dealing with a tax bombshell, "the new york times" revealing trump may have avoided paying income taxes for nearly two decades for business losses totaling nearly $1 billion. >> some of donald trump's supporters call him a genius for this. hillary clinton says that trump's returns confirm he is a business failure. so much at stake with 36 days now until election day, one day until the vice presidential debate. six days until the presidential debate. we have it all covered for you. i want to begin with senior political reporter, the most important number today might be $916 million. >> reporter: good morning. now before last week's debate, remember that donald trump had been on an upswing. polls showed him beating hillary clinton in a number of key battlegrounds but he stadiumblen the debate, got into a feud with a beauty queen and now new questions about whether donald trump even paid his federal income taxes. and about a nearly $1 billion

loss in a single year. all of which shining a new light on his own business record. >> he didn't pay any federal income tax, so -- >> that makes me smart. >> reporter: after refusing to release his tax returns for months, donald trump and his campaign defending revelations in "the new york times" that trump once claimed a $916 million loss on his 1995 income tax return. which legally could have allowed trump to pay nothing in federal income taxes for nearly two decades. >> there's no one who has shown more genius in their way to maneuver around the tax code. >> reporter: trump's high-profile advisers responding by praising the gop candidate's business savvy. >> he's a genius. what he did was, he took advantage of something that could save his enterprise. >> reporter: trump himself tweeting that he knows the tax laws better than anyone, and he's the only one who can fix them. >> trump goes around and says,

hey, i'm worth billions. i'm a successful businessman, but i don't pay any taxes. you, you make $15 an hour, you pay the taxes not me. >> reporter: former new york mayor rudy giuliani defending the practice in a contentious exchange on cnn sunday. >> most americans take advantage of every deduction available to them. >> most americans pay federal income taxes and donald trump apparently did not. >> reporter: trump campaigning in pennsylvania over the weekend lobbinging unfounded attacks against hillary clinton. despite warnings from gop leaders to stay away from personal attacks. >> hillary clinton's only loyalty is to her financial contributors and it to herself. i don't even think she's loyal to bill, if you want to know the truth. >> reporter: and, again, attempting to raise health over clinton's health. >> here's a woman, she's supposed to fight all of these different things, and she can't make it 15 feet to her car. >> reporter: mocking her recent bout of pneumonia.

>> give me a break. >> reporter: you now the trump campaign said everything has been legal. they paid hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes like property and real estate taxes but not yet denying "the times" report. tomorrow will be a key moment as we well. we'll see how trump's running make mike pence, deals with questions about the republican nominee's taxes. >> okay, manu, thank you for that. let's bring in senior adviser and former republican congressman from georgia jack kingston. good morning, congressman. >> good morning, alisyn. how are you doing? >> i'm doing well. so voters and viewers today have to decide whether or not these revelations about trump's taxes make him a genius or make him greedy. and so how does a loss of $916 million in the 1990s because of failed casinos that went bankrupt and a failed airline make him a business genius? >> well, i think people understand that he is a man who

owns lots of different enterprises, lots of different businesses in lots of different locations and states and that often you do have losses. sometimes you get tax deductions because of those losses, but he has paid income taxes. he has paid state, local, and federal taxes along the way or he would be in jail. even "the new york times," which we all know isn't exactly a republican advocate newspaper, they admit that he was totally legal. and, i might point out, f"forbe" reported that in 2014 "the new york times" did not pay income taxes. and they're not the only corporation to do that. and i think people understand the tax code is complicated. donald trump has said we're going to make it simplified, and he knows the tax system and i think he would be a good person to do that. >> now the problem, congressman, in his tax proposal, what he has put out for voters to look at, it doesn't address this issue of carrying over a loss and this

kind of loophole for real estate developers. so he can say that he knows best how to work the system, but he's not addressing how to fix it. >> i think going from seven different tax brackets down to three, giving a tax reduction from approximately 35% now to 24%, which is what their foreign competitors pay and for small businesses 15%, i think that's what people want to hear. they want to know, well, what kind of jobs will be created from the tax code? and they're looking at what we had in the last eight years which hillary clinton has been a part of and they're saying, you know what, i want to something different than the status quo. >> congressman, as someone who had to deal in congress with the budget, you know, the country's budget, are you comfortable with a billionaire not contributing for two decades to our national health care and education

systems and infrastructure and the debt, paying down the debt? are you comfortable with that? >> i am comfortable that donald trump has been paying taxes and i'm comfortable that he has been contributing to the economic development of cities and towns and where he has projects. >> but not federal income taxes? >> i believe he's been paying federal income taxes or he would be in jail if he did not. >> this shows he hasn't for two decades. possible.it showed that it's but we don't really know. i feel a little queasy that "the new york times" is publishing somebody's tax returns, which i don't believe it legal for them to have to begin with and, you know, being a paranoid republican you wonder is this lois lerner at the irs slipping things out the back door. you have to remember some of this is not coming from exactly the trump objective journalism that's out there. it's coming from very partisan things. "the new york times" is practically a hillary clinton

super pac these days. >> are you saying if he did not -- if it is true, that he did not pay federal income taxes for almost two decades, that would be illegal? >> that would be illegal if he wasn't paying and complying with the tax code. there's no allegation, even from "the new york times," that he's not complying with the tax laws. >> yes. >> i want to point out something, though, that's real important. remember, his projects did create jobs and did create tax bases in communities. these were bricks and mortars projects. hillary clinton on the other hand has only made millions and millions of dollars from speeches and apparently selling access. there were no jobs created because of the wealth that bill and hillary clinton made for themselves. >> listen, donald trump is obviously in a different it field and lots of people lost their jobs when his casinos went bankrupt. but, congressman, couldn't he put all this to rest if he just released his taxes, his tax returns, as every candidate has done for 40 years?

>> well, he has, as you know, released his financial disclosure. it was 105 pages long. he did that in it may. his taxes are under audit, and i have personal ly taken the time to call a tax attorney and say, is this legit if you had a client who was being audited, would you advise them to not disclose their taxes? and he said absolutely because the minute you do that, them you're going to have everybody second-guessing what the irs is doing and the audit would never end. he has said that once the audit is over, he will disclose his taxes. but, remember -- >> the problem with what you're saying that 105-page thing that he did put out answers all the questions is that it doesn't. we don't know how many -- how much he paid in taxes for these past years. we don't know his tax rate. we don't it know how much he's given to charity. do you think that these are all things that voters should know before election day? >> i think it is important for some voters but i think for the majority of voters who have seen their household income fall in the middle class families

statistically have had income fall from $57,000 to $53,000, 44 million people on food stamps and 94 million people are under employed or unemployed and i think the average person is saying, well, maybe he should release and maybe he shouldn't but i'm more worried about my own opportunities and my family and what hillary clinton refers to as basement dwellers yet those millennials out of the house so they can have jobs and opportunities. i think donald trump is addressing this economy and he wants to change things. and i think that's the higher priority for people right now. >> congressman, do you give money to charity? >> yes. >> okay. if you found out your candidate had not given any money to charity since 2008, which is the last time anybody can find evidence of it, would that make you uncomfortable? >> it would make me uncomfortable. i've asked this question in closed door meetings many, many times and there is a list of charities that he has given to and people who say we really appreciate what he has done.

i have no doubt that donald trump and the trump foundation, the trump family is extremely generous with charities. >> that's it different. unfortunately, the trump foundation, this is what i'm referring to, the investigation s into the trump foundation show that it's not his money. he's taking other people -- other people are putting money into the trump foundation and he's transferring that to charities but that he himself has not opened his wallet since he gave to the trump foundation in 2008 with the possible exception of covering the hurricane. >> by law, remember, he has to have other donors to that foundation and that's just the way the corporate tax law works so he has to have those donations. you know, i believe he's a generous guy but i want to stay focused on really and truly i think that people back home right now who are suffering not so much those of us who are in washington and, you know, maybe tied up in some of the political circles, you know, we're doing fine but i think the average family is really suffering out there right now and this isn't, you know, the disclosure of his

taxes isn't the paramount reason they're going to go to the polls. it's not why he gets 15,000 people to his rallies and hillary clinton gets 1,000. people want to change. and he's the element of change. he is talking about economy and jobs and infrastructure and things that are ringing to them and appealing to them. >> congressman, jack kingston, thanks so much for being on with your take on all of this. >> well, thanks a lot. >> let's get over to john. hurricane matthew headed right at haiti, cuba and jamaica. this is a powerful category 4 packing winds of 130 miles per hour along with torrential rain. residents up and down the east coast of the united states now watching this storm very closely. let's get to cnn meteorologist chad myers with the latest track. chad? >> john, yeah, the hurricane hunt earp now in the storm just found a wind to 140. expect that 130 to get upgraded here anytime soon. it is a category 4 hurricane

without a doubt. i know we've talked about maybe the potential for these other areas of convex to be other eyes. that's not the case. there's one eye to the storm, one center. it's right there and it's headed for that little peninsula of haiti, and we can see 30 inches of rainfall in that spot. and you take all that mudslide and all that rain and you push it into people, push it into cities, we are going to get a disaster there in haiti. we hope that it misses even by a few miles that would be a big deal. but where does it go from there? does it get up toward miami? that's the left side of the cone. it's possible. is it all the way out to almost the middle of bermuda, the atlantic? sure, that's possible, too, but we still have to watch 100-mile-per-hour, possibly a major storm, headed toward the east coast he especially the carolina coast or as far north as newfoundland that would be seven or eight days from now but this is a big storm in warm water. i don't think it's going to die anytime soon, john. >> will have to watch that closely and see if it drifts

west. chad myers, thanks very much. kim kardashian robbed at gunpoint in a paris hotel. armed men locked the reality tv star in a bathroom and took off with millions in jewelry and cell phones. jim bittermann is live in paris with the late-breaking details. jim, what are you learning? >> reporter: that jewelry included one ring worth $4 million alone and the contents of her jewelry box estimated worth about $5 million. that's according to the prosecutor here. they're still investigating trying to figure out what happened. they know that five gunmen came in here masked. they overwhelmed the concierge and demanded that they be taken upstairs to kim kardashian's apartment in this rather luxurious and discreet hotel. very few people know about this place as a hotel but a lot of stars stay here as a kind of safe house in paris. not so safe because of what happened last night. and there's a great deal of worry here about what's happened

to paris' image. the mayor of paris has been saying recently in a communique that she condemns the attack and wanted to remind everybody that 2 million people gathered for an event here this weekend without a problem. still, after all the terrorist attacks and this now it's going to really be damaging for the image of paris. the first word anybody had about th this, it happened about 3:00 in the morning and that came from kanye west, her husband who, in fact, was in the middle of a concert. here is how it went down. ♪ >> i'm sorry. i'm sorry. there's a family emergency. i have to stop the show. >> reporter: so the investigation continues. alisyn? >> jim, thanks so much for that update. well, donald trump is looking to capitalize on this it leaked audio of hillary clinton talking about senator bernie sanders and his supporters. could the leak damage clinton's standing with millennials? the clinton camp is here to

respond next on "new day." scary. e, tho [boy] that was awesome! [dad] yeah. [burke] covered. november fourteenth, 2015. talk to farmers, we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪

try theraflu expressmax,nd flu hold you back now in new caplets. it's the only cold & flu caplet that has a maximum strength formula with a unique warming sensation you instantly feel. theraflu. for a powerful comeback. new expressmax caplets.

donald trump is attacking hillary clinton over a leaked audio clip recording in february where she talks about then rival bernie sanders and his supporters. listen. >> there's a deep desire to believe we can have free college, free health care. it's a false promise but i don't think you tell idealistic

people, particularly young people, that they bought into a false promise. his ideas are indefensible. >> so hillary clinton, you might say, is already millennially challenged. at least she's not doing as well as president obama did with young voters. how does this latest clip affect things? the co-chair of the clinton/kaine transition project and the former policy director for hillary clinton. thanks so much. i mentioned that donald trump already picking up on this and did have a quick sound bite over the weekend. let's list en to that. >> hillary clinton thinks bernie sanders' supporters are hopeless and ignorant basement dwellers. then, of course, she thinks people who vote for and follow us are deplorable and irredeemable. i don't think so. >> respond to the bernie sanders clip. hillary clinton talking about bernie sanders voters as people

who live in basements and donald trump picking up on that. you never want it to put voters in a box, do you? >> you know, i actually urge every single american to listen to the entirety of the tape. i realize the leaked audio is really easy in this day and age to take a few sentences out of context, but i think the reality is if people listen to the entire tape, what hillary was saying about how we have to actually understand why young people are so frustrated with the political system, that was a key message in this and that's precisely why senator sanders himself yesterday said numerous times that she and he agree on that and that these -- he made a particular effort to say that there wasn't anything particularly controversial and they had a hard fought primary. they had some disagreements. hillary has after the primary worked with senator sanders on issues like college affordability.

they've come up with a joint plan to ensure that there is affordable college , tuition fre he college for all middle-class families. it's a great compromise. i think we can pick at this but at a time when donald trump has problem after problem after problem at that same rally he discusses he had five vicious attacks, unfounded attacks. we can talk about this but in the context i think people realize and i, again, urge everyone to listen to the entirety of the tape, it's on the internet. >> i agree 100%. and bernie sanders did defend hillary clinton and the greater context of what she said, but when you're looking at the campaign right now, let me remind you if you look at polling about you how people under 35 view this race right now, yes, hillary clinton is leading 44% to 28%, but that's not by a lot by historical standards. barack obama did much better against mitt romney than hillary clinton is doing right now.

there is some softness with millennial voters and while bernie sanders did agree with the thrust of what hillary clinton was saying, she also on that tape called some of his views indefensible, and bernie sanders quite clearly made it clear made him uncomfortable. let me show you what he told jay. >> of course it does. we're in the middle of a campaign and i, trust me, if you go to some of the statements i made about hillary clinton, you can see real differences so we have differences. there's nothing to be surprised about. that's what a campaign is all about. >> how much does hillary clinton need bernie sanders? you're nodding your head but bernie sanders just said he was uncomfortable when hillary clinton called his views indefensible. he did say that. >> i just listened to the same tape you did and he said one word about -- he spent his entire time explaining how they were in a primary at the time and they were disagreeing on issues. i think the important thing to note is that immediately after

the primary efforts were made back and forth between the campaign. they worked together on issues. from college affordability but objeviously also a public optio in health care. bernie sanders deeply influenced the democratic primary process and the platform andry took a lot of his ideas and they're working hand-in-hand. i'm excited he's going out this week and campaigning for hillary. he's a great -- he's a great messenger for her and he'll do a great job for her this weekend. he has a very clear message to millennials and all americans. so much is at stake in this election whether it's addressing rising inequality, citizens united, climate change, and issue after issue hillary has been a strong champion. of course it's on her to deliver that message as well as she did last week and is delivering this week. but, you know, i think on issue after issue as we get closer to this race, people are going to make decisions for themselves. >> you brought up donald trump's speech saturday night where he

said a lot of stuff that people look at and say that's out there including some stuff that's, frankly, indefensible when he questioned hillary clinton's fidelity in her marriage. let's listen to that quickly and then i have a question after. >> i don't even think she's loyal to bill if you want to know the truth. and really, folks, really, why should she be, right? >> now look, that's indefensible. there's no basis for that comment. it is not what we've come to expect. leave that where it is. look at how hillary clinton in the '90s dealt with some of those who made accusations against bill clinton, whether it be gennifer flowers or others and there are critics of hillary clinton who say she basically attacked the accusers here. hang on. what i'm asking, is that a reasonable line of questioning right there? is it fair to go back and question hillary clinton to talk about how she treated women

under these circumstances? >> look, i urge people to, again, release stories. "the new york times" story today says there's no evidence of what role hillary played in the pushback on these stories. i think people kind of recognize that maybe when a person is accused of having an affair with your husband, you're not going to be their biggest champion or fan. having said that, you know, i think people should look at hillary's record on women's issues. she's been a strong champion. look at who she is also running against and there's a story today in the a p, a bombshell story, of donald trump's actual treatment of women -- not his wife's treatment of women -- his treatment of women on "the apprentice." how he made comments about them. numerous people say he was a sexual harasser. i think let's put this in context, and i think people can decide for themselves. >> thanks for coming on. i appreciate you being here. >> thank you. >> alisyn? >> john, five weeks and one day

now until the election. what will the october surprise be for both? and what is this bombshell about donald trump's taxes now do to his campaign? we have the bottom line for you next. that's why at mccormick pure flavor is our mission. so you can realize the rich taste of pure flavor. after all, the smallest pinch of mccormick can make meals legendary. because pure tastes better. just checking my free credit score at credit karma. can make meals legendary. what the??? you're welcome. i just helped you dodge a bullet. but i was just checking my... shhh... don't you know that checking your credit score lowers it! just be cool. actually, checking your credit score with credit karma doesn't affect it at all. are you sure? positive. so i guess i can just check my credit score then? oooh "check out credit karma today. credit karma. give yourself some credit." sorry about that.

sureor put themhave ston a rack.e tires. but the specialists at ford like to show off their strengths: 13 name brands. all backed by our low price tire guarantee. yeah, we're strong when it comes to tires. right now during the big tire event, get a $140 rebate by mail on four select tires. ♪ with hotels.com's for every 10 nights you stay, you get one free. which is great for families. finally! whatever captain obvious. hotels.com. great for families. mom! and for sore losers!

"the new york times" breaking the news donald trump may not have paid federal income taxes for two decades. he also had a lackluster debate performance, an ugly spat with a former beauty queen and now is accusing hillary clinton of infidelity. here with the bottom line is senior political reporter nia-malika henderson and jackie. good to have you here. earlier we had on one of "the new york times" reporters who helped break the story this weekend about donald trump possibly paying no federal income tax. for the better part of 20 years. let me play you what she says was the headline of her story. >> this net operating loss came out of the sort of financial

wreckage that he had reaped in the early 1990s. is this something americans feel good about, that a wealthy businessman can finagle these losses into income tax coverage for as many as 18 years. >> so, nia-malika, he had losses in 1995 because of casinos that went bankrupt, of $916 million they found and that would allow him not to pay federal income tax for the next 20 years. what do you think the political fallout is? >> i think with his core supporters, they're going to believe the line this makes him a genius, right, the fact that he paid someone it to do his taxes and was able to get away with this and it's legal makes him a genius. that's on a lot of the front pages of swing state local newspapers across the country. but i think for other voters this will get at a couple of things, one of which is how great a businessman is he if he is having losses of almost a

billion dollars? he's failed at casinos, failed transaction with a hotel as well. those are questions and i think bernie sanders also made a very good point that democrats if they want to gain some leverage on this yesterday which is to say that middle class folks around the country pay taxes. those taxes go to veterans. those taxes go to infrastructure, and here is donald trump not paying any of those taxes, federal taxes, yet he is benefiting from those. he is getting away with something middle class income earners just aren't able it to and benefiting from a rigged system. >> so, jackie, the question i like to ask, so what happens next? hillary clinton happens to be going to your home turf, going to ohio today where she will talk to voters there. this seems like a particularly ferr fertile place. so how does she address it today, and do we think donald trump will take this on? since saturday night when he said some outlandish things on the stump, the man has been

pretty quiet even on twitter, jackie. has he been reined in? is he in a steel cage with kellyanne conway outside? >> i think don't he's been reined in. we've seen over the past, i don't remember how many months, every time we think he's reined in, he's on message, he wants to be pulled back, frankly. the way donald trump talks about this is going to matter because remember during the debate he said hillary clinton said something about his taxes, how maybe he didn't pay taxes and he said, well, that's because i'm smart. there was a great "washington post" story that showed the reaction in north carolina actually and the reporter said everyone gasped in the room that that's how he looked at not paying taxes and hillary clinton has been going after whether he's been a good businessman this entire campaign and this speaks to that argument. i think they're going to continue to use this and continue delving into donald trump's business record not only

on these tax returns but to flush out some of his other tax returns. just looking at the what we have, he doesn't look like that great of a businessman at all and he can't like that. >> nia-malika, what are you looking at in the vp debate? >> are they able to keep it nice? mike pence is a midwestern guy, he has the temperament and also tim kaine known as a nice guy. even tom cruise has praised him as being a nice guy. are they going to be able to keep it that way? for mike pence, is he going to be able to change the subject and change some of the outcome of that first debate? donald trump largely i think people thought he lost the debate. is he going to be able to gain some ground in this debate? and then if you are at this point kaine, one of the things i think the clinton campaign had done so brilliantly so far is to use these to gain some leverage, to introduce new topics and to really bait donald trump. how does tim kaine continue that? what kind of new information do we get about donald trump or

even mike pence in these debates that can continue the argument that hillary clinton wants to make about this republican ticket? >> and, jackie, mike pence will have to deal with machado and the net operating losses. he'd better have an answer for that. >> what we're going to see tomorrow night is a proxy battle with more smiles. these are two very seasoned politicians. i think you'll hear more optimism. it will be interesting how people want mike pence and tim kaine on the top of the ticket. >> join us tomorrow night for the vice presidential debate. indiana governor mike pence, tim kaine face off against each other 9:00 p.m. eastern.

>> "saturday night live" is back. we will look at how they did next. >> he is a bully. >> shut up. >> he started the birther movement. >> you did. >> he says climate change is a hoax invented by china. >> it's pronounced jina. like to show off their strengths: 13 name brands. all backed by our low price tire guarantee. yeah, we're strong when it comes to tires. right now during the big tire event, get a $140 rebate by mail on four select tires. ♪

perfect driving record. until one of you clips a food truck. then your rates go through the roof. perfect. ♪ accident forgiveness, liberty mutual won't rse your rates due to your first accident. and if you do have an accident, our claims centers are available to assist you twenty-four seven. call for a free quote today. liberty stands with you™. liberty mutual insurance. actually making your body feel better... making your whole day better. hi, everybody. i'm boomer esiason. and that's exactly what tommie copper does for me. now, they call it "wearable wellness"

and they have infused it into everything they do. sleeves that help support aching elbows and knees. tops that can help ease your overworked, sore back and shoulders. bottoms that help relieve stiff thighs and hips. and even socks and orthotics that provide added support and comfort. [ angie ] tommie copper's helped me feel better since the minute i put it on. if i could cover my entire body in tommie copper, i probably would! [ male announcer ] tommie copper is the pioneer of comfortable copper compression. relief from everyday aches and pains, effective odor and uv protection, moisture wicking, and incredible comfort! trust the original. add wearable wellness to your wardrobe. call now or go to tommiecopper.com. order 2 or more items and get free shipping. [ boomer ] work, performance, or whatever your day brings, experience the difference of comfortable compression. tommie copper. life hurts, feel better.

you've criticized secretary clinton for voting for the iraq war, but you, yourself, supported the war. >> wrong, wrong, wrong. you're being very mean to me tonight, coal train. >> "saturday night live" ta takinging a swipe at donald trump and his criticism of the media. this morning a look at what effect the media is having on the presidential race. joining us now senior media correspondent and host of reliable sources and our old friend, director of the school of media and public affairs at george washington university. frank is the former cnn/washington bureau chief. let's play just a little bit more because we can from "saturday night live." >> i was against the war.

ask anyone in the world named sean hannity. call sean hannity. >> you told sea hannity on his show, and there's proof? >> no, i told him in private. it was just me and sean late at night. i leaned over and i whispered in his ear, sean, i'm against the war in iraq. and then he whispered in my ear, i'm against the war, too. and the next thing i knew, i was kissing sean hannity. >> all right. so "saturday night live" also made fun of hillary clinton, but not as much. let's be honest. not as much. so, brian, give me deeper meaning to the whole thing. >> first of all, alec baldwin is having the time of his life. he was born to play donald trump, one of the best known liberals in new york. he's not going to go easy on trump nor are the "snl" writers who tend to be liberals, like hollywood in general. there is a lot to make fun of, though, about trump's debate performance and the "snl" writers could not shy away from that. >> frank, was entertaining.

does "saturday night live" affect the election? >> well, you know, people don't watch "saturday night live" and then go out and vote, but they watch "saturday night live" as they watch this program, as they read, as they hear. it's part of the ecosystem and the answer is yes. the jabs that come from alec baldwin go to the heart of the matter. he said, the microphone is broken. you broke it. you and barack obama took it to kenya and you broke it. brilliant writing, but it really nails in so many different ways these different threads that we've been hearing and it's part of the noise that's out there and people absorb that. >> it's very directed noise, too, though, the system is rigged, the media is against me. everyone is against me of and it's interesting the context of what we're seeing with newspapers, right? more and more newspapers are coming out and endorsing hillary clinton or not endorsing donald trump. some republican leaning newspapers that have endorsed republicans are endorsing gary

johnson. this chart paints that picture. doesn't this make donald trump's point the entire establishment is against him and for people who don't trust the media what do these endorsements matter? >> these endorsements don't matter all and they probably corroborate thedis trust that they already feel. what's significant about the he had torials if people read them, they are often carefully crafted. they are rather -- no, they are very specific in laying out their particular cases and in some examples like the arizona republic where they're endorsing a democrat for the first time in 130 years, that has a very po r powerful statement. the editorials are not just tweets. for people who are either on the fence or undecided, and there's a fair number of those people this cycle or for those not strong in their support, again, they add to that ecosystem of

discussion and debate that can be influential. >> so, brian, "the new york times," as you know over the weekend got their hands on donald trump's 1995 new york state tax return that showed he had a $916 million loss. there is a little excerpt from it, from the "new york times." we've had his surrogates on today who say this is illegal. they published something illegally. they should be ashamed of themselves. any thoughts on that? >> my first e-mail was to the editor of "the new york times." he had said last month that he would take the risk of jail time in order to objetain trump's taxes. well, that's actually a coincidence. he didn't say that because he was obtaining the documents, it happened to be a total coincidence and he doesn't expect there to be a legal risk. we heard lewadowski say he hopes trump sues. he's been trying to keep the tax

returns prip vat. trump's entire brand is about winning, and reality about politics is that it's a lot about losing. half the people that run for any given office lose. and what we're seeing right now is a candidate who seems to be on the losing end right now. we'll see what happens but right now he's losinging and i wonder how that's affecting him on the campaign trail and in his rhetoric and on twitter. >> great to have you both with us. >> thank you. >> donald trump's surrogates say he's a genius amid the report that suggests maybe he didn't pay taxes for some 18 years. so what does another billionaire businessman think about that? we'll speak with mark cuban next.

try theraflu expressmax,nd flu hold you back now in new caplets. it's the only cold & flu caplet that has a maximum strength formula with a unique warming sensation you instantly feel. theraflu. for a powerful comeback. new expressmax caplets. across new york state, from long island to buffalo, from rochester to the hudson valley, from albany to utica, creative business incentives, infrastructure investment, university partnerships, and the lowest taxes in decades are creating a stronger economy and the right environment in new york state for business to thrive. let us help grow your company's tomorrow- today at business.ny.gov

donald trump supporters say his business practices in the 1990s may have allowed him to avoid paying taxes are, quote, jeepous. genius. >> he almost almost a billion dollars in 1995. >> correct. >> that doesn't sound particularly brilliant to me. >> well, yes, it does. it shows what a genius he is. it shows he was able to preserve his enterprise and then he was able to build it -- >> there's no one who has shown more genius in their way to maneuver around the tax code as he rightfully used the laws to do that. >> what do other billionaires think about this? joining us now by phone is one of them, businessman and entrepreneur mark cuban, owner of the dallas mavericks and co-star of the show "shark tank." good morning, mark. >> good morning, alisyn. >> is donald trump a genius if

he figured out a way to avoid paying federal income taxes the past 18 years? >> no, if he was such a genius, and there's nobody who likes to brag about his genius more than donald trump, why won't he come out and explain what he did? if he was doing something that had some upside, come out and say it to us. more likely it was just another example of financial engineering and that creates problems for everybody. >> mark, this is legal. if this -- if "the new york times" and what they found in their reporting is accurate, and there's no reason to believe it's not, what he did was he declared a $916 million loss in 1995 and he then carried it over for the next 18 years which you are allowed to do. >> yes, you are. i've taken advantage of net operating losses as well. first of all, let's walk through this. in order to lose a billion dollars, $915 million, you have to have $915 million. and i don't think based off what he's written he had $915 million in cash.

based off his interest earned and the interest rate of the bond yields at the time, he probably had $100 million in cash that he used as a compensating and had to borrow the rest. now the key question after showing a $915 million loss is how much money does he owe still? who does he owe it to? was that debt forgiven because if it was forgiven that's going to eat up that net operating loss because the debt forgiveness is the same as income. he hasn't explained any of those things in any way, shape or form. that's a problem. >> well, he -- the sum of that could be answered if he released his tax returns, which he has not done. >> remember, he could just release the first page and we wouldn't have those details. if he wants to brag about how amazing his business acumen is, let him brag, explain it and he hasn't done so. >> mark, are you saying that -- let's say this was all legal, that he really did have that loss. >> it probably was legal. >> it was legal and three of his

casinos in the '90s did go bankrupt and he lost trump airlines and trump university and things like that. he really did have businesses losses. are you saying he should have volunteered to pay more taxes? >> no, not at all. all i'm saying is just explain it. you see, the problem with donald trump and why he's unfit to be president is that he won't own his mistakes. we all make mistakes. i've had companies go belly up. i say it all the time. it doesn't matter how many times you fail. you only have to be right one time and everybody will tell you how lucky you are. just own the mistake and explain it. if he did that, look, secretary clinton all the time is proposing incentives for individuals and everybody to invest in small businesses and will give you a tax advantage if you invest and hold an investment in a small business for five years or longer. if he had done something like that, we'll applaud him. we want people investing in

small business. if there's a net operating loss you carry forward, so be it because hopefully your wins will exceed your losses. the problem is there's no transparency and he won't own his mistakes and we don't want somebody like that who is ashamed of what they've done in the business world. >> he doesn't say this is a mistake, mark. he says this is a brilliant strategy. >> everybody around him did, right? well, he says he is smart for not paying taxes and that's just wrong. that's just wrong. at some point, look, i say it all the time. after military service the most patriotic thing you can do as a wealthy person is pay your taxes. that keeps the roads paved, the military paid, and kids going to school. and he obviously doesn't understand that concept. >> but, mark, are you saying that come april 15th that you would pay more of your taxes than what is -- you're legally bound to? >> no, no, that's not what i'm saying at all. what i'm saying is i don't -- look, i get offered all the time these tax advantage opportunities, and i don't take them.

if you buy this insurance product, then you can offset your income. because those things typically end up being disallowed and i don't do any of them. if donald is taking tax shortcuts, maybe he bought an insurance policy as opposed to doing something in real estate and he took a huge tax write-off to offset income. we don't know. and that's the inherent problem. there's no transparency and he is so ashamed of what he's done. he's not willing to speak up and explain to us what happened. >> well, look, what you're saying is that if it is true that what "the new york times" has reported -- and it is legal -- that he had a huge business loss of his money in the 1990s and he was then able -- >> we didn't say it's his money, right? >> but it's still legal. even if he borrowed it. he still can deduct it, right, mark? >> no, not necessarily. we've all heard about tax scams and tax shelters, right? what we don't know is whether or not this is a tax shelter. this could be something where he

got involved in currencies or insurance tax shelters, there's 1,001 that were very degreesive and offered at the time. this is right around the time that we were going public. and all the time there were accounting companies. i refuse to do them. we don't have any details behind the front page of his new york and new jersey returns, that this is a tax shelter. we're presuming it's a real estate deal that went bad. >> there's no transparency because he hasn't released his taxes. are you still offering $10 million to charity if donald trump were to release his taxes and do you want to up that total today? >> no, no reason to up it because he won't take it.

look, again, this it guy is unfit for president and if you're going to look at these tax returns and try to dig into them, the question you have to ask is was this a tax shelter or some kind of tax scam. he would have gone to jail. not necessarily. there's tax shelters that walk a very thin line. so we don't know what created this tax shelter. donald trump department have a billion dollars to lose at the time these were filed. it's hard to read the date but it looks like it was april 15 that he filed it. nobody -- it's impossible to get done for the previous year. if that's the case and it's april 15, that's fishy in and of itself. >> great to talk to you. newsroom with carol costello

after this very quick break. we'll see you tomorrow. [burke] hot dog. seen it. covered it. we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ pure is big, bold, bright and just better. that's why at mccormick pure flavor is our mission. so you can realize the rich taste of pure flavor. after all, the smallest pinch of mccormick can make meals legendary. because pure tastes better.

with hotels.com's for every 10 nights you stay, can you get one free.ary. which is great for families. finally! whatever captain obvious. hotels.com. great for families. mom! and for sore losers!

keeping the power lines clear,my job to protect public safety, while also protecting the environment. the natural world is a beautiful thing, the work that we do helps us protect it. public education is definitely a big part of our job, to teach our customers about the best type of trees to plant around the power lines. we want to keep the power on for our customers. we want to keep our community safe. this is our community, this is where we live. we need to make sure that we have a beautiful place for our children to live. together, we're building a better california. and good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you for joining me. donald trump beginning a new week in a very familiar place, fighting controversy. this time over his taxes. "the new york times" reporting trump declared a loss of m