we want to express incredible gratitude for all the law enforcement and the swift response that they took to minimize the loss of life by directly confronting the this is cnn breaking news. shooter, getting him to disarm himself and be able to arrest hello, i'm natalie allen in him. atlanta. i want the city of el paso to we continue to follow the breaking news from el paso, know and el paso police texas, the fbi is opening a department and everybody in this entire community know that the domestic terrorism investigation state of texas provides its full into saturday's mass shooting at a shopping center there. at least 20 people died. support for this community and another 26 have been injured. their efforts to rebuild. some we are told with life-threatening injuries. the 21-year-old suspected gunman for the country that i know has been paying a lot of attention surrendered at the scene and is to this, asking what they can in police custody. do, i ask that you keep el shoppers inside a walmart dove for cover as the shooter pasoans in your prayers. we know the power of prayer and unloaded a volley of rapid the power that you can have by

gunfire. using that prayer. for every mom and dad, for every son and daughter, [ gunfire ] we ask you put your arms around your family members tonight and give them a hug and let them know how much you love them. >> stay with cnn as we continue to bring you more information on >> bystanders quickly tried to assist the multiple victims. yet another mass shooting in the we want to warn you this next united states. video is very disturbing. >> it's tragic and i think we have to stay song for our city and i think in a situation like this, you ask yourselves how can i help? so the first thing we thought of, let's go to the school and [ speaking a foreign language ] see what we can do to be there. it's like it's a time where we all need to come together instead of being separate. every day, visionaries are creating the future. ♪ so, every day, we put our latest technology and unrivaled network to work. >> help.

help. ♪ help. the united states postal service makes more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country. ♪ because the future only happens with people who really know how to deliver it. >> we need cpr. we need cpr. >> terrified witnesses were still shaking as you can imagine as they described what they saw. >> we're in the freezer section and he heard the shots. at first we didn't think anything of it. kind of sounded like fireworks and started coming closer together and then he was like is that gunshots? i said, yes, people were running inside saying there was a shooter. we took off towards the back of the room where the stockroom was pushing people out of the way telling them to go and ran out towards the back and employees were telling us to go into the freight containers and we sat there for maybe 20 minutes and

told us to come out and they did because there was elderly and children and they were getting hot. >> there was a whole bunch of kids in there. they were out without their parents. i tried to pick up as many as a could. >> i heard yelling. there were cops with gunning summer's not the time saying get on your knees and for making bucket lists. that's when we went back in the bookers know summer is for booking it. room. we were scared to death. (chime, slam, chime) like booking a beachside resort >> texas is no stranger to mass and ordering two more tacos than you need to. check. killings. of the ten deadliest hootings in showing the deep end who's boss. check. the u.s. four have taken place in that state. starting a scooter gang with the fam. governor greg abbott spoke check. awesome. earlier about this latest tragedy. bookers know summer won't last forever. >> as large as the tragedy was, you're going to thank me. so be a booker at booking.com. 20 precious lives lost, six more the world's #1 choice for booking accommodations. injured. this was not going to be forgotten. >> police say the suspected gunman is from allen, texas. that is more authori600 miles a.

the el paso police chief says a document posted online shortly after the shooting appears to be a manifesto with what was described as a nexus to a potential hate crime. cnn's ed lavendera is in el paso, texas, he spoke earlier about the investigation and how other witnesses described the attack. >> reporter: law enforcement investigators are still on the scene. the entire parking lot and the scene around the shopping center is closed off as investigators do their work inside of that store piecing together all of the evidence and combing through that horrific scene. that is the work that continues. we also know that there is a great deal of anxiety and stress among many community members here as they still are trying to gather information about loved ones. we met the family earlier today of 86-year-old angie engelsby

inside the walmart. these children tell us they had spoken to their mother. one of the relative has spoken to their mother moments before a gunshot erupted and that the family has not heard from her since so this is now many hours after the shooting and they are still desperately trying to find her somewhere here in el paso but are fearing the worst at in the el paso shooting as this point so that kind of in similar attacks caring for capture the anxiety and the injure takes a toll on blood excruciating pain and people supplies. coming to terps with what they th thats's why el paso police put witnessed. out an urgent appeal for blood we spoke with one woman, hand se donors and the response was overwhelming. long lines stretched down the block outside one facility. was standing outside the doors volunteers showed up as can you of the waulmart waiting for her see to pass out pizza and nephew to come out of the store drinks. the governor said the community when she heard the gunshots and can take heart from this kind of reaction. a got a glimpse of the gunman >> as i was talking with members leaving the scene then what she saw next is something she will never forget. of the texas house of representatives behind me right >> i was waiting for him to come now earlier today, moments ago,

out but it was taking too long they pointed out to me as they then i heard the first one, showed to me what a video taking where -- what's going on? place in this community about but it was so loud. how people in this community are very loud. standing in lines around buildings to give blood to and then i just saw everybody dropping. that's when i just ran in there, provide water, to provide like trying to. support and as they pointed out, but then i saw him run this way. so i chased him. and i thought he got shot. el paso is defined not by the >> and who was hit? >> the baby. my nephew. catastrophe that struck this town, the way el paso is really the baby that some man carried defined is the way this that got shot. community comes together and the guy just gave him to the ambulance. i don't know. supports each other to bridge it was awful. the divide of this catastrophe. this happened today toward the >> reporter: natalie, miss row pathway of where el paso will be tomorrow. morrow was shaking as she >> local officials are now asking people to sign up and recounted this man covering a schedule their donations in the baby covered in blood and days ahead. handing this child off to a in the middle of the chaos paramedic there at the scene and at the shooting scene we heard racing away. those are the images of -- that from one woman desperately trying to find her mother. are ingrained in many of these

>> i got tired of waiting and witnesses and victims' mights as they grapple with the pain and waiting and waiting and i just want to know where my mom is. horror of what they experienced >> tell me what you've done to find her so far. today. >> ed lavendera. >> so far we stayed at mcarthur none of the victims so far have been identified. school and went to school there u.s. president trump is and then my niece took me to condemning the attack on twitter saying the shooting was not only pebble hills. tragic, it was an act of she wasn't there. the bus was empty. cowardice and added there are no we said -- i asked the reasons for excuses that will ever justify killing innocent i want to know where my mom is. people. those feelings were also shared by democrats hoping to replace where are the people in walmart? mr. trump in 2020. where did you put them all? where have they all gone? >> children should not be in i saw the buses. fear of going to a community festival or going to school or and my mom -- no buses came. i didn't find her. going with their parents i just want to find my mom. shopping on a saturday at least tell me where she is. afternoon. >> enough is enough is enough i want to know if she's dead or and it's been enough for the alive or still in walmart. past five years. i need to find her. this is well beyond anything this is the only way we're going to do it. that we should be tolerating. >> i think all over the world people are looking at the united >> okay. states and wondering what is >> the agony and the heartache. going on? time after time after time we're so many feeling this. this is the woman she's looking

seeing indescribable horrors. >> are we or are we not prepared for. her mother. to stand up to the corporate gun lobby and are we or are we not just before the shooting started, she spoke with her prepared to stand up to the evil family while she was standing in line at walmart. of white nationalism in this that was the last time people country? >> mayor pete buttigieg there heard from her. and he expanded on his comments police have not released a list of victims. me and the guys walked into this place. saying the u.s. is being attacked by white nationalist terrorism which he believes is inspiring murder and is abetted by weak gun laws in america. his rival in the race, beto o'rourke he can chosed though sentiments but the el paso native went a step further. he suggested president trump's rhetoric on minorities may have played a role in this attack. >> yes, we've had a rise in hate you woulda thought from the name crimes every single one of the it was gonna be packed with sailors. last three years during an so i immediately picked out the biggest guy in there. administration where you have a and i walked straight up to him. president who's called mexicans now he looks me square in the eye, and, i swear he says, "welcome to navy federal credit union." i ve a wonderful hybrid. slate blue. crème interior. raini rapists criminals.

he was so nice! he has tried to make us afraid navy federal credit union. of them. to some real effect and our members, are the mission. consequence attempting to ban we all use our phones differently. all muslims from this country i can manage the time they spend on their phone, the day he signed that executive order, the mosque in victoria, who they're texting with, all of that. it's a win for all of us. texas, was burned to the ground. (vo) the network more people rely on, gives you more. those chants we heard in like plans families can mix and match, greenville, north carolina, send her back, talking about her including the new just kids plan. that's verizon. fellow american citizens duly elected to represent their constituents in the congress who happen to be women of color, he is a racist and he stokes racism in this country and it does not just offend our sensibilities, it fundamentally changes the character of this country and it leads to violence and, again, there are still details that we are waiting on but i'm just following the lead that i've heard from the el paso police department where they say there are strong indications that this shooter wrote that manifesto and that this was inspired by his hatred of people here in this

community. >> now with our cnn national security analyst joining us from boston, juliet kayam. (door bell rings) it's ohey. this is amazing. with moderate to severe ulcerative colitis, all right. are you okay? juliette. even when i was there, let's talk about what we're learn interesting this shooter and this supposed manifesto. i never knew when my symptoms i actually loathe that worth would keep us apart. that this person posted talking so i talked to my doctor about humira. about his motives. what can you bleen from what i learned humira can help get, you're hearing about it? and keep uc under control >> from what we're hearing about when other medications haven't worked well enough. and it helps people achieve control that lasts. it and stated from our so you can experience few reporters, what we're reporting, or no symptoms. this was a document loaded onto humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. 4chan. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, a very -- essentially just a including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, violent cesspool of racial serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. animosity right before the before treatment, get tested for tb. killings began. and it was focused and i think it's important we say it. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, focused on anti-hispanic -- it or have flu-like symptoms or sores. was anti-hispanic. don't start humira if you have an infection. it was at a particular group of be there for you, and them.

ask your gastroenterologist about humira. people, hispanics, mexicans when you think about, here's a with humira, control is possible. murderer who traveled eight to nine hours by car to go to a you need some tlc on your eyelashes! border city to a walmart that is known to be a walmart that, you meet lash serum solution. conditions and cares for your lashes with lash caring complex. know, kacaters to the border see a denser, thicker-looking lash fringe in just 4 weeks. community. there are some mexican nationals who are victims so we don't have i would highly recommend it to anyone. to try too hard. with lash serum solution, 7 out of 10 women saw fewer lashes lost two plus two sometimes equals four which is this a violent during makeup removal. my husband has noticed a difference. i really love lash serum. white supremacist who got radicalized and we'll figure out over 10,000 women have tried it and love it. how to focus on mexicans and try new lash serum solution. from l'oreal paris. hispanics and took that out today so unfortunately it's now all too familiar in terms of counterterrorism and heard chris wray mention the rise of white supremacy is amplified and amplified on social media networks and know that the public discourse, the sort of

failure from the top to condemn white supremacy at this stage tears and prayers to help contributes to a sense that these men are somewhat heal the city of el paso. emboldened right now. i think that's why we're seeing 20 lives were lost there saturday. these -- honestly, we were more than two dozen others were together last weekend. we're seeing these every injured. people gathered at a church to weekend, right? that sort of is the big picture but we'll learn more about that honor those in the shooting and specific radicalization process. to heal. >> right. the vigil ended with a song to heal this community. and this shooter was just 21 and we are seeing younger white men carry out these mass shootings in the united states and he indicated he didn't even plan this out for more than a month. yet he carried through with it. he also talked about perhaps ♪ being shot by police but and this is austin, texas, a apparently from what we candlelight vigil for the victims. i'm natalie allen. understand, gave up. >> right and something about the i'll be back with another hour of news. heroism of it or maybe he wanted and george howell will be joining me after the break. to be captured so that he could tell his story. he did post something online. he does want this to be a public event but i think the youth factor is really, really

important that this is a generation that has been raised on social media platforms. they've been very slow to get a lot of this stuff, a lot of this hatred, a lot of this radicalization material offline and are quite good when it comes to isis materials but facebook every day, visionaries are creating the future. and twitter and others have been quite slow when it comes to ♪ white supremacy an white radical so, every day, we put our latest technology says and see them trying to do and unrivaled network to work. something in the last couple hours to get some of this stuff ♪ down. in terms of his age also this is the united states postal service makes more e-commerce deliveries to homes a generation of white men who are the first generation of men, than anyone else in the country. white men being raised when the ♪ united states birth rate is now because the future only happens with people who really know how to deliver it. majority nonwhite babies. this is the last generation of white men who are -- who were born as a majority. that is -- i say that because that's amplified in their literature which i unfortunately have to read.

the sense of displacement and find each other online and not condemned by the white house, by president trump. all of those pieces fit together. no one to blame but the murderer my copd medicine... himself. ...that's why i've got the power of 1 2 3 medicines with trelegy. we're see flag in the numbers the only fda-approved 3-in-1 copd treatment . the fbi is documents. ♪trelegy. ♪the power of 1-2-3. >> they so easily find a place ♪trelegy 1-2-3 trelegy. on the internet to fuel that with trelegy and the power of 1 2 3, hate. i'm breathing better. trelegy works 3 ways to... ...open airways,... ...keep them open... ...and reduce inflammation... they cheer when people do this. ...for 24 hours of better breathing. how hard is it for intelligence trelegy won't replace a to stay ahead of this? rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. >> it's really difficult for one trelegy is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure a lot is anonymous. something put something up like before taking it. do not take trelegy more than prescribed. i hate hispanic on 4chan. trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, there's not much you can do. if you don't put anything that pneumonia, and osteoporosis. is going to be sort of call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, specifically violent against a mouth or tongue swelling group of people or only put it ...problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur.

think your copd medicine is doing enough? up 20 minutes before that will maybe you should think again. be hard to take down. what are these social media ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy and the power of 1 2 3. platforms doing? they're giving these men a sense ♪trelegy 1-2-3 of community and, therefore, a sense that their hatred is sort save at trelegy.com of a majority opinion, right? this is something that almost everyone must absolutely believe. they live in this world of sort of, you know, limited media engagement, limited ideological engagement and they're just feeding off each other which amplifies it. look, 4chan, you can -- people with defend it if they want. it is a cesspool of violence but it is a platform that exists for that kind of language. when i get off air i'll probably get hit by a lot on twitter. this is it what they do and they -- this is something you can't just bring down. it is a platform where the sharing of ideas is occurring so that's the challenge right now, the extent to which these men no

♪trelegy 1-2-3 the mucma fest! of summer... longer feel alone even feel like they have a community that wants country music's biggest stars perform their hottest hits. them to act this way. >> right. very sick community, indeed. and the first time ever. lil nas x, billy ray cyrus and keith urban juliette, we always appreciate perform the hit "old town road." your insights this. is happening too often, isn't it? thank you. cma fest! our breaking news will sunday 87c on abc. continue right after this. and after the show (vo) the hamsters, run hopelessly in their cage. check out a special encore performance of brett young's song, "catch." available only on xfinity. just say "brett young" into your x1 voice remote. this is cnn breaking news. content on their endless quest, to nowhere. >> and we continue, following the breaking news this hour.

the mass shooting in el paso, but perhaps this year, a more exhilarating endeavor awaits. texas. i'm george haowell. >> i'm natalie allen. defy the laws of human nature,at the summer of audi sales event. 20 people were killed, 26 were get exceptional offers now. hurt, some with life-threatening injuries. the 21-year-old suspected gunman surrendered at the seen and is in police custody? but allstate actually helps you drive safely... >> the shooting started 10:30 with drivewise. it lets you know when you go too fast... local time, when walmart supercenter was packed with ...and brake too hard. shoppers. people inside the store hid, and with feedback to help you drive safer. giving you the power to actually lower your cost. tried to find cover. unfortunately, it can't do anything about that. as the gunman opened fire, round after round. and you hear it here. now that you know the truth... are you in good hands?

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he didn't say anything. he walked in and started shooting at everybody. we were hiding there for maybe ten minutes until everything was calm and we -- i started pushing people out of walmart and just telling them to get out. get out. the only thing i -- the first thing i heard was the gunshots and then when i turned around and to see what was going on, that's when i saw him and that's when i ran back with my mom and i told her let's go let's go, let's go and i started to help the senior citizen, help her get out and just getting people out of there, just letting them know we need to exit out. >> and that is just one eyewitness account of how this horror unfolded in el paso, texas, saturday. a gunman opening fire at a packed walmart killing at least 20 people. more than two dozen others were

injured. most are being treated at area hospitals. video from the scene shows the chaos including people running out of the store and one man hiding under a table as gunshots rang out. [ gunshots ] >> police arrived at the scene in about six minutes and took the suspect into custody. cnn has also learned the fbi has opened a domestic terrorism investigation. let's talk about that from san francisco now. cnn law enforcement contributor steve moore joining us. a retired supervisory special agent at the fbi. so let's talk about this investigation that's opening up and what are you hearing that indicates that this is domestic terrorism, steve?

>> well, natalie, any time they've got some kin manifesto, if this -- if this follows through and it is actually his manifesto, all you need is a political or a sociological reason to call it terrorism and this is classic domestic terrorism. so what happens now is you have, you know, multiple the jurisdictions, el paso and texas want to prosecute the murder. the fbi has jurisdiction as domestic terrorism. what they will usually do is find who has the stronger case and who has the best chance of a quick prosecution and the institution of a penalty. >> and i know you've said that for many years people that are motivated by hate have channels to come together but we are seeing more and more of these dark areas of the web that give

these young isolated and mostly white men a community and not only is it a community it's actually a community that is encouraging these acts. talk to that and how difficult that is to try to figure out what's going to happen and when before someone like this carries something like this out. >> well, it's really immensely difficult, natalie, because you're having to search through areas that don't even have, you know, google doesn't even get to them. they're in the dark web and in the same way that pornography just exploded with the web, you're going to have the same thing for violence, you're going to have every single vice that mankind has seems to have been amplified with the internet and that's part of our problem as a society that we didn't have. i mean, look, 50 years ago, you

know, not trying to get into the gun debate but 50 years ago everybody had access to guns, not that many people are going out and doing mat shootings. mass shootings seems to be something that is fomenting possibly through internet but certainly has become the thing with people who are this mentally ill. >> what else, though, can be done, because if you look at the map of countries around the world the united states is the country that seems to have that mental illness and such easy access to guns, steve, and it's almost like we were doing this just one week ago, the same thing. how do you take it back once this becomes an epidemic in the united states? >> well, it can't be a single prong attack. if -- i mean, you have to go

after the easy access by these ill people to get weapons. that's just -- that in itself is a definition of insanity, letting insane people have high-powered military weapons. so you have to hit it from that point. you also have to hit it from the mental health point and have to look's places where they are meeting on the internet and deciding as a society where we draw the line and it's a very important dangerous thing that we have to do to determine where free speech stops and starts and whether we have to move that line but certainly we have to hit this from about ten different directions and right now i don't think we're hitting it from any except let's all stop this. >> and this shooter apparently began his manifesto by saying this is the day i'm likely going to die but ended up giving

himself up so we will probably be hearing more about who this person is and what was the motivation. all right, steve, we'll have to leave it there. we always appreciate your contribution. thank you. and we'll be right back. and it really shows. with all that usaa offers why go with anybody else? we know their rates are good, we know that they're always going to take care of us. it was an instant savings and i should have changed a long time ago. it was funny because when we would call another insurance company, hey would say "oh we can't beat usaa" we're the webber family. we're the tenney's we're the hayles, and we're usaa members for life. ♪ get your usaa auto insurance quote today.

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shock and heartache in el paso, texas. vigils and prayer services are being held for the victims of saturday's mass shooting at a

shopping center. at least 20 people are confirmed dead. more than two dozen others were injured. the suspected gunman, a 21-year-old white male, surrendered and is in custody. police say it may have been a hate crime and the fbi has opened a domestic terrorism investigation. one witness says the shooter appeared to be on a mission. >> he's going for blood. he's going for death. that's his favorite thick right now. he wants that blood lust. he wants to fulfill so after he seeing people start running you can hear the different firing. he starts pop, pop, pop, he's trigger finger. that's what he we heard. heard run, shooter. after we got close to the back we didn't hear much of it because i'm going, i'm going, i'm going. >> so many people luckily ran out the back of the store. there was, of course, an

immediate need for blood for the victims and donors quickly lined up to help. one of them spoke earlier with cnn's wolf blitzer. >> it's somber. you hear some sniffling earlier as the updates were coming across the tv we have here in the waiting room. the line just continues and continues to grow. at this time the blood center is no longer taking donations for today. they are at maximum capacity however everyone in line, there's easily 75 to 100 people in linary are aware all they're doing is making appointments for tomorrow or monday and willing to wait to get to the front to make an appointment. i believe el paso, we're 100 or something today, waste supposed to be in the 100s. >> you're doing a really, really life-saving work. what motivated you, frances? >> you know, i'm b positive is my blood type and i try to be

positive throughout my life and if there's ever something i can help with, it's easy to make a dollar but it's harder to make a difference so i try to get out there and do whatever i can to help. >> when you speak to others waiting in line what are they saying to you? >> how could it happen here? you know, it's crazy. it's walmart. you know, even though el paso is big, it's still a small city. everybody knows everybody. and, you know, immediately when everything happened this morning, my son called me. he was at work and then from there it just -- the group text just started with everybody checking in, everybody from my work family to my extended family in louisiana, extended family in california and of course the local family. everybody checking in to make sure everybody was safe. >> victims' names have not been released to the public. many people, of course, still unaccounted for after the mass shooting. earlier our alex marquardt spoke

with the mayor of el paso. >> the governor and i just visited with the families waiting on information over at one of the schools here in el paso. it's >> it's extremely tough and extremely heartbreaking. what about the investigation. what is the governor telling you about the suspect? we understand he is a 21-year-old man who drove all the way from allen, texas. what more do we know about the investigation into him and into his motive? >> well, there isn't much to update since we had the press conference. we talked about this? i should say gentleman, this murderer who came from outside of el paso and as i've said before, no one in el paso would have ever done something like this. this is not what we're about as a community. the investigations are still going through and identifying the bodies and they're going

through their normal forensic work and then the families will be notified but nothing new is happening yet. we're here at the scene as it stands now. >> was the shooter, do you know, was he known at all to authorities? >> i don't know that. i do not know that. he came from out -- i think allen, texas, is i think they said is where he came from but my point is that just a real tragedy. >> can you describe the scene before the shooting? what would have been happening at a walmart in el paso, texas, on a saturday morning in early august? >> a lot of shoppers. everybody getting ready for back to school. normal routines. just a normal saturday for people and yet this tragedy struck. >> you and others have talked about how tight knit this

community is. what has been the reaction since this horrific massacre happened now just over nine hours ago? >> well, it's been reported. we've had significant blood donors this. is a very generous community. it is a community that goes back 350 years and people just don't understand. we have -- we are a close-knit -- we are a large and close-knit, the largest community of our type on the u.s./mexico border. there is nothing in north america that can equate with what we have here with el paso juarez. this is totally unexpected and as i said probably never would have occurred within el paso. >> you must be heartened to see those long lines of donors, of blood donors coming out to donate blood. there have been calls to -- for people to sign up online. what can people do to help the community right now? >> well, we've set up the -- the

health foundation set up a website for donations for victims and their families and the other -- what we're telling other people, continue to donate blood. that's what we need right now. >> i want to bring in john matthews, a former dallas police officer and author of "mass shootings, six steps to survival." mr. matthews, thank you for being with us. >> glad go be here. >> i want to first get your reaction to this shooting that happened in el paso and what we are learning about the shooter and the location at a walmart in el paso, apparently he started in the parking lot. what's your reaction? >> well, again, horrified at what happened. our hearts go out to the folks in el paso here in dallas, you know, we experienced a mass shooting and i can tell you every time one occurs we relive that event and this is something that is going to stick with that community for a long time. one of the things that i'm encouraged about today,

listening to witnesses, visiting with people out there on the scene is how proactive so many different people were. they had done an active shooter drill and employees at the mall had practiced what to do in such a situation and it was so encouraging that someone that goes around and works with folks all over the country on this on how to stay alive that these folks took it upon themselves. they were proactive. they brought people inside and locked their doors and sheltered in place. they loaned them their cell phone in order for them to call loved ones so i was very, very encouraged and i can tell you having rao researched this for several decades, that saved lives right there. any time we can get potential victims out of harm's way, we're

saving lives. >> and, of course, the political discussion about what's going on in this country, that's for another day but the sad thing about it is that you travel the country helping people prepare for the event they are in just what happened in el paso that suddenly they realize there's a shooter amongst them. i did hear a young woman who was saying that she pushed 40 people out of an exit but couldn't help an elderly woman and felt horrible about that but also heard another account of a child who came into a store in the mall and said there's an active shooter and people responded passively. in some respects isn't it just impossible for some people to grasp what is going on at the moment? >> well, that's what we've got to do through education, through training, there outreach to the average citizen, the average person in public out there to let them know you're seeing this on television. you're following it in the news. you know, mass shootings and

active shooter events are a part of society. you have to understand that, you don't have to like it but you have to understand it and be aware of it. and so some people did take it seriously. they heard the first shots. i know that we spoke with one woman who said i heard the shots, i recognized it wasn't normal. i had my 1-year-old baby in the car and i sped away. whereas others still weren't sure what was going on or all of us honestly want to say we live in a safe community. we live in a safe environment. it'll never happen here. we need to raise our level of awareness just so people understand it can happen here and if it does, you've got to be able to respond and not just dismiss it. >> it used to be a mass shooting a day in the united states but it's gone beyond that now. what is the main thing that you tell people if, say, they were caught in a situation like this and what they need to do as far as getting away or we saw some video of people hiding.

they couldn't get out. so what are they to do? >> that's right. you can't always get out of this situation so what we did is we went back and looked at every single mass shooting since 1980 till today and developed a research-based model on what were the effective actions that people took in tactics that they made that allowed them to survive. we called the model escape and the first thing you try to do is exit. any possibility of getting away from the shooter or getting away from the scene, exit as fast and far as you can and stay away. don't go back. i know you have an urge especially if you have friends and relatives to go back and save them but get away as fast as you can. if you can't get away and some people just weren't in a position to get away, then we want to you seek cover. cover is anything that's going to protect you from bullets.

today people hid in cars. they hid behind cars. they hid behind cement pillars, all great things to do because bullets aren't going to be able to penetrate it and get to you. if you can't find cover, find concealment. something to hide you and several of the folks today said, yes, we hid in a storeroom. we hid in a shop. you know, we hid behind a closed rack. even if it's not going to stop bullets if that shooter can't see you you probably won't become a victim. assess the situation. if you have to move, get low to the ground, run in quick bursts. the last step, engage only as the last possible resort because most of the time engaging the shooter, someone that is bent on killing by an average unarmed citizen won't turn out well for the citizen so, you know, exit as soon as you can, seek cover, find concealment. those are the best things to do.

>> thank you so much, john matthew. thanks for talking with us. >> thank you very much. texas governor greg abbott spoke earlier about this tragedy. here he is. >> 20 innocent people from el paso have lost their lives and more than two dozen more are injured. we, as a state, unite in support of these victims and their family members. we want to do all we can to help them, to assist them. we pray that god can be with