>> we'll have to see what they're following. the extent of the procedure. a one sentence explanation is not sufficient. he wants to of course it's a very complicated matter with the president having over 500 different entities all flowing up through the holding corporations and he wants to see the extent to which they're conducting this examination or if they're conducting this information of the president's returns. >> congressman, i appreciate your time. we'll continue to watch this. thank you. >> anderson, thank you very much. >> the news continues, i want to hand it over to chris for cuomo "prime time". >> thank you. i am chris cuomo and welcome to "prime time". it's 3:00 a.m. in paris where our lady of paris sits ravaged by fire. 13 million a year come to her. one of the most recognizable symbols of christianity. an aspirational symbol that withstood centuries. this may be her biggest test.

new info on what happened and when and how but the story is about what happened next and i think it matters more than anything else that we're waiting on later this week or arguing about in the moment there's much to be said and understood and done. what do you say? let's get after it. ♪ >> it's in paris but they're not just parisians. it's a catholic place of worship. those aren't gist catholics singing. this is something that effects people the world over. 856 years of history and so much more up in flames people with awe inspiring images. and of course there's the believers, christians, especially catholics starting

the most important week of the year, rebirth and renewal this is the image. the being tried by fire. the spire of the cathedral. consumed by what looked like hell fire. a powerful painful image one so many will never forget. yet it could have been worse. one firefighter was seriously hurt. we're told 400 were battling. these are very difficult conditions. we'll learn more about that tonight. how hard the challenge was. thank god more people weren't hurt. thank god we're not just measuring it in terms of human cost. that place is a crucible. a stone z acting as an on for all inside. we're lucky it wasn't palm sunday. there wasn't a mass or tour going on at the same time. here's where things stand. the source of the inferno is unknown. it could be linked to renovation

work to fix the historic stone walls. that would not be unusual. it's a very common experience, but it's under investigation so we don't know. the location matters. our lady sits on an island in the historic heart of paris in the middle of the river. first reports of smoke and flame just before 6:00 p.m. local time. people kept commenting, you're going to hear this, on what termed like a delay. where were the sirens? where were the people coming? where was the help. that island has few bridges. they're not wide. it's rush hour. boats can get there and pump water but they can't get that close that quickly. so after the evacuation there was an empty desperation of waiting during which time the 315 foot spire collapsed. around 7:59 p.m.. the flames grew into an inferno. we have to talk about that tonight. was the fire just isolated in

the top or feeding it's way up? fed by all the wood and the air in the nave. that's the main part of the church before the alter and it would make the fire feed up toward surrounding scaffolding in a wood sub ceiling that is just food for flames. the fire chief said there was concern for collapse because without the roof even stone walls can fall and if they fell out there could be a different order of magnitude in terms of damage. when the bells fall they take the towers with them. questions were echoing all across the world. but then the flames started to lower and we saw these lights that i want to show you. this was the only relief i had today. it wasn't the fire engines. up in one of the towers where the bells are there were little white lights all of a sudden and we knew the firefighters would now reach there so the flames were gone. they were able to walk up there. there was some integrity to it.

that maybe the bells wouldn't fall and take the towers with them. we know that teams managed to salvage an unknown quantity of pressure relics but the main ones we heard were secreted to a safe location. what is believed to be part of jesus's crown of thorns. part of his actual cross. there's a heavy, heavy item for catholics and christians. now we know that stuff is safe and the mayor tweeted it tonight. it's not just stuff. in terms of this could have been human cost. what we worry about most in terms of things seem to be okay. the twin bell towers first constructed in the 13th century. they were recently replaced. 2013 i think. this made this cathedral the tallest structure in paris until the completion of the eiffel tower in the 19th century. this was it. after world war i notre dame bells range loudly.

and for the liberation of paris after world war ii in 1944. she has been there for so much history and so many sought solace within her walls during that war and beyond and more recent times during the attacks in 2015, the bells rang out again and masses gathered for prayer. i was there among others. many of whom were not believers. this is more than a cathedral. it's more than a symbol for the religious. it's more than another museum in europe. this place matters. this is an aspirational symbol of beauty and devotion to somebody bigger than ourselves and this fire happens at a time that those she means the most to need her most. there's a lot to discuss about the past, what happened today and our future. let's bring in an associate professor of fire science. always a pleasure. >> thank you for having me. >> thank you very much. we get the significance measured

so many ways but i want to help people understand a lot of this got rushed through in the moment. why this happened now obviously there was an intensity. explain it a little bit. stone on the outside. seems cig na see seems cig it seemed so significant but on the inside hollow with a ton of air and old wood. what does that mean? >> from a firefightering perspective this is a classic church fire. 19th century back 5 or 600 years earlier. the fuel load is at the top of the building. the key thing that we see is that there was probably renovation work going on. >> scaffolding. >> which means that's really a potential reason why this has happened today. we have to do a complete investigation. we have to make sure that intentional acts weren't here or accidental things, cigarettes

things like that. and we had things like that and numerous fires in churches over the years and they all come out basically this way because the fuel load is way up in the air and the firefighters can't get to it quickly and of course again it's all wood. >> there's a ton of air in what they saw the nave. it feeds the flames. this coming through the roof. our understanding is this was metal and stone. >> it's the wood deck underneath and the wood structure. >> it can burn through stone and metal. >> the spire. this is the iconic thing. >> it was the physical manifestation of the aspiration of something better above us. we see the bell towers so if i can bring this in a little bit, this is where the bells are. this is where we saw smoke and fire but we also saw the firefighters. the configuration of this significant or what you deal with in this situations of architecture?

>> a spire. also typically framed to wood on the inside. >> when this fell it's is supporting structure and who knows what was done by the renovation worker. >> exactly. we never want a fire like this to occur but the failure of the roof system actually did help the firefighters tonight because that brought them closer to ground level and also cut down the amount of heat that you feel like from a fireplace and things like that into the bell towers basically and then the embers are being generated as well. >> so one of your guys, one of the deputy chiefs here in the city said you can't fight that from the inside. that makes it a crucible. it's an oven this there. the smoke. there's not enough ventilation. you have to fight it from the outside, true? >> yes. the fact is that you have a building with no roof on it now. the stability of those walls -- >> even stone. >> 200 feet high. >> so on the outside, you see the impressive metal and the

stone but this is the inside. >> right. >> that's the fuel load there. >> it will burn. so this is one of the famous rose windows that they have there. there's several in this and they were worried about that getting blown out. it didn't happen. >> right. >> thank god for that. >> so now inside, we can move people around in this. this is what i want them to focus on. this is the nave. the beautiful architecture that's supposed to be so inspirational. so what does it mean from thermodynamics and fire fighting. >> probably something like plaster. >> you're looking at the bottom side of the roof up in the air basically so behind that of course, in all likelihood is a triangular attic space if you want to call it that but it's an area in which a fire could be occurring and you can't get to it. that's the problem. it's behind all of this. >> and this will all feed itself up too, right? this is all air and all wood and stuff that could be just for

fire and even with all the stone you think it's going to be that but it's far from it. again now, the geo-location situation is also relationship -- relevant. situated in a little manhattan within paris. we have the rivers. these are not huge flow bridges. they're not even like the ones that are farther up. that's going to create a huge problem in terms of rush hour in getting there. >> not only the people leaving but trying to get to the scene basically. >> we were talking about the water ships but even the ones that can get in there over time that's not a great vantage to be fighting this fire. >> accessibility is a major problem. >> smoke is also the issue. is the color relevant to you or just reflective of material? >> it's just material. people mention black earlier on. the traditional brown smoke and

stuff. that's wood burning there. >> nothing unusual? >> one thing we should point out here too is that plume of smoke also contains a lot of embers. chunks of burning wood and that's always a big issue with these buildings is that these embers can drop on buildings blocks away. >> true. one of the good things about being an island but not completely isolated. the bells. there was fear that if this burned around them and they fell that it was almost like what we learned during 9/11. what happens on the inside will effect the outside. >> right. >> legit concerns? >> you can see it's a wood framed structure in here. they had firefighters in there. we can see them working inside. the main sanctuary roof went down and that helped them here because they moved the fire from where they were. >> this was the fear. >> there was and you had guys still protecting this.

in retro spect. they saved -- >> they're going to have some stories of heroism. just let people know at home what are you dealing with if you're inside this stone tower surrounded by wood and reigning heat at you and embers are flying through every opening in the wall. >> this is about as bad as it gets. >> yeah. >> they were able to put it out. now this was preserved. did we get lucky or this is just hard to take down. because it's mostly stone. >> there's wood structure inside. >> this is the more iconic vision of the church and things. so the fact that it's still there is because the fire is on the opposite side of the building. >> but it did tear through. >> it did. look how quickly it moved. >> they talk about the fear of

delay. >> i think it's largely logistical. here's the hose work they were doing. that was the best that you could do. you had to fight it from the outside as long as you could. >> there's no way to go inside to fight this. you don't want to put people in there. you're certainly not going to use the scaffolding. that's already been compromised and now a lot of people were making the suggestion. where are the choppers. i brought it up on live television today because we think about that. the air restrictions around paris not in an emergency situation, the french authorities said just to address one thing and get it out of the way, we have the capabilities, we fight forest fires all the time. we're not doing this because we're worried about putting that much water inside this structure right now we're afraid it may make it worse structurely for the walls. does that square with you? >> yeah. if it's a fixed wing aircraft

there's not one that could drop in that spot moving 700 miles per hour over. helicopters. one of the issues you got to here is its a chimney effectively. >> they're so thin. >> that's another issue here and i think they realized they could cause more damage than not. >> it's not without the president. >> he said the right thing and recognized this as the tragedy and said work was going to slow down within the white house and all eyes were on this. a lot of people were talking about that and it was not a factor today. if anything it might have made it worse. professor. thank you so much for making this understandable. thank god we're not measuring it in terms of human loss. >> we can rebuild. >> thank you. >> so again, look, this is heavy. it's so heavy because of the significance. you can't process this as a simple reality. this is the week.

a billion catholics including your flawed friend speaking to you. this is deeply personal. in fact, i was surprised by how hard this hit me and it hit me with an immediate question, what happens now? the vatican is shocked and saddened about the disaster. what will the pope do especially at the end of this week? is there an opportunity in this? father edward beck has his take on what the loss means and the challenge it presents, especially this week. and later on, there is much more to this building than what you see. one of the reasons the loss is so heavy is the history that has happened within these walls. when you hear what she has been through and what she has been apart of over the centuries you'll get the gravity of the situation.

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live pictures here. still fighting the fire. it's still dangerous because fires reignite all the time. i can't wait to hear the stories of the firefighters that made it into the bell towers and put the fire out in the conditions they were in. i mean, that's going to be amazing. look, the worst hopefully is over. the physical loss is great and remarkable. the spiritual significance also looms large especially now. right at the start of holy week. obviously it ends easter sunday. this was the main meeting place in paris for catholics at this time of the year. many rights and rituals throughout the week, not just sunday. so what is the loss? how far does it resinate? and what are the challenges going forward? one of my best friends, one of the people that i would -- i don't know who else i'd want to lean on in a moment like if this for an understanding or a perspective than father edward beck.

always a pleasure. >> it's good to have you. >> so the art and the architecture. so many people no matter what they believe, 13 million a year came to see this. twice as many as the eiffel tower. we get the historical nature of this but for this week, what sense do you make of this at the beginning of holy week to have this happen to one of the most magnificent christian symbols? >> first of all, you have been there with your wife and kids. i have been there. we have seen the windows. we have heard the magnificent organ and bells toll. for us it's not just a tourist attraction. it's a place of prayer. it's a place we went to be lifted up. so we just celebrated yesterday passion palm sunday.

you mention the crown of thorns being one of the relics. that symbol of the passion in this cathedral and that's a parentheses toward the end of the week as we move toward holy week. so ironic to me and you know this when we come to the vigil on holy sad saturday night. in all churches around the world, they'll light a fire except the symbol of the fire on holy saturday night and we'll all be thinking about the cathedral that night but the symbol is there's light in the darkness. it's the light of christ to come into our darkness. that's a very different kind of fire than we have seen today but i can't help but hold on to that message that for christians and people of faith it's about death but new life. it's about hope. president macron said we will rebuild. well for christians it's another way of saying we will persevere.

there is resurrection. there is new life. >> people come to you all the time wanting you to explain horrible things. this is another. why does this happen at this time when we need to be doing there the most and bring people together the most and this is when we lose her? >> well, i think it's interesting, france has struggled of late with religion and it's own christianity. the churches are not very full in france. during the terrorists attacks, you know, you were there, people gathered for silence outside of there and it became a symbol of something so even for nonbelievers they gather there and they may question why would this happen but doesn't it cause us to reflect on. what is it that drew people to the beautiful place? there was something about being lifted up that this is, as you said, it's more than us.

it's higher than us and it's a time to say nothing lasts. it took centuries to build and how long it will take to rebuild but it will. nothing is permanent and yet god is in the midst of it. from those ashes. like the phoenix. something will rise. it will bring people together in a significant way as tragedy always does. i feel like god is in the midst of it somehow even in the pain and destruction. >> thank god we're not measuring this in terms of human loss. we know a firefighter was hurt. we don't have any other reports yet. i was shocked by that. to fight in the conditions they were fighting in that's some of the most daunting and dangerous circumstances and conditions for firefighters. they did it with so much success. the vatican is upset about this.

is there an opportunity in this? do you think there's any chance that pope francis goes to paris for easter and leaves the vatican? >> i'm going to say that's not going to happen. think of the security concerns. trying to put that together between now and easter. would the pope want to do it? yes. this is the pope that doesn't want to ride in the pope mobile and doesn't care about security. the people around him do. so i don't think that will happen but you can be sure he'll be talking about this tragedy hole tli holy thursday. friday. saturday. when he lights that easter fire. i think what a wonderful opportunity to say fire isn't just about destruction. it's about light in the darkness and the light of christ. as you know, my father was a firefighter. he went into many fires and he had many stories about it and my

heart is with the firefighters too. i know what my father endured and how important it is to be apart of this. that's the real message. there's brave people trying to save something that matters to people and that's the sense of hope that i have. that people willing to do that for the sake of something else and we're watching them right now up in the air. in the worst of situations we see the best of us. >> exactly. >> father beck, you make everything better. thank god for you and thank you for being in my life and helping the audience tonight. >> god bless you this week. >> i need it. >> as we watch this awful scene and the battle that is on going, you have to believe the worst is over right now but tell that to the men and maybe women in that building right now going through things that are still really hot that could spark at any moment. all right. saving what is left. good think about this.

roughly twice the number of people visit this place every year as they do the nearby eiffel tower. this is much more than a religious shrine and much more than a tourist attraction and so needed right now. this took centuries to build in terms of lure. not just destruction. it is a unique story that matters. and open your eyes so what this creates as a vulnerability and maybe an opportunity. i'll share that next. this is the story of john smith.

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the notre dame. we all know what she looks like. what she means. she's called our lady, right? notre dame is just the french language of that and she has this special island and even though she is situated there and this is her resident country she means so much to so many. the history matters. first stone layed in 1163. pope alexander iii. this took 200 years to complete and would wind up being a symbol of human potential the world over. 856 years she has been there. key moments in history. it's where henry 6th of england was made king. ransacked and damaged in the 1600s. in the french revolution. rebuilt after napoleon took the crown from the hands of the pope there in 1804. a century later, joan of ark was beatified there.

trooping filled the place at a memorial service for fdr. even those that haven't seen her in person know it by lure and legend. writer victor hugo immortalized the cathedral. the novel we all try to get our kids to understand in one way or another. the hunchback of notre dame. fictional bell ringer. in the churches roof. the book galvanized a major restoration project of the church. in the 1800s. there was talk of taking hr down. in recent years she has fallen into disrepair. people continue to visit. the architecture, the art, the significance. it's saints and profits and gargoyles and also a place of pilgrimage and prayer. a gattic gothic jewel. it's open every day for mass. it's a sanctuary for some of the most coveted relics in the christian faith and it's not just that they are kept but this is the week, the one time of the year, holy week when the church would unveil them to remind

believers of the significance of what they're about to relive. that crown of thorns, that piece of what is believed to be part of the cross that jesus was crucified on. that's heavy for believers there. we're told by the mayor that some were removed during the restoration. we don't know if anything is lost. it may all be safe. it raises heavy questions. why such a tragedy. why now? does everything really happen for a reason? blessing from tragedy, it's tough to understand. harder for most of us to accept and yet tonight even in the midst of mourning, france's president vowed we're going to rebuild it and we're going to do it together. maybe that city will come closer together from this. they could certainly use that. in fact, we all could. now to understand what was lost, i'm going to bring in an expert in medieval studies to show you what she has meant to the culture beyond christianity and

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people all over the world watched and wept today. notre dame cathedral in flames. some screaming as the spire fell. nicholas paul knows how woven this cathedral is into france's history. really within the world. he leads the center for medieval studies. professor, thank you. no reason for us to avoid the

obvious, there was some what of a feeling of reminiscence of seeing the two big towers at the front of the cathedral. fire ingulfing them, the fire falling into the flames. the gasp. there is a reminder of what we lived through here on 9/11. thank god we're not measuring this tragedy on human costs. but it's real and we should deal with it. it's part of what resinates. >> you're talking about two iconic buildings. completely symbolic of the cities they're in. really woven into the cities. it's hard to avoid that kind of comparison i think for americans watching it. especially on tv. >> our lady of paris is meaningful to the entire world. why? is it just architecture or through time has there been an accrued significance? >> well, there's so much to say there. in some ways we have to talk about the symbolism of notre dame.

it's symbolic of france and paris but symbolic for a lot of people of what the middle ages mean. that was the case in the 19th century. there was an attempt to try to capture the character of the midevil city and put it on display in the cathedral. if we look back at the middle ages and follow the story forward it's remarkable to think about how -- what a story it was that unfolded in the shadow of that building. so the philosophers that debated there as the church was being built, the school of music. that was based in notre dame. >> it's heavy stuff. >> the irony that something that has withstood so much, it's had it's ups and downs but nothing like this. >> it doesn't appear that way. >> it might be taken out by a construction fire.

there's an irony that teaches us that everything is vulnerable no matter how much it's withstood. >> it does. it's reminiscent to what happened to many that caught fire at one time or another under different circumstances. so this kind of fire, that would have actually been something that medieval communities -- it would have been traumatic to them but not uncommon. maybe we have become too comfortable with the idea of the safety of these buildings. >> is it true that victor hugo was part of an effort that was about an extential crisis for this church. they believed that part of the city needed to be redone and reclaimed. including taking her down. >> there was a restoration movement which was responsible for the famous gargoyles that you see. a lot of people look at them and

say look at the sculptures. they are representative of the 19th century. >> why did they add them? >> to make it even more medieval of to capture the medieval character of the building. >> it worked. they always get me when i see them. why do you think eiffel tower, there's almost nothing like it. you talk about something iconic. the word has been beaten today. twice as many people go to see the cathedral as that tower, why? >> it's interesting. if you think about it in terms of other cathedrals in france or other famous religious buildings, it has this iconic status and not because it's somehow superior to those buildings but more because of its nature at the center of the city and part of the city's story and it was always there. >> you're a midevil expert but

if you had to pick one or two events that happened in or around this cathedral that you believe separated in significance. what would you pick? >> i have my own preferences but one is the school of music that developed there at the end of the 12th century. it symbolized what was happening in france and in paris more generally as an intellectual century. -- center. the renaissance was getting started. it became the heart of medieval civilization. that was happening at notre dame. >> it was also relevant -- it was cross purposes because one of the threats to that movement was the church and yet here in one of its signature events there was something being given protection that was vulnerable even from the influence of the vatican. >> right. the other thing i would say was you mentioned the crown of thorns which we don't know what

happened with that relic now but the story intersects with the cathedral in an interesting way. when the king of france first acquired the relic in 1238 he intended to build a new building for it. but while that was under construction this is where he placed it and put it at the center of his city and with his people which was an important symbolic moment in his building up of france and paris. >> especially this week of all times. it makes you think about the significance of this place and art and architecture and what it means in terms of our evolution such as it is. in very precarious times. professor, thank you for letting people know this place matters and it will hopefully continue to do so. the significance of what we witnessed today shouldn't be

underestimated. there's not a lot of moments that bring the world together. don lemon has personal thoughts to share about the cathedral and what today meant. when we come back. do your asthma symptoms ever hold you back? about 50% of people with severe asthma have too many cells called eosinophils in their lungs. eosinophils are a key cause of severe asthma.

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if you go to paris you visit notre dame. you just do. it's one of the most popular spots there. one of the most visited landmarks in the world. let's bring in d. lemon. don, you've been there. you know what week this is for catholics. you know the theme, rebirth and renewal. >> sad watching it. it feels like people lost a member of their family, at least

that's what they tell me. i mean, i had the same reaction as you. obviously you're a catholic, i'm not. we talked about notre dame all the time, we studied it. i haven't been to notre dame probably since the '90s. l although the last time i was in paris was 2016. you definitely see it. but you cannot put it loss, i don't think there's a way to put it into context. as i was trying to explain to people this is work of art. it goes beyond catholicism and the church. it is simply a work of art that is beautiful and moves people in certain ways and in positive ways that we need especially now in this world.

just for solace and reminder there's also beauty in this world. >> this goes beyond religion. let's just say you're not a believer. when you are in that it'll force you to believe, but also looking at the architecture, just being inside something that is so monumental and so beautiful, i mean if you don't appreciate what it means to people of faith then you have to appreciate what it means to people who love and admire architecture. it's just amazing. >> i mean, look, these aren't just catholics that go to visit these place. he sees in this reaffirmation of the purpose of this week. i lean on faith because of weakness. and for me when i was processing

this today other than the parallels to 9/11, i have anything like this shake me. of course thank god we didn't have to worry about human loss today like we did then but it's an interesting message to make sense of. beginning of holy week. timeo rebirth and renewal, we lose something that mattered so much this time of year. >> it is a building. they will try to replace it, but there's a lot that's irreplaceable there. because you focus so much on notre dame as well as you should, i'm going to focus a little bit more on what's happening with the mueller report coming up. we have john pistol who worked with the special counsel. he says the next part of the story will be trying to get information at least about the redaction and get people to unredact it. that's where this story is

going. as we know it's going to be released on thursday so we're going to take you forward. >> good, get after it, my friend. i'll check back in a little bit. look, it's the right move. we dedicated the whole to this tonight because it matters. we all know about the arguments the president says and the taxes. but something like this only happens once and especially this week i just don't think you can escape the meaning behind it. whatever you want it to mean, that's my point. especially when i got my brothers and sisters here at cnn that are giving you all that other stuff. so our hour's on this. and my closing argument is about what i worry most about today and what i'm most hopeful about going forward next. ♪

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>> announcer: this is cnn breaking news. hello and welcome to our viewers in the united states and all around the world. you're watching cnn's coverage of the devastating fire at notre dame cathedral. i'm rosemary church. >> and i'm max foster outside of notre dame. you can see the traffic flowing as many of them were trying to allow access to emergency services to continue their work within the cathedral. obviously the major flames have died down and thenoters are saying things are under