♪ . >> i'm michael smerconish in philadelphia. we with el come viewers from the occupation and around the world. just when a week for the president you thought could not get worse it did. he was taped by his own lawyer about a payment to karen mcdougall. the president's strikeout after doing damage control with his

helsinki tropical storm humberto. president trump may have made things worse when he devated from the script. overlooked by many, the seven words he refused to say. which i think provide great insight into his view of the russian cyber attack. and after his performance was panned, the president renewed his charge that the media is the real enemy of the people. this week when sarah sanders didn't like a question, a reporter stood up for his colleague. movies adopted by birth, they didn't know ab each other until they met at eej 19, the story took a dark turn. i'll talk about the director of three identity cam strangers. but first a bad week for the president ended even worse, reporting friday by the "new york times" the president's lawyer michael cohen, secretly recorded a conversation with trump two months before the elect in which they discussed

payments to a former playboy model karen mcdougall who said she had ap affair with trump. this conversation was about a month after the parent company of the national enquirer ami paid mcdougall $150,000 for her story and did not pub learn it in a practice known as catch and kim. today the washington post says in the 90 second conversation, cohen can be heard trying to consider buying the rights to mcdougal's story. trump tells one person with only in of the recording, the post also reports that trump was largely silent in the conversation. the recording was a part of the evidence seized by the fbi when it raided cohen's homes an offices in april. according to "times" prosecutors want to know if it's evidence of any campaign finance laws and it would seem to critic the trump campaign denials of any

knowledge about the affair and payment to karen mcdougal when the "wall street journal" first report the story, four days before the election. at that time hope hicks said this we have no knowledge of any of. this she said ms. mcdougals claim was totally untrue. it raises more questions than it answers, not the least of which, why would the president's own lawyers tape it? will the subject matter be protected by the attorney/client privilege? might the president face a more perilous soigs situation in new york's second district than the mueller probe. from the perspective of prosecutors, perhaps the biggest question is whether any payments were made to protect the family or to influence the outcome of the election. the last time the president's voice was heard on an embarrassing tape, the subject matter was more carn am. in that case, he emerged

unscathed. while the person who whom he was speaking lost his job. whether this ends the same way? well, that remains to be seen. go to smerconish.com, answer today's survey question. will the contents of michael cohen's recordings hurt or help? i'll give you the results at the end of this hour, joining me now a trial lawyer, named by the national law journal as a top ten litigators in pennsylvania. he teaches at lastings, stanford, berkeley and the penn law schools. full disclosure, i'm afilmiated with his firm of klein and spector. i need to show you a remarkable tweet from president trump from earlier this morning. put it on the screen inconceivable that the government would break into a lawyer's office early in the morning almost unheard of, each more inconceivable they would take a client, totally unheard

of ap illegal. the good news is your fate president did nothing wrong. this pli brings it to a few level, there not now a public war between the two? >> yes, mike, there appears to be. this is a surprising tweet from the president he suggests his former lawyer, michael cohen, committed a crime. >> you teach rules of evidence to law students. so take me into the classroom. explain to me the attorney-client privilege and the significance of this news about trump being taped by michael conabout karen mcdougal? >> well, the significance ability this tape is that it may indicate there was criminal conduct by either president trump or michael cohen or both of them and the way we get there is the following. we start with the attorney/client privilege and the attorney/cleept privilege

says a communication between an attorney and a client for the purpose of receiving legal services is privileged from disclosure to others. but there is a narrow exception to the attorney/client privilege and that is where the communication is in furtherance of a crime or of a fraud and that brings us to this tape that has been described in the "new york times" and the washington post today, including by the president's tomorrow rudy guiliani as concerning a discussion between president trump and his then attorney michael cohen about a claim that was being made against then businessman donald trump. >> that communication would plainly be an attorney/client communication. cohen representing trump in connection with a claim being made by mcdougal some that then

raises the question, how can this be lawfully released? and it can be lawfully released if the conversation was in furtherance of a crime or a fraud by mr. trump or mr. cohen or both of them. >> so the privileged conversation put up that second slide again, i love the way he's walked us through it. a privileged conversation may be lawfully disclosed if the court has found it to be in furtherance of a crime or fraud. we don't know how this ended up in the public domain, but are you pos iting the idea that perhaps it's because the special master looking over the totality of all that evidence seized from cohen has determined it falls under the crime/fraud exception to the attorney/cleept privilege in smr meek, that's exactly right. the federal judge on april 26th

of this year appointed former federal judge barbara jones to inspect the tape recordings and the documents that were seized from michael cohen on april 9th of this year. and she has ruled that almost all of these documents and things are not privileged, including a ruling just this past week that over a million such items were not privileged. and it stands to reason that this tape recording may have been one of those items. >> okay. read the tea leaves now. who would have motivation to put this in the public domain? >> michael cohen. he would fought be permitted to do -- >> why? >> first of all, he would not be permitted to do so before now, because the communication is privilege that the crime fraud

exception applies. he has a mote have aition to put this out publicly, for two reason, one to sew his cooperation ap assistance to the government in building a case against the president and second if he still entertains the thought that the president might pardon him, the putting of this tape in the public domain is a pressure point op the president that he can do the president great damage. >> this story as per the tweet and your reaction to it has taken a dramatic turn today. true? >> yes, it really has, michael. it's extraordinary that the president would suggest that michael cohen has committed a crime in relation to the tape recording of this conversation, which, by the way, appears to have occurred in new york state, in which there is one party consent him i'm sure that president trump knows that, because he's been involved,

himself, in tape recording and making statements, going back to when he was a businessman and going into radio shows and the like. he hoes the law on tape recording others. so not only is he wrong in suggesting that cohen committed a crime in recording him, but to accuse his former lawyer, who simply said may have the goods on him of committing the crime is a terrible, terrible idea. is there thanks for your expertise. we appreciate it. >> you are welcome, michael. >> i want to know what you think, go to smerconish.com. will the contents of michael cohen's hurt or help president trump? go to my facebook page, i'm read responses throughout the course of the program. what do which have? smerconish, unfortunately,ing in is going to hurt him. >> nothing may hurt him in the eyes of the for example% who put

him in office. but there is a whole different constituency here. that's in the second district of new york, by the way, distinctively different from the mueller probe. one more if we have time. smerconish conrecorded trump because he knew who he was de dealing with. he also knew it would come to something like this, some day. i keep thinking who else might he have recorded? he's very access elbe to members of the media, what might other tapes show? just oneering. up ahead, the president received a lot of criticism for what he said in helsinki, i think what's more interesting is what he refused to say. ail tell you what i mean. plus a show of unity in divisive times. why did he do it in he'll tell us and triplets separated at

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with the stroke of a shark and striking of seven words, the president might have told us everything we need to know about his interpretations relative to the investigation of the russian meddling in the 2016 election. as a result, his post-summit efforts at damage troll after helsinki and the meeting with vladimir putin only made matters worse. that was before he invited putin to the white house. where to begin? first there was the timing. the president had ample opportunity to clear up any discrepancy before leaving finland on monday, especially where he did interviews with two fox personalities after the meeting ended but before departing for home, instead, there was no effort to say he had misspoken before air force one took off, probably because he said exactly what he mane to the say. second the scripted claim he later made he had meant to say wouldn't instead of would is belied by the totality of that

context. that one sentence was an outlier. it was in keeping with his i don't have all preparation while addressing the media in putin's question, it would have been odd to call him extremely powerful to then say i don't see any reason why it wouldn't be rush. third, when he read scripted words that he recognized russia's cullle aebt. he couldn't top going off script, it could have been others also, when he wondered if the hack was the work of a 400 pound man. here's the checker. >> that many have missed. it's what he refused to say aloud that had been spelled out in front of him. when the president welcomed the media into a meeting he was having with congressional leaders at the white house. she sat with four pamgs of

notes in front of him. members took pictures, tom brennan of the "new york times," whose photographs captured trump's happened written notation, allowing an easy comparison of what was delivered. on the top of page two, these words appear, quote, in saying as i have said before, that i accept our intelligence community's conclusion about russia's meddling in the 2016 election the president read those words verbatim, then he added what he had written in his own handsh there was no collusion the misspelling is his. he then continued to follow the script. >> in a key sentence in my remarks. i said the word would, instead of wouldn't the sentence should have been i don't see any reason why it wouldn't be russia. sort of a double negative. i have on numerous occasions noted our intelligence findings

that russians attempted to interfere in our elections. >> okay. so far, so good. then came this deletion, quote, anyone involved this that meddling to justice, stricken, presumably by his own happened, he was supposed to say, anybody involved in that meddling either would be or should be brought to justice. he couldn't do it. probably because he couldn't do it. his deviation is an ad mission he has no desire to see anybody involved in the meddling brought to justice, it's that simple the stricken words are a trial lawyer's dream, reminiscent of when charles manson's prosecutor, famous lily lamente that alone could have convicted him. assuming the president ev sits down with special counsel mueller.

mueller could spend an afternoon questioning trump, for starters, did you those those words, mr. rump? do you not believe those words, mr. president. who do you have in mind? mr. president? to the extent it is proven russia meddled in our elections. who do you believe should be spared justice for the russian attack? you know, usually it's what the president says that raises questions. this time, it's the other way around. it's what he would not utter. this week the "new york times" broke the story that weeks before his inauguration, president trump was given definitive proof that putin interfered with the election. joining me now is a co-author, david sanger, the national correspondent with a brand new book, very timely the perfect weapon, war, sabotage and fear in the cyber age, david, you

know the story today, michael cohen having taped trump. what is robert mueller's interest in that issue, if any? >> i not clear how interested he is in that. clearly, if you look at what mueller has done of the past couple of months, he did an dime of the people that ran the internet research agency. they're the ones in russia who put out those ads and commentary on facebook and social media. then, ten days ago, he indicted 12 officers of the gru, the russian intelligence unit that broke into the international democratic committee and then work with wiki leaks, created falls personas, created gucifer 2.0. what is missing from it is wlrpt they got help from any

americans, and that people who clearly, the mueller is trying to press for information on that is paul man a forkts go es to trial soon. rick gates, his associate. of course, gem michael flynn, the national security adviser, briefly under president trump. and you'd have oadd michael cohen into that, in case he heard any of that along this way. so this question of the deletions you were referring to gets to what's really the central intrigue that you just don't know the answer to in the mueller tear, with i is, was there, were there americans and were there americans who were linked to the campaign or close to president trump, who somehow interacted with either the gru the internet research agency or other russians. >> that takes you to our story this weekend. i'm sorry, go ahead. >> something that occurs to me

after reading your book is mueller is operating largely on a cyber ev den scli trail as he attempts to answer those request. . >> he certainly is. if you go into that indictment of the 12 gru officers, what's remarkable about it is he has transcripts of text, e-mails, other conversations, and i have been told by people in the intelligence community he actually didn't get that from u.s. intelligence but that, instead, he was able to put it together from foreign intelligence agencies that cooperated and from legal process here in the occupation. now, that raises an interesting question because so many internet communications go through the infrastructure set up in the u.s., servers in the u.s., or at&t or verizon or aol or you know any number of other internet service providers, google, of course, apple, that it's very possible that the gru

didn't realize that some of these conversations were running through u.s. servers, which ultimately mueller may have been able get access to. >> david, i hear a cism from supporters of the president often from radio callers, who say to me, yeah, but our hands around clean and there is an academic at carnegie mellon, don lemon, i had on my sirius xm program who did a study and said between world war ii's end, 81 times in 61 nation, we've meddled. what thoughts on that do you have? >> that's southernly true. the gooungs united states has interfered, particularly in the cold ware in elections in italy in the 1940s, latin america in the '50s and '60s. japan, we staged a coup in iran in the 1950. so certainly on the question of meddling elections or

interfering in elections, the united states does not at all have clean hands and you know when you go through the perfect weapon as you and i were discussing earlier this week, like i michael, we also don't have clean hands on the question of cyber intrusions into other countries. the only way that our cyber defenses and our cyber autopsies work is by getting inside the networks of foreign countries, of course, that's a violation of law in those countries. so while you could come after the russians and say, what were you doing inside the network with the dnc, they can easily turn and and say, clearly, you are inside the networks of russian intelligence and soft. this is one of the essential problems. >> that's why i brought it up. >> this is one of the essential problems with cyber. which is we have wrapped so much secrecy as a government in our cyber operation, offenses and defenses, that we haven't been

able publicly debate ground rules about what is off limits and what is not. so if you and i sat down, i learned that from the book. i was going to say, are you in totally uncharted territory as your book makes clear, hey, david, we appreciate it. go and enjoy that weather heepdz you. >> it's not so rough out here, michael. great to be with you. >> still to come the gracious gesture heard around the bombed, h -- world, the famed halle jackson. is this a seen of new alliances in the media? in the media? he'll tell us next.

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>> an alliance developed regarding the president's war with the media or so it seems. first, backgrounds, you will remember his visit to teresa may, he ignored cnn's jim acosta and chose to call on john roberts of fox news. >> it's such dishonesty reporting. nbc is probably worse than cnn. >> sense you attacked cnn. can i ask you a question in. >> no, no, john roberts, go ahead. cnn's fake news, i don't take questions from cnn. cnn is attack news, john roberts of fox. >> so roberts then asks, without making kimps i reference, he was criticized and arguably has

shown on wednesday halle jackson was quizzing sarah sanders about when the president and putin interfered in the election. sanders tried to move onto the next questioner. here's the end of the back and forth. >> he sees, he is misspoken, he comes out and says that. >> you told the president once again, moving on to jordan. go ahead. >> so she was trying to call on jordan fabian of the hill. here's what happened next. >> i'm going to take a question. >> anything i remember a time the president publicly called out vladimir putin. >> i think the fact that the

president said russia interfered with jordan. >> joining me now is jordan fabian, gutsy on your part, insofar as when you defer maybe sarah sanders isn't going to come back to you with another question. >> that thought entered my mind. all of us in that room are trying the get our questions in, we're trying to get to the bottom of the answers we are trying to get. the reporters us a versus a chance to ask follow-up questions before the questioning moved to me. >> so as i was watching you on wednesday, of course, i was thinking of jim acosta and john roberts. were you thinking the way that

had gone down in the united king come? >> obviously, i wasn't. when you are sitting in the chair, you are basically trying to get your questions straight and not sound like a war on television. i was trying to ask my questions of sarah sanders and then this interaction happened. look, i will not lie, we talked about behind the scenes of press corps unity. and if it was the right thing to do. >> is this a sign of things to come? do you think this may unfold in subsequent, in press conferences to come? >> you know, i hope so that in the sense that all of us in the white house press corps have respect for one another and do our best to make sure we do our

jobs. there is this dynamic partially how the president treats the media, we are tasked with defeating him. we are trying to do our job to report on the president and tell the readers what's going on the it happened to me or someone else, we would pay it forward. >> you owe a duty to the hill? if you defer, if sarah doesn't come back to you, i'm your editor at the hill, i will say, hey, jordan, way to take a bullet, but you testify got your question. we want you to be on ready.

thoughts? you hit the nail and you are serving different avenue actors, it's a tough balancing a. luckily for me, i think sarah did the right thing. i think a lot of viewers don't get when sarah goes to somebody else and somebody asks a different question, it's not a slight to the other reporter in the room. it's that all of us are covering different stories we were trying to get that out. >> i'm glad it's a tough balancing act. >> when a guest goes on the morning show, they call eight ginsburg, if somebody should defer next week, maybe they'll be falling eight fabian. i don't know, we'll have to watch. thank you, jordan. >> thanks, michael.

>> let's check in on social media comments on facebook, glad the reporters are starting to stick towing, joan, you get my point that sarah sanders is, she's finished now, she go es to jordan, jordan says, i'll surrender my time. sarah, to her credit, gave jordan back his time. she doesn't have to, if jordan gets cut out of that loop, you wonder, has he distinguished, has he provided his employer with what they're owed? one more if we've got time. we'd love to see reporters support each other when sarah sanders is trying to shut won down. wouldn't that be interesting if they came in with the same question? i think there will be more of this. the reason i wanted jordan on the program today is i have a suspicion there is more to come

in this regard. don't forget to answer smerconish dock. will the contents of cohen's reporting hurt or help? triplets. reunited at age 19 by sheer coincidence. their astonishing story is now a critically acclaimed documentary. but the story is a troubling one. i'm about to talk to the director.

three boys all adopted at birth and were not aware of each other's existence, so far interesting but not remarkable. then at age 19 the three boys met through a crazy set of,s and quickly realized they were identical triplets. it started off as a heart warming tale that attracted media interest. then a much darker story emerged in a new documentary that has earned rave reviews, three identical strangers, which is a hit in theaters. it will air on cnn? january. the director joins me now, hey, tim, i don't know if the scale is to four stars or five stars, eenl giving you the max. i thought it was terrific. i have to say i laughed and acried. you take us on an emotional roller coaster. >> upg that, yeah, that's what

i'm hoping the film does. it encompasses a wide range of emotions, people are laughing at the start. they gasch. they start trying. at the end they're angry. i'm pleased it is being so well received. >> i'm not giving it all away, bobby goes off to college and has a beat up volvo. if you ask him, he would said he has one sibling, he gets to school and quickly the pieces fall together. it turns out he has a twin brother on that campus one year prior. then what? >> then the two brothers finds each other. they celebrate. they're on the front of newspapers, particularly in the new york area. they get a call the next day, a guy says, i look just like you. i think we're tripletsp.

>> and they were triplets. this wasn't happenstance, this was design they would grow up in different environments? >> yeah the film kind of explores what happens off the three of them there a united, then become famous in new york and around the world, also looks at the circumstances behind the separation as you say it wasn't just a random event. >> and may i also say in bringing this to the screen, there is a piece of this we don't know, locked away at yale university is the still story? >> absolutely, there is a treasure trophy of documents relating to the brothers and swins separated, locked away in a vault until 2065, we believe. >> is there any prospect because of your movie, those reports

will be released sooner than 2065? is there well the brothers because of the film tapped work my producers did, the brothers have access to some materials related to them, heavily redacted photocopies. i am hope. as a result of this film the organizations video in and who can grant access will be much more transparent in talking about this study. . >> again not trying to give away too much. because this was all by virtue of some experience, for lack of a better description, is there any argue the ends justify the means, did we learn anything about three identity cal twins, raised if different socioeconomic backgrounds? >> i think that's the question at the heart of the fem. i think various people make an argue that this experiment was

justified in the area it occurred in, was started in, in the 50s and 60s. when there were a lot of scientific, psychology experiment, kind of the wild west in psychology. and later a prison experiment, which will not pass any ethical test today. for me the point you raised about the knowledge, knowledge was gained through all the damage done in this experiment. so it remains in my eyes pretty unjustifiab unjustifiable. >> let's call it five. five stars, i'm giving you five stars. thank you for being here. >> thank you very much for having me on. >> you deserve it. >> still to come your best and worst social media comments. i'm adopted, discovered my mother and two brothers live in same city as me.

i've don't my property unbeknownst since 1984 him my mother lives three brocks from my kids. everybody has to see this movie. it begins as a heart warming tale and takes a more sinister direction. there is a lot we still don't know, but thumbs up. it's your last chance to vote before we give you the final results. will the contents of michael cohen's reporting harm or help president trump? go vote! vity gives you lasting protection from tooth sensitivity. with first of its kind protection, it blocks tooth sensitivity at the source. so instead of your favorite foods making you feel like this. you'll enjoy them like this. bring out the bold.™ i love you, basement guest bathroom. your privacy makes you my number 1 place to go number 2. i love you, but sometimes you stink.

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time to see how you responded to the survey question

at smerconish.com. will the contents of michael cohen's reporting help or hurt president trump? survey says 9,879 votes cast. 82% say hurt. 18% said help. you know that rudy guiliani in his capacity as the president's attorney said this would ex-kbet the president. i would point out that "the washington post" today said you really hear michael cohen's voice and not much from the president. time will tell. what else do we have. social media reaction to today's program. put it on the screen. maybe trump struck that line because it had grammatical errors just like he was saying no to answering more questions. hey, bosscat, so much has been said about helsinki and appropriately so. the president on tuesday tried to get a mulligan by speaking to the media and launched the whole

semantic would versus wouldn't. seven words he would not say are i think a trial lawyer's dream and great fodder for mueller if he ever questions the president. the president refused to say that he onwants to see brought justice anybody involved in the russian meddling, and he needs to explain why. why didn't he say it. he cross the out the entense because he's afraid of an indictment against himself. i guess ellen what you're saying is he didn't want to say he wants them brought to justice because that would mean he would be brought to justice, at least that's your interpretation. give me another one. what have we got. smerconish, if the press core unites, the white house will end press briefings. true, tony. what if more follow jordan's lead at other events like when you saw acosta and john roberts. what if john roberts in the backyard at checkers said no, i

want to give me colleague from cnn who used to work here the opportunity to ask his questions. i think it is the start of something but we'll's find out. one more if i have time. smerconish, what does the tape matter? his supporters could see him shoot someone and fifth avenue and still would not abandon him. might be true. the question is not what his supporters will do or think, that pore taertains to what hapn 2020. catch up anytime at cnn go and on demand. i'll see you next week. (vo) this is not a video game. this is not a screensaver. this is the destruction of a cancer cell by the body's own immune system, thanks to medicine that didn't exist until now. and today can save your life. ♪

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well, good morning to you and welcome to saturday. i am christi paul. >> i am victor blackwell. after a week of strong criticism over the trump, putin summit in helsinki, the white house is worrying that meeting may have played into the hands of special counsel robert mueller. >> before the helsinki summit, the president's team was riding a wave of declining support for the mueller probe. now that performance may emboulder mueller. >> they're defending plans for another putin summit, this time in washington. >> cnn white house reporter is live in new jersey near the president's golf club. sarah, what are you using? >> president trump's lawyers are afraid trump's highly