targets that they have outlined, it will take a lot more than a few admittedly nifty technologies. thank you for being part of my program this week. i'll see you next week. good morning. it's time for reliable sources. our weekly look at the story behind the story of how news and pop culture get made. we're coming to you live this morning from the vegas strip. two days before the next cnn republican debate. let's take a live look inside the theater. the stage look like it's almost read for the bakers dozen of candidates who will be squaring off in two separate debates. it's a majestic room for this debate. cnn has something called the cone of silence. it's a room where the moderators, questioners, researchers all write questions and prepare for every possible

answer. moderator wolf blitzer will be there all day. thank you smouch for coo much f the show. >> thank you. >> let's look at the it's a debate. >> i'm wolf blitzer and i'm with cnn. what is the definition? senator john mccain low pressure governor perry. >> i'm sorry. blitz. i meant wolf. >> that's all the time we have. please give a hand to our candidates. >> after all those debate, how do you think this one will be different? >> i'm sure the viewership will be larger, probably because of donald trump. he keeps saying that. he's probably right.

this debate, our debate is simulcast on cnn international. >> and on cnn.com. >> there will be millions and millions of people watching. >> are the topics different? >> we'll focus on number one issue facing the american people right now and all the polls suggest it's the fear of terrorism. isis. we're going to go into national security and make sure our viewers and voters out there have the better appreciation with these candidates are after the debate as opposed to going into the debate. we want to make sure they appreciate where the candidates stand on the most important issues of the day. that's where the american public is right now. >> you mentioned other subjects. climate change come up to. >> possibly. all the major issues are out on the table. when you mention the cone of silence, that's what we do. together with other questioners,

we go through producers and researchers. we really have flow wheto know e candidates stand. what they have said in the past? what they're attitudes are on the important issues. where they agree and disagree. we study it an it's a lot of work in that code of silence. we don't want to give out information where they are going but we want to make sure the questions are smart, concise, to the point and let the candidates have an opportunity to explain to voters out there where they stand. >> i have never heard that phrase before i joined cnn, the cone of silence. why do you have that space? >> we don't want the candidates to know the questions. if too many people are aware of the questions. that's not what we want. it's a conference room. it's not much of a cone of silence. >> sounds kpieexciting. >> it's a conference room. we have serious discussions and

come up with really responsible and fair questions. on these issues that we'll focus on a lot in this debate, national security, the war on terrorism, international affairs. these are areas i've been covering for a long time. i feel comfortable going into this debate. i think our viewers will be happy because they will learn something. >> you mentioned the expectation for viewership. we have seen 15, 20, 25 million in the past maybe 5 million would have been tuning in. does that put extra pressure on you? >> no. i've done five in 2007, 2008 cycle. i did three in the last cycle. the people does make a difference. there's still millions of people that will be watching. the pressure is enormous. you want to be responsible and fair. you want to be precise. you want to be accurate. you want to be prepared in case one of the candidates says something that may be different than what he or she said a week

or two earlier. you want to make sure you're up to speed. it is a debate. you want to let the candidate explain their positions where they agree and disagree. >> do you want them to face off? where you writing questions that cause two candidates to speak with each other? >> no. i think what we're doing is writing questions that will allow the viewers out there, and you point out, there will be million, to better appreciate where candidates stand on the most important issues. if they agree, fine. we want to be precise and make sure we get some specifics from the candidates. >> when there was so much blow back after the cnbc debate, does that create a chilling effect for a moderator like you coming into this later in the cycle? >> no. i've done this before. i'm pretty familiar with the format. i know all of these candidates want in. they all want to weigh in. we have rules. how many seconds they can give in their opening comment and

give in rebuttals and follow ups and stuff like that. there's pretty specific rules. a debate is different than a one-on-one interview. when you're doing a one-on-one, you can follow up and go in. if the candidate doesn't really answer, you can say with all due respect you didn't answer the question. in a debate, it's different. you want the candidates to weigh in. this is not about me. this is about the candidates. i want to make sure that when i throw out a question, they answer the question. if they attack someone else in the process, give that other person a chance to respond. >> my last question, is the biggest challenge donald trump? this is the question that came up before the first debate of the cycle. is there a special plan if donald trump trying to take control or turn it back on you? >> if you look at his appearances in the earlier debates, i don't think he's tried to do this. you don't get to this level of politics, even if you're not a politician. donald trump is not.

dr. ben carson is not. you don't get to this level of politics unless you're smart, articulate, you know something about what's going on. they each bring something and all challenging from my perspective as a moderator. >> any predebate rituals? >> i try to get a good night sleep the night before. i go to the gym and work out. >> no gambling. >> i try to just go in with a positive attitude knowing i'm really feel blessed i have this opportunity to ask some serious, important questions to someone who may or may not become the president of the united states. there's the possibility one of those men or women could be the next president of the united states. when you're a journalist and you have that opportunity, you have that responsibility. you take it very, very seriously. i'm grateful to cnn and our viewers that they allow me to do this. >> back to the cone of silence for you. >> i'll be going to the cone of silence. >> wolf will take the stage at

6:00 p.m. eastern, 3:00 p.m. pacific time on tuesday. you can watch on cnn.com as well as on this channel and cnn international. this morning there's big poll news out of iowa. a brand new register poll showing ted cruz jumping to a ten-point lead over donald trump in iowa. a fox poll says they are tied. how will these new poll numbers change the media's narrative heading into the actual election year. let's ask our panel here in las vegas with me. the man to call about nevada politics. let me start with you john. what makes the setting for this debate different? we are in a billionaire donor's

hotel. >> we are. he's the audience of one that a lot of these folks will be talking to. they want his money. he wants to be with a winner this time. he invested a lot in newt gingrich. he's taken his time. there are reports that he likes marco rubio. people close to him tell me that's true. his wife likes ted cruz. >> we're heading into a crucial last debate. by the time everyone gets back from the holidays, it will be january. what do you think the candidates have to be asked? what do they have to answer in order to stand out before the holiday season? >> i think the dynamic of the race is coming into some se semblance of order for the first time which makes the debate more

important. that's one reason. the other reason is we have this period of time after the debate, the numbers aren't going to really move because ads over the holidays don't usually work. campaign ng the ming in the mid christmas and new years doesn't work. this debate will freeze the race and the aftermath of this. have an incredible amount of pressure. the most pressure is on the folks, whoever the establishment person is needs to emerge. right now this race looks like it's donald trump, ted cruz and one other person who is an established person, rubio, marco rubio. can chris christie get back into that moment and do well enough to sort of jump over him and be the establishment figure. this race for now has forced itself into a dynamic that this debate becomes the most important debate of the process going into the iowa caucuses. >> andrew, are you seeing the

media narrative shift toward ted cruz. what do you make of the polls that showing him surging. what do you expect in the press cover as a result? >> i think it makes sense. ted cruz is coming into focus as looking like republican front-runner, at least challenger to donald trump. he's leading in iowa. i think he's gained a lot of the support that ben carson has lost after his collapsed. when it became clear he didn't know what he was talking about on foreign policy and terrorism. i think more attention paid to cruz in the attention. you've seen the leaked audio with his talk from donors about his plan to go after donald trump. attract trump supporters and we'll see, it will be interesting to see how trump or how cruz handles trump does the

debate. he'll have ample opportunity to go after him but whether or not he does and sticks to his plan, we'll see. >> we'll take a short break. stick around. we have a lot to discuss after the break including a big media mystery. later, a journalist, a muslim, wrestling with how to cover donald trump's campaign. the new york daily news making quite a splash with its front pages lately like this one showing donald trump beheading the statue of liberty. we'll talk with the editor in chief and ask is there anything he won't put on the cover.

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welcome back. we're talking about donald trump because he gets constant media coverage. some positive, some negative. this week was different after trump proposed a ban on muslims in the u.s. i think you could feel a real change. you could tell that journalists were shocked. some called it unconstitutional and un-american. buzz feed editor and chief said it's okay to call trump a racist. some compared him to hitler and revered nbc anchor tom brokaw

decided to write this unusual editorial. >> trump statement even in the season of extreme s dangerous proposals that overrides history, the law and the foundation of america itself. >> what does our panel think of this week? has something changed? let's bring our panel back here. andrew, are you sensing push back from conservative media circles? you bought your staff the make america great again hats but times have changed. >> times have changed. i think a lot of people and a lot of conservatives too were entertained, amused by trump when he first got in the race. it's becoming a lot less funny now with his kind of blatant fear mongering and the ban on muslims. it's not as funny anymore. i think you're starting to see a lot of people get fed up.

you see the republican establishment is panicking a little with their plan to what are they going to do, a brokered convention to prevent trump from becoming the nominee. it's not funny anymore. it's totally fair for the media to kind of call him out on this. i think the practical impact is that a lot of people supporting trump just don't trust the media and it will like them make trump even more. >> i think a lot of us will ask are we proud of our trump coverage. i think there will be a lot of different answers. she said dear former colleagues, give us a week without trump. she said she can't because they would violate her proposal to not talk about trump for a week.

is there any logic to a proposal like that? >> no. donald trump is the dominant candidate in this race. he's as dominant as many other candidates that won in gop nomination in the past. the other thing i want to address is the muslim question is donald trump has not dropped support in those polls. one of reasons for that is if you take a look at the polls even though a majority of americans are posed to his views, they are in support of his views on these issues. this is isn't a media thing that the media has to take trump down, which i do not like that whole narrative where the media is responsible for taking donald

trump down. it's up to the voters to figure out what they want to do. the voters agree with limb on these issues. >> i want to put up a treat from you earlier this week. you wrote we're at disturbing time in america. tribal identity trumps the truth. do you agree that we're post-truth? >> people who support donald trump don't care about the truth. they care that trump is staying what they believe. he's standing up for people. brown's proposal, i understand her frustration but it's silly. you can't ignore the dominant front-runner in this race. i don't think anyone should be shocked or should have thought trump was funny from the word go.

this is a guy who has talked about rounding up illegal immigrants and deporting them. he said awful things about almost every other candidate in this race. >> when he makes fun of rand paul for being on the stage, his tendency to criticize people blatantly unlike any politicians, compared to other politicians he makes them all look stiff and his ability to stay anything. when he first got into the race, at least a little refreshing and kind of amusing. once he started actually proposing policies, it got a little more real and less entertaining. >> before we go here, since we're in las vegas, john one more question about a very

strange story out of this city. this is the las vegas review journal. it was purchased on thursday. we don't know by who. >> this is one of the strangest story not just here but the history of newspapers. it was told for 38 million more. not only are the owners refusing to reveal themselves, you have reporters tweeting yesterday how outraged they are that they don't know who owns their newspaper so they don't what kind of conflicts of interest might exist. how many major newspapers you know of, we don't know the owners are? >> zero. there are some guesses about who might have bought it. >> there's been speculation that the guy who owns the place behind us, sheldon adleson, who owns a newspaper in israel that he wields to get political influence. i know there's talk about him

purchasing a newspaper. there's no way to tell. >> so far no comment from him about that. >> i think the pressure will be so enormous on this newspaper to reveal the owners that i think they will have to come out. >> a story we'll stay on top of great to see you. thank you for joining the conversation. a perspective you've not heard in all of trump's proposal. it's a perspective of muslim americans who cover trump. hear the journalist point of view, next. this is the best block of all. it's like candy cane lane. i know. oohhh. oh, holiday ferris wheel. i kind of love it. look at those reindeer. jeffrey, you're awfully quiet back there.

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welcome back. what frightens us is not trump's word but his popularity. that's what the editor of the arab american news told me yesterday. by now you've seen the headlines about donald trump's proposal. this is what fareed zakaria said earlier this morning. >> in today's political climate, i must embrace another identity. i'm muslim. i'm not a practicing muslim. the last time i was in a mosque was decades ago. i'm completely secular in my outlook. as i watch the way in which republican candidates are div e divididivid dividing america, it's important to acknowledge the religion to which i was born.

yet that doesn't represent me or my views. i'm appalled by his bigotry not because i'm a muslim, but i'm an american. >> appalled, he said. he was travel ng ting in the uk trump announced his proposal. how are people outside the u.s. reacting to trump's announcement? >> they are kind of fascinating. most people didn't take it seriously. most people in the uk said he wants to ban donald trump from the united kingdom. most people didn't think it was real. when people have to cast a ballot or put their hands up that these outlandish views won't hold much water. it didn't care much weight outside the united states. most people are looking at this election with remarkable interest wondering where it's

going to go. i was shocked. i tweeted donald trump say please don't implement this until i get back to the united states otherwise i'll get stuck in the uk. >> at a moment like this, do you feel a responsibility to speak not just as a journalist but a journalist who is muslim. there's not a whole lot of representation or television air waves. there's no muslim jorge ramos. there's a big national hispanic organization that's criticize d trump. there isn't that version in the u.s. >> it hasn't reached critical mass in way to cause there to be these organizations. i think fareed said it so well. i tweeted out what he said. i got some really nasty responses and so did he about going back homes and things like that.

i don't get up in the morning and identify based on the color of my skin. there are many muslims who identify very clearly with their religion, but that's not how they think of themselves on a daily basis. we don't think of ourselves as terrorists or having anything to do with has to terrorists. until the pressure builds to the point you have to answer for other muslims, you don't see a particular need to do so. that said, there's an impression out there that mainstream muslims don't come out and say enough in opposition to terrorists. i like to point out, mainstream muslims are your taxi drivers, pharmacists, accountants. they don't see themselves, they don't identify with them. what they do identify with is candidates like trump and others, most of the others in the republican line up, who want to single out muslims as an

entire group for the actions of identifiable extremists. that's the part that becomes troubling. >> on television, on the air waves, online we need to hear from muslims who are journalists. let me end with one tweet this morning from one of your colleagues. he was watching one of the other sunday morning shows. some unnamed network and he wrote he saw four white pundits and a white host debating donald trump's muslim comments and he wrote sigh. we'll leave it there. thank you so much for being here this morning. >> thanks. coming up, has one daily newspaper gone too far with its over the top front page coverage to come tear trump's suggested ban on muslims to the early days of nazism? i'll ask right after this.

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provocative, surprising, sometimes even upsetting. that's what the new york daily news wants the front pages to be. take today's cover. it calls out the nation's four largest gun makers calling them merchants of death and showing the faces of the ceos. this has some questioning whether the paper is crossing the line to make a point or doing this in a desperate attempt to remain relevant and sell papers. i spoke to the daily news editor in chief. i asked when it comes to his front covers, how far is too far? >> is there such a thing as too far for the daily news? suggesting that trump is like isis, beheading someone or something, would seem too far. >> with it being a cartoon, i think you have some leeway there. i would argue that the power of that poem and of the imagery what made it resonate so well

with many, many people. we didn't get a lot of push back on this as we had with some of our covers on the gun violence issue. >> let's take a look at one of the most talked about covers from your tenure as ed titor. this is from december 3rd right after the attack in san bernardino. it said god is not fixing this. with all the the tweets from republican politicians saying their thoughts and prayers are with the victims. this was so hotly debated on fox news. do you feel your message was lost? >> i think it may have been by some people. that may have been unintentional or intentional in many cases. it was convenient to try to shift the conversation and the narrative onto the accusations that the daily news is condemning either god, religion or prayer. >> your headline said they were

hiding behind meaningless platitudes. that would see offensive to so many religious americans. >> they should be offended by the politicians have a track record of highing behind prayer and these meaningless platitudes. it's the only thing they are offering to a solution to what's a tremendous problem facing the american people right now. >> the next day your cover was titled he's a terrorist and showed other people you called terrorists, including the head of the nra. at what point do you all approach the line toward hate speech? >> i think hate speech is -- i think we're going a little too far if you're going to label that cover hate speech. we're just pointing out -- >> i'm just trying to put myself in wayne's shoes. he see a tabloid newspaper cover with his face and the word terrorist. >> the point of that cover was

to make sure we do not shift the conversation, to solely speaking about the terror angle on the shooting in san bernardino, which 100% it was. the bigger point is there was tied to the gun violence issue. as far as his concern, we have spent the better part of three weeks reaching out to him every day. we have extended the offer to write an op-ed for us which would appear in our paper and online. we have heard nothing. the stone walling and the bait and switch that goes on by the lobby -- from the lobby that he represents to us is a form of terrorism. it terrorizes the safety of innocent american people. >> you received so much attention online for this next cover. this was a few days after all your gun crusade covers. it says everything is awesome.

it was satire. tell us why you decided to go in this direction. >> we had been receiving significant amount of criticism for several of the back pages and calling attention to the lack of debate and true resolution or solutions to the issue that we're facing. we thought, well, okay, we have tried hitting people over the head with this. we have tried being as blunt as we can. some people don't want to talk about it. why don't we just give them what they want? >> which is puppies and -- >> puppies and everything is awesome. it ties in awesome to if you saw the lego movie. it has to be something that people are already fired up about. that isn't 100% the case. that goes a long way. a great image has illustrated by

the cartoon on trump is incredibly important. you've got to find the words and you've got to frame them -- it's got to be framed in way that's going to give you that punch in the gut. it's going to give that punch in the gut or make you angry or sad or it's going to make you happy. it's going to illicit some sort of emotion and that leads to some further thought on the issue. >> thank you for being here. >> thanks for having me. when we come back, one of the most popular podcasts is back. the surprising answers from the npr ceo when we come back. ♪ is it the insightful strategies and analytical capabilities that make edward jones one of the biggest financial services firms in the country? or is it 13,000 financial advisors

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tand that's what we're doings to chat xfinity.rself, we are challenging ourselves to improve every aspect of your experience. and this includes our commitment to being on time. every time. that's why if we're ever late for an appointment, we'll credit your account $20. it's our promise to you. we're doing everything we can to give you the best experience possible. because we should fit into your life. not the other way around.

welcome back. welcome back to reliable sources. fans of cereal are abuzz. season two had a surprise premier this week. it features the first interview with beau bergdahl who was held captive for five years. when i sat down with the ceo of national public radio, he said even though it's not produced by npr, the success is propeeling the whole medium of podcasting. >> our place in the food chain of information and journalism is to just be very rational, calm, to report the facts. not to stake out a position. we don't take editorial positions of any sort. >> there's this perception that

donald trump has helped television networks. do you find that to be true for radio as well? >> we haven't done the study. if you do an analysis of all the news organizations that donald trump has done with news organizations and us, i think we would come in pretty low in terms of the rankings. >> you haven't contributed to the constant, never-ending coverage? >> we cover him when there's something of merit and substance to cover. we're not using him as, to use his term, a ratings machine. i think he is ratings machine in the television world. that's not our place in the journalism food chain. we haven't kind of covered him that way. we don't intend to. >> when you look to the television coverage has it felt exploitative to you? >> i think some of it has.

>> how do you go about figuring out how to replace someone like diane rehm? >> it's hard to replace someone like her. she's been on air for 37 years. she's a great broadcaster. she's developed an amazing show and audience. it will be a loss for public radio. we work with the station in washington, d.c., wamu, our member station. they even be producing the show. we distribute it. i'm having lunch with the president of that organization next week to kick around ideas about where we go. it does create an opportunity for us to bring in new, younger voices. some of the approaches we have taken on podcasting which has been attractive to the millenial group. we think it's great opportunity. >> what is this podcast moment all about? even folk who is have never plugged in and listened to one have heard of cereal? >> it's all that story telling.

that's a reason i'm optimistic about npr and radio in general because of the programs we do. it's really about story telling. we >> and it's very informal and it's a mix of some of our new younger reporters and some of the people that have been covering politics nationally for years and years and mixing them together. it's a great blend. that is the new voice of what public radio is, new voice of npr. it's doing really well. and it's serious. there's nothing frivolous about it at all. up next, we are going inside the world of virtual reality. i'll ask about the future of it and its place in the future of media. ...that sound good?

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to give you the best experience possible. because we should fit into your life. not the other way around. welcome back to "reliable sources" live in las vegas. home to tuesday's presidential debate here on cnn. at our last debate, cnn did something unique, placing special cameras all around the theater to live stream that event in virtual reality. now it seems that every big news outlet is experimenting in vr. others are left asking what the heck is it exactly. i'm going to try to answer that question for you in today's episode of new tube. >> it could be the biggest leap

in capturing our world since the photograph. this is virtual reality. now, when you hear vr, you might imagine people wearing headsets and waving their arms. you might think it's a joke. but when you actually see it, try it, you stop laughing. all around the world, engineers are fine tuning technology that immerses you in a 3d experience. giants like facebook are betting big that we'll be strapping goggles to our head in the next few years. >> i think that virtual reality has the potential to be the most connecting technology of all time. >> he created oculous as a teenager. >> i was a science fiction enthusiast. using vr particularly for video games. >> in 2012, he used kickstarter

to try to keep his project afloat. and he ended up raising nearly $2.5 million. >> we were one of the most successful crowd-funding campaigns at the time. not because a bunch of studios came in, it's because people said we really want that. >> last year, facebook brought his startup for $2 billion. >> i've seen vr before, but this was by far the best experience i'd ever seen. i was seeing the next great technology platform that's going to define the way that we all connect in the future. >> hold on. give me a minute here. if you're like me, hearing other people talk about individuvirtus is not very compelling. it's the see it to believe it problem. so this is the best i can show you.

watch the first time i ever played games inside. >> it's like being in a child's play room. knocking on a ball. someone firing at me. i'm firing back. i can point at the other player -- are you next door? i'm grabbing a slingshot. as i pull it back with my other hand -- it's actually really hard to put into words. >> how do you describe individual wall reality? >> it has that power to really allow you to do anything, anything you can imagine doing in the real world you can do plus the whole new set of experiences that are not possible in the real word. >> you can hear where he's going in this. live news events in vr. even face to face meetings. >> once you can do that well enough, you really remove the need for people to travel and

burn tons of jet fuel to get around the world. you remove the need to have massive conferences just to get people in the same room talking to each other. >> will his dream come true? sony has a project, htc, then microsoft's hollow lens, and google cardboard. but virtual reality doesn't always come cheap. it's expected to cost $1500. >> i think our biggest challenge is driving the quality up and the cost down. >> the public might reject vr, but oculus has the potential to change the definition of a screen. because you forget you're looking at a screen at all. >> we invented photographs, radio, television, and then the internet. do you believe vr is the next in

that line? >> it's not only its own new medium, it's capable of emulating all prior mediums. within the next few years, we would probably have a meeting in virtual reality. i could be sitting on a bench in southern california or in the smog of los angeles. to us, it doesn't matter, we're both wearing vr headsets and feeling like we are right now, in the same place. >> i think i'm going to ask for a vr headset for christmas. "state of the union" with jake tapper starts right now. on the campaign trail, one on one with donald trump. after the republican front-runner's call to ban muslims from coming to the u.s. is called bigoted, unconstitutional, and worse, how does he justify it? >> there's a group of people, it's a problem. everybody knows it's a problem.