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we have exceptional guests. a retaliation sniper attack leaves five police officers dead. among my question, what's the future of the black lives matter movement. the political convention, the candidates strike different tones on this climate of violence. and, as anchor great chen charlton, she loves a cocktail, a sexual harassment suit. also, hillary clinton seeing a landmark for woman. our malcolm blackwell is here. >> what are the implications of this week's shootings of black men and police. five officers dead and another wounded in dallas. joining me now is charles

ramsey, a former commissioner of the philadelphia police department and former washington dc police chief and he was a coach of president obama's task force on 21st century policing. chief, i recently reread the recommendations of your task force where law enforcement takes the life of an individual, did you go far enough in terms of what you recommended? >> well, in retrospect, i think we could have gone further. the recommendations are good solid recommendations. we still have issues. we still have problems and looking at it now and i have to have a bit of disclaimer of what i am about to say, it is not coming from the task force. the only person i discuss this is lawyer robinson who's my coach chair in the task force. i believe we can take a step further. the investigation of officers involved shootings that involved injuries or death or any in custody death.

i believe that one way of solving the problem would be for the attorney general to establish within each u.s. attorney's office which it covers the entire united states and its territory, a team within that u.s. office. that could be made up of fbi or law enforcement officials or a member of the community of that particular u.s. attorney office covers and assisted u.s. attorneys to look at every shooting that takes place by police officers anywhere in the country doing independent investigations. now, that's not a civil rights investigation. if we find the course of investigation, there were civil rights vai realizati rights -- there is a lack of trust among the community that

police agencies can conduct investigations of themselves and quite frankly even surrounding jurisdictions looking at another police department, i don't think it is far enough. if we had to do it again, that'll be the recommendation. >> as i look at recommendations 2.22, 2.23, i think charles ramsey is making some news in so far you are now saying in every officer there ought to be a unit that would investigate each one of these shootings. >> we have to face facts. i think about what director comey of the fbi said a year ago of there are hard truth we have to face as a society. this is one of them. we lack the credibility to do this in a way that convinces the public it is fair and impartial. i think that's important. it does not mean the department or the people are hate doing it, it is about trusts and perception. we have to face that reality and that's one recommendations.

i think it is a concrete step that could be taken that would do a lot to move in the right direction. i also think that we have too many police departments in the united states, we have about 18,000 police departments. it is hard to have consistency and policy training s and procedures. most departments in the united states have fewer than 50 police officers. there has to be a serious effort towards regionalization merging these. the goal is to cut the number of departments in half in the united states. >> chief. >> again, these are steps that's going to take some time but we can do it. >> i want to ask you about the subject of disproportionality. i hear some saying african-americans are disproportionate and singled out. others responded and said well, crime is committed in the

african-american community. you say what to that issue? >> i say everybody is right. again, it is another hard truth, we have to take a look at police and look at ourselves and how we go about it and how we police in communities. communities have to take a hard look at themselves as well. they're approximately 13 homicides that take place. those are not police shootings, these are people killing other people. we have got to face the fact that we got issues there. there are drivers and there is society issues. we got dysfunctional education systems and dysfunctional families. these things are long-terms and they got to be addressed and fixed. we are not getting out of this. we are going to go from viral video with the same issue.

at some point we got to sit down and have thoughtful discussions and follow led by concrete actions. the use of the robot in dallas, do you have due process concerned? >> well, i have not heard about that before. i think under the situation and circumstances, you have no other options. you already have police officers shot. he made it clear that he was not finished. it was a unique situation that required unique tactics in order to resolve it. i don't know anymore than you know how it was used. i think that we have to take a look at that as an individual situati situation. i am sure he made that decision with careful consideration but they had to bring that thing to the end. they cannot have more people killed by this guy. >> i appreciate your analysis,

thank you chief ramsey. >> thank you, michael. >> a new yorker peace about this week's shooting by police and the contact -- those words were uttered by a gunman in dallas meaning any movement under that matter may well have met its end. what does the future holds? >> joining me now vanderbilt university and civil rights atea matter movement. >> i hope so, it is a destructive view in america. it is a markist organization all

about black liberations. it is not really address the real problems affecting to african-americans. it is problematic and misleading black people and it needs to go. >> that's ridiculous. black lives matter has none more top move the needle on reform of the system all over this country. i live in los angeles, the los angeles police department, we are the largest police department in the country now is equipped with body cameras, that shows police departments all over this nation primarily because young people primarily took to the streets, black lives matter to raise the issue of in equities in the criminal justice system. just because one lone individual, criminal who's not affiliated with the black lives matter group does nwhat happene

in dallas shoots those cops, you cannot equate of what he did. it is a movement that's raising the issue of the justices and the disproportionality of racial bias in their system. i think they ought to be credited and empowered and push the needle where this thing we are tackling this country called justice. >> professor, i think you are saying you are not excluding the action of this lone man and you don't like what you see >> no, it is marxium and it talks at genocide, i urge your viewers to go to the black lives matter website and read their own definition of what does black lives matter means. in the case of the two recent police shootings, videos don't

tell the entire story. if you look further in the case of the shooting in louisiana, the guy was a convicted felon. he had an illegal gun and he resisted arrest. in the case of minnesota where you had the girlfriend video tape and the other video tape she had on her facebook and the other one she and her boyfriend sitting in her car, that video is out there and so we have to look at the credibility of the witnesses and we need to not rush to judgment and i find that media, they're putting too much focus on ton videos. >> respond to that? >> with all do respect, professor, you suggested the

shooting of alton sterling is justified because he had a prior criminal record. at the time the police arrive at the scene after getting a call from the homeless man, they had no information about his record simply because you have a control record does not mean your life is devalued in this system. police officers are not empowered to shoot people because they have a criminal record. they did not have that information when -- >> they knew he had a gun and it turned out that it was an illegal gun. >> can i finish please? >> i louallowed you to finish. >> yes, the issue is where those office officers were in eminent danger and did they have the need and was there an opportunity to de-escalate that situation. there is never an every and i don't want to over generalize.

you see the situation going from zero to 100 and a level of force that is not used when they're not african-american men involved. for you to suggest that alston sterling somehow justifies those cops shooting him when he's unarmed pinned to the ground is ridiculous. it highlights the issue of race and how african-american men treated differently in this country. >> do you believe this issues mirrors where we were in the 1960s. >> conditions in america have worsen. when we talk about criminal justice, we have to deal of the fact that blacks are 13% of the population and they commend a disproportiona disproportion of violent crimes. they are more than likely to

commit homicide. when a police officer approaches a black person, i am sure if it is in a city they have in the back of their minds. i don't think people should be shot for routine police stops but for police stops is when ever they approach a car and they don't know who's in the car, there is awesome always danger. one reason why more blacks died in these encounters is they are likely to resist arrest. >> you get the final word, i want to keep it fair >> she should be applauded for her calm and her composure and allowing us to see how a routine traffic stop turned into a murder a cop shoots into a car with a woman and a four year old child, rather than focusing on that cop's action, we are blaming the victim, philando

castile and the contagious woman th courageous woman that recorded that. the victim should not have run and should comply. lets focus on the cop that had a badge under his gun and acting under the code of authority. . a lot of disagreements but respect, i appreciate having the dialogue here. thank you. >> tweet me with your thoughts. i am sure you will have many. i will read some later in the program. >> the shootings of the protests are symptoms of a huge divide in america we just saw that. how can the presidential candidates hope to address these problems. is trump just interested in winning the president scene. he maybe playing coy with the new york times but what if not? after being let go, roger ale,

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two years after police shot michael brown, america is in decisive. we are on the eve of election, what will hillary clinton do and donald trump do, what can they do? joining me now is michelle bernard of our political analyst and david frank from the national review. you may remember bill crystal as a potential candidate. bet betsy, let me start with you. in the 1968 election of a law enforcement candidate richard nixon. any parallels that you see relative to hillary and donald. >> it is possible and one of the reasons that trump have been

able to guarder so much conservatives in right way. what he's saying sounds very different for a lot of the political con wilhelmss census have seen. >> he's been more single mindedly supportive of the status quo. a lot of folks fodon't want to hear tough questions. trump is appealing to those voters and there maybe some people of that mind set >> michelle, at the oendend of turbulent week hillary clinton says it is a time for love and kindness and donald trump says our country is under attack. >> hillary clinton's statement is more in keeping of what the

country should be aspiring to be. you know there comes as point in time when i was listening to your interview earlier with the former police chief from washington dc and philadelphia, one of this i thinks he said was we have to face reality. there comes a time in the presidential campaign, i think that time is right now. we are in it and we are in a dangerous moment. i would say we have to face the reality of these cameras of what black americans have been complaining about many, many years have always known to be true is the reality and it has to be dealt with openly and honestly and for donald trump to say that the nation is under attack is so incredibly irresponsible particularly coming on the heels of what we saw what happened in dallas yesterday. >> is the nation under attack? >> no, the nation is not under attack but the nation is heading

in a terrible direction right now. we are not in 1968 yet. that was worst than people remember. we are headed in a 1968 direction. that's one of the things that donald trump feeds off of is the sense that people have that things are spiraling out of control. he's going to come in and set things right. unfortunately, he has no idea of what he's talking about of any policy issues that he ever addresses which is a disadvantage for a presidential candidate. he's sensing that people are feeling that things are heading into a downward spiral. there is been 44% 4 deadly shootings of police this year than last year at this point. there is been more ambush as a police this year already than for the entirety of last year. so, he's accurately identifying a terrible trend but we are not

in 1968 yet. i hope we never get there. >> david, do you put any stock in the report of there is still a movement a foot among some of the committee? >> i put a lot of stocks in those reports. i don't know if it will happen. i think it is a solid hope it will happen. look, there is hundreds of delegates who have already come forward to say that they oppose trump. i saw a report yesterday that if there is a secret ballot there is a majority of the delegates who are against trump. we'll have to see in a couple weeks when the convention starts. donald trump is doing on a day-to-day bases and doing about the best that he can to spoil republican chance to take the white house. he's somebody that continually under mining the gop cause about every other day.

it is as stockttonishing to wat. >> betsy, is newt gingrich the new running mate? >> gingrich was one of the key players in the house voting to pass nafta back in 1993. when gingrich appeared with trump in the rally was kind of funny. he thought nafta was one of the worst deal and destructive. he's standing shoulders to shoulders with one of the key players in the past with nafta. it will be hard to trump to find any support who has not been adamantly po adamantly opposed on his key

issue. >> michelle, i spoke to the presidential debate this weekend. this year's format in keeping of a way how it is done in 2012, there will be a 15-minute time increment --- there is not much time to whiehide when you are g a time. who does it benefit? >> hillary clinton is guyiven t tone of where we are in the campaign season and all that is happening in our country on the domestic front. this is going to be a fantastic opportunity for hillary clinton to show voters why she's the person to come out and vote for because she's going to be able to give real policy solutions to the issues that are facing the nation.

>> david, i am about to be give my assessment of the e-mail issue in 30 seconds or less, what's your opinion as it relates to hillary? >> if i have treated classified information as we know she treated classified information, the single most important role is to negotiate a good plea bargain. she broke the law and she lied to the american people. >> there should be a move to dump clinton has it is for donald trump >> i appreciate you all being here. thank you very much and nice to see you again. thank you. >> up next the chairman of fox news facing a lawsuit of sexual harassment. could this be the end of roger ale. >> we never know for sure

whether anybody hacks hillary clinton. we do know her actions -- >> i will not do that again, that's something at the time and director comey said seems like a convenience but it was a wrong choice. see me. see me. don't stare at me. see me. see me. see me to know that psoriasis is just something that i have. i'm not contagious. see me to know that... ...i won't stop until i find what works. discover cosentyx, a different kind of medicine for moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. proven to help the majority of people find clear or almost clear skin. 8 out of 10 people saw 75% skin clearance at 3 months. while the majority saw 90% clearance.

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the american people are sick and tired of hearing about your dam e-mails. >> me, too. [ laughter ] >> sanders sacrificed a major point of criticizing his

opponent which is the after math of what we learned from fbi director james comey, we may never know her private e-mail servers were hacked by hostile actors. we know that her actions -- her communication choice was never a matter of convenience. it was about asserting control and possibly national security. whose job it is to facilitate the public's access of information. her use of private e-mail servers and her representatives should never been the sole of which among 60,000 e-mails should have entered the public domain. more than half of those messages were destroyed without any chance of second guessing.

her staffs determined that all those e-mails were entirely public or private defides common sense. >> some e-mails discussing chelsea's welding and government business is logical. compounding the situation is a sworn testimony of patrick kennedy. kennedy claimed that though he received 50 to 75 e-mails from clint clinton, he did not recognize they were coming at clinton and not at state government. in the end, director comey says no reason for prosecutor would bring such a case >> the abc legal analyst, back in february, he looked at laws and reached the same conclusion. dan joins me now. >> well, back in february, lets

stop and take a look at the statues. >> i hate to say this because i know how people are going to react. it is really not that close legally based on the facts as comey. my concern ing of writing the vehicle was the stuff that maybe we did not know about. if there is something that we don't know about, i don't know what the results are going to be. comey did release information that we did not know about and additional problems for hillary clinton but it still does not reach the level of criminality. we are not talking about wrong or should she have done it. we are not talking about did she violate the state department, we are not talking about should there be ramification, we are talking about is this criminal and the answer to that is no. >> there were two statues, with regard to the misdemeanor statue, it has language knowingly removed such documents that you don't think she could

get home based on that language. now, it is the one that more people initially expected. not the felony, it is under the espionage act. the misdemeanor knowingly removed such documents. that's been a crime that people had been convicted of or pled guilty to for basically copying documents they should copy and taken them home and etc. many are saying why is this any difference t difference. the reality is and comey focused on this, you don't just say did someone knowingly set up the server. >> the felony dance is gross

negligence and he used the word "extremely carelessness." >> comey walked the line when he starts to use that language. this wall interpreted by the u.s. supreme court, the felony law to say yes, it is gross negligence and of course we expect someone would have bad faith and intent before we prosecute someone under this law. we have a whole group of amateur legal analysts out there who are saying look at the language, this could fit into it. someone by the way, professional analysts who are saying you could define this and you can charge her with a crime, you could. it will be the first time we ever use these laws in these wa ways. i don't think you should, i don't think the goal is to say got you. the goal is to treat hillary clinton like anyone else.

that's where i give comey a lot of respect. he's clearly not a fan of clinton. >> right. those of us in the business, your electronic bible, so you're perfectly position to respond to gretchen carlson filing against roger ailes, the chairman of fox news, might it bring him down with a bomb shell? >> allegation, if all allegations are true? and if there are other woman her lawyers are claiming. it will bring anyone down. that's the key question which is what do they have and first of all, in her case, are there plaintiffs, are there e-mails or contemporary newsstand? what did she have to backup the important meeting she had with

roger ailes where he claims that if we slept together, it would be better for the two of us. we don't know the answer. >> dan, even if they don't come forward, i have been thinking of the female lineup of fox, i bet some of them are fearful and having to go through depositions and having to provide sworn testimonies of all of their interactions with roger ailes. >> more importantly of a suggestion in the lawsuit that there are women at fox news who slept with roger ailes who benefited from that. >> that's it. where she drops in the lawsuit, if she's going to start naming names of those people and trying to get those people to testi testify -- >> her lawyer says her phone had been ringing off the hook since it made the newspaper. >> i don't know what it means. the bottom line is every high

profile case that a lawyer would tell you their phone brings offer the hook. >> sometimes it is true. with bill cosby, it is true. >> it does not persuade me. lets wait to see of what evidence, the most interesting question is it will settle. most of these cases will settle. this is the last thing that roger ailes want. >> danny, thank you for the analysis. >> coming up. if hillary clinton ends up being president, will it mark the end of sexism in our country? he thinks that the treatment could get worse if she actually becomes president. here is the tweet just coming in between the professors regarding

black lives matter. i agree with the person who sent this. it proves that we can have the conversation and do it in a respectful manner even when we don't agree. it's also fast, but unlike godawgs, it makes heartburn after dinner, history. new mylanta® tonight. faster than heartburn. at experian, we believe credit isnit's a skill.re. and like anything else, you can get better. so we make it easy for you to spot trouble in your report. or know if fraud is hurting your fico score. and if you need it, a dedicated fraud resolution agent can help you set things right. after all, watching over your credit is one of the most important skills of all. go to experian.com to enroll in experian creditworks today.

he's now turning his attention to podcasting which is titled "revision history." i think hillary clinton should at least listen to episode number one. the lady vanishes, you tell the story of the first episode and oddly it is about a 19th industry of a british painting. it has relevance of clinton, explain to me about the background. >> in the late 19th enindustcen.

a woman of a time when the artistic -- it was overwhelmingly male. every thinks doors are finally opened for women to enter the profession of painting. she thought of this great pioneer and that's not what happens. what happens is the minute she sees a little bit success, the doors slammed shut and she pushlpush pushed it out of the mainstream and suggesting of a harsh treatment of male establishments and that idea of his notion of a toke n about -- that's what the show is about. it is psychology -- he has come up with a space called moral. when a group, when a majority

group does something generous or good or open, they feel they have the license to go back and to do something nasty or to close the doors or to lash someone who they have once welcomed. that's what happens to elizabeth thomason and many times outsider who enters a closed world. i sort of feel like that's what may happen to hillary clinton. in the show i talk about the prime minister of austria. a parallel to hillary clinton. the minute she takes office, she gets subjected to a level of abuse that's astonishing. i interviewed her for the broadcast, that's the same phenomenon of having done something so generous of the first woman ever and the

majority feels they have the freedom and the license to lash out -- >> you documented in the podcast of this notion of war licensing as something you saw regards to the painter and jackie robinson and baseball and you saw it with those casting ballots for barack obama. >> he gets started with this when he looks at people who voted for barack obama. he found that people voted for obama then more likely to take liberal positions to take positions that maybe considered racial racially insensitive. he's saying the same phenomenon. look, i am the kind of person who voted for a black man into the presidency of the united states. what they can say about themselves is they feel they

have the freedom to go and adults their basic instincts. that phenomenon explains so much about that persistence of discrimination. >> to those who say well, the nation may shatter of the final glass ceiling of the first female, glad well, now, history is saying not so fast, this may get more challenging for clinton. when you look at other countries and the end of broadcast, it simply goes around the world and look at how many countries had one and only one female. it is a long list, the same thing to think about how many major cities in the united states have one and only one black mayor. that is common phenomenon that you open the door and you let one token in and look, i can now shut it because i proved and i

voted for david dinkin and now i voted for mayor bradley and now i adopt have don't >> i mean, the take away is, you'll know when we've gotten past these prejudices when the nation has it's second african-american president or second female president. i wish you good things. i thoroughly enjoyed the podcast. >> thank you so much. >> keep the tweets coming at smerconis smerconish. what gretchen did was courageous where was she when she was on fox's pay roll could have helped countless women. if it's true she endured a climate of sexual harassment but the discrimination came when her own contract wasn't renewed.

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i always say if you can follow me by spelling smerconish i welcome your tweets. sorry smerconish but objectively your ugly bias attitude today was to sabotage hillary clinton. normally the critiques that say i have an ugly bias are supposedly against donald trump. i call them as i see them. i deal with facts. and i believe that this e-mail thing has been misinterpreted by many. it's been all about the thwarting of the public right to know under the freedom of information act. that's what i said. i challenge you to call me out on facts that i offered that were incorrect. here's tweet two that came in today. smerconish why not use tear or sleep gas on dallas shooting suspects. this is interesting, i have been critical of the use of the

weaponrymo made for battlefield that gets delivered to mayberry usa. get a kick out of this one, smerconish i had to look closely at the tv. david french looks like you with a beard. let's take a look. there we are. now here's how you know the difference between us. bill crystal has not asked me to run for president against donald trump. speaking of which, i will be in cleveland one week from today as we get ready for the republican national convention. see you then, continue to tweet me @smerconish. [ ghost voice ] the name your price tool can save you money

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there's four cops down. >> at that point, i thought to