from there because of the amount of resources available that go after something like this. we can back off if we find out it's an accident. but i doubt that. >> we have another eyewitness here telling our show that he was there and heard five or six bangs. so as i said, very much piecing this together, it is very uncertain at this hour, what it could have been, but this one's saying five or six bangs, let's hand it off now with continuing coverage with "a.c. 360." and a good evening to you, we are in two places at once, washington, d.c. and great britain. there are reports of injuries and fatalities at an ariana grande concert. questiwe begin with manches taking care to not get ahead of the facts. there's probably more that we

don't know than we do know. phil black is joining was the latest. what do you think about this incident. and i'm giving our viewers a heads up, these are very early moments, and these reports are from eyewitnesses and it's very inaccurate and there's a lot that we don't know. >> t >>. >> reporter: the plirs in manchester are calling this a major incident. we know that it was deadly. we know that whatever has taken place there has claimed lives, there are casualties and fatalities as well. but we don't know the precise number. we can see from witness accounts, from people that have posted to social media, and it looks like a terrifying scene. almost 20,000 people in this venue, teenagers, perhaps children with parents who went there to watch arianna grande perform last night.

all of them trying to escape this venue in a very uncontrolled way. so it's also possible people have been hurt in that sort of scenario as well. what we have consistently heard from resources on the ground, there was one loud noise, a bang of some kind and that has triggered the fire and chaos that followed. police are trying to get help to the people who need it so you are urgently. >> phil, let me just, a couple of things. do we know where this sound, whether it's a blast, a bang, i have heard it described in different ways, and again, we don't know what caused it. do we know where in this arena it was? because the video, which is inside the arena where the concert is, it doesn't seem from the video we have seen that

there is any kind of compact area in the arena, did it happen inside the arena or inside the periphery? >> the video doesn't show any kind of explosion within the arena itself. believes the blast or the loud noise came from just outside the arena, somewhere in the hallways just outside. he spoke of a loud noise, one loud noise that he heard and in addition some smoke as well. so what we're hearing is that its may have taken place, not within the arena itself, but just outside and it seems to have taken place just moments after the concert finished. >> so we should also point out that at a concert venue like this, bags would be searched. so if it took place outside, it's possible that this occurred from someone who was trying to

enter. but it does not seem like this occurred inside the arena, with the pictures that we're looking at. >> reporter: indeed, from the pictures and the witnesses we have heard from, it doesn't appear that the incident took place within the arena itself. it's very early days in reporting this, so we do need to be careful. what we do know is that security at these venues for events like this, it is incredibly tight. there are bag searches, there are private security guards at the main entrance to these venues, checking people's bags, in addition to police outside the arena checking crowds. all we can go by is what we have heard from witnesses so far, at least one loud noise, it looks like it was just outside the arena venue itself. but what it has triggered is that wave of panic and fear as some 20,000 young people, mostly young people, i would say, within that venue have desper e

desperately tried to get out and escape that space. >> we're joined on the phone by c nr a cnn producer who is there, what have you learned so far? >> reporter: i arrived on to the scene approximately an hour after the incident. the police have a heavy presence outside the manchester arena, they have cordoned off the entire area, and they're obviously assessing what happened and how this explosion took place. to reit tra iit rate, the manch plirs are investigating, they have confirmed that this was an explosion at the arianna grande concert, there are a number of fa fatalities, but they have not confirmed the exact number. but this is under investigation. there was a man who was in the front row in the arena when this

happened. he told me when it happened, it was a large explosion and it was at the end of the arena, and he actually suffered an asthma attack and was dragged on to the stage by security person net and was evacuated that way. emergency services are reacting and what they have also done is that the local hotels around the arena, the holiday inn, that's where families are encouraged to go to, because young kids who are at the concert, are being allowed to go in there, they're being taken in and the plirs are in the process of setting up a line to call to get more information and of course to find out any loved ones who may have been in the arena. >> it's just about 1:00 a.m. there, about 1:06 in the morning, do you know what time this occurred at? >> the reports are that it happened around 10:55, 11:00

p.m. local. of course we'll only have those confirmed by the majesty police at some point when they have conducted their investigations. there have been conflicting reporting. initially there were concerns that there was gun fire and there were two explosions, what the police have said is that there was one explosion, there was one noise in the arena, and that has resulted in several or, well, i can't give you a number because the police haven't given one, but there are numerous serious injuries and they have also confirmed that there are fatalities and we are waiting on police to confirm how many that is. >> just to be clear, you're saying people have been encouraged to go to local hotels, i'm told cabs are taking people out of the area for free because police want people to leave the area. often the police would want to try to keep everybody somewhat nearby so they could interview people and see if there was

anybody who was involved in this in any way who may still be there, but obviously, in an incident like this, with a venue of some 20,000 people, people have fled in all directions, so that's not an option? >> reporter: yes, police will do their best to gather as much information as they can, but you know how vital it is in any form of attack, that the right information is gathered from the eyewitnesses, from people on the ground. so as many people who are either being treated or being taken to the local hotels, the police are doing their best to get a hold of these people and get as much crucial information as they can. >> reporter: both pamela brown and i have been talking to u.s. officials who have been briefed on the investigation, they have been told by people on the

scene, that there was an explosion that occurred outside the venue, that possibly caused a stampede, a sort of rush of people out of the arena that may have caused some of these injuries. officials, it's very preliminary, and they're just starting to get some of the briefings, but it does appear there was an explosion, as of right now they're looking at maybe terrorism, but nobody has said what caused this, but they do believe this was an explosion that caused people to run out of the arena which probably caused some of the fatal injuries. >> so it's not clear when you say the explosion outside of the arena, there had been one eyewitness who said that possibly something near the box office, but it's not clear if it actually was in the out if rim of the arena or out on the street, you're not exactly sure? >> that's exactly right, anderson, so it could have been on the outer perimeter, because you would think that security

would be difficult for someone to bring any kind of bomb or explosive material into the arena, so it looked like it was on the outer perimeter and that caused the stampede, the rush, again, this is just happen, and a lot of the officials who are on scene are telling us that they're still trying to piece it all together, trying to figure out exactly what happened here. >> and given that this now has happened several hours ago, if this had been a blast inside that arena, not only in the video we're looking at right now, would we probably see some sort of an impact zone, given that it's 20,000 people, many of whom are at the end of a concert, there would probably be video inside whon this occurred, so given that we have none of that video, we'll have to have cctv operators to find out

exactly what the cause of this explosion was. >> they're trying to figure out what occurred inside. we probably would have seen smoke, perhaps some more kind of destruction inside. i have talked to someone who did see the explosion occur on the perimeter. >> as well as, phil, as you work both the cia and the fbi, you know, for news organizations, off the reports that we get, eyewitness reports turn out to be inaccurate, because three or four people say they heard multiple blasts, but what thigh

really heard was the same blast, or they saw one gunman. i'm sorry, actually, phil black, let's go to you, are you hearing any public statements from british police? >> no further update from their initial reports, which were simply a significant incident, reports of an explosion, asking people to stay away, emergency workers are trying to get in there. what you're talking got is absolutely true, we don't have a sense of precisely what caused this consistently now, i think we're hearing from witnesses that that was one large blast, we first heard there was more, but increasingly, we're learning

from people on the ground that there was one loud blast. you have made the point from the video we have seen inside the eastern, there's no sign of detonation in there, no smoke or point of blast. but what you can see is the terror, as people try to get out of there in one large huge crush. >> manchester police have just confirmed 19 deaths have been confirmed, 19 fatalitiefatalitid 55 people have been injured, again, you saw that long line of ambulances heading toward the eastern. so this is the first actual confirmation of fatalities, 19 confirmed dead, 55 people injured so far. steve hall, you work with the -- and i'm just being told the explosion was at 10:35 p.m., 10:35 p.m. local time. it is now 1:13 a.m. local time.

so this was some three hours, almost -- yeah, just about three hours ago. steve hall, from your work at intelligence over the years, in terms of the investigation, in these early hours, with all these conflicting reports coming in, how difficult is it for people inside this arena to sift through eyewitness accounts? >> yeah, anderson, especially in the early going, it's extremely chaotic u the police and law enforcement obviously have a lead, not just in the early steps of the investigation, to try to determine was it a terrorist attack, could it have been something else, but also just to triage the situation, to make sure that people who are injured get taken care of. it's basic cloud control, and also as you mentioned earlier, trying to make sure that if there are key witnesses that those people remain at least reachable in the future. what's going on behind that in 2er78s of the intelligence service pieces s that you've got all the different disciplines,

the human intelligence, going back over recent intelligence, was there any indication, did we miss something? and is there any indication, that this is just the first of perhaps a series of attacks, some of the collection stuffs become terribly important, when intelligence forces are trying to determine if there are other indications that would give law enforcement and the government indications that there may be something else coming in the future. it takes time, the intelligence piece, you have to collect it and analyze it. but in the coming hours, you can be sure that the brits are going to be working hard, and they're also going to be cooperating with other western intelligence services, have you guys heard anything, what can you guys bring to the table to see if there are additional facts, and try to get to the bottom of the facts that have already occurred.

security a at an event like this is going to be tight. >> the security when you have any large event, and this is a good sized event, but especially for even larger things, the cooperation between the intel guys and the law enforcement folks is critical because you have concentric circles of ku security. so the initial reporting sounds consistent, if it was a terrorist attack or whoever the attacker was, got through the initial stuff, got closer, but when it became impossible to go further, probably decided to

detonate an explosion, that's all speculation, but that's what's happened in the past when you have these concentric circles around an event like this one. we're told that this event took place around 10:35 p.m. we're now at 1:15 a.m. how long does an investigation take, how many hours does it take before a greater picture is known, before cctv cameras, britain has an awful lot of cameras on the streets, a lot of eyes everywhere. >> london itself as well as most other british cities and the location in the uk, have a very, very pervasive coverage

capability. that's a good news, bad news story. it's likely that there -- you have to process that, and you have to do it in a timely fashion. i can't remember how long, but a considerable amount of time before the video of that boston bombing attack that yielded intelligence that was actionable. it's definitely going to be a long night for both the law enforcement and intelligence folks over in the uk. >> and phil black, for ouk poli have confirmed that 19 are

inju fatalities and 50 injured. most of those people have been taken from the scene, we saw those ambulances leaving from or to the venue. >> ythe figures that we're hearing from the police, at least 19 people killed and 50 wounded. and as we have been talking about, this is an arianna grande concert, these are children, teenagers and families, those were the people that were caught up in this as they left the venue shortly after words. and police say this is currently being treated as a terrorist incident, until police know otherwise. i guess you can say that's pretty standard in a sense, but what they're not doing is

speculating, but they're assuming the worst-case scenario. getting the first responders there. but also trying to determine to what extent there could be a further threat there at the location or perhaps in other places as well. so police will be in the process of locking that players down and investigating thoroughly to be absolutely sure that the threats to people there and to the emergency services and first responders who are working there that that threat has in fact passed and there's no possibility of further live there as well. >> and steve hall, this does present challenges for law enforcement, when you have an arena with 20,000 people, and there's been some sort of explosion outside, local authorities on the scene in that moment are faced with the idea of, i assume, do they just try to get everybody out of the venue, for fear there may be

more inside, or is having 20,000 people exit a venue, does that make them potential targets of someone else involved in this incident waiting outside. >> in my experience working with law enforcement, mostly foreign law enforcement, not u.s. law enforcement, in cases like this, they're going to determined if there are other devices that have not been detonated. that was true in the st. petersburg bombing in russia, police did find another device in another metro car. i think the key thing for law enforcement is to clear the year to make sure that there are no other risks that could do further damage at that particular site. but it's extremely chaotic, they are going to want to try to be in contact with people to get key and critical information

that will help unravel this, but there's so much data out there right now, that they're trying to pull down and make sense of it. it's going to be at least a number of hours before either the intelligence or law enforcement folks have a better idea of what happened. >> sam, can you explain what you heard and if you saw anything? >> reporter: yes, we had an extremely loud banging, nothing like i have ever heard in this venue before. and as we were just talking, we had seven ambulances exit the metro station, with lights and sirens flashings, really rushing down to the arena, i'm not sure what happened, but a large number of ambulances have just left the venue. i'm currently looking at a road

block, there's at least 25 ambulances positioned on the pavement, will be just literally sitting there waiting. there's five or six fire engines that i can see, all with the crews standing by, they're waiting to be give on the nod again to just go. a very, very large police presence. i don't know if you can hear the sir sirens, they're kicking up again. it seems to be coming in waves, all the convoys, none of the vehicles seem to be moving on their own, they seem to be five or six deep at any one time. the five that are running into the fire station now, i'm not too sure what's happening there, it's just absolutely mental at the moment. >> phil, how far from this arena are you? >> 200 meters from the arena,

and i'm about 100 meters away from the central station fire station, which is a very large fire station. the rapid response there as well. >> sam, have most of the people who were in the arena, we're told some 20,000 people were there. are they gone from the area now? >> yeah, the area, still is very quiet, it's very quiet for this area. after the first wave of sirens, and initial evacuation, it was filled with cars, the roads were actually bedlam, people actually going through red lights, it was very much families, kids, moms and dads. and it looks like the emergency services did a real good job of

monitoring that traffic, because the traffic jam was just about fiver minutes, now everything is still. we have some helicopters hovering extremely low. >> sam, i appreciate you talking to us and i appreciate your clear head in describing all that you're seeing now. freelance photographer joel goodman is also on the phone joining us, i understand you arrive at the scene, can you tell me what kind of explosion it was and what you saw and heard? >> i think got here quite early, to be honest. it's hard to say, but when arrived, there was quite a few sort of walking wounded. people had quiet severe injuries. and very quickly they pushed

cordons back further and further, obviously trying to keep the area clear so they can work safely in there, but i can probably give you an exact time. hang on a second. >> we understand the blast itself took place at 10:35 p.m. >> thank you, that's more than i know. i got here at 11:20. >> you said you saw a number of walking wounded, people with injurie injuries. i don't want to get into too much detail. but the nature of the injuries, was there anything you could deduce from that, whether they were -- there's a question of how much injuries were caused by the explosion or blast itself, how much may have been people being, you know, pushed or that the crush of people trying to leave? >> i'm not an expert on that and i couldn't air for concern, but it didn't like the kind of injury you get just tripping over somebody in a hurry, you're

talking about burns and people with blood. so it is more severe than that. >> do you have a sense of where this blast actually occurred? from the video, we're seeing that it was unlikely that it was inside the arena itself, given that we have seen video from the arena, inside it, that it may have been on the outskirts of the arena. and you took photographs of people being helped or several people being helped. do you have an idea of where in blast occurred? >> those pictures were taken to the railway station adjacent to the arena. once you get into the arena, there's a box office area, once you get into the arena, i don't know where these injuries occurred. but i would imagine it would be between where i stood and that box office area. just based on gut, from what i can see, but i don't know that for certain. >> can you just explain the geography of that? because there have been other reports that perhaps this occurred near a box office.

you're saying the subway station, the tube station actually links up with the arena? >> it's a railway station called victoria station, it and the arena are effectively joined, so you walk from one to the other via the same route. >> when you're talking about the box office for the train, or the box office for the arena. >> it's the box office for the trai train, and the arena is linked by a walkway. which is to say you could come straight from the arena and get to the train. >> the arena is tweeting out that this incident took place outside the venue in a public space, that's from the manchester arena. if i could just get specific on that box office that you talked

about. you said someone getting on a train could walk towards the box office -- >> you walk two minutes from the train or the tram, and across a very short walkway and you would be in the books office of the arena. >> is the security before the box office or after the box office? >> there's security, in case something goes wrong, on an everyday level. particularly, there's lots of armed police in and around the streets right now, which is extremely unusual for the city. there wouldn't routinely be any armed officers on the streets and there certainly would. be anyone with a weapon at all in the arena. >> in terms of when you would be searched before going into the easte arena, it would be after the box office, i assume?

>> the box office and the queue from the arena space, i was covering an event there two days ago and everybody entering the arena is patted down. so it's a public space joined to the train station, and then you get into the arena space. and you're patted down, i guess, routinely. >> we appreciate it, it helps to try to piece together what may have happened. i want to go back to shimon, what are you learning? >> reporter: just getting word here into our newsroom in washington to see that the possible cause into this explosion was a suicide bomber. three officials who have been briefed on this investigation, two u.s. officials and a western official to pamela brown all have said that right now investigators on the scene believe that a suicide bomber detonated a bomb as people were leaving the venue, which then caused all of these injuries and the deaths.

this is again, it's very preliminary, because investigators are still trying to piece together what happened. though it is a couple of hours into this explosion, there's still seems not to be 100% certainty as to what caused this, but they do believe this is some kind of a terrorist act, and potentially a suicide bomber set off a bomb. >> and there was just one possible assumptisuicide bomber? >> and if this was a suicide bomber, this changes everything, because the question becomes how did this person get to the venue, is there a larger network behind this. now it's up to the police to figure out are there others who may be plotting other, similar explosions. >> shimon, i appreciate that,

continue to work your sources. paul, the notion that shimon is reporting based on three sources that he and pamela brown have talked to, that this would have been a suicide bomber, that really does change this in terms of the investigation, because it doesn't seem like a suicide bomber would construct the vest or the explosives they were using. >> anderson, we don't know that yet, we know there have been individuals who have taken action and have managed to build their own devices, we saw that in new york city, the chelsea devices back in september of last year. but the concern at this hour, is that there's a terror cell

behind it. they'll be worried about follow on attacks, it's not lost on british authorities that with the paris attack in 2013, there was also an attack on a concert hall. that was part of a multiwave coordinated attack on the french capit capitol, that's why you're seeing armed police. if indeed there is a cell involved in this, a very worried night for british authorities, i have been told by officials that that security level is height onned to its heightest point in british history. that's because so many british nationals, residents in this country have gone off and fought in syria and iraq, almost 900 have made the trip.

a good number have returned to the uk. they're seeing increased return rates all around europe. and there's a homegrown radicalization problem who's feeding this, radicals who are staying behind and being encouraged by groups like isis to take action and being given instructions over the internet and over secure and encrypted channels. >> if memory serves me correct, manchester, we have seen arrests in manchester in recent years, have we not? >> that's right, we have seen quite a few arrests in manchester in the years since 9/11, there has been sort of local islamist scene there, the problem of extremism in manchester and the surrounding areas, back in 2009, there was a major al qaeda plot targeting a

shopping center in the city, which has really full at the last minute by british authorities east ee eeaster. we have seen people move from that area to syria and iraq, people move from syria and iraq back to those parts of the uk, that's part of the mix they're facing right now, a very elevated terror legvel, and there's a general election coming up here in a couple of weeks. isis has not got on a big attack through in the uk, there was another tack that seemed to be inspired by isis, the truck driver in westminster, knocked over pedestrians and a policeman. but there has not been a has casualty attack that's gone

through by a group like isis, really since the london bombings all the way back in 2005, but at this hour, no claim of responsibility from any terrorist group, but they're scramble all around the uk, this country tonight is on maximum alert. we'll have to see if that threat level goes up, we'll expect that to be a cobra meeting of the prime minister at downing street in the coming hours, they're very concerned. >> manchester police are reporting that there will be a controlled explosion of some order of what they deem a suspicious item, a block away from the venue, which is going to be a detonation of a suspicious device, this is standard procedure, often about a block away. if this is in fact a suicide

attack, we have seen it's become almost common place in these kinds of things, to have multiple attacks or even diversi diversi diversi diversionary attacks, two people who did detonate devices outside of a soccer stadium. >> in paris back in 2015, there was a three-way attack, the concert hall, some kamikaze u suicide bombers killed almost 90 people in the space of about 10 or 20 minutes before the police response came, that night there were attacks on cafes by a group led by the ring leader in that

plot. and so this was a sort of multicoordinated strike back in paris in november of 2015, anderson. we haven't seen any reports of that yet, so far, in the uk. but there's concern that there may be more coming down the pipeline when it comes to this threat. >> and paul, you were saying that, i mean, how does this change now that there is reports that this may have been a suicide bomber? just in terms of the level of attention intelligence service pays to this, how does that ratchet this up? >> reporter: well, obviously a suicide bomber, that would be the hallmarks of an islamist terrorist plot attack. so they'll be looking in that

direction about a terror attack. there have been reports on the bbc, talking about what they're describing as nuts all over the floor. so that's the only way this is pointing tonight. we cannot conclude at this stage, we'll have to wait for police to tell us much more in the hours ahead. but given the fact that they're looking into this real possibility, and it is there would appear some evidence that this was a suicide bombing. that certainly takes you down the islamist terrorist direction. it must also be noted that in recent months in europe, there's been a number of false flag plots where right wing extremists have been trying to blame islamists for terrorism. we have seen that in germany in

recent weeks. >> also if it was an individual or individuals, given the amount of surveillance cameras that i imagine are afternoon this arena, certainly great britain has an extensive video surveillance network, cctv network. the fact that if it was an individual, it seems like they timed it for when people would have been leaving this venue at 10:35 p.m., it would have been relatively easy to find given that there's a train station very close, that there would be cctv cameras to see this person waiting around and see where this person came from and get an image of this person, i would think. >> they'll already be looking at all these tapes and they'll presumably be able to trace where this person came from,

every metro train and bus in this city has some kind of cctv, so they will be able to presumably very quickly identify who this individual is, who they may be connected to, there also will be a lot of forensics at the scene, in terms of dna, and fingerprint analysis to see if this is somebody on their radar screen, and we have seen in so many plots, that the individuals have plotted these attacks have been at some point on the radar screen of security officials and it's very difficult for the intelligence to monitor everybody all the time. they just have the resources to monitor a fraction of people that they consider a threat. in the attack just a couple of weeks ago, he had been on the radar screen of mi-5 british security services. they'll be putting all this together to figure out what if any network was behind this and

they'll be racing to make an arrest to prevent follow on attacks. >> we have just gotten word that there's going to be a manchester police press conference in the next several minutes, and i was going to bring that to you live when it happens for the latest information, but right now manchester police have confirmed 19 people have been killed, at least around 50 or so people have been injured, police say that they're going to have a controlled detonation of what they determine to be a suspicious device, very close to this arena. and they are looking at this based on their reporting of shimon and our pamela brown, based on three different sources, two u.s., one western with knowledge of the incident that their are looking at this as a possible suicide bomber. a lot of questions obviously still and hopefully in that press conference we'll get more information. joining us now is phil mudd, of

the fbi, what's going on the ground? >> living here for ten years after 9/11, you see this in two ways, the first is the immediate event, the eyewitnesses will not be reliable, but questions like the forensic analysis? >> not reliable because people see things from a different vantage point? >> it's not confusing, people will air it was a yellow shirt, it was a blue car, and it was n wrong. i want to see the device, for example, not only what kind of device it was, but was it a device you have seen elsewhere? and the people who train you to do this kind of thing are not going to train you on ten

different kinds of devices, but people who conduct that kind of training are going to have a standard type of device that they train you on. >> the possibility of a suspicious package and not out of the realm of possibility that somebody would want to plant multiple devices. >> that would tell me did somebody bring in two devices, that brings to my mind, that there were two people, that it wasn't just a lone wolf, do we have a conspiracy here. >> or it could have been somebody in panic dropped a bag. >> what you see in these incide incidents, they have in panic, and high strung. when the security officials approach them, they kbogo aheadd

detonate. if they hadn't obviously been intercept at the perimeter, but someone with that kind of emotional disturbance is more than likely going to say i have to go down. >> paula, if you could just tell us what you saw what, you heard? >> reporter: hello, i was on the train station waiting for our train home, and we heard an explosion, we heard just one explosion, as we evacuated, we're about 10 yards away from the arena, when we got outside, people were running from the arena, and as we passed, there were children that were supposed to meet their parents and we just got a hold of them and said we need to get away, and we went to the holiday inn which is a short distance away.

>> had you attended the concert? >> we hadn't. we were out for our anniversary. we were at the station, which is right at the side of the arena. >> you heard the explosion. do you have any sense how close it may have been to you, how loud it was? >> well, we could feel the explosion as well as hear it. it was just -- it was muffled but it was just like a huge boom. >> when you say -- sorry. when you said you could feel it, are you talking about an air blast or shaking of the ground? >> just like it -- just like shaking of the ground possibly. >> okay. >> you could just feel it. it was very, very loud. >> our understanding is the explosion took place around 10:35 p.m. according to manchester police. were there many people in the

area where you were? had many people already exited the venue? >> well, we were just at the side. as we got -- literally outside of the arena where hundreds and hundreds of people were just coming down two steps. they were coming down the steps onto the main walkway to leave. they were all evacuating quickly. everyone left -- everyone seems to be going. >> were police already at the scene when you got there? >> no, no, not at the time. very, very soon afterwards. there was ambulance. i don't think people really knew what was going on. they were still selling t-shirts. we were getting past them. all of a sudden, there was

panic. everyone just ran everywhere. >> paula, it's lovely that you reacted the way you did to try to help those kids and get them to a safe place and contact their parents. i'm glad and the people you are with are okay. jamie waller was at the concert. joins us by phone as well. if you could, jamie, explain what you heard and saw. >> we were just -- she just finished singing. she walked off the stage. we went down to go out. there was a huge explosion. everyone looked at each other. everyone just ran. we just needed to get out because we didn't know what was happening. it was a mass panic. >> as soon as you heard this explosion, you knew this was not part of the concert itself? >> yes. we knew something was wrong. >> so had the concert had ended? ariana grande had stopped singing? >> she just finished doing

dangerous woman. we all got the -- the lights came on and everything was finished. then everyone starting coming and that is when the bang happened. >> how -- what happened after the bang? you said people started to rush? >> yeah. we all ran -- we all just wanted to get out. it was panic. we didn't know what was happening. get out in case anything happened again. >> was there any announcement made when you were trying to get out? >> no, nothing. we were all completely -- we were all just -- we didn't know what was happening at all. >> how difficult was it to get out? it looks obviously very chaotic. a lot of people are frightened. there's kids there. how difficult was it to get out? >> me and my sister were out in seconds. everyone was on the same page. everyone just wanted to leave. everyone was just running in the same direction. >> as you left, what did you do?

>> i just kept going, kept going. the police were coming, coming on moving. we followed the crowd. we found a place and we stood. then all the police, all the ambulances and the people on the floor and all the paramedics came around and we were just waiting and waiting for more information. >> how close were you to the train station? >> i think we were above it. i'm not completely sure. we were literally probably meters away from it. >> i'm glad you were able to get out quickly and thank you very much for talking to us. a very difficult night for so many of those who were there. late word on the controlled explosion that we told you about. according to police the item in question was abandoned clothing. nothing dangerous. we will continue to be here with

phil mud. that's a good thing in that there's not -- it seems like -- more than the one particular incident or more than one attempt. >> sure. any time you are going down this road -- you heard this referred to as a potential terrorism investigation. it's not a suggestion that practitioners believe that's what happened. you don't have time to waste in the event there's a broader network. you talked about one potential device here. you still have a lot of questions. what trained them? who radicalized them? you can have a conspiracy even if you have one attack, especially with a device that looks this significant. i'm saying, are we sure this is a single suicide bomber? he had the capability to build a design like this with this level of lethality by himself? >> how likely is it somebody built their own device? usually is the device built by somebody else? >> in this case i'm going to say, if you have a one off, that

to me starts to decrease the likelihood of a conspiracy that involves overseas training. i'm looking at the size and potential sophistication of the device. there's a clear signal you can look at. as soon as you get more than one person, the likelihood you have outside assistance that they sat around and sought a bomb maker. when you have a one off individual likelihood he acted alone, maybe built the device alone, increases. people typically like that in my experience sometimes also have psychological problems. they decide they got to do something and they go do it. >> paul cruickshank, remind our viewers, we are waiting for a press conference from manchester police we believe is going to take place any minute at the latest about we're told at the top of the hour about seven and a half minutes from now. it's 1:52 a.m. in manchester. the investigation obviously well under way. the area has largely been cleared, paul cruickshank, we understand from the concert goers who were there, a device

was detonated. we had an eyewitness was looking out on the street, said there were helicopters flying low. he still saw ambulances heading toward the arena from the local fire station which is right next to the arena. paul, there's a lot going on not only in manchester but also in london and really probably throughout europe at this hour as police and intelligence are trying to look for any possible leads on this. >> reporter: that's right, anderson. the entire apparatus that the british have put together to counter terrorism is going into full gear tonight, into full gear to understand where this threat came from and whether there are more threats out there given the fact that we are hearing the possibility that this this was a suicide bombing. the concern will be that this

was an act of islamist terrorism. the concern will be a group like al qaeda or isis could be behind it. groups with networks of operatives who have cell structures which they can potentially put into operation for these kind of attacks. it shouldn't be ruled out this could be a single individual, somebody who has managed to put a device together just on their own. we have seen isis over these encrypted apps online reach out to sympathizers and operatives in the west providing detailed bomb making instructions. they will be doing a lot of forens fo forensifo forensics to see what was used. was it thtp which is a signature for isis and its attacks in europe, notably in paris, in brussels. or was it some other type of

explosive that was used? given the force of the blast, it may well be that this was a high explosive that was used, a devastating high explosive in a confined space. they will be running out of the cctv to try to trace back where this attacker came from, which address, how they were acting in the minutes before the attack. were they given something by anybody that's been caught by the huge number of cctv cameras all across manchester? this investigation is really going to be going at full speed. the key concern is to prevent future attacks, more attacks from any kind of cell that's still out there, anderson. >> paul, when you -- we are waiting a press conference any minute now. we will bring that to you. when you look at the volume of attacks that we have seen in the united states, in europe and elsewhere, do you have a sense of how many of suicide bombings,

how many were carried out by just an individual who manufactured their own device and went ahead and did this, whether encouraged online or not and how many -- is the vast majority of this somebody connected to some sort of a netwo network, whether it's sophisticated or a couple of individuals? >> reporter: we have seen plots, many plots with just individuals who plan to be suicide bombers. we have also seen plots from networks, isis and al qaeda, where that's the case. i don't think that gets us anywhere closer to knowing whether this was a single individual who was responsible for this or a wider cell. i think those answers are going to come in the hours ahead. the first we will know about it if there are major raids across manchester and what we hear from the results of those. i think given the fact they will be going through all the cctv

trying to figure out where this person was living, that there are likely to be raids in the hours ahead in different locations perhaps in the uk. we often see that after these kinds of incidents. this appears to have been a major mass casualty terrorist attack. this country has not suffered one of those since the london bombings all the way back in 2005. that's really a testament to the professionalism of british security services who are regarded by many of their peers around the world as best in class. they put a lot of resources, a lot of technology behind preventing what we saw play out just a few hours ago in manchester. given the scale of the threat, they cannot stop all kind of attacks getting through. we saw a terrorist attack get through a few weeks ago on a bridge in westminster. the reality is there will be more attacks that will get

through in the months and years ahead. especially as isis loses ground in syria and iraq and more of these foreign fighters start gravitating back to europe. people who are trained killers coming back with an ax to grind against countries like britain who have been launching air strikes in syria and iraq. >> phil mud, in terms of an investigation like this, who would take the lead? is this manchester police at this point, or is this -- >> you should think of this in two parallel paths. the police -- the manchester police are terrific. there's a lot of extremist activity in manchester. they will have informant networks where as soon as they get a photo off cctv, they can go into the networks. the british security service has a broader responsibility. you have to determine whether other people are communicating or were involved in this. you have to have the immediate investigation what happened in

manchester, which will be supported by security services outside the manchester police and then the expanding investigation. broader uk cell going back to was somebody overseas involved in this or just radicalizing this individual. >> we are minutes away from a press conference from manchester police. we have talked about the attacks around there in paris, about the difficulties that french intelligence faces, certainly belgian intelligence, lack of coordination we have seen. where do the british stand in relation to that? >> reporter: there's excellent coordination between mi5 the domestic security service and on the other hand the various british police forces, especially the metropolitan police force here in london, which is it really the lead force in the uk when it comes to the terrorism threat. they work in each other's buildings every day. there's a lot of routine sharing of intelligence.

there's a hurdle of, however, when it comes to sharing across europe when it comes to sharing between the different intelligence services in the european union, information coming, say, from the french, british, from the ger mmans to e french. i heard frustration that that information is just not coming in sufficient quantity and sufficiently quickly given the gravity of the threat facing europe over the last few years. not enough yet has been done to improve that intelligence sharing, anderson. one thing the united kingdom has got going for it compared to the continental europe right now is it's much more difficult for these extremists to purchase on the black market or any other way ak-47s,