outside europe or the united states. the only countries that have not hosted games is africa and antarctica. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week, i will see you next week. good morning, i'm brian stelter, and this is "reliable sources," a look at the story behind the story, how news and pop culture get made. this hour, trump's toughest week yesterday, with tumbling poll numbers. plus how news outlets are getting creative, fact checking statements right on the screen. is it fair? plus new reporting on the future of fox news, with ousted ceo roger ailes still denying sexual harassment allegations against him, meanwhile the murdocks are speaking out. but first, the united states of anxiety, does all this election coverage scare you? i mean really scare you?

you're not alone. check out these findings. hillary clinton with an eight point lead over donald trump. the poll asked, thinking about donald trump has president, are you comfortable with this or does it make you anxious, 50% of americans say very anxious, another 20% say somewhat anxious, that's a total of 70%. and 51% say thinking about clinton being president makes them anxious as well. the media needs to acknowledge not just what's going on in our brains, but what's going on in our guts regarding this election, there's anxiety, there's fear on all sides. and these tensions are why tv's so-called trump supporters are so controversial. right now his surrogates, his supporters, well, they're playing defense. >> we have seen it all weekend,

4 versus 1. that's why the american people are watching these segments and saying maybe this is more political politically -- >> you want to sit there and you want to harp on him on the issues and you're forgetting about these other issues on the other side. >> did you hear what she said there, panels of four versus one. it may be a talking point from the campaign. the norm on tv is a panel representative of all sides of an argument, and this year that means anti-trump republicans alongside pro trump guests. but today we're going to do it a little bit differently. we're going to talk about donald trump and the charges of media bias. trump supporters say there's an awful disconnect between the media and the voters. a cnn political commentator, and

cnn political commentator and talk show host john phillips. scotty, you made a lot of news this week. when you talk about this on television, when you point this out on twitter, why do you think it's a winning argument for trump to assert media bias? >> first, media bias is not new. newt gingrich came out and said 82% of all those in the media probably lean left, and that's something we're going to have to address and move on with it. but that shows not only what we're talking about, but what we're not talking about. we spend so much time talking about all of the issues of trump and maybe one or two on hillary clinton amongst the panel. and not just here, it's across the board with news articles, where you look at headlines, there's usually

3, 4, 7 to one. that may represent various facets of people who are against mr. trump. one or two may be a pro trump view if we're lucky. >> do you think there's a sort of media bubble problem that so many journalists and producers and bosses are in new york and d.c. so they're not able to represent the views of the rest of the country? >> when you talk about establishment, a lot of people are referring to the media as being part of that establishment. you're not part a flyover country, great america out there in the heartland. it's a totally different atmosphere and what's being talked about is totally different from what's going on in new york and washington and that's where the media is coming out of. that's why people turn on the news and they hear all this bias, they feel it's not a fair representation. i have to go back to something that scotty said, it's not just

the negative things that are said about trump, it's the omission of things. >> give me an example. >> you want to talk about trump university, but there's no talk about the laureate schools where clinton has received $4.5 million that clinton has received for being the honorary chancellor. >> aren't you aware about those facts about clinton from the news media? aren't those ideas based on news media coverage of them? >> actually i am not, i have done a lot of reading and that's why i'm aware of them. >> isn't it from media reports is what you're reading? >> i don't know that necessarily all of it is media reports, some of it may be. >> don't you think you're doing an apples versus oranges

comparison, when you bring up clinton controversies, but they're not as big and newsworthy as trump -- >> it's not the media's place to determine what's newsworthy and what's not. if there are scandals on either side, put them out there and let the american people decide what's important and what's not. >> chris, isn't it the news media's job to decide what's newsworthy? isn't that the definition of news? >> we know the media is biassed. the dnc email links proved that, the dnc was taking their marching orders from debbie wasserman schultz. they showed politico submitting stories from politico.

before publishing those stories. look, this is a problem, but i also think we have got to point out the fact that a lot of the bias is because of the liberal ideology. but some of it is just because of entertainment, right? trump's sins are mostly rhetorical and it's very fun as readers to read about twitter duels and trump bashing someone's wife, it's more fun to read about that than it might be to read about things like email servers which is kind of boring. so part of the bias is because of liberal ideology. and part of it is because trump's giving them what they want which is entertainment. >> let me play devil's advocate. when your listeners complain about media bias, isn't this a victim hood media bias? isn't it that they're victims of a big, bad, liberal media? >> in many ways, the media buy yaz helped create donald trump.

let's start out with your original sin, with the media pointing out that -- they move on to foreign policy with the serious candidates. the problem was, that wasn't in an empty theater, that was in a theater filled with people and fox news provided the laugh track that allowed people to say wait a minute, people know what's going on here. then you move on to the "huffington post" that put in a wild disclaimer that -- in the early stages of the primary, they didn't spend their time going after trump that ended up being the real threat. what did the dem people, they spent time going after marco rubio. they made a pathway for trump through the primary. now we're in the general, any time he makes a joke they don't

like, the joke about the emails in russia was clearly him going for a life line? >> the audience in the room didn't think he was joking, do we just not have a sense of humor? >> he said he was joking, paul manafort said he was joking. >> the mother of the baby said he was joking. >> i like to think i have a sense of humor, but i didn't think he was joking. >> on bill maher, julian assange said you need to hack into the clinton emails and that fell on deaf ears. >> wikileaks came out later and said that was a confuses case. i was really struck by what another cnn commentator who said she was frustrated by her candidate. >> we are at a juncture where donald trump does need to step back and listen to newt gingrich

who said today, donald trump can win this, but in order to do that, he needs to stick to the issues, and i think that he owes that to us and to the -- if he can get back on message, he can make up that gap, he can win that. >> interesting comment there. amy, does trump ever disappoint you and do you feel comfortable saying so? >> look, of course i have been disappointed at times, i have with every candidate i have supported, they're human beings, they're not perfect. but at the end of the day, i'm going to stand by him. we need to talk about the issues that americans are concerned about, jobs and the economy and our safety and security, our national security. that's what we all want to be talking about. >> in that case, i'm with you on that, but in that case, why does donald trump talk about media bias. let me show you a few of his tweets complaining about the

"new york times," and cnn and other news outlet, he went on a series of comments against media outlets. scotty, why is it advantageous for donald trump to attack news media outlets. >> they wrote their story about all of the women that were against mr. trump that used to work with him and these women came out the next day and said, that's not what we told you, and did you ever see a recant from them apologizing for what they wrote about? >> the meat of the story was true. >> they still should apologize for taking the words of these women to twist. you just mentioned the mother of the crying baby, she said i was already out of the room, i took it as a joke as well. you hold trump one accountable and you look at hillary clinton supporters and you go, have you ever been disappointed in your candidate? and i have to tell you, in most

cases -- let's ask them that question, and of course they're going to say the email scandal? but are they going to mention benghazi? are they going to mention the millions that went to clinton initiative and the time spent on these little trivial joke issues that spawn into bigger issues. this week we saw the khan family, rightfully so, the proper honor that their son deserves, but this week we saw two gold star families coming out endorsing mr. trump saying we would not go on a political stage and bash hillary, we would talk about our son. those sorts of issues are why people feel like there's media bias. on the other hand talk radio is the opposite. talk radio is overwhelmingly

conservative. >> and this week, rush limbaugh, the king of them all renewed his deal. let's end this on an agreement that none of us care about the crying baby thing, that that was a silly thing. i think it was, we all think it was. let's come back on the other side and con otinue our coverag. also this hour, i have a message for sean hannity, it's something i have wanted to tell him all week long. so stay tuned. one coat, yes! ♪ there is a day, for every number. ♪ ♪ there is a time, for all my slumbers. ♪ ♪ and i can see, that i can't run and hide. ♪ one coat guaranteed marquee interior. behr's most advanced paint. come find our top rated paints, only at the home depot.

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welcome back to "reliable sources," before the break we were talking about what it's like to be a trump supporter or a trump surrogate on television. if the job of a surrogate is to represent the candidates they support, they're actually doing a good job, they're pushing past standard political boundaries, relying on non sequiturs, and doing so confidently, attacking the dishonest media when criticism comes, it's the donald trump school of messaging management. let's bring back our panel of pro trump commentators.

john, let me start with you, you're one of the newest hires here at cnn supporting trump's point of view on the air. one of the reasons why cnn hired you and scotty, is because all of the other cnn commentators are anti trump. as a cnn political commentator in recent weeks? >> i'm a republican that lives in los angeles in 2016, so all of my friends are jews, gays and scientologi scientologists, i'm used to hanging out with people who have different points of view so that's nothing new, i don't work for donald trump, and because of that, i'm not tareq aziz, the communications minister. i can call the balls and strikes and i think that's important for

those of us in the news arena. we have to be honest brokers. and there's one thing i want to point out with c nrks nrkscnn, ask some of the hardest questions in the business, they hold your feet to the fire, and that ee's exactly what they sho do. they do that to me and they do that to others and i'm very appreciative of that. >> scotty, you're the other paid commentator here on this panel. what do you do to prepare for these segments, since you're not talking to trump all the time, how do you prepare? >> i am not paid by the campaign as well. while i definitely get a lot of information, the campaign will soechbd out their additional press releases and i am one that does the research. when you sit there and prepare for these, it's more about

studying up on hillary clinton, in hopes you'll be able to counter and go against hillary clinton and point out some of her points, but unfortunately, we're always having to defend mr. trump and the words, because that's how it is and it usually goes negative. and you say i'm not going to look at my twitter feed for the next 30 minute office this. >> my job here is to fact check donald trump. do you feel like we're doing too much of that? what do you mean when you say you have to defend his words? >> there's no such thing as defending too much of donald trump's words, all i ask is that you fact check hillary clinton's words just as much. and i'm not specifically saying you, i'm saying the media as a whole. we don't want to sit here and have things biassed against us, but let's try to be fair. one of the great things about cnn is we have the opportunity to show how respectful conversation from two people who come from a different point of view should go. and sometimes when we have these

panels and we have these arguments and we tear into each other and we have four people arguing with each other, that's not a good example of how the rest of america should be with each other. at least when we are talking, and when we go quiet and go silent, is why we're having a lot of the problems we're having in america today. >> politifacts says there's-is that an example of bias? >> again, a lot of trump's sins are rhetorical. while hillary's might be more substantive and it might be more fun to read about trump's sins. but the more the media tries to tear down trump is it blows up in the media's face? >> how does it blow up in the media's face? >> the "new york daily news" who ran trump as a clown, they're losing reader ship by the day.

88% of young people get their news directly from facebook, and trump has been very good at utilizing that to his advantage. >> but on facebook they're clicking on links and going to cnn and other news media stories. >> yesterday on cnn you were talking about this really creative video trump had put on facebook, very low cost, very creative and while hillary clinton is spending millions on the ads during the olympics, people are not really watching tv during the ads. >> let me ask you, if this is so effective for trump, then why is he losesing in all the polls? why is this anti media cam pain not working for him with more voters? >> i think it's hillary's bump after the convention and i think come back after labor day when people come back after their kids are on vacation and they start listening to the election.

polling can be skewed too by the way the questions are answered, the number of democrats versus republicans that are polled. i mean you can't say that there's not any bias in the polling, because i believe there certainly is. >> people are going to hear you say that, amy, and say this is a review of unskewed polls, the people who thought that the polls were skewed against romney actually hurt romney. >> a poll is only a snapshot in time. if people really want to elect donald trump they need to be out there working for donald trump until the last ballot is cast. >> it is a snapshot in time, what if i take 50 snapshots, the real clear politics has it up by 7 points, that's outside the margin of error. >> let's look at this georgia poll that we keep touting, that

trump is down four points. they did the same poll back in may, this time they asked more democrats than they did republicans in august. when you look at that number, of course it's going to be more skewed in hillary clinton's favorite. they put more weight on the african-american vote, the female vote and the young vote, the youth vote. three areas that hillary did well on. that's why people go and get their own research, they pull the numbers themselves and see exactly what that poll is based on. >> is it dangerous to tell fans to not believe the polls? >> i didn't say don't believe them, i said do your research on them. >> another important thing that we need to consider is that a lot of these polls don't take into account mobilization. trump supporters, they are champing at the bit to get out there and vote. they were in the snow during primary season to campaign for him. those people want to vote. hillary supporters, a lot of them are not as passionate.

when the pollers call them, they're going to say yeah, i support hillary, but they may not take the time and the effort to go cast their votes. so we got to keep that in mind when we read these polls. >> hillary has had a good week. she has every possible advantage, she has a money advantage, she as a name id advantage and she's been in politics for years and years and years, and for her to not come out and kill donald trump in the po polls. >> i would say you got to wait a few more days to see the polls from this week to see how he and she are doing. one thing i resent about some media outlets, is that they are

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the next stage of the presidential campaign seasoning is set. sort of. just 50 days from today donald trump and hillary clinton should meet for a face-off. trump's allies are upset that two of the debates are scheduled

on the same nights as nfl games. he says he wants to play a role in who moderates them. here on last week's show, trump advisor jason miller said the discussion with the commission on presidential debates were going to start this week, but i checked with other sources and that's not true, and technically trump and clinton haven't even been invited to the debates yet. michael wolfe says that the debates could help trump turn things around. he will challenge their legitimacy, making his ultimate appearance there his personal zraum ma and powerful counter attack against the rigged system. and michael wolfe is here with me now in new york. michael, you're nobody's partisan. you're here to -- why do you think trump is making an issue of the debates, is it a useful

battle for him to have? >> it's his game, it's his mta. it's what we in the media sometimes fail to understand or become victim to. he is an entertainer. hillary clinton is a politician, trump is an entertainer. and if it comes down to that comparison, politician-entertainer, it becomes very volatile. so are 35 million, 40 million, 50 million people in the u.s. at a given moment in time truly entertained by donald trump? if that happens because he says something, because he makes a gesture, a flippant remark, an insult, then quite possibly the dynamic of this campaign changes on a dime. >> and that is a risk, perhaps for hillary clinton. >> totally. because she is not only not an entertainer, you might say she's anti entertainment. >> how so?

>> she's hard work, she's, you know, it's home work. >> the brand is about policy. >> it's home work to listen to hillary clinton. >> you think so? >> totally, completely. have you listened to her? >> some would say that's a gendered comment. to listen to her, it's home work. >> i invite them to say that. >> she's boring, she's dutiful, she's inexpressive. you can go down the list of things which i think she would probably admit to. her staff goes around saying, okay yeah, it's a problem, hillary can't speak in public. these are -- this is a significant -- it may not be a significant draw back to being the president of the united states. it's a significant draw back when you stand next to somebody who is for whatever reasons the most, maybe this is an exaggeration, maybe not, the most compelling person on earth. >> with that in mind, the with

the entertainment values in mind. i wonder if we're forgetting what a normal election feels like? mitt romney wasn't entertaining in 2012 and neither was barack obama, maybe the country was better off for it? >> quite possibly. what we have is the -- an incredible change in the dynamic of how to run for office. in the nature of the media, and it's reaction to the people running for office. there's a classic thing that the media thing changes every four years in some substantial way because of the demands of a campaign. >> huh. >> now it has changed because one of the candidates is entirely focused on the media. so the idea that he is actually a politician, that politics is involved, that policy is involved has gone out the window. he doesn't care about that, paul ryan, is he going to support, is

he going to wreck the republican party, doesn't make any difference to him. the only thing that makes a difference to him in his campaign dynamic is, are you paying attention to me and can i -- and can i capture that attention? >> it's like a fireworks show, and he has to make sure the fireworks keep exploding so there's something to see. >> and we say, everyone is saying, this can't happen. but it has been happening and who knows? it could happen. >> what do you make of this battle between sean hannity and wall street columnist brett stevens. stevens calledcalled -- >> what is this reaction, does this show the divide within the gop, within the conservative media? >> clearly. i mean, the conservative media is now eating itself. the republican party is eating

itself. >> these are both murdock outlets, the "new york times" and fox news. >> totally. we now though with the ouster of roger ailes are eating themselves. and i think they are as confused about donald trump about his meaning to politics as anyone else. >> you mentioned roger ailes, it's been two weeks since he resigned from fox news. this week one of the murdocks who's in charge of fox news says that the fox news will preserve and protect -- fox is going to stay conservative leaning even without ailes. do you think fox news will change without ailes there? >> i think it will change entirely. the murdocks have to change that. what are they going to say, we're going to change what has

been a huge success for us? but clearly they are of a different political temperament, they have been embarrassed by fox, and most importantly, roger ailes, fox had complete independence. unique in the television business. whoever takes over will report to laughlin and james. and they will function as all corporate entities function, as the corporate entity that owns cnn functions. they will say, be careful, be cautious, don't go there. >> so you think right now rupert murdock is in charge as acting ceo. but it's only a matter of months before fox news has to change how it does business? >> and understand rupert's level of being in charge, rupert doesn't know anything about the television business. although he knows how to make money, he does not know how to

programmer never has programmed a second of television. that's why he never got involved with fox's programs. >> it's going to be an interesting test for him in the next few months. after the break here, looking at coverage on cable news of trump and clinton, we're seeing fact checking right there in the banner on the bottom of the screen. is there a big change in the way trump's being covered? we'll talk about it after the break. home, car, life insurance obviously, ohhh... but with added touches you can't get everywhere else, like claim free rewards... or safe driving bonus checks. even a claim satisfaction guaranteeeeeeeeeee! in means protection plus unique extras only from an expert allstate agent. it's good to be in, good hands. welli do say that, you see... "well, fantastic!" a lot.

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and over 1,000 other incredible prizes. ♪ hey, is this our turn? honey...our turn? yeah, we go left right here. (woman vo) great adventures are still out there. we'll find them in our subaru outback. (avo) love. it's what makes a subaru, a subaru. get zero percent on select subaru models during the subaru a lot to love event, now through august thirty-first. the balloon drop feels like so long ago, doesn't it? in the span of a few short weeks, we have come from the republican nomination, to coverage of his so-called worst week yet. you have seen the headlines, here's the op-ed in the post, making long lists of every alleged gaff and saying trump is running out of time to turn it around. is that really the case, though? meanwhile, i noticed a new tone

in the coverage of trump and clinton. i have the perfect person to amountize that with me, an abrams, former general manager of msnbc. dan, great to see you. i have noticed cable news channels not showing trump's events live anymore wall to wall. what do you think of that? >> i think it's a couple of things. i think trump was a novelty when it started. people couldn't believe the sorts of things he was saying, at his rallies, on television, and now it's become a little bit expected and he's now a real candidate. for president. i think the other thing is, that now that it's not a republican convention and it's a democrat versus a republican, i think the media feels more of an obligation, that if they're going to cover a trump rally live, that means they're going to have to cover the clinton rally live, and let's be honest, the clinton rallies aren't as

interesting from a tv perspecti perspective. so they have to make a choice when to cover him and when not to. i don't think we had anything like this, we didn't have someone who so dominated the media coverage. but i don't think it's any question, when i was running msnbc that we would sit there and think about how do we be fair here? we have to make sure that we're not sort of giving one side an overt advantage when it comes to the amount of coverage one gives it. and remember, this is distinguished from the opinion coverage, people are going to say, well, msnbc was taking this position, or fox takes that position, but i think that the good cable news networks are pretty clear about when they're doing opinion and when they're not. >> i haven't seen fox do this fact checking thing, but i have seen cnn and msnbc do it. let's run some video of fact checking in the banners on the

bottom of the screen on cnn and msnbc. this week on msnbc, trump said he watched a nonexistent video of iran receiving cash. trump's son says father apologized to khans. he hasn't. is this a new development in cable news, to be fact checking in real time? >> it's a new development to be doing it in the chirons. we do fact checking and i say bravo to these networks for doing it. why? because i think one of the great sins of cable news is that we tend to make everything two sided. we ask questions like some say, or critics will say, except that the answer is, it's just not true. and if it's not true, let's call it not true. let's call it in the chiron, let's call it when we're asking questions et cetera. and that's one of the big problems with cable news. >> and if you say anything here and slip up, we're going to put it in the banner, so you have been warned

here, dan. >> let's talk about media bias, that it's smart for donald trump to be hammering away at media bias. is this a smart strategy for him going forward? because normally the old saying is that you don't pick fights with people who can buy ink by the barrel. >> i think it was a smart strategy during the republican primaries. i think now it doesn't make as much sense. but let's be clear, the media, both conservative and liberal, doesn't like donald trump as a whole. doesn't even every individual. let's admit that. but what's not true, is that they somehow love hillary clinton. because they don't really like her either, why? because she's not holding press conference, there's been this clintonian over the years where people don't get direct answers, and i think many in the media are to the left of hillary

clinton, and as a result they don't like her from the left. so there's a lot of reasons that the media also doesn't like hillary clinton, so is trump right that the media doesn't like him? yeah, but are the trump supporters rights that somehow the media doesn't like him? this is not barack obama 2008, when the media was swooning over obama. this is a very different situation. >> it's a media version of the unfavorable for the candidates. up next, and his new favorite buzz word, rigged. chevy silverado to the aluminum bed of this competitor's truck.e awesome. yeah! first, let's check out the aluminum bed of this truck. wooooow!! holy moly. full on crack here. now let's check out the steel bed of the silverado.

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one of donald trump's favorite words is "rigged." let me tell you why that's a problem for the press. he comes back to this word time and time again. >> a rigged system. >> rigged, rigged, rigged. >> rig the system. >> totally rigged. >> rigged.

>> the election's going to be rigged. >> during the primary's, trump's tirades were very effective with voters. we also know what he means when he says the word. so now he's expanding on it, saying oth things are rigged, too, like the media. >> we're running against a rigged press. we're running against dishonest people. okay? really dishonest people. >> that's not true. but trump certainly is not the first candidate to rail against the media. here's where he is the first time. this is a troubling first for a presidential candidate. he says he's worried the presidential election in november is going to be rigged against him. the comment garnered a lot of comments even though many experts say it's a preposterous claim to make. >> i don't really know where to start on answering this question. of course the elections will not be rigged. what does that mean?

that's ridiculous. >> but with all due respect to president obama, he may not be the best messenger on this subject. instead, those trusted by trump's base should be reassuring those of the voting system. conservative media is helping trump spread doubts without a shred of evidence. let me show you how not to interview a candidate about something as serious as this. this is sean hannity just handing trump the mike. watch. >> you said that you're afraid this election is going to be rigged. explain. >> yeah. i've been hearing about it for a long time. and i'm telling you, november 8th, we better be careful. that election is going to be rigged and i hope the republicans are watching closely or it's going to be taken away from us. >> mr. trump, thank you so much for being with us. >> that's it? if there were ever a time to challenge an interview, that was the time.

don't give me this that he ran out of time. this interview was on tape. the producers should have kept it going. hannity should have asked more questions. interviewers have an obligation to probe further and push back when a candidate says something dangerous and this is dangerous, subjecting an election is going to be stolen? this is third-world dictatorship stuff. now, maybe trump's just making excuses for an eventual loss. journalists cannot just play these sound bites, quote these claims and move on to the next subject. we can't let is seep into the discourse like it's normal. we have to stop and fact check and contexualize. "the washington post" said, "donald trump is wrong." reports of misconduct are often overreported in the press. again, the conservative media is vital but sean hannity and bill

o'reilly both failed their audiences this week. both interviewed trump and he said there was something fishy about the election in 2012 and later hannity ran with it. >> it was pointed out one week after the 2012 election that in 59 separate precincts in inner city philadelphia that mitt romney did not get a single vote. not one. and according to the cleveland plain dealer, there were nine precincts in cleveland alone. again, not a single romney vote. not one. now, maybe i'm conspiratorial. >> yes, hannity, you are being conspiratorial. a google search would show that there are other precincts where obama did not get a vote. hannity is using his megaphone

irresponsible. if a democratic candidate were saying this, every word of this essay would apply to him or her. it's unpatriotic for any interviewer or journalist to help him. i'm out of time here. i'll see you next week. "state of the union" with jake tapper starts in just a moment. spending the day with my niece. i don't use super poligrip for hold, because my dentures fit well. before those little pieces would get in between my dentures and my gum and it was uncomfortable. even well fitting dentures let in food particles. just a few dabs of super poligrip free is clinically proven to seal out more food particles so you're more comfortable and confident while you eat. so it's not about keeping my dentures in, it's about keeping the food particles out. try super poligrip free. and you're talking to your doctor about your medication... this is humira. this is humira helping to relieve my pain and protect my joints from further damage.

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cleanup duty? >> i support and endorse our speaker of the house, paul ryan. donald trump tries to make nice with his fellow republicans after a brutal week of intra-party battling. boosted by a $64 million infusion largely from small donors, can the trump train get back on track? plus, heartburn in the heartland.