welcome to "inside politics." i'm john king. thank you for sharing your day with us. the partial government shutdown is about to become the longest on record. this as tens of thousands of federal workers mark a federal p payday without pay and feel the pinch of the republican office. michael cohen said the president broke campaign laws and lied about his business dealings. the president says cohen is a liar. help still wanted. ten days shy of the two-year mark, new numbers show a stunning number of senior trump administration jobs are vacant.

record-breaking turnover in a white house we were promised would be exceptional. >> we're going to make america great again. we're going to use the best people. we're going to deliver. we're going to get the best people in the world. we don't want people who are b level, c level, d level. we have to get our absolute best. >> we're going to use our smartest and our best. we're not using political hacks anymore. >> it's a sophisticated chess match, but i've got people lined up. you have to use people that are truly, truly capable. we have to get the best people. >> back to those numbers in a moment, but we begin with the politics and the pain of a now 21-day-old shutdown. both nancy pelosi and chuck schumer say they will win the border fight. the other will follow.

the president is calling it a humanitarian crisis and saying without the wall, we are in danger. while the country waits on washington, payday brings fresh pena cross the country. all federal workers today seeing zero in their bank accounts where there would normally be a paycheck, courtesy of the united states federal government. you see it reads there zero dollars and zero cents. federal workers who live paycheck to paycheck say they're facing new financial stress, and in some cases, financial peril. hawki in horks c -- hock ing their things on line. need to pay my bills, buy my stuff. getting bills past due that are now going unpaid. >> the year-end bills kind of come all at once. our property tax bill. i have two kids in college, and so, you know, there is about

$10,000 worth of college expenses that are coming due, there is a car insurance payment coming up, and so, you know, i can fairly quickly do the math and come up with about $15,000 worth of expenses right now. >> cnn business reporter vanessa yerkovich is in washington. you're seeing many more federal workers than usual. >> reporter: that's right, john. on days when federal workers were expecting a paycheck, they're now having to file for unemployment. the department of labor is saying in the last week of december, that was the first week of the shutdown, 5,000 federal employees applied for unemployment. and that is significant because the week before, it was around 900. that's a 400% increase. so who is eligible for unemployment? it's federal contractors and it's furloughed workers. those are individuals who are not on the job and not working.

however, people that are on the job and not getting paid are not eligible for unemployment. we spoke to one woman who was incredibly frustrated by this and said she would love to be collecting unemployment. here's what she said about how she's doing and how her colleagues are doing as well. >> i already have members who have told me that they've been feeding their children for dinner peanut butter and jelly sandwiches because they don't have the money to pay for food to get them dinner. and so once saturday, sunday, monday hits, i believe that more people will be unable to come to work because they don't have the money. a majority of our staff live paycheck to paycheck. >> reporter: and that is what we're hearing from local labor unions who represent a lot of federal workers, that they're going to be expecting an uptick in members, federal employees

who are going to be filing for unemployment. the department of labor also hasn't released its unemployment numbers for federal workers from last week, john, and they're expecting that number to rise again. >> the personal toll as we watch this play out. vanessa, appreciate the live reporting there. in studio with me, salmon kim with the "washington post," olivia johnson with pliolitico, olivia knox. when you get those zeros in your account, the government is counting on that to help them with their argument. the question in washington, the question across america, what do you do when you don't get a paycheck? who blinks? the president says we want the wall, we're going to benefit those workers. they think it's for them. are they certain? >> it's unclear who wins at the end of the day, because for a

while you did see the cracks form more and more within the republican party as we got more of these stories about the pain the federal workers are going through. i think once the president made his way to capitol hill this week, particularly among senate republicans, he was able to rally at least a sense of unity after he said, we need to stick together, we just need to stay unified, and it was really only senators such as senator susan collins of maine and lisa murkowski of alaska who spoke out in that private meeting with the president. now if and when he goes ahead with this national emergency declaration, we know that's another act that will divide republicans, those who think this is the only option they have left, those who think this is an abuse of executive power. but it's clear to see, like, who comes out at the end of the day. because again, democrats do feel they do have a strong hand in this, that the wall is very unpopular, but at the same time they are the party that tends to feel more sympathy toward federal workers, and i think that is also a calculus that we shouldn't dismiss at this point.

>> i think -- the question is, as these hardship stories of federal workers accumulate in the coming days and weeks, who does that increase the pressure on? federal workers are, you know, a largely liberal bl orokblock, a question is do they put the pressure on nancy pelosi and say, this has to come to an end, we really feel the crunch here. or do they back her and say we can't pay ransom to a terrorist. democrats and the president are waiting to see here. i think the thing that democrats didn't expect was that the president can be sort of a madman on these sorts of things. he's simply not going to bend. i don't think it's clear if he declares a national emergency that he'll reopen the government. >> if he declares a national emergency, he doesn't have to reopen the government. i just want to remind people. 800,000 federal workers who don't get a paycheck today.

they're supposed to get paid today. if you look at the pay scales, most of them you would define as middle class. some make below $40,000 a year, many make in the 40 to $60,000 range. there are some people at the high end of the scale, so you presume some of those at the higher end might have more savings who can survive missing at least one paycheck. but does washington get this? you talk to members of congress, they say their phones were ringing off the hook already even before today. >> those graphics actually understate the problem because all those people go to restaurants, all those people go to the movies, all those people go to box stores to buy their kids' clothes. there's actually a much bigger ripple effect than federal workers. all those who need a federal license to do something. the fisheries in alaska are a perfect example. the winners and losers, i

thought it was really telling that the administration was taking steps to ease the pain on some of its own constituencies. that's telling you that pain is something they felt they need to do avoid. farmers who were getting transfer payments to help them because they were suffering as a result of the president's trade war, right? that program got locked up. they ended up extending the deadline to apply for it. so the reason the white house is moving to ease the pain on their own constituency tells you that's a financial lever. >> and despite the 800,000 federal workers going without paychecks, federal contractors are not guaranteed pay when the shutdown ends. the house is essentially taking that up as we speak, but it's the contractors who are not guaranteed back pay. >> you say maybe i'm for the wall, maybe i'm against the wall, the politicians should work this out under these

circumstances, not on our backs. >> i don't see a paycheck before the first of february, and where is my rent going to come from? >> my husband is making homemade bread because it's cheaper than buying it at the store. >> i have one more car payment and then i have to go to carmax and sell my car. >> the government says, let's reopen the government, mr. president, and then we'll negotiate. the president says, no way, because that's my only leverage. right? is it any more complicated than that? >> that's pretty much what's happening. the democrats believe they are winning the public argument, and that does appear to be borne out in polls so far, that a lot more people blame the president and republicans than are blaming the democrats. but as eliana is saying, that doesn't necessarily do you any good if that's not what the polls say. you do notice in the talking points democrats are reciting on this, they're focusing much more on opening the government than

they are on the wallisch issue. they're trying to focus on that because they feel that's their strongest argument. they're saying let's go back to normal and then we can negotiate. they are making a case against the president's argument about the crisis at the border, but first and foremost, they're saying, let's get the government back on track, get back to regular order. >> that's a key point because the democrats have passed three of the four bills they say would reopen most of the government. it would reopen treasury, agriculture, hud. they're working on a bill that would fund the department of transportation and the protection agency. now that the democrats are in power for a week now, how will they bring guaforward that billd say, is your number zero to fund the borders, or will they put some number in there to say, here's our starting point, mr. president. here's our number.

>> i would say maybe $1 for that border wall, but they've shown there are ready to put forward some money for border security. they're talking about new technology, repairing existing fencing that is there. you've been seeing efforts to kind of conflate the two and confuse the debate, and i think that's another issue here. i'm recalling the latest situation remaining with the congressional leader this week which didn't go too well when the president reportedly slammed the table and left. but republican leaders came out saying the president requested border security, and nancy pelosi said no. and democrats say later the vice president and senator confirmed that the president asked for a wall and democratic leaders said no. so you do see how the conflation of border security and the wall, which are two different things, are causing a mess in the debate as well. >> this is also why you hear the president say when democrats say they want border security but

won't fund the wall, they're pulling one over on you, because walls work, and that's why people have gone back to him over and over again, this is why wealthy people have put walls around their house. he wants people to think border security means very little without a physical barrier. >> i assume at some point, we'll get to this in a minute, after they resume negotiations, we would think the democrats believe they're winning right now. at some point they have to put on the table, how much are they willing to give and then we'll see. they just passed a bill to reopen the department of interior and department of protection agency. the house says, i'm not touching those. the president offers an offramp to the shutdown amidst the chaos. channelling one thought as they pose for a team photo.

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welcome back. as we went to break, the house passing an additional piece of information, this to make sure the furloughed government workers will get their back pay. it just passed in the house 11-7. now it will go to the president for his signature. the president fighting an administration case in the fight. the president hosts another round of border security. the bet on capitol hill is the next big move is for the president to declare a national emergency to pay for his wall. the administration actively looking to spend billions of dollars in unspent defense department money. otherwise there is unused budget

for disaster relief. he said this earlier today. >> you said you will most likely declare a national emergency. how soon will that happen? >> if we don't get a deal from congress, i may do it. i'm allowed to do it, lawsuit is 100% on my side. if we can't make a deal with congress, and we should be able to make a deal with congress. >> it's important to note as we discuss this, even if the president declared a national emergency, the government doesn't automatically reopen. the senate would still have to reach agreement for him to assign openings of part of the government. if he does this, somebody will sue, we'll let the courts figure it out, but at least you could get back to the table to reopen the government. president obama had the chance to do a national emergency and he said, that's an overreach. chuck grassley today moved from

judiciary saying, i don't want you to do this, mr. president. >> this is not a guarantee of the government reopening. we talked to mark meadows yesterday afternoon, a close trump ally, and he told reporters, i don't understand why people are saying just because he does this national emergency declaration that the government will automatically reopen. it's by no means a process that the president would agree to do that, even if he goes ahead and makes his declaration. but we've heard so much -- some of the complaints we've heard about from republicans are the potential concerns about an overreach of executive power, because this is something they talked a lot about when president obama was in office. so the fact that, you know, the concerns within his own party, the fact that this doesn't necessarily guarantee the government reopening, and also the fact this will get challenged in the courts. i talked to house armed services committee chairman yesterday. i asked him how democrats would respond if this happened. he didn't even let me finish my question before he said, we

would sue. there is a question whether they have standing to sue and their lawyers are working this out right now, but this will get tied up in the courts for a very long time. >> there are a couple things to think about. in terms of republicans being uncomfortable with this, there have been a lot of hypocrisies, republicans criticizing obama for overreach. i don't think we'll hear a lot of that because republicans tend to go along with the president. but i think there is a faction of people around trump who are hoping that the president declares a national emergency, gets sued in the courts and the president says, well, i tried. you know, that's the end of that. they don't actually believe he'll press ahead after there is a lawsuit challenging him. so i think there is sort of -- that's sort of a red herring and the president knows he's likely to lose if he goes down that path but views that right now as the only way out of this that doesn't look like he's caving on

a central campaign promise. he had 100,000 people chanting "build the wall" and i think there are a lot of people who see it as an exit, a smaller number who don't who actually want to see him build this wall. >> which leaves on the table, why didn't his party get it from both chambers of commerce. the president went to the border yesterday. he wore a "make america great again" hat, which should tell you just about everything you need to know, that he uses it in part as a campaign hat. it's a campaign slogan and tells you it's about politics. the border agents were talking to the president about drug crossings. the agents were very honest with the president saying much of the drugs, if not most of the drugs, come through legal ports of entry. the bridges, the openings, the roads where all the congress goes back and forth in addition to the tours. not the sections of border that runs through ranchlands. the president, though, says

this. >> i want to give this to the media a definition of exactly what's in front of us because it looks pretty brutal. this is not a manufactured deal, as you say, this is the real stuff. this is nothing compared to what they have. it's just all recent. this is all very recent. they didn't have to go very far. this is all very recent. >> the striking thing to me here from the beginning is the president won a nomination and then won an election. his party was in control of both chambers of congress the first two years. he didn't get this done. he has every right to push now to the democrats. i get it, but why be misleading? he has a case to make without being misleading. if he talks about drugs, he talks about immigration, there is a problem at the border. most of it is at the port of entry. they'll tell you that if you go there. >> those who they employ as

surrogates or quasi-surrogates to the networks, they're hearing that you need to tidy up your statistics. you cannot hand democrats day in and day out small victories, either through fact checks or gotchas. they're hearing that argument. the thing is, though, starting at the top there is a certain casualness with the facts and the truth, and it's hard to get that message across. they have dialed back. they rolled back some of the numbers they used to use, false numbers they used to use, don't make appearances anymore. >> the president and his allies like to talk about terrorists coming across that border. sarah huckabee sanders getting challenged by that by chris wallace last sunday, and kellyanne conley saying that was an enormous misstatement, which i thought was a concession by the white house. >> you haven't heard it nearly as much. some of what the president was being shown was, yeah, we got these at the ports of entry.

or, you know, we got this -- they didn't necessarily back up the president's -- >> there is an argument if you build more wall or more fencing, you can then dedicate more resources at the point of entry where it's coming through. there is an argument the wall can help focus attention on where it's coming through. >> the president's remarks in the oval office actually had line items for all of that. it had line items for storing up points of entry, security, it had line items for other agents. it had other line items in addition to the wall, and it felt like one little moment that they were playing down the wall. >> trump himself has actually played down the wall at various points. he's talked about, actually, we already made the border tighter in other ways. that was his claim last september when he was preparing to sign the bill the senate had passed before he reversed himself. he spent two years sort of explaining why he wasn't doing this or being put off, because the fact is that the republican

congress didn't want to do this. they didn't think it would really do any good, they didn't view it -- even the immigration hardliners don't think the wall itself is the real solution to tighten the border and reduce illegal immigration and even reduce legal immigration. you do need people, you do need technology, you do need other stuff, and there's places where a physical barrier isn't appropriate according to basically experts on both sides. the president's real argument for the wall has always boiled down to, i said i would do it and people liked it. that's pretty much the extent of the argument. >> he also said mexico would pay for it and he ran from that one yesterday as well. official signs now of a withdrawal of u.s. troops from syria. the question? just how long will it take? ake g your healthcare provider

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it is officially underway. a u.s. military spokesman announcing that the drawdown is underway but refusing to provide any details. cnn learned that ground equipment was removed from syria in recent days. unclear is whether the troop levels are also starting to draw down. mixed messages from the trump administration. the president surprised us a few weeks ago by promising a quick troop withdrawal. but since has promised it will be done carefully. his top aides have tried to calm nervous allies by saying the

drawdown would be on battlefield areas and not political affiliations. they're there mostly to help train kurdish rebels. c clarissa ward is on the ground. they're still on the front lines in many ways. what's the move there? how do the kurds address this move by the united states? >> reporter: well, i think there is mixed messages going on here. there is a sense on the surface that they're trying to make the best of a bad situation, that officials here are continuing to negotiate with u.s. officials to try to get some guarantees about what happens after the u.s. leaves. they want to have guarantees of protection from turkey just across the border. of course, the turkish view the kurds here as an existential terrorist threat. they want to have assurances that the u.s. has their back as well if there is a resurgence of isis, and more broadly, they want to have an assurance that this strategic alliance that they have nurtured, that they

have died for, is extremely meaningful to the american officials and american people. privately when you have conversations with people here, john, you hear a very different story. they are far less diplomatic. they feel abandoned, they feel angry, but mostly they feel fearful. there is a very real sense here on the ground that if and when those u.s. troops complete that pullout that there could be a bloodbath here, and they want to see america promise and take the steps need to ed to prevent tha from happening one way or the other, john. >> clarissa ward, i appreciate you being live there on the ground as we come back to the studio now. you hear that, everybody publicly trying to say the right thing. privately voicing concerns. this is not trivial business. i want you to listen here. this is the national security adviser john bolton with hugh hewitt today. first the president said we'll do this quick, then he said we'll do this right. john bolton had to go to

meetings with allies saying, calm down, calm down, it's not going to be precipitous, it's not going to be crazy. >> i think i spoke to the president four or five times by phone. i spoke to secretary pompeo about the same number of times. general dunford was with us in turkey, and as i mentioned a moment ago, the position we presented to the government of turkey was one that we had cleared through all the diplomatic and bureaucratic processes precisely so that the u.s. spoke with one voice. you know, the media loves to find splits in the administration. it's sort of a hobby of theirs. >> we do highlight contradictions when they happen. they happened in turkey, they've happened more broadly about the pace of the withdrawal. are we making a mountain out of a molehill here? >> it is true that the media loves to highlight splits in the

administration. it's also our job. but it's also true that there has been a split in the administration between the president who said we're getting out in 30 days, and then his aides, who seem to have convinced him? it's unclear exactly what's happening, but seem to have convinced him this is a terrible idea. bolton, on his international trip, said our pullout is conditional on the conditions in the region, and the president then said, master bolton speaks for me, the president saying that in a tweet. those are two completely different statements one to the next. now it appears troops are not leaving syria, but equipment is leaving syria? so i think what the president's aides have not accounted for is the utter confusion in the message that seems to be coming on a tremendously important issue. >> and if you think there is no mixed message, listen here quickly to the president himself.

>> our boys, our young women, our men, they're all coming back, and they're coming back now. we won. i never said we're doing it that quickly, but we're decimating isis. >> doesn't now mean quickly? >> they're not perfect, but i would say with bolton, we look at this in every administration. why? because we're looking at who is carrying the day and what it means for americans and the world. who is actually shaping policy? >> in this case, forgive me for interrupting, in this case policy that effects a very dangerous region in the world and potentially the lives of american men and women who have the courage to serve in uniform. >> absolutely correct. and this administration flipped the normal process. the normal process here is you approach the stakeholders, all the people who might care what happens to the 2,000 american service personnel on the ground in syria, the kurds, the turks,

the iraqis, the whole group of people. then you talk inside the plan administration and try to figure out, can we do this, how do we do this? then down the line you get a presidential announcement. that's not what happened here. what happened was in a turkish phone call with the president, he announced a withdrawal and now they're trying to pick up the pieces. >> it's not just all the rule followers were hung up on some handbook, it's by doing that you expose yourself to some arguments. maybe you don't have your defense secretary quit, who was viewed as a vital source of stability in the administration, because this decision was taken without his input. you bring everybody in the room, and you can say to people privately, maybe you're not going to like this, but here's what we're about to do. you can build a coalition. it's possible to imagine the administration building a very effective coalition by reaching across the aisle to some

democrats who believe this intervention wasn't a good idea. instead we got a tweet. >> to molly's point, elizabeth warren said she does support the goal of withdrawing troops in syria, aligning her with the president on that point, but she does criticize the way it was done. >> to your esteemed retired general and the president releasing troops overseas. i like that alignment. we have some stunning new numbers. downy unstopables

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topping our political radar today, some breaking news and some good breaking news about

the health of the supreme court justice ruth bader ginsburg. you'll recall ginsburg had some nodules removed from her lung. she missed court arguments this week, she'll likely miss them next week. but she said post-surgery evaluation shows no evidence of remaining disease and no further treatment is required. so good news for ruth bader ginsburg there. we'll have a timetable when she can return to work. moving on to this other big story, we're just getting new figures, this as president trump begins his third year in the white house. in addition to a quarter of his cabinet now filled by acting secretaries, there are 271 unfilled high leadership jobs across federal agencies. cnn's abby phillip live at the white house. abby, these are eye-popping numbers. >> they really are and they reflect a turnover that's very unusual for a presidency that is more than two years in.

both president trump's pret predecessors never experienced this level of turnover, certainly not in as high a level of cabinet. you see the president really struggled to get these positions through, both a combination of moving the senate through that's been closely divided in the last couple years, and also trouble filling these jobs. 70 vacancies at the state department, 14 at the pentagon and 17 at the justice department. what's interesting is president trump in recent days says he thinks this gives him flexibility. but what we have heard in our reporting from the republicans and from the president's allies is that is bafsically a coping mechanism. he's put in place in a quarter of his cabinet-level positions acting officials. that is an effort on the president's part to really try to backfill some of these positions. but republicans on the hill are saying this cannot go on much longer.

they want the president to name permanent people to these jobs and get them through the senate. the problem is when you're trying to fill a handful or more senate-confirmable, high-level cabinet positions, that is a tall order even for a republican-controlled senate, and i think that's one of the reasons you've seen the president at the white house in this position. when he had a cabinet meeting just a week ago, he was surrounded by a bunch of unfamiliar faces and names. a lot of people he started his administration with are now gone. by comparison, president obama lost only one cabinet official at this point in his presidency. the same is true of george w. bush. president trump has lost ten officials. two years, ten officials are gone in his administration. so in addition to the government shutdown, there is a level of dysfunction happening at the executive branch that is really unmatched in recent history. >> unmatched is even a polite way to put it. abby phillip, appreciate it.

when we come back, a health update for ruth bader ginsburg, and congress on capitol hill addressing government insight call their first witness.

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let's get some more from the story we talked about moments ago, an update on the health of court justice ruth bader ginsburg. what are we hearing? >> reporter: the court spokesman has given us an update on her health and said her recovery is on track, but she will still miss oral arguments next week. note she was not on the bench for oral arguments last week. but a post evaluation indicates no evidence for further disease and no further treatment is required. that's good news for ruth bader ginsburg. it was less than a month ago she had those two nodules removed

from her lung which were cancerous. that happened after she fell in november and broke her ribs, so it was caught early. this comes at a really important time for the court, because even though this term so far has been less than blockbuster, they are meeting behind closed doors to discuss big trump initiatives, big policies, those concerning daca, transgender military, and they're going to decide whether to take up those cases. they voted on that early today behind closed doors and she probably participated by proxy. again, she won't be on the bench next week, but the spokesman says her recovery is on track. >> on track is a good update. ariane de vogue, thank you. who will blink in the shutdown fight? (rooster morning call)

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a new time magazine cover story takes a look at the two key players, the president and the house speaker. at center of this drama are two towering figures whose clash will identify the next biennium. trump and pelosi, the yang and yin of a divided america, two powerful leaders with their credibility on the line, both convinced they hold the winning hand.

here's a cartoon of the two lobbing spitballs at each other. molly is back with us. it's an interesting cover. medieval weapons, you might say. but there are 800,000 federal workers not getting a paycheck today. for them this is personal. who will say how this ends are two very stubborn, very dug in, very determined, very different leaders. >> very different. it didn't really set in until -- well, and it didn't become literally true until this week that there is a balance of power now in washington. it's a whole new world and it's a new world for donald trump that i don't know if he has fully internalized, that he doesn't have all the power anymore. he has had a republican congress at his beck and call for the last two years doing everything or at least trying to do everything he wants to do. that is not the case anymore. there is a branch of congress

that has some power now. there is a democratic majority in the house of representatives, and it happens to be led by probably the savviest legislator that america has seen for the past few decades. nancy pelosi is a master of the inside game. we saw her put on a great display when she was tamping down the rumors of dissent in her own caucus in order to retain the speakership. this is her skill set. this is what she's good at and she has borne this out. the question is has she ever gained an adversary so predictable as donald trump? >> just moments ago, you can see one of her weapons or strategies is trying to get under his skin a little bit. they are talking about this prospect that the president may declare a national emergency. this is a wall of the failures of his administrations, problems that happened with mueller, a

cabinet in disarray and disgrace. that's the wall he's trying to build. this is a diversion and he's a master after diversion. she's poking a bear. >> she is, she is, and the democrats really believe they have the upper hand in this fight. it's very interesting, when you talk to both sides, the republicans, particularly the white house, they also say they have a winning hand but they don't have an exit strategy. they have this declaration of emergency, but there are a lot of people around trump who actually, whether in the white house and especially among congressional republicans, on a deep level they want him to lose this fight in that they don't necessarily want the wall built, they don't necessarily want a state of emergency. they just need him to be able to say that he won so he can get himself out of getting them out of this pickle. he's painted himself in a corner. we know he has a big ego, considers himself an alpha male. the republicans want him to get something that he can say he won. the question is will he accept that, or does he need to actually see, you know, the bricks going up and the wall

being built. >> and how much is she eager to give in her speakership to this point. >> this isn't the way she wanted to begin her reign, either. >> it's a great read if you haven't picked it up. brianna keilar starts right now. have a good day. i'm brianna keilar live in washington headquarters. ahead on "cnn right now," federal workers seeing zero on their paychecks as the shutdown reaches a record. why the president is trying to expand his powers. now racial remarks from republican congressmen. the question is what will the party do about it? a teenage girl found alive after her parents were found dead inside their home