future military action aim at containing guam and they also promised more missile launches targeting the pacific in the future. so north korea would say this was a test run, not necessarily them backing down as the japanese minister implied. obviously by flying the missile in japan they avoided a highly provocative act but if they follow through and they do in a southerly direction that could escalate the situation further than it already is. >> thanks for joining us. >> "new day" starts right now. we'll see you tomorrow. . we want to welcome our viewers in the united states and around the world. this is "new day" i.'s wednesday, august 30th. it's 5:00 578 here in houston where i am.

tropical storm harvey making landfall again, this time in louisiana where it is ham 34ering the area with heavy rain. here in houston where i'm standing, after five straight days of rain, i'm happy to report the conditions seem to be improving. the streets we drove in to get to houston, they were wet, but they were not flooded. the situation in the convention center is pretty dire. i'm in the city's largest shelter where at last count, 8,319 people are seeking refuge. there are two more mega shelters now open in this city. they're taking people in to alleviate the overcapacity conditions here. one-third of harris county which includes 4.9 million people in houston and the suburbs are under water. all eyes are on the two dams trying to contain the record breaking rainfall.

the death toll, it is, of course, on the rise. among those people killed, a veteran houston police sergeant. steve perez drown trying to get to his command post trying to help those in need. rescue crews and volunteers are working around the clock. they have saved thousands and thousands from the floodwaters. here are a few examples on your screen. there are thousands of these examples. we have all sorts of survivor stories to bring you this morning as well as updates on how houston is going to try to deal with this today. you have so much people in this concerned citizens corps trying to save their fellow community members. the big question is what will this rain mean as harvey returns? okay. hopefully texas will be spared any further damage except for this one east part we're

watching. in louisiana, already two feet of rain in the last 24 hours. there is a flood threat to several states in its path. all of this as president trump is back in washington after meeting with emergency responders in texas. the president is getting some criticism for how he was on the ground and was the focus on himself or the people that were suffering? we'll take you through the politics of it. he also has a new agenda item for you to entertain this morning, tax reform. the president says he's going to go ahead and make his pitch to the country as we're watching this natural disaster unfold. we're covering everything. let's begin with cnn's polo sandoval. one of the areas we're watching this morning, what is the status where you are. >> reporter: chris, the river continues to rise west of the city center. meanwhile in houston, the curfew has been listed as remnants of

harvey makes landfall again in louisiana. search and rescue operations continue. obviously that death toll continues on the rise in and around the houston area. that includes sergeant steve perez. we're learning his wife begged him not to go to work this past weekend as the storm was closing in on the region. we are learning that he did eventually go missing under an overpass, officials recovering his body just yesterday. he's someone described as having a passion forgiving back to his community. sadly, sunday morning would be the last day he would do that. the reality is the death toll would likely increase as officials try to find answers for the family in houston. cnn speaking to a loved one of

the family of six still missing at this hour. they say there's very little hope they'll find the loved ones alive. >> the current just lifted up the van and started pointing it into the water. it just took the van. and he had his window down, so he managed to get out the window. he tried to get around the van, but he couldn't. it was too strong. the current was too strong. >> he could hear the kids screaming and crying, trying to get out of the fan. he kept telling them to go to the back of the van open the back doors, open the back doors. from what he's describing, i'm sure the kids couldn't even grab a grip onto the van to reach the back door much less open it. he said it just went under the water. >> in order to try to prevent another tragedy like this, officials in fort ben county have issued a mandatory evacuation, including this community alongside the brass

sass. the water level is expected to go up at least another five feet in the next few days. >> polo, thank you for keeping track of that. we'll check back with you. harvey, as we say, is making landfall again, this time as a tropical storm, the storm dumping very heavy rain in eastern texas and the western parishes of louisiana. cnn's kaylee hartung is in lake charles, louisiana with more. what are you seeing? >> knowing harvey made landfall less than an hour from here in lake charles, i would think i would be standing here in the rain talking with you, bun that's not the problem. wind the bigger problem here. officials say they expect 40 to 50-mile-per-hour winds today, expecting power outages and trees down. i spoke earlier with the director of emergency services.

he said there were no calls for rescues overnight. it didn't rain as much as anyone expected either. yesterday, the night before, more than 5,000 rescues in cal cash shew. on the 12th anniversary of hurricane katrina, i spoke with governor edwards. he said unfortunately people in louisiana all too familiar with disasters. despite the unknowns, he says he feels he has the people trained, experienced and prepared for whatever it may bring. >> kaylee keep us apprised of the situation there. the specific concern are the dams built in 1940s. is the age going to be determinative of their strength. cnn meteorologist chad myers has the latest. what do you see in terms of the path and what are these infrastructure variables? >> the infrastructure is at its capacity. now it's actually flowing around the dam itself.

i'll get to that in a second. there's cameron parish right there where that center of circulation came onshore just a couple hours ago. and there goes harvey. finally, finally moving. the rain is moving away from houston, but still in beaumont port arthur. in some spots raining as much as 18 inches. i suspect we should focus on the beaumont port arthur area for the rest of the day. still will see a six to ten. cedar bayou, a new record at 51.88. four days ago i walked on this platform here and said there's a potential for 50 inches of rain. look what the computer model is showing. we couldn't believe it, it has to be wrong. we said if the computers are right, this will be a catastrophic flood. the computers were right. these are the dams we're talking

about, addicks, barker in good shape. they are not breaching, they are not breaching. what's happening is out of addicks water is going out of the buffalo bayou and into houston. that's what they expect. they're letting the water out on purpose. what is wrong is that the end of this right here is the end of the water, and the water is spilling around the top of the damn at 108 feet above sea level. if it's above 108, it will spill. it was planned to do that. that's not good for the neighborhoods there because those people there are flooding. they weren't flooding before. we do know certainly the flooding has happened all the way through these neighborhoods behind addicks and barker. and there are at least 3,500 homes flooded because the water couldn't get out of those dams fast enough.

alisyn. >> chad, thank you very much. we'll check back with you throughout the program. our next guest here is very lucky to be alive. his family of six managed to escape their home just moments before their boiler exploded and the house burnt to the ground in front of them. sadly they lost all of their pets except one of them, and the one who made it out with them is their dog named miracle. i'm joined by jose gonzalez and miracle. jose, thank you for being here. i can see how upsetting all this is to you. i'm sorry -- >> didn't hit me until you said it like that. >> i'm so sorry you're going through all this. we're grateful your family made it out alive. how many pets did you lose? >> 14. >> you had 14 pets in your house. you had new kittens i guess, eight, nine -- >> eight. >> eight new kittens and three other dogs besides miracle. >> yes, ma'am. a pit bull, a deer chihuahua and

teacup chihuahua. >> what happened this weekend? tell us what happened when you were in your home, trying to shelter in place. what happened? >> i woke up real early saturday. my step dad came out of his room to go check to see how it looked outside and he saw water in our yard coming towards the house. so we started getting everything into our room upstairs. >> all of you were gathered in one room. >> yes. >> at some point when you were gathered in one room, the water was getting higher and higher. >> yes, ma'am. >> at some point, not you, but some of your family members smelled gas. what happened? >> i had went to the bathroom. i didn't know anything about that. i used the bathroom so i didn't have to go upstairs and then the next thing i know i hear like a loud pop, and the door flew open and part of the frame hit me in

the back of my head. i was like what happened. i heard all my family yelling get out, there's a fire. i got out of the bathroom and started running out the front door. i was like, wait, where are the dogs? >> they said they're still upstairs. i tried to go but couldn't make it to my steps. the fire had already made it in the house. >> the fire had already started at that point. >> yes, ma'am. >> you and your family members, including an 11-year-old child got out and then you were in what, waist deep water? >> right in our house and stepping outside it was about knee high, but our house is raised about five feet. by the time we got down, it was up to chest, like going down our driveway, it came up to the waist. but once we hit the street, it came up to chest. >> then you had to swim for your life. you and your family members, six of you, had to swim across the street. tell me when you turned around what you saw happening with your house. >> none of us wanted to look at

it, but eventually we had to, and when we did, my room had already caught fire. >> so you watched your house burn. >> yes, ma'am. >> and how did you have miracle with you? >> i don't know. my mom said he just ran down the stairs as soon as he heard the pop. >> was he swimming alongside of you, in your arms? >> no. my sister grabbed him, the 11-year-old. she grabbed him. my dad grabbed her. >> she had miracle in her arms? >> yes, ma'am. >> why did you name your dog miracle to begin with? >> when he was born, two days after he was born, his mom and his six other siblings died. so my mom bottle fed him. >> she bottle fed him like a baby. >> yes, ma'am. >> i can see how close you are to miracle. what a sweet dog. and so when you watched your house burning, what were you thinking?

what was hamg? >> it felt like a bad dream. at first i couldn't grasp it for a while. >> and so how long -- now you've been here since the weekend. what will happen next for your family? >> well, as soon as it clears up, we have people that want to take us to waco. >> and you'll stay there while you rebuild? >> well, we're just going to go, move back. adds soon as this clears up, we'll wait about a month or two and see if it clears, then we'll go and get whatever there's anything salvageable. we had a big 200-pound barbecue pit in the back yard that we made. we're hoping that might still be there. all our cars -- my dad's truck caught fire. he had 30 gallons of gasoline and two power generators in the back of the truck. a piece of the house collapsed

into the truck. >> jose, we're so glad you and your family survived and made it out just in the nick of time before the fire started, and miracle has lived up to his name, really a sweet dog. thank you so much and we're wishing you the best and praying for you. thank you for telling your story for us. chris, this is obviously just one story here. as i said, there are something like 8,300 people here. we walked around this morning when we first got to the convention center, and it's early still. it's before 6:00 a.m. obviously the fluorescent lights are shining on people trying to sleep in these main corridors. there are three huge halls here that are about three times the size of football fields, and there is just cot after cot after cot donated by the red cross with people trying to sleep, people trying to heal. what you're looking at here are all the clothing donations coming in from other citizens trying to help their fael he

neighborhoods and people are softing through them, sifting through them, trying to figure out what size things are and what the need is. so all of this is happening even at this hour here in the convention center. we're joined now, happy to have our cnn contributor lieutenant general russe general russell honore. he coordinated the military efforts. tell us what we're facing with harvey? >> good news, i've been here about six hours and haven't seen any rain. the bad news is there are a lot of people still -- the search and rescue must continue over a very large area. i drove in here yesterday from beaumont, and the entire distance from beaumont to here which is almost 90 miles, the entire area is flooded, both sides of the highway. >> is it possible to know how

many people are still stranded in their homes? >> absolutely oochs. you consider all the south of houston and the number of people. i think there's still a major effort. alisyn, the first step after search and rescue is we have to go into every home and see if there's anyone left. from our experience with katrina, that's when we really found the bad news, because most of the people we found were elderly and disabled and they were home alone. so that sad story is still yet to happen. right now we're still -- for another 72 hours, rescuing the living. people that require, because the water is still rising. >> i've heard officials say that, if you can hear them and if you're in your home and if you're stranded and if you have a white towel, to hang it out your window so people know there's somebody in the house.

beyond that system, how do you know if people are stranded? >> this is the second big event. we've got to create a technology. the other thing we don't have an answer to, if people left their home, the home is empty, we don't have a common marking. in many cases we would go in to break the door, a house secure with no one in it. there's some things we've got to clean up. it's been 12 years and some hasn't been improved. we're going to try to use this experience to try to capture that. >> yet, the people i've spoken to who have experienced katrina and now are here, the workers, they say this what they're seeing in the convention center is much different, much better organized. you see a heavy security presence. what do you see when you walk among the 8,300 people sheltered here? >> you see organization which is different than -- what they call the shelter of last response for

the superdome. the government didn't know for 24 hours that we had people at the convention center. a totally different operation. we still have improvements -- >> it's hard to get your mind around there are 8,300 people here sleeping in all these crowded cot conditions, but there are millions of people in houston and houston was under water. where is everybody else? >> they're out there in survival mode and we've got to get prepared to go get them. this is going to get worse before it gets better. we haven't seen the worst of it yet. my estimate, my experience here in america and around the world, the worst is yet to come in terms of the outcome, which means people stuck in their home and we can't get them out, and they're isolated. >> no one knows better than you, thank you. you'll be with us all morning helping us get through all this. we want to rely on your expertise. let's get back to chris in new

york now. >> you are standing right to the next man. it would be unimaginable to be less prepared than they were during katrina, but this situation is going the right way in terms of what they can do in terms of the capacity they're getting. what do you do as the capacity increases? that's what you're going to see down there, alisyn, is how they deal with the need. president trump went down there to express his concern and his promise that the federal government will be there to reassure the first responders and those who are struggling. how did he handle it? did he give the right message? did he show the empathy required of the consoler-in-chief? we'll discuss the take, the criticism and the fairness of it next. on the agile mkc. and the versatile midsize lincoln mkx. or go where summer takes you in the exhilarating mkz.

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that in moments like this you need leadership so much. the president did go down to texas and promised disaster response unlike any other we've ever seen. the president's stops didn't include the hashedest hit areas, but for reasons. they didn't want to tax efforts there. the president is getting criticism for what he did say, didn't say and how. cnn's joe johns is live at the

white house with more. there's always going to be some criticism, but more intense than expected? >> reporter: that's right, chris. the natural disaster on the gulf coast giving the president the prime opportunity to get on the ground and engage with people suffering and struggling on the gulf coast. the president's visit to texas was well received by the people there, especially the state and local officials who realizes that help from washington is going to be required in the next days, months, weeks and even years ahead. the president was hit hard by the critics for what could be seen as a lack of expression of empathy for the victims, the president choosing instead to focus on the resilience of texas and offering words of encouragement. >> this was of epic proportion. no one has ever seen anything

like that. governor, thank you very much. we don't want to say congratulations. we'll congratulate each other when it's all finished. >> reporter: today the president is expected to go back on the road, this time to springfield, missouri, to offer the opening salvo, if you will, on his tax reform plan. no indication that the white house is planning on changing that trip due to the situation on the gulf coast. the president is expected to return to the disaster area over the weekend, chris. >> we're hearing from our reporters that vice president may be there before that, so we'll watch. this is certainly a show of force by the administration in this situation. joe, thank you very much. let's bring in our panel, cnn political analyst abby philip and cnn political commentator errol louis. errol, let's get to the criticisms of what was expected and what fell short? >> what was expected was that he

would show up, which he did. it was expected that he would be some kind of a comforter and show a side of this president that we've really not seen in public life. that was probably a little bit unrealistic. this is somebody who likes to show he can take charge, he can come in and organize things and come in and make things better. he's not somebody who is going to hold a weeping mother in his arms or anything like that. he didn't go anywhere near there. he didn't roll up his sleeves and get in the mud even for the sake of showmanship. that ended up being like an ink blot test. there's no way any president is ever going to get it exactly right. if you stay away, you look like you're aloof. if you go in, it looks like a photo opinion and it looks like you're wasting everyone's time. in my opinion, i think he got it about as good as can be expected. the real questions will follow about the recovery and if

rebuilding. when he said to the governor, we ool congratulate ourselves when it's all over, it's not going to get done during this presidency. they have a very long road ah d ahead. >> there's no question. look what we had in louisiana, 450,000 plus before -- assuming they had the count right. they have about 400,000 now. recovery becomes a defined term. what do you see as the measure of the man in this moment? >> i thinker roll is right. they knew there would be risks in doing this. when you go down early, you have to go outside the immediate disaster area and you don't get close enough to victims. i think trump did miss the opportunity to say something, a message from his mouth to the american people, to the people still in the line of fire here

about the fact that the rest of the country is with them, about what they've been suffering, about their loss and their experiences. that being said, to the white house's credit, they're aware of the reality that the situation did not lend itself to that. that's why they floated the idea and are likely to go back over the weekend when things have maybe settled a little bit or just enough that he can actually be face-to-face with people who are at risk here. i think they're aware. i think this is a first for president trump. he's going to have to learn how to do this. we won't know how he fairs until he's faced with that situation and they probably learn from the feedback and maybe some of the backlash from the experience. that he actually needs to do more. it's not going to be enough to say, hey, everything is going well and congratulate the of firms on the ground. no one really cares about that. what they care about is everyone

understands what they've gone through and what they lost. >> a particular piece of sound that ended up piqueing interesting. do we have it? >> thank you everybody. what a crowd, what a turnout. i will tell you this is historic, it's epic what happened. but you know what? it happened in texas and texas can handle anything. thank you all folks, thank you. >> the truth is, errol, this is who he is. if he's going to go somewhere, he's going to talk about the crowd size, the projection of his own popularity. that's who he was when he got elected. that's who he is now. you like it, don't like it, period. you'll have to measure the actions. will he get congress to give the money or will we see what happened with sandy. the political coverup that happened with sandy can't be allowed, if we don't call it out, some lawmakers will try to

repeat it. now today he's going to try to sell his tax plan. is that the right move in this moment? >> it probably is, to tell you the truth. the reality is he's going to have to make a transition to going back to running the government. as gribing as this is, as terrible as this is, we've got a lot of different things going ong. there's missiles flying over japan, a political agenda that doesn't come to a halt. the nation and the life of the nation goes forward. yes, it is the right thing. however, this is a case where what he says and how he says it will really, really matter. whatever else he says, he needs to express sympathy for people going through the trauma of a lifetime right next door. he's also got to be careful not to be too political about it. this is the political edge of selling the tax plan. this is trying to sort of stir people up and make them feel like something is necessary. this is the time to put pressure, that's why he's going to missouri to put pressure on the democratic senator there.

>> more proof of why it is the most difficult job in the world. errol, abby, thank you very much. let's get back to alisyn down in houston. that's the main test. will people stay interested, stay involved? you're in the right place at the right time. >> because, chris, as you know, it's raining again in parts of houston. southeastern texas is being hammered by rain. as harvey makes landfall now a second time, we have a live report from the ground next. also, to learn more about you can help those affected by harvey, go to cnn.com/impact. they need your help. ♪

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morning in louisiana, right at the state border with texas. the death toll is rising, though the numbers are very uncertain at this hour. 17,000 harvey evacuees are in shelters across texas including the one i'm standing in that's housing about 8,ccc. cnn's drew griffin is live in beaumont, texas, being pummeled right now by the rain. drew, what are you seeing? >> reporter: the rain increased overnight. 26 inches fell on beaumont texas yesterday, midnight to midnight. that's a record. it has done nothing but rain since then, and i mean really rain. we took a little bit of video about a half hour ago, and the area we were standing in just yesterday which was dry is now in several inches of water. this is the problem. the water rising everywhere in the county has made any chance of rescues almost impossible. we're really in a mode where you have to preserve life and get to

a dry spot. this is not about being comfortable, not about being fed. this is about surviving harvey until it finally exits. port arthur, texas, seems to be a very tough place to be this morning. the shelter there, one of the shelters is being flooded and needs to be evacuated. and chris, this is just going to continue until harvey finally gets the heck out of here. chris, alisyn? >> okay, drew, thank you very much. obviously we'll check back on your situation there. what we've seen, part of the big story of harvey here are all of the citizens helping each other. neighbors helping neighbors, even if they themselves are in a bad way, they're still stepping up to save complete strangers' lives. so we have an update for you on the unprecedented volunteer rescue effort and how it's all being coordinated next.

so the people here at this convention center where i am this morning in houston are

trying to wrap their heads around their new normal. thousands of people here and beyond will not have a home to return to anymore. as heartbreaking as that is, we're also seeing amazing humanity and grace. people have jumped into action to help their neighbors, even sacrificing some of their own safety to do so. joining us to talk about all this is neal bush, board chair of boints of light, son of former president george h.w. bush and the favorite son of former first lady barbara bush. did i get that right? >> glad you threw that in. >> i hope your mom is watching this morning. this is the story, there are so many citizen heroes. this storm, beyond any i can remember, even officials have asked neighbors to help neighbors. get in your boat and go help. how do you corral and organize something like that? >> first of all, there's not much organization needed at this point because when a neighbor cries out for help, neighbors

naturally do what they can. and it's been remarkable in this city to see the tons of outpouring of support and love for the neighbors. >> why does that make you emotional to see all of this? >> i'm genetically wired to be a little emotional. my mom and dad -- my dad, not my mom so much and my brothers and i, just tend to get really -- feel very positive about great things being done for others. >> i agree. it's really touching, all the humanity and the heroism we've been seeing. >> it is. i have a stepdaughter whose boyfriend jumped in a boat, rescued 20 people, and one of those rescues -- he's just one of many, one of hundreds or thousands, in one of those rescues he had a little baby who was turning blue. they ran with the baby and took it to emergency care. there's an amazing outpouring. if your neighborhood is under

attack, it's sez toy to help your neighbors. what we're trying to discourage is having floods and floods of other people coming in to volunteer. >> from other states and other places because that would be complicated. >> we already have stress on our infrastructure. the hotels and rooms and and dag dagss aren't ready for it. so over these next weeks ahead, working with fema, working with the red cross, with the local, there's been a lot of skepticism about governments. to see this government, the state government, the local governments react with such efficiency and clarity of purpose in mind has been really rewarding. there's been a lot of attacks, by the way, frankly, on the media. to see local media people -- to see you here, but to see local media people out in the streets working hard to bring information to people --

>> trying to warn people. >> it's been a great service that's been provided to everyone. to see everyone coming together, government, non-government, and to see these individuals rise with love in their heart, with a light in their heart to help others has been and is always the great story of disaster. >> i don't have to remind you about the catastrophic nature of katrina and the criticism after katrina leveled in part at your brother. what do you think the lessons are here for president trump. do you think he's done enough, spoken out enough? >> i don't really know how much presidential leadership helps. i think to have fema being active and engage in a way that's helpful is the important thing. we live in a divided time. let's face it. we have division based on politics and race and religious differences and economic

differences. the amazing thing for me to see personally is how all these divides are bridged when it comes to serving others. service is one of the things that unites people in a way that's powerful. republicans and democrats and people that hate each other in the social media world come together and help others in a way that is really, really enlightening and hopeful for america. >> no one asks when they're pulling you into their boat if you're democrat or republican. >> right. >> we have seen the best of people here on the ground in houston. neil bush, thank you for all you're doing and thanks for sharing it with us. >> thank you, alisyn. good to have you here. >> it's good to hear that people are heartening due to what's happening on the ground in houston. it's tough to imagine 12 years after katrina, as we mark that milestone, another storm is pummeling the state. we'll speak with the mayor of lake charles, louisiana. you're looking at pictures of

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years ago. it's hard to imagine, especially given what's happening right now. people in lake charles are once again getting pounded by heavy rain and winds, this time from tropical storm harvey. joining us on the phone is the mayor of lake charles, nick hunter. mr. mayor, can you hear us? >> i can. can you hear me? >> yes, i can. what is the situation right now, sir? >> we're doing okay. i'm going to tell you, this storm has been so crazy and so meandering, it seems like it will never go away. the previous night before last night was actually worse for us with the rain event. we did have to rescue several hundred people the previous night. but as of now, i can say within the city of lake charles we have not had any serious events last night. haven't had to perform any rescues like we did the night before. we're doing okay now.

>> in truth, all guys have been on texas. governor edwards was on the show a couple nights ago and he surprised me when he said we had to rescue 500 people because of the realities you deal with all the time. help us understand, the pictures we're seeing of lake charles, people on bikes, up to their knees in water, the place looks completely saturated. that will pass for okay given what you're used to dealing with. what is the need right now? >> i'm going to tell you, chris, the need is going to be after this -- for us, i'm only speaking for lake charles. the need is going to be after this storm moves because we have a lot of people in flooded homes. we're continuing to need immediate services. but after this storm moves, we've seen the need for federal assistance to help people get back on their feet. we are a very resilient people down here. we will survive and will take care of each other down here in

texas and louisiana, but we do need help from the federal government for the 40e78 owners and people displaced. that's going to be our biggest need. >> mr. mayor, we have seen the resilience of people in the area firsthand. we saw it during katrina, we're seeing it again now. we will not leave this story once the storm leaves the area. if you need something, please come to us and see us as a resource. >> thank you. i appreciate it. not only are we seeing what government can do. we're seeing what communities can do, what people can do. this is a horrible experience but it is en spierg. >> unprecedented storm, unprecedented response as well. be well, stay safe, stay in touch. >> thank you, chris. some say rising temperatures in the gulf of mexico may have fueled hurricane harvey's intensity. the talk about climate change is relevant if it's right. if it's not right, it needs to be discussed. our next guest predicted more intense storms. he wrote this in "the washington

post" back in march. water temperatures at the surface of the gulf of mexico and near south florida are on fire. they spurred a historically warm winter from houston to miami and could fuel intense thunderstorms in the spring from the south to the plains. those words are from "washington post" reporter and editor, and he joins us right now. let's get to the heart of the matter. first of all, thank you for joining us on new day. >> good morning. >> every time climate change comes up, and we're hearing it more with harvey than with past storms. same thing, you can look at the temperature two ways. this is one cycle of warm temperature. it's storm season. there's no proof, this could have as much to do with the type of development in houston, where they've cemented over so much of what should have been sponge ground as they can to the temperature. what's your argument? >> i think there's a combination

now. if we look back at the temperatures in the gulf of mexico back in the winter when i wrote that story, the water temperature in the gulf of mexico never fell below 73 degrees. texas and luouisiana had their warmest winters on record. new orleans also had its warmest february on record. so there was just abnormal warmth in the gulf coast states back in the winter. the warm water persisted in the gulf of mexico leading up to hurricane harvey. you need that fuel. you need that warm water in the gulf of mexico to power these storms, and we saw that explosive intensification of harvey as it approached the texas coast. obviously the warm water spurred by climate change played a role here. of course there's natural variability. we've had hurricanes hit the gulf coast for decades. i think there's ooh combination. i think global warming intensified the storm some.

obviously there have always been these storms and there will continue to be these storms in the future. >> jason samenow made the argument, the difference between temperature change and climate change, another point of controversy. samenow is right. temperatures are higher in the gulf. warm air and moisture is going to generate energy and storms. you're going to see worse storms, but it could just be a phase. it doesn't mean it's the direct result of a permanent change in the climate cycle or because of anything that human beings have done. what's your response? >> i think if you look at all the evidence which is out there and look at all the studies in the scientific literature, there is a clear and unambiguous signal that there's an anthropogenic component. >> meaning -- man made, human caused. absolutely. we'll see the human signal on the climate system continue to grow as long as we continue

greenhouse emissions in the atmosphere. we'll see continued warming and there's going to be more potential for these storms to blow up and become even more intense in future decades. >> do you believe that you can demonstrate with the data that what used to be called hundred-year storms happen like every other year now? i remember with super storm sandy, this shouldn't be that bad, but because of a combination of factors and things that have seemed to change over time, it was way worse. we were just talking to the mayor down there in lake charles, louisiana. yes, they're ridiculously resilient down there, incredible people with what they've learned to deal with as normal. it seems they're under water almost every year. >> the greenhouse gases we add into the atmosphere, they're like steroids. remember how many run totals inflated during the steroid era with baseball. we should expect to see more of these 500-year, 1,000-year

events because we're loading the atmosphere with these greenhouse gases, and we are seeing these more intense storms development as a result. >> jason samenow, it's never one thing. it's multiple things. it's how they developed in houston. it's how they engineered in the new orleans area and the levee system and greenhouse gases are also something you have to take into account if you want it to be better. thank you for making the case. we direct people to the article you wrote in "the washington post." jason samenow, thank you very much. >> thank you very much. >> thealisyn, this climate chan discussion and how these storms are getting worse, that matters as well. >> absolutely. you hear scientists connecting the two. this devastating storm harvey is making land fall again today. we'll take you live to the places that people -- where people are facing round two of this deadly rain and flooding. we'll be right back.

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