thanks to all after you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week. hey, i'm brian stelter. welcome to our viewers in the united states and around the world. this is "reliable sources," our look at the story behind the story, how the media works and how the news gets made. coming up, president trump and rupert murdoch and how big-money lawsuits are endangering newsrooms. first, breaking news. the white house now responding to overwhelming criticism of the president's saturday statement about the violence in charlottesville. his speech will be remembered and not fondly as the many-sides speech for not explicitly calling out and condemning the white nationalists, the racists and anti-semites who came to charlottesville and protested on friday and saturday. now on sunday morning the white house attempting to clean up.

this is a statement just out from an unnamed white house official. "the president said very strongly in his statement yesterday that he condemns all forms of violence, bigotry, and hatred and of course that ib colludes white supremacists, kkk, there's a typo here, nephew -- nazi, and all extremist groups. he called for national unity and bringing all americans together." i assume they meant neo-nazi. i assume that's a typo. it to show you exactly what the white house put out. there are obvious questions when you read a statement like this. why did it take so long? and why is the statement unsigned? is the president himself directly going to address the criticism? you could make the case that saturday was the worst day of the trump presidency with so many commentators include manager republican commentators and gop senators acongressmen criticizing the president for his half-hearted response. today, sunday, the reactions are still withering.

the headline on the influential drudge report, make america hate again, reacting to the chaos in virginia. take a look at the front pages from the local newspaper, the daily progress, doing great work in charlottesville. this is the saturday headline about friday's attorney general-bearing rally, these white nationalists, some explicitly racist, rally ong the campus of uva. "fire and fury." and a new headline this morning, "a di of death," reacting to woman who was killed when that man charged a crowd of counterprotesters with his car and two police officials killed when their helicopter crashed in charlottesville. amid all of this coverage, what is the responsibility of the press, especially showing violence and disturbing image, the kind that played on a loop yesterday, showing a nation seemingly at war with itself? is this constant repetition helpful? is sunlight the best disinfectant when it comes to racis or is there a better a? a lot to cover with our panel.

i want to g first to charlottesville and larry sabato, the director of the center for politics at the university of virginia. larry, i know this is personal for you. you were on campus friday night. those scenes of those mostly men, mostly young men carrying torches, trying to express their views, their largely racist, anti-semitic views, what was your experience friday night at uva? >> i live on jefferson's lawn in a pifl i don't know that he designed and it's right next to the rotunda. and i watched this group of young people, mainly young people, as you said, in their upper teens, 20s, 30s march with their torches lit and i was shocked first at how many of them there were. there were hundreds. i hate to put an exact number on it, but it went on and on. it was longer than our graduation lines. and then they got closer and i

heard what they were chanting. and they were chanting "you will not replace us," and that was alternated with "jews will not replace us." then they got to the front of the rotunda and it didn't take them but a few minutes to this do what they really come to d, get a lot of media attention by attacking the relative handful of counterprotesters who were there. this was all unplanned, by the way. we didn't know they were going to d it until late in the day friday -- >> saturday was planned, saturday's rally, but not friday night. >> not friday night. it came as a surprise to everybody. and i just can't -- as somebody who has been associated with the university of virginia for 47 year, brian, this was the most disturbing, nauseating thing i have ever witnessed there, and right there on the lawn, which the center of our university. i don't know long it's going the take us to get over this. >> everybody who's been so charlottesville loves

charlottesville, loves walking the downtown mall, but that's where this act of domestic terrorism happened yesterday, this car plowing into a group of protester, people protesting the group of white nationalists. now it's sunday morning. what is your feeling a day later? >> my feeling is one of of course shock and upset for the lives that were lost, including those two state policemen in the helicopter. they had been watching what was going on downtown and sending intelligence. but it's also a fear of dread -- threat, rather nape or talking about coming back again and again. you knew this was going to be a big thing when that snake david duke slithered out from under his rock and showed up, the former grand wizard of the kkk. >> that's interesting because i got an e-mail from a viewer saying what's the responsibility of the press, brian? not to broadcast any statement by david duke. do you agree? >> i think they should be minimized. i think if he says something truly news worthy, you have to,

but i think it should be minimiz minimized, and actualry i think the coverage of any future gatherings in charlottesville should be minimized. it has to happen. you have to have some cameras and reporters there. you have to have the police to from text them but assuming we can keep the violence at minimum or maybe no violence at all, i think it should be a minute or two package on the evening news. that would be the ideal as unrepresentative and unrealistic as that may be. >> let's broadn this out with david and kalyn in new york. david, same question to you on this issue of how to handle violent images, pictures of the protests that turn into the melees. are cable news channels, television news it in works, making things woshs by playing this on a loop? >> i think if you play the image of the car as you say it essentially upending these, you know, anti-racist counterprotesterser again and again and again, it juns scores the notion of violence in society and in some ways

subliminally, cable executives say we have to cover the news, we can make finer distinctions than that. my first professional gig 27 year ago was as an intern for the charlestown news and courier as it was called in south carolina. i was to asooned to cover a couple of klan rallies, one through downtown, the other jut side town. the editor in chief comes to my desk and says cover it, cover it fairly, if something news worthy happens we'll cover it bik. we won't give these racists, these klansmen, other protesters more coverage than they warrant because they want to say outrageous things. >> the counterargument being the press is doing a disservice exposing what's going on -- >> i think there's an obligation to cover this, but this is not a binary choice. we have to make subtle distinction and smart choices how we convey things. should david duke be quoted? some of what he said yesterday was newsworthy. should he be quoted at length, be represented as though he has

a movement behind him, we have to be very clear about. >> cover it but be clear these are fringe folks, not a lot of folks that agree to this stuff, but they are out there by the hundreds. >> folks, 1,500 is not a huge rally given the rallies we of soon in the past here, yet it is a real presence. it upended a real community. there was genuine violence. we have a responsibility to reflect that in the press and reflect to not to somehow fost ter idea this is the way in which the country has a whole is moving. >> and we learned something about the president as a result of yeesd coverage. based on how long he took to respond initially on twitter and at that event he was having at 3:00 p.m. and we learned something today from this cleanup statement fre the white house official. what was your reaction as white house reporter about this delayed reaction from the president to these white supremacists meeting in charlottesville? >> we're essentially seeing the white house drag it out. you made the point the president

has faced widespread criticism over his statement yesterday that did not specify white nationalists or supremacists, just said hate from many sides. we get a statement from the white house this morning in response, and it's attributed to an unnamed white house official. why not attribute that to a white house official like sarah huckabee sanders or another spokesman or the president himself if he really does condemn hatred in all forms including neo-naziism, and the kkk, why not put your name on that statement? and we know that the president is someone who is very quick to respond to other incidents. he was very quick to respond to pulse nightclub shooting and the paris attack and what happened in manila, which wasn't terrorism. and yesterday as these graphic this images were playing out television and we know the president loves that, he didn't say anything until about 1:to 20 in the afternoon. >> he's caused us to expect his immediate reaction because of his response to cable news coverage. let's listen in to scaramucci

this morning criticizing the president. >> well, i wouldn't have recommended that statement. i think he needed to be much harsher as it related to the white supremacism and the nature of that. >> scaramucci of course only lasted ten days as comes director. he ooh's beginning a press tour of his own. friday the president was very accessible. thursday and friday he had four pressers, answering about 50 questions and promised to hold a press conference on monday. could that be the next opportunity to address charlottesville? >> it could be. he has no events on his schedule today so reporters will not see him. but you're right, the president took more questions this week than he ood taken in months. he was taking questions from reporters. sarah huckabee sanders, press secretary, holding up a sign that said one more question, initially directing the president to stop taking questions and he ignored it and kept going and taking questions. yesterday when this happened he tweeted he was going the hold a big press conference yesterday and then during that he just

delivered a statement and took no questions from reporters and left the room. so now he's saying when he returns from washington on monday for a brief trip he's going the hold this major press conference and that might be the only time we've seen him unless he tweets again today about this. >> what struck me in some ways is that there was a bit of a sense of what we had after katrina, different kind of disaster, different kind of scope of tragedy and at the same time you saw the press totally turn on the white house in a way that was direct and focused, and you saw it through the tweets and the statements and the commentary of the conservative members of the press. you saw "the new york post" had a cover today that called it terrorism, talked about white supremacism, very explicit in the way -- this was rupert murdoch's tabloid, very explicit in the way trump himself would not be. you saw people basically, reporters who are -- straightforward reporters as well as folks on the left and the right almost beseeching the

president and the administration to get in front of this or at least get in the moment and it didn't happen. >> great point. >> it was a fascinating thing to watch play out and it was troubling. reporters don't -- despite what you haeshgs most of the time reporters don't want to be in that situation. >> but the expectation of how the president will speak -- any president will speak -- >> he is the the expectation for himself by criticizing obama regularly for not calling thing what is they were. he criticized him for not saying radical islam terrorism so many times on the campaign trail. yesterday we saw the president had an opportunity to call this out for what it was and he declined. >> final word to larry sabato, since you're in charlottesville, does what the president says in the coming days matter in charlottesville? will it help or affect the community? >> thanks for asking that, brian, because donald trump, of course, is very unpopular anyway here, but he missed his moment. he had the opportunity to d something when it mattered yesterday afternoon and any of his predecessors in modern times would have had the good

instincts to say the right things. he wouldn't because he won't denounce part of his base. they're white supremacists. we know what they are. we know who they voted for. so, listen, brian, if he wants do something to help us and everybody else, let him fire all the white nationalists on his staff starting with steve ban n bannon. actions speak louder than words, words written by a staff. >> you know bannon would rejkt being described as a white nationalist. >> i don't care. we've read all we need to read and there are others on that staff too. you know darn well they are. >> larry, david, kalyn, thank you very much. we have a bit more news coming in about this. virginia's governor now identifying the woman killed in the vehicular attack yesterday, 32-year-old heather heyer. he was killed when that car went -- that driver rammed his car into a crowd of counterprotesters. they were there to speak out against the white supremacists who had come to charlottesville. right here after a break, more

coverage of the president of north korea as well and a new competitive sport in media business. people trying to sue news outlets claiming defamation. a suspended fox host is one of the people sowing. we'll talk to journalist who he is suing for $250 million after this break. for a getaway. the lincoln summer invitation is on. now get our best offers of the season. on the agile mkc. on the versatile midsize lincoln mkx. or go where summer takes you in the exhilarating mkz. the lincoln summer invitation sales event. ask about complimentary pick up & delivery servicing. right now get zero percent apr plus 1,000 dollars summer savings on the lincoln mkx, mkc and mkz nitrites or artificial ham has preservatives.tes, now it's good for us all. like those who like. sweet those who prefer heat. sfx - a breath of air and those who just love meat. oscar mayer deli fresh.

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to help you find the next amazing version of yourself. it's time to unleash your secret weapon. it's there, right under your nose. get to your best smile up to 50% faster. visit invisalign.com to get started today. the media in the courthouse, so many pending cases against journalists and media companies right now that it's causing real concern among media lawyers. you remember in some ways gawker opened the door to this new era of litigation when wrestling personality hulk hogan was awarded millions and millions of dollars after gawker published portions of a sex tape he was if

that resulted in the venn chul shutdown of gawker. now there are a number of other suits we'll talk about, including this one, suspended fox news anchor -- host eric bolling suspended due to allegations covered by "the huffington post," who wrote about he allegedly e sent lewd, inappropriate messages to colleagues years ago. they had 14 sources for a story, it was published and fox suspended bolling pending an investigation. so what is bolling doing? he sz he's suing ali for $50 million. ali joins me on the phone. what is the latest in your case? you've hired a high-profile attorney, glaze whoeshgs's responded to the letter to bolling. is that right? >> that's right. sent the letter on friday an we have not heard back from eric's attorney yet and we'll see what happens. you know, if he wants to get into a fight with me, i'm happy

to take it on. >> he is suing you for defamati defamation. why is he wrong? >> i spent three months on the story, i have 14 source, i of spock on the vick testimony and that's on a factual basis. i know he's wrong. he's also wrong in the sense we have a first amendment and as my lawyer said the best defense of defamation is the truth. he is trying to intimidate me. he sees me as a young reporter that may be scared by big lawsuits. but if he wants to wade into this pond i'm happy to g in with him and as i said on friday, i look forward to having -- deposing eric and i look forward to discovery process. it's really important to note, brian, that he's suing me personally for $50 million. he did not include huff post, which is owned by verizon in

this lawsuit. if he wants $50 million, feel you've been aggrieved and deserve damages, you go after the multibillion-dollar conglomerate, not an individual reporter. >> interesting. fox news has nothing do with this suit either. bolling personally suing you personally. you think he's trying to intimidate you to silence you. >> yeah. and, you know, that would normally be a good strategy, right? you know, as i said, i'm a young reporter and, you know, most people would be scared by this. my life history has given me a lot of experience to not be scared by these things, and in fact i relish the opportunity to see and have him deposed an to stand up for not only my first amendment right bus the first amendment rights of many reporters who have this saying they would be scared by this kind of action. and, you know, i'm not trying to turn myself into a representative for the media

here, but i feel like i have to really fight this because of other reporters who would be frightened by this kind of action. >> mr. ali, thanks for calling in. appreciate it. >> thank you. >> fox's only comment today is that bolling remains suspended. he's been on the bench for a week while an outside law firm investigates the allegations against him. npr's correspondent back with us now talk through these various case involving newsrooms and media companies and journalists being sued. first on the bolling case, that what's your interpretation of it? >> i think bolling is trying to decide that a strong offense is one of his best defenses. a big, blustery essentially a summons to say he's going to file a suit. we haven't seen a text of the suit yet so we don't know precisely what his claims will be. $50 million is a huge price tag. he's trying to intimidate those who would investigate further. huff post, which wrote the --

commissioned and published this story said they stand by ali and they're owned by verizon. that's a deep-pocketed supporter ali has in his corner. i think bolling is a trump-like, a trump friend and supporter, trying to say brashly this isn't true, i'm going the bring the pain to you for inflicting this reputational damage on me. >> the president talked about wanting to loosen the libel laws to sue news organizations. is that what we're seeing now? >> there's this this great documentary out i was briefly interviewed for called "nobody speak." >> on netflix. >> yes. it takes the terry bolle and hulk hogan lawsuit. there are some lines that are connected here. petr teal, a strong trump advocate, spoke at the convention, turned out to be behind the scenes funding his suit against gawker. you've seen elements in which sarah palin, another, you know, sort of trump supporter and pre-trump figure in terms of her

bashing the press in her vice presidential run in 2006, she's suing the "new york times" now. their editorial page editor, james bennett, will be testifying. >> that will be remarkable. >> astonishing to learn of. and he'll be held accountable -- >> plain versus "new york times" another one, john olver at hbo being sued by a coal company ceo for something oliver said last week on "tonight." this week we learned disney had to pay at least $177 million in this pink slime case, a lawsuit -- a court proceeding up in the dakotas. it was settled by disney before it could reach its conclusion. disney i suppose paid that money because they believe the jury might force them to pay even more preponderance. >> they're extraordinarily favorable state -- i believe food defamation laws thereupon that made so it that the exposure for disney for abc news' parent company would have been enormous had they not paid. nonetheless, $177 million. >> could have been billions. >> a staggering sum.

in some case we have to disaggregate fox from the others. >> fox being sued by rod wheeler, alleging he was misquoted in a seth rich conspiracy story. >> basically being misquoted in a way that propelled to seeming credibility these completely discredited so far conspiracy stories involving seth rich and leaks of e-mails to wikileaks. what happened in fox in some ways is that specific story but it's also an outcrop of this handle that has reverberate ever since july 2016, the sexual harassment claim filed against the late roger ailes, then the arum chairman of fox news. there have been a series of lawsuits, some of which are still pending against the network, against the late roger ailes and also against some of the executives who were there at the time, some who are still there. i don't think donald trump went on the campaign trail to say i want to loosen the libel laws, i want to take it to the press as way of punishing fox news, which has turned out to be one of his strongest corners of support as his public popularity has

eroded. >> david, thank for being here. >> you bet. >> prae breaking news on reliab reliablesources.com. logon for my story about rupert murdoch and president trump, a private dinner they had earlier this month, intriguing because murdoch's "wall street journal" wooj is becoming increasingly critical of the president. details on reliablesources.com. up next, the president unleashing a war of words this week against north korea. is the press taking his bluster too seriously? we'll talk about it. ♪ we live like no one's watching,

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this week they were presidential statements. tabloid friendly, tv-ready threats from president trump to north korea. and of course north koreans have been making lots of threats as well. the take-away from all the coverage was basically nation on the brink, nuclear escalation. but despite the president's rhetorical posturing, the war of words between the two countries, there is no indication that the u.s. military is actually at a war footing, preparing to launch an attack against north korea. so i wonder if the press maybe took these threats too seriously, if that's possible. we have an all-star panel stand big. let's begin with cnn international correspondent will ripley live if beijing. will has been able to cover pyongyang and to enter north korea many times and spend time in pyongyang and other parts of the country. will, i wonder, how difficult is it to know what the north koreans are actually thinking? how do you break through propaganda and know what's really going on?

>> well, when i'm outside the country, often our only source of information is the state-controlled media, so you have to look, you have to read the statements coming out and look where they're coming from. for example, this week, when there was that very detailed highly technical description of how north korea might launch four intermediate range ballistic missiles over japan landing within 20 miles of guam, that story came from a korean people's army general which e gives you insight into what factions in the military are telling kim jong-un what they think he should do many-in response to the rhetoric from president trump. but today the more political factions in the country, they were talking about how the nuclear arsenal is a great deterrent that is keeping the peace on the korean peninsula. that's north korea's spin. it sounds counterintuitive to the rest of the world that north korea having nukes would keep the peace but that's their view of reality inside the country. the most meaningful and valuable conversations are the ones i

have inside pyongyang sit down with government officials when they can be more candid. >> you said several times this week in your coverage, i know this threat sounds insane, terrifying, however it's actually pretty common for the north koreans. it's like you have to provide that kind of context for their bellicose words. >> right, because for certainly the american audience who's relatively new to this story, when they hear north korea put ought a statement saying they're going to turn washington into a sea of fire, the mainland u.s. will be the staging ground for a nuclear war thax sounds very frightening. but north korea makes that kind of statement all the time and that's rhetoric they of been saying for years. it's not as troubling from my vantage point as what we saw when there was that highly detailed plan from a general that was going to be presented to unekim jong-un. we're not out tf woods in terms of what north korea may do. tuesday is a big holiday in north korea, liberation day, holidays where r when they often try to show military force. a week from tomorrow, the

u.s./south korea annual joint military drills are due to take off. those always enrage pyongyang. it was a week after those ended last year kim jong-un ordered their fifth nuclear attacks. >> let's bring in the rest of our panel, will. there have been conflicting messages from trump officials within the administration what's going on. jonathan shay, the "new york" magazine, put up this headline. he said ignore our president, u.s. government tells north korea. some would say a wag the dog distraction by president trump amid the whole russia investigation. been a lot of that even some conspiracy theories about this. let's talk with john kirby and ann compton about this. john kirby, former pentagon spokesman of the obama administration, ann compton longtime white house correspondent for abc news. yon, do you think that the tenor, the tone of the press coverage actually influenced the president this week, caused him to talk a in certain way about north korea? i kind of do, brian. i'm not boning good journalism. the north's program is obviously

advancing that isser than anybody wanted but i think there was this overescalating feeding itself of an coke chamber in terms of the coverage. he asked about the story in washington poes, the one that started all this, don't forget, a tuesday morning story about their ability, the north's ability to miniaturize a warh d warhead. he got asked about it in an opioid meeting and that's when we got fire and fury. in the next two to three days wes ka lated to the point the north koreans were saying we're at the brink of nuclear war. some of the tone and tenor of the coverage as well as social media chatter i think it just help eed feed the sense of fren. this could be part of the strategy of the president, go to brinksmanship, force the chinese and pyongyang to back down, but it's ting rouse thing to d because as will right hi says, we don't have perfect visibility into how kim jong-un thinks and how he makes decisions. >> and you've gone the dmz, travelled there with past presidents. i'd love to hear your reaction

to this week's rhetoric. >> brian, is it possible we're still struggling with how to interpret president trump's words? remember after his election people would say his supporters take him seriously but not literally. his critics take him literally but not seriously. diplomacy has always been covered with a certain reading between the lines, a kind of language of its own. and to have the blunt words like locked and loaded come out with such rapidity that it puts a special burden on reporters, the professional reporters, the editors who are covering the white house, to make the stories not only clear but in context so that americans can get the p bigger pick dhushgs kind of information they need. >> august 13th and we're still trying to learn as a country and a world how to interpret the u.s. president. it's an amazing thin you said. you're right but it's an amazing situation. >> there's no question that the

burden on reporters not only those at the white house every day but the larger news organization from which the rest of the media world get their information have a real responsibility now to -- with a maturity and good judgment and with a real responsibility to explain very comply caughted stories. north korea is a long story and a complex relationship to make sure that the voices that are heard and the greater context, the clearer picture, is not only reported but reported the way people and busy lives today get it in more than 140 characters on the screen of their smartphones. >> the phone alerts, the alerts on your phone can seem so m menacing. john, are you jumping in there? >> i completely agree with annened i think it puts a special burden on the president's national security team to try and provide context

after the fact. we saw that all during the week after fire and fury. you had tillerson saying everybody can sleep fine, we'll work this diplomatically. it's putting his national security team, which quite frankly has been handling i think this north korea problem with measured, deliberate policymaking thought, puts them in a difficult position to help provide the context to the media just like ann said. >> will, i have to let you go. last word to you. let's put you in an assignment editor role even though your correspondent in beijing at the moment. what's a story we should be focusing more on when it comes to the north korea situation? >> i don't think you could -- >> i think we get to watch very closely what's happening. i'm sorry, talking to me, brian? >> yeah. sorry for satellite they. >> okay. i think what we need to really watch is what is happening behind the scenes here in beijing where i am now, because ho china does have an important

role to play here. they have agreed, they voted in favor of that seventh round of u.n. security council sanctions, the first time they've ever approved sanctions after a missile test. normally they might abstain but they of never said we disapprove of this. clearly china indicating that ear more concerned about north korea's icbm program than they have been in the past. we know there was an editorial in the global times this week where china called to remain neutral if north korea were able to fire the first shot, this is an editorial of not the official government line but gives you insight into what were more hawkish views inside the government. they said china stayed neutral if north korea fires the first shot. the united states and south korea launch a preemptive attack, china may get involved. that's pretty significant because a lot of the cal clue calculus is what would happen fit's north korea and the united states, but if you factor in china, that changes the dynamic for all stake holders. economically china has a lot of firepower they have yet to use. yes, they'll restrict trade with

north korea, things like iron and coal and seafood and they're going to further limit their access to financial institutions, but china could cut off the regime economically, they could stop the flow of oil and stop trade and china has indicated they ear not willing do that because they don't want to see anything destabilizing in north korea. they want north korea's jet stream to remain in power as a strategic buffer with the united states. this phone call between president trump and president xi on friday, did that change the dynamic when president trump talked about the trade investigation, could china be motivated to do more, that's what we need to watch in this part of the world. >> you're in the right place, in beijing. will, thank you so much. ann and john, stick around.

. .

gee remember this week started with reports scrutinizing president trump's vacation. he denied it actually was a va caution. he said he was hard at work. then he started holding events on camera perhaps to give tv networks something to show. at one of the q&as he was asked

to comment on special investigator robert mueller and the washington poes scooped mueller's team and fbi agents raided former trump campaign manager's paul manafort's home. here is what he said in response. >> i thought it was a very, very strong signal or whatever. >> so many folks on try to figure out what did he mean, strong signal? to me it sounded like -- well, like this. >> it certainly shows that mueller's team is not afraid to make a big statement. it sends a pretty strong message that it's serious investigation. >> the raid could have been a signal to paul manafort that they have something and they're trying to zero in on him snipe thought it was a very, very strong signal or whatever. >> see what i mean? i think the president was saying what he heard on television. talking like a cable news talk head. back me now, two more people

much more than talking heads, amp e ann compton from abc news and rear admiral john curry, now a cnn military and diplomatic analyst. ann, is it possible i'm on the something here tx pd yd the president, he hears something from cable news, picks it up from television and shares it as if he's 'removed, passive observer? >> well, i'll tell you what worries me about the press coverage and the news coverage of this whole very complex and interrelated story. there has been a move by the administration to crack down on leaks. and while you can understand an administration wanting to protect secret information, i hope there's not a chilling e fact on not only the reporters working in washington but working on all aspects of this story because the more the american people know about the elements going into this, the clearer picture and the better context americans will have to decide for themselves where the

story is leading and who has been -- who they believe. >> and new leaks every day. john, when you were at the pentagon, didn't you have to chase down latin americas? -- leaker snsz. >> sure we did at the pentagon and the state department not so much. president obama was very tough on leaks. they're dangerous. i wrote about this friday night. i'm worried about the leak that led to "the washington post" story on tuesday. again, a good story, nothing against the post moving forward with it, but leaking details of a classified assessment about north korea's voting to -- put it in motion all this heated rhetoric and i think we need to all sit back and think about that for just a moment. but, yeah, look, leaks are never okay, at least classified leaks. there's all kinds of different types. when you're putting out confidential and classified information, that's against the law and the president is right to be angry about that. and his attorney general is right to launch an investigation

on that. i think with we do need to look at that seriously. but i am concerned that -- ann's right, you also don't want to stifle whistle-blowers who have legitimate complaints about government and processes either. >> thank you so much, both of you, for being here. i appreciate it. up next, a new poll that really stunned me. maybe it surprised you too. two top fact checkers stand big. ...it starts a chain reaction... ...that's heard throughout the connected business world. at&t network security helps protect business, from the largest financial markets to the smallest transactions, by sensing cyber-attacks in near real time and automatically deploying countermeasures. keeping the world of business connected and protected. that's the power of and. here ya go. awesome, thank you. thank you. that's... not your car.

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welcome back to "reliable sources." i'm brian stelter. do americans trust the information coming out of the white house? the latest cnn poll says, no.

i was really amazed by these numbers. this shows that nearly three-fourths of americans -- you can see it here, the first two sections -- say they trust almost -- most -- sorry, let me back that up. look at the in um benumbers her. most americans don't trust things from the white house. only 40% of americans say they trust most of what they say. this is a problem for the president but is it a bigger problem for america? joining me, two of the country's top fact checkers. glen kessler of the "washington post." angie olman from politifact, celebrating its tenth anniversary this month. does this poll show the strength of journalism? that, yes, the public may be skeptical of our work but they are paying attention to our reporting and they are learning about trump's fibs and falsehoods. >> i think that's right. there's more fact checking going on now in american journalism

than i've seen in my professional career. we fact checkers are doing it. but traditional political journalists are also putting corrective information in their reports when a politician says something that's factually inaccurate, it gets corrected. >> glen, you said earlier in the week the president's always, as a businessman, always twisted the truth. it's just that he wasn't held accountable the way he is now. >> right. when you're a real estate investor and you lie to banks, the banks don't put out a press release saying this person misstated his assets. they simply say we're not going to make more loans to him. what has happened now is that people are holding the president to account for his words and cataloging exactly what he says, how he's inconsistent, and how he has flip-flopped, how he makes misstatements and false statements. >> the banner on screen says -- minute ago said, the president, can he regain the public's trust? angie, do you think that's possible? >> i think if he started speaking more accurately it

would be possible. one thing that i've noticed is president trump had a lot of problems during the campaign with observationa aexageations,, errors. i haven't seen that change much since he's become president. some people thought he would become more presidential and pay attention. i still haven't seen it. we get mostly falses/pants on fires for his statements while in office. but if he spoke more accurately, i think he would be trusted more. >> journalists have a trust crisis, i won't hide from that. but it seems the president may have an even bigger one. >> right. one of the striking things about president trump is that when we gave a four pinocchios or angie gives a "pants on fire" to a politician, they will tend to stop saying those false facts. president trump instead repeats over and over many of the same false claims. we know that he's aware of these ratings because he's talked about getting pinocchios.

so i think if he wants to start closing that trust deficit, what he needs to do is actually stop doubling down or repeating false claims and instead, if he's called out, say, you know, that's not working for me, i've got to be more accurate. >> and gain credibility, which he'll need in a crisis. like where for example, involving north korea. glenn, angie, thank you so much for being here today. on "reliable sources."com check out all of our media's news, including this week's servering ties with jeffrey lord, the conservative commentator. all that and more on reliablesources.com. we'll see you back here on tv this time next week. like those who like. sweet those who prefer heat. sfx - a breath of air and those who just love meat. oscar mayer deli fresh. sweet!

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