hello, i'm dana bash. welcome to a special holiday edition of "inside politics." in an exclusive cnn interview, former vice president joe biden defends his record on race and says he's been taking on, quote, bullies like trump his whole life. senator kamala harris is expected to announce a fresh fund-raising haul this hour as her presidential campaign catches fire, and a red-hot rebound for the economy as the jobs market roars pack to life from a mediocre may. >> i share the president's frustration, as should all of america with the fed chairman who raised rates too fast and engaged in quantitative tightening in the absence of -- >> is the chairman loco in your view? >> i'm not going there, jim. i totally support the president and his characterizations. >> first presidential candidate joe biden is defendsing his

decades-long record in an exclusive interview with my colleague, chris cuomo. the former vice president is trying to recover from last week's democratic debates and senator kamala harris' direct assault on his record on racial justice, especially federally mandated school busing to desegregate schools in the late '60s and early '70s. biden says he just doesn't think it matters to today's voters. >> did you see the questions about your past positions from the perspective of race being as relevant as they are? >> no, and i don't think they're relevant because they're taken out of context. it's so easy to go back and go back 30, 40, 50 years and take a context and take it completely out of context. i mean, you know, i get all this information about other people's past and what they have done and not done. you know, i'm just not going to go there. if we keep doing that, we should

be debating what we do from here. >> here with me to share their reporting an their insights, cnn's abby philip, julie hirshfield times, margaret talev. so many things to dissect in this interview with the vice president starting with this whole notion of busing and what happened back then, what happened with kamala harris. i want to go to another part of this topic in this interview talking about his record, defending and explaining it and talking about it in the context of 2020. >> i was in favor of busing that was if a court ruled if there was a law passed or circumstance that a county, a city, a state did that prevented black folks from being somewhere, that's wrong, you should bus. i even went so far in the middle of that busing controversy with

saying i'd use helicopters if that was necessary to make the point. what the issue is now and it is then, voluntary busing, we supported it. i supported it then. >> so chris cuomo very rightly said that this isn't necessarily just about the issue of busing. that is not why kamala harris brought this up. maybe that was an issue for her, but she was obviously going for a larger point here. and this is an issue that goes to his record, which he tried to say isn't as relevant. is that going to fly? >> i don't think it is. i think what seems to be missing here is joe biden understanding why people want to hear more from him about looking back on that period of time. what do we know now about the undercurrents of opposition to busing. where did that come from? and it wasn't just about the logistics of busing, it wasn't

about whether a court ordered it or not, it wasn't about whether really the federal government ordered it or not. it was about whether white parents wanted their kids going to school with black students. that's what the debate is about. that's the part when he goes into -- he sort of falls into these technicalities as he tries to explain his position. he's not seeing the bigger picture. i think that's where some of this frustration with biden is coming from. i think he perpetuates that in this interview where he is not taking a look at the bigger picture and explaining himself in that broader context. even looking back on his position and saying, well, knowing what we know now, or learning what i have learned over my 40 years in politics and having seen everything that i've seen, here's what i would have done differently at that time. i think that's the part where biden seems to be unwilling to revise his views from that period of time. i think that's going to continue to be a problem for him.

>> and he says it's not relevant. again, i'm not so sure that voters who are used to going through somebody's very long record, if they have such a thing, are going to agree with that or whether or not they're going to say, you know what, he's right, let's talk about what he's going to do for us if he's in the white house in 2021. >> i think he is partly right. he's right on paper when he says that people -- busing is not a huge issue that people are going to be voting according to in this election. it's not about busing in this election. but it is very much for democrats about who is the candidate that represents their values, who is the candidate who is speaking in deep and relevant ways about issues of like race and able to reflect on his own record in a way that makes them feel like he would make good decisions going forward. i think in a lot of ways this is a signaling issue. i think that's why kamala harris clearly brought that up at the debate and was prepared to do so, because she's trying to show

that she is a person who has a more current and more deeply felt position on this and that joe biden does not. until he's willing to do that, that last part abby was talking about, to say that i had this position then but knowing what i know now it might have been different, i think that's going to continue to be an issue. >> there is a duality to kind of what the polling and focus groupings and feedback tells us right now about where biden stands. on the one hand the polls, even though he declined and harris came up after that first debate, the polls still show pretty consistently that people think he is the one best poised to beat president trump. on the other hand, when you look at his messaging, both across the aisle and to his own base, his own base are women and people of color. and on kind of the middle and the republican side, trump is very good at talking in kind of today's format and sound bites and twitter-sized pieces. doesn't make things complicated, just repeats the same phrase

over and over again, injects into the bloodstream. biden has not demonstrated an instinct to do that. when it comes to talking to the base, how do you talk about race issues? do you use words that instinctively make sense to people? these are his two challenges in these two pockets. yet at the same time people -- when you ask voters what they think, they think he makes the best sense and is probably the best poised, but does he connect? >> that's true. you really try to stake a claim of him being the best guy to go after trump, which ooii want to talk about in one second. one thing that i thought was so fascinating and tactical was the way that he described how surprised he was about the way senator harris went after him. watch this. >> why didn't you fight it like this in the debate? >> in 30 seconds? >> were you prepared for them to come after you? >> i was prepared for them to come after me but i wasn't

prepared for the person who came after me the way -- she knew beau, she knows me. anyway, here's the deal. the american people think they know me and they know me. >> you know, i will give you that little pop-up video. remember that from -- you probably don't remember it. >> yes, i do. i'm with you. >> but the point is, is that he's basically saying she knows me and she was being political. >> well, of course. joe biden has run for president twice before so he goes 30 seconds, as if he's not very used to this. but this she knows beau thing is really interesting because kamala harris and beau biden were really close and the harris campaign wanted to talk about that until this skirmish with joe biden, his father. now these two campaigns continue to be squabbling on twitter. this debate exchange has clearly gotten under people's skin on the staffing level and that's showing. >> let's talk about the number

one issue among democratic primary caucus goers, which is who can best go after donald trump. here's what the former vice president said on that. >> how can democrats have confidence that you can take on the biggest and the baddest when you're having trouble sparring in party. >> i don't think i'm having trouble sparring. you walk behind me in a debate, come here, man. you know me too well. the idea that i'd be intimidated by donald trump? he's the bully that i knew my whole life. he's the bully that i've always stood up to. he's the bully that used to make fun when i was a kid and stutter and i smacked him in the mouth. >> so the president, before he left for his golf club in new jersey, responded to that. listen. >> i don't think i'm a bully at all. i just don't like being taken advantage of by other countries, by pharmaceutical companies, by

all of the people that have taken advantage of this country. >> you know, it's interesting. joe biden may not be wrong in the sense that the kamala harris sparring that he experienced and wasn't prepared for is going to be a little different from what you might see if he is up against trump. it is a little bit more the -- the trump one is more visceral, i think. the way that trump fights in a debate, the way that he fights in the media is different. it's not about intellectualism, it's not about, you know, really thinking deeply about these issues from the '60s and the '70s. it's about who's going to win out on these very gutteral issues. i think that he -- i think that biden feels like that is a different thing for him and that he's more prepared for that. we'll find out, but i do think that a trump versus biden and a

kamala harris versus biden, these are two completely different types of fights. i think that's kind of what biden was referring to when he says i know the trump, because he's the guy who was in my school yard, you know, 50 years ago making fun of me. we'll finding o out if that's ty it plays out. >> very good point. you're talking about him positioning himself to fight the president, but of course the fight is just beginning among democrats to find out who is actually going to get that chance. the vice president talked about his position on issues very different in many respects from a lot of his competitors. we're going to talk about that and much more after a break.

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we're back with more of cnn's exclusive interview with 2020 presidential candidate joe biden where the former vice president made his case that his positions are more mainstream in his party than others. >> i think ocasio-cortez is a brilliant, bright woman. she won a primary. in the general election fights, who won? mainstream democrats who were very progressive on social issues and very strong on education, health care. look, my north star is the middle class. when the middle class does well, everybody does well. what i've seen around the country is the vast majority of democrats are where i am on the issues. i wish i had been labeled as moderate when i was running in

delaware back in the days. >> 80% of your party says center left. farther left is getting more attention and getting amplified. >> it is. >> there's a disconnect. >> look, it's center left, that's where i am. where it's not is way left. >> i should just add that bernie sanders, who like others on the liberal side of the field running for 2020, jumped on the former vice president's comments about aoc and he said on twitter i'm proud to be working with aoc and so many other democrats to pass medicare for all, debt-free college and a green new deal. this is the agenda america needs and that will energize voters to defeat donald trump. this is so fascinating, because as much as, as we talked about in the last segment, there's such a push to figure out who is going to be able to beat donald trump, there is a real ideological divide, differences, philosophical differences,

within the democratic party. joe biden articulated his position, i think, so much more than he did last week with this interview with chris cuomo. >> and when it comes to medicare for all, to be clear, polling supports biden is on to something. polling shows although americans like the idea of medicare for all, when you explain you might lose your private health insurance and not have a choice, people prefer what joe biden is talking about, which is a medicare buy-in option. he's also going to invite the pushback from sanders that he needs to have a more nimble response to than his campaign has in the past. >> but sanders is looking for a way back in. sanders' beef is much more with elizabeth warren than it is with joe biden. it's not like i'm really trying to decide between joe biden or bernie sanders, right? >> i think it does just illustrate it's bernie sanders and elizabeth warren. it's the people who are more -- who are drawn to vote for those candidates versus whether or not joe biden -- i mean the question going into this primary race has

been does joe biden's brand of democratic politics still play in today's electorate. and he is doubling, tripling down on that. let me just give one other example during the interview. he got even more specific on the issue of health care. on the issue of what to do about undocumented immigrants. >> i think there should be health care for everyone. i have a plan how to do that, it's rational and will cost a hell of a lot less and will work. we're in a situation where if you provide an option for anybody who in fact wants to buy into medicare for all, they can buy in. they buy in, and they can do it. if they like their employer-based insurance, which a lot of unions broke their neck to get and people like it, they shouldn't have to give it up. >> you have people running close to you now who are saying decriminalize coming into the

country illegally. do you think that should be decriminalized? >> no, i don't. people should have to get in line. but people are coming because they're actually seeking asylum, they should have a chance to make their case. >> you have a book coming out on immigration, you understand better than most all of the different points of view across the spectrum, but particularly inside the democratic party on this. >> well, it's true that this is a huge issue. one of the things -- the first thing, i think, that president trump pounced on after the second democratic debate is that everyone raised their hand when asked whether their health plan would cover undocumented immigrants. he said, game over, which the vice president still stuck by. >> which he absolutely stuck by but he is distinguishing himself from the rest of the field. the reason that trump thinks that is that this is a very difficult issue for democrats. i would put it in a separate category than health care, which i think the vast majority of the party is in the same -- has the same goal and it's just a question of how you get there.

but this is a really difficult question for democrats of where to come down on enforcement and how you deal with the undocumented people who are here. it is a real -- it's going to be a divide in the primary, it's going to be a huge issue in the general election. but i think it's also an example of the competing impulses in the democratic party right now. because there's all of this pent-up anger and opposition among democrats to what president trump has done on immigration. so many of these other issues, health care and education as well. but immigration for sure. and so they want to push this as far opposite from where the president is as you can go, which leads you to say we should just decriminalize illegal -- decriminalize crossing the border illegally. they also really want to beat president trump. you could argue and i think make a pretty

on both immigration and health care. he's basically saying preserve obamacare. obamacare would be more successful if republicans weren't trying to kill it by a thousand cuts. >> which means preserve the private health insurance system. >> yes. and on immigration it seems to me what he's basically saying is very similar to the obama approach which is until congress is in a place where they can pass bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform, let's patch it with some daca fix, enforce when you have to enforce, show mercy otherwise. it's basically a return to the previous status quo argument that tries to balance law and order with mercy. that seems to be the space where he's making the argument. i think where we haven't really heard biden yet as much as we probably will at some point in the next few months is foreign policy and how much he wants to step away from obama's approach on foreign policy. during the time they were in office together he was a good soldier but he did have different views on how to handle

various things. right now the election is so much going to be about the economy, health care and immigration, it makes sense we haven't heard that much on that. >> that's what the voters want to hear about, domestic issues. everybody stand by because up next president trump says he's considering an executive order for a controversial citizenship question on the 2020 census. from l'oréal paris.ra voluptuous volume. intense length. feathery-soft lashes. this is what paradise looks like. lash paradise mascara from l'oréal paris. take your lashes to paradise. hey, who are you? oh, hey jeff, i'm a car thief... what?! i'm here to steal your car because, well, that's my job. what? what?? what?! (laughing) what?? what?! what?! [crash] what?! haha, it happens. and if you've got cut-rate car insurance, paying for this could feel like getting robbed twice. so get allstate... and be better protected

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president trump is venting his frustration over a census citizenship question today. the president thinks his own justice department threw in the towel after the supreme court rejected the administration's argument for inclusion of a question about whether or not people are a citizen of the u.s. the source says the president has made clear that he wants to fight, and the president himself said today he's considering a number of options to do that, including executive action. >> we could also add an addition on, so we can start the printing now and maybe do an addendum after we get a positive decision. so we're working on a lot of things, including an executive order. think of it, 15 to $20 billion and you're not allowed to ask them are you a citizen. look, a lot of people thought

his answer was fine. i didn't see the answer yet. they thought it was fine. it can be expanded very simply. >> cnn's arion de vogue joins me now. you have more on the justice department. >> cnn has lenders that the department of justice is going to tell a federal judge later this afternoon that it wants to keep its options open, look for ways that it could add a citizenship question to the 2020 census. for now the justice department says that it will go to the printer without the question, but they want to keep their options open. as the president said there, they think that they have some scenarios that could muster a court's approval and they want to keep working in that direction. dana, that comes after a wild week, right? earlier in the week the department of justice told this federal judge that it wasn't going to add the question. and then trump issued those biting tweets and he said he wanted to keep fighting.

and now the department of justice will say, no, we want to keep our options open. so what that will mean now is daunting legal challenges, because this maryland judge is likely to set a scheduling order for over the summer to look at new discovery and new depositions. another judge is also in new york will be looking at sanctions motions. so these legal challenges are going to continue while this plays out, dana. >> thank you so much. on top of it as always, appreciate it. i mean this is so fascinating because the supreme court decided not necessarily that it's unconstitutional, but that the information that the administration provided was insufficient, right? the issue that the administration has had is that they're up against a clock, that they have to get the census printed and out because that is in the constitution, they have to figure it out. so that's why earlier this week the president apparently signed off on saying, okay, go ahead

and do the census without the question about citizenship. he got a lot of blowback from conservatives, forced his justice department to go back preholiday to the judge. here we are, they're trying another bite at the apple. and so the question is whether or not this is going to suffice, whether executive action is going to work, or whether they're just buying time so the president can show his political supporters that he's trying. >> that is a big part of this is just the president being able to show he's still fighting for this. the problem that he has and the administration has, and they know this very well, the court didn't just say there isn't enough information here, they actually said the rationale was contrived, made up essentially. and there was a lot of evidence presented during this legal challenge that suggested that the real reason that they wanted to add this question had to do with solidifying republican dominance of congressional districts. so until the administration -- they'd have to basically turn back the clock and say, no,

actually that wasn't why, here's why. unless they can produce that it doesn't seem likely they would be able to persuade a court that this was actually appropriate. and so then the question is can you do an executive order. and i think he would rather have this as an issue rather than a resolved question. just the way he put it with reporters, what's wrong if asking if people are a citizen. to most people that does sound like, yeah, what's wrong with that. i think he wants to keep saying that. >> we're so understandably in the weeds because this is such a fast-moving thing and there's so many legal questions and procedural questions about whether or not this can move forward. but you mentioned something that's so important which is the core of why this is even an issue at all and why there's a fight at all. and it is a political fight. the people who are battling this in the courts are saying, wait a minute, you're trying to suppress a certain population that we need to know about. >> he seemed to indicate in his comments that he thought that

would affect reaproportionment and all kinds of stuff. it's not clear that he has a consistent policy rationale for wanting to do this. the way that he talks about it is effective because it sounds like a common sense kind of thing. for the section of voters he's trying to reach, i think he's tapping into a real feeling. but if you just look at the calendar and the way things work, it seems very unlikely this is going to change the dynamic, at least for the 2020 census. if he were to successful and they were to rebuild a case and rationale for doing this, it could in effect affect the 2030 census long after somebody else is in office. >> everybody stand by because it is the first friday of the month which means it is jobs report day. the president had some thoughts on that as well as how the fed chairman should do his job. stay with us. wow! that's awesome! this 4th of july, celebrate in a new chevrolet. oh wow! they're all really cool cars. woo, i love it! i like those lights. look how beautiful this is!

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we had great numbers this morning. i think it was 224,000 jobs. those were really unexpectedly good. and our country continues to do really well, really, really well. >> welcome back. that was president trump this morning touting the latest unemployment report. the u.s. economy is seeing a strong comeback, adding 224,000 jobs in june after a disappointing may. june did see a rise in unemployment to 3.7%, but that's still historically low. alison kosik breaks down the numbers. >> hi, dana. a definite surprise to the upside for the june jobs report showing that 224,000 jobs were

added to the economy. so many were questioning whether or not may was a fluke or the beginning of a downward trend in the jobs market. i think you can say that it certainly was a fluke. what about the unemployment rate? the unemployment rate did move up from 3.6% to 3.7% but it did go up for good reasons. 335,000 people did enter the workforce. much of that may have to do with students who got out of school and went ahead and took jobs for the summer. needless to say, 3.7% for the jobless rate for june. where did people take jobs? business, 51,000 jobs added there. those are good-paying jobs. construction, 21,000 additions there. that's good to see because we do know the housing market is slowing down, it is under pressure. same with manufacturing. 17,000 jobs added there. another good sign because the manufacturing sector has been under pressure for about four months so we are seeing an upside surprise there of 17,000 jobs. otherwise, bottom line with this

report, the june jobs report surprising to the upside, putting to rest at least for today that we could be seeing a slowdown in the jobs market. dana? >> alison, thank you so much. here with the table, gina smilek joins your conversation. big picture here, everyone alison talked about, the may numbers were not good and that was the beginning of a downturn, whether temporary because of the trade war or other issues going on and this job report suggests it was a fluke. what do you see? >> absolutely. i think what we saw this month was a real solid jobs gain. paired with a lot of other positive things happening sort of underneath the surface. what we saw that slight increase in the unemployment rate as she mentioned happened as people flowed back into the workforce and as people left their jobs to find new ones, which is a real sign that people are feeling confident about the job outlook. the one soft point if there was

anything is wages are only accelerating 3.1% on a year-over-year basis which isn't a bad number but not what you would expect with strong productivity and a tight labor market. so if anything is worth paying attention to, it might be that. >> let's look at what this means. this is "inside politics" for some of the more political states, especially for president trump. if you look back in 2016 he is president because of some of the industrial states in the midwest and also in the rust belt. so let's look at this. wisconsin, he won this state more than any other. it was a surprise, any other state. people thought definitely hillary clinton was going to win. he won. then look at the state of ohio, there 5.1 when he became president, now it is 4.1, which is considerably better. michigan, it's about the same,

4.8 and now 4.2. so you look at those numbers, they're all better for these states, but the question is whether or not, you mentioned this and alison did as well. whether or not these numbers tell the whole story about how people feel. president trump is president because people might have seen the economy getting better but they didn't feel it at home or in their pocketbooks. does this tell that story? >> well, that sort of plays off of what jeanna was just saying. if they're not feeling like they have better wages, if they don't feel economically where they want to be, even if they have jobs, it's not necessarily going to be an upside. i think all of us who have watched presidential races unfold and certainly re-election races understand how important the state of the economy is to the incumbent president. president trump understands that too. but it's one of the reasons you're seeing him really hammer on this jobs, jobs, jobs he just tweeted and the white house is putting out big releases celebrating these numbers because they want to bake into

the cake for people in their minds, you're doing better, the country is doing better, because only if they feel it will that translate into votes for him. if you're being told everything is better and you're not feeling it in your own pocketbook, in your own household, in your own economic picture, it's not going to matter. >> he also needs someone to blame. in this case it's the fed. so he's laying the ground work to have someone to blame if the numbers drop off, the air comes out of the balloon or people don't feel satisfied. he's punching away at jay powell for months. is he going to fire him or not. >> let's hear what he said about the fed this morning and we'll talk more about it. >> but we're paying a lot of interest and it's unnecessary. but we don't have a fed that knows what they're doing so it's one of those little things. but if we had a fed that would lower rates, you would have a rocketship. when obama, president obama was here, he paid close to zero interest rates. i'm paying real interest. >> continue. >> so here's the bloomberg story from this morning shortly after

the president spoke. here's the headline. fed debate shifts from half point cut to whether to cut at all. ironically this jobs report is so good that now they're like maybe we don't cut interest rates and that drives president trump bananas. so you're going to see this fight continue. there is a correlation. every time you hear him talk about the fed, part of what he's doing is hedging against the idea that if the economy stops helping him as much as it has been helping him that he has someone else lined up to blame. >> which is not totally unusual for presidents to do. it is unusual in recent history, right, since the clinton administration presidents have avoided placing the blame on the fed, even in the deepest downturn since the depression. even in the recession nobody blamed the fed. president trump has started this train almost exactly a year ago now and has steadily been blaming the fed for the last year so i think he's bringing this into the public consciousness in an important way. >> what's different about what president trump is doing is it

seems almost purely for political reasons. there doesn't seem to be an economic rationale for cutting the rates. he keeps bringing up president obama suggesting that obama got an unfair advantage because the rates were low during his term and he wants that same advantage to help him as he's trying to make an economic case going into 2020. that's not an economic argument given the strength of the economy in this report. so that in and of itself is different and his advisers are backing him up on it for different reasons of their own. but the fed is looking at that and saying we can't justify this. we're supposed to be an independent entity here that's not moving based on the president's political whims and his desire to compete with his predecess predecessor. >> let me just say as we go to break, you mentioned that the president is in an unpress departme -- unprecedented way going after the fed, the guy that he nominated, calling him loco. up next, presidential

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topping our political radar, today is the last day for customs and border protection acting chief john sanders. he announced he was resigning earlier this week and this comes amid controversy over the

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welcome back. you're looking at live pictures of senator kamala harris on the campaign trail right now in sioux city, iowa. harris is still in the spotlight since last week's debate where she went after joe biden's record on racial justice. moments ago harris turned her attention back to her main target, president trump. >> make america great again? does that mean back before the voting rights act? back before the civil rights act? back before roe v. wade? what's he talking about, make america great again? there is such greatness in who we are right now. and so let's agree that we're not going to turn back the clock. we're not going back. we are not going back. >> and she's also leaning into a new attack line she debuted this week, saying the president is a

predator. >> he has predatory instincts and a predatory nature. and the thing about predators is this. predators by their nature identify and then prey on the vulnerable. predators are cowards. and we don't need a predator in the white house. >> it's a good thing we don't have a predator drinking game going on because that was just the one sound bite and she said it so many times. but it is noteworthy and it is interesting, particularly after the week that she had last night, how she is focusing so much on president trump in that way. >> certainly this is a candidate who had faced some early knocks for her prosecutorial record from the left and playing the prosecutor towards the president. if she stays this direct, i think this could pay off for her

strategically. >> i think this is also about coming after biden's holding on to this place in the democratic primary where democrats think that biden can take on trump. she has to now convince them that she can take on trump. she has to do that by actually doing it. for a long time these candidates have been trying to avoid talking about trump directly because that's really not what democratic voters want to talk about. but at the same time this is about -- this is about taking away the mantle of inevitability from joe biden and convincing voters that she can do it too. those voters who want to be moved more by their heads than by their hearts, that she is not a gamble for them if they were to trust her with the nomination going up against trump in the general. >> the other thing that i thought that was fascinating, when i heard that word predator, it went to sexual predator. it sounded like she was talking at least in part to women who have a real issue with president trump. many who voted for him and are now we see in the polls

re-evaluating, and i think that's going to be a consistent theme of this line of attack if she keeps at it. >> it is not subtle at all. sorry about that, margaret, we'll get you next time. have a great weekend. that you for joining us on "inside politics." brianna keilar starts right now. i'm brianna keilar live from our washington headquarters. welcome to this special edition of cnn right now. under way president trump in the 11th hour making a last-ditch threat to get a citizenship question on the 2020 census less than an hour before a court deadline demanding to hear the administration's plan. just a short time ago, the president said he's exploring all options, including issuing an executive order. >> we have four or five ways we can do it. it's one of the ways that we're thinking about doing seriously. we're doing well on the census. we can also add an