chris, there's some sense coming into this debate it would become a calm state affair between two federal politicians, dull versus duller some call it. it took 20 minutes before those tuned as most desperately trying to land blows in favor of their running >> governor pence can defend the donald trump. >> becoming a night of whose candidate is more insulting. >> you and hillary clinton would know a lot about an insult-driven campaign. >> reporter: using donald trump's own words. >> he's called women's slobs, pigs, disgusting. he went after john mccain apow and said he wasn't a hero. >> reporter: words pence in many cases didn't directly defend. >> when donald trump says women

should be punished or john mccain's not a hero, he's showing you who he is. >> senator, you whipped out that mexican thing, again. he, look, can you defend that? >> there are criminal aliens in this country, tim. >> reporter: instead, trying to take a similar tact against hillary clinton. >> he still wouldn't have a fraction of the insults when she said half of our supporters were a basket of deplorables. >> reporter: denying statements the billionaire has made in the past. >> dawned trump and mike pence have said he's a great leader. donald trump has business. >> i respect putin, he is a strong leader. >> donald trump's claim that nato is obsolete and we need to get rid of nato is so dangerous. >> nato has to be rejiggered, interchanged for the better. >> reporter: kaine frequently

interrupted pence. >> senator, i think i'm -- >> these were donald -- >> hold on a second, governor. >> reporter: trying to prove trump is unfit for office by quoting ronald reagan. >> he said the problem with nuclear proliferation some fool or maniac could trigger a -- >> senator, that even beneath you and hillary clinton and that's pretty low. >> reporter: hammering pence on donald trump's refusal to release his taxes. >> if i run for president, i will absolutely release my taxes. he's broken his first promise. >> he hasn't broken his promise. >> he stood on the stage last week and when hillary said you haven't been paying taxes, he said that makes me smart. it's smart not to pay for teachers. >> his tax returns that showed he went through a very difficult time, but he used the tax code

just the way it is supposed to be used and he did it brilliantly. >> reporter: as pence touted the message trump advisors want their own candidate to make. that they represent change. >> what you all just heard out there is that more taxes. $2 trillion in more spending, more deficits, more debt, more government. and if you think that's all working, then you look at the other side of the table. >> reporter: both candidates asking americans to trust their candidate and distrust their opponent. >> we trust hillary clinton my wife and i. we trust her with the most important thing in our life. we have a son deployed overseas and we trust hillary clinton as president and commander in chief but the thought of donald trump as commander in chief scares us to death. >> there is a reason why people question the trustworthness of hillary clinton, and that's because they're paying attention. >> reporter: ending on abortion and faith. >> stand with great compassion

for the sanctity of life. we can create a culture of life. >> why don't you trust women to make this choice for themselves? >> we can encourage people to support life, of course we can. but on fundamental issues of morality, we should let women make their own decisions. >> and, alisyn, flawless, that's how one trump adviser spun pence's performance. he was the calm and steady hand of that the campaign desperately needed him to be. that was never really in question. the real question, can donald trump do the same? >> let's see what viewers thought of the debate. cnn instant poll after the debate gave the edge to governor mike pence. 48% of debate watchers say pence won the debate, compared to 42% for senator tim kaine. two-thirds of viewers also said trump's running mate exceeded expectations.

only 14% thought that he did worse and then 18%, or let me read this instead of just reading it off the screen. more than half say the debate did not sway their vote. did not make them more likely to back trump. only 18% said the same for clinton. i've got to get math down at this hour, errol. skews more democratic than an average cnn poll of all americans. >> boy, was there a lot of drama about that after the first debate. this time because the republican came out on top, nobody will say a thing. great poll. so, style often trumps substance. but substance can come back to haunt you in a debate. let's take a look at what will come out of last night's big. errol lewis, cnn political analyst david gregory and cnn political analyst and washington puro chief for "daily beach" jackie kosinisc. if you have to pick a headline,

what is it? >> pence wins putting dalite between himself and his running mate. the reality is what i thought he did best in terms of style was really great. beyond that, he said a number of things that are quite different from what donald trump has said. if he can get away with it and donald trump praises his performance and the republican party will say full steam ahead with trump/pence it added some nuance and given the clinton team something that they'll have to be worried about. >> david greggregory, what is y take away? >> i disagree a little bit. no question that pence had an ease about him and highly relatable and i interviewed him many times and i thought he came off very well and tim kaine was a bit too in love with his brief, but i think he had a job to do and that was to continue to drive enthusiasm among democratic voters who may be unsure about hillary clinton. so, she took that fight rather

kaine took that fight to donald trump through mike pence. and i thought there was a lot of blood drawn and that pence didn't wipe up and that he didn't respond to. i will say on a point of style, first of all, i thought while it was soeber and substantive, i thought it was disjointed and not enough control of the discussion and i thought it was a really missed opportunity by tim kaine who wanted to be the prosecutor on the attack who didn't look to his opponent enough and put him on the defensive. he kept looking at the moderator. now, these are just kind of style tv points. but for a politician who wants to make, get in this guy's face and make a point, he didn't look to him. and say what about that, governor pence? how do you answer that? >> pence did a great job -- pence did a great job of those stylistic cues of looking to the camera and deciding what to answer and keeping his measure all the time. style ends up being your headline. jackie, one of the interesting

dynamics pence was not wanting to answer, because of all the trump said, trump said, he got away with not having to answer on lgbt rights. he got away with momentarily discussing his feeling about syrian refugees. >> yeah, he really did. but i want to go back for just a second. the clinton campaign would have to be worried about this. talking to them yesterday, there was kind of a lightness about them because what they said tim kaine was able to do was able to make his running mate step away from donald trump. even his running mate can't defend what this guy is saying. that's one of the things they're taking from this and push in the coming days. you're right, mike pence didn't have to defend his record in indiana on syrian refugees or lgbtq issues. you have to imagine, we can do a lot of that and call them out

for that in the press, but you would expect it at a debate in that scale to get to know the candidates better and their records and even having the moderator draw it out, if they weren't willing to weigh in on their own records. >> so, some people hit tim kaine on having what seemed like some canned lines. some canned zingers. >> yeah. >> let's listen to those. >> you are for donald trump, hired president and hillary clinton, dawned trump can't start a twitter war with miss universe without shooting himself in the foot. he loves dictators. he has a personal mt. rushmore. >> oh, come on. >> if you don't know the difference between dictatorship and leadership, then you have to go back to a fifth grade civics class. >> how did those go over, errol? >> i like the mt. rushmore, in particular. got its own hashtag and some

folks creating their own personal mt. rushmores. look, it was sort of too clever in part by the way mike pence spent five years doing talk radio and said, look, that's just silly for the kind of conversation we're having. the reality is those zingers only work when they're in contrast to the rest of the conversation. the rest of the conversation hadn't been sort of a solid policy discussion that you can throw azinger into the middle of. so, here, again, on style points kaine was playing the wrong game. i think pence was, you know, he did, it's a little bit of a radio trick. a you just say, hey, i could defend the guy and he didn't defend him. >> he didn't go out of his way to defend him. he tried sometimes saying, there you go, whipping out the mexican thing, again. you know, where he's talking about, trump calling mexicans

rapists who are coming across the border. he tried to put that in some context. he tried to put russia in some context. other aspects of this were just flat wrong. where the moderator or the opponent really has to bring the debate home for viewers. you're talking about russia. russia took advantage of the obama years. really? well, actually, vladimir putin invaded georgia while george bush was president. or that, you know, obama's responsible for isis. is there culpability there for how we got out of iraq and not continuing to have a residual force there? yeah. i love how the republican party who was for the iraq war just willfully ignores the fact that, in fact, the insurgency and the civil war and the roots of isis and zarqawi were planted because of the invasion of iraq but they just kind of cast that aside. >> that's part of the art of the debate. you only know what you show. you take the opportunities or you don't and the rest of us talk about it the whole next day.

we'll continue that right now. stay with us, guys. tim kaine repeatedly was pressing mike pence to defend what donald trump has said, to defend what donald trump has done. and the big part of the struggal for pence was not do that last night. now, did he go too far? how effective was pence? we'll show you, next. "yeah mom, the new kitchen's great. hey! if you want somethig to cook faster,

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a delicate dance for governor mike pence last night. he was hit over the head a lot by tim kaine about what donald trump has said. defend what he could and stay away from what he couldn't and he chose the latter most of the time. now, we have trump's own words. here's what senator kaine alleged and here's what mike pence did in response and here's what donald trump actually said. let's play it. >> let's start with not praising vladimir putin as a great leader. donald trump and mike pence have said he is a great leader. >> no, we haven't. >> donald trump has had business dealings -- >> he has been a leader far more than our president has been a leader. >> we don't think that women should be punished, as donald trump said they should for making the decision to have an abortion. >> donald trump and i would

never support legislation that punished women who made the heartbreaking choice to end a pregnancy. >> do you agree -- >> the answer is that there has to be some form of punishment. >> donald trump believes in deportation nation. they want to go house to house, school to school, business to business and kick out 16 million people. >> they came over illegally. some are wonderful people and they've been here for a while. they've got to go out. >> all right. let's bring back the panel. errol lewis, jackie kosinich. you want to put some daylight between what you think and donald trump thinks and you have to defend him, you're his running mate. how did it go? >> he did what i thought was sort of a usef fuful strategy f his point of view. we're a package deal.

you might like the policy or might not like the policy, but you can take the harsh version with donald trump and i'll give you the easy version. hey, it's going to be okay and that reality adjustment that has frustrated the trump campaign over the months which is that you get one outrageous statement and you call them on it and they start saying, no, i didn't say that. what i meant was and then you get the explanation. pence tried to do a little bit of that last night. i think it drives the opponents crazy because there are a lot of people who, when trump says i saw there were thousands of muslims cheering on 9/11. well, who are they? adjust it a little bit and here's a clip from one article that says that there was an unconfirmed report that there might have been two or three. so, you know, this is what pence is doing. this kind of reality adjustment. a debating trick, a political trick and it doesn't necessarily sort of work. but for a lot of people, it really does. especially if the opponent

doesn't. >> you're calling it it a reality adjustment, which is basically a denial of the videotape. >> my kids do that. they get punished for lying. this is jackie, do you think he was effective? you heard him denying and then there's the videotape, yes, they did. was it effective? >> i think mike pence was eff t effective for mike pence yesterday. let's not forget, this is a very ambitious politician and he knows that this doesn't work out, he needs to have a future. i think mike pence may be looking a little bit at 20/20 last night and not wanting to own some of these things or defend some of these things that donald trump said. let's not forget the week he had coming into this. donald trump got in a fight with a beauty queen. the aftermath of his not that great debate with hillary clinton. so, mike pence had stiff head winds going into this debate and, as a result, and whether it helps donald trump or not, i don't know. but i think mike pence certainly

looked good coming out of that to folks who were watching. >> david, could it be that pence wound up looking good for him in deflecting off of what trump has said he did not have to deal with lgbq and it also may have made people feel like, this guy might be better than the guy at the top of the ticket. >> it's like watching a debate from 2004. back in what politics used to be like before 2016. these are two pretty seasoned politicians who are smooth politicians. kaine was much more enamored of his one through five points and four debate points and multi-facetted plans. i think, i thought going in that pence was going to be twisted in knots trying to defend trump as we've been talking about. he didn't go out of his way to do that and tried to say, look, he's an unvarnished guy. kind of let him be him.

an effectiveness to that to, you know, really speaking to what drives a lot of support for donald trump. again, i just kind of focus on foreign policy. i think there's areas that are very thin that should give people pause. you know, if the answer s how are we going to deal with russia, oh, we'll be strong. that will be it. two administrations who have been tough with russia and it hasn't worked. i don't think kaine's answers were very good in that regard, as well. syrian refugees. you know, the clinton administration wants to bring in more and here you have pence talking about we need extreme vetting as if there's not tough vetting going on right now. and that we have the potential for displaced people from syria and else where if they're not assimula simulated well in other parts of the world some serious. >> there wasn't fact checking on the other side not as busy as

they were with -- donald trump said all mexicans are bad. may we have that moment to play for you versus what donald trump really said. listen to this. okay. base economy she said your running mate said all mexicans are bad. he said you're sending over your illegal aliens, some of whom who are rapists and murderers. >> and some, i assume, are good people. i was sitting right here when he said that. i don't know if the point is lost, to tell you the truth. it's a bit of a power phrase, but donald trump at the announcement of his presidency. his presidential campaign, did he call them rapist? yes, he did. did he say some are good people, unbelievably offensive? yes. does mike pence want to defend

that? of course. >> talking about tax cuts under bush leading to the financial collapse simply not true. and i thought there was a lot of innuendo around ties to trump's judgment in the way they accuse their critics of doing. again, if trump is not going to clear this up, it leaves plenty of room for them to raise these issues. >> jackie, not muscular defense of what tim kaine. he just kept repeating, we got osama bin laden and we got nukes away from iran and pence just kept pouncing on that and saying, no, you didn't. i guess, either way. >> panel, thank you very much. we have to leave it there. thanks for all your insight. we have to tell you about hurricane matthew and what's happening. after tearing through haiti and cuba, more than 1 million people have been told to leave their homes in the u.s. where is the storm scheduled to hit? chad myers has the latest track next on "new day."

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hurricane matthew packing a deadly punch in the caribbean.

pummeling haiti, cuba, taking heavy flooding, damaging winds. a trail of destruction in its path. cnn meteorologist chad myers join s us with the latest forecast track. once this thing gets over land, it will weak analen a little bi. >> that water in the bahamas is so warm, chris. there is very little shear. this storm will regain its old strength. it will regain significant strength. here's where we are right now. we're at about 125 miles per hour, gusts of 155. yes, it lost a lot of strength when it hit cuba last night. still moving at 10 in the warm water and the northern tip a category 3 storm. it doesn't look very good on satellite, but a very impressive storm gaining more strength as it runs up the east coast ask then makes a quick b-line to florida. where am i most concerned? i am most concerned from west palm all the way up to, let's

say sebastian inlet. that little cape that sticks out right there. category 4 storm on friday morning. this is thursday at midnight, really. very off the east coast. every single model that i looked at this morning continues to take the model slightly off shore. maybe 20 miles. but, chris, alisyn, you know 20 miles is nothing when it comes to forecast error. there is a chance it runs up the east coast and scours the entire beach area. that is also a similar chance of it stays off shore, making all the rainfall off shore and we only get winds of 50. we have to prepare for 120 and hope for 50. those are the differences by just a 20-mile deviation one way or the other. the eye is where the power is and the rest is the flooding and we could see mudslides and things like that if we get into the carolinas. into the high country of south carolina. right now that's not the forecast. still possible, but not the forecast. >> we will supplement your

information next hour when we talk to the hurricane center. everyone stay tuned for that. meanwhile, mike pence was tasked with defending dawned trump. did he help or hurt his boss? senator sessions, a trump supporter, gives us his take, next. (foot steps) ♪ (crickets chirping) ♪ (jet engine) ♪ (heart beat) ♪ (water splashing) (rain drops)

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the debate between tim kaine and mike pence was a clash of style and substance. pence was pressed to defend donald trump's past controversial statements. >> donald trump during his campaign has called mexicans rapists and criminals. he's called women slobs, pigs,

dogs, disgusting. he attacked an indiana-born federal judge and said he was unqualified to hear a federal lawsuit because his parents were mexican. he said african-americans are living in hell and he perpetrated this lie that the president is not a citizen. or john mccain's not a hero, he is showing you who he is. >> senator, you whipped out that mexican thing, again. >> so, did pence defend or deflect? let's discuss with donald trump supporter, alabama senator jeff sessions. good morning, senator. >> hello, alisyn. >> tell us what you think of governor pence's strongest moment was last night. >> well, you know, he had a lot of good moments. i thought his national defense was particularly good and his absolute understanding and insistence that part of the

chaos we have in the middle east was hillary clinton and barack obama's total withdraw from iraq. that set the seed for a lot of the problems for refugees and disaster we're seeing there now. >> let's talk about some of the possibly missed opportunities. you heard there tim kaine laying out a bunch of criticisms and you saw mike pence sort of shaking his head, no. but not vociferously jumping in to defend donald trump. did he miss some opportunities? i don't think so. what pence did and why he won this debate is he refused to be distracted. he stayed on the key issues of the debate. and a lot of the ways on some of these things are happening you have the question from the media or tim kaine with ten different charges in it and there's no way the respondent can actually address them each one. they take it out of context. they distort the meaning of it. they take something that was 20 years ago and fully not in

context and they throw it out and you just can't go down those roads and try to answer all those charges. sometimes it would be half a dozen in one line, one question. >> let's talk about something is demonstratively true in that case and not a distortion and an area of vulnerability for donald trump and mike pence was asked about that last night. that is the deportation force. donald trump many times during the primary and the campaign that he would call for a deportation force to get rid of the undocumented illegal aliens that are here. last night mike pence said that that was not true. let me play this moment for you. >> these guys and donald trump has said it, deportation force. they want to go house to house, school to school, business to business and kick out 16 million people and i cannot believe -- >> that's nonsense. >> they're illegal immigrants.

they came over lisillegally. some are wonderful people and they've been here for a while. they have to go out. >> how do you do it in a practical way? you think you can round up 11 million people? >> at some point we'll try getting them back, the good ones. >> why would governor pence say that's nonsense, we heard donald trump talk about a deportation force. >> what trump is thinking about, i'm not sure how firm hae is on the details. the touchback idea that many people have had when you go back to your home country and you want to get a legal status of some kind in the united states. what he said clearly in his formal speech in arizona about how we're going to handle immigration is we're going to end the illegality and assure the american people that the criminals that are in this country will be deported and then we're going to figure out how to handle the people who had been here a long time, who are good people.

that's his, where he is. but the key thing is you cannot ask the american people to provide any kind of amnesty until you've assured them that the illegality is over. that can be done by a president who has just a drive to get it done. >> but, senator, on the issue of deportation force, are you saying that you don't believe that donald trump has talked about a deportation force? >> well, he certainly said that. but he didn't say that they're going to go out house to house and round people up. >> he didn't say how it was going to be done. you know, i'm sorry to interrupt, but what donald trump said was that every one of them has to leave and he didn't explain how he was going to get 12 million, you know, undocumented immigrants out. so, a deportation force is one thing he was considering. are you forgetting that? >> he said this months ago. he said this months ago and he made a formal address a month or so ago in which he explained in

more detail some of the things that he would be planning to do. but you basically would have a self-deport. if you want to become yet a legal status in the united states. many people that propose this over the years. you go to your home country and apply and then you come back in with legal status. that is one way to preserve the rule of law -- >> so, self-deportation. self-deportation is what you believe donald trump now believes in. >> what he has discussed that and we'll wrestle with it. what he said he's absolutely going to go do in the lawlessness and put the country on the right path and get the illegal criminals out. that president obama says he's doing and he's not doing and we're going to protect the interest of the american worker and the security of the american people. >> senator jeff sessions, thanks so much for giving us your take this morning on "new day." >> thank you. >> let's go over to chris.

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strong claims made from both sides during the vice presidential debate, but was it strong and wrong? we have a little fact check for you with cnn chief business correspondent christine romans. you took a look, what did you see? >> the cnn reality team was hard at work, chris, vetting the claims made by both candidates. let's start with the clinton foundation here. governor mike pence fired off this criticism about how much the foundation gives to charity. >> the trump foundation is a private family foundation. they give virtually every cent in the trump foundation to charitable causes. less than 10 cents on the dollar in the clinton foundation has

gone to charitable causes. >> $20,000 portrait of donald trump. >> 10 cents of the clinton foundation has gone to charitable causes. >> just 10 cents on the charity goes to the charity. finds it spends 88% of the budget on charitable programs. that was in 2014. pence could have been talking about the money clinton foundation awards to outside groups. but overall, 88% goes to charities. so, our rating here is that claim was false. now, to the $19 trillion national debt. senator tim kaine made this claim about the high cost of donald trump's tax spending plans. >> he did ask us question about debt and the debt explosion on the trump plan is much, much bigger than anything on the clinton side. >> now, trump wants to cut taxes and increase spending on the military infrastructure. clinton will also increase spending, but she would pay for it by hiking taxes on the

wealthy. a study by the committee for a responsible federal budget finds trump's plan would add $5.3 trillion to the national debt and clinton would add $200 billion. our finding here, our fact check, true. let's talk about poverty and claims about poverty. pence also slammed the obama's economic record and said this about the number of people living in poverty. >> there are millions more people living in poverty today than the day with barack obama with hillary clinton at his side step under to the oval office. >> a lot of interrupting last night. true the number of people in poverty increased. but reeling from the great recession and the improving economy helped shrink that number. last year in 2015 fell to 13.5%. experts say that's the number to look at, not the total number of poor people. so, we rate pence's claim true,

but misleading. finally, last one for you here. deplorables. the basket of deplorables came up again last night. >> that's small potatoes to hillary clinton calling half of donald trump's supporters a basket of deplorables. >> hillary clinton said something on the campaign trail and the next day said she shouldn't have said that. >> but clinton did not back off the remark completely. she clarified that maybe not half of trump's supporters are deplorable. probably less than that. she did not apologize for using the term. so, we rate that statement, you guys, false. >> interesting, christine. thanks so much for that fact check. >> i always say every campaign is sort of true, but misleading. >> true but misleading. >> that's politics. >> thank you very much. did tim kaine lose on some style points last night? coming off as too aggressive at the debate. we'll break that down, next. [ boomer ] imagine what you wear every day

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order 2 or more items and get free shipping. [ boomer ] work, performance, or whatever your day brings, experience the difference of comfortable compression. tommie copper. life hurts, feel better. ""you don't want to ride the 13l checkiforever, do you?"ore?" "credit karma huh?" "yeah, it's free." "credit karma. give youself some credit." debates are opportunities and last night senator tim ka e kaine's big opportunity was to support and defend his candidate, hillary clinton. he was supposed to be on the attack. how well did he do? a big part of that is perception. jim hines a democrat from connecticut. he has endorsed hillary clinton. congressman, good tahave yoo ha.

>> good morning, chris. >> the headline a lot nicer than the debate between the two main candidates. pence won in our poll, 48-42. a big part of the criticism was, he was calm, more measured and kaine was hyperand interruehype too much. >> i think the senator burned a little hot in the first part of the debate. let's face it, pence was a cool customer. the piece that we're not talking about is that pence and being a cool customer really highlighted for a lot of republicans out there, my gosh, this is the way things used to be. we used to have a guy that didn't spend ten minutes of the debate talking about his conversation with sean hannity who wasn't out there being. wow, that reminds me of the republican party that used to exist and where is it now? >> pence definitely got some points to that. also given the luxury, by tim kaine, of talking about trump all night instead of defending his own record. tim kaine did not bring up the

lgbt which is how most of the country came to know about him. missed opportunity. >> governor pence saying we would take no syrian refugees. most americans would say that's a little over the top and did briefly come out what an aggressive stance mr. pence takes on women reproductive rights. >> are you surprised tim kaine didn't spend more time going after mike pence and what he represents as being a potential heart beat away from the presidency? >> i wasn't that surprised. his role was to defend the presidential nominee. to defend secretary clinton. of course, that's true. his other thing, his other objective had to have been and i thought he did this quite well. you're ariesinab reasonable guy old school presentable republican. how do you defend the fact shaming and that came up time

and time again. now, to pence's credit, he didn't take that bait, but that was the unanswered question that wra rang low the entire debate. how could he be on the same tickwit the guy that acts like a 9-year-old. >> pence's two big fits were on russia and on the safety of the world, in general. on the first one, he said that secretary clinton, when she came into office said my priority is the russian reset. and that it is an abject failure and that putin and russia are more formidable than ever. >> i don't think you can blame the secretary for saying right up front that the relationship with russia is not what it should be and we'll reset it and try to make it better. by the way, that relationship led tasomething that did come up a lot last night, the iran nuclear agreement. if russia and the united states weren't working with china, today it's quite possible that iran would be close to having a nuclear weapon or have a nuclear

weapon. so, the fact -- >> pence did a good job on that last night in terms of giving reasonable basis to suspect that the iran deal at best incomplete and at some point they will be able to get nuclear weapons. >> see, i completely disagree with that. he threw out the $150 billion number. the iranians have not even seen numbers of magnitude closer to 150 and they can't get any of the money into the country that they promised their own people. ten years from now, hey, we had a ten-year period in which iran was not two months away from a nuclear weapon. he also completely misstated this deal guarantees that in ten years iran will have a nuclear weapon. that's absurd on the face of it. if iran started rebuilding their nuclear capability and that fact and apart from being a violation of the iran nuclear deal would be a clear violation of the treaty and all the same tools at our disposal and should they go back to where they were three years ago and this idea that

this guarantees, which i hear from republicans all the time, is just a flat out lie. >> do you think pence helped trump last night? >> i think, i think there are probably people around the country that watched donald trump for the past year and republicans, in particular, who said how did my party get to this place? how did the party of lincoln and roosevelt end up with a guy who clearly has no knowledge of the role of the president and takes on and criticizes and actually shames mexicans, women, african-americans, you name it. i think they saw in governor pence the way things used to be. the way republicans in a way that certainly in my state of connecticut, a lot of republicans, i think, i think of very nostalgically. >> you don't think it boosts the ticket, it is a reminder that the ticket is inadequate at the top. >> if you think about it, what is going to happen we saw a debate that universally people say donald trump screwed that debate up. donald trump, i will concede was

reasonable and statesman-like last night and now we'll go back to donald trump in that debate. what is that contrast going to look like for people? one thing i know for sure is that people aren't going to the ballot box in early november saying i really like that vp candidate, i'm going with donald trump. >> poor vps, but last night they had their night. congressman himes, thank you. we're following a lot of news. what a moment we had last night. the race has changed, we'll tell you why. let's get to it. >> he's called women slobs, pigs, disgusting. >> you and senator clinton would know about an insult-driven campaign. >> donald trump is avoiding paying taxes. he used the tax code just the way it is supposed to be used and he did it brilliantly. >> why didn't she ever try to change those laws? >> people question the trustworthness of hillary

clinton. >> the thought of donald trump as commander in chief scares us to death. >> this is "new day" with chris cuomo and alisyn camerota. >> the two vice presidential nominees went at it in the fiery debate last night. tim kaine and mike pence sparring over issues. there were interruptions and s insults and mike pence finding different ways to fend off the attacks. >> hitting back with hillary clinton and questioning her record and trustworthness. now only four days until the next presidential debate and 34 days until the election. we have it all covered for you. let's begin with phil mattingly in virginia. good morning, phil. >> good morning, alisyn. no surprise what both candidates were trying to do last night heading into the debate. for tim kaine, make it all about donald trump. for mike pence, really present a calm, steady hand on the ticket. that, that they did.

but in a calm, steady way? not so much. >> you are donald trump -- >> hotly contentious from the start. >> i can't imagine how governor pence can defend the insult-driven, selfish me style of donald trump. >> reporter: the vice presidential debate becoming a night of whose candidate is more insulting. >> you and hillary clinton would know a lot about an insult-driven campaign. >> reporter: tim kaine repeatedly putting mike pence on the defensive, using donald trump's own words. >> he's called women's slobs, pigs, disgusting. he went after john mccain a p.o.w. and said he wasn't a hero. >> reporter: words pence didn't directly defend. >> when donald trump says women should be punished or mexicans are rapists and criminals or john mccain is not a hero, he is showing you who he is. >> senator, you whipped out that mexican thing,