welcome. it is 8:00 p.m. on the west coast. 11:00 in washington, d.c., this is anderson cooper 360. the first day in the books ends with president trump personally tied to alleged efforts to squeeze ukraine for help against political rival joe biden. it came as a surprise. bill taylor the top diplomat telling lawmakers about an overheard phone call he did not know about when he last spoke with them behind closed doors. on the one end is gordon sondland, on the other end, the president of the united states. ambassador taylor says it was the man who now says he hardly knows who sondland is, president

trum trump. >> the member of my staff could hear president trump on the phone asking ambassador sondland about the investigations. ambassador sondland told president trump the ukrainians were ready to move forward. following the call with president trump, the member of my staff asked ambassador sondland what president trump thought about ukraine. ambassador sondland responded that president trump cares more about the investigations of biden, which guiliani was pressing for. >> well, the staff is david holmes, who is now scheduled to speak friday to the committee off camera. jim is the president's tv lawyer, rudy guiliani certainly came up a lot today. >> rudy guiliani. >> rudy guiliani. >> rudy guiliani. >> guiliani. >> guiliani. >> guiliani. >> guiliani. >> rudy guiliani. >> and by the way, have you ever met rudy guiliani? >> guilianiing as you know is on record about his work if you crane on behalf of the president, senior state official george kent who testified alongside ambassador taylor today was asked about that. >> was it normal to have a

person who is a private citizen take an active role in foreign diplomacy? >> i did not find his particular engage. normal, no. >> mr. kent was also asked about the substance, if any, of the biden wong rongdoing. >> mr. kent are you familiar as you stated in your opening statements about these allegations related to vice president biden? >> i am. >> to your knowledge, is there any factual basis to support those allegations? >> none, whatsoever. >> the house republicans were given equal time devoted time to four points, congressman jim jordan who took the lead in a good deal of questioning. >> ambassador, you weren't on the call, were you? you didn't listen in on president trump's call and president zelensky's call? >> i never did. >> you never met the president? >> that's correct. >> you had two meetings. >> two of those i never heard of as far as i know. there was no reason for it to

come up. >> you never made an announcement. this is what i can't believe and you're their star witness, you're their first witness? you're the guy based on this, based on, i mean, i've seen church prayer chains that are easier to understand than this. >> okay. >> that i don't consider myself a star witness for anything. >> they do. >> i don't. i'm just responding -- i'm responding to your questions. >> you may redirect the witness. >> i think i was clear i'm not here to take one side or another or advocate any outcomes. let me restate that. >> it was a remarkable day. of course, it is only the beginning of marie yovanovitch the ousted ambassador to ukraine will testify on friday. george kent was asked about her today as well. >> did you support her extension? >> i asked her to extend it until the end of this year to get through the elections psych until ukraine and under secretary hale in march asked her to stay until 2020. >> some in ukraine probably

disliked her efforts to root out corruption. is that correct? >> as i mentioned in my testimony, you can't promote principled corruption action without pissing off corrupt people. >> let's start it all off with our 11:00 distinguished panel and legal experts. i got to say, you all are my favorites. are you the best. paul, who do you think had the best day? >> well, the democrats are trying to build a case and my law professor used to say a brick is not a wall. an architect is not a case. they had a lot of new information, we have hearsay allegedly a first person witness, who can put the president in the position of personally ordering up an investigation of his political rivals. >> that could be damming? >> that's ambassador sondland. >> that's what ambassador sondland was on the phone with the president and was overheard and the president was overheard by a third party. let's see if we get to that.

having been through an impeachment defense. the defense was non-existent. no one ever said, he's innocent. never. i don't think they believe -- i don't want to go to their motive. they never said he was innocent. they attacked the process, joe biden's kids, all manner of things, but they never said he doesn't do it so they're left with he did it but it's not impeachable. bribery is in the constitution as an impeachable offense. >> none of these people had a face-to-face with the president. >> but the people who did they won't let testify. >> that's also true. >> that is a completely speechless argument. mick mulvaney in addition to bolton. mulvaney is the acting chief of staff and the budget director. the order went to the budget department to hold up this money. we have a right to know. they won't let him testify. >> i want to push back a little on the defense.

i thought they made two key points today, ratcliffe from texas made a couple points in questioning. number one, asked the witnesses, due any reason to doubt president zelensky's words that he said publicly that he didn't feel pressured on the call? and he said i have no reason to doubt that. then he asked both witnesses, he said, this is an impeachment hearing. are you both here to testify. did you hear anything? do you know anything that constitutes an impeachable defense? and either of them would answer yes. . >> no, first of all. >> they didn't answer, that's not their job. one of the guys said that. >> look, the purpose of this thing is not to get impeachment in the house. the purpose is to move public opinion to convince the senate to do something. >> they did not ask that, they clearly said we are not here to be involved in the political. >> he was supposed to get on base. >> the strategy of the democrats today was to begin as paul said

to layout the case. they moved from the quid pro quo language, thank god, because it's so confusing, to an argument that president trump was trying to bribe a foreign power to benefit himself personally. >> that alone was a good move on the communications and messaging front for the democrats. i will say this, scott, we know from just following and watching ukraine that president zelensky, one, a weak and new president. he's a new beat to politics. he was a comedienne a few months before he took power. he's somebody who had to deliver for the people in ukraine. there's no scenario where someone like that is going to say i felt pressured, because that would make him fael weak. we all know the context of that. so i don't think that was an important development. >> i think it was important, actually, that they wouldn't answer that question, scott. because they had answered that question. the republicans would be saying, ah, see, they're never trumpers, they're a part of the deep state. they're here to get the president impeached. instead they said, you know

what, this is not our job. it's as if you transplanted them from another era in another time when diplomats were diplomats and were not political. >> i think you will actually find more people like them all over the foreign service. >> that's right. >> it's just they have been branded otherwise. >> you don't see them. >> i want to play a part of the conversation jim jordan said and talk about it with you. >> now there is one witness, one witness that they won't bring in front of us. they won't bring in front of the american people. >> that itself the guy who started it all. the whistleblower. nope. 435 members of congress, only one gets to know who that person is. only one member of congress has the staff that gets to talk to that person. the ret of us don't. only chairman schiff knows who the whistleblower is. we don't. >> i should point out the whistleblower's attorney is pushing back in tweets tonight sake, quote, the whistleblower quote never met with chairman schiff. he did not receive assistance

from congress or congressional staffer in drafting the complaint and taking this a step further, no one in congress staff or anyone else ever saw the complaint until it was released to congress by the executive branch. at this point, though, obviously, the republicans are focus odden the whistleblower. the president is focused on the whistleblower n. reality, what does the whistleblower matter given that this thing has moved so far beyond what the whistleblower had initially said, all of which has pretty much been verified by subsequent witnesses? >> so, on the factual matter, the whistleblower and that person's identity doesn't matter anymore. the whistle blower followed the law, made the report to the intelligence community, inspector general. >> that process took place. the white house tried to hold it up. it ended up coming to congress anyway. the president had to release the transcript of the calm. the whistleblower's identity doesn't matter anymore because the other witnesses that have been called, have testified both in closed session and now in

open session under oath have attested to all of the facts that were in the original whistleblower complaint. but let's not ignore what jim jordan is doing here. because it's despicable. what he's doing is he is part of this effort to try to put pressure on the whistle blower, dissuade future whistleblowers, i remember a time when republicans in congress and the intelligence committees protected whistle blowers and were concerned about that law being followed and that law being enacted in a way that would protect people in the intelligence community and what they're doing and what jim jordan is doing is trying to destroy that entire system that has been built up over years to protect -- >> it's purely a political calculation of destroy the whistleblower, say she a deep state actor, who is a democrat who hates trump, and, therefore, this whole thing was borne in a witch's brew of a democratic cabal. >> here's the thing, getting

back to why you don't need the whistleblower to testify. use common sense if it were another criminal or even civil case. somebody comes forward to the police and says i know of the murder, i know the assault. that's the last obligation. thereafter, the police can investigate it. you can bring people to trial. you don't need that person to testify. so number one, there's that point. number two, it's profoundly dangerous what they're doing here. this is why his testimony, pardon me, his questioning today, jim jordan's questioning is why there is a statute protecting federal whistle blowers. what he's trying to do is out that person, get that person in trouble and in physical danger. we know it can happen. it's already happened. >> and cabal paul says the senate. there is likely the senate. the senate is full of republicans and democrats that crafted that lawsuit. construct grassley, one of the most conservative republicans in

the senate and strongest of -- jim jordan can grandstand, they will screw up their trial in the senate. it's really stupid. >> one thing about the testimony altogether today that i took away, all these people will come and talk. it seems this thing will come down to sondland. he's the one they talked to that talked to the president. >> so did mulvaney and bolton, why aren't we hearing from them in. >> what kind of a dummy gets a phone call from the president of the united states and puts it on a speaker phone so everybody can hear it if that's what happened? you could hear it? i'm saying, step into the hallway. it makes me want to -- >> are they talking on a secure device? >> a, it makes me wonder, what was this guy doing? b, what is the white house going to say about this guy next week? he's already changed his testimony once. when is it coming? >> they're going to like cement him in the pool.

>> one of the committee members makes it through the first day of testimony. you will hear from democratic congressman jimmy raskin, how a man who did not see a single minute of testimony is reacting. >> that would be, of course, the president and more when we continue. there's just something different to a disney movie. (vo) verizon knows you love all things disney. i think we've watched every single movie at least twice. four times. 100 times. (vo) that's why your unlimited plan now comes with disney+ on us for a year. because the network more people rely on gives you more.

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. in addition to his surprise testimony which revealed a new witness who will be talking to the committee on friday, ambassador bill taylor was asked to underscore key elements to the committee. one item was his complaint and text messages including a rare first person diplomatic cable. he sent to secretary of state mike pompeo about the unorthodoxed arrangement he saw taking shape between ukraine and washington. >> you described in your text message exchanges that engaging in a scheme like this is quote crazy. can we also agree that it's just

wrong? >> yes. >> why is it wrong? >> again our holding up of security systems that would go to a country that is fighting aggression from russia for no good policy reason, no good substantive reason, no good national security reason is wrong. >> again, he covered much the same ground in testimony behind closed doors. now the question tonight going forward, does saying it on camera move the needle at all? i talked with jimmy raskin just before air time. >> do you think democrats accomplished what they wanted to or needed to in. >> yes. look, we needed to resituate this in the global context that the events took place in. what ambassador taylor and

george kent showed was, look, there is a struggle going on, on planet earth right now betwee the dictators and the despots and the auto kratz and the kleptokrats on one side and liberal democracies and everyone knows donald trump favors the people on the side of the dem -- despots and the tyrants, but in this case, he went beyond that, he actually undermined and tried to sabotage one of the struggling liberal democracy on earth, ukraine. it's been u.s. foreign policy to try to help ukraine, because russia is occupying part of their country are, crimea invaded their country. there are active military hostilities. congress voted $391 million to support the struggling democracy in ukraine. there is a new president who is a reformer who is trying to attack corruption and donald trump and rudy guiliani and rosenkrantz and gildan stern, the whole team of corrupt

operatives they have over there tried to essentially extract from the ukrainian government political favors as the cost of getting the money we voted for. >> one of the things republicans have been pushing back on is all the people testifying thus far today, if they didn't have a face-to-face with the president, in which he, you know, it's secondhand, they say. >> look at how convenient that is. they spend the last several weeks trying to do everything they can to pull the wool over america's eyes to stonewall on witnesses, to deny us the people who actually have the first-hand accounts, because they don't want them coming forward to tell the truth. then they complain that there are not enough people who spoke directly to the president. that's fear fault there are not enough people who spoke directly to the president. in any event, we have overwhelming evidence from all of these other witnesses about exactly what happens taking place. it was a shakedown operation, engineered by the president and

guiliani to try to get this political dirt that they wanted on the bidens. >> ambassador taylor testified to something today that he said he hadn't previously known when he testified behind closed doors, which was that an aid told him that the aid was having dinner with sondland, sondland had a phone call with president trump. >> yes. >> and then he characterized what the then sondland characterized the president's thoughts about ukraine. to you, was that incredibly important? >> it was very important. it's another piece of evidence, of course, our friends across the aisle will try to explain it away. it was another very important piece of evidence that the president was the cap tape of the ship. look, america knows donald trump well enough at this point to understand he was the one who was pushing the whole operation. i mean, that's how he operates. it's all about him. and it's about his obsession and what he's pushing and he was pushing this. they bragged about that, this numerous times. it's not exactly an agatha christi mystery.

>> if you are making the the logical argument, i don't quite understand it about the republicans, if you say the president doesn't know anything about this, didn't have anything to do with this, then you are arguing rudy guiliani and parry of all people and sondland are wandering around doing their own foreign policy and stuff. >> that can't be right. democrats can wait for this to go to courts to get bolton to testify or mulvaney. there are some that say that in an ideal world you would want someone like a bolton or mulvaney who obvious had a face-to-face with the president on this. >> in an ideal rule under the rule of law, everybody would give the sovereign, which is the united states their honest, truthful testimony. that's the way our system is supposed to work under the rule of law. it's scandalous and shameful you got people out there with a subpoena from the united states congress and they say, gee, i'm not sure if i should comply with the subpoena or do what the president is telling me to do.

i think i'll go to court to work it out. >> congressman raskin, thank you. >> thank you for having me. president trump reacting to the witness testimony he didn't see and definitely did tweet and retweet a lot about. where we all want more energy. but with less carbon footprint. can we have both? at bp, we're working every day to make energy that's cleaner and better. and we see possibilities everywhere. to make energy that's cleaner and better. 25 cent boneless wings at applebee's. ♪ born to be wild... born to be wild...♪ get 'em while they're hot. a former army medic, made of the we maflexibility to handle members like kate.

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and if someone trys we'll let you know. xfi advanced security. if it's connected, it's protected. call, click, or visit a store today. . with the president of turkey, president trump disavowed the entirety of today's hearings. he said he didn't watch it but tweeted and retweeted about it. he zansdz himself the report of a new witness who says he overheard a phone call with gordon sondland to discuss investigation when it came to ukraine and corruption of the

bidens and crowd strike, et cetera. here's what the president said. >> i know nothing about that. the first time i've heard it. the one thing i've seen that sondland said he did speak to me for a brief moment and i said no quid pro quo under any circumstance and that's true. the other i've never heard this. in any event, it's more second-hand information. but i've never heard it. >> do you recall the conversation? >> i don't recall, no, not at all. not even a little bit. >> and jeremy dimon joins me with the latest. the president says he didn't watch it. do you know that's true? clearly, he's a man that likes a television set. >> well, anderson, i spoke to a lot of officials. they say he was in meetings, busy, preparing for the turkish president's busy and busy in the meetings with the turkish president. they say he was not glued to the television in the way he had, of

course in previous testimonies, when other former aides of his were making allegations about his conduct. the president claimed he did not watch a single minute of this which is a little harder to believe, especially given he has a television in the dining room outside the oval office he often checks in on during the day, his account, whether it was his staff was tweeting or retweeting more than a dozen times. the president was briefed at the end of today and his aides insisted to him today was a today day of public testimony. one thing is clear white house officials are trying to project a sense of calm, trying to insist there was nothing damage of course in the testimony today. >> is it known the white house was aware of this alleged conversation between sondland and the president before taylor testified today? >> we heard from white house officials who said it was a revelation and their colleagues were surprised. the revelation bill taylor, an

aide, overheard a conversation between gordon sondland, the ambassador to the european union and president trump in which president trump said, look, he's interested in these investigation, he's asking about the investigations and sondland is suggesting to him the ukrainians will ultimately give in, give him what he wants. republicans, keep in mind, were critical today of the fact that there was one degree of separation between the allegation that some of these officials today were making and president trump. >> that is going to change. david holmes, the aide that overheard that conversation between gordon sondland and the president is expected to be deposed at the end of the week and next week, we are expected to hear, of course from gordon sondland, himself, in public testimony. >> thanks very much. appreciate it. back with everyone. how unusual would it be for the president of the united states, i don't know who called whom, but for the president of the united states to have a phone conversation with the ambassador of the eu while the ambassador

oeu hatches to be in ukraine on a trip. >> quite unusual. it was probably late at night at dinner. the ought thing i was remembering in his addendum, gordon sondland's iden item, hess references that he can't remember whether he had one or two phone calls with president trump. so i expect that will be a major line of questioning next week. what conversations did he have? now, he was a major donor to president trump. he gave a million dollars to the inaugural committee. that's how he got this ambassadorship. so perhaps -- >> well, that's not all. >> he also seals have been bright, anderson. beyond that so maybe they had a relationship related to 2020. who knows? there's lots of theories here that could be true. >> if you believe the president, they had no relationship at all. he says, i don't really know him. remember that? today he at least acknowledged that perhaps he had spoken to him for a brief minute. whatever he said. there was one point the president said i don't really know who he is.

>> it's very uncommon to speak with any political ambassador on the phone for a president and certainly one you don't know or know anything about. >> although this president does work the phones. i think the reporting is clear on this he calls a lot of people. he calls members of congress all the time. i think he calls more. >> but how important is ukraine to the president other than the bidens and crowd strike. >> that i understand is important. but it just seems like a, for the president to invest a time to actually talk to this person, who he says he doesn't know, to just check up on the investigation, that seems that it would be important to the president. >> according to ambassador they roar's testimony, his aide, master taylor's aide overheard the president later asked sondland, how does the president feel about ukraine? he says he cares more about the investigation to the bidens than ukraine, ukraine is being inv e invaded by russia. they've lost 13,000 people and

the president cares more about his stupid open six research effort than the people. >> even taking the president at his word he cared about corruption, pretend for a second that that's sincere, we have no indication anywhere that the president really cared about corruption anywhere else in the world and you don't think he raised it with erdogan today? >> i'm pretty confident he didn't raise wit erdogan today. that's, we know that's the excuse they've give even though corruption -- >> there is saudi arabia, mbs. >> any opportunity to address corruption world wide, maybe they did. but we have no indication. >> what was interesting just in hearing kent and taylor talk today is the extent to which u.s. policy has been an anti-corruption policy in ukraine. i mean, you can argue maybe it's not effective. but, it does seem like all the people that guiliani is

embracing and touting are actually, according to you know these witnesses, they're actually the ones who are corrupt. they're a part of the problem. >> including choe chokin, the c american prosecutor they were trying to get fired for some time. part of the time line interesting to me at least was in 2017 and 2018, there was increased amount of i had given to ukraine. i understand scott and others want to give president trump a lot of credit for that lethal assistance included. he didn't care about that. that was fine. until joe biden wanted to run for president and he wanted to get involved and figure out what he wanted to get out of it. >> there is an interesting time line. >> i don't want to gloss over the lethal issue. on this, remember, russia invaded in 2014 and the obama administration refused to give lethal assistance to fight the russians for two years. we sent out other things, not

lethal assistance, trump shows up. who is helping ukrainians fight the russians more? obama or trump? >> on that, whose got a tougher foreign policy, if you are worried about russian influence, who gave these people weapons to fight the russians? >> that the all distraction. >> did le not care about that? >> you are distracting, which is what republicans have been doing all day. what is the issue -- >> were they fighting against having jaff lens in, because that's the latest reporting that mulvaney was fighting against giving them javelins or buy javelins because it might upset the russians. >> and he pulled back a destroyer going into the black stae to stand up to the russians. i saw the story on cnn. >> what about -- >> that's worse -- >> that's good, i'm with you on that. i think president obama was wrong. >> i agree we you. but the argument that he's tougher on russia than anyone else. >> it's better than not only

allowed the invasion by turkey intoen areas that the u.s. had a foot hold in with our kurdish allies. >> also, congress voted for that aid. the president held it up. >> the only reason he released it -- >> there was a new election and they got a clean bill of health. that was the time line of actually what happened. >> the key thing is that you called it policy. which it was. you can disagree with it, say it was wrong. ambassador taylor agreed wit and thought it was wrong. it was not extortion. it was not bribery, it was something else, it was policy. >> this is about did the president condition aid on investigations not about, what about barack obama? >> we got to take a quick break, we spoke to a group of independent voters undecided about the 2020 election. here's their reaction to the first day of testimony.

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. no matter who you think gained the political high ground today, the real test could rest with voters. voters like a group of undecided voters, gary tugman met with. they all watched the hearings together today. here's what gary has to say. >> reporter: in the politically important state of wisconsin, we watched the impeachment hearing with six voters who are undecided about 2020. do you think that this day was problematic for the president? >> it definitely opened some doors. it opened up a lot more to discussion. >> reporter: each of these six say they could go for a

republican or a democrat in the next presidential election, regarding how this day went for the president. >> i think it could have been a lot worse. i was really like really thought it would be a lot worse. >> reporter: they may have watched the same hearing. but our group had very different takes. >> i think that overall the testimony that ambassador taylor gave is making me think and doubt donald trump's interpretations behind his actions. >> i think they'd have to have a lot of harder evidence against him to think that this was impeachable. >> i feel like he's leaving a wake behind him of problem after problem after problem. >> reporter: how many of you were impressed with the witnesses? >> all of you. so you believe what they said?

do any of you doubt what they said? yet not all of you think it was a bad day for the president. they said some things that were pretty negative about the president. >> they did. but they were only able to say what they heard or what they gleaned through multiple different venues. that's what i mean about the president not planning evidence to defend himself. >> that lead me to this question. you set it up very well. it's a catch 22, isn't it? republicans are saying you don't have first-hand knowledge. the trump administration isn't letting people with first hand only in testify. does that trouble you? >> yes. definitely. it reminds me of the secret courts of russia where i was born. you had people during the soviet union time they weren't allowed to bring them forward because the witnesses might discredit the government. >> i think the evidence, that was solidified in the answer. >> did you think the white house was making a mistake by telling

people they can't testify? >> it causes a problem, certainly. as if they were covering up something or hiding something. >> reporter: one person in our panel says she could potentially vote for a republican for president, just not donald trump. the rest say trump could still get their votes. they all say they will continue to watch the hearings. who was it a better day for republicans or democrats? >> republicans. >> democrats. >> republicans. >> neither. >> neither. >> republicans. >> democrats. >> gary joins me now. did any of the folks say today that moved the needle for them in anyway in terms of voting? >> reporter: well, i do want to say, anderson, although they were all undecided, they did have different voting patterns in 2016. three voted for donald trump. one for hillary clinton, one gary johnson a libertarian and the opts man said he didn't want to tell us who he voted for. but they're all you fighted about their personal opinions about impeachment and removal

from office. they don't want to give a personal yay or nay until this is over with. >> i think you should provide them with food and water. >> that room looked a little bare. a little worried. >> we are the best caterers oyster, lobster. >> i imagine when they heard anything above all the slurping. >> we are back with our political and legal team to discuss. you

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certainly historic day, one thing is clear. it's almost always instructive to talk with actual voters like the ones we just heard from in gary tuchman's report, and i have actual human beings to talk to here as well. what do you -- when you hear undecided voters like that, do you take away -- i mean obviously it's not a scientific poll. >> what they want are facts. they want to know the narrative, the story line. and i did think that adam schiff particularly chairing this committee was judicious. he was very poised. that could have been a freak show, and frankly that would have inured to the republicans' benefits. i think some of them, particularly congressman jordan, were trying to make it into that. voters were watching and they say who's got the national interest at heart? this very calm, unflappable chairman or this sort of spinning, gyrating top that mr. jordan was? >> scott, i think i saw an article you wrote today essentially saying today was

kind of a wash for democrats. >> yeah, i thought it was a lost day because i think it's a relative certainty the house is going to vote to impeach the president. so really the only mission here is to try to make a public argument that would cause the public to force their senators to change their opinion. right now i don't think they're anywhere near having the votes to convict the president. so to some degree i see this as a public relations issue, and from that perspective, i didn't see a compelling moment that would have shifted public opinion. on the voters, by the way, gary didn't ask this but i was thinking when we were watching them, i wonder what they think about this argument because i think republicans are going to make it. there's a remedy. if you're torn on impeachment, the remedy is we're going to have an election. and by the time a trial is getting wrapped up in the senate, they'll be casting the first votes in this election. i think a lot of people who are torn, that is going to be a compelling argument for them. >> so he's above the law. >> that is exactly the reason why the framers put impeachment in the constitution in the first place, which is that sometimes people who ought not be elected president of the united states based on their conduct or based

on their behavior need to be removed from office by an extra political process. so this came up in the context of merrick garland too, that merely because we were approaching an election year, that somehow the senate shouldn't fulfill it's constitutional duty. they took an oath to protect the constitution, and you don't throw it out the door marri mer because of the elections. >> senator burr came out yesterday and said it was going to be six to eight weeks. >> stretch it longer. that ties up the senators who are running -- >> exactly. you have the iowa caucus, which is the first week of february. that could stretch it beyond then. >> because they all have to attend. it's not like regular votes. >> six days a week. >> six days a week. they wouldn't be on the campaign trail. >> do we actually have to attend? >> you do as well. >> write a note to senator burr. >> i think they're worried about it, and i think that mitch mcconnell, being as smart as he is, is thinking about this. >> carrie, do you think that the

rest of the testimony is essentially -- i mean i don't know if they tried to lead with what they felt were their best witnesses or they're trying to build a framework and then have the lieutenant colonel come in in uniform. what do you expect moving forward? >> well, i've been looking for bill taylor's testimony for a while. i think he in particular -- i thought george kent was compelling from his diplomatic perspective, but bill taylor had a lot of facts because he was involved in different deliberations and conversations over the delivery of aid, and he personally was trying to figure out during this august period what in the world was going on with this aid and why was it being held up. so i think he an important story to tell. i do agree with something that scott said earlier this evening, which is that i think therest a lot of attention going to be on gordon sondland's testimony next week. >> yeah. >> i think as more of this information, in particular the new information about the new witness and that conversation that was held with gordon

sondland, ambassador sondland really is going to need to get in touch with his memory between now and early next week because the new witness is going to testify under oath on friday in closed session. and gordon sondland is going to testify in open session. >> and he's not going to be able to read -- >> he's not going to know what that person testifies under oath. and so he's already corrected his testimony one time. congress is not going to look kindly on him having to do do-overs again. >> who would have thought so much would hang on the shoulders of gordon sondland? when he gave $1 million to the inaugural committee, do you think he that, this could end up in -- >> do people here think that bolton will end up testifying or not, that he might testify in a senate trial? >> jeff toobin earlier made the point if he's running around the country getting paid to make speeches and in the speeches

he's talking about his opinion on what he saw, the question is why doesn't he just do it for the american people? >> same thing with a court order. >> he has an obligation. you can't refuse a subpoena. this is still supposed to be the rule of law. when you're subpoenaed, you have to show. >> that's it for us. we'll be right back. more news ahead. when you have nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea. try new pepto liquicaps for fast relief and ultra-coating. nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea. get powerful relief with new pepto bismol liquicaps.

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the news continues. cnn's special coverage, the impeachment hearings live with poppy harlow and jim sciutto starts now. all right. hello and welcome to our viewers in the united states and around the world. it has been a big day, and this is special live coverage of the first public hearing in the impeachment inquiry of president trump. i'm poppy harlow. >> and i'm jim sciutto. for just the fourth time in u.s. history, launches awmakers are o determine if a u.s. president has abused his power in such a way that warrants his removal from office. today it began with two diplomats testifying about their