tv CNN Newsroom Live CNN January 29, 2020 12:00am-1:00am PST
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trump impeachment trial. they'll give them to the parliamentarian, and the chief justice will then ask the questions to either the house managers or the president's defense team. and then you're going to have the real test. after the questions we'll see if mitch mcconnell believes that the votes are there to warrant debate on whether to compel witnesses and documents. according to sources who came out of a meeting with mitch mcconnell today, first that tells you that republicans are talking, right? so that's automatically a problem on that side of the ball. the word is that the votes aren't there yet to block witnesses. three kwar three quarters of you think witnesses should be allowed to testify according to a new poll. that includes nearly half of republicans surveyed. now, where are we in the state of play? is it more likely we're going to
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have witnesses now than it was before bolton, before the two cases and is that a good thing necessarily? let's turn to the big brains. i have all three of you here. professor, good thing to have witnesses? >> i think it's going to be good on balance. >> why could it not be good? >> well, sometimes you don't know what a witness will say. and there's a good chance that nobody really knows what bolton will say, and that could turn out to be good or bad again depending on what he says. and they be asked for this to be a trial of witnesses and they want to get to the truth and presumably bolton will help them get there. presumably it'll be worse for republicans because they also don't know what he'll say but he'll say damaging things. >> and they know ought mat if anything is said is more damaging than if nothing is said. elena, what are you hearing
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about this? is there any chance this is gamesmanship by mcconnell, make it seem like it's a struggle but in the end he pulls it out? or do you think with the bolton new information and his suggestion that it is a dicy proposition for holding back witnesses? >> i do think, chris, that, you know, bolton's revelations as part of this book have complicated mcconnell's calculus. i was just in kentucky to talk to mcconnell's die hard republican voters back home how they feel about this. a lot of mythology that surrounds mcconnell right now as republican majority leader has relied on his handling of this trial. and i do have to wonder that if, you know, ultimately he does not have the votes to block witnesses from testifying, whether that tarnishes the sort of image of him as kind of the ruthless go-getter who would not let anything hurt the republicans' case in this moment. so i do think this is about his
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personal legacy as much as it is just the outcome of this trial. >> elena, thank you. stay with me. chime in as you see fit. let me ask crow a legal question and then i have a political bounce for you, jim, to help me figure it out. you're a lawyer but you wear both hats. so the idea of risks in witnesses as the professor laid out, you don't know what they're going to say. another type of risk for democrats specifically is overplaying your hand as you could argue happened in investigations before this. oh, if we just get this one everything will change. that's a dicy proposition here even with bolton, is it not? >> it is. and now we've heard through the leak of what's in his book supposedly what he has to say about this, if he comes and doesn't say anything beyond that or repeats it, i think a lot of people will dee disappointed. it wasn't in the evidentiary record or from his own mouth but still i think people are going
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to be wanting more substance from him. >> there's also a chance he says, yeah, the president told me but then it still falls under the category of buts it's okay because he could easily say i didn't like his foreign policy choices. i thought he was compromising it, but that's still the president's call. here's why i think that you guys have to be careful about there being no witnesses is that i think that's the best thing for the democrats politically because it's not going to really change the vote. we don't have any indication. i don't want to get ahead of it, but we have no indication that senators have been swayed through this process that if there are witnesses there may be a guilty verdict here. we don't believe that. so if it's not going to change the votes, and you guys -- and there are no witnesses, the democrats will get to leak out whatever comes after this. right, they'll call in bolton themselves and say look what they didn't want you to see. i think it's better for you guys to have witnesses and bank it doesn't really change the
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calculus. >> look, i think all along the republicans have been on message saying they don't have anything here, they didn't put on a good case, we knocked it down. they relee ied upon hearsay testimony, unconstitutional principles that they put together a case for a fake crime of this obstruction of congress. you know, and what it all comes down to is that from a political perspective they've knocked down this case, they did what they needed to do. >> but they said you have no direct evidence tying the president to the plot and you've got bolton -- >> but it's the democrats saying, look, we had a rock solid case here. but if you had a rock solid case, run with the case. they said the case they put on was a rock solid case. >> they did. that's what they say but they're qualified, jim. there's a comma. the comma is because we couldn't get the main witnesses and new you've got bolton saying he wants to testify. but elena, you've been on the ground feeling this out.
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what do you hear? >> i think one reason to dwell why this could not be great for the democratic party is that to imagine yeah, maybe mcconnell doesn't end up having the votes for this but to imagine then 24 hours later john bolton saunters in to deliver his testimony i think is a bit silly especially from what we know from this white house. i already have republican sources in the senate telling me they will fight tooth and nail within the white house to ensure whether it's a claim of executive privilege or some such that bolton does not end up sitting in that seat. and then you have the question of whether democrats actually want to continue prolonging this trial, if this is something that gets tied up further in the courts with whether a claim of executive privilege is in fact apt in this case. so i don't think it's something as simple. >> i agree. process matters. but let me bring in the professor because elena i think
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tees that up perfectly. however, i think -- the professor lays out the premise here which is they bash bolton. and when you bash somebody on the exact subject matter that you might want to claim privilege on, it's a dicy proposition, professor, because it can look like a waiver. if they argue this is privileged conversation, he can't talk about it unless they say he can't release the book because there's classified information and in fact this topic which we know it isn't by exercise, how strong is the argument i'm sorry you waived it with bolton because you attacked his story. >> i think it's a very strong argument. >> why? >> because the president says and i'm paraphrasing but basically he said i didn't say what bolton said in the book. what does that mean? that means the president is already signaling something about what he said or didn't say in a conversation with bolton. that's enough to open the door. >> is a rejection -- you agree with the professor at that if
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you disagree with how a conversation is characterized you had with an advisor, can that see as a waiver? >> it can because you are giving content about the communication. he's saying no, no, that is not what was said here. that's saying content about the communication. you can't both say i won't let him talk about the content -- >> so either it's not talked about at all or isn't. >> this is not an attorney-client privilege, this is the executive privilege. it's his privilege at the end of the day. he did not divulge any information or information that was relative to a conversation that he had in the decision making process, which is the important thing here. presidents have to be able to speak with their top advisers freely. and the fact he says that's not what i said i don't believe opens up that door. you can argue it both ways but i don't think it opens up that door especially in the context of executive privilege. you look at the 70% number,
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though, a lot of it is from republicans who want to hear from biden and schiff. it's not just about hearing from bolton but hearing from the democrats as well. and to mitch mcconnell, i don't think this -- whether or not he can handle this and keep the votes i don't think is going to make a hill of beans difference in his re-election campaign. i think mitch mcconnell is very popular at home. he is going to go -- he's going to win elections solidly in kentucky. but also let's not sleep on mitch mcconnell here. he over over plays his hand. he always says it's tough. and at the end of the day a lot of times he delivers. >> but the last word is the one that counts. let's not paint him as some kind of different animal than ad78 schiff. this is guy who warned the democrats not to play with the filibuster and then he of course all this is subjective, but he perverted the process of picking
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judges in this country like nobody else has before. and here was his premise, jimmy, and you know it, you did something screwed up here you democrats by making it 50 plus to get judges through. because that was unfair i'm going to do that with supreme court justice and you see that as a principle? >> i said he's not a man of overreach. >> that's overreach. >> adam schiff, we found collusion, well you didn't find collusion. >> that's an opinion. it's not changing the constitutional process. jimmy, you want to compare a bad analysis, a bad conclusion -- >> you're making stuff up. >> -- to a guy who changed -- no, he was wrong even on the whistle-blower stuff. the guy never talked to the whistle-blower. we have no other proof. talk to his staff. you want to run-down that road then you better start swinging a
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stick at devin nunes because that guy said some funny stuff. let's just do what we've been doing well. both sides have some stuff to deal with. when it comes to mcconnell you are never going to sell me on the proposition he plays the game better. the guy changing and picking supreme court justice in a way that will forever politicize that process. but let's take a break. we'll argue more about it on the other side. we're going to take a break. when we come back the president just put out a tweet on bolton. all right, spoiler alert what happens when you say something that isn't good for the president? no matter how close you were to him before where do you wind up? get ready, here comes the bust. and did you notice that there was a little bit of a quick turn, all right? we're going to come back with the tweet, the tapes and the team. what does that mean? i'll show you. ♪ oh, oh, oh, ozempic®! ♪
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about this and his defenders? listen. >> anyone who knows john bolton is celebrating because of his intellect, his capacity, his experience, his talent. >> disgraced former national security advisor john bolton. bolton has turned and betrayed his former boss, donald trump. >> brilliant, celebrating and then angry puppy dogface, turncoat. see, that's how it works over there. this is the echo of the president. this is what they want you to believe but it's the same john bolton right? so let's discuss the implication. jimmy, the president is doing what he does best. he's attacking what he sees as a threat. right move with bolton? >> i would go one step further i'd describe it as capitalist. the guy is trying to make money, he's trying to sell books. and i don't know if that's where the president was trying to go with it, but i think that's a better narrative because i think it's more opportunistic and
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probably right. >> what they're doing over there is they okay. that's the okay. so what's to risk to this strategy of attacking bolton, a guy you once thought was good enough to be national security advisor? >> an attack that really doesn't have merit -- >> although the book does hurt him. he didn't want to testify and now he's got a book coming out and all of a sudden he's a patriot. >> it's not like in court where if they made a claim you made something up. you would the opportunity to actually come in with other evidence showing that you did think that at the time and you had been saying it at the time. there's not a lot of down side to continuing this line of attack. >> the flip side is the president is obviously saying bolton is lying. in fact he already said john bolton is lying in an earlier tweet attack. however, if bolton comes in and the manuscript comes in and you're able to match it up to
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what has already been said already in testimony by those who say they spoke to john bolton you start getting a ton of credibility. and if you're going to get into a credibility contest president trump is who you want to be against. and even though jimmy can be right, and boy did you pick a right time to come out and speak, and holding the book until march 17th, why don't you put it now if you want to it to be relevant, who wins the credibility contest? now you've got the a.g. on the spot, you've got the people who testified before about what bolton said to them. where does it come out? >> bolton might win on the credibility contest but that's not going to matter. i think with all due respect to the president and defenders in senate that credibility is not something he cares about. he's got a narrative and he pushes that narrative. facts don't enter into it. what matters into it is they like the president and they'll stick with him through thick and
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thin. >> let me just get elena in here. out on the hustings this is seen as mus clarity on the trump base, he's fighting back. what's your take on it? >> as a reporter it's interesting to me, chris. because several months ago when donald trump did fire bolton as i reported at the time in the atlantic he did ask his advisers whether that was in fact the best move. and it's something that mick mulvaney has dealt with before in saying donald trump can't fire me because i know too much. is there actual things that donald trump's top advisers have confided to each other before? donald trump i think was waiting for this moment when his fears and paranoia about what john bolton may or may not know about the workings of this administration could come to light. so, you know, i see that as pretty climatic, as the story line i've been following for a while. the second point i'd make, chris, is donald trump's tweet is not correct. john bolton at least if we are
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to believe him did raise this with nsc lawyers at the time when he was serving as national security advisor. i do think that jim is right, that there's an element that should be looked at with a lot of scrutiny what can john bolton do in terms of selling his book. it's not as if he suddenly had a revelation last week about his opinions about donald trump's conduct with regard to ukraine were in fact that. this was something, again, if we are to believe his own word he raised with nsc lawyers at the time. >> one question for house managers. give it to me. in this new phase of the questions -- i'm going to ask you what are you going to ask house managers? >> i'm going to ask house managers what did schiff know and when did he know it, was it relate today the whistle-blower? >> i actually would give them the opportunity to erebut some of what trump's lawyers have been saying, bringing the facts back in instead of focusing in
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on process and nonconstitutional arguments. >> what i would ask the house managers is what's an abuse of power, explain it, walk through us again why that's an impeachable offense, doesn't hurt to repeat something that is very historically sound. >> do you think the senators are going to do this stuff, by the way, or do you think this is stuff they'll miss? >> i think they'll dee do a lot of repetition. i think they'll do less of the questioning because it's not cross, they won't have immediate follow-up. it's going to be awkward and stilted. >> and they'll be talking directly -- obviously they're talking to the senators but they'll be looking at the senators. >> guys like ted cruz are going to go on the attack. >> but he doesn't get to attack. >> i get. but he's one of the smartest legal minds without a question. that guy is going to be front and center -- >> he will. he's going to be very good on the attack. a good debater, not so great with the facts himself, though. senator, you're always welcome
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to make the case here. it's much easier to talk about us than to us. we're going to take a break. all you guys, thank you very much. when we come back we're following two big stories, right? we have what's going on with impeach. this next phase and also this kobe bryant story is bigger than just mim. so many families were ruined. in the ntsb is giving us more information. it's ruined too many families. next. - do you have a box of video tapes, film reels, or photos, that are degrading? legacybox professionally converts them to dvds, thumb drive, or the cloud. legacybox is simple and safe, with over half a million satisfied customers. visit legacybox.com today, and get 40% off. (sensethe lack of control when iover my businessai, made me a little intense. but now quickbooks helps me get paid, manage cash flow,
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so what are we seeing? when it comes to the loss of kobe, we've seen such energy come out of the nba. people who played with him, others who joined because of him. remember he set a standard for coming out of high school in this new era. and they are coming out with all this emotion about what he meant. now, earlier i spoke with his former teammate and good friend derek fisher, and he talks about him. and ball playing is the least of it. >> most of my professional career as a player, most of my formative years as a man, as a father, as a husband alongside of kobe, plane rides, bus rides, in the arena, and we grew up together in a lot of ways even though i'm only a few years older. i don't think that any of us can achieve the best version of ourselves, you know, whatever
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our individual greatness is without inspiration from others. and for me personally he was a gift and a blessing because i got a chance to live with in a sense someone that on a daily basis was trying to access the greatest parts of who he is and who he was, and i don't know if, you know, we'll ever have someone else like him and, you know, that adds to the pain to not get a chance to see him continue on with his legacy. >> and look, you know, as subtly as you hear it, you know, kobe bryant went through some very difficult times and how that shaped him is obviously something that his friends are talking about, who he became. and now bittersweet and heartrending for them is who he still wanted to become. now, he's not the only person who had his best years taken from him. that really seems to be the story with everyone on there,
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his young daughter, the two other young women going to play, their young parents, a young coach. christina mauser was the assistant coach. she was recruited by kobe because of how great she was to the mamba academy team. i spoke to coach mauser's brother about the magic of his sister. what magic she was for her kids and how she should be remembered. listen. matthew, thank you for joining us. >> hello, thank you for having me. >> i'm very sorry for your loss. how are you doing with this at this point? >> i mean, if i were to try and word it i'm just in complete agony with my family, and this is just completely crushing. so just every ounce of my being
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is destroyed. >> this is so extraordinarily tough because your sister had everything in life in front of her. young family, young career, so much energy, so many years to provide, and that's what she was about. she was about giving back to kids and empowering young women. how do you -- what do you tell yourself about what this means? >> it's really just to channel my sister's strength. christina was always the strongest one, straonger than m, strongest in the family, strong for husband and the kids. and in some weird way this is her talking to us to level up. she was -- my sister was the
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greatest. and i don't even know where the message will prevail, but i think i know the big picture of like the family to and the brother-in-law and the kids to come together and honor her and now just live and represent her greatness, my baby sister. >> i know she was your baby sister and i mean no disrespect, but looking at the pictures she seems to be a superior athlete and a -- >> superstar. >> and i feel like you and i had similar experiences where our sisters were kind of taking it to us pretty much every time we competed at anything when we were kids. is that what christina was for you? >> oh, my gosh, so competitive. my sister just growing up was already a superstar. it was basketball. i mean, she was on varsity as a
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freshman and then all county and then volleyball. and even when we were kids her and soccer, she was extraordinary. it was all world at all this and it just made you want to be a better person and get to her level because she was -- she was amazing. she was the best. she was the best player, the best human, the best everything. and it's -- i -- this is bad. >> teaching girls. she joined this club as an assistant coach. how important was it to your sister not just to be a coach, not just to empower through sports but to reach young women through sports as a function of empowerment. >> and yeah just to mentor as a leader that she was and still
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is. the girls on the team called her the mother of defense, the mod for short, m-o-d. so the whole team called her the mod, and that was my sister. the mother of defense. and she put you in check, everybody. and she just represented goodness and leadership and got it all done. >> give me a memory of you guys as kids when you realized that she was going to be somebody special. >> when i -- oh, gosh. what highlight is she was able to throw the soccer ball during the throw-in like across the field. and it was like, wow. and so every time there was a throw-in for soccer they would have my sister make sure she was the one to do that. and it was just a legendary
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throw-in. and just 5, 6, 7, 8 years eeld just led to everything, basketball, anything she did she was smart, intelligent, hilarious. my sister was hysterical. >> you're hurting right now. she would know you're hurting. what would your sister tell you? >> right now she'd be like hey, time to level up. when i sit in silence and i try and hear her, you know, she's -- i can hear the whisper of her telling me it's going to be okay and to get through this, mourn, celebrate her, honor her but then go and represent her in this world and take care of -- take care of the kids. my beautiful nieces, my nephew, my brother-in-law. gosh, there's -- there's got to
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be some support from uncle matt now. but it's going to be a constant listening out for her and i'm just glad that she'll be -- she's up there guiding me now. and channelling strength through this interview as we speak here. >> when you are hurting what is the memory that you will cling to for now to remind you that what you had is worth more than just the loss itself? >> her smile and our overall just conversations, just in general. call her for anything, talk about anything, vent about anything. so just having that image of her smile and that'll help for -- i
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mean her smile will always help me. and so hopefully i can help everyone else, too. >> lean on that. lean on that. the only mistake you could make is to try to shutout the memories, to try to avoid the pain. i know it's hard, matthew. but don't do it. you had a special bond with somebody. there's nothing like a sibling, and there's nothing like a sister and a brother, and you have that. and hold onto it. don't hide from it, and feel what you feel. none of this is easy. but thank you so much for letting us understand just how great your sister was. >> thank you. >> -- to you to her kids, her husband, her community and to all those girls who knew her as mod, the mother of defense. >> yes. >> god bless, matthew. >> thank you. >> and best to the family. >> god bless. thank you. >> look, i'm no therapist but i like so many of you i know what
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it's like to feel that pain of loss and you've got to cling to the best of who's no longer here because that's how we keep them alive. now, if you'd like to help the mausers, she had a young family, christina and she's got a husband. there's a crowd sourcing page or whatever they call it, gofundme page approved by the family. i will post the link on my twitter page. you see it there on the screen. it will be on my twitter page as well. now in terms of why this happened the ntsb said the chopper was only 20 or 30 feet from clearing the mountain it crashed into. the pilot had over 8,000 hours in the air. he was a trainer pilot, he was very good. so how did this happen? there's new information telling us some things and raising questions. we have our experts to make
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from the ntsb today about the crash that claimed kobe bryant, his daughter and seven others. here's what we know. the helicopter had a sudden drop of about 2,000 feet in a minute. it was in one piece until it hit a hill side. investigators call it a high energy impact crash, and that's what it sounds like. this was going fast, it hit hard and that's going to have a catastrophic effect on the people inside. so why did that happen? let's take you to the aviation experts. we've got mary scavo and miles o'brien here. the pilot, lots of hours i think like 8,000. he was an instructor. he was instrument trained. so does that mean this is not a
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situation that screams out pilot error or might it still? >> not necessarily, chris. pilots with a lot of experience can fall into all kinds of traps, can lull themselves into a sense of complacency which can be dangerous. and you have to look at the type of flying this was. this was an experience pilot. by mission they are mission focused type a people with a client who's a rich, famous guy who's a type a mission focused person on a deadline. there is an insidious kind of pressure that is created in that environment. and there's been many aviation crashes in the past that ultimately have this as part of a contributing cause. >> you said earlier that one of the factors that often is first is to miles point is whether or not you should have taken off. these conditions a lot of ships were grounded at that time. what do you read into this
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decision? >> well, the decision to take off and i read into it that why was the decision did the pilot have a problem doing the instrument flight route, was there something with the helicopter that the instrument flight plan would not be approved for instance with this helicopter. not only does have the pilot have to be instrument rated but if you're going to go ifr you have to have auto pilot in the helicopter. there's something about that initial decision why they didn't file an ifr flight plan and do it that way. >> vfr visual flight rules means you're not using the instruments and gauges and ifr means you are. miles, when we look at what this helicopter did, it followed the normal route. we have no reason to believe this is not a route this pilot didn't take before. and there's some looping around
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glendale which seems to explain what we're hearing from the tower saying he's been holding for 15 minutes. maybe that was about air traffic or trying to get some better guidance, but that's probably the looping. and then as it starts to follow one of the major arteries, it asn ascends and then banks left and descends very rapidly. i know it's impossible to pinpoint what that means, but give us a sense of what those movements might suggest. >> well, first he was getting away with what we call flying scud running, flying beneath the clouds above the ground just threading the needle as it were. he got to that pass where burbank is and realized he toin flying the 101 route he normally flew and asked for special permission to fly through burbank airspace, had to hold until he got that permission. then after he got around to rejoin his route which was to follow the 101 highway he was at the lowest part of that valley on the 101 and yet it was still
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steadily rising the terrain into the clouds. so you could surmise as he was flying along that route he realized he couldn't maintain visual flight rules by flying that route. what do you want to do at that point? a good decision would be to turn around, another good decision would be to clime. but perhaps given the altitude record we've seen so far he would have been in the clouds ascending and making a left turn. the other thing very unusual about this, chris, one of the things inherently safe about helicopters in relatively bad weather is they can fly really slow. you can creep along and find your way. but he was flying over 130 knots which is more than twice as fast as you might expect in this case. so a lot of things indicate spatial disorientation, confusion, trying to turn around in the clouds and perhaps an aerodynamic stall. >> mary, taking what miles is
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saying we know, one, he almost made this over this mountain which seems to suggest he didn't see it until it was too late obviously and that the speed they calculate that he hit it at was something like 2,000 feet a minute or something like that. it's like 20 something miles an hour. and my suggestion is -- i'm no pilot but what i did with the research is that means the plane was probably trying to go up more than it was trying to go forward. does that make sense? >> yes, it does. but i agree with you. it seems to have caused the pilot to try to turp and turn very rapidly that causes the stall. except on a helicopter you actually have the rotor blades stall and that happens when you're heavy, when you've got a lot of passengers or cargo, when there's a lot of moisture in the air called density altitude, and when you make a sharp turn. and given what they had done up
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until this point they'd lost all their safety nets. they'd lost their radar, any proximity ground equipment they had onboard. i don't believe they had anyway, but if they had something like taws, it would have been going off all the time because they are just so low. >> and that's one of the things we're told this didn't have it. the ntsb recommends it but they didn't have it. i'll have you back. appreciate it. remember when president trump told us no americans were harmed in iran's retaliatory strike on our forces in iraq? none were killed, but then the president said, well, the injuries that we're hearing about they're like headaches and stuff. there's new evidence that he was really wrong about something that we could not get wrong anymore. bolo next. these folks don't have time to go to the post office
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bolo, be on the look out. 50 u.s. service members have now been diagnosed with traumatic brain injuries. that's from 16 from last week. they were injured in thirannian missile attack on u.s. forces in iraq earlier this month. potus of course had initially said no one was injured in that retaliatory attack. when the truth came out he did what he does his worst, doubling down on disrespect. >> i heard that they had headaches and a couple of other things, but i would say that i can report it is not very
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serious. >> so you don't consider potential traumatic brain injuries serious? >> they told me about it numerous days later. you'd have to ask the department of defense. no, i don't consider them very serious injuries relative to other injuries that i've seen. >> look, he's minimizing it because he thinks it looks bad if enough people are hurt. but he is playing into a pernicious prejudice about tbi. he doesn't think it's as bad. he doesn't know what he's talking about. this isn't a damn headache. serious concussions, brain injuries that affect processing, processing of emotions. they can be ever bit as debilitating as any other injury. the veteran of foreign wars one of america's oldest vet groups called it misguided. they demand an apology. so far silence. i thought you respected the troops like nobody else. you are embarrassing on a level that we need awareness. don't be part of the stigma. fix it.
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apologize. show you'll do it for the troops. be on the look out. thanks for watching. stay tuned. news continues here on cnn. feeling sluggish or weighed down can be a sign your digestive system isn't working at its best. taking metamucil every day can help. its psyllium fiber forms a gel that traps and removes the waste that weighs you down. it also helps lower cholesterol and slows sugar absorption, promoting healthy blood sugar levels. so, start feeling lighter and more energetic
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