tv Fareed Zakaria GPS CNN July 14, 2019 7:00am-8:00am PDT
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this is "gps", the global public square. welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. i'm fareed zakaria. we'll start this show with growing tensions between iran and the west. tankers and gun boats, sanctions and economic misery. where is this all going? i'll talk to one of the deals
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top negotiators. an undiplomatic response from president trump after diplomatic cables are leaked. >> he has felt it necessary to leave his position. >> whatever happened to the special relationship between the united states and the united kingd kingdom? i will ask britain's former foreign secretary. also, american leaders have hailed israel as a beacon of democracy in the middle east. now, as an election fight heats up, some say it is a democracy on the brink. and we'll talk to thomas freedman who thinks the future of israel itself is on the line. but first, here's my take. the best illustration of the in co haeurpbs of the straoepblg towards iran came last week in a
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white house press release. it read, there is little doubt that even before the deal's existence, iran was violating its terms. the white house has not subsequently explained how a country can violate the terms of a deal before that deal existed. this is not the only example of in co haeurpbs. when donald trump announced last month that he called off military strikes against iran he said it was because he learned that an estimated 150 iranians would have died. instead, he further tightened economic sanctions against iran. the sanctions being levied against iran are having a massive and crippling effect on the country, says jeffrey sacks, who has studied such measures. he noted, sanctions like these are known to cause a significant rise in mortality. given the size of the population, around 81 million, this is sure to be far larger than 150 deaths.
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and keep in mind, the people who would have died in the military strikes likely would have been iranian soldiers. who who are now dying because of sanctions are newborn babies, mothers, the elderly, and sick. the trump administration has created a humanitarian crisis in iran andeeeo political crisis in the middle east with no strategy to resolve either. the iran pact forced iran to commit, that it would never develop nuclear weapons, ship away 98% of its enriched uranium, destroy reactors, and limit and inspections for 10 to 25 years. by withdrawing from the pact, the trump administration has allowed iran to start moving away from those limits. for example, tehran had agreed that it would only development 300 kilograms of loewen riched
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uranium until 2030. last week, iran exceeded that limit discussing its move by pointing out that the united states had itself abrogated the pact. it would have created a rift within the western a ins look. the europeans are in open revolt against washington's unilateralism and have established an alternative payment mechanism for the dollar in trade with iran. it has been reacting with incremental actions by its own military or by associated militias from yemen to the persian gulf. each of these produces a reaction from the united states or saudi arabia. in other words, trump has sharply ratcheted up regional tensions with no good plan to resolve them. the trump administration is hoping for capitulation from the iranians in which they will return to the negotiating table
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and accept a deal far more own russ than the one they signed in 2015. it's possible this will happen but far more likely that this regional cold war gets worse and worse. even if there were some kind of temporary iranian concessions born out of desperation, they will surely not last. wounded and bit erred powers always find a way to return with a vengeance. the trump administration seems to forget the iranian civilization has been a major player in the middle east for thousands of years. it has a strong and a history of resisting foreign domination. the path to stability in the middle east does not lie in strangling iran. that would only sow the seeds of resentment, creating a more unstable region and one in which the united states will find itself mired for decades. alas, this is the path upon
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which we find ourselves moving. for more go to cnn.com/fareed and read my column this week. and let's get started. let's keep with the nuclear deal with one of the top negotiators of that deal. he was brought into the talks because he was energy secretary at the time and a nuclear physicist, once head of m.i.t.'s physics department. secretary mow niece, pleasure to have you on. >> thank you, fareed. pleasure to be back. >> it seems to me that the iranians are engaging in kind of almost staged violations of the deal, not even violations. they're sort of abrogating in ways that they are signaling that are sort of -- they claim permitted under the deal. what is the goal of these small
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steps that they are taking? >> i think it's very much as you say. they certainly are not showing any evidence and do not want to project that they are going after a nuclear weapon. but what they are saying is that they are not getting the benefits of the agreement after the united states pulled out. and then really ramped up what i will call secondary sanctions dramatically, cut off their oil revenues. so they are making a signal very, very clearly. i would say especially to the europeans. that they need some solution to their -- to the economic benefits that they are being deprived of and they will continue to ratchet up without causing, in some sense, a panic that they are pursuing a nuclear weapon but making the case quite clearly that something needs to be done. i might add, i think it is very important to remember that the
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agreement, the jcpoa has built into it a minimum of one year for iran to assemble the material for a nuclear weapon no matter what they do. if they go full-out, even make no attempt to disguise it, it would still take them a year. so, again, we have to put these, so far, small violations in a technical sense in perspective without diminishing the fact that they are, in fact, violations of some of the key parameters of the agreement. >> the big deal would be if they were to get rid of the inspectors and the cameras. because the deal has this very intrusive inspection process. dozens of inspectors at every site from the uranium mines to the labs, to the production facilities. is there any sign that they're trying to dismantle that
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inspection regime? . >> so far, not. fareed, i think you have hit the nail on the head. frankly, it's not emphasized enough that, in my view, and i have said this many times, the most important part of the agreement is, in fact, the verification measures that are unique to iran, much tougher than any other country is subject to. first of all, that's an indication that we actually had a broad spectrum of major powers, the united states, the european countries, russia and china, all taking note of the fact that iran did have a structured nuclear weapons program through 2003. and, therefore, the agreement is not built upon trust. the agreement is built upon, as you say, very intrusive and very unique inspection measures. >> the trump administration seems to be hoping that all this pressure will bring the iranians back to the negotiating table and negotiate an even tougher deal.
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longer time periods, include ballistic missiles, et cetera. you spent a long time negotiating with the iranians. what is the likely prospect of that? >> i think right now it's not very likely, unless there is a much more creative proposal that provides benefits on both sides. and one reason of it is quite frankly, look, we all know the supreme leader obviously approved the agreement. but in doing so, he was consistently saying publicly, you know, you really can't trust the americans. well, the u.s. pulled out. and that certainly did nothing but reinforce his argument. it's going to be very, very hard i think for these two leaders to come back together with a serious negotiation. we hope that that can happen. but the conditions are certainly not ideal, to put it mildly. >> so the trump administration, as you say, has ratcheted up the
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pressure tremendously. the iranians are responding in various ways. does it worry you that this kind of escalation spiral without a clear exit strategy, without a clear ramp that people can take, could lead to miscalculations? >> absolutely. i am, frankly, terrified of that possibility. i do believe that ultimately both the iranian government and our administration and our military do not want a major military confrontation. but as you say, once you start getting into tit for tat and the tits and tats are a symmetric, a military strike versus cyber responses versus across the middle east by iranians proxies against american assets and american personnel, this has every possibility of going out
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of control. >> ernest moniz, always a pleasure to have you on. >> thank you, fareed. next on "gps", the future of america's special relationship with the united kingdom after trump's twitter tirade against the british ambassador and prime minister. what is the future of brexit? i will talk to the former british secretary, david miliband, when we come back. guess what? we took everything you love about the bloomin' onion and created a menu you've never seen before. ♪ bloom, there it is! ♪ bloom, there it is! this bloom-ified menu starts at $13.99. and try our everyday lunch combos, starting at $7.99.
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by some accounts, when franklin delano roosevelt walked in on winston churchill in the white house fresh out of the bath and stark naked, churchill uttered these words. the prime minister of great britain has nothing to conceal from the president of the united states. and that statement to many encapsulates washington's long special relationship with westminster. the friendship has been shaken in recent years. a new low in the aftermath of kim darroch's trump's cables being leaked. and he was frank about what he was seeing and hearing, calling the administration inept, among other things. trump responded angry and nastily. joining me is david miliband, the former united kingdom foreign secretary. you knew kim darroch. >> i still know him. he's alive and well, i'm pleased to say. >> what did you think of him when he dealt with him
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professionally? >> well, he was an outstanding ambassador. the president called him pompous and stupid. those are the last words you would use for kim darroch. he is a worldly man. he was very insightful about america having talked to him during his time here. he made a point of knowing the washington game but also getting out into the country. and so he wasn't completely surprised by the victory of president trump. he's a very astute watcher of the american scene. and i think we now have really unprecedented situation. the last time the united states government asked an ambassador to leave was in 1856. this is a -- you called it a i low point. and i think you're right. it has contempt on all sides. >> what's strike building this is everybody understands that ambassadors are required to be frank. it helps, you know, each country. for donald trump this seems to be, you know, it's personal. he feels the personal insult. do you think that, you know,
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this seems more so than with any previous administration, you dealt with a lot of countries, the degree to which trump personalizes everything. >> there's two worrying things about it. one, why does the president really care? doesn't he have more to worry about than the ambassador from a cable two years ago? but secondly, the sense that everything is a battle. actually, the kim darroch relationship with the administration is one that had breadth and depth. and i think that there's a brexit angle to this as well. britain has put itself outside the european community of nations, the european structure. that leaves britain peculiarly vulnerable in the global village. obviously i think president trump smells some weakness there. this is ironic because the great claim of the brexit was to throw off the european chains and
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march around the world doing trade deals. what i think is becoming clear is britain is more like a cork bobbing on the open sea if it goes ahead with brexit. the no-deal brexit. there is a bilateral angle to it. >> joris johnson, the thing that precipitated the resignation is the likely incoming prime minister refused to support him. all the others, the prime minister, the foreign minister. do you think that was a mistake? >> yes. it was utterly spineless on boris johnson's part. the idea that you can't defend your own ambassador and not even understand it is the most basic thing to do. if a country can't choose its ambassadors to a country, it really is in a low point. boris johnson may be known to some of your viewers. he was former mayor of london, a member of parliament. he is the next prime minister. all polls suggest he will win the conservative leadership
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contest. the irony is he's got there by hiding most of his views. it's hard to track him down. journalists haven't been able to pin him down. and what he's foisting everything on they should hold on to a no-deal brexit. they say after three years we're not going to get a deal. we will take the consequences. examine that really is dangerous. >> because it's so dangerous, a lot of people think there might be -- this actually opens up or widens the possibility of a second referendum or parliamentary election. i was in london a couple of weeks ago. lots of people still hope that in such a circumstance you would go back to london and -- >> i would certainly want to. i do campaign and i would campaign for a second -- in a second referendum. i campaigned for one. look, in a way it slightly embarrasses for me yet again to explain to your viewers why
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britain is in a terrible mess. but we are in a terrible mess. the wrecking ball of britain's constitution, never mind its economy represented by brexit, is really severe. where we are today is that there is a rising chance of a no-deal brexit. it would be lunacy, i think, to go ahead with it. nonetheless, that is the demand of the brexit years. although theresa may is dead, her deal is not dead. lots of people are talking about boris johnson applying some lipstick to this withdrawal deal and trying to sell it to brexit. but the second is not dead. three years on from the brexit referendum, it is clear that the promises of the brexiteers carry no water at all. the brexit they promised is not available. so people have to decide whether to go ahead with this breach by the european neighbors. >> we will follow you and hope to see you in london one of these days very soon.
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friedman's "new york times" column this week. so how is israel on the line? tom friedman joins me now. his most recent book is "thank you for being late." an optimist's guide to thriving in the age of accelerations. pleasure to have you on. >> great to be with you, from read. >> you argue this is not really just about our differences in policy, you know, attitudes even towards the palestinians or the west bank. this is about the future of israel's democracy if benjamin netanyahu gets re-elected. explain what you mean. >> well, fareed, two things are intersecting here. one is netanyahu was basically charged with fraud and breach of trust by israel's attorney general, an attorney general he nominated. and so that is a very serious charge. netanyahu could be going to jail. that's one track. on the other track, israel had
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an election in april. and before that election, a lot of israelis suspected that netanyahu, if he won, was going to build a coalition and the conditions of joining the coalition would be that the members agree that once they get their majority in the israeli parliament, they will pass a law that says a sitting prime minister cannot be indicted. and when the israeli supreme court would strike that law down as illegal, they would then pass another law that would say, the knesset is making the supreme court subservient to its will. it would in effect turn israel into a jewish about yana republic. the parties, the only parties who would go for that banana republic deal, is right wing and ultra orthodox parties. they had him over a barrel. he was going to go to jails.
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what their their demands? they want annexation of the west bank, basically. so in the end, netanyahu couldn't strike a deal because he lost many other allies who didn't want to go along with his banana republic solution. now we have another election september 17th. this time everyone knows now what netanyahu is up to. if israel were to elect netanyahu skperp to put together a government that basically traded some forth of creeping an exation in the west bank to save the prime minister from criminal charges, every friend of israel in the world, jewish and non-jewish would have to make an ethical choice. are you ready to support anis rail that has turned into a jewish banana republic? and i tell you, fareed, that will rip apart every synagogue, every jewish constitution, every
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friendly forum on any college campus around the world. something very big is at stake here. this election is not a rerun of the last election. this election is about the core issues of israel's identity as a jewish democracy. >> what you're describing in terms of the proposal is part of what would seem like a disturbing trend, the kind of lawyer describing this is the kind of thing erdogan has tried to do in turkey. this is the kind of thing victor or ban tried to do in hungary when he described not a liberal democracy but an illiberal democracy. >> exactly. and you wrote the book on that, fareed. it is extremely important, where you have these majority leaders, they get in power. what they do once in power is attack all the independent institutions that can curb their power. the courts, the media, and civil society institutions. and netanyahu is going down that
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in a textbook way. it is extremely dangerous. and unfortunately our administration,s the trump administration, has been willing to be a willing accomplice to this trend. >> what does the landscape now look like with the former prime minister jumping in? does that change things much? >> it changes in this sense, fareed. in the last election there was a conspiracy of silence between the main center left party called blue and white and netanyahu's party. netanyahu's party didn't want to talk about the creeping an exation in the west bank. blue and white didn't want to talk about it either. they wanted to just focus on bibi's corruption. enter ehud barack, now 77 years old. and who they are really afraid of, they are really peers. he has come in and put
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everything on the table as i just described. he said, no, we have to talk about -- he called his party the democracy party. people have to understand that israel's democracy is at stake here, and the threat we are talking about is every bit the equal of the threat of iranian nuclear weapon. i think one shouldn't focus on barach. help cat likewise the whole center left, particularly the labor party, merits, a more left party, and maybe a new barach party into a hard-core that will get every left-on-center vote and align to get left of center vote, enough to put together a coalition or even a national unity government where maybe part of la cued breaks off, joins with the center and the center left. because they say we do not want to be a jewish banana republic.
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something is so big at stake in this election, fareed. this is about the core identity of israel as a jewish democracy. >> tom friedman, good to have you on. >> thank you, fareed. you may drive electric, have solar panels on your house. it won't make much difference unless asia acts in climate change as well. a plan to make that happen when we come back. come on. this summer, add a new member to the family. hurry into the mercedes-benz summer event today for exceptional offers. lease the glc 300 suv for just $419 a month at the mercedes-benz summer event. going on now. but we're also a cancer fighting, hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born
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and now for what in the world segment. on president trump's recent visit to the united kingdom, piers morgan asked him about what is probably the most tkphraeurg problem of the century, the climate crisis. trump said falsely that the united states has among the cleanest climates in the world before denigrating other countries. >> china, india, russia, many other nations they have not very good air. not very good water in the sense of pollution and cleanliness. >> donald trump is point to go a real problem here. if we don't target asia. it emits more carbon dioxide than anywhere in the world. the reason is coal. three quarterers of india's electricity was generated from coal in 2016, according to the international energy agency. as the "washington post" notes,
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emissions could soar as countries continue to industrialize. many climate proposals, including the green new deal, focus on the west, ignoring this "inconvenient truth". now, poor countries won't be able to turn away from fossil fuels unless rich countries help them get access to cleaner, often more expensive forms of energy. leaders have known this for some time, but they have never figured out how to act on it. well, the harvard economistist ken row government offers the world carbon bank. there would be a lot of details to hammer out, but it could help poor countries wean themselves off fossil fuels by funding new technologies and green projects. it would be funded like the world bank, like he said, through bonds backed by rich countries. it could even be partially funded through a carbon tax on rich countries.
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world carbon bank would solve many problems. for one, climate financing is fragmented. there are dozens of funds set up across the world and within specific regions that pump money into everything from reforestation in honduras, to preparing homes for floods in bangladesh. but according to the world resources institute, the missions of these funds often overlap creating confusion for donors about where to invest and for countries on where to apply for it. and corruption and fraud plague climate finance. a large,er, more robust agency could provide more stringent oversight in funds. but the biggest argument is the scale of the climate crisis. current efforts are just too small. countries have pledged more than $10 billion to the u.n.'s green climate fund, which is the largest of its kind. and only half of that money has actually been allocated to projects. and in 2017, trump canceled $2 billion pledged by the u.s. saying such funds were, quote,
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raided from america's budget for the war on terrorism. with or without the u.s. pledge, the money available to funds like these pales in comparison to the need. according to rogoff, any significant start to an energy transition in poor countries could cost at least $1 trillion a year. these figures are daunting, but advanced nations should not look away. after all, 75 years ago this month, world leaders convened in new hampshire. up next, much of the world just got done celebrating pride month. almost 70 nations still criminalize same-sex relations. i will talk to the two lawyers who fought against such a law in india and won.
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life imprisonment. a year ago, my next guests were the chief lawyers arguing against that law in india's supreme court. weeks later, it was struck down. india's chief justice said in his statement, criminalizing car tphal intercourse is irrational, indefensible and manifestly arbitrary. section 377 had been on the books since 1861, a relic of the british-colonial era. several laws still exist. indeed, the international lesbian gay, bisexual, trans and intersex association says almost 70 countries have laws that punish same-sex relations. congratulations on your victory in india and welcome to the show. >> thank you. >> thank you for having us. >> to me what's even more striking is 2013, the same indian supreme court had upheld
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the laws. how did you get the same court to reverse itself? >> right. so i think 2013 was, as you can well imagine, extremely difficult. it's one thing to have an old colonial era law. but another thing to have that upheld by a court in contemporary times. but there was a point in the hearings, it was a month-long hearing, fareed. the senior judge looks at the law officer and says, well, do you know any homosexuals? and the law officer laughs, chuckles allowed and said, no, my lord, i'm not that modern. and for all of us i think it was very clear at that point that we were going to lose because the judge had no imagination of who is a gay indian. i think from there on we decided that we would never again let
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lgbtq indians be invisible starting in that courtroom. so when we went back to court in 2016, we took real-life lgbt indians. >> you chose the case and the litigants carefully, right? >> well, you know, in 2014 and 15, 16, when we were putting this case today, lgbt people were not exactly falling over themselves to say that to the supreme court that just upheld the law in 2013. so these were the people who agreed to come forward. it wasn't like we had a wide pool of people wanting to put their names to this. so i think it was an act of bravery and courage on their part because they agreed to do this on the back of a loss, on the back of a supreme court having just said that lgbt
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people could be prosecuted under 377. >> there was a classical dancer, right? >> yeah. that's who this case is named for is a classical indian dancer. i mean, he is as quintessentially indian as you can be. a sikh indian. >> the most classical music. >> the most classic al of all dancers. really speaks so much to who is year in india and what is being indian. >> kenya ruled upholding the laws that you just got overturned. >> that's right. >> what do you think? do you have hope that this movement is going to keep building? >> i do.
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and i think the indian supreme court judgment plays a big part of that. because many of these former colonies have these laws because of british cologne yammism. after the supreme court judgment came you have seen activists in sri lanka looking how to turn their own laws. singapore, they filed charges a year ago now. there is definitely this movement. and i think it makes a difference when you have a court that relies on its own constitution, looks to its own you' jurisprudence. they are not just looking to courts from the west. america, canada, the uk. but also looking to india. >> and i'd ask you about the human impact of this decision. but in a sense, it's personal.
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you didn't just argue the case today together, you're also a couple yourselves? . >> that's right. . >> that's right. the loss in 2013 was a loss as lawyers, a loss as citizens. it was a personal loss. it is not nice to be a criminal who has to go back to a court as a lawyer to argue other cases. it is a deeply personal loss. i think for year folks in all of those post colonial colonies, the government has to have a sense that these are not our laws. these were never our cultures and why have we not been more proactive in bringing forth reform and expanding freedom. surely, surely independents in decolonization must do that. . >> what did it mean to you
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permanently? . >> it was quite difficult. we had a court where we were both lawyers at the supreme court. and the court just said gay people were second-class citizens. >> we felt this law had to be overturned. >> how did you celebrate when it did get overturned? >> you know, one of the things that meant the most to me is that my parents came to court the day the judgment was pronounced. we met them the evening before. my mom had been wanting to come to court for a long time just to kind of see us in action. and then they were there. and it really means a lot. because it says history owes an apology to lgbt people and their families. >> i think one of the most meaningful things for me was we were all together after the judgment came out. >> well, congratulations. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. >> and we will be right back.
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stadium erupted in an unusual chant. >> equal pay, equal pay. >> crowds joined them in chanting equal pay on the streets of new york city. the crowds were expressing support for the members of the women's team who filed a lawsuit against the u.s. soccer federation. the suit alleges, among other things, that the federation discriminates by pwaeug female players less than male counterparts. it brings me to my question. according to the world economic pore up, which of the following countries has achieved gender parity? iceland, norway, sweden, or none of the above? stay tuned and we'll tell you the answer. >> my book of the week is "leadership in temperature lent times" by doris kearns goodwin. studying four of the greats, abraham lincoln, two roosevelts
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and lyndon johnson. she offers deep insights. the answer to my "gps" challenge this week is d. according to the world economic forum's 2018 global gender gap index, no countries have achieved gender pairity as they define it. it measures gender equality across four pillars, political empowerment, educational attainment and health and survival. the top seven countries in the rankings, iceland, norway, sweden, fibben land, nick raug ga, rwanda and new zealand have closed 80% of their gender gaps. with current trends it will take 202 years to achieve economic gender pairity around the world. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week. no matter what i wore, i worried someone might see
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♪ bloom, there it is! ♪ bloom, there it is! this bloom-ified menu starts at $13.99. and try our everyday lunch combos, starting at $7.99. hey, i'm brian stelter. this is a special edition of reliable sources, all about information warfare. i'm going to show you what i mean. an example right here, tucker carlson attacking ilhan omar, and omar calling him a racist fool. what does rupert murdoch think about all of this? >> plus, the triumph of journalism. the latest example of investigative journalism linked to hasty exits from trump world. we'll get into that. and later a story about working together to cover the climate is
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