people without access to paid sick days are more likely to try to come to work ill as "the washington post" has pointed out. they expose their colleagues and commuters to the virus. thanks to all of you for being part of the program this week. i'll see you next week. i'm brian stelter. it's time for "reliable sources." this is our weekly look at the story behind the story of how the media really works, how the news gets made. this hour, the mueller investigation is tight as a drum. no leaks while the white house is leaking. why is that? and later, the play mate and the president, ronan farrow is here talking about that. "wired" editor summed up this week best. he said america is where the high schoolers act like leaders and the leaders act like they are in high school. unfortunately, two stories have merged this weekend. the pain that we all feel after

the latest mass shooting and the confusion we all feel about the russia probes. these stories have come together. while these grieving students in florida are asking politicians to protect them and announcing a march on washington, the president of the united states is making it about himself. president trump tweeting overnight, it's very sad that the fbi missed all of the many signals sent out by the florida school shooter. this is not acceptable. he is right about thart, but he continued by saying they at the fbi are spending too much time trying to prove russian collusion with the trump campaign. there is no collusion. it's clear he is feeling the heat and he is lashing out and implying that the fbi may have failed to stop the shooting because it's obsessed with russia. the president is insulting your intelligence. let's full up fbi.gov, and the

fbi, 35,000 people. there are a small number of agents working on the mueller probe, but they have nothing to do with the investigation of tips like the one that was missed before the parkland shooting. so where in the world -- at least we know what our federal agents had been doing recently. why they were too busy to stop school shootings. >> this is the fbi that spends all their manpower and resources going after a failed russian conspiracy that never existed and they should be going after bad guys. >> how many agents have been taken off the duty of investigating terror and domestic terror to follow these political dead ends? >> aha. that's where president trump got the idea. yes. this has been a talking point from pro-trump media ever since friday that there is a link between the fbi's failure and the ongoing russia probes. this is nonsensical, but i want you to see what's going on

behind the scenes. that was said on saturday morning, and saturday evening whar what did he say? he was in mar-a-lago having dinner with president trump. when did trump tweet that claim? 11:00 p.m. saturday. you tell me there's a connection there, but the tweets have continued all weekend long. here are just some of the tweets from the president. you look at what he is doing here. he is undercutting his own national security adviser. he is ranting and raving about the fake media. he has got tweets riddled with misspellings and profanity. maybe president trump in person is cool, calm and collected, but on twitter, he sounds deeply troubled and unhinged. this is why questions about his fitness for office are so urgent. this is the biggest story that i see happening right now. so joining me to talk about this and other issues, david gergen.

he was an adviser to presidents nixon, ford, reagan and clinton. and dan pfeiffer, former senior adviser to president obama. both of you have been communications directors for presidents. you have both been inside the white house, so i want to try to assess what we learned from this presidential tweet storm. david gergen, first to you. is this unhinged? >> it reminds me very much of the last days of president nixon when he became deeply, deeply insecure, lashed out in all sorts of ways and didn't remain focused on the job at hand. and this i'm afraid has been president trump's pattern for some time. i don't know why he is so insecure. it certainly suggests as mueller closes in more that there is he very much does not want us to know, and he is very afraid that mueller is going to get there. but i also think, brian, and dan can speak to this as well, the

way the white house runs and people and staff take their cues from the top, from the president. if he is deceptive, if he is dishonest with the public, then what you find in the white house is a culture of deceit and deception and they can't get their story straight, because there hasn't been a story of trying to be straight. >> is that what you see today? >> that's what i see today, yes. i think that we have an extraordinary situation where that tweet you just showed from mr. thompson put it just right. we're under all sorts of assaults and the press has been c chronicling our nation is under assault from the russians. it's not just 2016, but as we head into 2018, our children are under assault in their schools. dreamers are under assault from law enforcement officers and there is nothing -- there is no

moral leadership from washington, from the congress or the white house frankly, and where is the moral leadership coming from? i'm hearing broward county as we speak just a few blocks away from where a thousand people gathered and the moral leadership came from those young 18-year-olds. >> absolutely. so dan, i guess i'm left wondering, why hasn't someone taken away the president's cell phone? why are these tweets still coming out? why isn't there a support structure at the white house to save him from himself? >> trump doesn't want it and he won't allow it. even if you take general kelly who had a lifetime of experience in the military, his job is not to read the president's tweets, but that's like a chief of staff saying, i don't care what the president says because this is president trump's form of communication. and the people who -- there is a selection of bias who ended up working in the white house. the top tier, people who worked for george w. bush or mitt

romney or others have chosen not to be in this white house because they don't trust donald trump, so the people who are there are people who have come from the fox news set and are sort of people who are willing to risk career suicide, risk legal jeopardy for the glory, i guess, or infamy of serving trump. the president's inexperience is showing how incapable they are of doing what they are assigned to do. >> this is from one of the interviews where it was said that it's the media's fault. you all are worse than a hostile foreign government. >> there are two groups that have created chaos more than the russians. that's the democrats and the mainstream media. >> no surprise russia today ate that up. we can put on tweet the tweet from russia today. this is the kremlin-controlled media outlet that was promoting

what was said. ure reaction? >> this is the incentive structure for his staff. i'm sure hogan is a mid level staffer, and got a high five from the president for saying that. whether they are unwitting or witting they are being tools of the russian propaganda machine because they have an audience of one in trump and future career prospects at fox news and that is what is driving this. it all goes back to the president because this is what he wants from his staff. these are the kind of staff he wants, and -- you're doing what he wants them to do. >> to that point, the most interesting devoquote i read wa from "vanity fair." 2 it was an interview with steve bannon and let's put on what he said. he says, the democrats don't matter. the real opposition is the media, and the way to deal with them is to flood is zone with -- you know what.

is that what you see happening? all the tweets and all the messages and all the confusing counternarratives, it's just an attempt to flood the zone like that? >> absolutely. >> i think it's a way to discredits other institutions that may become critical to him. starting with bob mueller. >> with the fbi? >> discrediting mueller, discrediting what may come out throughout justice department through mueller and the press on what we're reporting on what mueller does, so a third of the country will believe it's all overblown or it has been made up or whatever it may be. there is a clear pattern right from the beginning that has actually in some ways worked because it has kept that base together, but it's eroding the trust in the presidency. the trust in this president around the rest of the country, and it has been extremely damaging, i think for our sense of being a single people that we have some sense of unity about

our country, and the russians are laughing at us because they are getting away with this. they are foam ending a lot of this, and there is no sense of urgency, especially ahead. we have an election around the corner this year. what if the democrats take the house back? will that be blamed on fake news? what if they fall short? are democrats going to think, it was all that meddling, and they have won a few seats that they wouldn't have otherwise one. this is what split the country apart, and it is a beginning and many other countries it's the beginning of an authoritarian rule, and that's the larger threat. >> that's a pretty frightening picture you just painted. are you personally afraid of that, david? >> i find it the threat is growing. there is a new book out about how democracies die, and it's quite striking about the number of countries that were led by democratically elected leaders,

but they turned more and more authoritari authoritarian. a dozen countries have flipped from democracy to authoritarianism since the cold war. we're not immune to that. i think we have strong checks and balances and thank good we have long traditions and norms, but we have to protect those, in a bipartisan way. we must come together. those of us who care about the way the country has been run historically, must rally to the kind of standards and the respect for rule of law, and free press has made this country great. >> and dan, last word to you. you have a point of view on your podcast "positive america" coming from the obama white house. you're a vocal critic of trump, but what do you want to see journalists doing in the environment that david just described? >> i think they need to keep doing what they have been doing and aggressively hold trump and his administration accountable. i think the problem here is not a failure of journalism.

it is two things. not just trump, but the republican party has decided they are okay with trump's behavior, the rampant corruption within the administration and doing essentially nothing about an attack on our democracy, and the mainstream media, whatever you call it, are doing their job reporting, but the problem is there is a propaganda infrastructure led by fox news that is a willing participant in covering up crimes and misleading the american people. i agree with david. our democracy is under assault and that assault is coming from 1600 pennsylvania avenue. and we think our democracy can vo survive anything, and these things happen slowly, and suddenly, and we are in a dangerous place, and we need both parties to step up, and the republicans have decided not to do that. >> david and dan, thank you for being here. after the break, we'll look at the right wing media narrative, what dan was just referring to. the talking points we're hearing

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on friday, robert mueller addressed one part of the crime. a grand jury indicted 13 russians with interfering in the 2016 election. now mueller is still investigating other crimes and potential coverups, but the pro-trump media is pretending not to know that. let me show you why these new talking points are so dishonest and pathetic. here's one. here's a talking point that journalists and pundits were saying on friday and all throughout the weekend. there has been no wrong doing by americans. trump world is off the hook. >> i'm reading this. there is just nothing here. >> no american knowingly took part in the meddling. >> there were no americans involved in this, at least as i understand this. >> no americans willingly aided the russian effort. >> but rod rosenstein did not say that. fox news anchor misquoted hype. here's what he actually said. >> there is no allegation in this indictment that any american was a knowing participant in this illegal

activity. >> did you catch that? no claim in this indictment about this activity. he is leaving the door wide open for further indictments and further relati further revelations. he has to because he knows mueller is still investigating. that's why sean hannity is being so disingenuous and he says, it doesn't prove collusion. >> it does not say that donald trump colluded with the russians or anybody on the donald trump campaign colluded with the russian. >> in this process, there was no collusion as you pointed out. >> there was no clooulollusion. there was no collusion yesterday. there was no collusion last year, and there was no collusion that will happen tomorrow. read the indictment. >> he is right that everyone should read the indictment, but these hosts are talking heads are doing a disservice to their viewers when they pretend the probe is over. it's just plain dishonest. if americans are implicated, these guys are just going to

move onto a whole new talking point. they will say something like you can't prove russians swayed a single vote or they will say, this is all obama's fault. actually, they are already saying that. >> are these indictments proof that the obama administration failed when coming to meddling? >> what did they do to stop it? >> where the hell was the obama administration? >> why is there not an investigation of barack obama, john kerry and of course, before him, hillary clinton? it's their scandal. >> they have been scrutinized and rightly so. they warned them about the attack, but there is widespread agreement he should have done before. we have an opinion columnist with "the washington post," and we have a former national security counsel adviser. we know through this indictment

these taactivities started in 2014. do you have regrets personally the obama administration did not do more? >> i left the obama administration by 2014, but all americans have regrets that we didn't do more, but we have to look at the post game, but we have to look at what's going on right now, and my best advice from a national security perspective right now is to unfollow president trump. his twitter feed -- >> to unfollow the president on twitter? why? >> his twitter feed which is arguably u.s. policy is filled with gross inaccuracies, misinformation, disinformation and lies and that makes vladimir putin very happy. his whole goal here is to spread misinformation and divide the american public. >> we're hearing from you on the left and trump on the right saying the russians are trying to sow discord. that's the new talking point that we have to unite as a

country. >> we do, and we have to look at the external enemy which is russia, and the president should start there, and in his tweets not attack the fbi, not attack democrats, not attack the media, and for once say, vladimir putin is hurting our country. what should we do about it? >> also let's talk about how the news broke. why is it is the only office that doesn't leak is mueller's office? >> it was extraordinary, and it was also extraordinary to see rod rosenstein himself out there talking about these indictments. the fact that the media's reaction of trump and his allies is to not talk about what the indictment does say, but to talk about points that it doesn't say and, in fact, doesn't even address. tells you how they were all sort of set back on their heels by this, and you think about the

obvious reaction is to look at what the indictment says, and then to say, how are we going to deal with theris and address th? you look at the president's tweet, and you think about if f.d.r. got on the radio saying that tokyo was laughing at us. that is not what a president is called upon to do right now. >> you know what will happen, and someone will say, how dare you compare this to pearl harbor? >> it is an attack on our country. it is an attack on our country with use of 21st century means and it is definitely a national security threat which is something that the commander in chief is supposed to be dealing with. >> and it is ongoing, which we'll get into later this hour. what are you hearing from your sources in the white house? what i'm struck by, we see every single day, new, shocking leaks

from the white house. you're one of the beneficiaries of those leaks. what do the aides say when he goes on these unhinged tweet storms? >> it's exhausting for folks in the white house, people in charge trying to keep the president in the white house on message. >> it's not just exhausting for journalists, but for them too. >> us too. i think a lot of -- chief of staff john kelly had been fairly successful in tamping down on some of these leaks. obviously they haven't stopped completely, but, you know, taken together with some folks leaving the white house who are known to be good sources for reporters, there was a bit of a stemming of the flow of leaks for a few months, but lately it feels like we have sort of gone back to the early days of the trump administration when it was a free for all. everyone against all, you know, people just sort of trying to win favor and improve their standing in the white house through selective leaks to the press, and a lot of that was

fueled by the rob porter domestic abuse scandal which really shook faith in kelly's regime, and brought out some of the latent elements in trump world that have used leaks to the press and misinformation campaigns and so on to great effect to sort of influence internal politics. >> that's the thing. until wednesday at 3:00 p.m. when gunshots rang out in florida, the porter abuse scandal was the biggest story being covered by the press. there has been less on it since then, but update on where things stand. were there lies that have not been explained by the white house? >> the sense is there is another shoe to drop. people inside the white house are shocked this has gone on as long as it has. this is now a ten-day story here, so given everything else that's happening t indictme, th idictment, a major school shooting and there have been whispers that the president is eyeing replacements for john

kelly. the president has been known to change his mind on a dime on these issues so we're watching and waiting right now, but internally there are a lot of whisper campaigns and, you know, as i said. faith has been shaken so i think everyone is traying ying to rid out, and act on the internal threats that he made, and at this point, it's wait and see. >> one more point i want to make about the dysfunction that journalists are trying to cover. this is something that reince priebus, trump's first chief of staff said with chris whipple. he has a book about this subject, and he said -- priebus said to him, priebus' account of his tenure talked about a trump wous in disarray. here's the quote by priebus. take everything you have heard and multiply it by 50. what did you think when you

heard that comment? to me it said all the leaks we get out of the white house, it's still just scratching the surface. >> it also speaks to a real challenge to us as journalists because if the news flow out of this white house, if the flow of scandals and controversies was anything that was resemble, i think the media would have more time to stand back and analyze each one and try to deconstruct it, but the fact is as you said, we were, you know, right in the middle of being fixated on rob porter and there was a school shooting and then there was a massive set of indictments. i think in some ways it's just coming at all of us so fast that you don't have the opportunity that you might have had in other administrations to really go back and do the deconstruction of how things happen. >> thank you both for being here. sam, stick around please. up next after a quick break

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if today is like every other

day in america, roughly 92 people will die from gunshot wound. almost two-thirds of those deaths will be suicides and the rest will be homicides. some of those murders and killin killings, they might warrant some news coverage for a day, but the deaths that get the most attention are the spectacle murders. the shocking crimes that take over the front page like the high school massacre. this was in "the denver post" in the wake of the columbine killings, but also the same headline over and over again like in florida. let's look at a couple of them. this is "the "miami herald"" in the shooting in parkland. showing the faces of the 17 students and teachers who were killed. a gun control campaign, it placed a giant gun on the cover and said, this is us. this is our country. 17 dead. mre surprising than the daily

news was "the post." this is a murdoch owned paper saying, please act. we need sensible gun control. i was most struck by this one. this is "the boston globe." it says, we know what will happen next. it precovered the next killing and said all we have to know is how many will die next time. it's true. there is a familiar script to how the shootings are covered, but this time did feel a little different. instead of just seeing the haunted aerial images of students streaming out of their classrooms just like columbine almost 20 years ago, we saw something new. we saw upclose video of the shooting and its aftermath from the perspective of the students as the s.w.a.t. team comes into their classroom. notice the shaking arms of the terrified students. it is new to see these climbs

from the vantage point of the victims. that's thanks to their cell phones capturing the footage. of course, it also raises ethical questions for news rooms and one more thing that's different this time. we're hearing from survivors in a new way. these high school students on cnn and other networks this morning announcing a new organization, a new movement they are calling never again. joining me now is the media critic for the baltimore sun to see what is different this time. there is an arm after these mass killings that the press should cover them less and not be excessive in the wall to wall coverage because it might inspire future killers. where do you come down on that? >> i don't buy into this, it's going to inspire future killers because there are all sorts of messages in our media that might inspire future killers. and so we have to. we have to cover them as intensely as we can, but brian,

i do think there is something to be said when minors are involved, and there are certain ways we can protect them. when we interview them, we should try to talk to their parents first. i saw cnn doing that on two occasions. anderson cooper and brooke balduin said they had gotten clearance from the parents before they interviewed. let's do that, and not exploit these children. i couldn't agree with you more. the biggest difference i think in this coverage is the way social media and new media have in some ways empowered these students in telling these stories. we had a freshman live tweeting the event while it was going on. we had a senior recording interviews with people who were hiding in a closet. this one really encouraged me. the internet troll -- social media troll that fox news has

tomi lahren was out tr trying to exploit it, and she said, this isn't about guns and a 17-year-old student said, excuse me. i was hiding in a closet yesterday. this was about guns. i was so happy to see that 17-year-old senior take her down. that's the level of discord -- that's how deep that kind of trolling is that a teenager took her down. that's really empowering. i'm very glad for that, but again, you know, we had excess on the other hand. the "today" show, interviewing a survivor whose best friend died overnight, and asking her how her friend was doing. maybe that's a mistake of the interviewers or the producers, but that shouldn't happen, especially on a show like this. we have to rein ourselves in, but we have to communicate to our audience, the horror of this. some of the social media -- >> about that. the what v and the another is a

headline i saw. it's called "show the dead bodies" show what gun bullets do to people to human beings. again, this is another view of this. one view is cover these less. be careful, and the another view is go further. show people what it looks like. >> brian, i have always felt that way about combat and war coverage. show it because we have to know. most americans don't get involved in it. you can stay out of the military. we have to know what people in the military go through. we should also know what police and people in first responders deal with in this country. it's important, but again, when you are dealing with minors, when you have -- >> right. >> you have children being killed, you have to be careful, and you have to respect a lot of other things, and i think you always have to go through the part pa parents. that has been my policy. i interviewed a woman who was

important. i lost time because i went to her mother first to get clearance and her mother and her had different views on whether she should be in the paper, but i wouldn't print her name in the paper let alone put her on camera without her mother's permission. >> and one piece of this that i thought we would share with the viewers, we have been hearing the name of the school quite a bit, marjory stoneman douglas high school. who is she? she's a real person. let's put her picture on screen if we can just to understand this. i think it's notable this is a journalist turned activist. marjory stoneman douglas was a journalist for the "miami herald" writing about the importance of the everglades trying to provoke the environmental movement, and became more of an activist, and we see the same thing. this line between journalism and activi activism, and some people cross that line and are advocating for change, but back to marjory stoneman douglas from 100 years ago, she was using her pieces in the "miami herald" and her books

in order to affect change. >> that's a conscious by a journalist. if you are anchoring coverage to of this, or you're involved in live rolling coverage, it could be for hours after the event, you keep it straight. you present information. we know legacy values give citizens information. it has been verified that they can make decisions about their own lives with, and, you know, if you are a parent or anything, you need this information. keep it straight. later, you can go into opinion. i see a lot of anchors right in the middle of it going into opinion, and that troubles me. keep it later, and this is the crisis we had with this election. remember the piece in "the new york times" during the 2016 election that said, if you are a journalist and you feel trump is bad for this country, should you remain objective or become an activist, and a lot of journalists have decided in a way to become activists.

that's a big decision. maybe you leave journalism or you go to a platform where you can do that kind of activist journalism, but whatever you do, you have to be clear with the audience. tell them where you are coming from. tell them what your values are because unfortunately, people are confused now about where the information is coming from. >> right. right. definitely. thanks so much for being here. if you are at home, you're curious about douglas, google her and look up her life story. it is fascinating. thanks so much. after a break here, why a story about the president and a playmate has everybody talking about something called catch and kill. im explain this tabloid tactic right after a commercial break. there are two types of people in the world. those who fear the future... and those who embrace it. the future is for the unafraid. ♪ ♪

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ronan farrow is describing an alleged affair between now president trump and karen mcdougal, and he has stories about the payment and system he says exists. i'm joined now by ronan, and he is also working with hbo now. this piece came out on friday, and it has been anticipated for awhile. you have added a lot of new details about this affair. how did you get ahold of these documents? >> a friend of karen mcdougal's, john crawford was present when she wrote those notes and all the -- ultimately did give them to us, and it was to sell the story. women sign into those contractucontrac contractual situations, and she feels a sense of regret, and she feels constrained in what she can say.

she did a thing, and she believes this exposes a system of contracts to keep women quiet through trusted intermediaries like "the national enquirer" and this company, ami, and there are security implications when that system works in the favor of the president. >> they say that your assertion is laughable, and the idea that "the enquirer" could have any assertion over the president is laughable. what do you say? >> we gave them ample time to give their input, and those are in our story, and people with judge those as they wish. we quoted six ami stories and they are quoted on the record on this piece, and they say this is a common tactic and the way it plays out, brian, is when this company has dirt on a celebrity or in this case, the most powerful man in america, it is used for leverage. was a term they used over and over again. it is used to influence those

people. >> in order to help their friends and hurt their enemies is the point. >> this would appear what happens in the relationship between david pecker and donald trump. pecker has on the record said, you know, he is loyal to trump, you know, that he does work on his behalf in some ways. now, you know, they talk about a negative side to that. this company knows where the bodies are buried, so even working in a friendly way to bury a story for someone, they have the dirt and can release it. >> i see what you are saying. we followed up with a former american media executive, and spokesman for the company. here's what he told me about catch and kill. >> as far as these stories being killed, or bought and killed, it is something that has been going on for a long time at not only these magazines but other publications. it takes the story out of the market so it won't see light of

day. >> in a that case, and that catch and kill case, how common is this? how many other stories has the enquirer caught and killed to protect president trump? >> broadly speaking the former ami employee we talked to said this is a fairly are yroutine practice. one of them was arnold schwarzenegger, and tiger woods. >> and you helped break the weinstein scandal hope, and he had a close relationship with pecker as well. >> the chief content officer, nf your banner, also had e-mails between them, and that was part of the reporting that he was calling women that harvey weinstein was targeting. >> is that how you were able to score this story about trump and his alleged affair? because of the story about weinstein, people trusted you to talk about this? >> i was moving in a world of sources that had ties to the players involved in both, and,

you know, that's not accidental, brian. these are both stories that reveal a system that in some cases is deployed to silence women with difficult stories about powerful men. >> in the end of your piece, you talk about every woman who is no longer silenced, she makes a difference. she makes progress. >> so right. and i don't say that. it's karen mcdougal who says that, and, you know, people will judge her in a lot of different ways, and she knew that going into this, but she told me she felt braver after seeing women come forward and speak truth to power and she hopes her speaking will cause other women to think twice before signing into the same vow of silence. >> people want to know if you have more stories like this in the works. do you? >> i'm a reporter. i'll keep reporting. >> on trump? >> i don't comment on stories --

>> and you have been looking into other media executives. >> i think if you subscribe to "the new yorker" you will see. >> good to see you. thank you for being here, and i understand why you want to keep it private even though we would like to know. after the break here, we're going to try to tie back the stori stories here, including parkland, and the russia probe. another connection between the two right after this break. get the lowest price when you book at hilton.com

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mueller's dime showed it was part of the propaganda machine. >> in the hours after the shooting it was russian bots pushing out gun rights, etcetera. >> i was struck by something mark warner said. he said we each bear some responsibilities for a healthy amount of skepticism when it comes to the dhipgs we read and share on social media. it is becoming more and more true every day. one of the things it's about, news literacy. news rooms have a role and so do

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all for action. >> people are dying every day. >> a demand for clang afthange florida's deadly high school shooting. we'll speak with