Skip to main content

tv   Erin Burnett Out Front  CNN  November 16, 2018 4:00pm-5:00pm PST

4:00 pm
80th birthday. happy birthday, ted. he's a great, great man. he did so much for all of us. we are grateful to him. the program airs tomorrow night, 8:00 p.m. eastern, right here on cnn. "erin burnett outfront" starts "erin burnett outfront" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com president trump calling for respect and decorum in the white house. this is reality. plus, president trump's legal team pushing back on specific questions from special counsel robert mueller. and we're going to tell you what they are. this as trump says he has written the answers to mueller himself. and the breaking news this hour, "the washington post" reporting that the cia has concluded the saudi crown prince personally ordered the assassination of jamal khashoggi. not what president trump wanted to hear. what will trump do now? let's go "outfront."
4:01 pm
good evening, i'm erin burnett. "outfront" tonight, lashing out after a court ruled against the president and in favor of cnn. a judge saying the white house must temporarily reinstate jim acosta's press pass. in response, president trump speaking aloud, threatening to walk away from all press questions he doesn't like. he says it's all about decorum and respect. >> rules and regulations, what do you mean, specifically? >> decorum. you can't take three questions and four questions and just stand up and not sit down. decorum. we have to practice decorum. you were there. you understood, and you understand we want total freedom of the press. that's very important to me. it's more important to me than anybody would believe. but you have to act with respect. you're in the white house. >> decorum and you have to act with respect when you're in the white house. like this. >> trump is on his hero journey right now, and he might not expected to have a crazy mother
4:02 pm
[ bleep ] like kanye west run up and support, but best believe we are going to make america great. for me, also as a guy that looks up to you, looks up to american industry guys, nonpolitical, no [ bleep ] with the beep on it, so i had the balls, because i have enough balls to put on this hat. >> let's just quote again what the president said today. "you have to act with respect. you're in the white house." so, in the president's own words, here's what should have happened to kanye west. >> if i think somebody's acting out of sorts, i will leave. i'll say, thank you very much, everybody, i appreciate you coming, and i'll leave. >> like this? >> no, i'm standing in that spot. i love this guy right here. let me give this guy a hug right here. i love this guy right here. yeah. >> a hug for kanye, but for reporters he doesn't like, his own lack of decorum is on
4:03 pm
prominent display. >> what a stupid question that is. what a stupid question. but i watch you a lot, you ask a lot of stupid questions. the same thing with april ryan. i watch her get up, i mean, you talk about somebody that's a loser, she doesn't know what the hell she's doing. >> i don't even need words here, do i? this isn't about decorum or respect for the white house, right? it's about controlling the press. the president making it clear that if he can't take away press passes, fine, he'll manipulate other journalists to accomplish his goal of silencing the questions he doesn't want. he didn't hide his intent. let me play a little bit more of what he said today so you can hear it for yourself. >> if i think somebody's acting out of sorts, i will leave. i'll say, thank you very much, everybody, i appreciate you coming, and i'll leave. and those reporters will not be too friendly to whoever it is that's acting up. >> that's the crucial final line, right? trump will leave if he doesn't like a question so he's betting
4:04 pm
that losing access to him altogether will make all the other reporters get in line and silence the reporter who was, quote, unquote, not being too friendly or acting out of sorts. i'm sorry. acting out of sorts. look, this isn't about decorum or respect. if it was, president trump would know that a question a president doesn't like is showing respect for the white house, because that is what a free press and democracy is all about. maybe he should listen to what a president he says he greatly admires had to stand and take. >> sir, if i may, the polls show that a lot of american people just simply don't believe you, that the one thing that you've had going for you more than anything else in your presidency, your credibility, has been severely damaged. can you repair it? what does it mean for the rest of your presidency? >> well, i imagine i'm the only one around who wants to repair it and i didn't have anything to do with damaging it. >> he didn't kick him out. didn't like the question, tried to answer it. tough questions aren't disrespectful or lacking decorum. having someone in the oval office dropping f-bombs and then
4:05 pm
giving them a hug is. jessica schneider is "outfront." jessica, the president responding directly to the judge's ruling in favor of cnn's jim acosta, which temporarily is forcing the white house to reinstate acosta's press pass and what we're hearing today is he seems to be saying he'll find other ways to silence those he doesn't want to hear. >> reporter: and that seems to be the message, really, from every facet of the white house, not just the president. even sarah sanders said in a statement immediately after the judge's ruling that the white house, they plan to develop rules and procedures in their words, and they say there must be decorum at those press conferences and any interaction with the president. what's interesting is the judge in this case, timothy kelly, he's a trump appointee, been on the bench for just about a year, he also touched on that possibility when he read his ruling today. he said, it's quite possible the president may never call on jim acosta again, but then judge kelly quickly pivoted and he said that that potential decision from the white house to not call on jim acosta, he said that wasn't relevant to his decision today, and that
4:06 pm
decision today, erin, it was a very narrow ruling here. the judge found that jim acosta's due process rights were likely violated when the white house revoked his pass so suddenly. he said that since acosta didn't have any notice or an opportunity to challenge the decision, and as a result, the hard pass must be instated -- reinstated, which it was. you know, but this was just round one, and by all accounts, it looks like the white house is going to move forward with this fight. the justice department has said as much, and of course they're also going to try to get a much broader ruling on their broader argument that first amendment protections don't mean an absolute right to access at the white house. so, this litigation path, erin, it could take a while, and in the meantime, you heard it there from the president. he's going to tamp down on press availability, maybe not ask -- call on reporters that he doesn't like their questions. he said it today, he might limit the number of questions. he might bar them from making statements. so there could be a lot of implications here, erin. >> all right, thank you very much. you know, you talk about, you
4:07 pm
know, penny wise, pound foolish, this is pretty stunning. former adviser of four presidents, david gergen, former staff member, margaret hoover and cnn senior political analyst mark preston. margaret, you're with me. no problem calling someone stupid or a loser if he doesn't want to hear what they have to ask but now, fine, we'll reinstate the press pass but we may not hold the availability. we may not allow questions. we may try to get you guys all to turn on each other. not about decorum. >> well, it's all about decorum so long as decorum is a one-way street and that's the deal with president trump is that decorum is a one-way street. he wants to be treated with respect, but he expects a certain kind of coverage from the press, because this is what he is actually good at in the private sector was branding and marketing himself and he did that by very carefully crafting how the press covered him, and it just turns out that when you're a private entrepreneur and businessman, there's a lot more flexibility to be able to do that with the tools and levers of the press and not when you're the president of the united states. >> i mean, you know, david, you
4:08 pm
see how he talks to reporters. kanye west, obviously, we saw that laid out. have you ever seen anything like that? what do you make of that juxtaposed with decorum and respect being the words of the day from president trump? >> well, we haven't seen anything like kanye west before, and i trust we will never again. see a person like that in the oval office speaking like that. it's hard to bring your kids in to watch television these days sometimes, isn't it, but it's good to see you back. look, i think the fundamental issue here is the right of the public to know and hold the president accountable, and parliamentary governments, the prime minister has to go in every day and answer -- and have question time and respond to in a very public way what's going on within the government. we don't have that in this country. there is no question time for presidents, and the only thing we have are these -- these press gatherings. when the press can ask questions on behalf of the country.
4:09 pm
so it's really important to maintain that tradition. that goes all the way back to teddy roosevelt, over 100 years of presidents answering questions on a regular basis. franklin roosevelt used to have two press conferences a week on average over 13 years and was very, very accessible and it was a lot of decorum, a lot of respect shown to him. frankly, i think that the respect -- there's higher respect shown to a president today than when i first went to washington. when i first went there, the president -- the press conferences, usually the press would stand up and there would be a lot of shouting and jumping to get the president's attention. now people are sitting down and i think there is more decorum. what is at issue here is this decorum argument is really -- is a cover so that they can -- they can control the press and turn away questions that are inconvenient, which i think then reduces the public's capacity to know what's going on. i would add one coda. that is, this was a significant victory today in the courts for
4:10 pm
cnn and for freedom of the press, especially because it came from a trump appointee to the court. >> right. that is obviously significant, as you and jessica point out. mark, you know, the clip that i played, sam donaldson asking former president reagan something he didn't want to be asked, right? other presidents get this. this always happens. as david said, they used to stand up and certainly with the press secretary, i mean, it's one more question, one more question, yelling, i mean, if you aren't tough, don't go in that room. but no one's ever been -- you haven't seen banned -- no one's been banned from these press conferences, no one losing credentials, so what happens here for trump? >> well, a couple things. one is i would take what he said today, his warning, very seriously. i do think that the white house is going to continue to clamp down on the amount of information that they send out and quite honestly a lot of the information they're sending out right now is misinformation, so i agree, we have to have these news conferences every day. we have to have the back and
4:11 pm
forth with the administration. otherwise, we're not going to be able to keep them in line and it's worth noting, even if you don't like cnn, if you're watching us right now or if you don't like jim acosta as a person, it's not about us. it's about you and i think that people need to understand that because if they come and knock us out, they're coming for you next and that's very, very scary. >> right. that's the precedent, margaret, that would be set here and what's amazing is that what the president's saying is, i can get there another way. fine. have your little press pass. i don't have to call on you. i don't have to hold the press conference. i can have your peers turn against you. >> and what he's trying to do is also send a message to journalists who cover him in a way that he views as favorable, and he's calling on them, giving them 45 minutes to show up at the white house and giving them as much time as they want with him. this just happened with the "daily caller." two reporters were called out of the blue for a sitdown with the president. there is a criticism amongst republicans that the president's writing here too, that the media's unfair, the media's been unfair to presidents for a long time. there's no president that believes the media is fair to them, okay? this is the system of checks and
4:12 pm
balances. there's not -- not the clintons, not bush, not obama, not hillary clinton, and nobody believes it's fair but that's the entire, by design, by the founders. this is why we have a first amendment. this is why we have a series of checks and balances and so this is so we, we, meaning the american people, can hold our government to account. by the people, of the people, for the people. >> you know, david, let me play, again, the interview with fox news. when you talk about the friendly outlets that he chooses to give his time to. let me just play again what he said to them about acting up. here he is. >> if i think somebody's acting out of sorts, i will leave. i'll say, thank you very much, everybody, i appreciate you coming, and i'll leave. and those reporters will not be too friendly to whoever it is that's acting up. >> just walking out and leaving, david. what would be the precedent for that if he just started doing that every time he didn't like a question? >> i just think it would be very
4:13 pm
inhibiting for the whole set of exchanges if you're always going to be on edge if you ask a question that he finds inconvenient and he walks out. if they're going to have a set of rules, it's got to be when a reporter asks a question, that reporter can have a follow-up so you can dig a little deeper. it's got to be that you do call on the wire services, you do call on the leading organizations out of there. you don't go ideological on them. it's got to be a set of rules that serves both the president and the public. and the press. >> and yet, mark, he also -- he's already made it hard for some, right? the reporter he called stupid is a cnn reporter hech. he didn't like her questions. the reporter he called a loser, april ryan, people know her as well. he has no problem humiliating someone and denigrating them in a way that lacks decorum and respect, that's for sure, when he doesn't like them already. >> no question and we can just lay it at the footstep of his own house. we heard melania trump the other day say she's not surprised that people make fun of her or don't understand why she's pursuing this goal of ending
4:14 pm
cyberbullying. well, we know why people make fun of her because of that, because her husband is really leading the charge in cyber bullies. >> he needs to be careful. all you do is risk rallying a real backlash from the press and the american people if you make the entire press the enemy of the good -- the enemy of the people or the enemy of yourself, what are you doing but risking a backlash because if you're not tough enough to go out and take questions on behalf of the people you represent, who's the weak one? >> all right. well said. we'll leave it there. thank you all. next, president trump reveals he has personally responded to bob mueller's questions. >> i write the answers. my lawyers don't write answers. i write answers. >> the president's long-time friend and attorney, jay goldberg, responds. plus, breaking news, "the washington post" this hour reporting that the cia has concluded the saudi crown prince personally ordered the assassination of a "washington post" columnist. but the president reportedly resistant to accept his own
4:15 pm
intelligence chief. why? and kelleyanne conway's husband reveals what he really thinks about the trump administration. >> the administration is like a [ bleep ] show in a dumpster fire. iyou may be at increased riskf for pneumococcal pneumonia -a potentially serious bacterial lung disease that can disrupt your routine for weeks. in severe cases, pneumococcal pneumonia can put you in the hospital. it can hit quickly, without warning, making you miss out on what matters most. a single dose of the prevnar 13® vaccine can help protect you from pneumococcal pneumonia. prevnar 13® is approved for adults to help prevent infections from 13 strains of the bacteria that cause pneumococcal pneumonia. don't get prevnar 13® if you have had a severe allergic reaction to the vaccine or its ingredients.
4:16 pm
adults with weakened immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects were pain, redness and swelling at the injection site, limited arm movement, fatigue, headache, muscle pain, joint pain, less appetite, vomiting, fever, chills, and rash. prevention begins with prevnar 13®. ask your doctor or pharmacist about prevnar 13®. well you remember what happened last year. you can't bring a backup thanksgiving to my sister's house. it's not like we're going to walk in with it. we'll bring it in as we need it. ...phase it in. phase it in? yeah, phase it in. phase it in? up here at the dewar's distillery, all our whiskies are aged, blended and aged again. it's the reason our whisky is so extraordinarily smooth. dewar's. double aged for extra smoothness.
4:17 pm
opportunlike here.rywhere. and here. see? opportunity. ev-er-y-where. about to be parents. meeting the parents. and this driver, logging out to watch his kid hit one out of the... (bat hits ball) opportunity is everywhere. all you have to do to find it is get out...here. ♪ but some give their clients cookie cutter portfolios. fisher investments tailors portfolios to your goals and needs.
4:18 pm
some only call when they have something to sell. fisher calls regularly so you stay informed. and while some advisors are happy to earn commissions whether you do well or not. fisher investments fees are structured so we do better when you do better. maybe that's why most of our clients come from other money managers. fisher investments. clearly better money management. i switched to sprint because they have a great network and i knew i'd save a ton of money. sprint's nationwide lte advanced network is now up to 2x faster than when i switched. and their total lte coverage is 30% larger. that's big news!! don't forget unlimited. sprint's unlimited can save you nearly $1000 in the first year over verizon and at&t. just think what you can do with all that extra money. (vo) up to two times faster than before. see how you can save nearly $1000. for those with hearing loss sprint. visit sprintrelay.com. breaking news, president
4:19 pm
trump's legal team balking, taking issue with some of the questions as they have in hand from special counsel bob mueller. according to a source familiar with negotiations, trump's team claiming questions about the transition period after the election should be off limits. they're citing executive privilege. but today, the president came out, spoke about it publicly. he says he is finished with at least some of the written questions from mueller and he wrote those answers himself. >> i write the answers. my lawyers don't write answers. i write answers. i was asked a series of questions. i've answered them very easily. very easily. i'm sure they're tricked up, because you know, they like to catch people, gee, you know, was the weather sunny or was it rainy? he said it may have been a good day, it was rainy, therefore, he told a lie. he perjured himself. you have to be careful when i answer questions with people that have bad intentions, but no, it's -- the questions were
4:20 pm
very routinely answered by me. >> "outfront" tonight, president trump's long-time friend and attorney, jay goldberg, also the author of the new book, "the courtroom is my theater: my lifelong representation of famous politicians, industrialists, men of honor and more." you've obviously talked to the president over a long period of time about this entire investigation. what do you make of how he is being right now, making the whole point, i wrote it, i don't need the lawyers, i wrote them. >> that's a big mistake. a person who acts his own client -- a person who acts as his own lawyer has a fool for a client. mark twain said that. and it's a big mistake. because the people on the other side are anxious to make a case, and they'll engage in perjury traps and reading everything the way they want to read it, and force a trial, which would be to subject the president to a
4:21 pm
circus atmosphere, and it's a big mistake. >> why do you think he's insisting on doing it, then? why is he insisting on writing his own? >> the question would be whether he did. >> so he may be saying it but it's not really -- >> he may be trying to show macho, but i can't imagine that giuliani wouldn't have gone over the answers to make sure that they're accurate or not. and i'm not sure that the president is telling the absolute truth when he says that he wrote these answers out himself. >> so, if he's not telling the absolute truth there, we know he has a tenuous relationship with the truth in many ways on statements he says separate from this investigation, just in general life when he comes out and says things. why do you call it a perjury trap? maybe it's just there's a lot of lies. >> well, first a perjury trap, to the viewers, it's the role of a prosecutor to prosecute past an existing criminal behavior. it's not the job of a prosecutor
4:22 pm
to manufacture alleged criminal behavior. a perjury trap -- >> you're saying if he said, i knew -- i didn't know about that meeting in trump tower and it turnds o turns out he did, is that a lie or a perjury trap? >> it depends on whether it's true or not. it would subject the president to a possibility of a trial and remember the president is subject to the criminal law at least once he leaves office. and to subject himself to the possibility of a trial would be not in the public's interest or certainly not in the president's interest. >> but if -- i'm just trying to understand. if they're asking a question, did you know about that, and then the written answer, he says, yes, i did, let's just say he did, right? obviously, before he said he didn't. that's a significant lie. that would be fair game, right? >> it would be. and that's why intelligent defense lawyers do not subject
4:23 pm
their clients to examinations by prosecutors. if you're an alleged target of an investigation, and he has to be viewed as a target, you don't subject yourself to interrogation by a prosecutor. >> so you're saying they shouldn't even be doing these written questions -- >> no. i mean, i opposed this from the outset. in fact, i made my position known in april. i remember it exactly. i said, do not subject yourself to interrogation by a prosecutor. i don't trust -- >> no matter the format. >> i don't trust certain members of the staff of mueller. one of whom i'm very, very concerned about, and it came to me as a surprise that he's now involved in answering questions, because i think there's a good possibility of him winning in the supreme court or the lower courts that the president is not subject -- >> but he shouldn't have to answer the questions at all. >> yes.
4:24 pm
>> so you think he shouldn't even be doing these and if he is, his lawyers should be writing them, not him. >> i'm convinced that he may have written them, but the lawyer would have the final word. >> okay. so, yesterday, when this came out, when it started to come out that we may be at a stage here where he has finished some of these answers, he went on twitter. he had been quiet on the russia investigation for a while but he went on twitter and he called the special counsel all kinds of bad things, conflicted, the team thugs, nuts, he made false claims in some of these tweets, just inaccurate things about mueller and he has tenure and his party affiliation. and today, he was asked about those, and here's what he said, jay. >> on twitter yesterday, you seemed a bit agitated about what you might be receiving the mueller investigation. >> no, i'm not agitated. it's a hoax. the whole thing is a hoax. there was no collusion. >> well, he's convinced that the issue is whether there's collusion or not. and i say, it goes beyond that.
4:25 pm
that the prosecutor could allegedly nail somebody on a host of issues, except and in addition to the question of collusion. he could ask him whether there was a meeting that he attended at a certain time and place. it doesn't necessarily have to be collusion. >> before we go, cnn this week had a larger part about the president's state of mind, the chaos in the white house, people who are departing, people close to him said he's pissed at damn near everyone. that's a quote. some of his long-time confidants worried for his health, they say he gained weight, they're worried act his health. do you see anything to be concerned about? >> well, in the room, prior to my appearance, i commented to my wife that he looked very well. >> you think he looks very well. >> i thought he looked very well. and of course he's under a great deal of pressure. i mean, his road of -- he's been on the road since the time he announced his candidacy. >> fair. >> so, of course he's worn with
4:26 pm
the trips and the attacks on him and the question of his wife's behavior in the firing or ostensible firing of a woman who worked in the white house. so, he's subject to a great deal of stress, but i think he looks very well. >> all right, jay, thank you very much. i appreciate your time. good to see you. >> thank you. i broke my shoulder, so i'll say good-bye with my left hand. >> all right. thank you. and "outfront" next, breaking news, "the washington post" reporting that is cia is determined the saudi crown prince personally ordered the assassination of a "washington post" columnist. so, will president trump now hold the saudi prince accountable? and the president reportedly questioning the loyalty tonight of this man. >> i'm deeply humbled as your vice president. greatest privilege of my life. the greatest privilege of my life. >> why the sudden concern about pence. oh! oh! ♪ ozempic®! ♪ (vo) people with type 2 diabetes
4:27 pm
are excited about the potential of once-weekly ozempic®. in a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. oh! under seven? (vo) and you may lose weight. in the same one-year study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. oh! up to 12 pounds? (vo) a two-year study showed that ozempic® does not increase the risk of major cardiovascular events like heart attack, stroke, or death. oh! no increased risk? ♪ ozempic®! ♪ ozempic® should not be the first medicine for treating diabetes, or for people with type 1 diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. do not share needles or pens. don't reuse needles. do not take ozempic® if you have a personal or family history of medullary thyroid cancer, multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if you are allergic to ozempic®. stop taking ozempic® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, itching, rash, or trouble breathing. serious side effects may happen, including pancreatitis.
4:28 pm
tell your doctor if you have diabetic retinopathy or vision changes. taking ozempic® with a sulfonylurea or insulin may increase the risk for low blood sugar. common side effects are nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, and constipation. some side effects can lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. i discovered the potential with ozempic®. ♪ oh! oh! oh! ozempic®! ♪ (vo) ask your healthcare provider if ozempic® is right for you.
4:29 pm
comcast business built the nation's largest gig-speed network. then went beyond. beyond chasing down network problems. to knowing when and where there's an issue. beyond network complexity. to a zero-touch, one-box world. optimizing performance and budget. beyond having questions. to getting answers. "activecore, how's my network?" "all sites are green." all of which helps you do more than your customers thought possible. comcast business. beyond fast. major development this hour. the cia has determined that the saudi crown prince ordered
4:30 pm
journalist jamal khashoggi's assassination. according to "the washington post," the cia examined multiple sources of intelligence which included this, a phone call that the crown prince's brother, who is the saudi ambassador to the united states, had with khashoggi. "outfront" now, shane harris, one of the reporters who broke the story for the "washington post." shane, obviously, this is a huge development. this is not what the president wants to hear tonight. so, tell me what the cia has -- what has convinced them of the fact that mbs ordered personally this assassination. >> well, it's kind of a mosaic of intelligence, actually. there's the phone call that you mentioned, which is quite important with the ambassador talking to jamal khashoggi before he disappeared. also, there is a phone call from inside the consulate, we understand from our sources, from one of the individuals that was part of this hit team calling back to saudi arabia to confirm to a senior aide to mohammed bin salman that the assassination had taken place. there's also an audio from a
4:31 pm
listening device inside the consulate that the turks had placed and that audio was given to the cia. there's other forms of intelligence we probably don't even know about but also a big part of this is the cia's assessment since well before jamal khashoggi was killed that nothing really happens in the kingdom of saudi arabia without mohammed bin salman, the crown prince's say-so. and they find it impossible to believe that an operation of this magnitude could have occurred without mbs, as he's known, authorizing it, and so that is also factoring into their conclusion that he was the person who ordered this assassination. >> and literally you're saying from the consulate where, at this point, jamal khashoggi's body is being destroyed with acid or disposed of in some way, somebody in that consulate calls mbs, crown prince of saudi arabia, and says, it's been completed. >> an aide to the crown prince, that's right. which is kind of a stunning fact when you consider that you would
4:32 pm
assume that if you were operating inside a diplomatic facility like this, there might be the risk in that country that you could be intercepted. this was a brazen attack, as we all know, and has been well documented. but the intelligence ultimately was collected by the united states and also by other governments, including turkey, and is forming this full picture that we're seeing now. >> this isn't what the president wants to hear. he's made that loud and clear, right? i talked to mbs, he assures he he did nothing, he doesn't want to hear this, right? there's nobody probably who wanted to be given the out of saying somebody else was responsible, which saudi arabia's trying to say, right? blaming deputy head of intelligence, anybody but mbs. so, what's your analysis, shane, as to why this came to you guys? was the cia worried that this would be swept under the rug or that the president wouldn't take action? i mean, it is interesting that this is coming out this way. >> well, we've been reporting pretty aggressively, as you know, on this story for a long time, and one of the questions that we have had, obviously, is
4:33 pm
what assessments are being made. >> yeah. >> about these fragments of intelligence that are being reported. you know what i think is interesting in this, you mentioned president trump, this is not news to him. he understands this information. he probably knows more about what the cia has than we even know about what they have at this point. and it has been made clear to him that the assessment is that mohammed bin salman directed, ordered this assassination. so, what we've seen and what we've reported on before as well is that the white house's position on this has been to essentially try not to take too much action. yes, there were these sanctions this week, but they followed on a statement from the public prosecutor in saudi arabia and charges there that, of course, implicated a lot of people but not mohammed bin salman, so you know, i don't think it's -- it's no secret the president has not wanted to pin this on the crown prince. >> certainly puts him in the hot seat tonight, then. shane, thank you very much, and obviously, as some very significant reporting there.
4:34 pm
the cia assessment that the crown prince is involved, obviously, is not what president trump wants to hear. trump said last month, let me quote, i will say this. i spoke with the king. i spoke with the crown prince yesterday, and he strongly said he had nothing to do with this. this was at a lower level. let's go to kaitlan collins at the white house now. kaitlan, look, this coming out and now everybody knows the cia's assessment, now it conflicts with what the president wants to hear. is this going to force the white house to act or not? >> reporter: and you're right, erin, that was a great question about why this assessment became public. does the cia trying to shield itself of any responsibility for this for whatever decisions the white house makes and i think shane made a great point there, that of course president trump likely already knows this. he met with haskell after she traveled back from turkey after getting all these intelligence assessments, so he likely already knows what we know, but the question is, what is he going to do going forward? because this isn't the first
4:35 pm
time the president has been at odds with an intelligence agency before during the his presidency but now they are really putting the ball in his court with this decision and that's because -- from gina haspel who succeeded mike pompeo after he took over at the state department. so it's raising questions about how the president will react now that this cia assessment is public, but also, erin, it points back to jared kushner, the president's son-in-law and senior adviser who has forged a very close relationship with the crown prince who the cia is assessing did know and did order the killing of this journalist, so it puts even more pressure on this white house not just to act but also to focus on this relationship that jared kushner has forged with them. so, the question really is now, erin, is the white house going to act on this? are they going to let this slide them by? all the focus is going to be on the white house who, for the past few weeks, has tried to put this story behind them. >> they certainly have. kaitlan, thank you. will go to bob bayer, former cia
4:36 pm
operative. what do you think the significance is here of the fact that this is coming out now and the details, right? like they are including the details. there was a call made from inside that consulate after the horrific dismembering of jamal khashoggi's body in which someone calls the crown prince's top aide saying the operation has been completed. it does not get more damning than that. >> it doesn't get more damning, erin, it's clear that the crown prince ordered a premeditated murder of khashoggi. you look at the context, you look at the intercept, the phone calls, you look at the turkish laek leaks on this, the fact that more than 20 people showed up in an operation. in saudi arabia, there is no such thing as a rogue operation. anybody who knows saudi arabia knows that mohammed bin salman ordered this, and i think the interesting part is the cia has confirmed this, and it's almost as a revolt from langley, telling the president, look, you can say what you want, but you're absolutely wrong, and let's don't ferlgorget this wast
4:37 pm
of his first deal going to saudi arabia and starting an alliance with mohammed bin salman, this is the art of the deal, i trust this guy, the arms deal and the rest of it. this is a huge setback for the president. >> i mean, it certainly is. you got to remember the crown prince, when this first came out, said, oh, jamal khashoggi left the consulate, right? remember the guy who had dressed up in his clothes and there's already been blatant lies from his mouth directly. >> you can't trust anything they say at this point. i mean, they're trying to cover up for the crown prince. there's nobody that can replace him right now. the crown prince controls the intelligence service, the police, the whole country, and so what do you do now? is it going to be a dynastic fight over, you know, getting rid of him? the king is senile. he's only lucid a couple hours a day, and i do worry about the stability of saudi arabia. you have to. and the significance for us. >> all right, bob bayer, thank
4:38 pm
you very much. obviously the president now with a huge, huge decision to make. and next, a problem with pence. trump reportedly questioning aides over whether his vice president is loyal. why now? plus, kelleyanne conway's husband, george, in a very public feud over the president. >> i don't think she likes it. but i don't -- you know, i've told her i don't like the administration, so we're -- it's even.
4:39 pm
4:40 pm
4:41 pm
4:42 pm
is mike pence loyal to president donald trump? "the new york times" reporting that the president is repeating that question so many times that some of his aides have become alarmed. if you remember, it was just last week when the president asked pence to be his 2020 running mate. >> will the vice president be your running mate in 2020? >> well, i haven't asked him but i hope so. mike, will you be my running mate? stand up, mike, please, raise your right hand. no, i'm only kidding. will you? thank you. okay, good. the answer is yes. >> thank you, sir. >> okay. despite that exchange, though, the "times" is reporting that some outside advisers are suggesting the president switch running mates and again they're saying he has been asking about pence's loyalty so many times that his aides are alarmed. "outfront" now, joan walsh, mark lotter, former press secretary to the vice president, and of course mark, i'll note you did
4:43 pm
sign an nda when you left the white house. joan, you're with me. let me start with you. white house statement in response to this "new york times" story, quote, the president absolutely supports the vice president and thinks he's doing an incredible job helping carry out the mission and policies of this administration. and yet, he's asking about his loyalty so many times, aildes ae alarmed. >> well, i mean, the president has been acting in this last week kind of like a cornered animal, erin. i don't think he trusts anyone except maybe his children. so, it's kind of -- it's almost natural that it would even extend out to mike pence, who has shown incredible loyalty as far as i can see. i mean, we know that people in this white house leak. i have never heard his name as one of the leakers or one of the people with the knives out for the president. he goes out, he defended him when people were really attacking him for his language after the synagogue murders. he defended him after charlottesville. he defends him. you know, and so it's very weird. it just seems to me like a sign
4:44 pm
of the president's paranoia, not a sign of anything mike pence has done. >> i mean, mark, if this is the case, that he is questioning pence's loyalty so often that aides are alarmed, what does that make you feel? you know mike pence better than anybody. >> well, and i also know that the president has the absolute faith in the vice president. i've traveled with both of them extensively in the last couple of months, and i've never heard anything like that. look, since day one, there have been people out there trying to drive a wedge between the president and the vice president from the time he was named on the ticket, and this is like a sport in washington, d.c., about every midterm in your first midterm, someone questions whether the vice president's going to be on the ticket or not. president answered that a week ago and i don't think anything has changed. >> well, one of the -- the ways that this president has gauged loyalty is how people treated him with the infamous pee tape, right? and i -- p, the letter. you guys know what it stands for. mike pence, you just went through joan all the times he's been loyal and stood by the
4:45 pm
president. that tape, the "access hollywood" tape, he was not. he put out a statement, mark. as a husband and father, i was offended by the words and actions described by donald trump in the 11-year-old video. "the new york times" is reporting the president has never forgotten that statement. we know with others he didn't forget it. chris christie didn't go on tv that weekend to defend him, he became totally persona non grata. is it possible that something like that, couple little things and then something like that all of a sudden he remembers it and this matters? >> i don't think so. because i also remember being with the vice president that weekend and he said the president needed to go out and explain to the american people and he did. the vice president was on the campaign trail the very next day. we were fund-raising in newport, rhode island, and we were then off and running again for the final month or so of the election and he hasn't stopped. in fact, he's in, i think, papua, new guinea, or in transit between australia and new guinea representing the president in
4:46 pm
the indo-pacific all week long. >> joan, here's the thing. mike pence, as you say, is, obviously, the "access hollywood" thing may or may not be significant at this point, but in so many other ways, i mean, loyal to a point where it's become sort of a joke and a punch line in some ways. i mean, here are some of the examples. >> it's the greatest privilege of my life to serve as vice president to a president who's working every day to renew the greatness of this country. from king david's time to our own, president trump has now etched his name into the ineffaceable story of jerusalem. the book is entitled the art of the deal and it's actually an american classic. greatest privilege of my life is to serve as vice president to a president who's keeping his word to the american people. i'm deeply humbled as your vice president to be able to be here. >> he's known, of course, for his looks at the president. >> longingly. >> look, if he is, as "the new york times" reports, questioning the loyalty of a guy who says
4:47 pm
things like, you're like king david, "the art of the deal" is an american classic, then who the he cck does the president trust? >> no one. i mean, i think we've gotten to this point where he is capable of questioning the loyalty of this man. i mean, even in that clip that you showed before where the president asked him to be his vice president, you know, and he said, raise your right hand, oh, no, don't do that. but he raised his right hand. i mean, he is so responsive to this president's quirks and his -- >> that's an interesting observation. i didn't even notice that. >> he did. and his quirks and his insecurity and his paranoia, he is just a soothing presence that melania is not to be honest, at least in the public sphere, i don't know what she's like at home. so, it's -- i think it's terribly disloyal. this man does not -- i don't like him. excuse me. i didn't vote for him. i don't know him personally. but he doesn't deserve this. next, kelleyanne conway's husband speaking out in a way we have never heard before. i'm going to speak to one of the men who sat down with george
4:48 pm
conway. plus, president trump called a race before it was actually ready to be called. >> mia love gave me no love and she lost. too bad. sorry about that, mia. >> if you were reveling a little too quickly, mia love is now in the lead. your life. it's time to get out of line with upmc. at upmc, living-donor transplants put you first. so you don't die waiting. upmc does more living-donor liver transplants than any other center in the nation. find out more and get out of line today. tailored recommendations, tax-efficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth.
4:49 pm
fidelity wealth management. ♪ ♪ -whoops -sorry! ♪ ♪ winning audience awards greeacross the country.ovie terrific. there's no better way to spend the holidays than with viggo mortensen and mahershala ali. they're so good, you'll wish the movie would never end. oh that was a good time. you get the price match guarantee. so if you find your room at a lower rate, hilton is like... we're gonna match that rate and give you an extra 25% off. what would travel sites do if you found a different price?
4:50 pm
that's not my problem, it's your problem. book at hilton.com and get the hilton price match guarantee. tonight, george conway, a respected conservative lawyer giving a blunt, to say the least, assessment of president trump. here is what he said when he withdrew from consideration of a job from the justice department as chief of the civil division.
4:51 pm
>> i don't know what time of year it was, i'm washitching th thing and the administration is like [ bleep ] a dumpster fire. and i'm like i don't want to do that, i don't know. and then you got the comey firing, and then him going on tv saying i had russia on my mind, and it's like oh, no. >> and out front now, the editor and chief of yahoo news that interviewed conway in the podcast called skull duggery. putting his hand on his head, i mean, conway has criticized the president on twitter, but this is a whole new thing, a whole new game that you have now seen. why is he doing this right now? >> well, i think it was an evolution. he started doing it fairly subtlely at first.
4:52 pm
retweeting some people. starting his own tweets, and then he just got angrier and angrier and said it was time to speak out. he said when trump trump won he had tears of joy. how does he feel defending voting for trump. here is how he answered your question. >> i wasn't a big fan of the clintons generally and my view was that he was the lesser evil, and -- >> is that still your view? >> i don't know. if i had to, you know, i just don't know if faced with the choice again i would probably move to australia. >> i mean, do you believe him? >> i absolutely believe him. he has every incentive not to speak out. primarily the fact that his wife is one of trump's top advisors. also a lot of people have not spoken out because they feel
4:53 pm
like they need support someone. conservative lawyers primarily they are conservative about advancing a legal agenda and making sure there are conservatives on the supreme court. and trump was able to do that with two nom nations and kahn way's view is that these conservatives have sold their souls, and his view is that there is more than the supreme court, there is basic values. >> i want to play another exchange, your college here asking conway about kellyanne. they're married, the top advisor to the president, who is throwing expletives around about how he feels about trump. here is this exchange. >> how is all of your activity, antitrump administration activity going on with
4:54 pm
kellyannei told her i don't like the administration. i would probably not be on this podcast, i would be on a beach somewhere. do you buy this? this is a typical dc marriage? >> no, it is not. i think that, you know, the fact that he said he started that by saying she is not happy with what he is saying, but he doesn't like the trump administration, it is refrequlee of what is going on. the sense that i got, and it is only a sense is that there is issues in the conway household that remain unresolved on this issue. >> look, i think anyone watching would expect that, but conway recently rote an op-ed.
4:55 pm
he said it was unconstitutional. it was set to play this a big response. >> who? >> kellyanne's husband. >> constitutionally appointing -- >> he is just trying to get publicity for himself. >> first of all, it is just a demeaning thing, right? calling him mr. kellyanne conway, is that supposed to be demeaning? he finds out that he is like a boss. is this going to end up a choice that kellyanne has to make. she could, it is hard to know. we have seen in recent weeks that trump seems to privilege
4:56 pm
loyalty there is a question of whether or not mike pence is loil enough. i think that clip is right out of his play book. when he doesn't like someone or feels threatened by someone, he basically, his stock answer is i don't know that person. in this particular case, i think he almost tried to just take his whole identity away saying he will not say george conway, he is mr. kellyanne conway. he said i also, he kind of deflected it, i also call myself mr. kellyanne conway. so he sort of pivoted based on what trump said appreciate your
4:57 pm
time. >> pulling out a razor thing victo victory. tom, a lot of things to go through here. let's take a look here in florida, it is still a tight lens in a sense, but here is the reality. somehow the recount happened. they have enough votes to make the difference, but this is the real difference. he had to overcome a pretty big margin. there is no sign that is going to happen now. he is saying you have to count every vote.
4:58 pm
he is the governor governor elect. >> the house, we have seen races come in throughout the week. i have to say play it again, the president was reveling in what was anticipated to be her loss. >> it looked like she was going to lose. here it is. >> mia love gave me no love. and she lost. too bad. sorry about that, mia. >> okay, we'll see if that is the last word here. he is bitter that she didn't embrace him, but look at what has happened here. ben mcadams has had a tiny lead over her. just today, i want you to look at how close this is. she is ahead by 400 votes, that
4:59 pm
is a tyiny margin, but if it holds on, if she becomes the winner. the republican vote from someone that she shunned and treated badly. i don't know how much that is worth, erin. this is the big map on all of this, the big map is that there is six outstanding, only two of them where the republicans are now leading the vote. one of whom is a republican that he dissed. hopefully the counting will be done before 2020. >> when it comes to mia love, his words, only likely to add fuel to her political dislike of him. >> in all fairness, what does she owe to him now? i would think nothing. >> all right, tom, thank you very much. as we're watching that. thank you to all of you for joining us. have a great weekend. watch "out front" any time,
5:00 pm
anywhere, just go to cnn go. ac 360 begins right now. let's go back to work, john berman here sitting in for anderson. a federal judge, a trump appointee, by the way, director of the white house, to reinstate his press pass. the work is the most important thing asking questionquestions, elected officials honest, keeping them honest no matter who has the microphone. the administration's particular words and actions have sparked so much concern. the white house did what it did with his credentials, it is why we're giving this claim by the president such close scrutiny tonight. >> you understand we want total freedom of the press. it is more important to me