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good evening. tonight with the coronavirus death toll approaching 47,000, the white house appears to be choosing political science over even simple truth. today, the government doctor, who was until just days ago in charge of the federal vaccine effort, sought whistle-blower protection. he said he was sidelined because he chose science over unproven and potentially deadly drugs favored by president trump. and rick bright, that's his name, rick bright's sudden removal from his job as director of the biomedical advanced resear research authority called barta. also, according to new reporting tonight in the "wall street journal," threatening to fire another. and, this evening, yet another scientist was forced to publicly attempt to backtrack on something he, himself, admits he said. the director of the centers for

disease control and protection was brought to the podium late today by the president to dis w disavow his own words. this is what robert redfield said to the "washington post" if a second virus hits during flu season. made headlines around the world. in fact, dr. redfield liked the article enough to promote it on twitter. as you can see from his tweet, he tweeted out a link to that article last night. and here is part of what he said in that article. quote, there is a possibility that the assault of the virus on our nation next winter will actually be even more difficult than the one we just went through. and when i said this to others, they kind of put their head back. they don't understand what i mean. end quote. so, again, he tweeted out a link to the story hablast night. now, little less than 24 hours later, the president said r

redfield was misquoted and that he didn't actually mean what his words actually said but they did. let's listen. >> i didn't say that this was going to be worse. i said it was going to be more -- or more difficult and, potentially complicated because we'll have flu and coronavirus circulating at the same time. the key to my comments and the reason that i really wanted to stress them was to appeal to the american public to embrace the flu vaccine with confidence. one of the greatest tools we have as we go through the fall/winter season that we're into is to get the american public to embrace the influenza vaccine and, there by, minimize the impact of flu to be the co-respiratory disease that we confront. >> okay. so just to be absolutely clear, in introducing dr. redfield, the president said he took issue with the way the piece was headlined, which he called totally fake. it originally read "cdc director

warns second wave of coronavirus this winter will likely be worse." it now reads cdc director warns second wave of coronavirus is likely to be even more devastating. neither of which appear to inaccurately characterize what dr. redfield actually said which is that the next wave could be more difficult than this one. in any case, the president can say, as he did at the briefing, the doctor was misquoted but when asked about precisely that tonight, dr. redfield, at the podium, took issue with the way the piece was headlined but admitted that he was accurately quoted. again, just to remind you and not to let falsehood have the last word here again is what he said. quote. there is a possibility the assault of the virus on our nation next winter will actually be even more difficult than the one we just went through. and when i said this to others, they kind of put their head back, they don't understand what i mean. and when asked about protests about stay at home orders and the president calling on states to be liberated,dr. redfield

told "the washington post," quote, it's not helpful. then he tweeted out a link to that same story he claimed he was disavowing tonight, in front of the president. let's be real. this is part of a pattern. anthony fauci was also sent to cameras. also seeking whistle-blower status because he said he didn't push the president's drug of choice, hydroxychloroquine. quoting now from a statement that he released late tonight. quote, i believe this transfer was in response to my insistence that the government invest the billions of dollars allocated by congress to address the covid-19 pandemic into safe and scientifically vetted solutions, and not on drugs, vaccines, and other technologies that lack scientific merit. he went on to say, i am speaking out because to combat this deadly virus, science, not politics or cronyism, has to lead the way. president was asked about it at the briefing, and gave a familiar answer. >> mr. president, i want to ask you about rick bright. he is head of the federal agency

in charge of getting a vaccine out to americans once it's ready. he says he has been pushed out of his job because he raised questions about hydroxychloroquine, some of your directives on that. was he pushed out of that job? >> i never heard of him. you just mentioned the name. i never heard of him. when did this happen? >> this happened today. >> i never heard of him. if the guy said he was pushed out of a job, maybe he was, maybe he wasn't. i don't know who he is. >> he is one of the many professionals trying to do their jobs, which is also what cdc official nancy messiner was trying to do in february. tonight, "the wall street journal" reporting the president was so angry he called the secretary of hea secretary of health and human services and threatened to fire her for telling the truth. president trump calls himself a wartime president and the truth it seems is the last constant casualty in this war. more now from jim acosta. so what are you learning about rick bright and the clash that is happening here?

>> he sounds like he is a casualty, anderson, of the president's war on scientists. war on science. in the administration, dr. bright is going to file a whistle-blower complaint. he is protesting his removal from his position. leading that agency that is charged with vaccine development. he was working on a vaccine for the coronavirus when he was, abruptly, pulled out of his position. he had been clashing with top officials at health and human services but it was basically over the points that he raises in this lengthy statement that was released to reporters earlier today. essentially, saying that he protested insi protested, inside hhs, the tendency of the president, other administration officials, for treatments like hydroxychloroqui hydroxychloroquine when there are studies showing it doesn't work. and when dr. brooight raised questions about it, he is saying he was ousted from his position and talking to a source familiar

with the situation this evening, anderson, we are told that he hasn't even been told what -- what he's going to be doing over at the national institutes of health. so it sounds like he has been pushed out of this job, into another job, and he doesn't even know what that job's going to be yet. >> what is his next step? >> i mean, at this point, he is saying he is going to be fighting for his job, according to the source we spoke with earlier this evening. he is going to be fighting for this job. he wants to be reinstated back in his position over at that agency. but you heard the president there a few moments ago essentially pouring cold water on that idea. saying, well, maybe he was pushed out. maybe he wasn't. anderson, from all appearances, he was absolutely pushed out and that is what dr. bright is saying, and it sounds as though he is going to have his chance to make his case. i will point out, though, dr. anthony fauci, who appeared at the briefing this evening, seemed to say that dr. bright is

going to be welcomed over at nih, and be given some important responsibilities. but it's not clear whether or not dr. bright's been informed of that yet. >> want to bring in chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta. sanjay, the president stressed coronavirus may not come back in the fall. and said there may be, quote, embers. have you seen any evidence that what we're going to be dealing with in the fall are just coronavirus embers? >> no, i mean, the virus is the virus. the virus is probably the one constant in this whole equation. we have to continue to be able to react to this virus which may continue to be these physical distancing measuring and probably really spearhead, as we have talked about so many times, by testing. finding people who are infected, isolating, finding their contacts. all that. but the virus is not going away. i mean, it's here. it's a contagious virus. can be lethal in certain cases, as we know. ultimately, a vaccine may inoculate us against the virus, which would be great and a real significant development.

but this is -- this is part of our human environment now. this virus. so it's not going away. how we react to it is what may change. >> gloria, i mean, this is the second time a doctor's clarified their remarks at the podium or brought up to clarify. even though what dr. redfield was clarifying was exactly what he had said. so last week was dr. fauci after he told jake tapper mitigation could save lives. tonight, it was dr. redfield. i'm wondering what you make of this pattern. >> well, it's -- first of all, i think it's a disgusting pattern, honestly. these are professionals, who choose their words carefully. and, you know, if you looked at the picture tonight of dr. redfield standing up there and the president standing to his side, looking like the executioner, who could chop off his head at any time and fire him, if he wanted to.

and we know the president can do that. and, still, what he did was he got up there and he effectively -- he couched it but he effectively said what he said. and he said "the washington post" was accurate. and i would argue that tony fauci did exactly the same thing. when when he stood up there. and i think perhaps the reason they all still have their jobs because the president would probably like to get rid of anyone who disagrees with him or challenges him or gets him in trouble with the public is that he looks at the polls. and he understands that the scientists are trusted more, by the american public, than he is. so he needs them right now. he needs them in his corner, as angry as it might make him. it would be very difficult for him to get rid of them. >> jim, it's interesting. the president said he never heard of rick bright. maybe he has never heard of rick bright. it is kind of his go-to thing of, you know, people he says

he's never heard of them. and then, of course, people he's been photographed with numerous times. it's the lev parnas, who was working with rudy giuliani. >> the coffee boy. >> yes. >> sounds -- anderson, sounds like the excuses we got during the russia investigation. the various figures of the russia investigation were the coffee boys. they had more coffee boys than they had coffee during the russia investigation. and the president seems to be offering up the same excuse about dr. rick bright. the president may not have personally known dr. bright and we don't know that for a fact at this point. we're still digging on that point. but obviously, he was known inside hhs because he was clashing with these health officials. and, keep in mind, think about where dr. bright was standing versus where some of these other top health officials in the administration were standing. president trump is figures on fox news have been touting hydroxychloroquine for weeks as a treatment for the coronavirus. remember, the president standing in the briefing room saying, what -- what do you have to

lose? what do you have to lose? and so on. and what dr. bright was raising, internally, was that not only do you lose the concept of time because you're being treated with something that may not be effective. but there are also health risks. there are -- there are cardiovascular risks with hydroxychloroquine, and that is starting to show up in some of these studies. showing a higher mortality rate and so on. so dr. bright was on the side of science. he was on the side of saving lives, and it sounds like there were top health officials he was clashing with, who were siding with the president, no matter the cost. >> i want to bring in another voice to the conversation now. lena son, who interviewed dr. redfield for the report. lena, i am wondering what you make of what you just witnessed of him at the podium because it seemed like the president was saying he was going to walk back what he said to you in the interview. but he actually did just verify, in fact, that he was quoted accurately in the interview. >> he was quoted accurately.

we had a very good conversation. he spent a lot of time talking about the importance of getting flu vaccination and why it was important for americans to get this message. and how the public health officials had to prepare for this -- this summer so that -- so that when covid-19 hits in the fall, which has very similar symptoms to flu, that the public health capacity, hospitals, would not be overwhelmed. he made this point of saying americans needed to get the flu vaccination because, that way, the hospital beds would be available for their mothers and grandmothers who might need it for covid. >> right. i mean, that's an important point as we pointed out a lot in our coverage. there -- many americans do not get the flu vaccine, even though it has -- you know, it has -- as dead deadly as it is. i mean, the flu is a dangerous thing and people die of it every year. the president said today that the headline to your story was, quote, totally inaccurate. i just want to put the headline up on the screen, which is, quote, cdc director warns second

wave of coronavirus is likely to be even more devastating. i mean, just from a factual standpoint, saying it's more devastate -- likely to be more devastating and more difficult is, essentially, the same thing. if -- if a deadly virus is more difficult, i mean, it's more devastating. but wondering what your response is to the president's issue with the wording. >> it's sort of use your commonsense. if you have this covid-19 -- if coronavirus, now, is hitting the united states, and it took place after flu season had already waned. and you're seeing overwhelming stress on hospitals, lack of protective equipment, lack of ventilators. just imagine what it would be like if it hit the same time as flu in the fall. and dr. redfield himself said that he -- that we were lucky that it didn't hit at the same

time as flu this year because -- and then, in his quote that i quoted him, he said it would be very, very, very -- i think he used four verys -- difficult on the health compass capacity. if people don't get vaccinated, the rush to hospitals, it is just commonsense the portrait would be, when he says very difficult and people not understanding what i means. it means that he is drawing this picture for americans of how bad it could be. that seems, to me, the definition of devastating. >> bottom line, you stand by your story. >> we stand by my story. i stand by my story. and dr. redfield said he was quoted accurately. and i would just point out, anderson, that after the story posted, he, also, tweeted and encouraged people to read the story. >> yeah. we put up his tweet earlier. lena, i appreciate your reporting. sanjay, i want to turn to the situation in georgia. president said this evening he disagrees with the governor's

decision to open businesses this friday. nail salons, you know, massage therapy spas and the like. dr. fauci said he would urge the governor to be careful. as a resident of georgia, as a physician, are there any signs that the government is -- is listening? because doesn't seem like it. >> no. and, in fact, just over the last few minutes, you know, governor kemp has now responded to what president trump said. and president trump said he strongly disagrees with governor kemp's decision to reopen things in georgia. as you just mentioned, dr. fauci says he was advise him against it. yesterday, ambassador burke said there's still an outbreak going on. this doesn't seem to meet the guidelines, meet the gating criteria. and what we just heard, anderson, that's not going to change a thing in the governor's mind. he is still planning on moving forward with this plan to start reopening things on friday.

hair salons, nail salons, tattoo -- what do they call them? tattoo parlors? >> oh, don't pretend you don't know about tattoos, sanjay. i don't think you're a tattoo guy. >> not a tattoo guy. but how do you socially -- how do you physically distance at those sorts of places? i still don't -- i mean, i think a lot of people are just thinking common sensense here at just doesn't fit. >> yeah. and restaurants and theaters, on monday, according to the governor of georgia. thank you very much. still to come tonight, the mayor of las vegas wants to end her state's stay-at-home order now. wants casino squs hotels as and and hotels to open now. we are going to show you my interview with the mayor from earlier today. after, we're going to talk with the man who issued the order, the governor of nevada. and later, former health and human services secretary joins me to discuss the president's -- of testing and the president's take on a possible second wave of coronavirus.

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rebound. the mayor of las vegas believes otherwise. i spoke to mayor carolyn goodman earlier today about why she believes casinos and theaters and hotels and restaurants should reopen now. the conversation went for more than 25 minutes. we're going to play about 15 minutes of it for you because we think it's important to try to understand the thinking of, in this case, the mayor of las vegas. afterward, we'll talk to the governor of nevada. >> thanks so much for being with us, mayor. you say you assume everyone has the virus and is just asymptomatic. you want casinos open, vegas back in business. is that a responsible call to make? >> that wasn't the call that i was really making. it was to get people back to work. we have so many in hoour hospitality crew. we're 2.5 million people down here and nevada and we have so many out of work because -- >> but you want casinos open, yes? >> well, that's a piece of it.

i want hotel rooms open. we have 155,000 hotel rooms, and most of our people who live here and are part of the population are hooked to those hotel rooms, in some way or ancillary way. >> so hotel rooms, casinos, theaters open. i mean, you want vegas back in business, no? >> i want our restaurants open. i want our small businesses open. i want our people back in employment. we have so many families that can't even afford to get the groceries for their family because they have been out of work for six weeks. >> but casinos. you want them open because obviously, visitors not going to come without casinos and shows and things. >> well, no, they'll come because they love -- we got major league sports here. >> so you want stadiums open. >> i'd love everything open because i think we've had viruses for years that have been here. >> i mean, you are talking about encouraging hundreds of thousands of people to come to las vegas. i get the financial losses people are suffering, which is awful. but you're encouraging -- i

mean, hundreds of thousands of people coming there in casinos, smoking, drinking, touching slot machines, breathing circulated air. and then returning home to states around america and countries around the world. doesn't that sound like a virus petri dish? >> no, it sounds like you are being an alarmist. i'm not. i lived in a long tief. life. i grew up in the heart of manhattan. i know what it's like being crammed in subways and buses. >> i'm being alarmist? >> i think you are by saying what you just said. >> so you don't believe there should be any social distancing? you don't believe this is -- >> of course, i believe there should be. of course. >> how do you do that in a casino? >> that's up to them to figure out. i don't own a casino. i don't know anything about -- >> wait a minute. wait a minute. i'm sorry. you are the mayor of las vegas and you want casinos to be open, even though you have no authority, thankfully, over casinos. but you say open them up. but you have no responsibility

about how that would be done safely? >> no. you're blurring -- no. no. no. you're blurring. not going there. i'm not a private owner of a hotel. i wish i were. and i would have the cleanest hotel, with six feet figured out for every human being comes in there. >> so if you can't figure out how to do this safely, why, as mayor of a city that you are responsible for the people's safety, are you calling for something that you have no plan for how it would be done safely? >> i am not a private owner. that's the competition in this country. the free -- free enterprise and to be able to make sure that what you offer the public meets the needs of the public. right now, we're in a crisis health-wise, and so for a restaurant to be open or a small boutique to be open they better figure it out. that's their job. that's not the mayor's job. >> so what are you doing as mayor to improve contact tracing and testing in las vegas? >> well, first of all, as

someone who is pretty sure she possibly had it in january, i have already been into the hospital to say take my plasma. i want to encourage others. >> what are you doing, as mayor, to improve contact tracing? >> i'm calling upon -- i'm calling upon everyone to go ahead, if they're positive, to go ahead and see if they can help being part of the preventive or the treatment pool that will have this plasma available. >> are you doing anything on testing and contact tracing? because in order to open businesses, every scientist says that is essential. >> i don't have that. well, no, that's for our scientists. and the whole thing is, is fact. >> right. fact, you're calling for businesses to reopen. every scientist and person, you know, who looks at this, says what we really need to do that is more testing. >> wait. wait. wait. you're seeing every. that -- no -- that can't work. we're not getting the truth.

and i know, over the years, going back to 19 -- the 1950s with the atomic bomb. don't worry about testing in nevada. you'll all be fine. take a shower. the reality is -- >> you're the one saying you'll all be fine. >> no. no. no. you're putting words in my mouth. i said open up las vegas. let us get started and go back to work. we have all these people. >> as mayor, what are you doing to encourage -- >> -- that can't even feed their families or take care of their families. >> i get the pain that's out there and that's real. and i am not minimizing that at all. i'm just asking, as mayor, what are you doing to improve testing, make it more accessible, and improve contact tracing? because every scientist, who you say you listen to, will tell you that's what you need in order to get online as fast as possible. what are you doing? >> every single e-mail that comes in with offers to get us kits and everything, i send it

up to the people in the hospitals for them to filter through, to find out if these test kits and everything that's being offered and provided for them. >> you said, in another interview, that you talked to los angeles mayor eric garcetti. >> yes, a good friend. >> okay. if you talked to mayor garcetti, he's doing everything he can to improve testing in los angeles. >> i think that's wonderful. and i -- i -- >> you said it's not your job. >> no, it is not part of our job. that's part of our health department. part of our hospital jobs. our labs. those are the ones who are the experienced and just everything being -- >> the governor says that -- >> i admire our governor. >> the governor says, unfortunately, i have known the mayor. i don't need politicians weighing in on what -- >> i am not a politician. >> -- what the best date would be. i need doctors and medical, sound advice. >> no. no. and who are -- who are his people? and are they, in fact, the best that we can have? i'm assuming yes and all i'm doing is asking for a plan so i can tell our people, who are

calling, by the thousands, when are they going to get a paycheck? how can they get a roof over their heads? i am down in the groundwork, with the people who've made this city what it is. who've come here to live, come here to build it, and we were not broken. and we need to get back to work. that's it. >> there is a -- chinese researchers have shown how this virus spreads. and i just want to put up for our viewers, this is a -- >> anderson, you are tough. >> no -- >> we're back to china. this isn't china. this is las vegas, nevada. >> wow. okay. that's really ignorant. this is a restaurant. >> that's ignorant to say? >> that's an ignorant statement. that's a restaurant and, yes, it's in china. but they're human beings, too. yellow is a person who is a person who is asymptomatic and infected. and all those other red circles are other diners, who that one

diner passed the virus to. all those other people became infected, in a restaurant that had air conditioning, and they believe it was the air conditioning which helped the virus spread to all those other people. >> and you remember the legionnaires disease in 1976 in philadelphia came all through the air condition. you don't remember because you're younger. typhoid mary. >> i do remember. >> typhoid mary, who i think passed away -- well, anyway -- during the late '30s. rode the buses. was a cook. and she was asymptomatic and she spread it, a fear of getting typhoid. and she never showed a sign of it. and she lived most of her life quarantined. the reality was i think 58 people passed away from typhoid. and so we're aware of this. we've learned from history. we've had ebola. we've had the west nile. we've had polio. >> none of those were as

infectious in las vegas. i mean, you didn't have people with ebola on a casino floor. >> we don't know that. >> you do because -- >> a neighbor of mine died from west nile because a swimming pool on the next property was filled with mosquitoes and the people who abandoned the house left the pool full. >> just as mayor -- all right -- as mayor, are you not concerned when you see just that restaurant, how air condition spreads this and other people become infected? >> yes, from legionnaire's disease. that's just what i said. we lost a lot of people in that hotel who had gone ahead and -- >> right. and there were steps to take to stop that, by changing the air filtering, if my memory serves me correct on legionnaires disease. there are not, yet, the steps to take with this other than social

da distancing. >> right. so people do that. i mean, i love watching our people here. they are so careful. and even as we have -- we work every single day. i have not missed a day. and anybody who was in or comes into the office that needs an appointment or has an issue, they all are with their masks on or we always enforce social distancing. and the office is absolutely pristine with germs. >> you're talking about your office. >> well, hopefully, everything in the building. we have shut down the lobby. >> but i mean, you know how -- look, mayor. you love your city. and i get you want it to go back to work. and i -- i totally get that and you hear from people and, you know, you're -- you're in a really tough position. i get it. but it just seems really irresponsible, given that, a, you are actually -- have no responsibility or say over casinos or what happens on the strip, that you're not -- you're not out there doing anything

about -- you're not doing anything about trying to improve testing like your friend mayor garcetti is doing in los angeles. or improve contact tracing. you are simply sitting there saying get back to work, get these casinos open again. and you have no idea or plan or you've done nothing to try to figure out, well, what's the best way to make that happen? how far apart should, you know, you know, a dealer be from the people? i mean, you are offering nothing other than being a cheerleader, which i guess is what part of your job is. and i respect that. and you seem like a very nice person. but i don't understand, do you not have any sense of responsibility fif you're callig for something, to try to make it as safe as possible? >> it is about putting our workers back to work. it is not about casinos. it is not about anything other than putting those, who lost their jobs, in a city that wasn't broken and didn't have

disease, back to work. we're 2.3 million people here. we have -- >> wait a minute. wait a minute. 3,900 cases in nevada. 163 deaths. and that's with social distancing. >> nevada. >> yeah, in nevada. you're saying there was no problem in las vegas, like there was no disease? there was not the virus in las vegas? because, earlier, you said you believe everyone's asymptomatic. >> oh, no, i'm sure, in january, and i know plenty of people who are coughing. some had fevers and, if they did, they stayed home because they thought it was the flu. the flu is unbelievably powerful, still. and so of course we know that. we tried to work on the sensitivities of people to be responsible as to spreading any kind of germ, whether it's the flu. >> but don't you think it's worked in las vegas, social distancing. don't you think it is eworke's ? because 163 deaths, compared to

other states, that's low. >> we're -- we're 2.3 -- we're 2.3 million people in southern nevada. and we've had 150 deaths. >> 163, i believe, is the latest number actually. >> that's for nevada. that's nevada. this is down here. 150. >> but hasn't it been because of social distancing that the numbers have been what they are? >> how do you know until we have a control group? we offered to be a controlled group. anybody knows anything about statistics knows that, for instance, you have a vaccine. >> you're offering the citizens of las vegas to be a control group to see if your theory on social distancing -- >> i did offer. it was turned no. no. no. wrong. absolutely wrong. don't put words in my mouth. >> you just said will be a control group. >> excuse me. what i said was i offered to be a control group, and i was told, by our statistician, you can't

do that because people from all parts of southern nevada come in to work in the city. and i said that's too bad because you know, you have a disease, you have a placebo that gets the water and the sugar. and then you get those that actually get the shot. we would love to be that placebo side so you have something to measure against. so all the data -- >> you want to get the placebo. you don't want to get the actual -- >> are you going to let me finish? >> the group who gets the placebo, by the way, usually gets the short end of the stick. >> well, you don't know. how do you know? >> mayor. mayor, if -- if you -- if casinos reopen, are you going to be inside those casinos every single night, putting your own life on the line? >> i have lived in this town for 56 years. >> are you going to go to the casinos every night and put your life on the line like all the workers? >> they don't need it. we weren't broken. tragically, have 150 we lost. tragic. we have 2.3 million people here.

>> i haven't heard you say, yes, that you would be sitting on those casino floors every night along with the people that you say you are holding their hands with. >> what -- what is the purpose of that? first of all, i have the family. >> because it would be pretty -- it would be putting money where your mouth is, to use, i guess, a las vegas term. >> wait. wait, anderson. you are too smart for this. anderson. >> okay. so you're not willing to sit on casino floors with them whethn they're reopen, and breathe the refiltered air. >> first of all, i don't gamble. i used to gamble when we first came to town. i don't have the time. i work seven days a week. i have so many things i have to attend to. i can't sit on a casino floor. >> i wouldn't want to sit on the floors either. i am with you on that one. that was -- it went on from there. joining me now, the governor of nevada. governor, thanks for being with us. i'm just wondering what you make of the push by the mayor, who

has no responsibility or say over when the casinos actually reopen. saying that it should open now and that there was no disease in las vegas. >> well, anderson, i appreciate you having me on and allowing me to respond to some of what she said. we are, clearly, not ready to reopen. we have, sadly, since you did that interview, we now have 187 deaths in the state of nevada. over 4,100 positive cases. i will not allow the citizens of nevada, our nevadans to be used as a control group, a placebo, whatever she wants to call it. i certainly will not allow that. i can tell you our largest trade union on the strip, culinary union 226, lost 11 members. they've lost 11 members to covid-19, already. i'm going to do everything i can to make sure they don't lose 11 more. >> you know, clearly, the -- one can quibble with how she says things and logic or lack

thereof. but, look, there's certainly a lot of people who want to get back to business. i'm sure you want to get back to business. what do you say, though, to those who say, look, you know, the -- the -- you know, the solution to this is -- is -- you know, it's keeping us all locked up in our homes, and socially distant. it's not worth the pain and the cost, economic and, you know, personal to people, long-term. >> well, i've been saying that for five weeks now, anderson, and you're absolutely right. i've never been prouder to be a nevadan than i am now because, when we put in restrictions our executive orders and directives that called for social distancing. and they called for hygiene, and they called for no large groups. and, you know, face coverings, you know, outside of your home. we have been able to keep our numbers as low as they are right now, the 187, 4,100, because of that. and got an enormous amount of cooperation from the vast majority of our citizens. now, there are clearly some that don't see things my way.

and that they have resisted. but most elected officials -- i can tell you mayor of reno and chair of the clarke county commission, they've been nothing but helping to expand our testing, expand our tracing, and to open. and to open at the proper time. las vegas is a great place to be. it's a fun time. it's a great place to have a convention. come for a party, extended vacation, whatever that may be. and we want to welcome everybody back to las vegas. we want do welcome 'em back to the lights on the strip. but that's not today and it's not tomorrow. and the resort operators have been incredibly phenomenal partners. great partners in operating this. matt maddocks, you might have seen the proposal. and they are putting a lot of time and effort into this, when we do it, we are going to do it right but i am not going to allow workers to be put in a position where they have to decide between their job, a paycheck, and their life. that's not a fair position to

put them in and i will not allow that to happen. >> it also seems, to me, just a cheap argument to say it's either open up now or, you know, or -- or the alternative is destruction. that -- that it's a binary choice of either human health or, you know, lives or economic health. it seems to me just long-term, for the health of las vegas, is you want to have confidence. you don't want to have a reopening, and then have to then pull back because there's been, you know, a huge outbreak. that's going to just, long-term, hurt confidence that people have in, you know, in any community. restaurants or movie theaters or casinos or wherever it may be. >> you're absolutely right. i couldn't have said it better. that's why we need a phased-in approach to getting to where we need to get to. i am following medical advice and scientists and statisticians. and they have exposed to me, you know, what we're really dealing with in terms of the metrics,

and having to follow a graph and the model that's been established. i look at certain criteria. i look at hospitalizations, as it relates to covid-19. intensive-care unit hospitalizations. ventilator usage. percent of positive tests versus tests that we've given. and they need those to have plateaued and begin the trajectory downward. now, i know people are asking for more clarity and more specificity, but you don't know when you're in the trajectory, until you're already partly into the trajectory because you might be a little bit going down for a day or two or three. and then you go up again. i am listening to the medical people. i'm listening to the scientists. they will decide, along with the virus and behavior of our citizens, when it's time to start reopening in a phased-in approach. >> you mentioned the local culinary workers union in vegas. the mayor's statement are outrageous considering our frontline workers have been dealing with consequences of the crisis firsthand. workplaces need to be safe and healthy, not a petri dish. again, these are the workers who are the backbone of that community.

>> oh, they're absolutely the backbone, anderson. they are on the front lines. they're cleaning the rooms. they are serving the meals they have lost 11 members. and people who are talking about reopening prematurely, i have talked to people who have lost a loved one to covid-19, to people that weren't able to visit a dying parent in a nursing home because they had restrictions on their nursing home. i talked to -- i spent a half hour with our first ground-zero patient that we had, a veteran at our veterans home. came out of a coma that he was in for 30 days and he thanked me. said, governor, at least i'm going to be able to see my grandchildren someday. had you not done this, it would have been impossible. it's important we protect the health and future and wellbeing of our citizens. we can rebuild our economy. we will rebuild our economy. las vegas will continue to thrive, but i can't do that if i lose more people. we need to protect their health and wellbeing.

there will come a time to open las vegas in a phased-in approach. i urge everyone, nevada has been incredible. the vast majority of citizens are wear face coverings, they are practicing social distancing. they're doing everything they can. and we need to send a sincere message and a consistent message, and it's difficult when we get one person that's kind of leading people astray. and i'm disappointed in that. >> yeah. governor, i appreciate your time. and your efforts. thank you. >> thanks, anderson, appreciate the opportunity. >> take care. coming up next, former secretary of health and human services on the need for more tests. the president's apparent war on his own science professionals. we'll be right back. (slow music plays) ♪ (laughter) ♪ ♪

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joined tonight by the need to test and reopen the economy and the president's need by health professionals to tow the party line. joining us is the former kansas governor kathleen sebelius, who served as health and human services director in the obama administration. and there is a differentiation of the second wave being more difficult and more devastating. is there a difference between those two things in your mind? >> no, either one of them is pretty terrible. what dr. redford is talking about is if you have a robust flu season, and we never know really what's coming, and we might have a vaccine that is fully effective or you might have a vaccine that is partially effective, we're going to have a lot of patients as we do every year, already with underlying health condition, older, more vulnerable, pregnant women, others who are susceptible to the flu, they will be in

hospital bed, they will be needing the kind of care and then if you spread oefbd on top , koefb on top of that, it could be deadly for even more individuals in this country. >> i mean, yes, as you said, a second wave of the virus, combined with the seasonal flu which a lot of americans do not even routinely get a vaccination for. >> that's right. >> and one of the things that dr. redfield was saying, he was trying to impress upon people the importance of getting a flu vaccine. >> getting it and getting it as early as possible. we're hoping that the vaccine will be very effective, but again, we've seen the vaccination numbers going up and down, there is a growing group in the country who are antivaccination and spread thes in information on the air waves. so flu vaccine is not a guarantee of anything, but we hope that there could be a

communication plan that starts now to get people ready to go get the flu vaccine quickly and then hopefully to be ready to get the covid-19 vaccine. there's still a myth that covid-19 is the flu so there will be a lot of people that feel i'll do one or the other, but i'm not going to do both, that would be a deadly mistake. >> it's interesting how we've become used to seeing the nation's top scientists filtered through the lens of the white house. it's rare, i think it would be in normal times even in other health crises, there's been press conferences from the cdc, you know, the head of hhs speaking publicly. everything now is filtered through the vice president's office essentially. does that -- is there a chilling effect, or do you think, it seems like that's intentional. >> well, it's, i think, very intentional.

i worked for a president who started with the fact that he felt we needed to be guided by the science. he felt as murky as things were, without a vaccine, we haven't seen the strain of the flu, we were dealing with, since 1918, that we had to tell people what we knew and what we didn't know, and get out of the way, and let the scientists, the cdc and nih talk to the american public. we did twice or three times a day updates on what was happening, when the vaccine would be available and what we knew about it and where it was going to be, but at every point along the way, president obama resisted political pressure to rewhite cdc guidance or bow to social pressure. he kept saying we have to follow the science and let the public know what the scientists say. i'm very alarmed that you get a lot of political spin before and after scientists talk, and today we saw them be asked to

essentially correct what they say which is absolutely right on target that this second wave, could be indeed much more serious and much more deadly, and i have no idea what the white house is going to do as we get closer to either treatment or vaccination, but we've seen the president from the briefing room promote what is totally unproven as an effective treatment, and call a drug out by name that needs to go through serious clinical trials. i've never seen that in my life. >> secretary sebelius, i appreciate your time. thank you. >> sure. >> take a quick look at the lines at a south florida food lines as it grows as a problem for the food supply. that's when 360 continues. as homes become schools at&t has created

a $10 million dollar fund to support distance learning tools, curriculum and resources to help educators and families keep school in session because the key to keeping kids learning, is keeping kids connected.

as the coronavirus death toll nears 47,000 there's growing concern about the nation's food supply. large meat processing plants are closing because workers have become infected. in south florida, people out of work because of the pandemic lined up for food donations, randi kaye was there.

>> let's go! come on! >> this was the scene in hialeah gardens, florida. cars stretching for miles. all of them waiting for free food. before dawn, organizers say more than 1,000 cars were waiting. >> what time did you come this morning? >> 4:00. >> 4:00 a.m. >> yes. >> some came as early as 2:00 a.m., sleeping in their cars for more than six hours before the food line opened. >> good morning. buenos dias. >> more than 60 volunteers showed up to help distribute potatoes, fruit, pickles and chicken, lots of it. >> how much chicken do you think you're giving away today? >> i don't know, but it's a lot. >> much of the food gathered by the non-profit group farm share was purchased from farmers so it wouldn't go to waste. >> we've seen probably the biggest need in the history of farm share during this pandemic. >> are you hungry? yes. >> many who came to pick up food told me they've lost their job and are running out of food at

home. >> no job, no money, so you're coming for food. >> reporter: he told me he's been out of work for weeks and has no food at home. same story for this man. >> do you need food badly? >> yeah, yeah, yeah. i'm not working at this moment. >> you're not working so you need food? >> i need food for my family. >> reporter: and the fact that it's free, so that helps. >> good idea. >> reporter: because you don't have the money to pay for it right now. >> no. >> reporter: each family takes home about 15 pounds of food. during this pandemic, farm share has given away 5 million pounds of food to families in miami-dade county, one of the hardest hit. >> reporter: when they first started these food giveaways in early march they were serving about 400 families. here they expect to serve 1400 families. so clearly, the word has spread and so has the desperation for food. >> reporter: cesar barrelo is a flight attendant, he's barely working and has much less money coming in.