good evening from washington, d.c. welcome to this unique event. the cnn democratic presidential debate with the two leading candidates for the democratic nomination. former vice president joe biden and vermont senator bernie sanders. candidates, it's good to have you. i'm jake tapper along with dana bash. >> we come together tonight at an extra oordinary time in our country when people are worried about far more than just presidential politics. we're in a national emergency because of the devastating global pandemic of coronavirus. it has killed nearly 6,000 people around the world and 65 dead and more than 3,300 cases known here in the united states. as a result, the debate will

focus heavily on the crisis. >> the setting is also different to reduce unnecessary risk of transmission of the virus, cnn, the democratic national committee and the campaigns moved this debate from phoenix, arizona, to here at cnn studios in washington without any audience. >> all of this comes as four more states, florida, arizona, ohio and illinois prepare to vote on tuesday with vice president biden currently leading senator sanders in the race for delegates. here's what we're going to do tonight. each of you will have 90 seconds to answer questions and 45 seconds for responses and rebuttals. as much as we can, we hope this will be a conversation between the two of you. so let's begin with the most important issue right now, the coronavirus and what you would do as president in the face of it. vice president booiden, let me start with you. we're in a reality right now that might have seen unimaginable a week ago. schools have been cancelled for

more than 25 million students, grocery stores health ises have been cleared out, march madness, disney parks, small businesses all shut down and just today the cdc issued a new recommendation that for the next eight weeks events that consist of 50 people or more throughout the u.s. be cancelled or post toned. what do you say to the american people who are confronting this new reality? >> first of all, my heart goes out to those who have already lost someone or those suffering from the virus. this is bigger than any one of us. this is a national rally into everybody move together. and i laid out in detail what i would do were i president today. go to joebiden.com. i laid it out in significant detail. but there are three pieces. first of all, we have to take care of those who, in fact, are exposed or likely to be exposed to the virus. and that means we have to do testing, we have to get the testing kits out, i would have the world health organization, take advantage of the test cuts

they have available to us even though the president says a million or more are come iing. let's get all the tests web done as quickly as we can. secondly, i would make sure that every state in the union had ten places where they had trooif thrust testing arrangements. i would also at this point deal with the need to be planning for additional hospital beds. we have the kpapt in the department of defense as well as with the fema. and they can set up 500-bed hospitals quickly. we have to lay all that out. but we have to deal with the economic fallout quickly. that means making sure the people who lose their job, don't get a paycheck, can't pay their mortgage are able to pay it and pay them now. and do it now. small businesses be able to borrow interest-free loans. i see my time is up here are are you going to hold us tightly, but that's what i would do. go to joebiden.com. it lays out what i would do if i were president today. >> senator sanders, dr. fauci

acknowledged that it's possible that hundreds of thousands, if not millions of americans could die from coronavirus in a worst case scenario. if you were president right now, what's the most important thing you would do tonight to try to save american lives? >> firstly, whether or not i'm president, we have to shut this president up right now. because he's undermining the doctors and the scientists who are trying to help the american people. it is unaccept able for him to e blabbering unfaction yule information. second of all, what we need to do, and i'm glad he has called a state of national emergency, what we have got to do is move aggressively to make sure that every person in this country finally understands that when they get sick with the coronavirus, that they will -- that all payments will be made. they don't have to worry about coming up with money for test

ing. they don't have to worry about coming up with money for treatment. this is an unprecedented moment in american history. i i obviously believe in medicare for all. i will fight for that as president. but right now, in this emergency, i want every person in this country to understand what when you get sick, you go to the doctor. when you get sick, if you have the virus, that will be paid r for. do not worry about the cost right now. because we're in the middle of a national emergency. second of all, we have to make sure that our hospitals have the ventilators they need, have the ic units they need. right now we have a lack of medical personnel. and i worry very much that if there is a peak, whether we have the capability of dealing with hundreds of thousands of people who may be in hospitals. so we need unprecedented action right now to deal with the unprecedented crisis. and bottom line from an economic point of view, what we have to say to the american people, if you lose your job, you will be made whole. you're not going to lose income.

if trump can put or the fed can president a trillion and a half into the banking system, we can protect the wages of every worker in america. >> thank you. joe biden, president trump says he does not take any responsibility for the problems with coronavirus testing in part because he says he inherited so many rules, regulations and red tape. did bureaucratic red tape ham per this response? >> no, the world health organization offered testing kits that they have available to give to us now. we refused them. we did not want to buy them. we did not want to get them from them. we wanted to make sure we had our own. he said something like the best scientists in america or something to that effect. the idea that we are not prepared for this and not -- the other thing i want to point out. i agree with bernie. we're in a situation where we have to now be providing for the hospitals that are going to be needed. needed now. the present system can cannot

handle the surge that is likely to come. so we should already be sitting down and planning where we're dpoing to put these temporary hospitals. and we can do that. we have been through this before with the coronavirus. we have -- excuse me with dealing with the viruss that the h1n1 and as well as what happened in africa. we provided these hospitals dealing with these great pandemics and we were able to do it quickly. people would have a place to go. but we need equipment to protect the first responders. >> senator sanders, obviously, another major health concern for officials is the surge in patients all at once. overburden hospitals. you mentioned icu beds and ventilators. we're already in the middle of flu season, so a lot of the beds are being used. if you were president right now, what would you do to make sure

every sick american is able to get treatment so the u.s. does not suffer the same fate as italy where doctors have to decide wright now who gets life-saving treatment and who does not. >> let's be honest and understand that this coronavirus pandemic exposes the incredible weakness and dysfunction nalityf our current health care system. twice as much for health care. how in god's name did we end up with 87 million people ununsured or underi object sured and people watching this that are not feeling well. should i go to the doctor, but i can't afford to go to doctor. what happens if i'm sick? it's going to cost thousands of for treatment. who is going to feed my kids? we are the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people. we're spending so much money and we're not even prepared for this pandemic.

how come hospitals in rural areas are shutting town? how come people can't afford to get the prescription drugs we need because we have crooks running the pharmaceutical industry. in the midst of this epidemic, you have people in the pharmaceutical industry are saying, wow, what an opportunity to make a fortune. so the word has got to go out. i certainly would do this as president. you don't worry. people of america, do not worry about the cost of prescription drugs. do not worry about the cost of the health care that you're going to get. because we are a nation, a civilized democratic society. rich and poor, middle class will get the care they need. the drug companies will not rip us off. >> vice president biden, some medical experts are saying the only true way to control this virus is through a national quarantine requiring every american other than essential personnel to stay home. would you take that unprecedented step of a national lockdown? >> what i would do is what we

did in our administration. i would call a meeting in the situation room of all the experts in america dealing with this crisis. i would sit them down and i would do exact ly what we did then. what is it that we need? listen to the experts. what do woe need. with all due respect for m medicare for all, you have a single payer system in italy. it doesn't work there. it has nothing to do with medicare for all. that would not solve the problem at all. we can take care of that right now by making sure that no one has to pay for treatment, period, because of the crisis. no one has to pay for whatever drugs are needed, period, because of the crisis. no one has to pay for hospitalization because of the crisis, period. that's a national emergency and that's how it's handled. it's not working in italy right now. ask they have a single payer system. with regard to what else i would do, the fact is that we're in a position where i would bring together the leading experts of the world. instead of doing this in the united states, instead of doing this piecemeal, sit down and do

a what we did with the ebola crisis. what is needed and have one voice, one voice like we did every day we met in that crisis in the situation room. lay iing out overall, for all t nation, what the best proposal is and how to move forward. in the absence of that, governors are making some sound decisions. they are doing the best they can by going out and getting health care expert this is their communities and states to move. but it should be directed from the white house, from the situation room, laying out in detail like we did in the ebola crisis and we beat it. >> thank you. senator sanders, your response? >> first of all, the dysfunctionality of the current health care system is obviously apparent. as i said earlier, there are people who hesitate going to the doctor. you're going to have a maize of regulations, if this is my income, if that's my income, can i get it? we are not prepared. trump only kpas exacerbates the

crisis. when we spend twice as much per capita than any oh nation, one might expect we'd have enough doctors all over the country. we'd have us awe fordable prescription drugs. one might expect we are prepare ing for a pandemic that we were ready with the ventilators with the icus and test kits we need. we are not. and bottom line here is in terms of medicare for all, despite what the vice president is saying, what the experts tell us that one of the reasons that we are unprepared and have been unprepared is we don't have a system. we got thousands of private insurance plans. that is not a system that is prepared to provide health care to all people. in a good year without the epidemic, we're losing up to 60,000 people who die every year because they don't get to a doctor on time. it's clearly this crisis is only making a bad situation worse.

>> that has nothing to do when you're in a national crisis. the national crisis says we're responding. it's all free. you don't have to pay for a thing. that has nothing to do with whether or not you have an insurance policy. this is a crisis. we're at war with the virus. we're at war with the virus. it has nothing to do with co-pays or anything. we just pass a law saying you do not have to pay for any of this, period. >> that's not true. as a matter of fact, that's not true. that law has enormous loopholes. i understand that nancy pelosi did her best. but what you're talking about, joe, is enormous loopholes within that that, in fact, it's thot necessarily covering treatment for all people in america. and people are going to be stuck with the bill unless we change that. we're going to offer legislation to change that. >> if i may, i offered legislation. i laid out on my plan that it would cover exactly what is not covered by the house. i laid out in the plan that i

laid out for how we would deal with this crisis. nobody will pay for anything having to do with the crisis. this is a national emergency. this isn't a question of whether or not this is something that could be covered by insurance or anything else. we out of the treasury are going to pay for this. it's a national emergency. that's what my plan calls for. >> but the weakness of this, let's do a hypothetical. family members diagnose with the virus. terrible tragedy, massive anxiety. the wife has the virus, the husband is a wreck and wants to go get counselling. doesn't have the money to do that. maybe their kid breaks a leg. they don't have the money. you're saying right now in the middle of a crisis, last year at least 30,000 people died in america because they didn't get health care when they should. because we don't have universal coverage. i think that's a crisis. 1 out of 5 people cannot awe

ford the prescription drugs they need. they suffer, some die. i consider that a crisis. bottom line is we need a simple system, which exists in canada, exists in countries all over the world. that is if you are an american, you get the health care you need, end of discussion. we can save huge sums of money doing that. the trick is do we have the guts to take on the health care industry, some of which is funding the vice president's campaign. do we have the courage to take on the executives at the prescription drug industry. some of whom are funding his campaign. >> this is a national crisis. i don't want to get this in back and forth in terms of politics. i laid out a plan building on obamacare, providing the public option of medicare. it would cover everyone. this idea that this is his only answer is a mistake in notion. but regardless of whether my plan was in place or his, this is a crisis. this is like we are being attacked from abroad.

this is something that is of great consequence. this is like a war. and in a war, you do whatever is needed to be done to take care of your fepeople. what you do is -- and i proposed it and laid it out in detail. everything that you need in terms of dealing with this crisis would be free. it is paid for by the taxpayers generally. generally. it has nothing to do with bernie's medicare for all. by the way -- >> vice president, thank you. if i may, the vice president just mention ed war. would you deploy the u.s. military in an effort to contain the virus? if so, how? >> i think we use all of the tools that make sense. and if using the national guard, which is folks i think in new york state are already using the national guard, that's something that has to be done. this is clearly, as the vice president indicated, a national emergency. and what i worry about is not

only how we respond aggressively to the virus, but also how we respond aggressively to the economic fallout of a global recession. so right now in illinois and ohio, if my memory is correct, the governor there has said they are closing down bars and restaurants. what happens to the workers who are there? what happens to the millions of workers who may end up losing their jobs. so what i think we have got to do right now is if trump can provide or the fed can provide a trillion and a half for liquidity for the banks, we are going to say to every worker in america, don't panic. you're not going to -- you'll be able to pay your mortgage. you're going to get a check. >> we're going to talk about the economic -- go ahead. >> the sans i would call out the military. now. they have the capacity to provide this surge help that

hospitals need and that is needed across the nation. i would make sure that they did exactly what they are prepared to do. they have done it. they did it in the ebola crisis. they have tone it. they have the capacity to build 500-bed hospitals and tents that are completely safe and secure and provide the help to get it done to this overflow. so it is a national emergency. i would call out the military. >> the ebola crisis is one thing. this is, obviously, a pandemic, which is far more severe and impactful to this country. and i think one of the things we want to remember here is that we have a lot of elderly people in this country who are told to stay home. don't leave your house. who is going to get food to them? you got schools all over this country now being shut down. how are we going to make sure that the kids do well in this crisis, not become traumatized? what do we do about the parents that have to stay home with kids and can't go to work? bottom line here is that in this

cris crisis, we have got to start paying attention to the most vulnerable. that includes people who are in prison right now. people in homeless shelters right now. what about the half a million people who are homeless tonight? who is going to respond to them? in 2008 when we had the wall street bailout, they did well for the people on top. they bailed out the crooks on wall street. they forgot about the suffering of ordinary americans. this time around, let us learn that lesson and pay attention to the working class of this cou country. >> we have learned that lesson. and again, i lay out in detail what we should be doing now is we should be surging help to those places which are the most vulnerable. we should have every single person that's in a nursing home being automobile to be tested. we should be moving forces in to do that. we should move in the capability to do that. the president should be sitting down right now and do what we did before and asking the question, okay. you're going to close everyth g

everything. how do ewe get prescriptions that have to be filled? how do you make sure when you close that school, the children will be able to get the food program. how do you make sure you'll be able to see to it you get your mortgage paid? i propose that all of that be covered and it's going to take a multibillion dollar program to do that. but first things first, the first thing is take care of the the immediate needs we have now relate iing to surging the kind capability we have to prevent this great bump in terms of how it's going to cause such pain as well as moving in the direction of making sure we have long-term plan. >> we're going to talk a lot more about the economic impact. but first, senator sanders, china. when the outbreak first started, the government censored the whistleblower doctor who sounded the alarm and down played the true gravity of the the virus. what consequences should china face for its role in this global dcrisis? >> one of the consequences is we have to learn that you cannot lie to the american people.

you cannot be less than frank about the a nature of the cry us is. what bothers me very much is you have a president of the united states today, mr. trump, who is praising china for the good work that they are doing when, in fact, as you indicated, they were lying to their own people and allowing the virus to move much more aggressively than should have been the case. i don't think this is the time for rep mags. now is the time to be working with china. they are learn inging a lot abo this crisis. and in fact, we have to work with them. we have to work with the world health organization, we have to work with italy. if there was ever a moment when the entire world is in this together, got to support each other, this is that moment. >> that's why i insisted the moment this broke out we should insist on having our experts in

china, in china to see what was happening and make it clear to china there would be consequences if we did not have that access. we have to lead the world. we should be the ones doing what we did during the ebola crisis. bring iing the whole world together and saying this is what we must do. we have to have a common plan. all nations are affected the same way by this virus depending on exposure. and so we need world leadership. we need international leadership. we need someone who knows how to bring the world together and insist on fundamental change in the way in which we're approaching this. >> senator sanders? >> the bottom line here is that in the midst of this crisis, we have got to act in an unprecedented way. and that means every country on earth is going to be affected. every country on earth has got to work together. it also means that we tell the

pharmaceutical industry, we tell the big money that this is not a time for profiteering. this is a time for all of us working together. the world health organization is a very, very strong organization. it is sad that we have a president that has ignore d the international community in so many ways, including in terms of international health crises. >> thank you. obviously, another part of this story is the economy, which is reeling from this pandemic. many economies are warning of a recession. just hours ago the federal reserve cut interest rates to near zero percent, which has not happened since the financial crisis in 2008. vice president biden, what would you do? >> what i would do is make it clear to the world and make it clear to the united states that we are going to have to have a major, major, major bailout package that we do not reward corporations. we reward individuals who in fact are reel put to the test

here. the problem is the policies in this administration economically have eaten a lot of our seed corn here. the ability for us to use levers that are available have been used up by this god awful tax cut of $1.9 trillion, by the fact we have used the fed will be of little consequence now. they have already used what leverage they have and so we're going to have to just level with the american people. here's the deal. we're going to have to not only deal with the immediate crisis, which is the most critical now to let people know their mortgage is going to be paid. their rents are going to be p d paid. they are going to have child care. they are going to make sure all the medical bills are cared for relating to this. we have to go beyond that. and we're going to have be be in a situation where we're meeting on a dilly basis like we did in the middle of the financial crisis to decide how we're going to find the wherewithal and the money to see to it we hold all

these folks harmless. but not do what trump wants to do. he came along and said i got a great idea. >> senator sanders? >> the ebola crisis, in my view, exposes the dysfunctionality of the health care system and how poorly prepared we are despite how much money we spend. the ebola crisis is also, i think, posing the cruelty and the unjustness of our economy today. we have more income and wealth inequality than any time in 100 years. what that means that in the midst of this crisis, if you're a multimillionaire, no one is happy. you're going to get through it. you're going to get everything you need. you're not worried about health care. you're not worried abts income coming in. half of our people are living paycheck to paycheck. we got people who are struggling

working two or three jobs to put food on the table. what's going to happen to them? so the lesson to be learned is we have to move aggressively right now to address the economic crisis as a result of talking -- got ebola in my head. as a result of the virus here, the coronavirus, what we have got to do also is understand the economy and how unjust and unfair it is that so few have so much and so many have so little. >> people are look iing for results, not a revolution. they want to teal with the results they need right now. and we can to that by make iing sure that we make erbe whole who has been so abomination of desolationly hurt. in terms of their lose a job, in terms of not having the ability to care for children, in terms of the health care costs they have relating to the crisis. we can make them whole. now. and put in process a system whereby they are all made whole.

that has nothing to do with the legitimate concern about income inequality. that's real. but that does not affect the need for us to act swiftly and very thoroughly and in concert with all the forces that we need to bring to bear to deal with the crisis now so no one is thrown out of their home. no one losing their mortgage. no one is kicked out of their house. no one loses their paycheck. no one is in a position where they have a significant financial disability as a consequence of this particular crisis. >> thank you, vice president. senator sanders? >> i think it goes without saying that as a nation we have to respond as forcefully as we can to the current crisis. but it is not good enough not to be understanding how we got here and where we want to go into the future. so how does it happen today in

the wealthiest country in the history of the world, half of our people are scared to death. i agree. it was my idea originally to make sure every person in this country is made whole as a result of this crisis. god willing this crisis is going to end. we're going to have to develop an economy in which half of our people are not living paycheck to paycheck and struggling to put food on the table. >> i don't disagree. you were asking about the crisis. what are we going to do about the crisis now, which is incredibly consequential to millions and millions of americans. it's not going to be solved by a change in tax policy now. it's gnot going to be solve ed how we deal with health care. it is going to be solved with an emergency need right now. what do we do? first thing we do is make sure that health care is available by us having the tools to be able

to deal with it. that requires us to go out and do much more than this president has done in terms of planning. secondly, it requires us to be in a position where we're anticipating what will happen in the next month or weeks in terms of the flow into the health care system by bringing the military along, more hospital beds, more training, more equipment, more equipment to save the first responders as well. in addition to that, we then have to also look at what are the immediate needs right today. how about that person who has been laid off today? how about that person who doesn't have an income today? they have to know that tomorrow when the paycheck comes due, you will get that paycheck. and thirdly, we have to think long-term about how we deal with making all those who have been badly damaged right again. and then we move on. then we move on to change the economy in ways that are more profoundly necessary than people think, but do nrespond to the immediate needs. >> thank you. senator sanders, you voted

against bailouts for 2008 financial crisis. many believe those spending bills were a crucial part of stabilize iing the economy back then. would you support billouts for industries that are being crushed by the coronavirus outbreak now? >> i did, you're quite right. i voted against the bailout. because i believed that illegal behavior being done by the people on wall street should not be reward ed by a bailout. and today, those banks are more prosperous and own more assets, by and large, then they did back then. they are bigger now. i thought at the time in the midst of massive income and wealth inequality the people on top who were surtaxed should be bailed out. we gave trillions of dollars in seetzero interest loans to larg banks. but to answer your question where we are right now, we need

to stabilize the economy, but we can't repeat what we did in 2008. joe voted for that. i voted against it. because we have got to do more than save the banks or the oil companies. our job right now is to tell every working person in this country, no matter what your income is, you are not going to suffer as a result of this crisis of which you had no control. >> vice president? >> had those banks gone under, all those people would be in deep trouble. deep, deep trouble. all those little folks, we would have gone out of business. they would find themselves in position where they would lose everything they had in that bank. whether it was $10 or $300 or a savings account. this was about saving an economy. and it did save the economy. and the banks paid back. they paid back with interest. i agree with bernie. someone should have gone to jail. that was i guethe big disagreem had. but the question was they paid back. in addition to that, it also part of that was bailing out the automobile industry. saving thousands of jobs.

tens of thousands of jobs over time. he voted against that as well. >> i did not vote against that. that bailout money was used later on by bush to protect the automobile industry. but here's the point. in terms of that bailout, there are way that you can bail out when you have a handful of people with incredible wealth who are prospering off the illegal behavior of individuals n this case on wall street. you know what you say to them? i said this to the secretary of treasury. you want a bailout, that's fine. have your friends pay for it. not working people. the other point is joe should know. it wasn't just the $700 billion program. the fed gave trillions and trillions of dollars in zero interest loans to every financial institution in this country and central banks all over the world. that was essentially a grant.

because they then could sell that and bring in interest rates much greater than the zero interest loans that they got. >> vice president biden? >> look, the fact of the matter is that if, in fact, the banks all but had gone under, we would be in a great depression. we would have not -- how do you get out of that? bernie is saying that he's going to do a wealth tax or something a at the top 1% could pay for everything. and they should pay for everything that occurred. we are talking about tens and hundreds of billions of dollars. that's what this was about. and the fact was that it saved the economy from going into a depression. after we passed the recovery act, which was the one that got the three votes to get it changed, that had $900 billion in it and was the thing that kept us from going into a great depression. >> i'm going to stay with you, vice president biden. many of the 11 undocumented immigrants and now even many

legal immigrants in the united states are afraid to seek medical help. how do you ensure they feel safe enough to get treatment to help stop the spread of coronavirus? >> anyone who shows up to be tested for coronavirus or gets coronavirus and is treated would be held harmless. just like i have argued all along. any woman who crosses the border or being beaten by her husband but she's undocumented, she cannot be deported because she reports. there are certain things you cannot deport an undocumented person for. and that would be one of them. it's in the interest of everyone. those folks who are out there, it's even in their interest that that woman come forward or that man come forward because it deals with keeping the spread from moving more rapidly. they will not, should not under

any circumstances be held accountable and be deported for that purpose, period. >> i have been criticized because the proposal for medicare for all includes making sure that undocumented people are also covered. and right now, we have the absurd situation where undocumented people who try to do the right thing are sick. they want to go to the doctor. they don't want to spread this disease. they are now standing and thinking about when i.c.e. is going to deport them. so we have to make sure that everybody feels comfortable getting the health care that they need. that should be a general principle above and beyond the coronavirus. second of all, we have to end these terrible i.c.e. raids, which are terrorizing communities all over the country. and thirdly, the time is long overdue for this country to move to comprehensive imfwrags reform and a path towards citizenship for the 11 million undocumented and further more on day one as president i would restore the

legal status of the 1.8. >> we're going to talk about immigration in a minute. but i want to ask about something shast going on now. back to the crisis. we know people over the age of 60 and those with underlying medical conditions, etc. herbally heart disease, lung disease and diabetes are the most vulnerable to coronavirus. and are being asked to change their behavior to protect themselves. so senator sanders, you're 78 years old. you had a heart attack. what are you doing to protect yourself? >> a great deal. last night we had a fireside chat, not a the rally. i love doing rallies and we bring thousands of people out to the rallies. we're not doing that right now. in fact, our entire staff is working from home. so on a personal level, what we're doing is i'm not shaking hands. joe and i did not shake hands. and i'm very careful about the people i am intera acting with. i'm using a lot of soap and hand

sanitizers to make sure that i do not get the infection. and i have to say thank god right now i do not have any symptoms and i feel very grateful for that. >> vice president biden, you're 77. what are you doing to protect yourself? >> fortunately i don't have any of the underlying conditions that you talked about. number one. number two, thank god for the time being, anything can happen, knock on wood, i'm in good health. number three, i'm taking all the precautions anyone would take whether they are 30 years old or 60 or 80 years old. and that is i'm going to make sure that i do not change hands any longer. i do not engage -- we did the same thing. our staff is all working from home. we are not doing rallies. we're doing virtual rallies and virtual town hall meetings. we're in a situation where now i do not -- we encounter people, we're not going into crowds. so i'm take iing all the

precautions everyone else should be taking. i wash my hands god knows how many times a day. i carry with me, in my bag outside here, hand sanitizer. i don't know how many times a day i use that. i make sure i don't touch my face and so on. i'm taking all the precautions we're telling everybody else to take. >> let's turn to the race more broadly. you have each laid out starkly different visions for how to bring about change. vice president biden, senator sanders is calling for a political revolution. you said people want results, thot revolution. make the indication for why a revolution is not what the country needs or wants. >> we have problems we have to solve now. now. what's the revolution going to do? disrupt everything in the meantime? look, bernie talks about -- excuse me, the senator talks about medicare for all. he still hasn't told you how he's going to get it passed. or how there's a possibility of that happening. he hasn't told you how much it's

going to cost. it doesn't kick in for four years even after it passes. we want a revolution, let's act now. pass the booiden health care pl which takes obamacare, restores all the cuts made to it, subsidizes further, provides for lower drug prices, make sure that there's no hidden bills, make sure we invest $50 billion in dealing with underlying diseases that are in great consequence. diabetes, alzheimer's and cancer. a medicare option. we can do that now. i can get that passed. i can get that done, if i'm president of the united states of america. that will be a fundamental change and it happens now. i can tell you from experience being a significant consumer of health care with my sons and my family and all the things we have gone through. what people want is hope and they need it now. not four years from now. and bernie still hasn't told us how he's going to pay for it. >> not quite true. >> senator?

>> let's do something that's very rarely done in the congress. let's do something that the media doesn't do. let's talk about the reality of american life. why is it that over the last 45 years despite the huge increase in productivity and technology the average worker is not making a nickel more? why is it that over the last 30 years the richest 1% have seen a $21 trillion in their wealth. bottom half of american, a decline in their wealth. why is that we are the only major country not to garn teen health care to all people as a human right? why the only major country not to have paid medical and family leave? we give tax breaks to billionaires when half a million people are homeless. it comes down to something we don't talk about. the power structure in america. who has the power? i'll tell you who has the power. it's the people who contribute money. the billionaires who contribute money to political campaigns. who control the legislative

agenda. those people have power. you want to make real changes in this country, if you want to create an economy that works for all, not just a few, if you want to guarantee quality health care for all, you know what you need? you need to take on wall street. you need to take on the drug companies. and the insurance companies and the fossil fuel industry. you don't take campaign contributions from them. you take them on and create an economy that works for all. >> you want to do that, do what i proposed over 30 years ago. federally fund all elections. no private contributions in election process. if you want to do that, join me. maybe you and i can fundamentally change that. and the complication is i've not accepted a contribution of anybody over $2800. not one. my average contribution is $44.

just this month i raised $33 million. average contribution is $51. the idea that this is somehow being fund ed by millionaires. in the the last supertuesday and before that, bernie outspent me 5 to 1 and i still won. i didn't have any money. and i still won. >> senator sanders? >> it's good you had an idea 30 years ago. i don't want to join. you why don't you join me? why don't you get rid of your superpack. pac. i got two other superpacs running ads against us. go on television and say, you know what, in the past, you condemned superpacs. is that correct? >> you get rid of the nine superpacs? >> i don't have any superpacs. come on. give me a break. >> i won't give you a break on

this one. you condemn superpacs. a superpac is running negative ads. here's the point. this is the point. in the richest country in the history of the world, half of our people should not be struggling to put food on the table. and the reason for that is you have a political structure in which big money interest dominate our economy. we're going to move to china and pay people starvation wages there. this is an issue that has got ton ultimately deal with. who has the power in america? are we content with so few exercising so much power when so many people have given up on the political process? >> i proposed a significant change to the tax code and have been proposing it for a long time. number one. number two, it's not just about taxing the super wealthy. it's about making sure everybody

pays their fair share. i can pay for my health care plan by changing the way in which we deal with capital gains. people should pay baseed on their income tax. not 20%. that would pay for my entire health care plan, to cover everyone. everything i call for, i pay for. i do not believe, and i have not supported these exorbitant tax cuts for the wealthy. i strongly opposed the tax cut of $1 trillion. and i said at the time this is all about trying to eliminate the safety net. the idea that bernie implies and says things, speaking of negative ads, you're running an ad saying i'm opposed to social security. it's a flat lie. >> let me ask you a question. you're right here with me. have you been on the floor of the senate, you were in the

senate for a few years. time and time again talking about the necessaity with pride about cutting social security, cutting medicare and veterans programs. time after time, you were not a fan of simpson. >> come on, joe. >> here's the deal. why don't you tell the truth. we all make mismistakes. how i will increase social security. >> that it is paid for. go to joebiden.com and look at my exchange with paul ryan object his desire to try to

privatize and understand how he manipulated an ad. >> let me lrepeat it again. i want you to straight with the the american people. i am saying that you have been on the floor of the senate time and time again talking about the need to cut social security, medicare and veterans programs. how to deal with the deficit. everything was on the table. i didn't support any of those cu cuts. everything was on the table. including in your judgment cuts to social security. >> in order to get kinds of changes we need. you just contradicted yourself.

one minute you said i'm on the floor. it was a reason why i was worried about the deficit. maybe that's good reason or not. you work to cut and advocate for the cuts of programs. >> i did not. i never voted to cut social security. >> not talking about voters. >> look, i voted to protect it. i was just going to look at the debate with paul ryan for the vice presidency. look at what i did. and bernie, will you acknowledge your campaign took out of context the exchange between paul ryan. are you say iing it's wrong? >> did you -- >> wait a minute. i'll answer your question. you answer mine. one more time. were you on the floor for whatever reason talking about the need to cut social security

and medicare? >> no, i did not talk about the need to cut any of those programs. >> all that i would say to the american people, go to youtube. it's all over the place. joe said it many times. i'm surprised you can defend the change your mind on it, but you can't deny the reality. >> senator, because you brought up social security and have been talking about it, i want to ask you about something you wrote in 1996. you remembwere a member of the and wrote, quote, it's clear we will have to make incremental adjustments in social security taxes and benefits. why are your past comments any less relevant than the vice president's? >> i advocated adjustments and have for years. it's among other things increasing the cost of living assistance. you're not going to find me ever calling for cuts to social security. we duststormed by look iing at e

general population instead of the higher cost for prescription drugs and for health care. that's what i was talking about. when joe and others were in admin with the both simpson, i formed along with people like barr a bra boxer the defending social security caucus to say, no. when 20% of seniors trying to get by on $13,000 a year or more, we are not going to cut social security. >> vice president biden, yesterday you endorsed an elizabeth warren plan that would undo key parts of the privacy law you helped pass in 2005. a few hours ago you announced support for making public college tuition free for families who make less than $125,000 a year. what changed? >> two things. number one, let's talk about the

bankruptcy. it was passing overwhelmingly and i improved it. i had a choice. it was going to pass. a republican congress. and i offered two amendments to make sure that people under $50,000 would not be affected and women and children would go to the front of the line on alimony and support payments. that's what i did. i it not like the rest of the bill. but i improved it. number one. number two, i talked with senator warren about her proposal. this is the first opportunity we have had to make substantial change in what we couldn't get done. i supported her proposal. she should get credit for having introduced it. with regard to what we're talking about in terms of college education, i have been say i saying for a long time we're in a position. we need 16 years of education.

the exact bill of a little over a year ago capping it off at $125,000 in income, you could get free up to that point. up to that you have to pay for college education. it only worked for public schools and work for public universities in your state. i support that idea. it was a good idea. and i us support it. so that's what it is. and i'm not saying everything bernie said has been wrong. >> i assume you work on these changes? >> this is a little bit about leadership as well. joe talked about bankruptcy. joe, you helped write that bankruptcy bill. >> i did not. >> that bankruptcy bill, we talked about education. we have 45 million people in america struggling with student debt. some of them really struggling with student debt.

the bankruptcy bill made it impossible, difficult for people to escape from that student debt. it was a very, very bad bill. you said, joe, that a majority of the people voted for it. i voted against it in the house and i was right. and i don't have to rethink my position. that's what leadership is. having the guts to take an unpopular vote. noths just bankruptcy. the different between joe and i is four years ago it was not a popular idea. glad you're coming around now. four years ago i said that public colleges and university should be tuition free. people were saying that's a radical idea. well, you got states and cities and counties all over the country that are moving in that direction. and i'm glad that joe is on board. but what leadership is about is going forward when it's not popular. when it's an idea that you get criticized for. so i'm proud of that fact. and i'm proud of my leadership

on many issues. i talked about raising that $a 15 four years ago. >> go talk to the governor. >> i'm not aware of that. >> four years ago, it was a radical idea. very few people in congress were talking about it. >> look. the bankruptcy bill did not affect student debt for 90%. because the law had already been pass ed. you could not declare bankruptcy for those loans that were from private institutions. you couldn't do it. so the bankruptcy bill didn't affect that. it affected 10% of the people. the first bankruptcy bill. 10% of the student loans. now we're in a position where we're able to correct that problem. if i hadn't stepped up and changed the law as it related to

people making $50,000, those for alimony and chort, that i have would have been in the bucket too. i made it. i did not like the bill. i did not support the bill. i made it clear to the industry i did not like the bill. this bill calls for the opportunity to fundamentally change the mistakes we couldn't correct in the bill the first time around. and that is why i support elizabeth warren's idea. it's a very good idea. >> is this is circular logic. we are going to reform the bill that i voted for. if you hadn't voted for it f you rallied other people as i try to do in the house voting against it, we might not have the problems with it we have to do. whether you're opposition or

support for legislation regarding gay communities and the defense of marriage act. you remember that bill. gay marriage today is considered a little differently than it was 25 years ago. i remember that bill. it was a very hard vote. i voted against it. you voted for it. i voted against the bankruptcy bill, you voted for it. i voted against the war in iraq, which was also a tough vote. you voted for it. i voted against the disastrous trade agreements like nafta, which cost this country over 4 million good-paying jobs. you voted for it. i voted against the height amendment, which denies low income women the right to get an abortion. you have consistently voted for it. i don't know what your position is today, but all that i'm saying is we can argue about the merits of the bill. it takes courage sometimes to

vote and do the right thing. >> you can argue about the past. this man voted against the brady bill five times. background checks. five times. number one. number two, this man is the only one of the few democrats i know who voted to exempt the gun industry from being able to be sue d. talk about a special, special interest. we should be able to sue drug companies. we should be able to sue tobacco. we can't sue gun manufacturers because he voted for that years ago. he said it was a mistake. the question is what do we do from this point on? and by the way, i might add, i'm the first person to go on national television and say i supported gay marriage. i supported gay marriage when asked. and so it started a ripple effect. i'm not taking all credit, but i'm the first major player to say i support gay marriage on national television. >> all i'm saying here is we can

argue this or that bill. but in this time of crisis when we're living in an unsettling world economically, health care, the coronavirus, the people of america know my record. for 30 years i stood with working families of this country. i have taken on every special interest there is out there. and that's what i will do in the white house. that's a totally different record than joe. it's manifested in this campaign when you're getting all this money from wealthy people and billionaires. so i think if you want somebody who will take to the white house what i have done for my whole life. that's take on special

interests. >> let's talk about the future. if you become the normminee, ho will you appeal to supporters of senator sanders when you do disagree on so many issues? >> he's making it hard for me right now. i was trying to give him credit for things. look, i think that i want to make it clear. if bernie is the nominee, i will not only support him, i will campaign for him. and i believe the people who support me will do the same thing. because the threat to the united states of america is donald trump. it's critical. i would hope that bernie would do the same if i'm the nominee and encourage his supporters a as well it's bigger than either of us. character of the nation is on the ballot. it goes well beyond. we both agree we need health care should be a right, not a privilege. we both agree we have to deal with student debt. we both agree we have to deal

with education and access to education. we both agree that we have a new green deal to deal with the threat that faces humanity. we disagree on the detail of how we do it. but we don't disagree on the principle. we fundamentally disagree with this president. this is a man who wants to cut social security. cut medicare. so this is much bigger than whether or not i'm the nominee or bernie is the nominee. we must defeat donald trump. he is the four more years of donald trump will fundamentally change the nature of who we are as a nation. we have to restore this country's soul. that's essential. as long as this president is there, we're not going to be able to. >> can i say a word? >> it's just a quick question. if he is the nominee, you have said you would support him. will you campaign for him? will you urge supporters? >> on day one when i announced

my candidacy, i said this country did not deal with a president who is a pathological liar and doesn't know the constitution of the united states and believes is above the law. who is a racist and sexist. he is the most dangerous president in the history of this country. i i said day one. i hope to win the nomination, but if i don't win the nomination, i and i think every over democratic candidate is prepared to come together to do everything humanly possible to defeat donald trump. but let me respond to something that joe said. with talked about the green new deal. all of these things in general terms, but details make a difference. what i have said throughout this campaign, and i don't think i have heard you say it, if we're going to save this planet for our kids and future generations, we need to have the courage to

take on the greed of the fossil fuel industry and make it clear to them that their short-term profits are not more important than the future of this planet. we have a detailed proposal. happy to get the endorsement of the sunrise movement. >> we're going to get into the green new deal. a quick break. when we come back, the presidential debate will return. stay with us. b whatever is going to come its way. we're always preparing. make sure that the network is working. all the time. we are constantly looking at it, we're constantly monitoring it, take that responsibility very seriously. the most rewarding thing about the work we do is whenever we see a customer able to communicate back to their loved ones. that is why we do what we do. we're relentlessly committed to the network. so in times like this, america can stay connected to work, school, and most importantly, to each other.

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welcome back to the cnn democratic presidential debate. live from washington, d.c. and as we noted, arizona will vote on tuesday. we solicited questions from undecided democratic voters there. one is from amy langfelt a law professor from arizona with a question for senator sanders. >> our access to health care is at risk. women are disproportionate infected by bile requirements, social security cuts issues that affect health.

>> my cabinet, my administrator will look like the last i heard over half of the people in america are women. >> in terms of policies unlike joe, i have consistently believed and have a 100% voting record. >> we have to move aggressively to deal with domestic violence in this country fpz it's 50 or 60 on cents on the dollar. we theed to have universal affordable high quality childcare so women who are

single or married can go off to work and know that their kids are going to be well taken care of. so i think if you look at my agenda, which is on bernie sanders, what you will find is a strong agenda in fighting for the rights of women and incredible political assault by trump and are republican governors across this country. >> number one, i agree with the question and the underlying premise of amy's question. number one, i committed that if i'm elected president to have an opportunity to appoint someone to the courts who will be appointing the first black woman of the courts. it's require d they have representation now. it's long overdue. secondly, if i'm elected president, my cabinet, my administration will look like the country and i commit that i will, in fact, appoint a woman to be vice president.

there are a number of women qualified to be president tomorrow. i would pick a woman to be my vice president is. number three, i'm the guy that wrote the domestic violence law. i'm the guy that put in the prohibitions that no one who abuses someone else should be able to own a gun. period they should not be able to own a gun. i would get the boyfriend exemption amended now. i have gotten it passed that if you are going to stay in a court, you cannot own a gun. no one should be able to own a gun who has abused a woman, period. >> but vice president, just to be clear. you just committed here tonight if you get the nomination your running mate will be a woman. >> yes. >> senator sanders? >> may i respond? >> right now, a woman's right to control her own body is under massive assault.

joe, you have in the past on more than one occasion voted for the height amendment, which says that a woman, low income woman could not use medicaid funding for an abortion. is that still your view? >> it is not my view. it is not my view. everybody who has been in the congress voted for the height amendment at one point or another because it was locked in other bills. the reason why i came out opposed to the amendment is if we're going to have public funding for all health care along the line, there's no way you can allow for there to be a requirement that you have a woman who doesn't have the money could not have coverage under health care. >> i'm glad -- >> number two. i did that awhile ago. number one, number two i would send immediately to the desk of the united states congress when i'm elected, if i'm elected president, a codification of roe v. wade. because i think it's a woman's right to choose. it's a woman's opportunity to be

able to make that decision. and in fact, i have gotten 100%. >> before we move on, -- >> you're a lifetime 100% voting record. >> a as of late has been 100%. i don't know whether it was 25 years ago. >> i mean, one of the differences, not to pick a bone here, is i have been consistent. i have always believed in that. and you have not. i'm glad you have changed your voo views. >> senator, to be clear. the vice president committed toic picking a woman. if you get the nomination, will you? >> in all likelihood, i will. to me, it's not just nominating a woman. it is making sure that we have a progressive woman and there are progress i have women out there. so my very strong tendencies is to move in that direction. >> let's turn now to immigration. vice president biden, you have recently said for the first time that the obama/biden administration made a big

mistake in deporting millions of immigrants, but you didn't publicly speak out against it at the time. what commitment will you make tonight that as president you won't deport millions again? >> number one, i said that it took too long to get it right. the president did get it right by daca as well as making sure he tried to protect parents as well. and by the way, moving on an immigration bill as well. we already had an immigration bill and bernie voted against it. had he voted for t we would have 6 million undocumented citizen ises, as us speak right now. but i will send to the desk immediately a bill that requires the access to citizenship for 11 million undocumented focus, number one. twnumber two, the first 100 day of my administration, no one will be deported a at all. on that point on, the only

deportations that will take place are commissions of felonies in the united states of america. >> so to be clear, only felons get deported and everyone else gets to stay? >> yes. the reason is it's about uniting families, it's about making sure that we can both be a nation of immigrants as well as a nation that is decent. >> let me respond to what joe's comments about 2007 immigration bill. that bill was opposed by the largest la latino organization in america. they called the guess worker program akin to slavery. the bill was killed because it was a vote on the amendment. i think it was 49-48. you know who voted with me? barack obama. he understood that proposal was a bad idea. we don't need slavery in america where guest workers are forced to stay with their employers. but in terms of immigration in

jury rogeneral, let me outline the things we do. we restore the legal status of people. immediately, we end these i.c.e. raids chrks are terrorizing communities all over this country. three, we change the border poli policy. no federal agent will ever grab little babies from the arms of their mothers. and i think we can pass what the american people want and that is comprehensive immigration reform. a path towards citizenship. >> to suggest positions like this send a message that when a democrat is in the white house, the border is open. do they? >> no, that's what trump says. that's a total lie. what we're talking about is a humane, sensible policy supported by the american people. nobody is talking about open borders. and of course, trump lies a about that. but the bottom line is right now you have in this country people

who have been here for decades. they are working hard. they are raising their kids. they are an important part of our agricultural economy. these are good people. yet they are living in terror. we have to end that terror and end the i.c.e. raids and move toward a path towards smi citizenship. >> let me set the record straight. the idea that it was slavery, barack obama supported that bill, that immigration bill. kennedy supported that immigration bill. i supported it pit doubt whether those people think it's slavery. and by the way, right after his vote against that, he went on the lou dobbs show and continued to take jobs from americans. which is one of the republicans. you think ted kennedy is for slavery?

we can deal with securing the border. >> they are coming through ports of entry. we don't need a wall. and by the way, i would immediately as president surge to the border. i would end this notion for the first time in history. and is desperate situation. they should be able to come to the united states and have a judgment made. >> no one would be ut in jail while waiting for their hearing. >> it's kind of what i have been saying throughout the entire campaign.

>> we need to deal with those based on international law. we need not to be dividing children from their parents and dividing families up. we need a humane border policy. and i'll tell you what else we need. i speak as the son of an immigra immigrant. didn't have much of an education. i will end the ugly demonization of the white house of the immigrant community in this country. we have a president who is trying to divide us up. it bricks people together. native american and asian-american. >> vice president biden, you opposed sanctuary cities as a presidential candidate in 2007. where did you stand now? should undocumented immigrants by police be turned over to immigration officials? >> no.

>> senator sanders? >> of course, not. one of the things that goes on when you have that process, is that not only the psychological terror, i have talked to these kids. kids are scared to death when they come from school their mom or dad may not be there. maybe deported. what we need to do is to end, ask i will end this on day one, the i.c.e. raids that i have been so harmful to so many people. and we need to do again what the american people want us to do. i'm the son of an immigrant. this is a country significantly built by immigrants. we have to appreciate each other and end this demonization come ing from the trump administration. >> senator sanders? >> we are a nation of immigrants. our future rests upon the latino

community being fully integrated. the idea that any american thinks it doesn't pay for us to significantly invest in their future is absolutely a bizarre notion because if we do not invest, everything that the very wealthy are concerned about will, in fact, get worse, not better. we should be embracing, bringing them in. just like what happened with the irish imgrants after the fam in. we have been through this before. zen phobia is a disease. >> thank you, vice president biden. let's move to the climate crisis. the world health organization call it is a health crisis. and warns that climate change could fuel the spread of infectious diseases. can you foint point to specific measures in your climate plan

that address that threat? >> of course, we do. this is what the scientists are telling us. the same scientists who make your point. but they are telling us if we don't get our act together in the next seven or eight years, there would be irreversible damage done to this planet. we're talking about cities in america from miami to new orleans to charles ston, south carolina, being under water. we are talking about severe droughts, which will prevent farmers from growing the food that we need. we're talking about extreme weather disturbances, which houston, texas, just a few months ago. we are talking about the absolute need, and i want to hear joe's position on this, this is not a middle of the ground thing. this is not building a few more solar panels or a few more wind turbines. what this is about is transforming our energy system as quickly as we humanly can

away from fossil fuel. it is insane that we continue to have fracking in america. it is absurd that we give tens of billions of dollars a year in tax breaks and subsidies to the fossil fuel industry. this has got to end and end now if we love our kids and future gent kragss. >> first thing that president obama were summoned to the state department -- excuse me, the defense department is to meet with all the chiefs. the single greatest threat is climate change to our snasnatio security. as populations have to move buzz they can no longer live where they are because their identisl are sinking, because you saw what happened with the change of weather patterns. it causes war. it causes great migrations. they say that's the single biggest problem. number two, there's an awful lot of people today who are, in fact, getting ill because of the changes in the environment, particularly up where bernie lives, it has nothing to do with

him, but up in the northeast because you have everything from beetle infestation and a whole range of things causing disease in addition to eliminating fo foilage. >> let me ask you then. you talk about this being the number one crisis. they told you at the pentagon. the price tag for your climate plan is $1.7 trillion. that's about $14 trillion less than senator sanders wants to spend. is your plan ambitious nuf? >> yes, it is. if you go to joebooiden.com, i y out the first 13 things i would do immediately upon being elected. number one, we're going to reinstate all the cuts the president made in the standards for automobiles, investing in light rail, so we take cars off the road, making sure we're in a position where we are now in a position that we put 500,000 charging stations in areas that,

in fact, all new highways that we built. making sure that we spend $500 billion a year in the federal government paid for transportation for the vehicles we run. all of those being converted to be able to run on low carbon fuel or no carbon fuel at all by having thunderstorm move into a direction that is all carbon free. we can do these things we can lay down the tracks where nothing can be changed by the next president or following president. the one beyond that. in addition to that, we also have to, i would immediately rejoin the paris climate accord, which i helped put together. i would call the 100 nations, to the united states in the first 100 days to up the ante and make it clear that, in fact, if they didn't, there would be a price

to pay. and lastly, i would be right now organizing the hemisphere and the world to $20 billion for the amazon for brazil no longer to burn the amazon. and us say this is what we're going to do. they absorb more carbon in the amazon than we emit in one entire year per year. >> thank you. senator sanders? >> all well and good, but nowhere near enough. you mention ed we started this debate talking about a war-like situation in terms of the coronavirus. we said we have to act accordingly. you said it. you're right. i said it. we have to act dramatically, boldly, if werth going to save lives. i look at climate change in exactly the same way. it's not a question of reentering the paris accord. that's fine. who cares. not a big deal. the deal right now is do we have the courage? this gets back to the point i'm trying to make all night long.

do we take on the health care industry and tail light them their profits are not more important than health care for all. do we take on the fossil fuel industry? in terms of the fossil fuel industry, these guys have been lying for years. like the tobacco industry lied 50 years ago. we don't know if fossil fuels, if oil and carbon emissions are causing climate change. they knew. they knew. but this is an issue of enormous consequence. what joe is saying is nowhere near enough. it's not a question of money. we have time to talk about this. this is a world changing event. >> you want to give him a chance to respond. but we're ta staying on this issue. >> no more subsidies for the fossil fuel industry. no more drilling including offshore. no ability for the oil industry to continue to drill period. it ends. number two, we're in a situation

as well where we cannot -- we are a able to move rapidly to change the dynamic in terms of what we can do to set in motion. the fact that he says lclimate change, paris accord doesn't mean much. we can get everything exactly right. we're 15% of the problem. 85% of the problem is over there. we need someone who can deal internationally. we need someone to bring the world together again. we need someone who move in a direction that, in fact, if you violate the commitment you make, you will pay an economic price for it. like what's happening in chi in. they are exporting coal. >> obviously, the paris accord is useful. but it doesn't go anywhere -- if you're laughing, you're missing the point. this is crisis. >> bingo. >> i'm talking about stopping fracking as soon as possible. i'm talking about tell iing the

fossil fuel industry that they are going to stop destroying this planet. no ifs, buts, maybes about it. >> so am i. >> i'm not sure your proposal does that. i'm talking about speaking to china, rush yarks the countries all over the world. and in this moment, making the point that instead of spending $1.8 trillion on weapons of destruction designed to kill each other, maybe we should pool our resources and fight our common enemy, which is climate change. i know your heart is in the right place, but this requires dramatic, bold action. we have to take on the fossil fuel industry. your plan does not do that. >> my plan takes on the fossil fuel industry and unites the world 3 you just got finished saying. what's he going to do? he's going to bring these countries together and plak it clear to them. i'm saying we make them live up to the commitments. if they don't, they pay a financial price for it. they pay an economic price for it. because we can do everything.

my state is three feet above sea level. i don't need a lecture on what's going to happen about rising seas. i know what happens. i watched the whole peninsula just like it is in south carolina is. something i know a little bit about. i wrote the first climate change bill in the congress that was called a game changer. i came along and said that we're going to trade. we'll forgive debt if you don't cut down your forest. i have been way ahead of this curve. the idea that bernie found this out is amazing to me. >> bernie didn't find it out. bernie is listening to the scientists. you're talking about making countries around the world tul fill their commitments. those commitments are not enough. what this moment is about, joe, is that the scientists are telling us they underestimated the severity of the crisis. they were wrong. the problem is more severe. so all that i'm saying right here is that we are fighting for

the future of this planet, for the well-being of our kids and future generations. you cannot continue, as i understand, joe believes to continue fracking. continue me if i'm wrong. what we needed to right now is bring the world together, tell the fossil fuel industry that we are going to move aggressively to win solar, sustainable energies. >> thank you, senator. >> no new fracking. by the way, on the ror ri act, i was able to make sure we inve invested $90 billion in making sure we brought down the price of solar and wind that is lower than the price of coal. that's why not another new coal plant will be built. number one. number two, we're in a situation where we, in fact, have the ability to lay down the tracks where no one can change the dynamic. and that's why we should be talking about things like i have been talking about for years. high speed rail, taking millions

of automobiles off the road. making sure we move in a direction where no more drilling on federal lands, making sure that we invest in changing the entire fleet of the united states military. >> thank you. i want to talk to you about fracking. because you want to ban fracking, which a method of extracting natural gas. the shift away from goal has resulted in reduced carbon emissions. so how can the u.s. transition to your targeted goal of zoo row emissions with fracking completely out of the picture? >> we have to invest in unprecedented way. you started off by saying we're talking about a $13 trillion investment that's a lot of money. i have been criticized for that. i don't know what the alternative is. we have to be dramatic. and what being dramatic is massive investments in wind, in

solar. in sustainable energies in general in research and development and making our buildings all over this country. we can put millions and millions of people to work making our buildings energy efficient. moving our transportation system to electricity. so what we're talking about is a massive unprecedented investment. that is what the green new deal is about. i supported it. i will fight to implement it. >> thank you so much. we're going to be back with more from the cnn democratic presidential debate. stay with us. you can't claim that as a dependent!

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welcome back to the cnn democratic presidential debate. on tuesday voters in arizona, ohio, illinois and florida will pass their votes in the democratic primary. >> thank you, jake. let's move now to foreign pol y policy. senator sanders, there are about 1.5 million cuban-americans living in florida right now. why would they vote for you when they hear you praise a program of castro, who tortured and killed thousands of cubans? >> i have opposed authoritari

authoritarianism when it's in cuba, saudi arabia, china or whether it is in russia. that is my life record. i believe unlike the president of the united states in democracy, not authoritarianism in cuba or any place else. what i believe right now in this world is that we are faced with a global crisis and a movement toward authoritarianism. that's what pugh tin in russia is leading. that's what saudi arabia is lead ing. as of the of the united states, unlike donald trump, i would put the flag down and say that in this country and in this world, we have got to move toward democracy and human rights. that is my view and has always been my view. >> to be clear, senator sanders, cuba has been a dictatorship for decades. shouldn't we judge dictators by the violation of human rights and not by any of their alleged achievements? >> i think you can make the same

point about china. china is undoubtedly an authoritarian society. but would anybody deny any economist deny that extreme poverty today is less than what it was 40 or 50 years ago than today? that's a fact. we condemn authoritarianism wherever it is. but to simply say that nothing ever done by any of those administrations had a positive impact on their people, would i think be incorrect. >> vice president biden, you have criticized sanders for praising castro. but in 2016 president obama said cuba made, kwquote, a great progress in educating people. and its health care system is a huge achievement they should be congratulated for. how is that different than what senator sanders has said? >> he was trying to change cuban policy so the people would get

out of the thumb of castro and his brother. that is to change the policy to impact on cuba's policy by get ing them opened up. that was what that was about. but praising of cuba, the praising just now of china, china is an authoritarian dictatorship. that's what it is. we have to deal with them because they are there. but the idea that they, in fact, have increased the wealth of people in that country is marginal the change that's taken place. they have a million muslims in prison camps in the west. you see what's happening in hong kong today by the way, the idea that he praised the soviet union when it was the soviet union about the things that they had done well. they are an awful dictatorship killing millions and millions of people. in addition to that, we have a circumstance where after the election was all over, we knew what was done by the russians now in interfere iing with the

elections. this man voted against sanctioning russia for interference in our elections. i don't get it. >> what you don't get, this is exactly what the problem with politics is about. the question. did china make progress in ending extreme poverty over the last 50 years? >> that's like saying jack the riper -- >> this is the problem. >> yes, it is. >> this is the problem. we can't talk -- us dote china is terrible and awful. nothing is good. but the fact of the matter is china is an authoritarian region. by the way, the question that was asked, barack obama, president obama was more generous in his praise of what cuba did in health care and education than i was. i was talking about a program 60 years ago in the first year of the castro revolution. so the bottom line is that i think it's a little bit absurd,

if it you're going to lock at the world the way it is, of course, we're opposed to authoritariani authoritarianism. before it was -- it was good idea. i was condemning the dictatorship in saudi arabia when a lot of other people in washington weren't. i was condemning the uae. you were not. >> vice president biden? >> the idea of occasionally saying something nice about a country is one thing. the idea of praising a country that is violating human rights around the world is, in fact, makes our allies wonder what's going on. what do you think the south koreans think when he praises china like that? what do you think the australians believe in the shadow of china. what do you think it happening in indonesia in the shadow of chi china. words matter. these are flat out dictators. period.

they should be called for it. straight up. we may have to work out, for example, i was able to help negotiate a new start agreement with russia. not because i like putin. >> sticking with foreign policy, you acknowledge that your support and vote for the iraq war was a mistake. what lessons did you learn from that mistake? and is how might those lessons influence your foreign policy decision making as president? >> i learned i can't take the word of a president when, in fact, they assured me they would not use force. remember the context. the context was the united nations security council is going to vote to insist we allow inspectors in to determine whether or not they were producing nuclear weapons or weapons of mass destruction. they were not. what's the first thing that happened when we got elect ed? president obama turned to me and said, get those troops out of there. i was responsible for getting 150,000 troops out of iraq.

14 years ago it was a mistake. i'm prepared to compare my foreign policy credentials up against my friend here on any day of the week, every day of the week. >> let's start off with the war in iraq. i was in the house. i understood -- by the way, let's be clear about what that vote was. you were there at the signing ceremony with bush. everybody in the world knew that when you voted for that resolution, you were giving bush the authority to go to war. everybody knew that's exactly what he and cheney wanted to do. most people who followed that issue closely understood that the bush administration was lying through its teeth with regard to saddam hussein having weapons of mass destruction. i was on the noor of the house time and time again. but the issue is not just the war in iraq. that was a long time ago. the issue is the trade agreement. it wasn't so easy to lead the

effort against disastrous trade agreements. the issue was the bankruptcy bill that you supported. the issue was the defense of marriage act. the issue is whether or not in difficult times, god knows these are difficult times, we're going to have the courage to take on powerful special interests and do what's right for working families in this country. >> why did you vote not to sanction the russians? >> because you keep talking about iran. that was tied to iran. russia was in iran. they indicated support for what i did. that was undermining the iranian agreement. >> that's not true. >> that's the only reason. i have condemned russia time ask time again. >> vice president biden? >> the fact is that the idea that i, in fact, supported the things that he suggested is not accurate. look, i'm the guy that helped put together the iran deal and

got the inspectors in there. that was my chief of staff was the guy, my foreign policy guy doing that negotiation. i was the guy that helped put together a 60-nation organization to take on the isis in iraq is and syria. i have dealt with these folks. i know what they are like. i know who the good guys are and who the bad guys are. the fact is this -- bernie's notion about how he embraces folks like cuba and the former soviet union and talks about the fwod things in china, it's contrary to every message we want to send. >> senator sanders? >> i have led the effort against all forms of authoritarianism, including america's so-called allies in the uae and in saudi arabia. a as you may know, work with conservative republicans to

utilize for the very first time the war powers act to get the united states out of the horrific war in yemen led by saudi arabia. that's what i did. so my view is that in a world moving toward authoritarianism, the united states has got to be the leader where people all over the world look to us for guidance. >> thank you. gentlemen, i want to ask each of you about your vulnerabilities in this election. senator sanders has won more of the hispanic vote so far. in fact, he doubled your support in california among hispanics. he almost tripled it in nevada. so why is your message not resinating with hispanic voters? >> my message is resinating across the board. every single state we have been in there's been a significant turnout. in virginia turnout was up 70%. he didn't bring them out. i brought them out. and number two, look what's happened in mississippi.

look what's happened in north carolina and washington state. look what's happened across the board. why am i winning ul those places? what's the reason? the reason is because they know i am a democrat with a capital "d" who believes our base is the bis of the democratic party, which are hard working men and women who are, in fact, high school educated, african-american and all minorities. suburban women, people who have a sense of our place in the world. that's why i'm winning not just winning, but overwhelmingly winning. not even close in these clplace. >> senator sanders, let me follow up with you about an issue you're having for the second consecutive presidential election. you're struggling to gain wide support from african-americans. why is your message not resinating with african-american voters? >> here is what i believe is happening. this is an important point.

and why i decided to run for president. i think it's imperative that we defeat trump pit think our campaign of a biracial, multigenerational grass roots movement is the way to do it now we have won some states. joe has won more states than i have. but here's what we are winning. we are winning the ideological. even states in mississippi, it turns out that a majority of the folks there believe in medicare for all. that's true in almost every state in this country. the orr issue is we are winning the generational struggle. depending on the state, we're winning people 50 years of age or younger. people 30 years of age and younger. i frankly have any doubts. if i lose this thing, joe, i will be there for you. but i have my doubts about how you win a general election against trump it will be a tough

opponent. unless you have energy, excitement, the largest voter turnout in history. to do that, you are going to have to bring young people who are not great voters. they don't vote in the kinds of number thas should into the political process. you're going to have to bring latinos, who are great people that we need, but also don't vote in the numbers we need. i have my doubts that biden's campaign can generate that energy and excitement and voter turnout. >> i will do that. and by the way, let's get this straight. the energy and excitement that's taken place so far has been for me 70% turnout increase in virginia. i can go down the list. they are coming out for me. i didn't even have the money to compete with this man in those states. i virtually had no money. the press kept saying, biden has no money. they were right. biden had no money. the idea why are they doing that? the reason they are doing that is i know what has to happen. i know what needs to be done.

and by the way, the idea that everybody supports medicare for he's yet to know exactly. so here's my point. people don't know the detail at all. and the fact is i am winning overwhelmingly among democratic constituencies across the board. we'll be right back. d, sill: won't it sink?! alright, i'm going to get back to you. i'm going to get back. people ask me what sort of person should become a celebrity accountant. and, i tell them, "nobody. nobody should." there's nothing wrong with liking privacy, but i just don't think you need a separate private plane. but i, but i want it! you can't claim that as a dependent! because it's inanimate! that's what the pay me for. not enough, though. not nearly enough. hey, buddy. what's the damage?

i bought it! the waterfall? nope! a new volkswagen. a volkswagen?! wow! i think we're having a breakthrough here! welcome to caesar's palace. wait, you're in vegas? sure looks like it! wha-, what, what? what are you doing back there? ♪ ♪ ♪ enjoy 90 days free. learn more at quibi.com.

welcome back to the cnn/univision democrtic presidential debate. finally, gentlemen, thanks so much for everything. as we end here tonight, let's return to the coronavirus which does not discriminate based on ideology, it does not care if one is a democrat, a republican, a conservative, a liberal, an independent. what's your concern about those affected by or dealing with the coronavirus? >> our hearts go out to everyone. we need to move aggressively to make sure that every person in this country who has the virus, who thinks they have the virus, understands they'll get all the health care that they need because they are americans, that we move aggressively to make

sure that the test kits are out there, that the ventilators are out there, that the icu units are out there, that the medical personnel are out there. jake, if i may also say, in this moment of economic uncertainty in addition to the coronavirus, it is time to ask how we get to where we are, not only our lack of preparation for the virus, but how we end up with an economy where so many of our people are hurting at a time of massive income and wealth inequality. it's time to ask the question of where the power is in america. who owns the media? who owns the economy? who owns the legislative process? why do we give tax breaks to billionaires and not raise the minimum wage? where do we pump up the oil industry while a half million people are homeless in america? this is a time to move aggressively, dealing with the

coronavirus crisis, dealing with the economic fallout. but it is also time to rethink america and create a country where we care about each other rather than a nation of greed and corruption which is what is taking place among the corporate elite. >> thank you, senator sanders. vice president biden, what's your closing message tonight for those concerned about, affecting by or dealing with this virus? >> number one, as i said at the outset, i just can't imagine what people are going through right now who have lost someone already. i can't imagine what people are going through when they have a mom, for example a good friend of ours is sitting outside the window of a nursing home where her mom is because she can't go in, trying to do sign language to her mom through the window to be able to talk to her. i can't imagine -- i guess i can imagine the fear and concern people have. number one, one of the things that i think we have to

understand is that this is an all hands on deck. as someone said, maybe it was you, jake, at the outset, this is bigger than any individual. this is bigger than yourself. this is about america. this is about the world. this is about how we bring people together and make the kind of sacrifices we need to make to get this done. so first and foremost what we have to do is start to listen to the science again. as i said, what we did, we met -- what i would be doing today, i would be sitting down in the situation room literally every day like we did at the outset of other crises we had when we were in the white house and pulling together the best people, not just in the united states but the world, to say what are the prescriptive moves we have to take now to lessen this virus terror be, to beat i to the point where we can careful more lives, get more people tested, get more people the kind of care we need. and what do we do beyond that to make sure that the economic

impact on them is in fact rendered harmless, that we in fact make sure every paycheck is met, every paycheck that the people are going to miss, that we keep people in their homes, they don't miss their mortgage payments, they don't miss their rent payments, making sure they'll be able to take care of education, and by the way, the schools are closing down right now. there's so many things we have to do. in addition to that, what we have to do is we have to have the best science in the world telling what can stay open and what need be closed. closing schools means not being able to provide lunches to people who need the school lunch program to get by. the idea that we can close any place, i can understand the decision made to close places where 150 people or more gather. but how do you keep open the drugstore to make sure you can get your prescription? how do you deal with things that necessarily have to be kept

going and what's the way to do that? there should be a national standard for that. it should be coming out of the situation room right now. by the way, the single most significant thing we can do to deal with the larger problem down the road of income inequality, is get rid of donald trump. donald trump has exacerbated every single one of these problems, both the immediate urgent need and how we're going to hold people harmless for the damage done as a consequence of this virus. it's important we do both. >> vice president biden, senator sanders, we want to thank you for for being here tonight under these challenging and trying circumstances. we wish both of you the best. our thanks as well to our partners at univision. thanks so much for watching. please stay healthy, stay safe. our coverage of tonight's debate and the coronavirus continues now with anderson cooper. jake, thanks very much. there you have it, the

cnn/univision debate, joe biden, bernie sanders, and the unwelcome coronavirus. the candidates acknowledged it in their final remarks, also at the beginning, greeting each other with an elbow bump, not the usual handshake or hug, then stepping up to podiums that were six feet apart. >> then there were moments when these two gentlemen seemed to be a world apart about the pandemic and how to address it, obviously that was heavy in the air. they both said, listen, we have to think about the coronavirus right now, we got the breaking news from the cdc limiting gatherings to 50 or under, how does that square with primaries going forward? we also got word from the pentagon that the first american sailor has tested positive. we're seeing what should be expected, anderson, it's going to grow and grow and move through every aspect of society. >> yeah, it's been an extraordinary day, a momentous night, a debate unlike any we've seen, vice president biden

committing to having a woman as vice president, bernie sanders saying he likely would. back with us is david chalian, gloria borger, david axelrod. david, you've seen a lot of debates, i don't think you've seen one quite like this. >> no, i don't think we've had one under these circumstances. i thought the opening of the debate which obviously focused on the crisis was the strongest segment that we've seen from joe biden in 11 races. he looked like a guy who was in command, who knew what needed to be done, who spoke to the problem with clarity and self assurance. and it was a very, very strong hour, really, for him. i think it was sort of a tale of two debate. bernie sanders clearly came understanding the numbers in this race. this really wasn't about the primary race in many ways. it was about bernie sanders saying, these are the issues my people care about, how are you

going to address them and bring them into the fold. and i think that biden was still fighting the last war in the second hour, and didn't pick up on those cues on climate change and a few other issues. so in that sense it was a missed opportunity because he could have paved the way for unifying the party moving forward after tuesday when presumably he will amass delegates enough to persuade sanders. but he may not. it may be harder to do because he didn't take advantage of those moments. >> gloria, biden did seem to get off track when senator sanders began more aggressively going after his record. >> sure. he took the bait. and honestly, i don't see why he should have. he had a very strong debate. it was a substantive debate. bernie sanders was clearly trying to use this crisis to expose the health care system in this country and to talk about his medicare for all and the unjustness of the society in

terms of the economy. sanders had a plan, he was attacking biden, biden should have just said go away, but he did take that bait. howeverly say i thought biden was really strong. if people were watching for somebody they could trust in a time of crisis, somebody who understands their families, biden is mr. empathy. at the end when he tells the story of a good friend of ours sitting outside a nursing home window trying to make signs to her parent so she could communicate even though she is not allowed in, people understand, that is going on all over the country. and biden over and over again said, this is bigger than us, this is bigger than america, this is about the world and how we interact with each other. and i think that's a point that according to polling, people trust biden on. so while i don't think this changed the race in a very dramatic way, i think he managed to reinforce a lot of what people like about him.

>> david chalian, it's rare to see more of a conversation debate -- there were debate moments of time being cut off and the like, but it was much more of a conversation and it definitely helps biden in terms of not stumbling over facts or figures or trying to get a point in when all other people are yelling. it's a format that seemed to suit him. >> yeah, when you get down to two people, especially two people who have a fundamentally different investigation, you do get a real robust conversation. having the time to be able to do that so you're not trying to make sure that 11 or 10 people on the stage have fair time, it makes a big difference. i will say, in addition to the empathy piece that gloria is talking about, the other thing that i think biden displayed in that first hour is a command of government and what it can do and how it can be deployed here. everything from not just what the president could do in a given moment, but the use of the

military, that biden fully committed to using in a way that sanders seemed less certain. so that notion of a commander in chief, somebody who's been in government and knows how to deploy it i think was really on display. i will note, though, what is so fascinating to me politically about this debate, the delegate math in this race has made clear that this race for the democratic nomination has ended to some degree. it's come to a close, just by pure numbers of the delegate math. what this debate proved to me, what i think it sort of showed to democratic voters there is that what is entirely unclear is how this democratic nomination race actually does come to a close, despite the delegate math. what david was saying about the piece of bringing the party together, when this nomination race gets down to one, when bernie sanders presumably is the one that departs at some point, i think that remained a mystery tonight, because despite the --

in advance of the debate, here's an olive branch from joe biden, i'm going to join elizabeth warren on bankruptcy, i'm going to join bernie sanders on free college, that wasn't the tone of tonight. bernie sanders was still unloading on joe biden's record, which surprised me, and joe biden was still engage ing with bernie sanders. >> he was aggressive, he did push biden on -- to me the biggest issue was the 2005 bankruptcy bill as well as on social security and health care. what i found interesting was phrases that bernie used when he said, i know your heart is in the right place. so he was clearly i think trying to push him policy-wise more towards where he sees his supporters line up. but he wasn't going in for the kill with biden, which is something that you may have assumed considering that he is so far down in the delegates. i think it's because sanders has repeatedly said over and over

again that he is going to ultimately support the nominee and there's a different tone from sanders versus 2016. >> yes. >> it's very clear that sanders views biden in a way that he didn't view hillary clinton. it's been widely reported that he considers biden, or did, more of a friend when they worked in the senate together and he felt as though biden has constantly been kind to him. so it's a different dynamic. >> the night really has a dual context. i want to shift focus right now to the coronavirus, we have breaking news on that as well as the plans that each candidate laid out tonight for addressing the pandemic. moments before the debate, the cdc published new guidelines on limiting certain events. and i'm quoting now, cdc in accordance with its clients for large events and mass gatherings recommends that for the next eight weeks, organizers, whether groups or individuals, cancel or postpone in-person events that consist of 50 people or more throughout the united states, throughout the whole country,

they're saying. we should note the guidelines do not apply to day to day operations of schools, institutes of higher learning, or businesses. still, it is a big change. if in fact executed by people around the country, would be a major, a major shift for a lot of people in their lives. the backdrop to all of this, nearly 3,500 cases now in this country, 65 people have died so far. with that i want to bring in our chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta. the cdc issued these new guidelines saying cancel or postpone in-person events that consist of 50 people or more throughout the united states. is that enough? how much could that actually help contain the spread? >> well, i think it can go a fair distance towards containing the spread. i think the bigger thing here, anderson, is we're final getting some specifics around some of this. people have been told that social distancing is important. i think so far it's been sort of

ad hoc, big organizations, communities, even states sort of trying to figure out what that means, how to handle that. this is an arbitrary number, 50 people. i think it goes a long way because it gives a sensitive importance to people who have heard about the coronavirus but are really starting to pay attention, hearing what's happening with the nba, hearing what's happening with their own schools and things like that. now you're hearing from the federal government, every single place in the country should not have a gathering of 50 or more people. frankly maybe that's still too many people. again, i think that's an arbitrary people, it's tough to figure out. the challenge with gatherings is obviously the virus can spread. the challenge with gatherings also is then those people disburse and go to where they came from and then you have to figure out who did all those people come in contact with. there have been several conferences now and those type of things where we've seen outbreaks, these mini clusters

of coronavirus occur. i think that's what they're trying to address here, anderson. >> sanjay, we're also just now learning new york city will limit all bars and restaurants to takeout and delivery. all theaters, nightclubs are ordered to close. the mayor is going to sign that executive order that goes into effect tuesday. so again, this is just -- this has been sort of a cascading effect, but this is an extraordinary thing, all restaurants and bars, only able to delivery and takeout. that's -- in new york city, it's extraordinary. >> it's extraordinary, and for a lot of people who live there, this will be the first time they've ever experienced something like this. obviously it's a significant decision because of the impact on that entire food industry. but anderson, one thing that you and i have talked about now a couple of weeks and i think bears repeating is that this isn't a linear thing, these social distancing measures. they don't trigger, like you get

this far back and it triggers, or you go this far back and it triggers another thing. if you're going to do these types of social distancing measures, you've got to do them early. there's been all sorts of studies done on this, they model this. a thing to keep in the back of the mind is once the number of people infected in this country is around 1%, then a lot of these social distancing measures don't really work anymore or they don't work as well, at least. >> because -- >> because you already have too many people out there and no matter what, too many people out there who have the infection, so even if you try and sort of distance them apart it's very hard to break the cycle of transmission. what are you trying to do with social distancing? keep people a certain distance apart. the virus has a hard time moving from person to person and eventually the virus will start to peter away. if a lot of people have the infecting, the impact of social distancing diminishes. the point is it's not like as you go along, you wait 'til it

gets further along to sort of apply more significant measures. if you think you're going to apply these measures at all, it's best to apply them early. and that way, maybe it's eight weeks now as opposed to, you know, a longer time later on. it's a little counterintuitive but it's really important i think to understand that point. >> sanjay, thank you very much. obviously we'll be checking in with you and all our medical team all throughout the evening. there's a lot going on right now. back now with the panel. this is uncharted waters just not only as a society for us and on a health standpoint but also politically for these candidates, for this upcoming race, how this affects primaries. cities are saying don't gather. do people then go out and vote and stand in line and are they three to six feet apart? >> david chalian has sensibly been asking this question just about every hour, whether these

primaries can go forward. and obviously it raises a question, if the guidance is no more than 50 people, often that number of people can gather at polling places. what you're hearing from the governors is, well, there's been so much early voting in these states that we don't expect those kind of crowds. but, you know, it will be interesting to see how the next 36 hours play out. one of the questions i got back from one of the governors is, well, if we don't do it now, when will we do it and what happens to all the millions of early votes that have been cast, are we going to wait months to count these votes? it's very, as you say, uncharted waters, no one knows quite what to do. that's why they're eager to get this round over with. the later states have postponed elections. >> george was originally scheduled for next tuesday, that's the been postponed to late may. louisiana, the democratic primary there was supposed to be later and it has been postponed

to june. so you are seeing some examples. to your point, anderson, about a cascading effect, i find it hard to believe in this environment that we're in right now, with still 36 hours to go before polls open, that the idea of proceeding as planned, it doesn't seem like anything in society is proceeding as planned right now. i'll be surprised if these elections do as well. >> we'll have more from our team here. we'll go back to chris in new york. >> look, it's a fascinating conversation, in real time, as anderson was talking with his panel, we get an alert on the huge change in new york city, which will be living in a way we've never really seen. i have van jones, kirstin powers, governor terry mcauliffe. who made the most of the moment where we are tonight? >> in the middle of a pandemic, the healer has real