dukes on roller blades. cute is not a phony quote from t reagan. all i can say, is that is cute, very cute, on the ridiculist. and the news continues with chris. chris? >> thank you for that image of wolf which i will never get out of my head. i'm chris cuomo. welcome to "prime time." joe biden got a wakeup call in the first debate. how will the former vp respond? you're about to see as we show you new parts from our exclusive sit-down. and the multimillionaire with connections to princes and presidents. that man is jeffrey epstein and he had quietly beaten the case against him until now. he's back behind bars and we have someone who's covered this

story from the beginning and says the truth of who this man is and what he has done will below you away. what do you say? let's get after it. ♪ former vp joe biden doesn't do a lot of sit-downs, but he did one with us on independence day. we tested, he offered some new answers and then an apology followed for remarks about segregationist senators. now, watching the former vp with his wife, jill, was even more interesting to me than being with biden alone. why? because the people around a candidate often signal things the candidate does not. take a look. >> i appreciate you guys taking this opportunity. >> happy to be here, man. >> thank you. this time how is this different for you? >> well, it's -- you know, i think we knew this was going to

be a little bit tougher. it feels a little bit different. there are so many candidates in the race. but so far it's gone pretty well. we've been in, what, two months and things feel good. >> biggest surprise for you so far? >> the biggest surprise i think was the debate. i think -- you know, i think probably kamala was a little bit of a surprise. i think that's the biggest surprise so far. >> different position for you. fighting from the front, right? you've been an underdog pretty much your whole career. you've achieved amazing things. but what surprises you about fighting from the front? >> well, i knew that whoever is in the front is going to have a target on their back, and i knew that was occurring, but what surprised me is the response of people on the street, the people that no matter where i am, there's an enthusiasm and all the talk about hits and the rest, but i keep having

endorsement after endorsement, the governor of connecticut endorsed me, the mayor, the leading african-american person here in waterloo -- not here, but in waterloo endorsed me, a number of african-american leaders have endorsed. the mayor of atlanta. what i try to do, chris, is focus -- i know this is a marathon. and i try to focus on my feel here, what's happening in the street, what's happening when i go out. and it's been gratifying. you know, i -- i've been surprised not about the attacks but i've been surprised at the intensity sometimes of the attacks. >> making you second guess yourself? >> no, it doesn't. it doesn't make me second guess, but it makes me decide, this race is about the future. we can go back and pick everybody's record apart, if you

want, you take it out of context because nobody knows the context at the moment. so it's easy to distort. it's surprised me a little bit some of the stuff that's come out in terms of the attack lines. and -- but i'm not going to go there. and i'm going to try -- look, barack said it best, you don't want to form a circular firing squad. the only person who wins in that one is the president of the united states. the guy who's there now. >> 2016, such a hard decision for you, frankly at the time i didn't know how it could have come out any other way. did you think that joe biden had had an amazing run, but that was it in 2016? did you think that was it? >> i did and i think joe thought that as well. once this president was elected people started coming up to us and saying, you know, joe has to run. he has to run. and then charlottesville occurred and then it sort of got louder and, jill, you have to tell joe he has to run.

>> what did that do to you? how did you process that emotionally? >> well, i think -- you know, i have always said that i thought joe would be the best president and i've always supported him and i know where his heart is. i know his values. and i think he's in such direct contrast to what we have now with president trump. and so as i started to think about it and our family did, i said, you know what, it's the right decision. >> why is it worth it as somebody who grew up in politics. you know what's going to be done with him. on his best day, at his best, running at 105%, you know what it's going to be like, and that's just the primary, let alone the general election against one of the most faresome politicians we've ever seen. why is it worth it? >> it's worth it because it's going to change the lives of so

many americans. everything that he's worked so hard for, and that makes it all worth it. >> you said at a rally, you want to talk big ideas, i'm going to cure cancer. did you mean it that way? >> what i meant was, what i've said all along, we can fundamentally change the face of cancer and eventually we'll cure -- i think we'll be able to cure almost every cancer. the thing is, we're devoted to that notion and think of what we can do in this country if we take the resources that are being wasted now and spend it on significant research on cancer, on alzheimer's, on diabetes, on so many things. i've been sitting down with the scientists, we're on the cusp of so many breakthroughs and what are we doing? we're doing nothing. we're doing -- not doing nothing, we're tweeting from

normandy from some actress or something. i don't know. it seems to me -- chris, i think you know me, i've never been more optimistic in my life about the possibilities of this country. >> why? we're so divided. we can't be together on anything. we can't get congress together to help kids on the border. >> the fact of the matter is, we're in a better position. our politics is broken, but the public is not broken. the point of the matter is, there's so many opportunities. we not only have the greatest military in the history of the world, we've led by the example of our power all these years. we're in a position where we have the capacity to do so much of the greatest research universities in the world. it's all right there. what bothers me is there's one big roadblock and i'm not being mellow dramatic, it's donald trump. what he's done when they try to

gain power, he's trying to divide us in every way, race, religion, ethnicity. that's the only way he can stay in power. it has to stop. if we can't bring it together, we're in real trouble. >> americans want us to be reunited. we were just at a rally here in iowa and everyone was saying we have to work together, we have to solve these problems. they're too big. they have to solve them together. >> one fight at a time. that's the general election. it seems the fundamental tension now is, is joe biden the right fit for this party at this time? they're coming at you not on policy, but the way you discuss policy, the phrases you use, that you are not in step with their lingo, let alone where they want to go. >> let me tell you, i think i'm more in step with the lingo than any of them. i was asked to go into 24

states, campaign for 69 candidates. i said we're going to win back the house of representatives, we beat republicans head on. we went to their neighborhoods and made the case against them. my dad would say half of it is showing up. the idea that we've decided that our system doesn't work anymore, which i'm hearing some of them saying, that we're going to pack the courts, we're going to fundamentally change the way -- i'm going to do what trump did. i'm going to do it by executive order. what are you talking about? this is the fourth of july, man. we're celebrating what a group of revolutionary folks did. they put down their life, liberty, scared honor, why? for a value set. if we give that up, we're in real trouble. >> it was interesting hearing somebody who wants to be president saying doing everything by executive power is wrong. now, with jill biden, if you noticed there, there is a

protectiveness. she's the spouse, that's going to be the way it is when you're seeing your significant other running. but she gets that her husband has no friends in this primary, at least while the nomination is up for grabs. and when it comes to that, she's ready to fight by his side. >> does it make you feel differently about where this could be headed? >> i think that they were looking at the past -- i mean, the one thing you cannot say about joe is that he's a racist. >> now, we also have the first comments from the bidens about their son hunter. they've been talking about his mental health struggles. what will they say about it and could it be something that becomes part of the campaign? next.

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campaign's negotiated, points to a stigma. that would never come ut if out said he had liuke chemoya. what do you want his mental health to mean? >> we've seen the struggle. we've seen the struggle and we know that most american families are dealing with some sort of struggle like we are. and i think they can relate to us as parents who are hopeful and are supportive of our son and we will continue to be supportive and i think that makes us more empathetic about helping other americans. >> he's going to beat this. this kid, i'm telling you, as you know, you knew beau, hunter has heart. he's fighting.

he's never given up. he's the most honorable person i know. and i read that article and all i could do is think of, my god, he gives me so much credit than i deserve as a dad. but it took enormous courage. i knew nothing about that article. except he told me he was having this long interview. everybody has to deal with these issues in a way that is consistent with who they are and what they are. this guy is the most generous, honorable man that i know. and i am confident, confident, he's going to make it. and, look, it's a -- the idea that we treat mental health and, quote, physical health as they're distinct, it's health. >> we have to put more money into mental health whether it's for our education system, whether it's for our veterans, whoever it's for, we have to -- we have to start to look at it,

talk about it and put more money into it. >> talking about it is huge. that's why i bring up hunter. you've been hearing about your son. you got in this race, you knew everything they could find about hunter was going to come back, business, we'll see what they do with him having a mental health struggle. but discussing it as something you can beat, something you can treat already that's a different dialogue than we're used to hearing. curing cancer, that would mean so much, getting people to accept that mental illness is the same as any other malady, that could be huge as well. >> it's gigantic, and it's doable, it is doable. the idea that somehow -- think of all the people out there, chris, who don't -- one of the things we should be debating in this campaign is health care. whether or not we have the adequate -- what's the best way to get health care? when barack -- what barack did, the affordable health care, we

thought about mental health -- >> your party now wants to get rid of the aca. >> that's why i'm opposed to any republican who wants to dismantle it. the idea you're going to come along and take the most significant thing that happened and it got done makes no sense to me. >> four out of the top five people are on the complete opposite side than you. >> and i understand that. that's about the future. what are we going to do? i believe they're totally sincere. but starting over would be i think a sin. >> they say you're either on in or half measures that don't work. >> let me tell you something, i noticed the measures of the affordable health care act work well.

none of them -- they are saying, if you're satisfied with your employer-based health care, you got to give it up. we gave an option. now things are changing because guess what's happened. you know, the thing that barack and i would talk about, god love him, he never took credit as he should have. it was like everything was dropping on his desk. i said we got to make the case that people know what you did. it wasn't until they started taking it away it was a consequence of what barack had done. if you notice in 18, we went out in all those campaigns, you're finding republicans, i want to get rid of pre-existing conditions coverage, i want to get rid of -- it's a different place. and the public has been educated in that i believe they've embraced it for you. >> one more question for you, if you don't mind. you're much more interesting. >> that i agree with. >> you mentioned senator harris,

the debate, i'll talk to the vp about that as well. but when you were listing the things, here are the things we're going to have to fight against in this, here they are, they may not think you have this, this, this, you did not imagine you would think -- did you imagine that one of the things that you would have to deal with early on is whether or not your husband's past is basically bigoted. >> they can say anything but -- >> the crime bill, working with people who were seen to be obviously extreme thinkers and bigots themselves, bussing, did you anticipate those and does it make you feel differently about where this could be headed? >> i think that they were looking at the past. the one thing you cannot say about joe is that he's a racist. he got into politics because of his commitment to civil rights and then to be elected with barack obama and someone is saying, you know, you're a racist, as soon as i heard -- >> they're saying you're not a

racist, but this all -- >> as soon as i heard those words, i thought, uh-oh, what's coming next. and i think the american people know joe biden. they know his values. they know what he stands for. and they didn't buy it. >> you don't think -- you took a hit in the polls and some -- >> but the polls are coming back up. the polls are coming back up. we just saw that today and i think the more people get to know joe, the higher the polls will get. >> chris -- >> thank you for your time. >> thank you. >> i thanked the former vp's wife because that was the end of the interview with her. and the vp and i went on and had an interview. there's a long way to go. and the point in campaigns is you don't know where you're going to get hit from. you don't know what it's going to mean. the question is, after this interview, is the former vp, joe biden, in a better position or

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so we just had another part of our exclusive interview with joe and jill biden. as we all know, it is early, but we did have our first dropout in the race today, congressman eric swalwell. he's done. did this change minds? create new problems? let's bring in our panel. after this, better or worse? >> i think he's better at communicating his message. the question of whether it's a winning message is a separate one. but he's making clear that he's got some differences with the other candidates, he's making clear that he wants this to be a values-based discussion, that he's not going to come with a blizzard of proposals and he's making clear that he's -- you know, without saying so, arguing

for a third obama biden term that he wants to go back to. even as he says elections are about the future, he's kind of saying, let's get back to where we were. if you liked where we were before 2016, i'm your man. i don't know if that's a particularly compelling argument. the polls will tell us the performance so far is telling us that people are looking for something a little bit different. but biden is making his case and i think he's got some reason to do it. >> you're not bringing up the bussing, the crime bill or anything like that. do you believe he's satisfied on those issues? >> he's going to have a problem with black voters. >> it's one of his highest demos, by the way. >> it is, but it was very high for hillary clinton in 2007 all the way up until iowa and it all switched, you know, right after that. so it's solid but it's not permanent and people are looking around and they're shopping and that's where i think -- that's why kamala harris took the shot that he did.

>> and, you know, that was a good execution of a premeditated plan. that's politics. and it was interesting to hear from jill biden's perspective, we thought she was a friend. >> no one is a friend. >> pelosi says everybody has plans. good point. pop reinvigorated the phase, you governor in pros. this is about the time for imagination. is biden competing to plan for plan or principle to principle. is he in step with where the party will end up? that's the question. >> he's certainly out of step with the far left of the party. there's no question about that. and the challenge often for democrats in these kind of elections is the primary base is further to the left than the general election primary voter and independents. it's always a hard line to walk if you really focused on the general election, no different

for biden than anybody else. what i found curious in the interview, they said don't look back, this is about the future. don't look back, but kind of look back, because, joe, me and barack, if i was him i would raise president obama constantly, but you can't have it both ways. >> or can you? >> i think the first thing that joe biden is trying to re-establish especially for young people that he has a consistency of values and decency throughout his career that might set him apart ifield. and there's truth to that. it's a singular record. he's not a racist. he's done terrific things as a public servant and then there are these new anomalous things that play bad with today's electorate, including the anita hill hearings, including the

apology that was necessary about -- >> the segregationist senators. >> he's more than a segregationist, he's an epitome of evil and hate that existed in this country in that era. >> do you think that it's that -- his ideas are tired? is he dated by his time? >> joe biden thinks out loud. i've known him for 40 years. >> yes, yes. >> and a lot of those thoughts are terrific. and some of those thoughts you want to say, keep them to yourself. i think that's what we've been seeing. but i think we got to come back to this is a divided democratic party. the soul of the democratic party is up for grabs and we don't know where the hell it is going to go. >> but you keep having these head to heads. you got to factor the soul versus the head. >> you got to win -- >> and the democrat -- >> thread this together for me.

all right. and i really don't get it. i really don't get it yet and seeing all the numbers and even the tabs underneath the polls, i still don't get it. new, new, new, new, new. medicare for all, nothing else will work. then head to head matchups, biden best against trump. you talk about where the party is, 80% says center left. i don't get it. if it's all new, new, new, left, left, left, then why in head to head does biden win? >> there is this gap. your brother talks about it quite a lot -- >> does he have an answer? we got to get him on the phone. >> the reality is, the shorthand is, twitter is not real life, right? there's this noise machine and we're all hooked into it and we all participate in it and we stir it up and it tends to skew left. you know, when you hear biden say things like we don't need to

change the format of the supreme court, that's an unveiled shot at buttigieg. it's his way of trying to sort of remind everybody -- the reality is, the performance both in the midterms, all of the polls tell you, it will play out -- i think we can be confident it will play out in the primary process as well as that. yes, this is not a far-left party. the democratic party is not a far-left party when it comes to voting. >> you got a very strong progressive wing that right now is -- >> the media is amplifying that part. >> think of this question in terms of joe biden, can any democrat who voted for the iraq war win the presidency? or win the nomination? i haven't seen a lot of talk about that. i think that that, for instance, play that with young voters,

play that against donald trump, that seems to me is the kind of thing -- forget the polls right now. the polls are a snapshot for a moment. there is a titanic struggle going on and we got to look at each of these issues and how they hit people in the gut, particularly in those few states that this election is going to be decided on and -- >> button it up for us. >> as a former operative, i'm most concerned about the biden campaign that, and i believe dr. biden, they were surprised by what happened with senator harris. they should have known bussing was going to be an achilles heel and after the comments about the segregationist senators, they should have been more prepared. i think they should have known that kamala had been bussed. but to not be prepared for that question, the staff has got to get their "a" game going. >> you've got rust, or that

you're not ready for this particular fight. that's an open question. but here's what i do suspect most, i don't think we have any idea what's going to decide the democratic nomination yet. by this time next year, we will have had an entirely different conversation about something that emerged that we didn't know that would matter that much, we'll see what that is and see it together. thank you very much. couldn't have better people on a night like this. one big story down. another one that you have to dig into. jeffrey epstein has appeared to beat his case, this is back in the early 2000s. the man who cut that deal with him is now the labor secretary. he's got supporters that are part of this administration. they say, that was a tough deal. it was an okay, fair deal. now there's a new crop of federal prosecutors that feel differently. epstein was just indicted what you need to know about how far this may go.

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jeffrey epstein, two things you got to know, made his money in the shadows, but had lots of powerful pals in the spotlight. he stands accused of using that money and pals to hide his crimes so the reach of what and who this case touches now may be dramatic. federal prosecutors in new york

said the defendant is a registered sex offender and a continuing danger to the community who faces devastating evidence supporting deeply serious charges. like what? according to the indictment unsealed today, between 2002 and 2005, epstein paid girls as young as 14 to have sex with him. he worked with employees and those around him to lure girls to his home. he paid his victims to recruit other girls. but a lot of that really, most of it was said back then. so what's new now? federal agents searched epstein's manhattan mansion, they found a vast trove of lewd photographs of young-looking girls. who knew about them back then? a lot of somebodies were around this man. our current president joked about epstein in 2002, it's about the same time former president bill clinton and britain's prince andrew were

flying all over the world with epstein on his private plane. while the clinton spokesperson says he knows nothing about the allegations, he's not alone. epstein's social circle is said to have include harvard professionals, scientists, actors, actresses, who's who. connections and money paid off in the past. most notably in 2008 when epstein was gift wrapped with the most lenient sentence for a serial sex offender in u.s. history. what was it? 18 months, 13 served. during those 13, six days a week, 12 hours a day at the office. all allowed. you've never heard anything like that. the man who signed off on that deal, he was a u.s. attorney, he's now the u.s. labor secretary in president trump's cabinet. what's changed? earlier this year, a federal

judge ruled that the department of justice violated the law by failing to confer with epstein's deal with the victims. a full accounting of that case will almost certainly be part of the scrutiny surrounding these new allegations including any new crimes. this time, it may be different because despite all the years of reporting, there's something rare going on here. your attention is on this case. it wasn't last time. now, my next guest tried to warn the world about epstein more than a decade ago. she says the man threatened her and was able to silence her, but no more. what happened then? what changed? vicky ward, next. award winning interface. award winning design.

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but it's not really something yoyou want to buy.. it's not sexy... oh delicious. or delicious... or fun. ♪ but since you need both car and home insurance, why not bundle them with esurance and save up to 10%. which you can spend on things you really want to buy, like ah well i don't know what you'd wanna buy cause i'm just a guy on your tv. esurance. it's surprisingly painless. look, we all suspect that money can matter when it comes to consequences in this society. and if so, jeffrey epstein could be exhibit a. how did someone with all that proof of real prurience get such light treatment. vicky ward says she knows the deal and has been onto this man since 2003. good to see you on "prime time" as always. >> thank you, chris. >> back then you say he tried to

intimidate you, was effective in doing so. how so? >> at the time very few people knew who jeffrey epstein was. he was this mysterious guy who lived in the biggest private residence in new york. no one knew how he made his money, he didn't go out, but he did have this very influential affluent circle of friends that you've mentioned. he had -- he caught our attention when i was at "vanity fair" because he flew bill clinton on his plane to africa. i was trying to find out the source of his money and i discovered he was not what he said he was. he was not a hedge fund guy, he was not a money manager for billionaires. he wasn't trading. what i did discover is that he had been mentored by a man who was at that time serving a 20-year jail sentence for master

minding the biggest ponzi scheme in american history pre bernie madoff. >> we never heard of an investigation of his money. >> no, because my story, when i was reporting, also i -- he was known for throwing parties to which lots of billionaires came, lots of academics, lawyers, important people, and there were always these young girls. the jeffrey epstein story has always been in plain sight. >> we're not talking about 20-somethings. young, teenage and below. >> absolutely. many at that time, you know, people would talk to me at the party, and often they didn't speak english. and there was always a sort of nod and a wink, we don't -- we don't ask what jeffrey's really doing with them. but two young women did talk to me on the record about their

experiences with jeffrey epstein. one of them had been 16 at the time she claimed that he alleged assaulted her. her sister has been a little bit older. their mother also went on the regard. their characters were vouched for by several people. jeffrey epstein would call me up all the time and ask how the story was going and what did i have on the girls? what did i have on the girls? and he would say to me, you know, if i don't like the way this story turns out, something bad is going to happen to you. something bad is going to happen to your unborn children. i was pregnant with twins. and then he would say, by the way, that's off the record and sort of laugh. as the story went through serious fact checks, serious legal vetting, he suddenly appeared in the magazine's editor's office, he and "vanity

fair's" editor had a private conversation after which the women were removed from the story. i was told at the time that jeffrey says he's very sensitive about the women. it should just run as a financial piece. there had been some negotiation, jeffrey epstein in return for taking the women out said that "vanity fair" could use photographs of him, including a picture of him in a bathing suit. >> what's the defense of the decision at the time? he didn't understand the true scope of the story? >> he said that he didn't think i had the reporting. well, i think the women -- the women were afraid who spoke to me and their mother and everyone around them felt that when they were cut from the story that this was proof that jeffrey -- they were no match for jeffrey epstein. he was too powerful. it's exactly what all jeffrey

epstein's victims have been saying all this time -- >> what do you think changed this time? as we were talking about the indictment today, it is a litany of all the things that i've heard before. the only difference is who will stand behind >> the culture has changed and importantly the light that the miami harold shed on the victims stories that were incredibly poignant and credible. back in 2008, alan told accost a. he was going to make mincemeat of the women. in the miami harold showed they were credible and the stories were awful. and what happened is congress reacted. the republican from nebraska should get a big shout out for teaming up with the democrats for saying wait a minute how did

this happen? they went back -- >> what was that in 2008? >> that's the point. >> who made the phone calls. it wasn't the trump administration. this was a long time ago. this was in clinton land. where did this happen? he was friends with clinton. then bush. then you had obama. there were a lot of different administrations that overlap. who made phone calls to whom to get epstein the deal? >> the one in 2008? accost a was asked about this. interestingly. during the transition. is epstein a problem during the confirmation hearing? and batted it awa saying no, no. i had one meeting and i was told that was above my pay grade. >> defenders come on show and say he did what he could. he wasn't as easy people thought. >> that's clearly not true.

first of all, as you have to give a shout out to the lawyer. from the era. bradly edwards who represented the victims. the second the plea deal was announced, bradly sued on behalf of the victims to unseal it. >> said this is a breech. it breaks the crime victims rights act. you can't strike a deal without telling the victim. so i think that this story has played in plain sight, chris, throughout all the administrations. what's being missing is the out rage. finally, congress has acted which is i'm sure why the fbi felt em boldened along with the interesting that the public corruption unit is involved, that suggests bribery possibly. somewhere. >> look, we'll keep an eye on it

now. it's good people are focussed on it. we'll benefit greatly from your experience back then. and see what new names emerge. that give new context. from the worst of people in the u.s. to talk about to the best. did you see the women lead us to greatness again? what a wonder that team is. let me ask you something, why aren't the dollars falling the way the confetti will to celebrate them? that's the closing argument. so he stepped on the dr. scholl's kiosk. it recommends our best custom fit orthotic to relieve foot, knee, or lower back pain. so you can move more. dr. scholl's. born to move.

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usa! usa! our women put us on top again. best in the world. with signature american strength and swagger. black, white, gay, straight. as one. kick ass squad. four championships makes them

the victor in half the women's world cups ever played. what else is proved we can come together when it matters. twitter had one voice. when we combine different faces from all the places we're often more than the rest of the world can muster. so cool for mine and all your daughters to see this and see themselves in the champions. the win highlights a challenge. we should use the moment to do something about it. >> equal pay! >> not usa. equal pay. 28 members of the team are sue claiming gender discrimination. members of the caucus sent a letter noting in part a woman player basal ri is 30 grand less than her male counter parts. google this you can complicate the analysis. it seems to hide the simple reality. look at it this way if the men's team had won it all last year

each player would have earned $1 million. each. the women get less than a fifth of it. they made it all the way again. check out the tv ratings. up 20%. days before this weekend's victory nike said the woman's home jersey is the top selling soccer jersey ever. no matter the gender. president trump is involved here too. he's been feuding with rapinoe. the latest is this. he has praise for them. good for him. no formal invite to the white house. here's the argument. this is great opportunity for the president and for the team. and for women. and the country. invite the team. they dominated the rest of the world. it would be the best application of the slogan america first. sure, rapinoe might take a pass. others may as well. so what. that's their choice. this is america. the team won on the biggest stage. the president should showcase them. call on u.s. soccer to pay them

equally. own the bully pulpit. you love it, mr. president. this is the time all of us want to hear what you say. it would be great thing for the president, the team. women. and the country. simple argument that's it. thanks for watching "cnn tonight." we have d. lemon right now. trouble already? i just got back from vacation. you're trying to cause trouble saying the president should invite them. you know what's going on. he's fighting with rapinoe. >> get over it. >> i'm not going to the white house. >> surrender. >> if she doesn't want to come she doesn't have to come. she scored a hell of a goal. say hey u.s. soccer you don't want to get on my bad side. pay them what they're worth. what a win for him. for everybody. >> oh, chris. so quaint. you're so positive. >> you are really something. you come