bill in november. the deadline is today, and if they vote no. >> if this is -- >> the democrats win, trust me. >> i want to thank everyone on the panel. the senate vote expected just seconds from now, i want to hand things over to don lemon and cnn tonight. indeed it is breaking news. will the government shutdown, you're going to find out in this broadcast. look at the pictures live, they're from the senate floor, can you see some folks still scurrying about. a vote is scheduled to begin at any moment now. it's on that short term bill to avoid a government shutdown, to try to avoid a government shutdown, if it happens, the vote will happen, you'll see it here on cnn, we'll bring it to you. here's where we stand right now. if republicans can't win over enough democrats to reach 60

votes, this bill will fail. and barring a hail mary, the federal government will begin shutting down at midnight, that is less than two hours away. there is a last minute scramble right now to try to come up with an alternate deal that could keep this government open. but the clock is ticking. it's clicking down to 12:00 a.m., and where we go from here is really anybody's guess, but we got you, and we have a whole lot of people who can help us get through this, we're going to watch it all unfold live right here on cnn tonight with me. >> let's get right to phil mattingly on capitol hill. wow! here we are phil, we've been talking all week, last night we said it was down to the deadline, you said the next time, when they gavel in, they had 13 hours to dry to come up with something. doesn't seem like they have so far. talk to me about these last ditch efforts to avert a government shutdown. >> to put it bluntly, not to

bury the lead at all, there's no deal. right now, everything they've been trying to do over the course of the last hour appears to have failed. john cornyn coming out, telling reporters no deem. let me walk-through what happened here, over the course of the last couple hours, the idea of pitching a shorter short term funding bill, it was at four weeks, they were pitching three weeks, saying this could be a potential offramp, don. obviously, substantively, policiwise, this wasn't anything democrats were looking for. there were democrats who came out and said, they wanted to vote with republicans. several other democrats had voiced concerns internally about the imagine way forward, the hope on the republican side, and this was a proposal offered by lindsey graham, was giving them something, even if it was just one week on the length of the cr would be enough that democrats at least 12, 13 or 14 of them would be willing to come on board. democrats met behind closed doors, more than an hour and a

half, trying to walk-through what they were going to do, when they came out of that meeting, one senator said nothing has changed, what that means, don, is as this vote starts and it's expected to in a short while, it's very clear, it's a 60 vote threshold, mitch mcconnell will not have 60 votes. this vote will go down, at this moment, there are no contingency plans. everything right now is leading heavily toward a shutdown at midnight. >> you're saying there's a chance? >> seriously, i want you to be clear here, there is no daca deal. and so what's the path going-forward for democrats? they don't know either? >> yeah, look, i think that's the big question, i think some of the democrats have been frustrated. it's not a large number of their 49 members, it's important to note, the vast majority of the democratic caucus has made clear in lengthy statements over the last 24 hours, they believe this is the best path forward, the

reason why, they're frustrated with the process, they are very frustrated and most importantly, very disruptful on where republicans are on the daca issue. whether or not they'll get to a resolution on that issue. because of that, they don't believe there's any reason to agree to anything right now, short of some type of legislative option on daca. here's the reality, in a short period of time, those deals aren't anywhere close. the bipartisan proposal on daca has been rejected by the president, by republican leaders, even lindsey graham, one of the sponsors of that this evening. says he doesn't believe that's in play any more. democrats right now are basically going to have the fight. they say the fight needs to happen, this is the moment for the fight, they have the issue they want to fight on. in terms of what it will take to actually get them back on board, i don't know that that's actually been laid out yet. at least not in the sense that

republicans are willing to consider at this point. >> we're sitting here watching these live pictures. they said 10:00, how are they usually on time? >> usually they're pretty accurate. the one element that throws things off a little bit, the closed door democratic meeting went on long. it was running into this vote right now, i will say one thing, when it comes to the u.s. senate, if votes start being delayed, talks are still happening, things might actually happen, i think when senator cornen came out and said in a definitive manner, there is no deal, and he said flatly, we need 12, 13, 14 democrats right now, and we don't have them, it didn't look like there was much of a path forward, there are a lot of people who don't want the government to shut down at midnight. right now, it looks like that's where everything is headed. >> thank you. stand by, let's get to elsewhere in washington. the latest from your end of pennsylvania avenue, what's the president doing? >> good evening, not quite as

much activity here on this side of pennsylvania avenue, but all eyes at the white house are on the u.s. capitol. particularly the floor of the senate, as senators begin to mill in, there is an open question here. would there be enough votes to reach that 60 threshold. hour by hour, that optimism has dwindled. there's not been an all out effort here at all to get those democrats on board. the white house press secretary sara sanders has been sending out messages on social media, calling out individual red state democrats individually and mocking them or trolling them for not supporting this deal to keep the government open. democrats are unified on this front with the exception of some of those who are up for a re-election this year, the president for his part had been quiet on social media. a short time ago, he sent out a new message, let's take a look at that again.

not a lot of room for optimism there. not looking good for military, safety and security. on the dangerous southern border, democrats want to shut do down. of course, there, the president passing this as a fight over border security. that is just one small part of this, though. the immigration deal that he had talked about only a week ago, has not made any progress. i've been here throughout the day, i was using sunglasses earlier when i came in, now obviously it's dark out. not much progress in terms of deal making, there was one key meeting earlier today here, this afternoon, that was about it. >> you may be needing sunglasses by the time you leave if you -- what phil says is true, there's no contingency plan, they haven't come to a vote yet. i have to ask you, let's put the president's tweet back up.

you said the immigration -- that's a small part to do with it, what is -- in border security, what is the military have to do with this, and also tax cuts? what does that have to do with anything. >> the president for the last couple days has been saying he believes democrats are doing this -- are holding up government funding, not voting for the republican plan to punish him for his tax cut law he signed last year. he said that when he was traveling in pennsylvania briefly, democrats are trying to punish him for that. democrats are trying to use their leverage here on immigration, particularly the dreamers on daca. that is something the president said that he wanted -- and i'm just struck by here as we take stock of what day it is, it's january 19th, we all remember a year ago, the president being sworn into office, on that day, he told some senators at a lunch on capitol hill just moments after he was sworn in, he's

like, we'll take care of the kids. meaning the dreamers, of course, so all of them have had a year to deal with it, both democrats and republicans alike. senator schumer came over here for a meeting, that was -- i would say the most dramatic point of the day for 90 minutes, the new york democrat came over here for a meeting, and interestingly only four people in the oval office for that, not the big meetings we normally see. there was a sense of a deal, you have to wonder, why are these meetings happening again at the 11th hour, it is how things get done in washington. things only get done in a stress situation. you have to wonder if they would have had those meetings earlier, could anything else have gotten done. if a deal is going to be done after the shutdown, they have to agree to something. the president said, i'll take the heat. if he really means that, he'll take the heat on immigration and daca. they can get a deal that republicans and democrats can sign on. if he doesn't, there's a stalemate here. >> very good point, he said a

year ago, he would take care of the kids, it's not like it had to get down to this point, you're right on, they had a year to do this with this particular president. jeff stand by, as well as phil mattingly, you're looking live now with some pictures on the senate floor. this is a crucial vote that should happen at any moment now, according to phil mattingly. there are -- obviously everyone is not on the flower yet. hopefully they're working and there will be a deal to avoid a government shutdown. the senate republicans if they can't win enough democrats to reach 60 votes, then barring some hail mary, the government will shut down at midnight. they could come up with something after that. but that's where we stand. let's bring in david swerdlick, also molly ball and david trucker. wow! that was dramatic. did you hear the sound from the

senate floor go away in a vacuum. good evening to all of you, david swerdlick, here we go again. >> yeah. >> at the last minute? why can't congress get their act together? >> you have a situation, where especially in the house, members are in districts that are either heavily democrat or heavily republican. we shrunk the number of swing districts. you have a situation where members know what the voters in their districts want and have less incentive to compromise across the aisle, it's a little different in the senate, that's the general pattern going back a decade or more, in this case, you also have a situation where republicans control both houses in the white house, but democrats having experienced the obama years are realizing that they have to at some point take a stand. republicans during the obama years showed that they were willing to take a hostage. they didn't get a lot for it, they showed they would take a hostage. democrats haven't shown they would take a hostage, this might

be their opportunity to do it. >> what if they end up the hostage? >> well, okay, look, there are risks for democrats too, going-forward. there are risks for democrats not doing it. the risk is that it reflects poorly on the fact that they held up the continuing resolution. held up the budget because they didn't provide enough votes to break the filibuster. voters want a deal on daca. they want democrats to press republicans on immigration, and will not be happy with their members if they don't do that. here's the thing about the hostage taking. it's not rooting for hostage taking, it's not rooting for the democrats, what it is, in a two party system, it doesn't work if one party is afraid of the other party and it doesn't go the other way. one party has said over and over again, we'll shut it down, and the other party is afraid to. that's where we are. >> david trucker, you agree with that? >> i think there's a lot of

truth to that, the democratic base is itching for a fight and they're very concerned about the daca issue, they want their party on the hill to use the budget as leverage. we're having trouble coming to an agreement not on a long term spending plan, and not just on daca, but on a four-week spending plan to buy them time for negotiations. part of the problem is that there is not a lot of trust to go around. republicans don't trust the president, never mind democrats, and the president has a habit of agreeing to -- agreeing with whoever he's talking to at the moment, and then his mind can change and he reassesses. after other people have rushed back in to tell him, that's not what you want and that's not what your base wants. at the same time, you have members on capitol hill that have their own agenda and their own concerns, i think right now what both sides are trying to figure out is, how does this benefit us and what are the

risks. republicans feel confident for the first time in a long time, because the shutdown in a sense would be driven or you could explain it as being driven as a minority of democrats in one chamber of congress. >> we'll get to you in a moment. i need to get to the senate floor, mitch mcconnell is speaking now. >> in the house amendment to the senate amendment. he's not speaking any more. >> signed by 17 senators. by unanimous amendment -- to the senate amendment 195, shall be brought to a close. the yays and nays are mandatory under the rule. >> listen, he was speaking moments ago, we missed it. we expect chuck schumer to come out at any moment, you'll have to roll with us, it could be a little bit frenetic. it sounds like -- is this the vote underway? >> mr. booker? let's see what's happening. stand by. >> mr. boezman.

mr. brown? mr. burr? miss cantwell? mrs. capito. mr. cardin? mr. carper? mr. casey? >> so getting some clarification, yes, this is the vote that's happening now. mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer will speak afterwards, everyone stand by, will the government shut down, we'll find out momentarily. >> mr. coons? mr. corker? mr. cornen? >> aye. >> ms. cortese-masto?

mr. cotton? mr. crepo? mr. cruz? >> aye. >> mr. danes. >> as we -- as a vote, we'll continue our conversation. sorry, david, to interrupt you, did you finish your thought? >> it's not a problem. don, look, i think the bottom line is that once you get this close to a shutdown, into a government shutdown, it's no longer about the policies that brought you to the brink, it's about who blinks first, whoever blinks first ends up weaker in the next round of negotiations, that is governing all of the decisions both democrats and republicans as well as president trump are making as we go forward. >> molly, i want to bring you in here, and get what you think of

this conversation, here we are at the once again, really at the 11th hour, this really is at the 11th hour for this, and we're voting on something that's very important to the american people, i don't remember this happening with any other administration, there's been a lot of drama, we didn't necessarily have to be here. >> well, look, i wrote all of my big papers in college by pulling all nighters the night before, so i certainly understand needing a deadline to get things done. that was certainly the case in the previous administration too. we had constant governing by crisis. constant deadlines and blowing the deadline and negotiating over how long you were going to need until the next deadline, that you would also blow through, but to go back to your original question of what is wrong with these people, why can't they get their act together? this is a case study in congressional dysfunction. it makes sense to have gridlock when you have two sides that

fundamentally disagree. this is not that, this is just two sides that can't come together on the things they do agree on, you have a majority of the house and the senate who say they want to continue daca. and there was a deal to do that. nobody says they want to shut down the government, and there was a deal to keep it open. nobody wants to do this constant deadline stuff. a majority of the house and senate want to extend chip. even with all of that, they can't make the deal, and the president who as we've said over and over was supposed to be the guy who makes deals, he's been the deal breaker, he's the one blowing up the deal when congress manages to get the parties up together and get something done. you couldn't get a better example of how bad things are in congress. >> molly, david, i need you to stand by. i want to bring in senator jeff murkily. how are you going to vote? >> it's going on right now, and

well i certainly am going to vote against this one month proposal from the house, but we are going to put forward a one day or a three-day or possibly both continuing resolutions, so that we can keep the government open, but really put mitch mcconnell and trump's feet to the fire for intensive negotiations to get this done. >> why are you willing to shut down the government tonight? >> we're not shutting down, we will propose to keep it open for one day or three days about. >> he bragged about how it's good for america to have a shutdown. you know who's in power, it's the republicans in the house and in the senate. and in the presidency. >> so listen, did democrats screw this all up, why not take this win on the children's health insurance program, keep the government open for a month, and try to tackle daca later on? >> to address the issues, multiple issues that were

neglected. these are things that we were bringing up in august and september, republicans were obsessed instead with shutting down health care for 30 million americans, and then they were obsessed with a tax bill to deliver a trillion dollars to americans. tonight we don't have anything on the opiod epidemic, we don't have anything on keeping our community health centers open. orddressing the health department's needs. we need intensive negotiations to get this done. including members of our community who have been held in limbo for far too long. >> if you need to go, let us know, i'll certainly understand. >> i have my team standing right here to make sure i don't miss it. >> you're good. there are at least three democrats all from red states who support the cr, did they try to win you over? >> no, they didn't. they're, of course, i respect my

colleagues, but as we anticipate, we'll see a number of republicans will be voting with us tonight. this governance is incompetent, it's irresponsible. it doesn't address the needs of the nation, and there's a strong sentiment among republicans and democrats that this is no way to run an operation. no way to run a country. >> the white house is calling this a schumer shutdown, are democrats going to get the blame here, do you think? >> not at all. it's clear who's in charge. when the republicans block the bipartisan bill that we've been trying to put on the floor, and realize mitch mcconnell blocked amendments to prevent a bipartisan proposal from being considered. when the republicans proceed to block a vote on a continuing resolution to keep the government open for one day or three days. this is completely 100% on their hands, they're in charge. deciding to shut down the government. >> season the this why americans

hate washington? the simple task of funding the government can't get done? >> what's absurd in this case, you have three bipartisan proposals more if you count defense. you have bipartisan support for the clinics, bipartisan support for the dreamers, bipartisan support for the health care clinics. it's really just -- it's -- if ever it was simple to close a deal, if the president had any talent to close a deal, this would have been closed today. >> okay, senator. it sounds like they're counting the votes, no? >> i better run. >> all right, bye. >> senator jeff murkily, democrat from oregon, they are counting the votes. i hope he has enough time to get his vote in there. let's bring the panel back in. molly, as they count the votes here. again, it has been a long time

and coming. as jeff zeleny said just moments ago, the president stood and said a year ago tomorrow we're going to help these children, meaning the daca kids. and so one year into it, and nothing has happened. >> i believe sorry to correct you, he was sitting down when he said that, that was at the lunch he shared with senator durbin after the inauguration, yes, the president has been all over the place on this, what i take away from having closely watched his varying stance on the dreamers, he's repeatedly expressed his heart for these kids, he's repeatedly expressed that he has feelings for them, he has compassion for them, he doesn't want to kick them out of the country. he doesn't want to seem heartless, at the same time, he's pulled in the other direction by the promises he's made on immigration and by his base, and by his more hardline advisers, the decision has been to not make a decision. and to put this off and put this off and put this off, and try to

please everybody. of course, you end up pleasing nobody, when you do that, if he really felt strongly about it, the president could have gone one way or the other. we saw him end daca. and then immediately pull back from that and say no, we're going to extend it and make congress do something. he's just been all over the map, you had mitch mcconnell say they would have an easier time getting something done if they just knew what the president wanted. >> i just want to say that senator murkily, we heard him, he did a no. he made it for the vote. he can't blame don lemon and cnn for that. who was that, david swerdlick or david trucker? >> it's david trucker. i was going to say, the only way you're going to get a deal on daca is if the president goes first. the reason that is important, immigration is a hot button issue for the republican base and on the republican side. that they need the cover of the president in order to go forward and take a tough vote, a potentially perilous vote, in

the next few months, many of them are going to face republican primary voters, especially because this president has a habit of changing his mind, even sometimes after a vote is held, what they need is some ainsurance and confidence that the tough vote they're taking is something that's going to result in something. and also, they need the political cover of the president's approval, if they have trouble at home, for helping to legalize and prevent for deportation, 800,000 of these dreamers, they can tell their voters that the biggest immigration hawk in town supported it, they got border security concessions because of it, therefore you should be happy with it too and you shouldn't be mad at me. >> interesting. what's incredible here is we're talking about two issues with very broad public support. 80% of americans say it's extremely or very important for the president and for congress to fund chip. 63% say the same thing about dealing with daca. there's a plan to deal with

both, and yet washington continues to play games here. >> that goes back to the point molly made a few minutes ago, about the idea it's backward and confounding to americans when congress is on the brink of shutdown over issues that they more or less agree on, and where the public is going in one clear direction. i think that the point david made a second ago is key. president trump wants to -- david was right, that republicans need the president to go first, they're unlikely to get that in any definitive way, what president trump wants mostly out of this is to look good. but because he doesn't operate from a set of core beliefs, he's not sure what looking good means in this situation. is it being tough and strong and the guy who sold the border wall and saying, i'm a hawk on immigration. or is it the who's your daddy, benevolent strong man that the protect these wide eyed dreamers from being sent back to their home countries. he wants to be able to claim a

win legislatively, but i don't think he knows what that looks, like, i think we're in this situation you're showing right there on the split screen. >> we're watching the vote happening now on the senate floor. as soon as they have the votes and we know what the grand sum total is, we will bring it to you, i have another polling question for you. 56% of americans believe it's more important to avoid a government shut down that protecting the dreamers. what does that mean for the democrats? are they playing this right? >> this is the thing, although polls show, the cnn poll shows that overwhelming number of americans, including republicans support letting the dreamers stay, that number you just showed indicates that it's not an issue where a lot of americans are going to go to the polls in november. and that's going to be their decisive voting issue, that is why we're sort of in this limbo situation. here's the challenge for democrats, i'll go back to this

idea that when one side over the last however many years has been playing by the marquis of queensbury rules, the other side has been playing by ultimate fighting rules, that's the democrats and republicans, you're not going to be able to sit down at a table and hash out the fine deal points until both sides have a little bit of fear of the other side. even though democrats are risking some things for november by going this way, what they probably have decided here to do is say look, let's let manchin, donley, vote for cloture, and everyone else is saying, let's hold out. >> i want to bring in brian fallin and scott jennings, welcome to the program, here we are brian and scott, in the middle of all of this, what's your reaction. brian first. >> this vote that's happening right now is a show boat, it's a sham, don. they could have had it last

night, in fact, chuck schumer tried to get consent from mitch mcconnell to have it last night. we've known since yesterday this thing didn't have 60 votes, we could have spent today negotiating in good faith on a bill that could have kept it open tonight. this vote's going to go down, and the real negotiating can start. they want mitch mcconnell and donald trump to hold up their end of the bargain and do what they promised several months ago. in december, the last time congress pun theed on the continuing resolution, mitch mcconnell promised to democrats and republicans alike, he told jeff flake to his face he would give him a vote on any bipartisan deal they could strike on daca. senators from both sides of the aisle came up with that deal, mitch mcconnell is refusing to give it a vote on the senate floor. donald trump said just a week ago, he would pass whatever this

bipartisan group came up with, he's gone back on his word on that front. that's why we are where we are tonight. >> some democrats have crossed over. before that, give me your assessment to this, and then i'll ask you the question. >> brian is i think overstating the support for whatever daca deal he's referring to, there's not legislative language that anyone has 60 votes on the floor. i agree there's bipartisan support for getting the deal done for the dreamers. we don't have legislative language that we know for sure would win? we know there's plenty of support for chip, and plenty of support for keeping the government open. which is why it's mind-boggling democrats are voting for those things tonight. all you need to know, joe manchin in west virginia, donnelly in indiana, mccaskill in missouri, jones in alabama. >> they're in red states. >> all of these people live in red states, most of them are on the ballot. that's all you need to know about the politics of this, the democrats are on the losing end

of this message war. that's why people in tough races are crossing over. >> it's not over, gentlemen, until they pound the gavel. but they already have more than 45 votes against cloture, they can only afford how many? 40? >> the thing needs 60 to pass, to go to an up or down vote, so this thing's dead? >> does this mean the government is going to shut down unless there's a hail mary? >> unless there's a measure in the next 90 minutes. >> it's overnight and on the weekend. i expect there may still be -- scott may know if he's in touch with mcconnell. what's really going to have to happen here is, to scott's point, yes, there were some democrats that crossed over and voted for this measure, there

are republicans that crossed over like lindsey graham and voted with the democrats to block this. every pop i'll siefer in the last week, there was an abc poll today that showed by a 20 point margin. the daca measure is supportive according to a cbs poll that came out today, by an 89-11 measure, these kids -- these 800,000 dreamers because of donald trump's decision to rescind the daca program back in december, he made that decision of his own volition, after promising last year he would take care of the daca kids, he's created this crisis, we've had two short term funding extensions of the government, the first time in december, donald trump, remember that meetings with chuck and nancy, where he struck a deal with the democrats in the oval office and said, i'll do a deal with you on daca. in december, there was another short term extension of the

government. mitch mcconnell got 18 democrats crossed over. he promised he would put this daca bill on the floor in joan. democrats have said enough, this is going to be the third temporary extension of the government. you fool us twice, shame on you. >> everyone talked about that meeting today with chuck schumer. he went to the oval office, that was supposedly big, maybe they could work something out. do you think he came out of that meeting saying, this president has promised so much, and democrats said, how -- how can we believe him? every time he promises us something, he does the opposite? >> well, that's the thing, don, i think chuck schumer went to that meeting this afternoon, optimistic, he's had plenty of conversations with donald trump. >> and you know him? >> i worked for him for six years. chuck schumer has had enough conversations by new with donald trump, if you can get him one on one, you can get him to agree on anything.

and that's why he's twice now publicly agreed to cut a deal with democrats and republicans on daca. his chief of staff who's a right wing ideologue. and steven miller who's a 33-year-old hack that worked on capitol hill and was a spokesperson for jeff sessions and is also a right wing ideolog ideologue. so to the extent that chuck schumer emerged from that meeting earlier today, with some glimmer of hope, it's because donald trump can be reasonable because he's reminded of hips own promises that he made to these daca kids. then these ideological staffers in the west wing get back to donald trump and he reneges on his promises. that's why mitch mcconnell himself said the reason we don't have a deal on daca, is because mitch mcconnell doesn't know where donald trump stands on this any more. >> how do you think he's handled himself, and what is he thinking

over the last couple hours or so? >> well, i think he feels like the republicans are in a very solid position as it relates to talking to the public about what they're doing, tonight the vote count will not lie, it will be most republicans voting to keep the government open, and most democrats voting to shut the government down. i see it simply, there are two cakes in the oven here, one cake is ready to eat. one cake is not set up yet, that's the daca bill. i agree with everything brian said about the polling and the support, but the legislative language is not yet ready, it will be ready, and i have full faith that a vast majority of congress is going to pass a fix for the dreamers in the next couple months, and donald trump will sign it, it is not ready tonight. if you want to talk about manufactured crisis, and i heard mcconnell talk about this over the last couple days, why are we dying on the daca hill tonight. no one's going to get deported until tomorrow, we have until at least march. there is no urgency to do daca

tonight. however, there are ten states that are going to run out of chip money, filibustering chip to die on the daca hill tonight, is going to look foolish. >> i want both of you to stand by, i want to get to phil mattingly. you have some news for us? >> yeah, look, i think the big question now is what happens next, here's what we know, this vote is going to go down, it's not been gaveled in yet, there are enough votes -- enough no votes to ensure they won't pass the 60 votes threshold. after this one, there will be another one, it will be procedural, it won't matter in the grand scheme of things. here's what you can expect in the next couple days, assuming this continues to go that long. as many painful votes for democrats that come from red states that are up for re-election in 2018, as they can possibly muster, there is no sense right now on the republican side of things that

mitch mcconnell is in the mood to deal in anyway. they believe the four-week stopgap is the pathway forward, that means they're going to try to make things as difficult as possible for democrats in the days ahead, i will tell you, i had one republican source tell me flatly, a couple hours ago, the wild card in this issue will always be the president, they don't know when the president is going to step in and try to change the dynamic, they thought for a period of time that might be happening, clearly democrats thought for a period of time today, that might be happening, i think there's two things you need to keep a close eye on in the near term, over the next couple days, what is the pain threshold for democrats who are dealing with immigration issue pds. >> does he decide he's had enough, or you talked to house republican leaders, you talked to senate republican leaders, they're comfortable with where they are right now, they feel

like they're in a good place, democrats are out over their skis on this one, i can tell you right now, brian will say the same thing, democrats don't feel that way, they feel like they're having a fight they need to have, as long as those two sides stay in those two positions, this is going to continue for the foreseeable future. >> phil mattingly is on capitol hill, we're going to get back to him in a moment. are we going to sundland? okay, we're having trouble, we're going to go back to scott jennings, and brian fallin. so i was talking about you two guys about knowing the two leaders, the democratic leader chuck schumer and mitch mcconnell, both of you know them. after this they're going to speak. what do you think they're going to say? are you sure they're going to speak? are they going to figure out

something to come with, so the government doesn't shut down? >> you first, brian. >> i don't know, you heard phil report that mcconnell is cooking up another cynical ploy of trying to expose democratic senators from trump won states to as many show boats over the next 90 minutes as possible. maybe you'll see something where he offers a three-week continuing resolution or two-week continuing resolution. let me respond to two things scott said before you went to phil. he said democrats should want to extend the children's health insurance program, that's right, we obviously do, the children's health insurance program, let's be clear, the authority for that lapse on september 30th. democrats howled when republicans went home without extending that program. they held out without extending it on purpose to use it as a bargaining chip tonight. if they wanted to bring it up,

it could pass by unanimous consent, they're purposely attaching it to the cr in order to make democrats have to give up on the dreamers. the other thing scott said, there's no urgency to the dreamer crisis, there's no deadline until march. there's 800,000 kids that came out of the shadows and registered, under president obama, the government told them they would get protected status, they signed up, they gave their phone numbers, home addresses, where their parents live, now the government is telling them they're going to be exposed and rounded up and deported by the act of trust they took when they came out of the shadows. dreamers are losing their status, their deferred status, hundreds of them every day on a rolling basis, it's not just a matter of a march deadline. democrats who meet with these dreamers all the time. and their stories are heart breaking, i would like any of these republican senators that are voting against this measure tonight and acting like it's not

a crisis to meet with these dreamers, you heard secretary nilsson admit she's never met a dreamer, i would think they'd have their minds open, if they met with one of these people impacted by the threats donald trump is making. >> scott, you want to respont to that? >> i share brian's passion on fixing the issue on daca. >> they deserve legal certainty. virtually every republican i know agrees with that, i don't think there's broad consensus in the congress and the white house right now over what that legislative package is going to look like. what we do have consensus on is the chip program, it lapsed last year, the funding hasn't run out, the funding is running out, and 10 states at least are on the hook for this very soon, it strikes me, that if i were a democrat, and i had to go home, and every state has some population of chip kids on this health insurance program, and i have to explain why the government is shut down, you're

talking about pitting 9 million u.s. citizen children versus 700,000 noncitizen daca people. not to den great their status, and denigrate who they are and what they need. when a vote could be had tonight to fix the chip program, i don't see how democrats think they're going to win that argument. you ask what mcconnell's going to say? this man is a study in message discipline. he's going to continue to say all you have to do is vote yes. chip gets fixed, that's a simple message, and i think it's going to sell. if there is a fix and they know that they can do it, why -- why can't they get it done? that's what everyone at home is saying? why can't they do it? >> don. i think we have to be honest here, i don't think the republicans want a daca deal. paul ryan goes around and says he wants to help these kids, and donald trump goes around saying he wants to help these kids.

every action they take is completely to the contrary, just this week the trump justice department filed a motion in federal court seeking to defend donald trump's decision to rescind daca. that was an utter act of bad faith. they could have waited for this to be solved. they threw another log on the fire here. douse some more oil on the flames to inflame the situation, and the democrats are completely reasonable i think in saying that if we don't resolve this tonight, this might be our last point where we have any leverage to exercise in this matter, and march will come and there will be no action taken. scott keeps saying there's no consensus around a daca solution, that's not true. there are seven republican senators that are co sponsors the deal and principle that was struck last week by jeff flake and lindsey graham, alongside dick durbin that they brought to the white house before donald

trump rejected it. there are seven republican co sponsors, let alone how many others may be willing to vote for it, but are not willing to buck mitch mcconnell. if that was given a standalone vote on the floor, it would pass. if paul ryan would put it on the floor of the house, it would pass. the fact that they will not do that is that they're operating in bad faith, they don't want to rescue these 800,000 dreamers. they're worried about offending trump's xenophobic base. >> stand by, sunlan is here with us. >> i'm here at the russell office building. this is a place where many senators came down from their office, they take the short trip over to the u.s. capital, i spoke with a lot of senators as they were enroute there, it's no surprise how this vote is breaking this way, a lot of talk about what the plan b is, and i

have to say, a lot of people did not know what the plan b is. cory gardiner said, we're going to keep continuing to work really end out the clock to midnight tonight, the last 90 minutes after this vote fails, we're going to keep working, see what we can do. no optimism on his part that they would be able to reach any sort of hail mary passage. at this 11th hour, i asked him, would you be in support of potentially a few days short term cr? some republican senators really interested in that, senator inhofe, republican senator said yes, he would be in support of that, they don't want to see any sort of long shutdown, not what a lot of senators wanted up here tonight, i have not seen any democrats pass. just republicans enroute to the vote. the big question is what's the plan b, there are fascinating conversations, if you look down on the senate floor, fascinating huddles going on.

there is this collective oh, goodness what is plan b, we have to figure this out. for many hours, this was the direction that republicans and democrats knew they were headed. right now, they're faced with the reality of having to go there. >> the democrats are supposed to meet tomorrow at 10:00, are there plans for republicans to meet? take us there, take us to this contingency plan and who will be at these meetings? >> we know that democrats in the house are going to be meeting tomorrow. as of now, we don't have any firm plans for any other groups that will be meeting. of course, we know that senate majority leader mitch mcconnell says he intends to keep the senate open and working in the event of a shutdown. he's planned a lot of test votes to force many democrats to take some hard votes as they get through this. certainly negotiating behind the doors, behind closed doors is the most important thing that

will be going on as they get through this this weekend, but as far as the feeling and the tone i'm getting from many senators going out to cast their vote, a little defeatism, the question is, where does this all go next. >> where does it go? it's anybody's guess. so thank you, we'll get back to you. she's standing by in washington. also phil mattingly standing by as well. on capitol hill. the voting is pretty much over, they have not announced the final vote count yet, so we can still say it's ongoing, they're not done yet, they have not pounded the gavel, we don't know what the exact vote is, we do know there are enough votes to defeat this, and the government is expected to shut down to defeat this cr to keep the government open. unless there is a hail mary, unless they come up with some sort of a negotiation, some sort of fix between now and midnight eastern time. chuck schumer, mitch mcconnell

supposed to speak. we're going to carry it for you here. let's continue to discuss this until we can figure out exactly what's going on on the floor, exactly how many votes and you'll know when we know. i want to bring in sarah setmeyer and maria cardona. and selena zeto as well. here we go, everyone, it's very fluid, we could go back to any number of folks, but we don't know. but we're going to go with you now. both sides are there right now, what do you think? >> well, if you're wondering what voters think, i think there's probably a level of expectation that voters sort of expect congress to be dysfunctional. all have you to do is look at what their approval rating is, right? it's like 17%. so they don't expect a lot out of congress. and so i don't know if there's a

big upheaval. i went around before i came out here tonight, and i went around and talked to people, people that were democrats and republicans, about how they felt about this, if they were a democrat, they were still going to vote democrat. if they were republican, they were going to vote for republican. when i talked to independent voters, as you know, those are the important people that swing at a certain point, summer or in the fall, they're still nimble about this, and there's this idea that there's probably going to be so many more crisis between now and november, i don't know that it hurts either party that bad -- that much. as we talk to our other panelists, let me give you a little bit i'm learning from our folks that we have planted there in washington. they said on the senate floor, republicans and democrats are spending more time than usual on the opposite side of the chamber. i guess they're trying to make some sort of deal, win people

over, on the republican side of the chamber, a huge scrum has broken out. with democratic senators cane, stabenow, donnelly, klobuchar, bennett, cardin. the scrum continues to grow. tillis and corker. meanwhile dispatched to the democratic side of the room to talk to elizabeth warren, cory booker, and so on and so on. that's how it works there in washington right so many times that have come down in this short period of time that has come down to the wire. it certainly has been a dramatic year with this administration. i mean this is a mess. do people out in the country, salena, before i bring other folks in, do they feel like no one in washington is doing their job and no one in washington is really listening to them even though many of them may have voted for this president, who they think is hearing them, but the folks in washington may not

be doing their business? >> well, i always think it's interesting in that i think congress, in particular the house of representatives, but also in the senate, they are the most reflective of who we are in our communities, right? and so i think that this congress and this senate is reflective of how polarized we are. and so i don't know that people are that surprised that they're dysfunctional because they understand, like, they're feeling disruptive not just on the republican side, but also on the democratic side. and i don't know that there's going to be that much big repercussion from this. i mean it's hard for the democrats -- i will say this. it's very hard for the democrats to say the republicans shut the government down just because they all voted to keep it open, and they've got some red state democrats in there, including

doug jones, who is incredibly progressive, you know, personally progressive, but he voted for the way his constituents feel. i thought that was an interesting and sort of smart move on his part. >> not all republicans -- i mean most of them, the large majority of them, but not all republicans voted yes. >> i should say that, yes. you need 60. they only have 51. i think that two or three of them didn't vote for it. mccain, graham, and paul. >> tara, go ahead. say again. >> it was also flake, lee, and paul. they didn't vote for it either. >> okay. >> i think that was cover. if there had been enough votes from democrats to put this over, i think mitch mcconnell could have convinced those guys to vote for it possibly. that happens all the time. i know on the house side -- i worked on the house side for

seven years. there would be times where members would vote for something knowing that they had cover, whether they would send it back to committee or vote against an amendment, but then vote for final passage so they could go on record saying they were against certain things, but they end up voting for the whole thing. this is some of that political brinksmanship. what you're seeing with the senators talking to each other in little pockets on the floor. look, no one actually wants a shutdown. this is something that has become the weaponization of the budgeting process and part of the dysfunction in washington that has plagued both democrats and republicans who have been in charge for the last several years now. we haven't had a budget passed in regular order in years, and this is part of why people were upset and voted for donald trump to drain the swamp, to change things like this. but unfortunately trump -- he got -- he derailed what would have been bipartisan efforts, probably would have avoided a

shutdown. he derailed it with his tweets and with the shithole comments last week, and that blew everything up. and democrats saw an opportunity to use that for political leverage to try to get something on daca, thinking that republicans would get the blame for the shutdown because in the past, they have. i think that they're overplaying their hand at this point. the cnn polling today, i think, was very revealing, showing that the majority of americans cared more about stopping the government from being shut down than the daca fix. scott jennings made an excellent point that daca is not imminent right now. you still have a month to fix that problem. it is the schumer shutdown at this point. it's not republicans that are doing this. it's a pocket of democrats that are from very left states, that are holding this process hostage because they want a daca fix now, thinking that that's going to help them, i think, in 2018 and they're standing for something. i think at this point it may actually backfire on them. >> maria, is this republicans giving -- democrats giving

republicans a taste of their own medicine? >> i think it's democrats actually fighting for what the majority of the american people want, and it's actually democrats fighting for what president trump even promised, not just these kids, but promised both the bipartisan group of republicans and democrats who wanted a daca fix, and president trump promised if you bring me a bipartisan deal, i will sign it. quote, i will take whatever heat there is for this, unquote. and then two days later, instead of a bipartisan legislation, he gives us shithole countries. so the republicans are actually on the hook for this. the majority of the american people, we saw this both in the cnn poll as well as "the washington post"/abc poll, by 20 points would blame republicans and president trump on this. and here's another point. you know, we talk about how people out -- you know, outside of the beltway, let's say, how are they going to see this? how are they going to judge this? and, yes, they don't believe

that congress can get anything done. but people do believe that their own member of congress wants to get things done. but president trump campaigned and promised that he would be the deal maker. he campaigned and promised that only he could fix this mess. and here we have a president who was presented with a deal and instead of accepting the deal, he blew up the deal. the other thing is you're not going to see any democrat that has ever said or tweeted or put down in a public statement that maybe a government shutdown is exactly what we need, that a government shutdown is exactly what america needs to fix this mess. trump tweeted that may 2nd of 2017 while he was a sitting president. so there are so many things here -- >> that's a fair point, maria. i think but the republicans in congress who are trying to get this done, believe me, they're not thrilled with the trump tweeting.

yeah, that's how we got here in the first place. >> right. >> i think everyone was happily on track to avoid this, and then trump tweeting and those kinds of comments because he doesn't really understand how these things work, and he doesn't really care about how republicans look. he cares how he looks. so -- >> agreed. >> in this instance, this is what's making it so challenging. you saw mitch mcconnell say, look, let us know what you want because we don't know what you want. president, let us know, because they can't function this way if they don't know where the president stands. so that part is fair. democrats -- everyone knows you need 60 votes. democrats are the ones saying, hey, we want daca, and we want it now. and the republicans are saying, well, we can fund children's health insurance, the military, and the government and things that are fiscally imminent that need to be fixed now, and let's do that. and then we can continue to negotiate. i think that's solid messaging. it's tough to sell that to the american people right now. >> i need to get this in. we won't hear from the president tonight. the president will not be speaking, at least not -- he may

release a tweet. we know that he does at any time, whenever he wants to, and there could be a paper statement. but we will not hear from the president tonight in person. salena zito, i want to bring you back in here because we're following this closely. people who are tuned in, zoned in, really interested in politics following this closely. i think many americans maybe more so following because they're concerned about their government being shut down. how much do you think -- how closely do you think the average person, especially republican and trump supporter, how closely are they paying attention to this? >> it's friday night. they might be coming home for a kid's basketball game, or they went out to a movie or binge watching a show on netflix. >> or binge watching "cnn tonight" abowith don lemon. >> of course. that goes without saying, right? that does not say that people aren't interested and they're not paying attention to this. of course they are. this is part of their lives. this is part of culture.

this is part of, you know, civic engagement. but they don't watch it and obsess over it in the way that we do. a lot of times people say, well, there goes congress again, and i know in "x" amount of days that we'll be back to the -- eventually the budget has to get fixed. i'm not saying that's a great place to be, but unfortunately as part of our culture, that's sort of where we are right now. i personally don't particularly care for it. but, you know, both parties are in this sort of disruptive populist movement, and so they're okay with this -- not okay like, yeah, this is great. >> it's par for the course at this point. >> yes. thank you. i lost my words. that's what i was trying to say, yes. >> it's not very often that -- >> status quo. >> it's not very often that you have salena zito, who writes and speaks for a living, who's at a loss for words when it comes to this. but i think many people are at a loss for words.

there has been so much drama. we've seen so many of these votes. we saw it with the health care vote. we saw it with this. we saw it with taxes. so there's been a lot of this in a short period of time. so much drama, so much down to the wire. and americans are wondering, not that the government hasn't shut down before, but in this amount of time, there has been a lot of drama. let's get to the top of the hour. it's 11:00 here on the east coast. i'm don lemon. we're live with the breaking news. i want to get to cnn's phil mattingly. phil, they voted. there's a pause. what's going on? >> reporter: obviously the vote is still open. we've seen a number of smaller groups develop on the senate floor, bipartisan groups, groups that included senate democratic leader chuck schumer at one point, some moderate democrats immediating with some moderate republicans. at one point senator schumer pointing out senator lamar alexander, senator lamar a known

republican and a deal maker. then just a few minutes ago, senator schumer and mitch mcconnell walking off the floor. there's not a ton of detail in terms of what's actually going on right now, but i just spoke to a staffer who was on the floor, has just walked off the floor and told me essentially they're trying to figure something out right now. it doesn't mean they're going to get there. by all accounts, things are still in a pretty bad place. but the recognition, the reality of nothing kind of sharpens the senses like a near-death moment or a near-death experience. right now people are on the floor trying to discuss a pathway forward. and as i noted, the two most important people in the united states senate, the senate majority leader, mitch mcconnell, the senate democratic leader chuck schumer walked off together off the floor with their staff. how is this going to end up? it's an open question but what's important to know is while this vote is clearly going down, the votes are already cast with the exception of john mccain, who is absent. and senate majority leader mitch

mcconnell who for procedural reasons hasn't cast his vote yet, there's still time left tonight. and people are talking. i will note people have had the opportunity to talk, and people have spoken throughout the course of the day with the same deadline intact. and they haven't reached any kind of deal yet up to this point. but the discussions are actually happening, and we're going to have to wait and see if they will actually lead to anything. >> you said there's still time, phil. what do you mean? >> reporter: well, it's 11:00 p.m. the government shuts down at 12:00 p.m. i think one of the interesting elements of the senate, as slow and kind of slogging pace that at times it can have, the senate can move very, very quickly if it wants to move very quickly. again, there's no deal that's been struck. these are just conversations, and people are largely flying blind right now. staff doesn't have their phones on the floor, and senators clearly aren't yelling up into the gallery telling reporters what's actually happening right now. but should something develop, if every senator agrees to move forward on something, you can

skip a lot of procedural steps and actually move something forward. so here's the most important takeaway right now. the procedural vote, it's going down. no question about it. however, during the course of this vote, there have been several bipartisan conversations including a private conversation off the floor between mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer. people are trying to do something. will they succeed tonight? will they succeed for something in the future? that's the open question right now. but keep a very close eye on this. votes are not normally open for this long. >> right. >> these types of bipartisan meetings on the floor with so many different groups of senators, pockets of them meeting together, is not something you normally see in this type of scenario. >> you say it's not over yet, meaning the vote is still open and folks can change at this point. some have not voted at this point, correct? >> reporter: there's no expectation this vote is going to change. this procedural vote is very clearly going down. obviously if they wanted to,

they could change their votes. the expectation, though, if something were to be reached, would be that they could bring something up after this. this doesn't preclude them from doing something after this vote. again, i don't want to say that's going to happen. i would just say that conversations are happening, conversations tlouhroughout the course of this day haven't been happening. they are happening right now at the last minute on the senate floor. >> i feel you because this is open for a long time. usually by now we would hear whether it passed or failed. i want you to stand by. let's bring in jeff now. the latest from the white house, we're hearing, jeff, we're not going to hear from the president in person tonight. that doesn't mean a tweet or maybe a paper statement. what's going on at the white house? >> reporter: don, just as we were coming on the air, you can see the lights actually went off behind me here, those lights that illuminate the outside of the white house. there are still some lights on inside the white house. what that means essentially is the white house is done for the evening. we are told by officials here that the president is not going to be making a statement on

camera of any kind tonight. officials here will not be as well. we do expect a written statement of some sort. when that happens, we will of course bring it to you. but beyond that, the white house is essentially out of this game for the moment. this is something that is unfolding. as phil was just saying there, this is one of the most fascinating times in washington, really one of the few times when members of the senate are on the floor in a moment like this. and it's fascinating to watch as you've been talking about, don, the republicans and democrats coming together and talking, having conversations. people watching from home, they might be wondering why doesn't this happen all the time? why didn't this happen earlier? it's a good question. it's what's called dysfunction right in front of our eyes there. the reality here at the white house is not expecting anything other than a shutdown at midnight tonight. they do say the fact that it's going into a holiday weekend -- or a weekend, excuse me, will not cause a lot of disruption. they hope that there is a vote over the weekend before there is

actually any, you know, hard, concrete examples of shutdown effects at national parks and other matters. but essentially at this point, no one here expects anything other than a shutdown come midnight, don. >> all right. we're going to keep jeff there. we're going to keep phil, and we'll check back with them if need be. thank you very much, gentlemen. i want to bring in now david rohde. rebecca berg is with us as well. scott jennings back with us. so thank you all for joining us this evening. again, here we are down to the wire. so, scott, you're getting some information from senator mcconnell's office, mitch mcconnell. what can you tell us? >> well, there are conversations going on as the reporters indicated, and in fact one conversation that occurred was lindsey graham, who of course voted against the original deal here on the floor tonight, apparently went to mcconnell and said, we could do a three-week extension and give ourselves a little more time. mcconnell concurred with graham. they took it to schumer who said

i cannot sell this to my caucus. so there was a little bit of a movement there to try and maybe get a three-week extension, but chuck schumer told the republicans, i can't sell that. it goes to show you that conversations are still going on. people are skeptical that something could happen in the next hour, but clearly people are trying, and that should be encouraging if you care about the government shutting down at midnight. >> i have it here. it says lindsey graham offered a compromise idea calling for a continuing resolution through february 8th. again, this was before the vote. he said in a statement, i believe we will need a cr that runs past the week of the state of the union. they wanted to get it done so that if this does go long, the president's not standing there saying the state of the union is shut down. i'm sure that was one reason. again, it was they wanted three weeks in order to keep the government funded and open. david, your reaction to what we're seeing right now on the senate floor and what's playing out in washington? >> i think this is really sort

of governing by base. the democratic party, they don't want to seem like they're rolling again. they want to keep their base energized that worked so well in virginia and alabama. this is our politics today. donald trump is governing by base. it's how do you get your supporters as riled up as possible. >> rebecca, i want to bring you in now. you have lots of sources in washington. are you hearing anything from them? >> absolutely, don. already we're seeing unfolding the beginnings of the political blame game with this potential shutdown, and it's been really interesting to see the democrats, who of course a few years ago in 2013 were saying that a shutdown would bring chaos, now saying that it's necessary to be able to push through an immigration deal. some saying that they don't want the short-term spending solution. they want something longer term. really it's a role reversal from what we saw in 2013. i want to bring up some interesting polling that i was looking at earlier from 2013. after that shutdown, republicans

were widely blamed for that shutdown. of course you remember ted cruz and some others held up the government spending measure over concerns over obamacare even though they were blamed for that shutdown, of course, they won the senate in 2014. so you have to think that some democrats tonight are thinking about the way that played out and what it might mean for them. is this a risk politically that could pay off for them or at least not be damaging for them in an election year. it's very interesting. >> i want to bring in brian fallon now. brian, should the dems take this proposed three-week deal? i have to say this came over as an urgent at 9:16 p.m., and people knew that before they started voting. so i mean are they going to change their minds now? this whole thing with lindsey graham and then lindsey graham saying he couldn't sell it, what have you, this came over at 9:16. anderson was still on the hour. does this matter at this point? >> no. i don't see why the democrats would go for that. three weeks versus four weeks.

it's the same difference. it's just an excuse to punt without dealing with the daca issue. and, you know, i keep going back to this notion that jeff zeleny just a minute ago was talking about, you know, why is it going up to the deadline? dysfunctional government. well, actually republicans and democrats had a deal in place with a week to spare. last week, lindsey graham, jeff flake, dick durbin, bob men endecember, gang of six, three democrats, threen ares, went to the white house to present donald trump with a bipartisan deal that could have solved the whole problem, and trump rejected it. trump previously said i want a bipartisan deal that deals with four planks. i want something on daca. i want improved resources for the border. i want something to deal with family-based migration or what they call chain migration, which is a slur. and i want something to deal with the diversity visa lottery. so the deal that democrats and republicans struck with all four planks, all the issues that

donald trump said were his parameters and he rejected it because stephen miller and john kelly, the chief of staff, told him to. now we're all watching the senate floor. i think it's very unlikely anybody is going to change their vote. he's probably off the floor right now scrambling what's the next thing to bring up. keeping the vote up is procedural for him to bide some time. right now what i expect -- we're talking about looking at the senate floor and talking about chuck schumer, mitch mcconnell talking to each other. the most important person is not on the screen right now. it's donald trump. mitch mcconnell is not going to agree to anything with chuck schumer. they're not going to hatch a deal on the senate floor until mitch mcconnell knows what donald trump will sign. i guarantee in those back channel meetings, somebody is on the phone with mark short or with john kelly, if not donald trump himself, to figure out what he would accept. we need to hear from the president. where is the presidential

leadership? you heard jeff zeleny say that the lights are turned off at the white house, and we're 58 minutes -- or 49 minutes away from a shutdown. there's not going to be any word from the president tonight? he's not going to speak to the nation to explain, even to frame it in his terms about why the government is shutting down? this is a complete abandonment by the president, who said he was the master deal maker. >> he's going to mar-a-lago tomorrow to host an event. >> do we have jeff zeleny? >> with $100,000 per couple. maybe that will work in our favor because he wants to get down there to host that event. but he should be negotiating right now with senators on both sides of the aisle and coming up with a deal. mcconnell and schumer cannot solve this until they know where donald trump stands. >> we're going to work to get our white house correspondent back and try to get some of your answers, brian, because i think that that is true. where is the president? what is he doing? we have about 46, 47 minutes until the government shuts down, and the president has not spoken.

they said that he will not be speaking tonight. maybe there will be a paper statement. maybe a tweet. we don't know. but i'm sure the american people would like to know from their leader what's going on. how does he stand on this? let's bring in -- >> hey, don. >> is that scott? go ahead, scott. >> i just wanted to respond to brian real quick on the president. brian said they won't accept a three-week deal. they don't want this deal that's currently on the floor that passed the house by a big margin. the only thing they will accept according to brian is to stick a daca fix in there, whatever that looks like. i'm not aware of the legislative language it would be. let's just pretend there is a document floating around. so that's the only thing they will accept. otherwise, it is permanent shutdown. it is indefinite shutdown. what is there to negotiate? what would you have the president do if the only thing the democrats will accept is this one thing and nothing else? there is no negotiation. this is just simply the democrats saying, we will keep this government shut down indefinitely until we get the one thing we want and only one thing. >> how about eassure the

american people that if the government does indeed shut doufdon down, that he has it, it will be fine. they will get their paychecks. it won't affect the military. they're going to work something out with daca. this might be the final moments and congress may be ineffectual in his sight, but he is the leader, the commander in chief. he's there to make the american people feel good. this will be okay. you can all go to bed and go about your business. i've got it. i'm the big guy. that's usually what presidents do. why not this president? that's been the expectation of every single president before him. >> yeah, i think the thing about a government shutdown is the whole government does not shut down. in fact, very little of it actually shuts down. as brian said earlier -- >> scott, you're avoiding my question. respectfully, scott, you're avoiding my question. >> no, i'm not. you're asking -- >> i think most people get it. we've explained that. it's going into -- we're on the

weekend. so if it's going to happen, this is probably the best time for it to happen because most government employees don't work on the weekend. >> yes. >> that's fine. we all get that. we're talking about the president of the united states. we're 45 minutes away from the deadline for a government shutdown, and they have said -- this is the reporting and this is from the white house, as they call it a lid, meaning you're not going to hear from the president, who every single person in this country wants to hear from. where is the leadership? that's all i'm asking. i'm not asking you about the effects of a government shutdown. we can debate that. we're talking about the president. >> i think -- i think he did show some leadership today by reaching out to schumer and trying to have a conversation. and i think the administration has tried to inform the public, as you pointed out, don, about what would they do if a shutdown occurred. mick mulvaney was talking about making plans -- >> mick mulvaney is not the president. >> but i'm not sure what the president would say tonight that

would satisfy the democrats. i'm not sure what give and take there could be because -- >> all right, scott. i understand. i'm not talking about appeasing the democrats or republicans. i'm talking about appeasing democrats and republicans and the american people, those who voted for them and those who didn't, because he's the president of the united states and offering at least some clarification and some way forward as to what happens next and how he and his administration plan to handle this. that's it. that's all i'm asking. i need to get back to the white house. let's get back to the white house. i think that's a very important question. jeff zeleny is standing on the lawn. jeff, you said before we went on the air, right at the top of the hour, the lights went off at the white house. we got this notice saying there's a lid. where is the president? why aren't we hearing from the president, from the administration? a government shutdown is imminent. >> reporter: don, good evening again. sorry for not being here before. i went back into the white house actually to see if anyone was

around. i can tell you the offices that we can interact with, the press secretary offices, they are closed. i am told there is going to be a statement at some point coming. it could be held up a little bit by what is happening there on the floor. if there is indeed something happening here. but, look, we did not expect to hear from the president this evening. i would expect that he is in this building mind behind me he. our lights are shining in his windows. the lights at the front of the house are indeed not on right now. usually it's closed by 11:00. we are not allowed in here usually after about 10:30 or so. so we are being allowed in a little bit later than normal. this is something we're going to have to hear from the president on. the president said himself -- i was doing some research on earlier shutdowns. we all remember that 2013 shutdown. when donald trump was a private citizen, he told fox news during an interview then the president will own this shutdown. of course speaking of president obama. so certainly the same rules hold

true that this president indeed owns the shutdown. now, of course there will be blame placed across both sides, democrats and republicans. but he is the one in charge here. so we are watching to see what he will do tomorrow morning. will he call another meeting? will he try and bring people together? he also wanted to get down to florida, to mar-a-lago. he has a big one-year anniversary celebration, a major fund-raising dinner where big donors are flying in, have already arrived there. as of now, his trip is off. something would have to dramatically change by tomorrow morning. but, don, we are not expecting to hear from him. perhaps a tweet or something, but that would be the extent of it tonight. again, not that unusual. i don't remember other presidents on the cusp of a shutdown also coming out to speak to our cameras, but that does not mean, of course, we wouldn't want to hear from him perhaps if he's watching. he certainly is the one who has to, you know, weigh in at some point on this in a leadership role. >> the lights are off, but somebody's home. they're just not talking to us.

thank you, jeff. i appreciate it. phil mattingly is on capitol hill now. i understand there is a good faith effort to try to get somethi something done and that's your reporting. >> i'm trying to sus out what's going on on the floor right now. the senators aren't super forthcoming when they're down there, a there. here's what i've gotten up to this point right now from people directly involved in the process. the talks, i'm told by several people, are real. we've obviously seen this play out in front on live television. bipartisan groups of senators getting together. mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer walking off the floor at one point. senator schumer walked back onto the floor. what i'm told is while the talks were real and while some people considered the talks productive, at this stage it is too late and there's not enough space to reach any kind of deal to keep the government open before midnight. so this is the basic state of play, don. over the entirety of this day,

there have not been a lot of at least rigorous talks between the two parties. senators schumer and mcconnell have spoken by phone at least one. other than that, there hasn't been a lot of communication between them or their offices. they're obviously all talking right now, but i think they've gotten to the point right now whereas brian pointed out, the issues for democrats haven't just changed. it's not a date change type of issue in terms of how long a short term funding bill would be. this he want very specific policy proposals, very specific commitments. those are commitments republicans aren't willing to make at this point in time, and they certainly aren't willing to make them on the senate floor in the middle of a vote. the fact that people are getting together in groups and talking, don, we're about -- i do want to point out something else. this is really a kind of important aspect of all this. where the president comes down on this will determine where this ends up going. where the president agrees that republicans should go to try and

meet democrats somewhere will determine where this is going. and the conversations between democrats and the president in the hours or days or however long this goes in the future will determine how this all plays out. how those are going to happen, we simply don't know at this point. we got a taste of it this afternoon for a short period of time, but obviously a lot more is going to have to happen to resolve. right now is just a bridge too far between the two parties. >> phil, so what determines where all of this goes? nothing can happen without leadership from the white house. so just one reason i was wondering where is the president because mitch mcconnell, lindsey graham, they're not going to sign off on something that they're not sure that the president is not going to approve or like. so that's one reason i'm asking where is the president? why isn't he speaking out about this if why aren't we going to hear from the white house? without leadership from there, none of this means anything, correct? >> i think it's an important point to make. i deal with the lawmakers.

i don't deal with the president and his team on a regular basis. mitch mcconnell has said it plainly for the last two weeks when it comes to the d.r.e.a.m.ers, to the daca issue. there is nothing republicans are willing to do on capitol hill right now until they know exactly what the president is going to sign. he is the leader of the party. he determines the agenda. he's the one that kind of sets the tone for everything that's happening. and i also think they are very clearly aware that they don't want to get in front of him on anything because what happens if he decides that this is something he doesn't like? then they will be attacked. then they could be undercut. i think everybody is very careful with how they interact. i will note i've been told by multiple people, mitch mcconnell and john kelly have been in regular contact throughout the day, through all the white house discussions with senate democrats, with chuck schumer. the contact goes back and forth. the line is very open between the two institutions. but i do think, don, you make a really key point.

the president will determine where republicans end up in the end. republicans are very comfortable with the position they're in right now. they have a house passed bill. that's what republican leaders in the house and senate believe should be their position from now and going forward. but if the president moves off that, republican leaders are likely to follow. >> quick question before i go back to jeff zeleny about where the white house is on this, and specifically the president. so at midnight, is it automatic that the government shuts down if they haven't reached some agreement, or is it still in play until they decide something and they close this vote? >> yeah, so technically, yes. but i think obviously there's nuance to that, right? first and foremost, it's a weekend. so i actually think that's giving some lawmakers a little bit of space because the biggest issues are the 850,000-plus federal workers that would be furloughed immediately. well, they now have a couple days until that would actually happen. some of the institutions or entities that this would be involved with, they would be closed on the weekend, so they don't have to worry about that

as well. but, no, it's not contingent on this vote or when this vote closes. >> got it. stand by. jeff wondering where is the white house on this, where is the president. i understand you have some information for us. >> reporter: we are getting the first reactions from the white house to this vote in the senate. and exactly what phil was just saying there as you were talking. what is the president going to say about this? that will tell us a lot about the direction where this now goes. now, we do just have a tweet moments ago from white house press secretary sarah sanders. i believe we have that for you now. if not, i'll read it to you. it says this. democrats can't shut down the booming trump economy. are they now so desperate they'll shut down the government instead? #schumershutdown. in those very few words there, we are getting an indication at least, an early indication, of the president and the white house's strategy here. blaming the democrats. of course that's not a surprise. this is an echo of an earlier tweet we heard from the

president saying they're trying to shut down the trump economy. one thing we don't see, though, in the tweet from the press secretary, don, is any mention of the republicans who also voted against this plan. the republicans, including senator lindsey graham and a few others, who also do not believe this is the way that business should be conducted in washington here. but we are getting a sense, as phil was saying, you know, to look for those signs from this president, we are getting a sense at least from his advisers what they're going to do. go after the democrats. but when the sun comes up here in washington, and i expect it will tomorrow again, what is the strategy here because they do need to craft some kind of a deal here. so the #schumershutdown was something we heard about 12 hours or so ago, and then senator schumer came over for a meeting. that seemed to go fairly well at least by those standards, but obviously nothing came of it. but digging their heels in the sand here. partisanship tonight not surprisingly in washington. >> thank you for that.

we appreciate that. if you get something, let us know. we'll put you right back on the air. i want to get back to rebecca berg, david rohde and brian fallon. my question, david is honestly, i get it. this is politics. this is washington. it's fine. play the blame game. but at this moment when americans are like, what is going to happen? this government is going to shut down. most people are like they don't really know it's the weekend and what effect it's going to have. so they're concerned. don't they want to hear from the president, and don't they want some re-insuranassurance that eg is going to be okay instead of the blame game? why? >> i think the messaging will grate on people. is it going to be the trump shutdown, that hashtag, or the schumer shutdown. this is an opportunity for the president to show some leadership, but this is no surprise that he's not getting into the nitty-gritty of a deal. he's never done that. the tax cut, the repeal of obamacare, the white house was

never offering any specific solutions. it was sort of dumping it on congress to figure out the details. so there's no surprise here. maybe they keep him off camera because, again, this effort to call it the schumer shutdown. but i do think as this goes by, as time passes, they'll expect leadership from the president, and it will become the trump shutdown. it will be -- tomorrow is the anniversary of his first year being president. >> he said in 2013 when the government was on the verge of being shut down, as he said to fox news that people will blame the president. they won't remember who the senate majority leader was, who the house leader was, or whatever congressman or senator. they won't remember that, but they'll certainly remember who the president is. and that is one of the reasons that i'm saying this because, yes, as an american, i want to hear from my president, democrat or republican. at this point, it doesn't matter if there's an "r" or a "d" in front or behind your name. i want to hear from my president. >> you're going to get, you know, a tweet storm, the same

rhetoric. >> i don't want a tweet. i want someone standing there either at the white house, coming out, walking down that red carpet or whatever, and walking up to a podium and saying, listen, i know you're concerned, but don't be. i got this. >> but that's not our politics today. our politics today is listen to my base. i'm going to fight the bad guys. >> you can make this point over and over and over. i cannot make this point enough. i think people at home are frustrated and concerned about this because, listen, we've got 30 minutes, just over 30 minutes left. people want to hear from their president. i don't think you can say that enough. so, listen, is there any chance, rebecca, that over the weekend, that there may be some sort of deal, maybe some sort of clear messaging, some sort of clear leadership coming from washington? >> absolutely, john. it's no coincidence that mick mulvaney, the budget director for the white house, mentioned

today that the weekend does give them some wiggle room. and so congress works best with deadlines, and they don't see today, as crazy as this sounds, they don't see today as a firm deadline because you wouldn't see the full effects of the shutdown until monday. so they really feel they have this weekend to get their act together. that said, as we've discussed throughout the evening, there really is a lot of space between the democratic and the republican position on this. republicans want more time. they want an extension to discuss the immigration issue, and democrats don't. democrats say, we've had enough time. we should reach a deal and get this settled. so how you're going to find the middle ground between those two points is really the question. i don't know how they answer that question between now and between monday. >> brian fallon, i want to bring you back in and talk about is there a chance for a -- i guess there is, for a deal this weekend. and if so, how will that play out? how might that play out? >> well, one good sign, son -- i mean an hour ago we were talking about the idea of the senate

republicans just bringing up one show vote after another to try to put pressure on red-state democrats, and you're not seeing that happen. you're seeing this vote be held open while back channel talks continue off the floor. so that at least is a positive sign. i think in terms of how it might resolve itself over the weekend, i think there's two paths that the democrats, for their part, have laid out. and one is for the president and the senate leadership to take up the bipartisan deal on daca that lindsey graham and jeff flake reached with dick durbin last week. you know, mitch mcconnell won't want to talk about it, but both lindsey graham and jeff flake, two republicans, voted with the democrats against this continuing resolution tonight. but mitch mcconnell -- i think that measure would pass, and according to a poll today, it was 89-11 the public supports rescuing those 800,000 kids that are in limbo right now. but mitch mcconnell can't bring it up if h