Skip to main content

tv   Fareed Zakaria GPS  CNN  May 19, 2019 10:00am-11:00am PDT

10:00 am
life. to the fullest. public square. welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. i'm fareed zakaria. today on the show, are we on the road to war? has the trump administration been setting things up for a military confrontation with iran? >> if they do anything, they will suffer greatly. >> then the trade war with china. it has roiled markets and it's costing americans cash. who will blink? trump or xi? >> you want to know something? we always win. >> i'll talk to experts on each hot spot. and india's elections are
10:01 am
done, and no matter what party wins, we know one thing. accused crooks will be elected. i'll bring you the stunning findings and their implications for america. plus, trump, putin, bolsonaro, orban, duterte. we know the face of right-wing populism, but what is its opposite? can liberalism put up a fight? "the new yorker's" adam gotnick defends. but first, here's my make. donald trump has seemed largely uninterested in foreign policy. he got excited briefly when he thought he could win a nobel peace prize and hyped the danger of an imminent north korean attack, so he could then play the peacemaker. when it became clear that a deal was not to be had easily, trump lost interest and scarcely mentions the subject anymore. beyond north korea, his foreign policy has largely been one of subcontracting, a familiar style
10:02 am
for a real estate developer. middle east policy is farmed out to israel and saudi arabia. policy toward left-wing regimes in latin america have been delegated to saber rattlers like john bolton and marco rubio. the rest of latin america is dealt with solely through the lens of immigration. in other words, subcontracted to stephen miller. the one common aspect of trump's foreign policy, however, has been that abroad, it has provoked a vigorous nationalist response. take china, where the government has gone on the offensive and denounced what it sees as america's aggressive trade demands. beijing's state-controlled television network recently featured a commentary tying american tactics to previous foreign efforts to subjugate china. after 5,000 years of wind and rain, what hasn't the chinese nation anchored, the anchor said. if you want to trade war, we'll fight you until the end. in the end, the islamic republic
10:03 am
has been able to withstand the economic storms kacaused by u.s sanctions so far because it has been able to pin the blame on trump's anti-iran strategy, not the regime's economic mismanagement. washington has always underestimated nationalism, especially in iran. many of iran's foreign policy moves stem from its geopolitical position, not some fundamentalist shiite ideology. even allies are becoming more assertive and anti-american. in 2015, before trump's election, 66% of mexicans had a favorable view of america. by 2018, that number had dropped to 32%. confidence in the u.s. president plummeted in that same period from 49% to 6%. the pattern recurs almost everywhere, in canada, confidence in the u.s. president went from 76% in 2015 to 25% in 2018. in france, it's worse.
10:04 am
from 83% under obama to single digits under trump. in fact, in a recent pew survey of 25 countries, only two place expressed greater confidence in trump than they did in his predecessor, russia and israel. yet other countries are simply following trump's advice. in his 2017 speech to the u.n. general assembly, donald trump called for a great reawakening of nations, urging countries to use patriotism and self-interest as their soul guides in foreign policy. trump's north star has been to celebrate a narrow conception of national interests, reject the idea that there are larger international interests, and by implication, to denigrate the idea of cooperative win-win solutions. the chinese, the iranians and so many others are simply doing what trump urged and since the u.s. is still the world's leading power and trump's style
10:05 am
has been aggressive and undiplomatic, the easiest response abroad is a nationalist anti-american one, feeding public anger, stoking bad historical memories, and locking countries into a win-lose mind-set. it's a world with more instability, less cooperation, and fewer opportunities for america. and it is the direct logical consequence of donald trump's philosophy of america first. for more, go to cnn.com/fareed and read my "washington post" column this week. and let's get started. will the heightened tensions between the united states and iran lead to war? and what would it mean if there were actual hostilities? these questions are on people's minds all around the world. let's try to get answers from today's guests, both of whom have reported extensively on and
10:06 am
in iran. robin wright is a contributing writer to the new yorker. her book on iran is "the last great revolution." jim sciutto is cnn's chief national security correspondent and the author of a terrific new book, "the shadow war: inside russia and china's secret operation to defeat america." we will get to that, jim. but first, let me ask you, what is going on? it seemed as though the administration, john bolton, the national security adviser, mike pompeo, was setting up a kind of aggressive series of moves that were essentially designed to provoke the iranians or confront the iranians. and the president said, wait a minute, i don't want war. >> whiplash. think of the span of those two weeks, a clear and present danger, requiring the deployment of an additional carrier group. i mean, this is the most powerful weapon in america's military arsenal when you think about it. the aircraft carrier and all the ships and submarines that come with it.
10:07 am
great alarm, and now the president in the span of that time now saying, i don't want war, let's find a way to talk. as happens so many things in this administration, with foreign policy or national security issues or threats, was there any discussion of a broader policy here? was there a consensus built within the administration over this? it doesn't matter, because the fishers have been playing out very much in the public eye. the president's comments versus the comments of his secretary of state and national security adviser, it leaves the american public with legitimate questions as to what the policy is, but also america's allies anded aerer sar s adversaries. which increases the risk of misunderstanding and we're seeing this play out in full time. >> robyn, it seems that president trump was not aware that mike pompeo has had a very long-standing hard line view on iran, but that john bolton in particular has had these very long-standing and very hardline views on iran. >> well, there's clearly a split
10:08 am
within the administration over what their end goal is, john bolton has had a long-standing relationship with the iranian opposition. he's talked about regime change. he wrote an op-ed in "the new york times" saying, it was time to bomb iran, this was before taking his current job. he has talked about a counterrevolution, basically. whereas mike pompeo, who had talked about regime change, has kifd m kind of modified that view at the state department, more in line with president trump's view that you'll want to see a change in behavior. but he's issued 12 demands that often result to regime change. the president is willing to talk to the supreme leader. they've reached out to the iranians since president trump took office, almost a dozen times. so i think that they all agree on what they don't want to see in iran, but the question is, what do they ultimately want to see proactively or creatively in terms of happening in tehran itself? and that, i think, has led to a real gap. and that's why you've seen this breathtaking buildup suddenly to
10:09 am
the potential of war. and now this beginning of a kind of pullback. how do we avoid a war? the danger, of course, is how do you de-escalate once you've reached this point and that is the challenge for both sides today. >> jim, it seems to me that the way you de-escalate in the trump administration is, trump just changes the subject. he did this with north korea. the way he hyped up the threat, then realized he wasn't going to get the nobel peace prize, so all of a sudden the situation is the same, venezuela, they drew a red line saying maduro had to go, maduro didn't go, so he just suddenly stopped talking about venezuela. is that likely, that this will just go away? >> the president frequently declares victory where there is no victory and where the facts don't support it. and it does get to fundamental questions to the president's foreign policy here, because he has tried this same tactic as you noted, but also on china. maximum economic pressure to get the north koreans to abandon nukes, to get china to fundamentally change its economic model, an unfair one,
10:10 am
but that seems to be from its perspective in china's national security interests. now to get iran back to he negotiate a nuclear deal that it's showing no intention of renegotiating. at least today, trump's approach to all of those issues as well as venezuela appears to have failed. so what is the plan "b"? they've certainly articulated no tri alternative to trump's policy. the world is left with the consequences of that just not being supported by the facts. >> robin, what do the iranians do? they are feeling the pressure. the iranian economy is reeling. it's going to contract 6% this year. can they make trouble or are they too weak at this point? >> i don't think iran is weak at all. it clearly has very strong presence across the middle east. it has proxies who have been operating in lebanon, iraq, syria, they are still major players even if they're feeling the economic pinch. and they do feel the economic
10:11 am
inch. oil has gone down from 3.2 million barrels a day to under 1 million barrels a day. and they are going to feel this long-term. but the challenge now is they have issued a deadline for the europeans to help bail them out of the sanctions squeeze of 60 days or they may, they threaten pull back even more from the steps promised in the iran fleerl deal. iran is still complying, and of course, five of the six major powers engaged in the deal still believe nit, still support it. the question is, are we setting up some benchmarks down the road that will lead fourth escalation, even if there is a pull back at the moment on the kind of military steps. so this is still very much a live situation. >> one of the things iran could do is get active on the cyberspace. this is the subject of your new book. i want to ask you, just tell us, what is the main thing, this terrific book about cyber war, how the chinese and the russians
10:12 am
are both very actively engaged in it. what do you think is the principle message you want to get out of the book? >> my principle message is this. i think that americans are generally aware of one front of what is a much broader war. they're aware of, for instance, russian interference in the election, or chinese theft of state secrets, which has been so central to the president's trade war with china today. but the fact is, there are many other fronts on which china and russia are attacking the u.s. and the west on a daily basis and with great effect. there are illegal land acquisition, occupation of territory in the uk, annexuation, china creating a whole new area in the south china sea. americans aren't aware that both russia and china have deployed weapons in space designed to take away essential space assets that the u.s. military, but also civilian world depends on, because they know we have such great depends. and i should note that iran and north korea watched china and russia as well. they don't have the same resources, but they use similar tactics in cyberspace, they use
10:13 am
it in space, they use it on the ground. and this is part of the strategy, it is not by accident, it's an explicit strategy that both russia and china are using. they call them by different name, winning without fighting is how the chinese refer to it and when you look at the results of this war so far, they have made gains. and the fact is the u.s. has only recently recognized this shadow war, as i call it, but is still trying to discern a strategy to effectively respond to it. >> so it's a kind of asymmetrical war that we are much less aware of than they are. >> absolutely. and also designed to attack the u.s. in the west, just below the threshold of sparking a kinetic reaction, a military reaction from the u.s., and they've been very smart many their sort of spidey sense, as it were, in detecting how far they can go without the u.s. reacting. and look, russia's occupying a european country, sovereign state, ukraine. china has, in the face of repeated american protests created new territories, taking
10:14 am
away territory in effect from u.s. allies. they've interfered in election, russia has, they've deployed space assets. what has the american response been? some sanctions here, some sanctions there have not fundamentally changed either country's behavior. that's a failure by any other definition. >> jim, fascinating book. thank you. robin wright, always a pleasure. >> thank you. next on "gps," the united states is already in a war, a trade war, with china. but what is the end game? i'll be back manyin a moment to discuss. th licensed agents available 24/7. it's not just easy. it's having-a-walrus-in-goal easy! roooaaaar! it's a walrus! ridiculous! yes! nice save, big guy! good job duncan! way to go! [chanting] it's not just easy. it's geico easy. oh, duncan. stay up. no sleepies.
10:15 am
[music playing] jerry has a membership to this gym, but he's not using it. and he has subscriptions to a music service he doesn't listen to and five streaming video services he doesn't watch. this is jerry learning that he's still paying for this stuff he's not using. he's seeing his recurring payments in control tower in the wells fargo mobile app. this is jerry canceling a few things. booyah. this is jerry appreciating the people who made this possible. oh look, there they are. (team member) this is wells fargo. it's how we care for our patients- like job. his team at ctca treated his cancer and side effects. so job can stay strong for his family. cancer treatment centers of america. appointments available now. her saturdays are a never- ending montage of comfort. [tv sfx]: where have you been all my life? but then anne laid on a serta perfect sleeper. and realized her life was only just sorta comfortable. not just sorta comfortable. serta comfortable. ♪
10:16 am
♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ applebee's new loaded fajitas. now that's eatin' good in the neighborhood. applebeeand i don't addajitas. trup the years.s. but what i do count on... is boost® delicious boost® high protein nutritional drink has 20 grams of protein, along with 26 essential vitamins and minerals. boost® high protein. be up for life. onmillionth order.r. ♪ there goes our first big order. ♪ 44, 45, 46... how many of these did they order? ooh, that's hot. ♪ you know, we could sell these. nah. ♪ we don't bake. ♪ opportunity. what we deliver by delivering.
10:17 am
>> tech: at safelite autoglass, we every chip will crack.. this daughter was home visiting when mom saw a chip in her windshield. >> mom: honey is that a chip? >> tech: they wanted it fixed fast so they brought it to us. >> mom: hi. >> tech: with our in-shop chip repair service, we can fix it the same day... guaranteed. plus with most insurance a safelite chip repair is no cost to you. >> mom: really? drive safely. all right. ♪ acoustic music >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, ♪ safelite replace. (music throughout)
10:18 am
on tuesday, president trump diminished the seriousness of the trade war with china, calling it "a little squabble." but despite his attempts to downplay it, the two sides are at an impasse and in the meantime, american consumers are paying a price, as white house economic adviser larry kudlow admitted last weekend, contradicting and reportedly upsetting his boss. so how does the trade war end? we have a terrific panel to discuss. kevin rudd, the former prime minister of australia and current president of the aisha society policy institute, he joins us from beijing. michael pillsbury has been described by president trump as the leading authority on china. he's director for china strategy
10:19 am
at the hudson institute. and rana faroo is a global economist with the "financial times." michael, you have influenced the president a great deal. you wrote a piece arguing that one of the core demands of the u.s. position be, i think you originated the idea, that the tariffs stay in place until you see chinese compliance with the trade deal, because in the past, they have cheated so, from your point of view, is the u.s. position tenable? and is it the right one? >> well, don't forget the president's goal for the long-term is zero tariffs, increased trade between the u.s. and china, increased investment by the u.s. in china and china in the u.s. that's the grand strategy here. to improve overall relations with china, not to have a new cold war and not to have a trade
10:20 am
war. but to get to that overall goal, there's been a number of steps taken to get china's attention, because as president trump sort of joked, president obama let them get away with murder. president trump's also, fareed, has some pressure from his own democrats, from the left. bernie -- as we call him, wants to have currency manipulation label for china. seven senators wrote a letter to president trump, warning him not to be tough. chuck schumer, the senate leader of the democrats, march 2nd did a tweet chastising president trump for not raising the tariffs that day to 25%. so we have a complicated political situation here and in many ways. >> kevin, what michael described as the complicated political situation in the united states, which is keeping president trump on a pretty tough line with china seems to be mirrored in china, where you are right now.
10:21 am
"the new york times" has superb reporting out that suggests that when the chinese side finally translated the document, the trade deal into chinese and circulated it among the leadership, xi jinping, the president of china, found that there was more pushback, there was more opposition to it, and so changed instructions at the last minute. he had essentially said, approve the deal and he vetoed it. that seems like chinese politics at work. is that right? >> well, fareed, here in beijing, i don't get a daily briefing on what the politburo is doing, so ultimately we don't know the detail of china's internal processes. but the key question is this going to china's own politics on the question of trade negotiations with the u.s. there is a particular provision in the u.s. negotiating position, at least as reported, which the chinese have found obnoxious and unacceptable, and
10:22 am
that is a provision which says that if in the future, the united states judges that china is not honoring the terms of the agreement, then the united states can unilaterally impose punitive tariffs against china, but also in the same agreement, requiring that china would under no circumstances then retaliate. now, all i would say in response to that is, if the united states were in a trade negotiation with me as the prime minister of australia, i would find that absolutely unacceptable. and i'm not surprised the china find it unacceptable. i still think there's a way through these negotiations, but the united states has to think through its own position on this, as well. >> rana, what's striking to me looking at it from the u.s. domestic point of view is president trump is putting tariffs, the chinese retaliating. those tariffs are hurting trump supporters much more than anyone else. farmers in the midwest, small
10:23 am
manufacturers, but they are staying with him. "the new york times" has terrific reporting that says that these people say, we're willing to take this price because we are taking the long view, the chinese have been stealing our intellectual property. it seems like there is nationalism at play here that is supporting pr ining president t position. >> i think that's absolutely right. it's interesting, because of the ten states that will be most affected, eight voted for trump. so the president is playing a pretty high stakes game, but as you point out, farmers are with him. i spent some time looking at a supply chain in the carolinas and i spoke to a cotton farmer that had calculated down to the penny what it was costing him, but he said he was still with the president. and he pointed out did many small businesses and manufacturers in that state, look, they're just happy that someone is pointing out the flaws and in some cases the hypocrisies of the last 20 years of trade where america said, all right, as long as you let us export coke and banking services, you can send us all the cheap clothes from china that you want. and that's created concentrated
10:24 am
area as of pain in the u.s. those are the places that voted for president trump. and it's interesting, because as michael pointed out, there's an interesting far-right, far-left overlap in these policies. i hear a lot of people on the far left saying, actually, maybe we do need more of a local ecosystem. also, i would say that i don't think we're going to reset, no matter who's in the white house in 2020, i don't think we're going to reset to business as usual. china itself is like the u.s. post world war ii. it is a really big single language market with plenty of room to grow. they are building their own ecosystem and they have their own smartphones that sell better than apple. you see more of a bipolar or tripolar world depending on how europe plays out. >> we will get to exactly this point when we come back. beyond the specifics of the trade war, what is the world going to look like? a new cold war with china? a bipolar world, what, when we return.
10:25 am
last year, the department of veteran's affairs partnered with t-mobile for business, to help care for veterans everywhere. with va video connect, powered by t-mobile, men and women who serve can speak to their doctors from virtually anywhere, and get the care they deserve, so they can return to their most important post. best friend, quarterback, or just dad.
10:26 am
the va provides the care, t-mobile provides the coverage. it's either the assurance of a 165-pointor it isn't.on proces. it's either testing an array of advanced safety systems. or it isn't. it's either the peace of mind of a standard 5-year unlimited mileage warranty. or it isn't. for those who never settle, it's either mercedes-benz certified pre-owned. or it isn't. the mercedes-benz certified pre-owned sales event. now through may 31st. only at your authorized mercedes-benz dealer.
10:27 am
listen to your mom, knuckleheads. hand em over. hand what over? video games, whatever you got. let's go. you can watch videos of people playing video games in the morning. is that everything? i can see who's online. i'm gonna sweep the sofa fort. well, look what i found. take control of your wifi with xfinity xfi. let's roll! now that's simple, easy, awesome. xfinity xfi gives you the speed, coverage and control you need. manage your wifi network from anywhere when you download the xfi app today.
10:28 am
and we are back with kevin rudd in beijing, michael pillsbury in washington, and ra rana foroohar here in new york. michael, i wanted to ask you about what the chinese reaction to the trump strategy has been. because it strikes me that donald trump is approaching it from the point of view of what he often calls his kind of america first strategy, kind of nationalist strategy. there's a lot of patriotic support for him among his base, the support at the far left. but the chinese are also reacting, it seems know, from their nationalist point of view. their reaction has been very much a kind of don't tread on me nationalism, has it not? >> i think, fareed, there's often an assumption in the u.s. that it's just america that has to deal with its domestic trade politics on policy. but the chinese have politics,
10:29 am
too. it's called party politics. and they do have internal debates. now, the core point here is in the politics of china right now, which is just celebrating the hundredth anniversary of something called the may 4th movement, which mr. pillburry would know all about. it's a highly nationalist period to deal with the rise of chinese nationalism a hundred years ago, with response to external pressure from foreign powers. i find it highly significant that china in response to this latest twist in the trump administration's trade policy is now itself going down the nationalist road and saying, here we are drawing a line in the sand. it's going to make an agreement harder rather than easier. and i go back to the overall purpose of a strategy on the part of the u.s. or anybody else, which is to bring about a change in the other side's negotiating behavior. i'm not sure that's being achieved. >> is that not a fair point that i find myself quite sympathetic to some of the things that
10:30 am
president trump says about china, even the strategy in terms of getting their attention. but in all of this negotiation with foreign countries, he doesn't give them a win-win option. it seems like he -- if you think about nafta, he wants to humiliate the other side. and it's very hard for the other side to take that, because they have domestic politics, as well. and you know, is that not a fair criticism that, fine, you've got their attention, you've got some tough demands, now tell them, here's this wonderful win-win. it's not that you're losing and i'm winning. and that's what will get us to the deal. >> i think that's right. president trump's been very careful to underline his good relationship with president xi. i don't think he's gloated or in any way said something that would enflame the hardliners on beijing. on the contrary, president trump and his team have kept the 150-page agreement completely secret. there has not been a single leak of any of the text at all. but we can see our top
10:31 am
negotiator comes to washington, has written a lot himself. he's a famous economic reformer. he signed up to a very important report with the world bank about ten years ago called china 2030, fareed. this is a plan to reduce subsidies, open the free market, open up china to much better financial conditions. they want to maintain the commanding heights of socialism, but the debate has been over how much to let the market really open up. and leo hough and his side has been disadvantaged because as president xi fought to take over china in 2011, 2012, he courted the hawks, especially on the economy and the military. so i agree with kevin. politics in beijing are very, very important. and i think president trump frankly knows all about this. >> rana, so at the end of the day, you have this standoff. both sides are inflicting pain on each other. there are people who argue that china is hurting more because it is more trade dependent. oer
10:32 am
on the other hand, it's a dictatorship where the united states is a democracy and it feels the pain more viscerally. who's going to blink? >> i think in the short-trm, china has more pain to take, but they're also taking a long view. i was really stuck by xi's latest speech, talking about the plans for one belt, one road, how it's going to link up through europe. you already see, by the way, parts of europe, italy, greece coming into the chinese orbit. so that economic diplomacy that china is rolling out is, i think, pretty sophisticated. >> and maybe trump's mistake here was not to bring the europeans in. >> i was just going to say that, and particularly the germans. to be fair, as you said, trump has some legitimate beefs with china, but so do the europeans. and that was our big, strategic mistake. what i'm watching now is where europe is going to go, particularly as 5g and new technologies roll out. are they going to buy from huawei or qualcomm. these will big steaks economic diplomacy in the years ahead. >> thank you. fascinating conversation. next on gps, india's
10:33 am
six-week long election is finally over. when the results are out, you shouldn't be surprised to hear that accused crooks are among the winners. what in the world? i will explain, when we get back. sanitizer kills 99.9% with 0% bleach. lysol. what it takes to protect.™ my digestive system used to make me feel sluggish. but those days are over. now i take metamucil every day. it naturally traps and removes the waste that weighs me down. so i feel... lighter. try metamucil and begin to feel what lighter feels like.. introducing new metamucil premium blend, sweetened with stevia and made with all-natural flavors and colors. it's a delicious way to get your daily dose of fiber. try it today. or psoriatic arthritis, little things can be a big deal.
10:34 am
that's why there's otezla. otezla is not an injection or a cream. it's a pill that treats differently. for psoriasis, 75% clearer skin is achievable, with reduced redness, thickness, and scaliness of plaques. for psoriatic arthritis, otezla is proven to reduce joint swelling, tenderness, and pain. and the otezla prescribing information has no requirement for routine lab monitoring. don't use if you're allergic to otezla. it may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. otezla is associated with an increased risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. upper respiratory tract infection and headache may occur. tell your doctor about your medicines and if you're pregnant or planning to be. ready to treat differently with a pill? otezla. show more of you. ready to treat differently with a pill? [ slow dance♪music plays ]
10:35 am
sfx: record scratch music (plays throughout): [ 'watch me walk' by spencer ludwig ] yo dj, can i put in a request? ♪ don't have no sass about this ♪ ♪ i'm on my way i'm on my way ♪ ♪ can't take no class about this ♪ ♪ i'm on my way i'm on my ♪ like this! ♪ this is a moment you plan for. to start your investment plan, find an advisor at massmutual.com sfx: [ mnemonic ] wat t. rowe price, hundreds of our experts go beyond the numbers to examine investment opportunities firsthand. like a biotech firm that engineers a patient's own cells to fight cancer. this is strategic investing. because your investments deserve the full story. t. rowe price. invest with confidence. for adults with moderately to severely active crohn's disease, stelara® works differently.
10:36 am
studies showed relief and remission, with dosing every 8 weeks. stelara® may lower your ability to fight infections and may increase your risk of infections and cancer. some serious infections require hospitalization. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you have an infection or flu-like symptoms or sores, have had cancer, or develop new skin growths, or if anyone in your house needs or recently had a vaccine. alert your doctor of new or worsening problems, including headaches, seizures, confusion and vision problems. these may be signs of a rare, potentially fatal brain condition. some serious allergic reactions and lung inflammation can occur. talk to your doctor today, and learn how janssen can help you explore cost support options. remission can start with stelara®. now for our what in the world segment. the final polls just closed on the indian election, the last stage of the largest democratic exercise in the world. indian elections always feature dazzling statistics about size and scale, but here's an unusual
10:37 am
one. according to data released this week, almost 20% of the candidates running are facing criminal prosecution. that's right. nearly one fifth of india's potential parliamenttarians are accused of a crime, according to the accountability watchdog, the association of democratic reforms. now, many of these are not jaywalking or parking violations. they include murder, attempted murder, kidnapping. the proportion of candidates who are embroiled in criminal cases in india has steadily increased since 2009. but what is really shocking is not that such candidates are emboldened to run for office, it's that historically, these suspected criminals tend to win. almost one third of the lower house's current parliamentarians are accused in criminal cases. in the last three national elections, on average, candidates accused of crimes have been almost three times more likely to win. those are the findings of the
10:38 am
recent book "when crime pace" by the carnegie endowment's milan ve veshna. now, i should be clear, indian courts are so backlogged, trials can drag on for a decade or more. the larger message is that india has long had a message of mixing crime and politics. why does this happen? india is fragmented by his caste system, and in the past few decades, long-oppressed members of the lower castes has been gaining some power and voice. that's brought with it fresh ethnic tension. vashnav and his peers did a study in late 2013. they messaged indian's ethnic bias against how likely they were to face candidates facing serious criminal cases. they found in places with a high
10:39 am
degree of ethnic tension, people were much more likely to support the accused in politics. you see, it seems that the more threatened indians felt by the power of other groups, the more likely they would be to vote in a strong man from their side who might have run afoul of the law. this is a clear case of tribalism trumping the rule of law. voters may know a politician breaks the rules, breaks the law, but there's a perception that he does this for their side. does this sound familiar? a majority of americans believe that president donald trump committed crimes before his presidency, according to a quinnipiac poll released this month. that includes almost all democrats, but also 17% of republicans, a group which still overwhelming supports trump. in march, one third of republicans thought trump was probably guilty of a crime before he became president. perhaps some of those voters look at trump the way indian voters look at their leaders.
10:40 am
he may be capable of doing bad things, but he'll fight for them. group think and tribalism can undermine the rule of law. in a poor country like india or even in the richest land in the world. next on gps, from tribalism to liberalism. the liberal ideal is under attack from both of its phalafl. you'll hear a full-throated defense from adam gotnick. and...whatever this was. because we make our meat with the good of the deli and no artificial preservatives. make every sandwich count with oscar mayer deli fresh. (danny) after a long day of hard work... ...you have to do more work? (vo) automatically sort your expenses and save over 40 hours a month. (danny) every day you're nearly fried to a crisp, professionally! (vo) you earned it, we're here to make sure you get it. quickbooks. backing you.
10:41 am
they're america's bpursuing life-changing cures. in a country that fosters innovation here, they find breakthroughs... like a way to fight cancer by arming a patient's own t-cells... because it's not just about the next breakthrough... it's all the ones after that. with a leesa hybrid mattress. bedtime is no longer simply the time you go to sleep. it's time to switch off and catch up. time for a deeper rest from a better mattress. experience the leesa hybrid mattress. combining pocket spring responsiveness with premium foam comfort. leesa's hybrid design makes it the experts mattress of choice. american made. built to last. and right now it's on sale. get 15% off and two free pillows. go to leesa.com today! we humans are strange creatures.
10:42 am
other species avoid pain and struggle. we actually... seek it out. other species do difficult things because they have to. we do difficult things. because we like to. we think it's... fun. introducing the all-new 2019 ford ranger built for the strangest of all creatures.
10:43 am
to save 30% on all the medications we carry. so go directly to petmeds.com now.
10:44 am
almost 18 million people from around the world visit the united states every year, but there were two particularly notable arrivals this past week. on monday, hungary's far-right nationalist prime minister, victor orban, was at the white house where the president called him a highly respected leader who had done a tremendous job. and on thursday, brazil's far-right nationalist president bolsonaro spoke at an event in dallas. these two men and fellow travelers like donald trump and vladimir putin represent the growing global threat to the ideas of liberalism. but my next guest offers a full-throated defense of liberalism and says we need it now, more than ever. adam gopnik's new book is "a thousand small sanities." welcome, adam. >> thank you, fareed. >> the book began, you say, after the election of donald trump, when you went with your daughter for a walk.
10:45 am
>> on the night of the election of donald trump, she was shaken, not because there had been a change in parties in power. i would not have sympathized or endured that for very long. changing parties in power is a crucial party of liberal democratic values, left to right, right to left, back again. she was concerned about the specter of a kind of new authoritarianism, even a predatory authoritarianism that she hadn't been prepared for. so i took her out and we walked around and wandaround our new y block for two or three hours. and i did her absolutely no good. she was texting to her friends, but i made a mental memorandum to myself, saying, i'll write a letter to my daughter about liberalism, trying to explain why the values that i brought her up with, and i had inherited from my own father weren't just a family tradition, but they represented real, enduring, important values that had helped make the world a much better place than it had ever been before. >> first to explain, when you talk about liberalism, you're not talking about it in quite
10:46 am
the left/right party sense. what do you mean? >> i don't mean it in the sense of something that's owned bip the democratic party or by any one political party. i'm talking about the set of ideas, of principles the whole temperament that's motivated liberal democracy and inspired liberal democracy at least since the 18th century, and particularly since the american civil war and the end of slavery and the beginning of all of those great programs of emancipation, for african-americans, for women, for sexual minorities now. that whole great program of reform and self-correction that inspires liberal democracy and its institutions, belief in free speech, belief in an oscillation of parties in power, a belief in education, an open education and in having dissident ideas not just allowed but welcomed and encouraged. all of that set of ideas is what i mean by liberal democracy and what i mean by liberalism and it doesn't belong to any one party. >> so why do you think it's now under threat, just again to
10:47 am
explain, what is the rise of ill liberalism that you see around the world? >> m has always existed and it's always threatened liberalism. liberalism, it's an interesting thing, fareed, almost always looks extremely weak in any historical moment. the 1930s with the rise of fascism and communism, everyone said liberal institutions and liberal democracies will be too weak to counter it. and many great intellectuals went either to the extreme left or extreme right. and they were wrong, liberal institutions proved much stronger. >> then in the 1950s, people said the same thing vis-a-vis communism. >> and in our own time, after 9/11, you heard many people saying the same thing, we don't have the discipline, the rigor. at every one of those moments, it turned out that liberal dp x admoniti democracies turn out to be extraordinary strong. and that's very much what this book is about. why they're so strong. >> you describe as one of the
10:48 am
shining lights of liberalism, john mccain's concession speech to obama. explain why. >> yes, because it's terribly important that we remember that liberalism and liberal traditions belong to no one party. one of the crucial, and you think about it, fareed, astonishing, miraculous things in the liberal tradition, totally unknown to the rest of human history is the idea that we can surrender power without vengeance and without feeling embattled. when john mccain stood up there on the night of 2018 a08 and sai how were the new president and i wish him nothing but well, we take that for somewhat for granted. he did it with particular eloquence in a particularly embattled time. but that's a miraculous thing. that isn't something we should ever take for granted. and in that case, john mccain's concession speech was a great moment in the history of liberalism. >> and you think that trump does represent a threat to this? >> how can we deny that he represents a threat to it?
10:49 am
every day he tweets something, and it's not a question of where you stand on abortion or what the federal reserve should do about interest rates. it's a question of, every day, the president tweeting something to cast doubt on the legitimacy of an election. to cast doubt on the basic g legitimacy of his political rivals. to imply that his political rivals are criminals, are in themselves illegitimate, you know perfectly well, fareed, that's what happens in autocratic countries. that's what happens in third world dictatorships. that's where opposing the party in power risk your livelihood and your life very often. we see that. that's the large history of mankind is a history of autocrats, imposing penalties on people who oppose them. that's not the liberal tradition. and when it comes under assault in that way, we can say, well, it's just rhetorical, it's another tweet, but it's a gopnik. >> and we will be right back. baas
10:50 am
or later... every chip will crack. this daughter was home visiting when mom saw a chip in her windshield. >> mom: honey is that a chip? >> tech: they wanted it fixed fast so they brought it to us. >> mom: hi. >> tech: with our in-shop chip repair service, we can fix it the same day... guaranteed. plus with most insurance a safelite chip repair is no cost to you. >> mom: really? drive safely. all right. ♪ acoustic music >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, ♪ safelite replace. we need a solution.ut their phones down. introducing... smartdogs. the first dogs trained to train humans. stopping drivers from: liking. selfie-ing. and whatever this is. available to the public... never. smartdogs are not the answer. but geico has a simple tip. turn on "do not disturb while driving" mode. brought to you by geico.
10:51 am
and i don't add trup the years.s. but what i do count on... is boost® delicious boost® high protein nutritional drink has 20 grams of protein, along with 26 essential vitamins and minerals. boost® high protein. be up for life. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ applebee's new loaded fajitas. now that's eatin' good in the neighborhood. applebee's new loaded fajitas.
10:52 am
(music throughout)
10:53 am
listen to your mom, knuckleheads. hand em over. hand what over? video games, whatever you got. let's go. you can watch videos of people playing video games in the morning. is that everything? i can see who's online. i'm gonna sweep the sofa fort. well, look what i found. take control of your wifi with xfinity xfi. let's roll! now that's simple, easy, awesome. xfinity xfi gives you the speed, coverage and control you need. manage your wifi network from anywhere when you download the xfi app today. . last week south africa concluded its sixth national
10:54 am
elections 25 years after its first free elections. 17 million people cast their votes, and it brings me to my question. what percent of registered voters came out to participate in this year's election? 87%, 72%, 66% or 58%? stay tuned, and i'll tell you the correct answer. my book of the week is the one you just heard about, adam gopnik's "a thousand small san tis" written as a letter to his daughter in the wake of trump's election, the brilliant "new yorker" writer has mounted a defense of liberalism, the philosophy of slow, incremental progress opening up doors, fighting discrimination all to secure individual liberty and dignity. though it does not have the fire and brim enstone appeal of radicalism right and left, gopnik rightly points out that liberalism has changed the world. the answer to my" gps" chag edge is c, only 66% of the nearly 27 million people registered to vote in south
10:55 am
africa's election actually exercised that hard-won right. turnout has been declining since democratization when 87% of the people turned out and overwhelmingly supported the party behind south africa's liberation, the african national congress, but reenchtsly support for that party has also dropped. historically the anc was south africa's hope for party, the one that promised change and equality, a better life for all as the slogan goes, but the party hasn't delivered on that promise. the anc's 25 reign over south africa has been awash with corruption scandals. economic growth now hovers near 1%, and south africa is the world's most economically unequal country, according to the world bank, with that disparity cementing racial divisions. it's worse for young south africans. unemployment already high at 27% nationally. it's over 50% for workers under 25.
10:56 am
while the anc garnered the majority of votes again this year, it did so by its smallest margin yet. this is partly because the party has failed to truly overcome apartheid's legacy making space for radicals on its flank. just look at the rise of the economic freedom fighters, a party that encourages anti-white sentiments and land redistribution without any compensation. i wish the best of luck to the anc's leader president ram posa in his quest to finally deliver on his party's original promises. after all as mandela is often quoted as saying, it always seems impossible until it's done. thanks for all of you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week. girl: dad! keep on watching! amazing, honey. (horn tooting) ♪ who can say why your heart sighs ♪ ♪ as your love flies kraft. for the win win. his life is pretty comfortable.
10:57 am
then, he laid on a serta and realized his life was only just sorta comfortable. i've been living a lie. (laughs) the serta icomfort hybrid mattress. not just sorta comfortable, serta comfortable. woman: (on phone) discover. hi. do you have a travel card? yep. our miles card. earn unlimited 1.5 miles and we'll match it at the end of your first year. nice! i'm thinking about a scuba diving trip. woman: ooh! (gasp) or not. you okay? yeah, no, i'm good. earn miles. we'll match 'em at the end of your first year. you don't see psoriasis. you see clear skin. you see me. but if you saw me before cosentyx... ♪ i was covered. it was awful. but i didn't give up. i kept fighting. i got clear skin with cosentyx. 3 years and counting. clear skin can last. see if cosentyx could make a difference for you. cosentyx is proven to help people with moderate to severe plaque psoriasis find clear skin that can last.
10:58 am
don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting cosentyx, you should be checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms. or if you have received a vaccine or plan to. if you have inflammatory bowel disease, tell your doctor if symptoms develop or worsen. serious allergic reactions may occur. see me now. i'm still clear. how sexy are these elbows? get clear skin that can last. ask your dermatologist about cosentyx. with priceline, bundling our lowest prices on flights, hotels and rental cars means you spend less time planning and more time travelling. we like that! by the way, these chairs are ours. everyone is already sitting.
10:59 am
i went straight to ctca. after my mastectomy, i felt like part of my identity was being taken away. my team made me feel whole again. cancer treatment centers of america. appointments available now. cancer treatment centers of america. last year, the department of veteran's affairs partnered with t-mobile for business, to help care for veterans everywhere. with va video connect, powered by t-mobile, men and women who serve can speak to their doctors from virtually anywhere, and get the care they deserve, so they can return to their most important post. best friend, quarterback, or just dad. the va provides the care, t-mobile provides the coverage. it's either the assurance of a 165-pointor it isn't.on proces. it's either testing an array of advanced safety systems. or it isn't. it's either the peace of mind of a standard 5-year unlimited mileage warranty. or it isn't.
11:00 am
for those who never settle, it's either mercedes-benz certified pre-owned. or it isn't. the mercedes-benz certified pre-owned sales event. now through may 31st. only at your authorized mercedes-benz dealer. hello, everyone, and welcome to our viewers here in the u.s. and around the world this sunday. i'm fredericka whitfield. all right. we begin with the president firing back at the first republican in congress who says trump engaged in impeachable conduct, michigan's congressman amash post everposted what he called his own principled conclusions on the mueller report writing attorney general william barr misrepresented the report and president trump engaged in impeachable conduct. trump