him slip out of europe and into syria. a lot of things going on. we'll keep on track of all of them. back to you. >> thank you so much, fred. you'll see him again and us at 10:00. >> smerconish starts now. a pitiful week in american politics. to my ear, no one person has set forth both a strong and yet thoughtful response. last saturday night in des moines, despite isis's claim of responsible for the paris attacks, none of the democratic debaters would use the word radical islam. they all took a page out of the president's book assuming that using the term would be badmouthing all muslims. not true. look at what just happened in ma mali. gunmen stormed the radisson shouting allahu akbar and then

reportedly released some hostages because they could recite the koran. why ignore their motivation. on sunday, at a middle school in myrtle beach, ted cruz told reporters the u.s. should accept only christian refugees from syria. senator cruz, our constitution forbids religious tests. and on monday when asked by the press, the president grew testy. but the questions pointing out that you once referred to isis as a jv squad and more recently you said that isis was contained, they were totally fair. that same day, chris christie whose state shares the statue of liberty off its shore told a radio interviewer that the u.s. couldn't risk allowing anymore syrian refugees not even young

children who had lost their parents. he said, quote, i don't think orphans under five should be admitted into the united states at this point. hey, governor, have you read what it says on that statue? what happened to send us your weary? tuesday i was disappointed to hear the routinely rational governor of ohio john kasich make a reactionary proposal. while speaking at the national press club, he proposed a new federal agency to promote judeo christian values. no, governor. promoting a set of religious values, that's what they do. it only got worse as the week wore on. thursday when a reporter asked donald trump whether his white house would compile a database of all muslims in america, trump replay rereplied absolutely and then he added that he would go i don't understand a database. he later tried to blame his poor response on the reporter's question. mr. trump, such a list doesn't sound fashionist.

it is. that same day in mobile, alabama, ben carson likened some syrian refugees to rabid dwogs. do you realize that you're referring to people that isis itself regards as rate tors? and then the house voted to halt the syrian refugee resettlement program with 147 democrats joining 242 republicans. let me remind everyone, if we reject true funls, we leave them with no choice but to choose between isis and bashar al assad. we're living in trying times that brent a defining opportunity for american politicians to distinguish themselves. and somebody needs to step up and offer solutions as to how we best combat the threat we face from radical islam. i believe it's a combination of sober thinking, a strong response and fewer sound bites. this story is far from over as the hunt for terror suspects continues. brussels is now on high alert. and for the latest, we go to

drew griffin. drew, presume bring they got the specific intel or they would not have closed the metro system. what can you tell us? >> reporter: they said it is an imminent and serious threat. the prime minister went on tv this morning saying that any he had information it was something akin to a paris-type attack, but nothing specific in the targeting and that's what has so many concerned here. the belgian area is a wide region to be on high alert. basically what you're saying, could take place anywhere in the entire city and that's why concert venues have been closed, theaters have been closed, some shops have been closing. and people have been encouraged believe it or not the not to gather in groups. so on the one hand they are reacting to specific information. on the other hand, this is such

a wide ranging threat, it seems pretty clear that belgian authorities don't have a handle on exactly where that threat might be targeted. >> in the span of the last week, a number of individuals have been taken into custody not only in belgian, but unless fwrans. do we know whether this this information came from anyone who has been appre-ended? >> reporter: we know they that one arrest in molenbeek where many of these paris attackers have come from or were hiding prior to the at that time patac. it was one man, he had some weapons, but no explosives found and no suicide explosive vest was found. we don't have the exact timing of that arrest as it relates to the emergency threat measure which was put into place overnight. but the timing is somewhat

suspect in that they made that ride last night and then in the middle of the night, the threat level raised up from three to four belgians highest level, somewhat unprecedented here. >> and finally, why belgium? >> reporter: belgium has been the weak link by all counterterrorism expert animal sis analysis, this country has not been doing now share information and has not been doing enough to get its own information. the prime minister and other security officials vowed to put more manpower and money into fighting the threat where many terrorists have come to plot and plan attacks. >> thank you so much. there is hardly consensus among american politicians as to hour response. my next guest sees the debate as one involving stark choices.

joining me now is the former cia intelligence officer who was this charge of the alex station, the hunt for bin laden at the cia. you know blogs at nonintervention.com. michael, anything i said at the outset that you want to respond to? >> the points you made about fascism is very important. the first thing that happened after attacks was demand for more surveillance of the entire population and collecting their phone numbers and their calls and all of that. the founders were very clear. longer a war goes on, the more power accrues to the central government and he create a despotism. we need an american politician who will stand up and say lrngs america comes first. what do we need to do. the answer at this time is that

for the first time since 1996 when bin laden declared war, we have the ability to break the back of the caliphate. there wasn't one then. there is one now. but to have a caliphate, to have a nation state, you need hydroelectric dams and oil wells and electrical system and cell tower networks and you need minds engrained and a railroad. we have all of those targets, all of those targets play to our strength for a change. but there is not the one person out there who is willing to kill a civilian. so no matter what we do on the periphery, the islamic state and its caliphate continue to grow. basically because we are afraid to behave as if america counted more than anything. >> i read your blog as you know, and it seems to me that you've presented this as an all in or all out proposition. i know what all out looks like. what does all in look like to

you you? >> it would to be take out every piece of infrastructure, hospitals, universities, irrigation systems that a make it impossible for the islamic state to raise money, to provide electricity, sanitation, potable water. do exactly what we did to the germans. this is finally something that our military can do. it can't defeat these people on the ground, but it can destroy buildings and facilities. >> but we don't have the stomach for that. you've advocated not only going after hospitals, but also universities. do you think that the western world, americans in particular, would stand by for the film footage that would be be shown on cnn and elsewhere of the so-called innocent civilian death count? >> i don't know if they would. they should. what's the difference? they're not americans. we're defending ourselves. we wouldn't be there if we weren't attacked. my idea would be to destroy their infrastructure and senator

graham and senator mccain say the arabs are happy do this on the ground. let them do it after we're gone. and if they don't, it's their problem. >> is there anybody on the 2016 stage who is channeling you in the the noninterventionalist path would seem to be a rand paul. all in would be donald trump. where are you? >> i would never vote for anyone who served in the government so far. this government is corrupt. it is uninterested in protecting americans. and it drifts toward fascism. instead of being willing to take the footage you just described, you know, i'm a complete noninterventioni noninterventionist. i would rather get out of there and leave it all to the europeans and arabs to sort it out and come home and let what is going on to continue. and that will an all out shia sunni war. >> so even though you've

described the all-in approach, you say with your years of experience running the bin laden unit at the ci after ta, we sho out and let the sunni and shia forces have at it? >> that's correct. it's almost a god send for these people who believe in ala, ala may not be looking correctly at them because if it comes to a sue a sunni/shia are war, it would be devastating to them. >> i want to show a short video and then ask a question. roll it, please. >> even with combat troops on the ground, we've proven that we cannot preet defeat these people. we are so incompetent in terms of conducting foreign policy and in terms of conducting military operation. >> why are they using you, what is the message they're trying to convey? >> i think they're using the message that what i'm speaking

of is the reality. and their reality and they need that reality to continue to grow the caliphate and to attract people. >> we've lost two wars. not because our marines and soldiers are bad, but because our politicians have lost the idea that fighting involves killing. and until you kill the enemy to the point where he does not want to fight anymore, you will lose. i don't think we have that gumption. so the only option is to come home, squedefend our border, red our military and take care of ourselves and let the rest of the world go wherever they want to go. >> so either all in or stay completely out. and i worry that we don't have the stomach for either. but thank you so much for being here. >> the halfway approach leads directly to fascism. >> so what do you think? tweet me and i'll read some of the best at the end of this

program. just ahead, the new york city police department is stepping up its ability to rapidly respond to terror. with the closing of mass transit in brussels, i want to ask ray kelly what precautions need to be taken here. and as congress turns anti-muslim rhetoric into policy, i'll talk to one key governor who is not shutting the door to syrian refugees. ♪ nothing artificial. just real roasted turkey. carved thick. that's the right way to make a good turkey sandwich. the right way to eat it? is however you eat it. panera. food as it should be. i have a resident named joyce, and i said "come to class,bout let's start walking together" and i said "and i bet you money you'll be able to do that senior walk". that day i said "ok it's me and you girl, me and you!" i said "if you need to stop, there's a bench we'll just hang out in the shade." she said "absolutely not! we are going to finish this race!"

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marie callender's with a crust made from scratch. because when it's cold outside, good food and good company... ...keep you warm inside. marie callender's. we've learned new york city's police department is beefing up its ability to rapidly respond to terror with a new permanent unit that by year's he saend will is more th0 officers. that move has been in the works for a while, but it adds resourc resources. so how safe are americans and how difficult would it be to mount attacks here while many analysts have called the paris attacks sophisticated and coordinated, my next guest disagrees saying they were shockingly simple. ray kelly is former new york city police commissioner, vice chair of k-2 security, he's written a memoir called

vigilance. for the brussels subway to be closed today, you'd think they have pretty specific intel, no? >> it appears that way. in fact that's what they said, it was the result of very specific information. but they're closing a larger area than just in brussels itself. so they have something going on. what it is, we can only guess. >> so here we are about to begin one of the biggest travel week. how concerned are you about americans flying, americans on the new york city subway, americans going back their day to day activities? >> we live in a dangerous world. but in new york's case, new york has done more than any other city in the world to protect itself. this latest move of creating a permanent unit i think is a good move. if i could have done it, i would have. we had a reduction of 6,000 police officers in our head count. this administration is hiring another 1300 police officers. this is a good you've.

but we don't have specific information. i will say this, though, isis will try to do what it says it will do. they don't do too much bluffing. if they say they want to come to the u.s., want to come to new york and washington, i believe they will try to do it. >> chief bratton says we've gone blind regarding technical advances. that isis now has this capability of encryption. will you briefly speak to that concern? >> yeah, we have encryption now that has exploded all over the place. we have apps that are encrypted, cellphones don't allow law enforcement to get into that system. i think it should, but it looks like this administration and certainly the i.t. industry is against that. so we'll have a standoff and the immediate situation is we simply can't get into these iphones and encrypted apps. >> in other words, they have apps now that isis is able to use for terror purposes that

individuals who do what you used to do for a live willing, they can't crack and if i understand what commissioner bratton is sayi saying, we're not getting the support from silicon valley that we need.commissioner bratton is we're not getting the support from silicon valley that we need. >> that's correct. the administration says there is soon a key that will be breached so it defeats the purpose. so, yeah, i don't see it changing anytime soon unless there is legislation from washington that mandates it. >> commissioner, mayor de blasio in new york city ended the dem graf graphics unit. what was that and is there still a need for it? >> it was a unit that would determine who was living in new york city. new york is the most diverse city in the world. and we wanted to know who was in the city. in many ways it's very tribal. it came about in 2003 when we saw suicide bombers in iraq coming from certain towns in

libya. we wanted to know who in new york perhaps is from that area. so it was done above board, it was done in the open. it was never meant to create leads. and as we said many times, people have said no leads coming from this unit, it's like saying derek jeter never scored a touchdown. that was not the purpose of the unit. i'm assuming that function is going on now someplace else in the department without the unit being in existence. >> it seems like so much of the law enforcement activity in belgium is concentrated in one particular neighborhood, a neighborhood where there is a large muslim population. and my recollection is that the hands have been tied here in new york city for doing the type of mapping that you've just referenced because some people use the word profile as a pejorative. speak to that. >> i certainly hope that is going on someplace else in the department. as i say, new york is the most diverse city in the world.

people come from all over. i think it's a very legitimate function of government to know where people are coming from and where they're settling certaiei york city, a city attacked twice successfully and had almost 3,000 people killed about apclear function of government that should be assumed and not touted for its elimination. >> your book is titled "vigilance." thank you for being here. >> thank you. up next in the wake of the paris attack, more than three dozen of america's governors have closed their borders to syrian refugees. i'll talk to one of the few who is letting them in.

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policy. the house easily passed a bill that would expand the program allowing refugees into the u.s. enough to override the promised veto. 31 governors have closed their doors, a dozen are on the fence and only seven states are keeping the door open. including colorado whose governor john hickenlooper joins me thousannow. i'll put up on the screen a macht country that is color closed and shows the relative position of the different governors. you're one of the very few allowing refugees. what is it that you see that you think the others do not? >> well, first, my understanding is we don't really have a choice. in this country, our constitution, our laws say that once someone is legally in the united states, governors can't say that they can't drive through your state, you can't say that they can't live in your state. we have the freedom of mobility.

it's one of the reasons isis hates us. and i think sacrificing that freedom to make a political statement, you look at all the riskterrorists, refugees go through years of background checks. terrorists are gets visas. it's just you out of balance. so our sense is if the president of the united states says that this is our foreign policy and part of our war on terror, then i think i feel that as a governor i took an oath to uphold the laws of this country, i think i have to follow through. >> i know that we invited at least ten of the republicans who feel differently about this to come on and explain themselves and they opted not to. have you satisfied yourself that the vetting process that is currently used for the syrian refugees is satisfactory and safe for colorado residents? >> well, like any governor, the

safety and security of our community is the number one concern. so i have every belief that the federal government is continually trying to improve the vetting and making sure that that screening process goes through. but at a certain point, after 2010, the top minds in the department of state and all the military agencies all worked together on this, the counterterrorism institute -- or counter terrorism center, all these people are doing the best they can and at a certain point you have to say you know back since 1980, we've had millions of refugees come through and so far not one has done an act of terrorism in the united states. >> why then 53% of americans feel differently than you do. why do you think the polling is

as decidedly opposed to your view? i mean, it says only 28% want to resettle 10,000. has this not properly been explained to the american people sf what do you see in that data? >> quelwell, it's an election y so a lot of voices with a lot of different opinions. and anyone who watched the events in paris as they happened, i mean these people are creating terror. but we have to fight back against that. and this is -- we are at war and we have to recognize that winning a war is not just military, we're fighting for the hearts of -- at some point five, ten years from now, syria, we'll win this war and we'll want people to go back to syria and want to live there. and we want them to come with some sense of that this is where democracy can be. and ideally, they will want to live there and defend their country and fight for it in a

way that they can't do or at least they feel they can't do now. >> finally, paul ryan said we cannot let terrorists take advantage of our compass, this is a moment where it's better to be safe than sorry. we were all raised with thatted a damage. why didn't it apply here according to you? >> well, i think -- i think we have to keep improving and make sure our safety is at our maximum highest priority. i don't disagree with that at all. but i also recognize that a terrorist is not going to go through a refugee program where they spend 2 1/2 to 4 years of intensive interrogation and process. these are the candlestick maker, mostly orphans and widows. the reason they are refugees generally is because isis hated them and they were being persecuted or terrorized in

their home country. i think if we send them away, we're playing right into isis' hands. >> they then have a choice of either joining bashar al assad or isis. i get your point. governor, thank you for being here. this week, another governor, john kasich, who is running of course for president, said our government should have a judeo christian values agency. i have a problem with that. isn't that the concept that is awfully close to what isis is all about? and in fact what is the ultimate goal of the isis terrorists? the author of a widely read article, what isis really wants, says it's all about the koran. an american professor who is a muslim scholar says they're criminals and ignoring their religion. both of them are next. for seven, we did battle. until i said... you will not beat...

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i'm asking is our strategy working? >> what strategy? tell me what the strategy is and i'll tell you you if it's working. that right there is the problem because they have a strategy. they're gathering right now in raqqah by the tens of thousands. hidden in the civilian population. and they know exactly why they're there. >> why is that? >> they call it the end times. what do you think the beheadings are about? crucifixions, revival of slavery. do you think they make that [ bleep ] up? it's all in the book, the only book they read it all the time. they never stop. they're there for one reason and one reason only, to die for the caliphate and usher in a world without infidels.

that's their strategy and it's been that way inside since the 7th sent sdhurry. so do you really think that a few special forces teams are going to put a dent in that? >> that scene from the show time series couldn't be more relevant. so what does isis really what? graham wood is it a contributing editor at the atlantic and lecturer at yale. when he wrote an essay with that as the title, it was posted more than a million times on facebook and tweeted more than 41,000 times. and an expert in islamic law also joining us. graham, peter quinn was channeling your essay. isn't that your point? >> yes, he got most of it right. when isis describes what it wants, it wants exactly as is he e says, islamic state closely associated with end times belief, the belief that they are

ushering in the apocalypse by doing this. >> and you say their most ardent followers derive from a coherent even learned interpretation of the cokoran. >> yes, i've. so to followers of sooiisis, ans they know their text. they have a very specific and weird interpretation of the texts, but they read them very carefully. >> is it a weird or literal interpretation? >> it's a kind of literal weird interpretation. there is a long history of islamic law that is not literal in the sense that they read it, but they have a kind of learned view of this that breaks from islamic tradition. but breaks in creative ways that are closely attached to the text that they cite. >> do you agree? >> absolutely not. it is the farthest thing from a learned interpretation, it's a political reading. isis is nothing but a political ideological movement. they're a bunch of criminals that are deforming the religious

text to serve a political agenda. their agenda is a reign of terror that contradicts the overarching moral and humanitarian framework of the koran. the koran and the directives of islam prevent and prohibit the killing of women, children, elderly. december december indicatisecr of worship. if the enemy asks for peace, the koran says you have to give him that peace. this is directly against every tenet of islam. it's a political reegd. it's disjointed. it's in-cohesive and based on the ba'athist regime who have

created thissed agenda. >> is this what we would be if we acted via a literal interpretation of deuteronomy? >> i think that's a good way to look at it. >> we've been able to discount some of that kind of stuff in the older new testament. >> and what he said is i think a good reflection of the mainstream islamic point of view about isis. however, what isis agrees with him about is that they are taking 1,000 years of tradition and reforming it, they're reading it in a different way and in a way -- >> is a reformation needed? >> absolutely not. a reform is not needed. there is discourse and theological discussions going on for 100 years about the role of the koran and the moral message that is in the koran that that has relevant. what we need to do is look at the underlying causes, political

social and economic causes for the rise of isis. isis was created because of our foreign policy in that region and it was created by the regional dictatorships that are in that region that are repressive. and keep in mind all of these tortures and things that we're seeing that isis is doing, these are not new to that region.mubarak regime, assad, saddam did that. this repression, torture, excessive repelling force has been in existence, all has happened is the secular nationalists, for example the pa ba'athist general, he's one l d leader of isis. he's doing the same rerepressio. >> isis when it talks about its origins, they say that it was born out of a vacuum of governance, that the american invasion allowed to come into being. but then they say that they are reviving practices. they are in that vacuum finding a space to take these practices

that they read from the 7th century and then enact them. when they do that, they do it in a way again that is surprising to many people, that is shocking and is in itself i think a kind of reformation. >> it's hard for me to be the arbiter of what islam does or does not represent, but in your piece you quote from a princeton professors who says that they distorted the text is a politically incorrect view. respond. >> there are many people who would simply see practices like slavery, like beheading of infid infidels, say that these have nothing do with islam. they certainly have nothing to do with the practice of islam by most mlu muslims. but their tradition does include these things. so there is a cotton candy view of islam that forgets that these

were practices. >> is he promotings cotton candy view? >> and he is we would aware of the history of islam and well a waiver the many ways that you can interpret islam not to require any kind of be head williwill i heading or -- >> i'm not coming cotton candy. isis is the fringe of the fringe of the fringe. does not represent islam. the problem is not islam. blami blaming islam won't resolve isis. isis will only be resolved by the underlying causes that we need to take care of militarily and political and economic solutions. >> i wish we had more time. thank you. so where do you stand on this debate? tweet me and i will read some of your tweets at the end of the broadcast. just ahead, for me, john kasich has been one of the rational gop presidential candidates. now he want as government agency to promote judeo christian values. i don't think it's a good idea

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presidential candidate john kassic is touting an idea for spreading judeo christian western values which to my mind would make us almost as intolerant as isis. here's whaecpd. >> i will con so tsolidate them a new agency that has the mandate to promote the core of our values, the values of human rights, democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of religion and

freedom of association. >> i want to ask tony perkins about that, president of the family research council. thanks for being here. i've been favorably disposed toward john kasich from what i've seen of him thus far. but that disappointed me. what was yours morning, michae. i actually would have to agree with you on that. i don't think we need more government. i think government is the problem. he with don't need government to promote judeo-christian leaders. we need to respect our constitutional freedoms, the freedom of expression, consistently under attack under the last seven years of this administration. we need elected leaders that are committed to upholding and living by the constitution. >> i no he that governor kasich walked back a portion of that which focused on what you said, the establishment of a new agency or arm of the brocky. that wasn't the troublesome part. troublesome part was that we are

now going to seek to expand our religious interpretation, so-called judeo-christian values. that plays right into the hands of isis. that was the part i was finding problematic. >> let me be very clear. i don't want a government that embraces a religion and promotes a religion. what i want is a government that respects religion, which is what we are supposed to have. i don't want a government that is exporting their brand of christianity or anything else. what i do want is a government, not just me but millions of americans, a government that respects the right of christians to live according to their faith and take that abroad. we do want those principles of religious freedom. that's not an american right. that's a fundamental human right. even the united nations recognizes that. it should be a factor in our foreign policy that when you expect other nations to respect the human right of freedom of religion, which this administration has not done. >> i think we are saying the

same thing. i would expand it to say, freedom of religion or even freedom from religion. you and i both know that the establishment clause says. let me ask you about a related subject. the syrian refugee situation. how does tony perkins look at that. should we be letting them in? >> i think what was expressed by congress this week and echoed by the american people, the concern over the president throwing open the door to syrian refugees was confirmed by the french prime minister yesterday who said the attacks, the terrorists that did the attacks there last week, used the crisis created by the syrian conflict to slip into the country. look, we have an obligation to protect americans. i think what congress did was reasonable. slow down this process. we love those that meet the criteria. i would say the president has proposed a reverse religious test. >> how so in.

>> when you look at who has come in under the president's policy, 97% of them have been muslim. 2.5% christian. if you look at who isis is targeting for administration, christians, uzites. under our own law, they should be given a higher priority. religious persecution is a factor for who is refew gee in this couldn't interest i. >> isn't that a reflection of the fact that christians are few and far between in that part of the world. >> they are 10% of the population in syria. that should at least be reflected in the refugees coming into this country and it is not. >> tony perkins, thank you so much for being here. >> thank you. have a great day! >> you too. your best tweets of the program just moments away.

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i like to say, you can follow me on twitter if you can spell smerconish. a lot of reaction this hour. including a lot of comments about my opening commentary. let me show you some she said. you know, i'll say, stuff, is getting real when smerconish starts his show angry and sounding very hawkish. i think we had a really pitiful week in american politics and

the response from so many of our elected officials is not frankly what it should be. gary c said, excellent opening monolong log. as long as we govern in sound bites, no solid solution exists. >> i think we are being harmed this is playing itself out in political season. all of these thoughts are being condensed in 20-second sound bites and not advancing what needs to be done. >> from julia patrick, we have christians in our own land that distort the bible as isis has done with the koran. remember waco. >> there is justification in the bible for a lot of bad behavior. we have been known to discount it. i think many muslims need to do the same thing with regard to the koran. only to those that perpetrate jihad in the name of ala. did the guest just say, bomb hospitals to stop people who

hate usa pretty sure that's how you make people like you. >> that guest said, we have to go all in or stay the heck out. keep the tweets comi coming @smerconish. i'll see you next week. this is cnn breaking news several breaking stories at this hour. belgian authorities have made an arrest in connection with the paris attacks. they said the suspect's home in molenbeek. >> three mane rested in turkey. qu one, a belgian national. >> the international manhunt continues for salah