while you're there you can nominate someone you think should be a 2017 cnn hero. that's it for us tonight. i'm chris use moe in for don lemon. i'll be back again here tomorrow night. please, take care. hello and welcome to our viewers in the united states and all around the world and great to have you live with us. i'm john vause. >> and i'm isha. this is la. >> another talk about donald trump jr. linked to a russian

attorney last year has changed. >> the attorney said donald trump had nothing to do with the meeting but now something different. >> reporter: new reports tonight from the white house over president trump's hands on role, crafting an explanations of his son's meeting with runner over the 2016 election. >> the president weighed in on my information he could. >> reporter: the white house acknowledging for the first time the president helped write a statement his son donald trump jr., son-in-law jared kushner and paul manafort has with the russians and others in the trump tower. the president dictated that busy leading statement. >> he certainly didn't dictate but he weighed in and offered suggestion like any father would do. >> reporter: his own lawyer

assisted mr. trump didn't write the statement saying the meeting about russian adoption. >> i wasn't involved in the statement drafting at all nor was the president, i'm assuming that was between mr. donald trump jr., between don junior and his lawyer. >> reporter: the attorney who's representing the president in the russian investigation said it again and again last month on president, the president had no role. >> i do want to be clear, the president was not involved in the drafting of the statement and did not issue the statement, it came from donald trump jr. >> reporter: the statement was drafted aboard his flying from washington from the g20 summit in germany. initially the meeting was described to the "new york times," we primary discussed a program about the russian children that was active. it was not a campaign issue at the time and no follow-up. only days later the real purpose of meeting became clear when donald trump jr. released

e-mails showing it was part of russia and its government support and for many trump for officials trying to take down the clinton campaign. donald trump's son replied, if it's what you say i love it. the questions put the new white house press secretary on defense. >> the statement that was issued was true and there was no inaccuracies in the statement. i think the bigger question is everyone wants to try to make this a story about misleading. the only thing i see misleading is a year's worth of story that is been about this russian collusion and false stand ls based on amononous sources. that's the only thing misleading i see in this entire process. >> reporter: leading republicans see it differently in capitol hill. >> i don't know what role the president playing, if any. here's what i would suggest, that when you put out a

misleading statement it's going to be hard to quince people to stop looking at other thing. >> reporter: that is senator lindsay gram, republican of south carolina speaking what many republicans here are saying, it erodes the credibility of white house. all these changing stories on russia. the president's lawyer saying he was not involved on crafting that statement. the white house press serktd saying he was involved. the white house now saying the president was involved trying to deflect all of this, saying there's simply nothing to see here on the russian investigation. of course that congressional investigation in the house and senate as well as through special counsel will have the final word on all that. jeff zeleny, cnn, the white house. >> joining us now dave jacobson and john thomas. good to see you both. john, let's start with you. so here we go, the father knows best defense. but you know, i use to watch

"father knows best." why you should release your tax returns, in this case did donald trump teach junior how to shade the truth? >> trump and all the trump family they run their real estate development company, it was a family operation, it's clear it was one brain, i'm not surprised. in fact, the earlier explanations earlier july the president was involved in crafting a statement seems strange to me, especially since the president likes to control the message from his top down. >> that's the only thing that seemed strange to you? >> this revelation, the only thing that seems damaging is that they changed their story. i don't think the fact that donald trump was involved in crafting the message with his son is a big deal. >> just so ask you, john, the white house saying there's nothing to see here, is that in

itself damning? >> it's totally disingenuous to what his lawyer said. it's not america first it's trump first. i think this president also loves nickname, we should call him by a nickname, donald the devil. this is a guy who lies through his teeth repeatedly through the american people and that's why you're saying this rift in the republican party. today lindsay gram criticized the president. i think you're going to see more of this in the weeks head. >> the question though john, whether or not he weighed in, what was in his mind what h d he know, we just don't know. if you look at the report from "the washington post" it was clear, the president did not take the advice of those around him, his lawyer or communications team. he thinks he knows better than everybody else and that's

causing a problem for the president. >> that's the issue that's plagued his administration. he didn't take advice well from his team. they've all been a wash through. we'll see if he takes the advice of general kelly. you're right, "the washington post" articles said, i believe it makes sense, all of his team was saying, you just got to come clean. >> get in front of it. >> and that's what you should have did yone. >> did -- leak this story? >>-of-good authority but it makes perfect sense. with him all of a sudden being fired. >> yeah, i mean, yes. again i'm sure it'll all come out. there are no secrets in washington these days. but dave, it also begs the question, the president's intervention in a situation reported by "the washington post" as whether he truly understands the magnitude of the legal jeopardy he could

potentially get. does he get it? >> i don't think he there's intentions of breaking the law. but robert mueller is at the intend of -- to the obstruction of justice. i think this fans the flames and i think that's what hurts the president. i don't know that he understands it. >> i don't think president trump believes he's in any legal jep city here, i think that's part of the problem. he looks at it thinking, well, i didn't collude with russia. >> it begs the question, why did you mislead the american public and not tell people about this so-called secret meeting with vladimir putin. that's another thing that compasser baits this issue. >> there's a lot of issues out there when it comes to the president. the president talked about that much criticized speech he delivered to the boys' scouts.

people say it was inappropriate and political. this is what the president told the journal. i got a call from the head of the boys' scouts say it was the greatest speech made to them and they were thankful. the publicist known to the scout says they made that call. the criticism of donald trump's speech stands as it is. john, who is the president talking to? >> it could have been a donor of the scouts. i feel like the president might be going like this when he says, well, somebody from the scouts. you know. but i believe somebody made the call just wasn't the head of the scouts because they took a bold step to rebuke him. >> here's the problem, donald trump's credibility has been flushed down the toilet. when there's an act of war, we need to go to war or perhaps

defend our allies abroad and he has to go before the camera and make a plea for them, they're not going to believe him. >> i think there's so many daily back and forth between the media and democrats and trump, it's all getting blurred. it's hard for us to keep up with it. how is the average person. i think while the democrats are ingrained the president can't be trusted, i don't think the base at this point cares or keeping up with it. >> did we -- >> seems like the days of the week. >> this is when the president was introducing kelly as the chief of staff. >> so as you know the border was a significant problem. even the president of mexico called me, they said their southern border very few people are coming because they know they're not going to get through our border, which is the ultimate compliment.

>> after the comments from there trump the government issued a statement. the president has not been in recent telecommunication with donald trump. this is a plan that began before inauguration when the story came out that trump wanted a military freedom and they denied it and said it wasn't going to happen. they lie about things they don't have to lie about. >> i mean, yeah it was the inauguration crowd size, pick and chose your battles. >> chose your lies. >> yeah. what i just don't understand about that is that trump's right. illegal immigration is down. >> why does he have to do the extra -- >> i'm not sure. >> that being said, you're using pathological, david it brings it back to general kelly. it's one thing to manage the twitter and scripted speeches and keeping the president

reading from prompter. but then you have these off-the cuff moments. how do yo go out against that? >> i don't think you can, that's the problem. it's something different when you're governing. this is the problem with donald trump, the last time he met with the mexican president was with the g20 i believe. right if front of the president he said the mexicans were going to pay for the border wall. >> there's no permanent fix to this solution but i think if your general kelly, what you do is try to minimize the distractions that do get the president off message and that means end the leaks. create power the chief of staff yourself so you control what gets to the flow and what gets to the president. and every good chief does that to the president. before general kelly people would go to trump and he was putting out fires himself -- >> that's pretty specific.

the president of america called me. >> absolutely that's very specific. >> i'm not saying the president is going to be perfect but if you limit the number of things -- >> you mean don't have him speak to the press? >> no no, i mean limit the information that get to the president you might be able to control it. >> i see what you're saying john but i think there's no way to chain the beast. >> what you're saying basically is president continues to be distracted in a way but in of his own self-inflicted wounds. that is what is causing increasingly un-happiness within the republican parties and lawmakers. the book called the conscious of conservator. here's one of the more critical lines. i've been sympathetic to the -- at the highest levels especially

by the actions of one's own party. john, the message in the book to republicans and congress is essentially grow a spine and stand up to this president. this book is damning. >> he also needs to sell books. he has to say something that's going to get us to talk about his book. >> right. it is possible -- >> and there are members within the party that think they should stand up to the president. i think as long as the president retains his base of support, the members are going to get in line behind the president. >> but does this encourage others to come out and start speaking? >> you would think that john mccain and linda say gram and susan collins would have made some of that happen but. >> he's up for re-election, he's one of the most vulnerable republicans on the upcoming

elections, at the end of the day the republicans haven't presented anything meaningful. when you got this continued chaos and friction within the republican part it hurts all the folks that are going to be on the ballot next year. >> trump still has control of his base and the rest of the administration will fall in line. nixon had control of his and he was voted out of office. the republicans in congress will have to leave first and not weir about what the polls say. >> there's 70 house seats that are targeted by the dnc and democrats this cycle. as we get close to the election if that generic ballot test has democrats leading by double digit they're going to get spooked and creating distance from the president. >> john, do you believe that? >> yeah i think the analyze is right. >> very very quickly, do you know who's happy right now?

spicer, he's grinning. there's the photo. >> i haven't seen that for a while. >> he doesn't work at the white house. >> he's not looking at the rearview mirror. >> he could return as spokesman. never know. >> who know. >> maybe he'll be in the next book we're discussing. >> david, john thank you. >> thank you. up next facing an escalating threat from north korea, north korea says it's willing to talk to pyongyang. plus, a lawsuits alleges fox news fabricates a story with oversight from the white house. the trump administration's response just ahead. kind never. we choose real ingredients like almonds, peanuts and a drizzle of dark chocolate. give kind a try. ♪

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and north korea itself. he's not going to allow, president trump, the ability of this madman to have a missile toll hit america. if there's going to be a war to stop him it will be over there. if thousands die they're going to die over there and not here. and he's telling me that to my face. >> bill hughes joins us from san francisco. philip good to see you. keep in mind the statement from senator linda say gram, the president considering military options to destroy north korea. a few weeks after that rex tillerson made a rare appearance in front of reporters and said this. >> we do not seek ara jet stream change or the collapse of a regime. we do not seek an accelerated use of the peninsula, we do not seek an excuse to send our military north of 8th parallel. we're trying to convey to north

korea that we are not your enemy or your threat but you are presenting a threat to us and we have to respond. >> two very different statements and both tone and disturbance, which one will be heard loudest in pyongyang? >> i think it's not clear which one they will hear, that's part of the confusion. you got mixed messages and miscalculation can be catastrophic. linda say gram is a smart guy. he knows the military option will be catastrophic. i don't think that's a realistic option. i think the south korea's are going to be especially to any type of strike will stan for it. linda say gram is drumming donald trump's message which is to try to put pressure on china to do something which i don't think they are because t not credible to them. >> there's all the focus you

mention on china to bring out north korea. u.s. lashed out against beijing over the weekend. so, with that on the one hand, on the other hand again we have tillerson with a different take. here's what he said. >> we've been very clear with the chinese, we certainly don't blame the chinese for situation in north korea, only north korea is to blame for the situation. we do believe choonz has a special relationship because of of this economic activity to influence north korea's regime in a way no one else can. >> he's saying the same thing but the tone in delivery is night and day compared to the president. >> i think you're right. the chinese have been playing good cop in this game, the united states have been playing bad cops. that work if the two are

coordinated, in fact they're not. what has to happen is united states and china has to rally talk and get understanding about what the future of the korean peninsula is going to be, what it looks like. if they're able to do that, whack happen is the united states is serious about solving this problem and not containing it. the united states is going to have to get more benefits, and the chinese will agree knowing it's not really regime chance that the united states is pushing for, they'll be willing to use more sanctions and sticks to get a hopeful solution and a freeze. >> and finally come questions has been raised about how successful north korea's missile was last week. maybe it didn't have the range or the capability initially thought. this is their conclusion, north korea's am beneficiary to reach along the west coast like washington, d.c., if they want to accomplish that with this missile. this missile of design may not

stretch that far without breaking but north korea will try anyway. they won't succeed this year or next. what's your take on that? >> i'm inclined to agree. the key take away is over the last two tests, one in may and july, is that they're getting better at it. including kpabts where they're able to shoot it much hire and for a longer period of time, at some point it will happen. it doesn't matter whether it's going to be two, three or five years from now, the bottom line, the status quo if we keep doing what we're doing, which is more sanctions and nothing else they will eventually get to where they will be able to hit the united states. they'll be able to make a nuclear device on to this missile that eventually hit the united states. that's something we have to work on, we have time. we've got to move forward to keep them from getting that threshold capability. just under this per spect, under the grandfather he did 15 test,

under kim jong-un the father he did 10 tests. depending on how rapidly they can do this they can do it faster than anyone think and we have to be aware of that. time is not on our side. >> it's not here either, we're out of time. philip as always great to have you with us. thank you. >> thank you. donald trump says the u.s. is holding venezuelan president nikolaos moe month did you ever radios responsible. the pro government supreme court says they were planning to flee, the men publicly opposed the election on sunday of a pro may due ra that could rewrite the constitution. time for a break here. for everyone else what's

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your voice is awesome. the x1 voice remote. xfinity. the future of awesome. . 11:30 here on news night. welcome back to our viewers in the united states and all around the world i'm john vause. >> and i'm isha sesay, this is cnn newsroom live from los angeles. the warehouse says president trump still intends to sign off on tougher sanctions against russia but hasn't done it yet. u.s. vice president mike pence has been touting the bill on his tour of former republics.

>> in a further promise of our commitment the president will sign a statement of sanctions against russia. in in a sign of our commitment the president will sign a statement to cot fie our -- >> claire good to have you with us, how is mike comments and views being viewed there in moscow? >> i think from his point of view his eye ten rare in its speaks volumes. he's been to acetone ya, and was in georgia yesterday. russia strongly opposes pence that he strongly sports. that was yesterday. today he's in montenegro which 32 months ago game the newest member of -- and this sets out what is an old conflict with

russia. it's not just where he is and his actions as his words as well, he uses opportunity right on russia's doorstep to launch a tirade for moscow which is what he calls destabilizing activity in ukraine. he said that the recent diplomatic action by russia are in compelling or cutting the u.s. personnel in russia by about 60% and closing two diplomatic properties. that won't deter the u.s. from its commitment and others what he call freedom-loving nations. this is coming at a time when the climate is so tense. -- with it's neighbor as long as it doesn't meet to the expansion of the alliance, clearly which the two sides feel differently. it's coming at a intense moment in this relationship.

>> yeah. rex tillerson -- this weekend when he meet with russian foreigners. what is the expectation of that meeting, what more can you tell us? >> right, we go to the first comment from rex tillerson on the recent retaliating measures that the russians have taken, as i said the cutting of diplomatic personnel in russia by 16%. the compounds were seized. as of yesterday we saw trucks with diplomatic plates leaves so the draw down has already started. he said the cut to personnel makes the work of mission more difficult and he plans to raise this with serve yay lavrov. as for how the measures are going to effect the mission we don't know yet, it's up to the u.s. side to decide who gets caught. they have until accept the 1st

to do that. whether or not rex tillerson will make any difference to this, it seems very unlikely the process has already started isha. >> claire joining us from moscow. thank you. an explosive new lawsuit claims fox news worked with the white house on a flaky story, allegedly as a distraction from the russian investigation. those details next right here on "newsroom l.a.." at this amazing hotel. yeah ash and i share everything - dresses, makeup, " water bottles... we do? mmhmm. we share secrets, shoes, toothbrushes... what? yeah i forgot mine so i've been using yours. seriously? what's the big deal? i mean, we even dated the same guy. who?! uh, go to priceline and get the hotel deals you won't find anywhere else. wise man, i'm nervous about affecting my good credit score.

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. hello everyone, fox news is facing a lawsuit that claims it worked at the warehouse and a wealthy republican don narrow to make up a fake story. >> the suit also claims it was part of a distract to cause by the ongoing russian investigation. brian stelter with the details. >> reporter: there is a possible this is a guy who provided to wikileaks all the dnc e-mails.

>> reporter: a fox story could have finger prints that reach all the way to the white house. a new claim about the white house concocted a story and claims the white house had over sight. >> if it was truth wouldn't that blow the whole russia collusion narrative the media's been pushing out of the water? >> reporter: that is puerto rar this pro trump conspiracy theory. at the center of the story is ed whattous ski a whether republican donor. claims that fox was in ka hoots con triping a link between richard and wikileaks. >> it's very consistent for a person with my experience to begin to think well perhaps there were so much e-mails

communications. >> richard's family says that's not true and dc police believe his killing was a botched robbery, nothing politically motivated. that didn't stop fox. >> it doesn't look like a robbery it looks like a murder. >> reporter: after days of coverage in may the network retracted the story. now months later willard's lawsuit said-misquoted, defamed by fox. his suit goes much further claiming the story was collaborated with the white house. why, quote, to switch the blame from russia and refute collusion claims. whattous ski named as a defendant strongly denies the allegations. >> the lawsuit is absolute crap. there's knob to this lawsuit that has any merit whatsoever. >> the text message to wheeler is one of the suit's most eye popping claims, not to add any more pressure but the president

just read the article and wants it out immediately. it's now all up to you but don't feel the pressure. he now says he was just kidding around. >> i was just joking with the man, and that's all that was. >> reporter: the white house pushing back as well. >> the president didn't have knowledge of the story, the white house didn't have any involvement in the story. >> reporter: but there is a link to the white house. he and wheeler met with then, circumstance sean spicer a month before the phony fox story came out. it was just a ten-minute curtesy meeting and the white house had nothing to do with his story. the suit claimed that spicer asked to be kept abreast of the developments. as for fox it claims the actions that it reported the story to retract from the russia issue, quote, completely erroneous. >> brian is with us now from new york. it took fox a week to contract this story after it was established but the network was hammering this story long before

that and creating a false narrative. it wouldn't the russians who hacked the dnc it was ket rich. -- seth rich. and the fake knews is living on until this day. >> it is. it's a counter narrative that is contracted from trump voters what do not accept that russia interfered in the election. that is partly predicated on the wikileaks e-mails. there's a lot of evidence involving russian interference by the dnc e-mails is part of the story. it wouldn't russia it was this dnc staffer who stole the e-mails and got them over to wikileaks and was killed for doing so. imagine the heart ache this is put this rich family through. they say the conspiracy theory is bogus but it's been an increased am of pain grieving for the loss of their child, now

they have to see this stories all over the place and fox perpetuated it. >> and they begged for weeks asking the network to stop it. for whatever reason it took a considerable am of time. you mentioned wikileaks, according to the news the fox -- here are those stamtsz. my investigation up to this point shows there was some degree of e-mail exchange between seth rich and wikileakses. my investigation shows someone within the dc government, democratic or national commitment of team is blocking the murder investigation from going forward. that is unfortunate. seth richard's murder is unsolved as a result of that. now, this is what wheeler said was his first reaction when he saw those bogus lies attributed to him. >> the reporter from fox news, malia zimmerman wrote that story. i immediately challenged her and said this is simply not true,

you and i both know that's not true. she say her bosses told her to leave the quotes in there. that's why we're here today. >> wheeler alleges that's how the president wanted the story. we don't know if that's true. at the very least can we say the white house did nothing to kill a story which it knew to be totally false. >> i think on the false news side the ethics of fox behavior here are they're lacking to say the least. the idea that the bosses wanted this out there, they are pushing the story, it's disturbing. from a journalic ethics point of view this is a disaster for fox news. on the white house side i think it's americaier, it's unclear exactly how much involvement there was at the warehouse. we know sean spicer had this meeting with wheeler where they talked about the investigation. spicer suggest there went any other conversations after that,

the lawsuit contradicts him. now the lawsuit also says steve bannon was in touch in some way with the gop donor who was pushing this. so it's merky, i think there's more that needs to be done on the white house piece of this. >> we don't know if these allegations are true, we don't know how much involvement there was from the president of the united states, did he work with fox news so fabricate a story but it comes after "the washington post" reported that donald trump dictated a false story about his son's campaign meeting with a russian lawyer. these accusations will be devastating for any person but seems especially so for a president who complains daily about fake news. >> and this is a false news story. what false was pushing in may was a false story. it came at a terrible time for president trump, terrible time meaning he had just fired james comey shlg just shared top secret informing with the

russians. at that time, it was the low point in his presidency. what did fox do, it touted this story that made him look in some ways good, and gave a counter narrative to all the russian collusion questions. so this was for trump, it was a story he needed at that moment. does that mean the white house was involved in some way, as you said we don't know, we need to have more reporting on this. maybe the lawyers will be able to get more through the discover process in this lawsuit. >> very quickly, last question here. wheeler he's claiming he was forcing to correct the record, that caused ir rep bl pardon ha his reputation and career. how reliable is he and his testimony? >> i have questions about that. because he was at fox saying some of this on the air and now he's telling us a different story. it's unclear why he's had this change of heart. ive questions about that i'd like to ask him.

the biggest issue here is is the trump and white house the deceptive nature, "the washington post" story about the recent example. then you hear about fox and the white house working together to concoct this stair. the reason i'm taking it seriously is because of the the credible crises and its pass behavior trying to influence and interfere in news coverage. >> of course in all this a complete and total disregard it seems for what the parents of this young man having going through. >> that's the saddest part of up. >> bro brian good to speak wasn't. >> thanks. serena williams is slamming the gender pay gap. the tennis superstar face up hard troupes on what black women earn compared to their white counter parts. e real ingredients like almonds, peanuts and a drizzle of dark chocolate.

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percent less than white women. >> the cycles of poverty and sexism are much harder to break than the record for grand slam titles. unfair pay has prevailed for far too long with no consequence. employers across the u.s. should understand that all male and female employees should be compensated equally. >> not close or almost the same but equally. >> with us is areva martin. let's go back to that and repeat it for our viewers. basically black women make 37 cents less than every dollar but they also earn 17% less than their white female counter parts which really kind of brings home this intersection between racism and sexism that black women

face, a reality that is often overlooked and not part of the dialogue. >> and in fact people i think sometimes are offended when you bring it up. you know, we were tweeting about black women's pay equity day and i got a blot of blow back on social media what about white women and latina women and other women? these are the numbers and statistics. i'm not making this up. i didn't create this reality. i'm trying to hope to move the needle forward so my daughters can grow up in a world where we don't have these disparities amongst any women of any race. but it's a sensitive topic when you talk about race whether it's police brutality or unequal play, people get weird about the race conversation. >> feeling a bit awkward right now, as a white male i want to apologize. >> i'll write your check

afterwards. but serena williams is the highest paid female athlete last year. just to compare serena, she comes in at number 39 if she was on the men's list. she bumps andy murray which is ironic there. men's sport pulls in more revenue. is there an argue why women of color get paid so much less? >> you know what is interesting is this pay equity issue that we're dealing with, it's not just in sports or it's not just low income. >> it's in housekeeping and cleaning. >> it's in law. it's in law. >> it's in law. >> it's in medicine. in the tech industry, in television. it's in a lot of industries where you would think because people are educated and more enlightened we wouldn't see the despairties but it's across the

board and i think that's what caused serena to write this powerful and passionate letter. but i want to point to something positive happening. in 2015 california enacted one of the most aggressive pay equity laws in the nation and basically changed the way courts in california could interpret its laws. it said that women and men doing substantially, not the same but substantially the same job have to be paid the same amount. that made a difference. before that law was passed i could be a maid, you the janitor but you make more even though we were cleaning the same building. >> that's the 1963 equity pay act said same. this is substantially similar. >> that makes a big difference and prevented employers for retaliating for talking about their salaries. if i know you're making $2 an hour more than me i can go to

the boss and that wasn't the case before 2015 in california. >> and another thing i found interesting. according to a survey that she is on the board for, she found more than 43% of black millennial women believe men and women have equal opportunities for promotion. what do you make of that? >> they don't know their history. it's not surprising to me. we have been talking about politics every day in this country. i remember when we were in the 2016 presidential election talking to millennial women about the importance of electing a female president. whether it's hillary clinton or anyone else and the women said to me they didn't care. for them, women and men had the same opportunity. they weren't jazzed about the women being the first female president. i think that mirrors that same attitude and unfortunately they need to hit the history books.

if they knew how difficult the struggle has been they would have a different point. >> thanks so much. >> appreciate it. you have been watching "cnn newsroom" live from los angeles. i'm jf j >> and i'm isha seshay. it was tough getting out there on stage. i wanted to be clear. i wanted it to last. so i kept on fighting. i found something that worked. and keeps on working. now? they see me. see me. see if cosentyx could make a difference for you- cosentyx is proven to help people with moderate to severe plaque psoriasis... ...find clear skin that can last. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx.

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donald trump jr.'s initial statement about his meeting with a russian lawyer avoided key details and now the white house admits the president helped craft that response. trying to convey to the north koreans we are not your enemy. but you are presenting an unacceptable threat to us. >> america's top diplomat says the u.s. is willing to talk to north korea while others are contemplating a military response. plus fox news is facing a lawsuit that claims the president was involved in a face