the cruise missiles, and what does she say about it to the critics are from the left? >> well, she has talked about soft power, and what we can do to maintain america's strength around the world, but to s.e.'s point about -- sorry about my water, have been up all night. but to s.e.'s point about interventionists to realists, the country is war weary, and we are not ready to go to war every time there is a quote, unquote emergency. the american people want the smart way to handle the middle east and the smart way to handle putin and china without often going to the military issues. one other thing, and this is veterans day and we didn't have lindsey graham on the debate, and i like that, because i get all of my bar jokes from him, but there is an opportunity that they should have talked about the v.a. and many of the veteran

needs resources and better health care system, and we did goent that last night. >> well, there going to be more debates down road. >> wolf blitzer, december 15th. cnn >> and i will say that they will be together on the 15th of december, tuesday, mark your cal en daers and i will be hosting. so, still to come, terrorists ofibls are fearing that the bomb may have brought down that metrojet airliner killing all 224 people aboard, and now a u.s. team has been invited to investigate first hand, and we are getting new information. of two aleve for six tylenol? what's the catch? there's no catch. you want me to give up my two aleve for six tylenol? no. for my knee pain, nothing beats my aleve.

the u.s. will soon get its first look at the crash debris are from the russian metro jet that went down over egypt's sinai peninsula killing all 224

aboard. egypt has accepted a rerequest from the united states to assist with the investigation. a source says that the national transportation safety board here in the united states will dispatch a team once it has details of when and where the plane's engines will be examined. the engines are u.s. made. meanwhile, they believe that the most likely scenario is that jihadis plant ed a bomb with c4. and now joining us is our terrorist expert paul cruikshank. and paul, c4 is military explosive powerful enough to bring down a plane, but how easy is it to obtain? >> well, we know that the group that has claimed responsibility, the isis affiliate in sinai has stockpiled a large quantity of c4 explosives ash and they have used the c4 explosive in attacks

this year, and so it would be consistent with isis in sinai to carry out the attack rather than the airport. it reports away from the lone wolf scenario, because it is difficult for an individual without connections to the wlished terrorist outfit to obtain this military-grade explosive, wolf. >> and matthew, there is a suggestion that the timing on the bomb may have caused the detonation of 30,000 feet about 23 minutes into the flight. here is the question. what if that plane had been delayed in takeoff? >> if that is the case, it wouldn't have mattered, wolf, because if it is c-4 as the explosive, it requires a blasting cap or the detonator, and so there has to be something to set it off, and if that is the case, it would have gone off on the gate or the runway. the altitude has nothing whatsoever to do with the blast

if it is c-4 and the detonator. >> and once the ntsb and the investigators that are now invited get to the actual scene at the sinai, and the egyptian, and the russians and others, matthew, when you get, there how hard to have evidence of some sort of bomb out there among the dee brie? >> well, you know, this cabin was compromised at a high altitude and so the physical evidence could be miles and mile miles throughout the scene, but however, the evidence of the wreckage, they can sift through the reckawreckage and identify explosives, and maybe not find the pieces of the timer or the detonat detonator, but they will find something that will tell us more than we know right now. >> and paul, there is reports that the isis leadership was calling for violence against russia, and maybe the isis leadership in iraq as well.

what have you learned about that? >> wolf, on october 30th, the spokesman abu annan issued a a call of arms against the united states and russia to urge fellow jihadists to target the united states and russia, and the isis group within sinai would have heard this loud and clear a top priority for isis that russia be targeted. isis presenting russia as the co-equal enemy like the united states. so another perhaps indication that, perhaps another indication suggesting whether it is isis responsible here, wolf. >> because if it is isis, there is some speculation, paul, that yes, maybe russia is the target, because of russia's increasing involvement main the war agains isis in syria, but the other argument is that these isis terrorists hate the government of president al assisi.

and so the real target was the egyptian government here. >> well, if it was isis in si sinai, there would have been two targets, one as you say the egyptian government to undermine that government and to topple that government, and how better to the that than to decimate mate the tourist economy, and also if they wanted to go after the russians, they could have gone after the british charter jets that day, but they chose a russian jet, and this is to designed to turbo charge the isis support in the e global e jihadi movement, because there is a lot of anger in the sunni muslim world for the russians because of their support for the assad regime. >> and the officials are pleased that the egyptian regime has allowed the american ntsb to go to investigate.

thank you both. and now, men who accused of being white supremist s as are arrested. and now we will tell you what the fbi says they were planning to do. only glucerna has carbsteady, clinically proven to help minimize blood sugar spikes. so you stay steady ahead.

an alleged white supremist plot is uncovered in virginia. the fbi has arrested two men plotting to bomb black churches and jewish synagogues as a plan to start a race war in the united states. the fbi says it was given information through confidential sources and information and surveillance that the men were concocting allegedly a plan to kill a jeweler to begin with and then use the money from the jewels to quote purchase land and stockpile weapons and train

for the coming race war. another man was arrested for conspiracy to commit a robbery. let's bring in our senior editor of the intelligence project and hate watch at the southern poverty center. and now, ryan, how alarming are these alleged race war plots that seem to be coming forward nowadays? >> well, they are obviously a! alarming, and they are increasingly common. earlier this year at the southern poverty law center, we released a report called "the age of the wolf" looking specifically at the acts of violence coming from the radical right, and racist right, and what we found is from the period of 2009-2014, an act of violence carried out or thwarted from the radical right every 34 days. so unfortunately, this is very much a reality of the world that we live in now. >> and we know that there are racists who hate african-americans, and anti-semites who hate jews, but how unusual to have a group allegedly like these two guys

who were just arrested by the fbi that go after blacks and jews? >> oh, it is not unusual at all. you know, lest we forget that not that long ago dylan roof walked into the church in charleston, south carolina, with the plan to commit a horrible act of violence to carry out, and he didn't talk to anybody about it. these people are radicalized online, and carried on the actions without any alert to the law enforcement, and it is quite common >> this criminal complaint that i read from the u.s. district court for the eastern district of virginia saying that the two guys allege think were planning the shooting or the bombing of the occupants of black churches, and jewish synagogue, and conducts violence against persons of jewish faith and doing harm to one gun owner in the state of oklahoma. after what you have learned in this alleged plot, how far along were they? >> well, a lot has to be learned from the particular plot. the men were ar a rested over

the weekend, and the investigation as far as we know is still ongoing. law enforcement is not talking about what they have said beyond what is listed in the criminal complaint, so i am assuming that much more will come out. we don't know how far along they we were, but that is ist not necessarily the point. the reality is that the very idea that they were considering this is alarming enough. it starts some place, and thankfully the law enforcement stepped in and a stopped this one soon. >> how many time types of hate groups like this under surveillance by the fbi and other law enforcement as far as your information out there is concerned? >> oh, there is no way i would know that. i know that right now, we listed 784 hate groups from last year, and that is down a little bit, because increasingly as the groups shrink, thek a shuns are taking place, or the people are bearing across the ideas online

and in racism forums online. no way to monitor that, and no way to monitor what someone ascribes to or the ideology, and as if it is happening in their own home. >> and has it gotten worse since president obama took office, the hate out there? he is the first african-american president, of course? >> without a doubt it has gotten worse. almost to the date when president obama was elected, hate groups in the united states skyrocketed. last year they fell by about 1/5 and what that coincided with is a pattern of violence taking place from single or small groups of people. in this study that we released earlier in the the year, we found that 74% of the violent incidents tracked between 2009 and 2014 were carried out by one person. if you include a group of people of one or two, that is a father/son or husband/wife and that goes to 90% of the incidents that we tracked

involved this small group of people. now, that is a particular problem for law enforcement, because it is very hard to infiltrate or to monitor a group of people that are conspiring to carry out the act of violence that you don't know that these people exist. >> ryan lens of the southern poverty law center, thank you for joining us. >> thank you for having me. and up next, presidential candidate george pataki is going to talk to us live about the debate that he missed last night, and the future of his campaign and more.

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so the candidates on the debate stage last night, they are insist iing they won and th they did well. in what could a story first, donald trump called the presidential debate in his words "elegant." jeff zeleny had a chance to speak to him on the campaign trail, and the debate here last night from jeb bush and donald trump. >> you said it is a beauiful thing to watch the candidates dropping out one by one, and with this debates in the books, time to go to more hardball against the other candidates, ben carson and the others? >> well, i think that it is going so well, and to be honest with you, i loved the debate last night. we got high marks on the debate, and i was very happy with the way it worked out. every single poll, and the underlying poll, drudge and everyone else had me winning the debate last night, but i don't know it is up to them if they want to drop out, they can drop out, but it has nothing to do

with me, but i think that you will be seeing people dropping out. >> who is next? >> i think that i know, but i don't want to predick. i mean a lot of people have to dropout, because they are not resonating, and they are very good people, but if you don't the resonate, you have to drop out. >> and what about -- >> no, not at all, but she was interrupting everybody. and you know who interrupted kasich, and what did i do with him? the same thing. i a glad that you are here. i said, let jeb speak? did i say that? you see, i said "let jeb speak" because he was interrupting jeb. i said, let jeb speak. >> it is almost like you felt sorry for him. >> and in the background, it needs to be stronger? >> and no, you were nice to me this morning and said it is elegant. >> and conciliatory. >> maybe that is how i need to be. >> debates only or on the campaign trail? >> no, not in the speeches,

because people would be disappointed if i did that, but during a speech, it is different, and during the debate, you have to give other people the chance to talk. in the case of carly, she was interrupting a lot of people, and by the way, four people came up to me afterwards on the stage, and that -- and they say, thank you for what you did with car carly. i think that she is a nice person, but if you remember, i did the same thing with kasich, because he was cutting off jeb bush, and i said, have to be, but i want to show respect for the other people up there and let them talk it's their time to talk. >> donald trump earlier this morning in manchester, new hampshire. coming up, my conversation with george pa tag ki, the former new york governor, a presidential candidate. we'll talk about thalast night moving forward. i wanna see, i wanna see. longing.

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. welcome back. joining us now to talk about the republican contest, the former new york governor george pataki. mr. governor, thank you for joining us. did you watch the two debates last night? >> i did, wolf. it was interested and i hope represented a turning point in the campaign. >> explain that because in the past you've suggested -- and i want to be precise -- if someone showed they could unite and lead the party you would drop out. did you see someone last night who could unite and lead the party? >> no, i didn't. but what i did see last night was a lot more substance, a lot more talking about issues, differences on issues like immigration, differences like on issues concerning syria, and the no fly zone. that's what i've kwawanted to s happen. i think when we get away from the theater of politics and the policy and the ideas of the candidates, things are going to

change i. hope that's what the media and the candidates start looking more seriously at as we go forward. >> you just heard donald trump say in that exchange he had this morning, if some of these candidates do not resonate, they should drop out. you didn't make the debate second tier earlier debate last night. what do you say to donald trump? >> you yoknow, wolf, it's impossible to resonate when you don't get your voice heard. that's the first stem. i think the idea that the polling is based -- the debates are based on early polls, whether or not you're on the big debate or the small debate -- and by the way, you look at the media coverage, and again the first debate got virtually no coverage at all. it becomes about popularity, name i.d. i didn't have a reality show. i haven't run for president before. i don't have a brother who was president. i hope, though, last night did represent a turning point where it's about ideas and about your record and your vision because i know i disagree with a lot of

the things that were said there last night and i believe i could add a lot to the dialogue that the people would like. >> what's the biggest disagreement that you feel you have? where do you stand out? >> well, on the issues first of all, republicans have to embrace science. we never even talk about the environment, climate change, the fact the earth is getting warmer. and what are we going to do about it, ignore it and pretend it isn't happen something or are we going to embraigs innovative next generation solutions that will allow us to both grow the economy and deal with greenhouse gases? everybody talked about their tax plan, and they all have wonderful tax plans. not one of them in my view has the ability to articulate how they're actually going to get it done. and part of the frustration with washington, you say all these candidates, i'm going to do this, i'm going to do that, they get elected and they go, i can't because this is in the way or that's in the way. 12 years as you know, wolf, i had a very democratic legislature in the assembly and put in place reforms. not just what is your plan but

how do you intend to pass that plan? this is something that i think the american people would like to hear. we didn't hear it last night. i hope we do going forward. >> there was some good divisions there, good substantive disagreements, for example, on immigration. you heard what donald trump had to say on the one hand, john kasich the ohio governor on the other hand. where do you stand? >> first of all, i think's absurd to say we're going to put 11 million people on buses or trains or box cars and send them back. not only that, what wasn't really discussed last night in any depth is trump's idea is also to take american-born citizens, children, 9, 10, 11-year-olds who have never been out of this country and deport them. that is not just unconstitutional, it is absurd. i didn't hear anyone on the stage say that his idea was unconstitutional and absurd. i did hear a lot of criticism of amnesty. and i understand that. i am for upholding the rule of law. but i don't think if you require

people to come forward and perform community service, acknowledge they broke the law before they have a pathway to a legalized status that's amnesty. i would have liked to have debated that. yes, wolf, finally it was a good substantive debate. there were differences, but there are a lot of other differences out there that weren't articulated last night that i hope i have the chance to bring to the next table where the people are watching. >> so just bottom line right now, governor, are you still committed, you're good to stay in this race? >> i'm in. i'm going to new hampshire tomorrow and friday and beyond that we're going to continue to make the case. you know, i'm a realist, wolf. i understand where i stand. at some point, either going to have to the resources or the opportunity through the media, opportunities like this, thank you, to make the case to the american people, or the path just isn't going to be there. but i'm not at that point yet but a long stretch. i hope i never get to that point. >> we'll continue to watch together with you. governor pataki, thanks very much for joining us. >> thank you, wolf.

>> that's it for me. i'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in "the situation room" the. for our interview viewers, amanpour is next. for our viewers in north america "newsroom" with brooke baldwin starts right now. and here we go, wolf blitzer thank you so much. great to be with you on this wednesday. i'm brooke baldwin. you're watching cnn. policy, not personalities, dominated the fourth republican debate. you had eight presidential candidates sparring over issues such as syria and the tax code, trade, the minimum wage, the military, and oh, so much more. what emerged here really two kinds of contenders, those truly focused on the republican primary vote and those thinking longer term through the general election. the distinction, though, is perhaps most clear when the candidates sparred over the issue front-runner donald trump credits himself for righting that being of course