for you. 75 people are dead after a charter plane carrying a brazilian soccer team crashes in colombia. miraculously several people on board did survive. >> officials confirming the plane was carrying a now famous brazilian football club. it crashed miles after the pilot declared an emergency. we have cnn's shasta darlington. she has the very latest from rio de janeiro. this was a brazilian soccer team. it's going to hit the hearts very heavy there. >> thaertt's right, chris and alisyn. 75 people killed when a chartered plane crashed outside of colombia. this was around 1:00 a.m. local time. the good news, if you can call it that, is that there were six survivors. initially there were five people recovering in hospital, then afterwards they found a sixth person under the fuselage as rescue workers were struggling to find bodies. they found that sixth survivor.

this is obviously very tough news here in brazil. the team is from a very small team. we know that other survivors are with the press core. support staff. gathering at the stadium. the survivors. it was taking off from brazil, had a trip and were going and they were celebrating. they were headed off to represent not only their hometown, their home country. alisyn, chris?

>> horrible situation. i can't believe he lived. somebody surviving, you know, going into harsh terrain. >> our last hour. moved the fuselage and survived. >> the attack at ohio state that killed -- injured 11 people. rose is rosa flores is live. >> reporter: well, good morning, alisyn. take a look behind me and you'll see that students are walking around, riding their bikes as they're heading to classes this morning. classes resuming.

trying to bring back some normalcy. one eye witness, not only are students asking why but could they have done anything differently? ohio state university police naming student abdul ali artan as the attacker. u.s. official saying arten was a legal permanent resident originally from somalia who came to the u.s. in 2014 from pakistan. authorities looking at posts he made on his facebook page expressing grievances posted moments before the attack saying, quote, i am sick and tired of seeing my fellow muslim brothers and sisters being killed and tortured and i can't take it anymore. back in august they quoted him in a profile saying he was scared to pray in the open as a muslim. investigators are looking into possible motives for the attack

and say they cannot rule out terrorism. >> we're always aware that that's the potential. we're going to continue to look at that. >> police say just before 10:00 a.m. artan jumped a curb ramming a car into a group of pedestrians. >> he exited the vehicle and used a butcher knife to start cutting pedestrian. >> a guy ran a car through a crowd of students, he did it purposefully. >> i'm at ohio state. a guy crashed his car into a bunch of people. >> we need an ambulance here fast. >> a minute into the attack osu police officer alan horusko arrived at the scene, shot him three times and killed him. >> the officer engaged the suspect and fired shots and used deadly force to stop the threat. >> 11 people wounded in the attack. all are expected to survive as the attack unfolded, students barricaded doorways to avoid

becoming a victim. the campus on lockdown for an hour and a half. >> ohio state will be stronger having come through this. >> reporter: now police are still trying to determine a motive here and terrorism has not been ruled out. they have interviewed family members. they have interviewed witnesses and scouring through surveillance video. as for the somali community here from talking to somali community leaders, they tell me they're afraid of retaliation against that community. >> rosa, thank you very much. let's turn to the transition at the white house. president-elect trump set to meet again with mitt romney. this is odd because members of his team have been savaging romney for the last two days. is he going to be secretary of state? hard to know. trump confirming one pick for us this morning. hhs, health and human services, you're going to have someone, a congress person who is a vocal critic of obamacare there.

for details cnn's sarah murray live in washington. what do we know about who's going to get the big job to fix the health care system? >> reporter: good morning, chris. you have a couple of announcements today. congressman tom price is going to get the job to be head of health and human services. another health care related announcement. sema verma is the head of medicare and medicaid services. trump is moving forward as there are still big looming questions about who he's going to go with for secretary of state. donald trump is barrelling ahead with another round of cabinet picks today naming georgia congressman tom price a fierce critic of obamacare to lead the department of health and human services. >> the most important thing that the american people understand and appreciate is that it's destructive to their health care. >> reporter: after this teaser from mike pence -- >> more announcements tomorrow.

>> reporter: one of the thorniest issues. who will fill the coveted position of secretary of state? it appears trump is still pondering his options. the president-elect is slated to dine with mitt romney tonight, a signal the 2012 republican nominee is still in the running for the job despite the protests of some of trump's top aides. >> the number of people who feel betrayed to think that a governor romney would get the most prominent cabinet post after he went so far out of his way to hurt donald trump -- >> reporter: adding to the intrigue, trump plans to sit down with another candidate, senate foreign relations committee chairman bob corker. after meeting with retired four star general david petraeus on monday, trump tweeted that he was very impressed. >> very good conversation. we'll see where it goes from here. >> reporter: but petraeus who's in the running for a number of national security and defense slots could be a problematic pick. while trump continually attacked

hillary clinton on the campaign trail for her handling of classified information. >> she deleted the e-mails! she has to go to jail. >> reporter: petraeus comes with his own baggage. he stepped down in 2012 as cia director amid fallout from an extra marital affair and was convicted of a misdemeanor for sharing classified information with his miss stress. he's currently on probation in that case. now rather than keeping the focus on his new cabinet pick this morning, donald trump appears to have some other plans. he's taken to twitter to talk about the flag. i want to read you his tweet saying nobody should be allowed to burn the american flag. if they do, there must be consequences. perhaps loss of citizenship or year in jail. now in the past politicians have also tried to put forward protections for the flag. hillary clinton when she was in the senate proposed a law that would have outlawed flag brng. george h.w. bush also wanted to do away with flag burning, but the supreme court has disagreed. when they weighed in on this

they said that the right to burn the flag is constitutionally protected under the first amendment so this is the kind of thing that could be far beyond donald trump's reach. chris? alisyn? >> sarah, thank you so much for all of that. let's bring in shawn duffy. good morning, congressman. >> good morning, alisyn. how are you doing? >> i'm doing well. do you want to weigh in on flag burning and whether or not this is a topic we should be dealing with today? >> i think there are a lot of other issues that the country cares about, but in regard to flag burning, i love my flag and i love what it stands for and i hate those who want to go out and burn it. >> yes. >> i think the court is probably right that we want to protect those people who want to protest and their right to actually demonstrate with disgracing our flag even though so many of us who love our country and love our flag object to it. i don't think we want to make this a legal issue so i disagree with mr. trump on that and the court's probably right. >> okay. so why then do you believe that the president-elect is tweeting

this out? people do take his tweets seriously, particularly now that he is the president-elect and he appears to be stepping on some of his own message about cabinet appointments. what's the rationale behind that? >> well, he can walk and chew gum at the same time. as he's going through the interview process, putting his cabinet together, he can still see certain issues that come up and talk about them on twitter. so i think he's a multi-faceted guy who can do many things at the same time. i don't think this takes away from the work he's doing to build out his administration. >> do you think this is possible that this was an intended distraction to get the media off the scent of his false claim that there were millions of illegal votes during the presidential election? >> the real story there is you have jill stein and hillary clinton coming to wisconsin with

a recount of votes. donald trump won by 22,000 votes. both of them admit that they're not going to overturn the decision in wisconsin. they're wasting our county's time and resources. >> yeah. >> they're putting a stain on our state and our electoral system. i think this is donald trump's response to what hillary clinton has done with joining jill stein and asking for a wisconsin recount. >> okay. >> alisyn, this is frustrating because it was hillary clinton who was aghast, this was going to be a constitutional breakdown, democracy was in jeopardy if donald trump didn't accept the results. here hillary clinton is protesting the results. >> she has accepted the results. >> okay. >> she conceded. >> not in wisconsin. not in wisconsin. >> if there were millions of people who voted illegally, shouldn't we look at that? >> so let me get to that in one second. she hasn't accepted the results in wisconsin, that's why she has

joined jill stein in the recount. i disagree with mr. trump. i think the president and the white house are right. this has been a fair and free election. we haven't had anyone hack our voting system. the results that have been reported by each of our states are accurate. everyone should accept them. jill stein, hillary clinton and donald trump. i don't think it behooves the american people or the american electorate to sit and cast stones at what happened on november 8th. let it go! i don't understand why mr. trump is kind of sitting back and talking about the electionhat he actually won. wiers don't want to call into question the results. winners want to go, i won, let's move on and let's govern. alisyn, why he's engaging in what hillary clinton is doing and jill stein is doing, i don't get it. >> well, neither do we, and you are one of his supporters and surrogates, so what is behind that? >> well, listen, i'm not in the room or i'm not on his twitter feed, but i would think that

he's offended by what's happening in wisconsin and potentially in michigan. if you're going to call into question states that aren't going to flip from trump to hillary clinton because there's too many votes there, maybe he's trying to call into question the fact that he won the popular vote. >> but he didn't. he lost the popular vote. >> no, i know. that's my point. he's trying to say, i won the popular vote. >> but he didn't. >> hillary clinton didn't win wisconsin, i know. she didn't win michigan or pennsylvania. >> she's not claiming to. this is what -- look. you're echoing what i think -- >> she is, alisyn. >> that's not exactly right, congressman. hold on a second. let's get through the details. what jill stein says is there was some discrepancy between the paper ballots and the voting machines that needs to be looked into. it's not going to change the course of the election, so that's it. everybody accepts that. >> so -- but so hold on a second, alisyn. why then is she asking for a hand recounted vote in wisconsin

instead of, you know, going through our normal electoral process in a recount through our counties? she's actually wanting to burn up time so our electors don't go to donald trump -- >> that's what you think is behind what jill stein is doing? >> well, the question becomes why then do it? she got 1% of the vote. she's raised more for the recount than she did in the whole election. >> agreed. >> why would hillary clinton who made such a big stink in the media, you on cnn -- >> she's not saying that she doesn't think -- >> to suggest that anyone will call into question the election. >> look -- >> hillary clinton has joined this process. if she was a leader she would say, jill stein, enough. my donors, enough. this election is over, donald trump won. >> got it. >> you're not going to flip wisconsin, let's move on. >> understood. if donald trump were a leader, what would he say about whether or not there was any potential illegal voting? >> well, he is a leader because he won the election. >> what should a leader say?

>> running a very successful business. >> i made this point earlier to you. i think he should chastise hillary clinton for engaging with jill stein. i don't think he should call into question the vote totals that he might argue gave him the full total of electoral votes. again, i don't think this behooves him to engage in this debate and this conversation. i think a better debate is who's going to build out his cabinet? what is the government going to look like? what are our top priorities to make america work again? how are we going to improve salaries, incomes, opportunities for american families that crossed from democrat to republican to vote for mr. trump? i think those are the points that are better made. the conversation that i think americans care about. >> yeah. >> how do you secure your border? how do you defeat isis? >> yes. >> this young man in ohio, how do we stop people from coming into our countries as refugees and killing or slicing up americans? we have to rethink these policies. i think those issues matter far more than a guy sitting up

tweeting about an election that he actually won. >> congressman shawn duffy, we appreciate it. we look forward to talking about all of those things as well. thanks so much for being here. >> thanks, alisyn. >> chris. more breaking news that we are following. there are raging wildfires that are forcing thousands to evacuate from resort towns all through tennessee. there are a number of homes, several hotels already destroyed. we have someone on scene. cnn meteorologist jennifer gray, she has the situation right now. what is the current status? >> reporter: well, chris, we still have the raging wildfires. a break from the rain now. should get more this afternoon which is helping firefighters, but it's a little too late. we already have at least 30 structures burned. we have 16 story hotel that we hear is damaged and possibly many, many others. we have hundreds of first responders here, firefighters here from all the surrounding areas as well as the national

guard helping to put out the fires, helping people get to safety. the shelter behind me has about 1300 people in it from the area hoping they will have a home to return to. wildfires threatening popular resort towns in east tennessee. >> all of the previous fires i've been part of could not have prepared me for what we have experienced over the past 24 hours. >> reporter: at least 14 fires near the smokey mountains national park forcing mass evacuations. >> we covered our face with wet towels and then we finally got in the car and we drove down the mountain a little ways and we ran into a tree that was over the road so we had to turn around. we couldn't see to get back up the mountain. >> reporter: endangering homes and businesses in nearby gatlinberg and pidgeon forge. at one point 30 homes engulfed in the fires. this hilton hotel. the raging fires are showed just

outside the hotel's windows. guests anxiously watching from inside. the fire now at the edge of the dollywood theme park. the park not yet damaged by portions of the resort evacuated. >> we have multiple trees now falling with embers starting additional fires throughout the area. >> reporter: wind gusts topping 70 miles per hour combined with the worst drought in the region in nearly a decade fanning the flames. >> we're dealing with the worst possible conditions imaginable. >> reporter: top priority now that the sun is up will be assessing the damage and see where we stand with containing those wildfires that are still raging, alisyn. >> absolutely. keep us posted on what they can accomplish out there. meanwhile, president-elect trump told "the new york times" that he wants to be the president to broker peace in the middle east. so what information does he need to know before heading to the negotiating table? we will get former senator george mitchell's take next.

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all right so president-elect trump is continuing to shape his election. that's why we focus on it. what is the future and you have the iran nuclear deal. peace is as urgent as ever.

to discuss a man who knows, george mitchell, former u.s. special envoy for middle east peace under president obama. he's the author of a new book, a path to peace. a brief history of israeli/palestinian negotiations. great to see you as always. thank you for being with us. best to the family. >> thank you, chris. >> this is a value, this book. i often feel that giving people what they need to know is difficult, very taxing, you do it well and succinctly. you have to know what hasn't worked in order to figure out what may work. another president who optimistically says i'd like to help bring peace to that region. what do you need to know? >> well, the first point is that you don't take the first no, the seventh no, or the 20th no for the final answer. the pursuit of peace is so important, not just to israelis

and palestinians, but to the american people, to people around the world, particularly to the region of the middle east that we have to continue to pursue it. secondly, i believe israelis and palestinians will ultimately, i hope soon, come to the realization that it becomes the only viable option for both of them to achieve it. >> do you accept this fervor from the right of the israeli political scene that seems optimistic about president-elect trump and that they feel that president-elect trump means the two state solution is over. do we see any proof of why they should be optimistic about that? >> i have not seen that. i don't know that. >> i looked. i've never heard from donald trump during the campaign saying forget the two state thing. >> i don't think he's ever said

that. we wrote the book before the presidential election. >> right. >> our book makes the argument that we look at the alternatives and they're not nearly as feasible, not as credible, not as likely to succeed as the two state solution although the two state solution has not been successful. we've had 12 presidents since this was created. 20 secretaries of state. many envoys and no one has been able to bring it together. i believe it can and will happen. >> what needs to be different in order to make it happen? >> well, i think there has to be a willingness by the leadership on both sides, israelis and palestinians to take the painful and necessary steps to get into negotiations, to stay in negotiations and reach an agreement. i don't believe peace in the region can be imposed externally. it requires the participants.

>> donald trump has many times in different contexts that people we have negotiating our deals stink. he's a real negotiator. he knows how to get it done. do you see any risks to his penchant for bravado and big talk going into the middle east negotiations? >> well, in the case of the middle east, of course, he's right. we haven't been successful. we've tried to get an agreement and failed to get an agreement between israelis and palestinians. there have been successes. camp david produced a peace between israel and egypt. later president clinton was actively involved between peace between israel and jordan. there are examples of success. i believe it can and will happen with respect to israel and the palestinians. i hope very much that he is successful. i applaud his interest in the subject. i hope he gets involved

personally and he'll have undoubtedly a large team of people and we should pray for his success in this regard. >> what do you offer as advice for what you've opened from president-elect donald trump before he starts talking to the parties? >> well, he's getting a lot of advice. i'm not sure he needs it from me. >> you've been there. he's thinking about appointing his son-in-law right now to do it who has no experience in the region. >> yeah. >> so as someone who does, what do you say? >> i think it requires the creation of incentives for both sides rather than the imposition, rather than ordering them what to do, punishing them. the success in this regard is through the creation of incentives. that will encourage each side to recognizehat president george

w. bush said before he left office. israel has a state. the people don't live in fear and anxiety. they want society. palestinians don't have a state. they're not going to get a state until the people of israel have reasonable and sustainable security. they're not going to get that until palestinians get a demilitarized, sovereign state. each should be vested not only in their own goal but in the other achieving its goal. >> this is one of those books, "a path to peace" that if you care about the issue it's worth the time to read. you've done it in succinct fashion. george mitchell, thank you for your service to the country. thank you for being on "new day." >> pleasure to be here. what is president-elect trump trying to accomplish with his inflammatory tweets? we get the bottom line next. i have asthma...

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president-elect donald trump tweeting this morning that flag burning should have consequences. i'll read it for you. nobody should be allowed to burn the american flag. if they do, there must be consequences, perhaps loss of citizenship or a year in jail. what does this have to do with anything?

let's get the bottom line with cnn politics executive editor mark preston. mark, this follows on the footsteps of at least half a dozen tweets that mr. trump sent out last evening about cnn and how frustrated he is with cnn, that we are not believing his false claims that there was vast illegality of voting during the election. so what's going on? >> reporter: well, you know, i wish that we had enough time in this segment to get to the bottom line of what donald trump is doing, what he's thinking about. i don't think we ever will. he has really been a conundrum to everyone, not only us in the media as you know, but to fellow republicans, democrats, just about everybody. they don't know why he keeps on trying to side track himself. you know, alisyn, in many ways he's playing from a position of weakness right now. he won the election. he's going to be the leader of the free world. the prime minister of japan altered his schedule to go to new york last week to meet with him. he has world leaders calling him

daily congratulating him on his win. for him to engage in this behavior is very, very bizarre. as far as the flag burning stuff goes, we hear him talking about the late justice scalia and how much he admires him. it was justice scalia who took a stand and said he agrees with flag burning, or at least the right to do so. in fact, this is a great quote from 2015 from justice scalia before he passed away. if it were up to me, i would put in jail ever sandal wearing scruffy beard weirdo who burns a flag but i am not king. it seems to act like donald trump is the king. >> he's trying to be popular. he's taking hits. the transition seems messy. it doesn't seem successful the way he wants it to be, although he has been fairly productive. >> and fast. >> certainly compared to the obama administration, but the stuff about the voting makes him look foolish to say that there are 2 million people that voted

illegally, his own people in the party have to run away from it because it's wrong. this works as a distraction because every time you talk about flag burning, who likes people who burn a flag? there couldn't be a less popular thing. but here is the risk that you're talking about. you undermine what is protected in this country, and that may come at a cost. if we start to create our laws based on what we like versus what our constitution says must be allowed as an exercise of freedom, that's scary, mark. that's scary. >> yeah, no doubt. but listen, he is trying to distract away from -- chris, i do agree with what he was saying about the vote fraud. but the fact is it's a self-inflicted wound. he's the one who came out and said, you know, about the vote fraud. so he's only creating a more difficult situation for him, digging himself a bigger hole. to your point, the fact that he said in the tweet last night that you could lose -- perhaps lose your citizenship. >> citizenship. >> i'm going to take away your

citizenship or i'm going to give you a year in jail. he's already creating the penalties that would happen if you were to do that. >> nobody likes that. >> he lass a good ear for his base. >> i believe in the constitution. the story is decisive. in 2004 or six, make flag burning illegal. >> here it is. the slippery slope. what's next. unc unconstitutional.

>> what would happen next. what would happen next. what would happen next. the cabinet. >> thanks, mark. >> go down this road. >> it's only a matter of time before you get here. >> no, but if we do what we don't like. bad day ft. meade yeah. time for cnn money now, consumers are spending billions of dollars in cyber monday sales. business correspondent christine romans told me that. what are people buying? is this living up to the hype. >> monday, 2016 living up to the hype. americans spent a record 1.4 billion yesterday. that's up 10% from last year. 1.2 billion on mobile devices. that's a big jump.

a cool $1.936 billion. for kids it was lego sets, nerf guns are the top sellers. samsung 4k tvs. the highest price drops are on television. tablets. >> in the third quarter. they'll help you. thank you very much. >> do the camerota. >> asked for it last night. he's very excited about a nerf gun.

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imagine a world without satellites. tvs, mobile networks, the internet do not exist. >> i don't have the imagination for that. >> could be a possibility as the u.s. prepares for another threat of possible space war. cnn special report tonight takes a look at this new cold war with a familiar adversary, russia.

>> good morning, charlie crew, let's get started with the changeover. >> one of the first warning shots in space was spotted here. at the joint space operations center at vannenberg air force base in california. >> all assets are currently tasked. if you have any questions, ma'am, that's all i've got. >> in may 2014 when a small team of airmen monitoring a russian space launch saw something they'd never seen before. >> it's part of the russian space launch we were tracking three rockets. one was the actual satellite that they were launching in orbit, one was the rocket body, and another was what we assumed to be a piece of debris. >> reporter: but soon after that debris came to life. lieutenant general david buck, commander of u.s. military space forces, was on duty. >> the one object that we

assumed was a piece of debris started to maneuver in close proximity to the booster. >> reporter: it has continued to over time make maneuvers? >> we're watching it very closely. >> reporter: in other words, it's not debris but a satellite with new and dangerous capabilities. >> all right. let's bring in cnn chief national security correspondent jim sciutto. very enticing report people can watch tonight. what do you want the take away to be? >> reporter: well, let me tell you this. i thought of war in space as some kind of distant, futuristic possibility some day, but the fact is the countries are already testing and deploying weapons, weaponized satellites like this that russia launched. what it's been doing since that launch, it's been circling u.s. communications satellites, spy satellites, stalking them in effect and the concern from the u.s. military is that this is a satellite that if it wants to could either ram into those satellites like a bullet, take

them out of service, or in some other way interfere with them. you have that. china has launched a satellite that has an arm on it that can grab satellites out of space and take them out of commission. you know, it's straight out of moon raker, right? looking back to james bond. >> james bond. >> and i thought that these were things that were kind of conceptual ideas, but the fact is we spend loads of time with u.s. space command and they're already up there. it's russia but it's also china. they know we're so dependent on this stuff, not just you and me, god knows we are, but our military that if they were to take that away from us, we'd be vulnerable. >> i mean, it sounds, as you say, jim, sci-fi, but of course the future is now. so what is the plan for this doomsday scenario? >> so the u.s. is debating this right now. i mean, how they react to this. i mean, they're already trying to protect their satellites making our satellites maneuverable so they could get out of the way of the predator,

right? things like that. there are lasers, too. you talk about futuristic. there are already lasers being tested to deploy satellites. try to reinforce satellites to protect them. the real debate is does the u.s. deploy its own weapons in space to be able to shoot back. that's currently a debate right now. you know, is that really a place we want to go to where war in space is thinkable? you know, it might be where we're going. >> seems like we're there. there's been such a nonchalance about things cyber it will be interesting what happens here. jim, thank you very much. >> thanks, guys. >> you should watch this cnn special report "war in space." it's tonight at 9:00 eastern. meanwhile, the accused charleston church shooter will represent himself in court. this is a trial that could land him on death row. we will discuss why the judge has made this decision coming up. all right. on a very different note, we're less than two weeks away from the tenth annual "cnn heroes" all-star tribute hosted, of course, by anderson cooper on

december 11th, so on this giving tuesday, that's today, giving tuesday hashtag here's how you can help our top ten heroes continue their important work. >> i'm anderson cooper. each of this year's top ten "cnn heroes" proves that one person can make a difference. again this year we're making it easy for you to support their great work. go to cnnheroes.com and click donate between any of the top ten cnn hero to make a direct contribution to that hero's fund-raiser on crowd rise. no matter how small, it can make a big difference in helping the person who inspires you to continue their life-changing work. cnn is proud to celebrate all these everyday people changing the world and through december 31st offer you this simple way to support their causes. you can donate from your laptop, your tablet, or your phone. just go to cnnheroes.com. your donation in any amount will

help them help others. thanks.

big legal development to talk about. a federal judge is going to allow dylan roof to represent himself. the survivors, victims, loved ones could be cross examined by the suspect himself. let's discuss why the judge made this ruling with cnn political commentator and former south carolina state representative, bacari sellers and cnn legal

analyst, staff writer for the new yorker, jeffrey toobin. let's start off on the straight legalities. what control over the defendant to want to represent himself called being pro se, for yourself, what control does the judge have? >> he doesn't have a lot. one has a constitutional right to be one's own lawyer. if you are not competent, if you are legally insane you can't represent yourself. if you are going to disrupt the courtroom, you can't represent yourself, but the judge satisfied himself that dylan roof is not insane and that he would not be disruptive so he gets to represent himself. >> bacari, so often when people hear things like this they realize for the first time that the criminal justice system is about the constitution, it's not about justice for the victims. and i know that you are friends with some of the victims. you were friends with reverend pi

pickney. this will be traumatic for them to have to see him every day in court and to possibly be cross examined by him. >> i think it's going to be very traumatic and very painful. just listening to some of the tweets and some of the images that are coming from the courtroom right now, speaking with my good friend malcolm graham, former state senator of south carolina, who lost his sister, it's very tough for the entire community and very tough for our entire state. you know, when people represent themselves pro se, jeffrey knows this saying, oftentimes it's said you have a fool for a lawyer. dylan is going to have a very difficult time when he has to cross examine a woman like holly shepherd or felecia saunders, two of the survivors of this. those are two incredibly strong women and i know that we think that dylan roof may have the upper hand and i know we think that dylan roof may have this platform, but i think that the city of charleston, the victims and survivors are so strong that they're going to turn the tables on him and show him what strength and courage actually look like. >> certainly he has a

disadvantage legally. there's no reason to believe that this kid knows what the heck he's talking about, but what happens if he during his case or his rebuttal case or cross examination, he becomes abusive of the people? can the judge then make a ruling? >> oh, absolutely. the judge has already indicated that he is going to have a close watch and a close hand on dylan roof to make sure he doesn't unduly disrupt or bother the witnesses, but you know, it's worth pointing out that this is not a whodunit. everybody knows dylan roof shot these people. and the horrible people who commit these mass murders are often the kind of narcissists who want the attention of being their own lawyers. bundy. for getting his -- >> ted bundy. >> ted bundy represented himself for a time. mosoui, the tenth hijacker in virginia tried to represent

himself. this is part of the whole pathology. this is not part of the legal strategy. this is evidence of what a sociopath dylan roof is. >> if he acts like a sociopath or if he were to make some sort of -- use it as a platform to make some sort of white supremacist statement, then what does the judge do? >> the judge can just say you can't represent yourself anymore. i'm not going to let you -- if you want to take the witness stand, you can, but you can't speak in the courtroom otherwise. the judge can limit cross examination, say that's not relevant and, you know, rule it out that way. at an extreme case he can exclude him from the courtroom. this is an experienced federal judge. he knows what's going on here. he doesn't want to see these victims tortured further so i am -- and from everything i understand, bacari will know far better than i, that this is a very strong group of victims and they are not going to be -- >> so, bacari, you think this won't keep people off the stand? >> no, it won't.

you'll have -- in every case you have two people who emerge in their kind of quest for justice, and in this case you'll have jay richardson who is actually prosecuting the case for the federal government and you have a preeminent federal judge in this case. you have the victims who are going to be extremely strong. i look forward to our state shining through this. >> just by the way, this is federal court and he's eligible for the death penalty here. state of south carolina has said they are also going to prosecute him and also going to seek the death penalty. >> got it. >> the legal result here is not in doubt. >> jeffrey, thank you. thanks to all of you for tuning in. the "newsroom" with carol costello picks up after this short break. stay with us. made specifically for indoor cats. purina cat chow. nutrition to build better lives. (vo) it's the holidays at verizon, and the best deals are on the best network. (both) yes! (vo) with no surprise overages, you can use your data worry free

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and good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you so much for joining me. president-elect trump names congressman tom price a man adamantly opposed to obamacare to serve as health and human services secretary. it's an extremely important position, yet president-elect trump is busy tweeting about flag burning. yes, flag burning. just about an hour ago he tweeted, quote, nobody should be allowed to burn the american flag. if they do, there must be consequences, perhaps loss of citizenship or year in jail. although the late justice antonin scalia, a supreme court justice trump