good evening, we begin tonight "keeping them honest" with a tale of two white houses, one where a threat russia poses is real and one where the opposite is true. given all we've seen over the last year and a half, which white house does president trump inhabit. today's press briefing was a show of force from the president's own counter intelligence and national security team and they did not mince words. >> the intelligence community continues to be concerned about the threats of upcoming u.s. elections. both the mid-terms and

presidential elections in 2020. in regards to the russian involvement in the midterm elections, we continue to see a pervasive messaging campaign by russia to try to weaken and divide the united states. >> that was director of national intelligence, dan coats. the director of homeland security, kirstjen nielsen, was equally blunt. >> our democracy itself is in the crosshairs. free and fair elections are the cornerstone of our democracy and it has become clear that they are the target of our adversaries, who seek, as the dni just said, to sew discord and undermine our way of life. i support the assessments and past efforts and those today to interfere with our election and of the current threat. >> democracy in the crosshairs, secretary nielsen said. here's the fbi director, chris wray, the one president trump

himself appointed. >> this is a threat we need to take extremely seriously and tackle and respond to with fierce determination and focus. >> that sounds very clear, more than clear, trump appointees in the briefing room of the white house, with the president's blessing, speaking out in no uncertain terms about the ongoing threat from russia to american democracy. there is nothing they said today that diverges much from the census that russia remains a threat. what makes it so interesting is the gulf between what these top advisers and cabinet members are willing to say and what their boss is willing to say. >> is russia still targeting the u.s.? >> thank you very much. >> let's go. >> that's the president shortly after the helsinki summit. the white house claimed the president didn't mean, no, they aren't targeting the u.s., he meant no as i don't want to take anymore questions. the reporter said the president was answering no to her questions.

the cleanup was after the helsinki summit saying he meant to say wouldn't instead of would although in that cleanup the president said it could be others meddling and since then calling the russia story a hoax and investigation rigged. the difference between the president's reluctance to call out russia and the security team's willingness to was noticeable. striking enough to call out this question from dni coats. >> in the run-up to the helsinki summit,s u.s. officials, nato ambassadors to russia said the president would raise the issue of maligned activity with the president. he didn't address that. you said to make the issue of meddling a priority. how do you explain the disconnect between what you are

saying, his advisers and what the president has said about this issue? >> i'm not in a position to explain fully or talk about helsinki. i would ask the security director here to address that question. >> i just want to emphasize what you just heard. the director of national intelligence when asked about the president's behavior in helsinki said i'm not in a position to understand fully or talk about what happened in helsinki. a pretty stunning statement, either dan coats cannot talk about what he knows or truly does not have the picture of what was discussed behind closed doors that echos something he said publicly days ago. after he made that statement, he turned things over to john bolton who repeated what vladimir putin said at the press conference, that election meddling was the first issue president trump raised with him. he's just saying what vladimir

putin said publicly. it's not clear anyone does except perhaps vladamir putin. as for the president he spoke out at a rally again tonight about how tough he's been on russia and also saying things like this. >> now, we're being hindered by the russian hoax. it's a hoax. i'll tell you what, russia is very unhappy that trump won, that, i can tell you. >> that's not what vladamir putin said at the press conference. he wanted trump to win. more on this from jim acosta at the white house. do you have any understanding why the press briefing on this topic happened now? >> we were told earlier in the day the president directed those officials to come out in the briefing room and say all those things, how they're on the case when it comes to russia meddling interference and the elections. a few moments ago, the president had a golden opportunity to drive that point home at this rally in pennsylvania earlier this evening and he just didn't do it. as you said, he defended his summit with putin in helsinki

and said the russians are unhappy he's the president of the united states when vladamir putin admitted at the summit he wanted donald trump to win. there's this huge disconnect. we could all feel it in the briefing room earlier today and why you saw so many reporters asking that question. yes, i'm sure it was very assuring to a lot of americans out there to hear the director of national intelligence, fbi director, of homeland security to say they're on the case. looming over everything in the room is the fact the president has said all sorts of things to diminish the russian threat in the past. he just said it could be other countries, not just russia. that's so opposite what we heard from his top officials at that briefing. >> and it was just yesterday sarah palin called the sarah sanders called the mueller investigation into the russia

meddling a hoax, wasn't it? >> that's right. she echoed what the president was saying. the president tweeted this attack at the fbi, went after former officials of the fbi including jim comey once again going after the institution of the fbi, sarah sanders that during briefing yesterday. it was interesting to note one of the reporters in the briefing today pressed the fbi director for an answer to that. in the presence of sarah sanders in the room, chris wray said that his agents from the top on down are determined to do their jobs and carry out their duties. i thought it was an interesting moment, it was somebody in the administration, no, sir, no, sarah sanders what you're saying is not true. >> is there any indication the president is ready to embrace the findings of the intelligence chiefs he's now appointed that russia is trying to affect the elections this fall? >> there's no evidence of that, anderson, and that is what was -- it was -- i think it was awfully good that you saw a lot of those officials come into the

room earlier today and say, all of these things about how they're going to try to stop russia meddling in the 2018 midterms. you heard the fbi director and homeland security secretary all saying there are these new initiatives and task forces aimed at stopping cyber attacks on our democracy. what was missing in all of this was to have the president of the united states, to have an anonymous official to say the president sent them out there. i don't think that's good enough. when the president had this opportunity this evening to say, i did this, i sent these officials out there, we will stop this. he didn't do it. another opportunity missed? thanks. joining us now, max boot and cnn legal and security analyst and phil, former senior official at the fbi and cia. it is interesting this disconnect that took place, the president reit -- place, the president reiterated in his

speech and his officials were so clear in the russia involvement. >> i think the fact the president continues to acknowledge this is exactly why the intel chiefs had to do this. when you have a threat from a foreign adversary, attack, you need the united states to speaker with one voice and that voice usually comes from the president of the united states, to say, this is who we are, this is what our values are. this is important when there is misinformation, part of the attack is a misinformation campaign. the president, consciously or not, is actually doing putin's work for him. he is echoing and amplifying divisive messages putin is hoping to sow and delegitimizing rhetoric. so i think that part of fight willing back is for these intel chiefs is to make this public statement. >> phil, you worked for the cia and fbi in your long career. does it really matter whether or

not the president is echoing what the national security apparatus is saying as long as you have chris wray, dni coats, nielsen, all pointing at russia, saying we're aware of this, working on this, doing everything we can to make sure the sanctity of the voting process remains. >> time-out, anderson. 95% of the americans couldn't name one of the people who spoke today. can't name the national security advisor and can't name the cabinet members. they can name the president of the united states and he has at least two major responsibilities here well beyond the intel that people like me who used to be on the inside would ask him to do. number one, what is the message to vladamir putin after we see this happening only a week after helsinki, the president told vladamir putin why don't you visit the white house. i can tell you the consequences on vladamir putin are nothing. if the russians continue to this, the answer to trump is, sure, i'll go visit the white house and we don't have to talk about it.

one final point and more significant, the domestic message the president has to send, in new york -- you live in new york, anderson, time and time again they say the new york police department and fbi have secret work to do. if you see something say something. the governor and mayor had a message to the people. and the facebook intervention they talked about this week, what has the president said to the american people and who is the messenger to the american people. i don't see one, anderson. >> if this were so important, should the president have been there or echoed this at least tonight saying, you know, i've -- i totally agree with what my intelligence chiefs said and -- as opposed to talking about it as a hoax? >> of course, anderson but it is clear the president does not agree with what the intelligence chiefs are saying. you saw the clip a few moments ago he called this a hoax and they are saying this is a major

danger to the united states. one of the most revealing lines is when john bolton said, the president has made very clear what his priorities are. by that, i think bolton meant he has a priority focusing on russia. in fact, the president has made very clear his priority is not to focus on the russian threat, he only views this through his prism of his own political self-interest. he doesn't care about getting to the root of the russian interference in the 2016 election or in the future, all he cares about is saving his own political skin, which is why he and other senior officials have now taken to referring to the mueller probe as a rigged witch hunt delegitimizing the investigation and essentially doing vladamir putin's work for him. >> i talked to michael hayden and director clapper, all saying having the president be the one on top of all his national security apparatus directing all of their efforts. we heard from each of these people individually. chris wray testified in congress what the fbi is doing to try to

counter-russia in the upcoming election and dni coats and others express concerns. people who worked in intelligence agencies and the fbi all say it is critical for the president to be the one setting the agenda and giving it all a sense of urgency and coordination. do you agree with that? >> absolutely. one of the things after 9/11, in light of the 9/11 commission's recommendations was to break down barriers in terms of sharing intelligence, create the office of the director of national intelligence in order to bring all these different perspectives these agencies have so that good policy can be made. that is made at the top by the president of the united states. many things, covert actions abroad, have to be authorized by him in writing with a finding it's important to national security.

so, in many ways, these agencies cannot act effectively without him getting on board and without him creating a coordinated strategy and tell them exactly what he wants them to do. >> did it jump out to you that he's not fully aware what happened at the summit or talk about it? not understanding or having been reliably been briefed by the president exactly what he said to vladamir putin, i find that surprising. >> it is. let me make this real to you. if there is a conversation between the president and putin about election interference and putin makes specific representations about what he will or will not do. let's take it further, say there's a conversation about syria and russian engagement in syria and putin makes representations to the president. who will verify what putin says to the president?

the director of the national intelligence. the dni coming out of helsinki should be saying, putin said this, mr. president and this is what putin said after speaking about russian interference. instead, what he told us, you just reported to us he doesn't know what happened. >> i have spoken quite a bit about what happened in helsinki, what do you think about what dni coats said? >> it's deeply disturbing. this is a president accused very credibly of colluding with russia in 2016. evidence is piling up including the recent cnn report michael cohen is prepared to testify donald trump knew in advance about the meeting between the russians and the trump campaign. you have a president suspected of working with russia to affect american democracy. the same president is in an off the record meeting with the russian president where nobody including the national security knows what happened. this is not diplomacy as usual,

very unusual and disturbing and worrisome given the unique vulnerability of donald trump to russian pressure. >> thanks very much. next, the revelation of manafort's trial, not how little money he had but how little he had when he went to work for donald trump, riches to rags tail. and you'll hear it when we come back about. also breaking news on alleged spy maria butina. what it might say about how russian intelligence operates in the u.s. but just one can "behr" through it all.

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it was dominated by a prosecution witness that told the jury manafort was in serious financial trouble in 2016 after his lobbying business dried up. that was his long-time bookkeeper full of details. manafort was basically broke when he took the job on the trump campaign. that's interesting. >> he was. he was in serious financial trouble according to the testimony of his bookkeeper. she was on the stand for several hours. she talked about how strapped for cash he was after his lobbying business in ukraine dried up. it was so bad he was in danger of losing his health insurance. in one e-mail said he needed $120,000 urgently to pay some personal bills. we've been talking about this. it was stunning change of fortune for the man buying $15,000 ostrich coats now scrambling for money in 2016. this was also right at the time he joined the trump campaign to work for free and also at a time he helped a bank executive at bank who gave him a loan to get a job with the trump campaign,

too. these are the details prosecutors are putting out for the jury. >> as much as the defense shows the bad guy -- >> her exact quote was he approved every penny of everything we paid. not only that, the bookkeeper describes in details how manafort lied to the banks. prosecutors show a side by side of documents. one where the book keeper told one bank that manafort's company lost more than $1 million in 2016. manafort, he sent the same person at that same bank a different financial statement saying his company actually made $3 million by around the same time period. prosecutors are priming this jury with a lot of evidence for charges to show he committed tax fraud, too. >> and saying now gates will testify. >> they floated will he or won't they, they weren't sure. they finally said they will call gates, today or tomorrow. >> and will manafort testify? that's something the judge

brought up. they want to bring in evidence manafort was ever audited by the irs. the judge said, if you want that evidence or testimony to come in, it would be much better if paul manafort testifies, the next big question. >> appreciate it. still breaking news what that russian woman arrested for conspiracy and acting as a russian agent, forever she acted as charged and some info on her skillset with politician, a hint, she wasn't exactly subtle. what are you learning? >> she wasn't exactly subtle. she is innocent until proven guilty but an alleged russian

spy. she didn't use the kind of spy technology we would expect, communicating on twitter and what's-up, with those her own age and older men. she was so flirtatious, men walked away wondering what her ulterior motive was, what she wanted from them. this gives you the various ways moscow runs its influence operation, that's what experts said when i asked about her spy tactics. look, vladamir putin has a number of seasoned operatives he can plant in the u.s. to run operations for him. he also will tap people like maria butina through other people he knows to gain information and access in the u.s. that's what prosecutors say is going on in this case, anderson. >> did she talk about ties to russian intelligence at any point? >> she did. this is one of the allegations that has come out against her from some of her classmates who wish to remain anonymous, there were a couple instances she

actually was intoxicated according to sources who were familiar with this and talked about her ties to the russian government and talked about her ties to russian intelligence and talked about how she ran a gun rights group from moscow and sort of had the buy-in to russian intelligence. this was so alarming to some people she said it in front of, on two separate instances, her classmates reported it to law enforcement. >> what does her lawyer say? >> he says she was completely innocent, an american university student, not a spy. she's pleaded not guilty to charges of conspiracy as well as acting as a foreign agent in the u.s. but he also said in other interviews he believes sexism and this anti-russian sentiment given the political climate now has tainted the case against her. he hasn't fully made these arguments in court but she's back in september and we will

hear more in the courtroom. more breaking news who robert mueller wants to talk to now in his investigation, a name that goes back to the russians in the campaign and you might be surprised to it. also, there's new insight on whether the president wants to sit down with the special council or not. could there be a method behind the choice legal experts call not a great idea. the legal team weighs in when "360" continues. my car smells good. it's these new fresh-fx car air fresheners from armor all. each scent can create a different mood in my car. like tranquil skies. armor all, it's easy to smell good.

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russia special cancel robert mueller wants to talk to the russian oligarch and singer/son who pushed for the trump tower meeting. today, the father's attorney revealed negotiations have been going on for nearly a year. so far, there's no agreement and breaking news from the president's tv lawyer, rudy guiliani saying team trump is close to deciding whether the president will agree to do an interview. guiliani saying i think our decision will get made in the next week to 10 days. the "new york times" reporting the president is eager to talk. two views why that may be and how that may play out by jeffrey toobin and biographer, michael d'antoni.

>> do you think the president wants to sit down or part of a strategy? >> it's probably both. donald trump is nothing if not self-confident. he's testified a lot and given a lot of depositions in civil cases. he's mostly done better than badly in those cases. >> everybody focuses on the tim o'brien case in the "new york times" but actually done well. >> he's never been charged with perjury in what he said in those depositions. he has done well. most of those cases have wound upsetting rather than going to a resolution. i think he's confident in handling a deposition. i think it's part of his brand not to be afraid of anything. i think he wants to be perceived as someone who has nothing to hide and will testify. i think there is really, at least a measure of candor in what he's saying that he does want to testify. >> this seems to be how donald

trump has approached a lot of situations in his life believing he can -- if he talks to somebody he can convince them. he can be very charming when he wants to be. is that something he's had all his life? >> it absolutely is a quality he's exhibited all of his life. i only found really one example of an interview where he just couldn't bring anybody around, and it was one of the early ones he did with "time" magazine. he bumped into a reporter who actually reminded me temperamentally what people say about robert mueller. he was a pretty upstanding straight ahead guy and trump just couldn't win him over. for the most part, he is able to win people over. he gets them relaxed and charms them and i think he even surprises them when he's not super aggressive.

he could attempt that. as mentioned he has experience testifying in depositions. he even images himself as a lawyer himself he has spent so much time with attorneys he feels expert. >> if there is an interview with mueller, there's not going to be a judge there. he can filibuster. you've interviewed the then candidate trump, he talks and talks and that could eat up practically the whole interview. i think he knows that. just a prosecutor sitting there is not going to be able to say to him, stop talking. he is in many respects going to be able to control what happens if there is an interview. again, that doesn't mean it's necessarily a good idea for him. he has a lot of tools at his disposal. >> i spoke to alan dershowitz last night, saying he always tries to get clients not to do an interview in this situation, it's a perjury trap waiting to happen.

if you're not lying, how is it a perjury trap? >> a perjury trap has always been a meaningless expression to me. if you tell the truth, you're not going to be perjured? dershowitz says if there's somebody else who believes they're telling the truth, a different version of events what the president is saying prosecutors can go with that person's version. > have too much respect for mueller that they would simply bring some sort of action. remember, there's not going to be a criminal prosecution out of here. all that's going to come out of this is some sort of report. the mere fact that two people have different recollections of an event does not create an create a perjury trap. that happens all the time. the fact that there's a legal trap is a bogus argument. >> according to the "times," if the president sits down with them he can convince them their own inquiry is a witch hunt and obviously shows confidence in his own ability to sway people. >> of course, he's ever

consecutive. i think in this case the stakes are much higher than the stakes he's faced in any litigation prior. there is that factor to consider. believe it or not he does imagine himself to be the actual president of the united states. he doesn't act like it a lot. he does, i think, have in mind his legacy. that could move him to resist ultimately cooperating as much as robert mueller would have him cooperate. he's going to be more careful than usual, uncharacteristically careful, i think. >> remember, too, what i think he's really trying to convince is the public, not so much the mueller people. he's been pretty effective. look how republicans have shifted over the course of the mueller investigation.

his people have come around on mueller to feeling it's a witch hunt. i don't think he really believes he will convince mueller he's engaged in a witch hunt, i do think he believes at least his supporters will feel that way if they don't already. >> lastly, i want to ask you about the reporting that the mueller team is seeking to interview this russian pop star behind the introductions setting up the trump tower meeting. how likely is that it that would actually happen? why would some russian citizen do that? the pop star who is the person that engineered the infamous tower meeting. he spends a lot of time in the united states and grew up in new jersey. he's english. he will not get within a mile of this. his father, who financed the miss universe in moscow in 2013, he will stay farther away. i'm not surprised the mueller team is trying to get to them but i wouldn't hold their breath.

>> as we mentioned, president trump is on the campaign trail again, on the rally with a crowd where people who believe in conspiracy theories, call themselves q anon. we'll hear what they have to say. what does help for heart ♪ the beat goes on. it looks like emily cooking dinner for ten. ♪ the beat goes on. it looks like jonathan on a date with his wife. ♪ la-di-la-di. entresto is a heart failure medicine that helps your heart... so you can keep on doing what you love. in the largest heart failure study ever, entresto was proven superior at helping people stay alive and out of the hospital.

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at president trump's rally tonight in pennsylvania, scattered among the crowd are people who believe in conspiracy theories so broad and bizarre difficult to believe to put it mildly. it's no longer an isolated thing. the sign with the q on it is for q anon. this video was from the presidential rally in tampa two nights ago. and we focus on what views they believe in and the fringes of political thought. tonight, we wanted to hear what they had to say but because so much had been said about it, we sent gary tuchman. to tonight's trump rally. what happened? >> reporter: anderson, the rally ended a short time ago, people streaming out. many people arriving early this morning waiting in line. we wanted to see if the people who followed this movement wanted to talk to us. we found they did want to talk to us.

what they told us was quite interesting. waiting in line in a driving rain, very motivated trump supporters, wanting to see the president in person in wilkes-barry, pennsylvania. >> we are q. >> reporter: some of those people wearing and holding the 17th letter of the alphabet. >> reporter: you're holding a red, white and blue q. why do you have it? >> it's shift. >> reporter: you are wearing a shirt that says -- >> it means where we go one we go all. >> q anon is the people that believe in what trump's trying to do to change our country. >> reporter: that is a generalization. more specifically what q anon is, is a fringe movement in which many baseless conspiracy theories are discussed on the internet, organized on the idea of anonymous but well-connected persons nicknamed q. >> your shirt says the storm is here.

what does that mean to you? >> i've been following the posts since october 28th. >> reporter: on the internet. the person other persons who say they're q. >> right. >> what is q? >> an entity of 10 or less people that have -- >> a problem with the government? >> have high security clearance. >> reporter: how do you know that? >> i'm telling you this is what i appears to be. >> appears to be. this is what you're guessing. >> you don't have proof there isn't. >> we've all been gathering online talking as americans and uniting. >> reporter: do you think it makes you comfortable talking with other frustrated people? >> yes. >> reporter: maybe there's no evidence of it. stuff talked about it on the internet. >> there hasn't been

non-evidence yet? >> reporter: and a major this is press is the enemy. you don't believe in the first amendment? >> i do. you guys are weaponized. >> reporter: what is that? i don't know anybody in the cia except a couple people over the years. what does it mean? >> conspiracy theorists. >> reporter: do you think i'm weaponized by the cia? >> maybe not to your knowledge. that's unfortunate. >> reporter: you believe there is a deep state? >> yes. >> reporter: what do you think that deep state is doing? running this country? >> i think they were and they're petrified now because they're losing their control. >> reporter: donald trump is the president. he's running the country, right? >> yeah. he's having to fight against them. >> reporter: he said he could do it all himself. you think he's fighting with the deep state a year and a half in his term? >> i think he was fighting before he was elected. >> reporter: who is in the deep state? >> the clinton and bushes and obamas. >> reporter: you think the clintons and bushes and obamas are running this country as we stand here in the rain? >> no. they're trying. >> reporter: the anonymous q is

a hero to many, one man hoping to believe in q looking straight into our camera. is it possible you're believing in bogus information? >> let's see, q, let's see. >> did you get large numbers of people lining up at the rally support the q? what sort of numbers did you see? >> reporter: i don't think there were large numbers, anderson. a lot of people we talked to had no idea what it was. other people wanted to see donald trump and other people wanted to see the president of the united states with their children. it seems like a relatively small number. i will tell you it's catching on and i would anticipate at future rallies we will see more people holding big qs and clothes with qs on them. >> do they think the president supports q anon. >> reporter: sarah sanders was asked about it and did not give any indication at all the president supports it. each and every person i talked to who follows this does believe

donald trump is a supporter even though he hasn't said so. >> appreciate you being there. joining me now is will summer, reporter for "the daily beast" writing for q non since its inception. do you have any idea how many people believe ins the conspiracy theories? i certainly don't want to paint people -- >> they were saying it's relatively small number of people who went to this rally. hard to tell how many people believe in it. you wouldn't want to say everyone at the rally, a diehard trump supporter. at the same time, the numbers at these rallies we're seeing, maybe a couple dozen believers. that's pretty bizarre in april there was a rally in d.c., a

couple hundred people showed up. they were chanting the qanon slogans. you know, whatever it is, did is remarkable that so many people have become convinced of this. >> from what i understand, they have people believing the qanon thing. have a different belief in what the robert mueller investigation actually is? >> yes. they have come to believe that robert mueller is in league with trump and an ally of his, and it's a ruse to cover up that he's really investigating hillary clinton or barack obama. >> why would trump be attacking the mueller investigation? >> that's all part of the ruse? >> i understand a rival to q has now emerged. people who go by the letter r? >> q kind of disappeared in july, his followers are very devoted. they were left bereft and

someone named r showed up. they said, maybe this is the new guy to follow. and they posited that r was jfk jr. who died nearly 2 decades ago. >> does this have anything to do with the pizza gate foekds? there are republicans that hillary clinton and others are running a pedophile ring in a pizza parlor in the basement? >> absolutely. a key part of qanon is not just that trump is fighting against the deep state or the clintons. he's fighting against global pedestrian fire networks all over the world. they have no evidence for this, it's crazy stuff. >> i understand that some people believe that the president has

given them secret signs that the way he holds his hand or puts some fingers together he's forming the letter q during speeches? >> yes, they're obsessed with getting some sort of validation from trump that q is real. they'll look at videos and saying, maybe he's moving his hand in a way that he's mentioning q. they've been asking a lot of white house reporters to ask trump about q. they seem to feel that this if trump was asked about it, they're convinced he would say, oh, yeah, it's all real. >> does anyone seem to know who the person q actually is. or if it's a -- one person or groups of people? >> q's identity is very mysterious. maybe a foreign operative, there's a lot of theorys going around. really nothing that i think is worth considering.

i think perhaps it's just a troll or a couple trolls in the basement somewhere and this whole thing has gotten out of hand. >> can you explain again the core belief. the whole international pedophile ring linked with the deep state. and robert mueller is >> yeah, it's very confusing. i mean sort of the -- and it's constantly growing. something will happen in the news and they'll claim, oh, the deep state tried to shoot down air force one. sort of the gist of it is that trump has teamed up with the military and sort of various virtuous world leaders, including vladimir putin and kim jong-un to take on this global cabal of democrats and hollywood elites and bankers and all this kind of stuff, who they claim are essentially responsible for all the evil in the world and soon trump will have all these people arrested. >> william sommer, i appreciate your reporting. fascinating stuff. i want to check in with chris to see what he's working on for "cuomo prime time" at the top of the hour. >> like every other fringe group, they can believe whatever they want. it's what they do in the name of

those beliefs that raises concern just like fringe groups on the left and others on the right. that was a good interview to have. we're going to be taking on the news tonight from a legal and a political perspective. we've got governor kasich on the show. we've got former a.g. mukasey on the show. we're going to be testing out different theories of what's going on with the russia probe and what needs to happen in the next set of elections. then we're going to take a look at what the pope said about the death penalty and what it means to be pro-life and how a lot of people who may think they're pro-life may not meet the standard according to the pope. >> interesting. about 8 1/2 minutes from now. up next, the search is on for this man who police say shot and killed a famed cardiologist. according to investigators, he held a grudge against the doctor, carried out a brazen execution on a bicycle in broad daylight. the police are looking for information about this person. more details ahead in a moment. ♪ you shouldn't be rushed into booking a hotel. with expedia's add-on advantage,

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there's a manhunt in houston, texas, tonight. police are looking for a man accused of killing a renowned cardiologist who once performed surgery on george h.w. bush. the doctor was gunned down on his way to work at a hospital. he and the gunman were both riding bicycles. when their paths crossed, the gunman opened fire. this is the suspect caught on surveillance video moments before the deadly attack. with more on the manhunt and the crime, here's cnn's ed lavandera. >> reporter: houston investigators say as soon as joseph pappas suspected that investigators were closing in on him, he jumped on his ten-speed schwinn bicycle, pedaled away from his neighborhood, and disappeared. police chief art acevedo says there's a sense of urgency to capture the 62-year-old murder suspect. >> he's in great shape. he's a great marksman, and he's a great danger. so let's hope that somebody knows where he's at and calls us. >> reporter: investigators believe pappas' motive for killing dr. mark hausknecht was

a grudge he's held for more than 20 years. that's when the suspect's mother died during surgery while being operated on by hausknecht. on the morning of july 20th, dr. hausknecht was riding his bicycle down this sidewalk. his wife said investigators told her that the gunman emerged from this scaffolding head-on and fired at him three times. it was a brazen attack. it occurred at the height of morning rush hour on this busy street. perhaps the gunfire was muzzled by the sounds coming from this construction site. but police say it was a well thought out and planned attack. so much so that it allowed the gunman to ride away on his own bicycle this way as if nothing had happened. chief acevedo tells cnn evidence found inside pappas' home shows the murder was painstakingly planned. >> this man was actually studying this doctor, studying what he was doing for a while, and it took great planning and ultimately great skill to do what he did.

and i'm just thankful that we now know who he is and now with the help of the public and our great investigators, we'll find him. one way or the other, we're going to find him. >> reporter: joseph pappas spent 30 years working in law enforcement as a constable in houston. he started a real estate business several years ago. >> that's where he paid our bill. >> reporter: joe donaldson owns a legal courier business and he says he spoke to joseph pappas just before the murder. pappas hired donaldson to file legal documents in a houston courthouse. the documents transferred the deed for his houston home to a woman in ohio. donaldson says after leaving, pappas called him multiple times that morning to make sure the documents were filed. >> he was very nervous. he opened the door to a crack looking out. then he opened it a little more. then he opened it fully and was looking up and down the street, seeing if anyone else was there. >> reporter: for days joseph pappas stayed around his houston home. one neighborhood even says he was seen mowing his lawn this

past sunday morning before disappearing when police first checked on his home on tuesday night. >> ed joins us now from houston. what are investigators worried about given his law enforcement background? >> reporter: multiple things. he might try to, you know, carry out a similar attack or want to -- you know, he's very skilled at being able to handle the firearm, that sort of thing. but one of the other concerns is he might somehow still have access to police radio scanners and be able to monitor the manhunt for him. the police chief here in houston tells me that that is one thing they are concerned about and that they're looking into it and how they handle the search for him. >> and they're assuming he's still armed and dangerous? >> reporter: yeah, absolutely. the police chief says that, you know, no reason to believe he isn't armed and dangerous at this point given what he's already done. the other thing is that they have talked to somebody close to pappas, who told police that he received a text from pappas several days ago that he might

want to commit suicide. so police either believe he's suicidal or dangerous. police don't know exactly what they're dealing with, and that's what makes them concerned. >> thank you. quick reminder, don't miss our daily interactive newscast on facebook. 6:25 p.m. eastern. news continues. i want to hand it over to chris. "cuomo prime time" starts right now. thank you, my friend. i am chris cuomo. welcome to "prime time." a major headline from the trump administration today. russia attacked our election. they're attacking us right now as i speak. and we have to do everything we can to safeguard the upcoming races. the intelligence chiefs, homeland security chief, national security adviser all on the same page, and then came president trump. you're going to want to listen to what he said tonight. then we get into testing the russia realities. a former u.s. attorney general is here to argue russia may not have cared about whether donald trump would win. so what does michael mukasey