-- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com the ban on muslims coming to the u.s. is there a fine line between free speech and hate speech? another american billionaire, tom sayer enters the fray defending american values and what he calls the david and goliath to save our planet.

good evening, everyone. welcome to the program. i'm christiane amanpour, live in new york tonight. donald trump is known to shock, but this time he has shocked, horrified, and disgusted people, not just in the united states, but all around the world. with that call. >> donald j. trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of muslims entering the united states until our country's representatives can figure out what the hell is going on. >> you hear that? the sound of what "the new york times" calls trump's applause lies. for the philadelphia daily news, it's a french page enton dra.

forget muslim terrorists, donald trump is the real danger to america. and at 10 downing street, the british prime minister david cameron completely disagrees with trump, calling the comments divisive, unhelpful, and quite simply wrong. the council of britain said trump ought to be barred in entering the country, for those who espouse hatred have no place in the uk. what does this mean for the presidential race here and the republican party in particular? the newly elected republican speaker of the house paul ryan, said trump's muslim ban is unamerican. >> this is not conservativism. what was proposed yesterday is not what this party stands for, and more importantly, it's not what this country stands for. >> joining me now from boston is one of america's top civil rights lawyers, brian stevenson. mr. stevenson, welcome back to

the program. obviously you've spent your whole life defending and fighting this kind of bigotry. what did you think about where politics is in this country when you heard those comments? >> well, i do think it represents something different. i think people have been tolerating some of the commentary of donald trump. they've characterized it as comical and frivolous, yet deeply offensive and troubling. i think this is worse. this is religious bigotry. it signals something really dangerous in american political life. this is the kind of rhetoric that led to putting japanese-americans in concentration camps in the 1940s. it's the kind of rhetoric that we used to terrorize african-americans in the south. it is the politics of fear and anger. unfortunately, people will buy into it. they like to get revved up and hate someone. and when a presidential candidate engages in this kind of rhetoric, we have to see it

as a real threat. >> look, this country is whetted constitutionally to the first amendment free speech. is there, as many around the world are asking, a distinction between free speech and hate speech, and does this measure up as hate speech? >> i think there's no question this is hate speech, when you are basically condemning all muslims, that all muslims are suspect, that is what we talk about when we talk about hate speech. the difference between our country and other countries is we've always relied on a moral resistance to that kind of demagoguery. unfortunately, the absence of moral resistance is the threat. we don't have laws that say you can't use the "n" word, or you can't degrade women. but we have this consciousness that says that when you engage in that, you should not be rewarded. the problem is that mr. trump is being rewarded, he's being celebrated, hoe's being encouraged to engage in this bigotry.

all americans need to see this as a threat, not just muslims, but all of us. that led to years of bigotry and enslavement, and against catholics and jews and protestants in ireland. until we recognize it is the very element that leads to the kind of bias and discrimination, when george wallace said seg grey gags forever, he was saying the same thing donald trump is saying right now. we've got to recognize that. >> there's obviously a history of this. we're also hearing calls for donald trump's fellow republican presidential candidates to stand up and be counted, and say no to this kind of rhetoric. to that end, lindsay graham said this on cnn earlier. i want you to listen and then we'll talk about the other candidates. >> he's a seen ohphobic

religious bigot. you know how you make america great again? tell donald trump to go to hell. >> that's pretty strong. is that strong enough? and should the other candidates also stand up and be counted? i could read a whole list of some hovering around that bar of big olted comments made by many of the other gop candidates as well. >> well, it is very strong. i think what we have to do is see what other people do. i think you don't accommodate this kind of perspective. you don't host "saturday night live." you don't get engaged by people who are committed to true democracy and justice. you don't get tolerated. what we did to the members of the klan, what we did to people who were engaged in nazism, we isolated and we excluded from legitimacy that kind of sentiment. we can't yet seen the republican party do that, but i think it needs to be talk about it.

this is inappropriate comments, but we need to see more. more than that, we have to see how people respond. >> and finally, you know, even dick cheney, former vice president has come out and condemned these comments in terms of the media. jeffy goldberg said donald trump is now a threat to national security. and demonizing the u.s. and there's also a sense of sort of comedy and anger as well coming from britain, because trump repeated this specious claim that parts of london were so radicalized, that the police dare not go there. and boris johnson said come over to london, our metropolitan police will give you a guided tour to show you that that's not the case. he said the place he would most fear to go in new york where he might run into donald trump. how do you counter this kind of rhetoric?

>> we actually have to start talking to the people who are listening and responding to it. i think if we focus too much just on trump, we're going to miss a bigger problem. there are hate crimes being committed against muslims every day. there are people who are laughing about the victimization of people who are muslims. there are people who are not taking seriously the complaints that the people in the muslim community have been making for 20 years for the way they are targeted and menaced and threatened. i think that means that faithful christians and faithful jews and faithful buddhists say trump's words are meaningful, we are going to embrace this community and call it our own. that's the kind of activism and conversation i think we need to have. it's the way it resonates in a psyche still not ready to engage in the conflicts that these represent. >> thank you for joining us on this day. and just earlier, i spoke

to, as i said, the iconic american film director, actor and writer spike lee. he, of course, is also dedicated his career to challenging assumptions, not only about race, but also class and gender and religion. and i asked him, of course, about his reaction to donald trump's comments. you're an artist. many people here believe rightly that the constitutional protection to free speech is paramount. my question to you is -- >> i'm not saying he can't say what he says, but the stuff he's saying, i hope that was -- when it gets down to it, that these statements he keeps saying are going to pile up, and people are going to be like, we're not voting for you. i mean, what would it say to the world if trump got elected? what does it say -- what would it say to global society? when we go around the world saying we're the beacon of

democracy, and, you know, the constitution, human rights, all that stuff, and then he's the president? we don't have that moral foundation anymore. because you listen to the stuff that he says, you know. i don't think that's what the united states is about. >> many people believe that he is a master showman, a master attention seeker, and that every time he has a dip in his polls, he throws these verbal grenades, these political and cultural grenades out. what do you say about his ability to capture the headlines, as a showman? >> well, what did p.t. barnum say? there's a sucker born every minute? but, look, there's no negating the fact that he's a great showman. but we're talking about the highest office in the united

states of america. this is not a tv show. this is someone who -- the president has the guy next to him, who got that box, and i've seen that box. i've seen the box. and one thing, and one code -- >> you're talking about the nuclear code. >> yes. i've seen the box. i had a fund-raiser for the president. i saw the box. that's scary. it's even scarier if he -- i don't want trump anywhere near that box. nowhere near it. >> and tomorrow, we'll have the rest of my interview about spike lee's latest film, just opening here in the united states. and timing is everything. it is, of course, about the epidemic of gun violence here. and as we take a break, we want to recall a past national

hysteria. the height of the cold war, and the red baiting by wisconsin senator joe mccarthy. back then, a towering giant of american broadcasting, edward r. morrow set the compass of the media straight. >> the defenders of freedom wherever it continues to exist in the world. but we cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home. the actions of the junior senator from wisconsin have caused alarm and dismay amongst our allies abroad and given considerable comfort to our enemies. and whose fault is that? not really his. he didn't create this situation of fear. he merely exploited it. and rather successfully. cashus was right, the fault is not in the stars, but ourselves. good night, and good luck. believe it.

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change. it seems many politicians are willing to go places where few others would dare to tread. if there's a single truth to american politics, it is that money talks. one man trying to use his billions to bring what he calls common sense back to politics is tom sayer. in the course of a few years, he's made himself a must-see donor for any democrat seeking office here in the united states. when i spoke to him earlier today from the climate summit in paris, he told me the fight there is david versus goliath. tom stayer, welcome to the program. >> christiane, it is wonderful to be here. >> i'm sure you didn't expect me to ask this as my first question, as you're there for the climate conference. but you are a very heavyweight democrat with a lot of activism and money behind causes for your party. i wonder what you make of what some may feel verges on hate speech by the leading republican presidential candidate last night, donald trump when he said

ban all muslims from coming to the united states? >> well, i think that when people are upset, and worried, that is the time when you have to make sure that you stick to your deepest values. and that you represent best what america stands for. and i think that president obama stood up and did that in his speech. and i think that for americans who have had the dubious pleasure of hearing mr. trump sound off in various ways, that none of us really appreciate, we have to realize that he has a right to free speech, however much we deplore what he has to say. but in times when people are worried, the key is not to lose your head, not to go to the places that he chooses to go, but in fact to realize that that is the time when your deepest values have to come into play. >> let's transition from that to what you're doing in paris right now. because obviously there was this terrible terrorist attack, and yet the city, the country has

received so many hundreds of world leaders, also people like yourselves, activists who want to do something for the environment. what can you tell people about the economic benefits? because they all say, hang on, this is going to penalize us if we do something different on climate change. >> well, christiane, you're absolutely right, the go-to move for our opponents is to claim that any progressive energy, policy, is a job-killing energy tax. let me say, that's the reason i'm in paris. i'm in paris, along with governor brown, leading a delegation of california business people, to show the world that that statement by our opponents is false. the fact of the matter is, the places that have progressive energy legislation like california are growing faster than the united states -- than the rest of the united states of america. so we have created jobs in the last few years faster than the u.s.

we've grown faster than the u.s. and our analysis is, to date, and going forward, moving to progressive energy policies creates net jobs, raises people's incomes, and lowers their energy bills. so that i have not seen any justification for the other side's claims, and we have spend a ton of time and effort to make sure what is true to date and will continue to be true. the fact of the matter is, from our point of view, it's inevitable we'll create hundreds of thousands of clean energy jobs, and the question will be will they be good paying jobs and distributed throughout society, and i believe that they will be. >> let me get back to politics again. you've been a supporter of hillary clinton in the past. you've held fund-raisers for her but you have not actually come out and endorsed her this time around. why not, and do you think you will? >> what we're trying to do is take advantage of the presidential election process to push candidates from every

party, including mrs. clinton, including every democrat and every republican, to come out with what their program and program is to get us on a sustainable economic path. what we defined that is, to get at least 50% clean energy by 2030. we're asking every candidate, including mrs. clinton, to be specific. because i think the time to talk about the science is over, and we think the time for good intentions is over. what we want is specific plans. so right now we're waiting to see how that turns out. we believe that every candidate is going to have to talk at length about energy. we believe that ultimately every candidate, including republicans, is going to have to accept the science, and start to talk about solutions. >> tom, on that note, thank you for joining us from paris. >> christiane, it's a beautiful rainy day here in paris. when we come back, we imagine standing up to bigotry and fear. words that ring true through history. that's next.

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finally tonight, imagine a world of global threats and chilling fears, where actions and reactions can mean life or death. the action by the united states government to deny refuge to jews fleeing hitler's persecution, turning a boatload away in 1939, meant they had to return. many to the death chambers. fearmongering is classic political populism, and too often it clouds individual conscience. so tonight, we end with the eloquent and piercing call to conscience by pastor martin nemolay, written a year after he was liberated from a concentration camp where he had been sent for opposing the nazis' control of churches.

he said first they came for the socialists, and i did not speak out because i was not a socialist. then they came for the trade unioners. and i did not speak out, because i was not a trade unionist. then they came for the jews. and i did not speak out, because i was not a jew. and then they came for me. and there was no one left to speak for me. reflections of doing not the wrong, but the right thing. and that's it for our program tonight. remember, you can always see our show online, listen on our podcast and follow me on facebook and twitter. thank you for watching, and good night from new york.

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hello to our viewers joining us from the united states, and welcome back to our viewers from around the world. i'm rosemary church. >> and i'm errol barnett. despite the swift political backlash, donald trump is not retreating from his controversial proposal to ban all muslims from entering the united states. world leaders are denouncing the republican front-runner's statements. >> investigators say the attackers in the california massacre appear to have been radicalized at least two years ago.