>> working very hard, with governors, now on testing. going to help them out. >> the president and the governors seemed to unite around testing a few days later. >> preparing to use the defense production act to increase swab production. >> the president planned to use the dpa to force production of desperately needed swabs for testing. federal testing labs were offered for some states to use. and the latest economic relief bill allocated $25 billion for testing. so, by the end of april, diagnostic testing was progressing. though, still, nowhere near where it needed to be, according to health experts. >> we are working with more than 400 test developers. 220 labs around the country. >> ultimately, we're doing more testing, i think, than any of the governors probably even want. >> four days later, the white house announced a blueprint for testing. putting the responsibility back in the hands of the states. >> we have enough testing to begin reopening, and the reopening process. we want to get our country open. >> a plan that had the administration taking a victory

lap. >> i think that we've achieved all the different milestones that are needed. so the -- the government, federal government, rose to the ch challenge, and this is a great success story. >> the federal government has done a -- a spectacular job. >> but the plan had medical experts reacting quite differently. >> the white house plan calls for around 7 million a month. we're talking about a million a day. so you can see the delta here. it's like four times off in terms of the amount of testing that we need to be doing here. >> it isn't perfect, and we're not there yet. and we're not. but we're going to get there. we're going to get there soon, i hope. >> and they'll need to because the only true end to this pandemic, the holy grail, a vaccine is, still, on the horizon. >> i think there's no question that the speed at which these vacci vaccine trials have been going is unprecedented. vaccines can take decades to make. hiv-aids, 40 years, and we still don't have a vaccine. that gives you an idea of how challenging this can be.

>> all of this is a race against time. to reopen. to get back to some semblance of normal. and, most importantly, to save lives. it will be a marathon, the experts say, not a sprint. and, with every step, serious communication failures, that took, and continue to take, the country offtrack. >> the virus. >> such as downplaying the threat and severity of the pandemic. >> when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away. i hope that's true. >> hydroxychloroquine. >> or, pushing a drug, hydroxychloroquine, for the treatment of covid-19. a drug the fda just warned against using outside of a clinical trial or a hospital. >> what do you have to lose? take it. >> and then, of course, the recent disinfectant situation. >> then, i see the disinfectant. where it knocks it out in a

minute. one minute. and is there a way we can do something like that? by injection, inside, or -- or almost a cleaning. >> an unbelievable and perplexing moment that had people calling hotlines, asking if they should be using disinfectant on themselves, to combat the virus. >> this idea of prompted statements from the cdc, epa, numerous state health officials, and even the makers of lysol and clorox to warn, do not try this. it could kill. >> requiring doctors, public officials, and organizations, to shift their focus from fighting covid-19 to actually warning the public not to ingest disinfectant. >> i certainly wouldn't recommend the internal ingestion of a disinfectant. >> we wanted to ask the white house about all of this. but they declined to participate in this documentary.

for now, americans need to keep their eyes looking straight ahead, to the finish line. listening to the experts, and not get distracted by confusing and unfounded messages. >> i don't think there's only one path to defeat covid. we need our leaders to be focused, serious, honest, to be able to deal with new, fa fast-moving scientific information. that's the path to defeat covid. >> why, now, in the middle of this pandemic, are we investigating the record? well, while we were producing this documentary, the united states hit a grim milestone. 1 million americans diagnosed with covid-19 and, according to "the new york times," internal trump administration cdc

projections show more than 200,000 new cases and 3,000 deaths, every single day, projected at the beginning of next month. rates far greater than what's happening now. startling numbers. they remind us, every day, just how lives are, literally, at stake. and that's the reason that we do this now. not because we want to point fingers or blame the chinese government or governors or president trump. the reason that we look back is so that the same mistakes are not repeated as these numbers continue to rise. and, just in case there's another outbreak later this year or next. we want get the facts on the record, especially when the president is apparently weeding out and replacing truth tellers. government watchdogs, such as the acting inspector general of the department of health and human services, who was telling a truth that, apparently, president trump did not want told. the time to get these facts on the record is when memories are fresh, and when people can remember what was done and what

could have been done faster or better. or at all. . good evening. thanks for joining us. as people begin to crowd public areas again, new modeling out today projects a sharp spike in both case loads and death counts. according to at least one of those reports, the reason is partially the relaxation of social distancing guidelines. that report comes from an institute at the university of washingt washington whose modeling has been cited by the white house and director is going to join us in a moment. dr. chris murray says this rise of mobility in the last ten days is likely leading to some increased transmission. this is what the rise in mobility looks like. all of this, from the weekend.

take a look what happened in panama city beach in florida. as you can see, people heading to the beach. there, they are on the beach. claes clearly, not respecting social distancing guidelines. a similar situation in the national mall, nation's capital, crowds joining together. some wearing masks, many not wearing them. new yorkers also took advantage of the beautiful spring weather to go to central park. the other spike was first reported by "the new york times." the white house and cdc have disavowed the numbers, however, "the times" report that slides created from the report carry the cdc logo on them. now, in both reports, cases are projected to spike with the death count rising sharply. last night, president trump tried to say that, quote, everything is working out, unquote. even as he upped his own estimate. two weeks ago, today, he projected deaths between 50,000 to 60,000. last night, he said it would be 75,000 to 100,000.

however, a member of the president's coronavirus task force, dr. deborah birx, appeared to contradict the president's projections. quoting dr. birx, our projections have always been 100,000 and 240,000 american lives lost. so we want to start this hour with nick watt, who joins us from los angeles. so restrictions going to ease at the end of the week in california. what's life expected to start to look like there in the near term? >> well, in the near term, anderson, probably not a lot of change i've got to know honest with you. listen. we were among the first in the country to be told to stay home. that's going to be 50 days ago, come friday when the governor is finally going to start lifting these restrictions. he's been under a lot of pressure over the closing of the beaches. he's had three counties say that they are going to defy his orders and just open their businesses anyway. but he says this has nothing to do with politics. these decisions are driven purely by the science. and actually, he said, you know,

local areas, local municipalities, can move faster, or slower, if the data really supports it. his statewide guidelines. already, we have heard from the mayor of san francisco who says her city might need a little bit more time. >> today, restaurants can reopen in nebraska and florida. bars in montana. offices in colorado. yes, some social distancing restrictions remain. but, by the end of this week, more than 40 states will be partially back open for business. >> while we have been staying indoors, we have been slowing down the spread. but, what we haven't done is gotten rid of the virus. >> this is what new normal looks like. eating, in texas, complete with masks. in miami beach today, they had to close the popular south point park, again, after police issued 7,300 warnings to people not wearing masks. the projected number of deaths

forecast by early august in this country just nearly doubled to more than 134,000 in that well-known model from the university of washington. the reason? >> one of them increased mobility before the relaxation. premature relaxation of social distancing would add more presumptive deaths, as well. and we are seeing a lot of outbreaks in the midwest, for example. >> another model used by the administration projects a sharp rise in deaths to around 3,000 a day by june 1st, according to sources. and a rough eightfold increase in the number of new cases, every day, nationwide. now, in 15 states, the daily new case count is falling. among them, those northeast hotspots. >> you see the decline is, again, not as steep as the incline. but reopening is more difficult than the closedown. >> but, in 20 states, the daily new case count is, still,

rising. among them, wisconsin, minnesota, illinois. the governor of california will now allow some retail to open friday, with significant modifications. he says certain areas of lower concern can move even faster. >> we will afford them that right, with conditions and modifications, that meet the health needs of the entire state. >> meanwhile, the white house is now focusing on 14 potential vaccines. >> we are very confident that we're going to have a vaccine at the end of the year. >> miracles can happen. it could come together. but i'm certainly not banking on it. >> the makers of that potential therapeutic, remdesivir, say they have now donated 140,000 courses to the federal government. >> they will determine, based upon things like icu beds, where the course of the epidemic is in the united states. they will begin shipping tens of thousands of treatment courses out early this week. >> and, today, in d.c., history

was made. >> oh yay, oh yay, oh yay. all persons having business before the honorable the sprupre court of the united states are admonished to give their attention. >> that's the supreme court, for the first time ever, meeting by teleconference. >> nick, the white house is pushing back on the projections reported today. what did they say? >> yeah. pushing back, strongly, against the projection, anderson, that says that we're going to have 3,000 deaths a day, by june 1st. and we're going to see the daily case count increasing eightfold. they are pushing back heavily. we just got this statement from white house spokesperson. this is not a white house document, nor has it been presented to the coronavirus task force or gone through interagency vetting. this data is not reflective of any of the modeling done by the task force or data that the task

force has analyzed. make of that, what you will. anderson. >> nick watt, thanks very much. our chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta joins us now. sanjay, i want to get to specific numbers in a moment but just in terms of what we are seeing, what we're hearing, clearly, people eager to get back some sort of version of normal. are things happening too fast? >> well, they seem to be, anderson. i mean, you know, there was these gating criteria that were put forth by the white house. somewhat general but, still, you know, saying 14-day downward trend that you needed in cases. that was to sort of give some evidence that things were, you know, objectively going in the right direction. and most of the states or many of the states that are opening this week and have opened over the last week did not meet those criteria. many had their peak just over the last few days. so i think it's too fast. i think the reality is, at any time things start to open, given that there is a contagious virus out there, there are going to be

people who become infected, as you and i have talked about. people who would become infected that, otherwise, wouldn't, if we weren't open. i think it's just a question of how many? you know, there is all these different models out there. the scenario that nick watt was just talking about was a scenario, you know, some version of that's been out there for some time but there are other scenarios as well. right now, i think it's pretty clear that we are getting better, in terms of the overall number of cases every day. we're sort of plateaued. maybe, not necessarily, getting worse but not getting better. not coming out the back end of that curve. >> and the new government number, the slides with the cdc logo on them, which were obtained by "the new york times" first. they project a rise to 3,000 deaths a day, in the u.s., by june 1st. i know white house is disputing those numbers. they say they're not white house numbers. they weren't presented to the coronavirus task force. but they are in line with other projections, and clearly the administration is concerned things may be going in the wrong direction. >> yeah. i mean, you know, it's

interesting because i followed these models, carefully, since -- since january. and -- and there were these various scenarios. you know, sort of the mild pandemic scenario, the moderate, the more severe. and what these were and seems like maybe these scenarios were created, you know, more than a month ago. and, in some ways, the actual numbers that we're seeing in terms of numbers of cases and numbers of deaths, in some ways, have been worse than that scenario up until this point. but the point is, i think, anderson, at this plateau right now, are we going to start to head back up? or are we going to go down? the plateau is definitely lasting longer than i think the modelers would have suggested. but i think what's concerning at this point is that we're at this inflexion point. and if we start heading back up and we get into exponential growth, meaning it's not just going up linearly but all of a sudden really starts to shoot

up. as we saw in mid-march, that would be a real concern. we could double the number of deaths every single day. we could go from 25,000 people becoming infected every day to in the hundreds of thousands of people being infected every day. there's just over a million people that have been confirmed right now with the infection. if you start talking about 100 or 200,000 people every day that have the infection, that's a million people a week, even more than that. that's what we have to prevent. and that's when you asked me is it too early? that's why i'm answering that i think it is because you want to avoid that exponential growth again. >> sanjay, i want to bring -- stay with us. i want to bring in dr. chris murray. director of the institute for health metrics. it's been cited by the white house, which now projects deaths above 134,000. dr. murray, thank you for being with us. can you walk us through the new numbers? because i think the last time we talked, i can't remember exactly but i think your projections

were in the 60,000 range. they had been as high as 81,000, i think at one point. what are the specific factors that have made the numbers jump so high, just since last week? >> well, we had been operating and modeling assuming that states were going to stay the course. keep social distancing on through to the end of may. bring new infections down to a really low level. and, then, states would switch over to a testing, contact tracing, isolation strategy. that's clearly not happening. so we've now built into the modeling what we're seeing around the country. both, in terms of the mandates coming off. but, also, even before the mandates came off where you see, in the mobility data, people starting to get out more. having more interaction. all that translates into greater risk of transmission. and what we see is some states will continue going up. texas. georgia. florida. a series of states in the

midwest. other states will have much slower declines than would've occurred if there wasn't this increase in mobility. so all that, put together, gives us a much bigger number by august. it, also, has a bigger range and it has states with transmission running well into july and august. and, you know, the way to think about this is there's two things happening. people getting out, being more active. some people going back to work. and, on the other side, states are scaling up testing. that's why we are seeing more cases in some places. and that's a good sign. and the temperature's going up and we do see a statistical correlation between transmission and temperature. and what's going to happen is going to be the balance of those forces. >> sanjay, do you have a question i think? >> yeah. you know, i'm curious what -- what you thought, professor

murray. i guess it was probably a scenario that was released today that may have come from johns hopkins originally that suggested that we could go to some 200,000 new infections a day. and some 3,000 deaths a day. it's tough to even say that out loud but that would loud. but what do you think of that? does that make sense to you at all based on your modeling? >> well, you know, there is a huge range of possibilities out there. our estimates for june 1st are about 890 deaths a day. so about a third of what that model's saying. and perhaps, more importantly, i think when you see the graph fra that model, it's having the u.s. go into exponential growth after june 1st. and i think it's down to this question about how how much will testing, contact tracing, scaleup, rising temperature, put

brakes on transmission? how much will people, you know, be cautious? will they wear a mask? will they avoid too much physical interaction, on average? and if that goes in the direction that we think the balance will be, we'll end up well below the 3,000 deaths a day. but it really depends what states do, what people do. >> and you found that there's a statistical correlation between mobility and transmission. i mean, is that -- can you explain that? is that based on data you have collected in the past week or so, since the states have begun to ease restrictions? >> so what we've done is we've gone back, and we looked at this r term. you know, how many people does each case infect? and we've looked at it, by state, all the way back to mid-march. and then we'd run statistical correlations or regressions, you know, so explore that relationship with population density, with mobility, with temperature, and with testing per capita. and we find really strong relationships and the strongest is mobility. so there's, clearly, a huge bet

people are out and about and how much transmission occurs. that was having a very beneficial effect on transmission. so, no surprise, as people go back to being more active and interacting with each other, we're going to see increased transmission. >> professor murray, when i looked at some of your models earlier on, you did show this scenario where we could get to a really low level of infection. i can't remember if it was .1% or whatever the number was. you see places around the world, like new zealand, where you get really low rates of infection. are you still optimistic that we can get there? there's been a lot of tough news lately. is there some -- some hopes for optimism, in terms of these low levels of infection possibilities? >> well, i think, you know, new

zealand's a fantastic example because they, put in place, with clear criteria, stay-at-home orders, the whole social distancing package. they waited until transmission got to a really low level, and now they're scaling back and clear criteria to which they will go back to social distancing if -- if it rebounds. we thought that that's what would happen in the u.s. you know, go the distance. stay to the end of may. get transmission to sort of new zealand levels and then it's sort of manageable with contact tracing, isolation, testing. clearly, that's not going to happen. i think we have entered a new phase. people in the u.s. are going to become more active. states are going to take off mandate. so, now, it's going to be really up to individuals to try to minimize their exposure, themselves. especially, those that can. some people don't have the luxury of having jobs where they can work from home. but, you know, wear a mask.

avoid as much contact as possible. and we've really got to focus on scaling up testing and contact tracing and isolation. and i think the most important thing is if we can just space out, you know, the relaxation of social distancing, even a little bit more, it's going to make that task more possible. right? >> wow. this is -- yeah, depressing. talking about more deaths. obviously, there is a tradeoff for getting the economy going as well but that's what it boils down. dr. sanjay gupta, thank you. chris murray, as well. appreciate all your work. still ahead, how should the federal government respond to these projected spikes in fatalities and case loads? also, the spike has yet to alter any state plans to reopen. ohio governor mike dewine is going to join me to talk about whether these projections, in any way, affect his timeline for ohio. >> "anderson cooper 360" brought

to you by nondrowsy, 24-hour claritin. d by over two hundred outdoor and indoor allergens. because to a kid, a grassy hill is irresistabale. children's claritin. feel the clarity and live claritin clear.

[anthony] hey mama, what's up? [mama] i'm confused. confused about what, everything ok? yeah, i only see one price on my phone bill. that doesn't sound confusing mama. you're on t-mobile, taxes and fees are included. oh come on, there's always extra fees! not on t-mobile mama. why can't all my bills be like this? i don't know mama. bye mama, love you. anthony? umph! at t-mobile, taxes and fees are included. and right now, when you switch your family, get 4 lines of unlimited for just $35 a line.

i'll start... oh, do you want to go first? no, no i don't...you go. i was just going to say on slide 7, talking about bundling and saving...umm... jamie, you're cutting out. sorry i'm late! hey, whoever's doing that, can you go on mute? oh, my bad! i was just saying there's a typo on slide 7. bundle home & auto for big discosnouts. i think that's supposed to say discounts. you sure about that? hey, can you guys see me? "show me what you're made of." so we showed it our people, sourcing and distributing more fresh food than anyone... we showed it our drivers helping grocers restock their shelves. we showed it how we're donating millions of meals to those in need.

we showed it how we helped thousands of restaurants convert to takeout and pop up markets. and how we're encouraging all americans to take out to give back. adversity came to town. so we looked it right in the eye. and it won't be us... ...that blinks first. sharp increase on the number of projected deaths from coronavirus. two reports projecting a large spike in fatalities. before the break, i spoke to dr. chris murray at the university of washington said there is, quote, clearly a huge relationship between how much people are out and about, and how much transmission occurs, unquote. joining me now, two former

secretaries of the health and human services department. who served in the clinton administration, currently a congresswoman from florida. and katherine, who is the former governor of kansas. secretary, how concerned are you, first of all, about these new higher death toll projections and compared to what we're already seeing, which is people coming out, not wearing masks, and states opening up? 6. >> well, anderson, i'm very concerned and i think that we all should be concerned. we are a big country. we have a disease that's moving from spot to spot. i listen to scott gotlieb, the former head of the food and drug administration, over the weekend, who talked about the fact that we are in for a slow, simmering summer. where disease outbreaks are likely to occur. and what he said is that, although the last six weeks of mitigation, strong mitigation in some states, of staying at home

and social distancing and really locking down. definitely, had an impact. but it didn't have as much of an impact as people would have hoped. the curve has really not gone very much down. we're on a plateau, which means as we open up, as we continue to have hotspots in meatpacking plants and places like kansas, in nursing homes, in prisons all over this country, we are going to see outbreaks continue to occur. and i don't know any state, as a former governor, any state that has actually met the guidelines that the cdc put out. of 14 days of decline in disease. or is ready for the kind of massive contact tracing that we need to be able to do with testing, to isolate cases as they begin to reoccur. >> congresswoman, i mean, given what secretary was just saying, none of these states have really

met the 14-day criteria. do you -- i find it sort of stunning that, you know, obviously, president trump was embarrassed by suggesting that -- that, perhaps, studies should be done of injecting disinfectant into people. and, so, coronavirus task force briefings have stopped. it seems the like administration, now, essentially, just wants this to be a statewide effort, state by state, and not have the trump administration be the face of this, on a daily basis. >> you know, it's -- it's a stunning lack of leadership. and it's a human tragedy that's unfolding. each of these lives are precious. the administration should have hit this with a hammer. they -- they never purchased the testing supplies that would've been necessary. they never purchased the ppe. this should not have ever -- the supply issue should have never been left to the states. and the standards and the state strategies should have been

brought to the federal government, approved by them and, then, implemented by the states and funded by the states. a group of us have introduced a bill that does exactly that. but hitting it with the hammer was very important initially. and, instead, they went, tap, tap, tap, and basically said, okay, states, you decide. you purchase everything. and they left it to the states. you know, it's like the articles of confederation when they were sort of competing against each other. we are one country and demanded fabulous leadership and we just didn't get it. and hitting it with a hammer, it's our behavior. hitting it with a hammer and, then, asking people to stay at home as part of that strategy, it would've, at least, driven this downward. and, now, we're -- we're out there, opening up restaurants, with no testing. we're -- we have grocery stores

opened and everybody that works there is not being tested. we're not even testing all the people that are cleaning buildings, including our -- our hospitals. and we're -- we're falling further behind, in my judgment. even though it looks like we're leveling off. and i'm -- i'm scared to death about these frenetic openings and it's not like i like staying inside. i hate staying inside. >> well, secretary sevillius, what's your advice to people watching tonight? because it is frightening. obviously, look, everybody wants to get back to work, get back in business, and get going. you know, be outside. but this is not a situation where an individual just being responsible protects that individual. it's, your safety is dependent on other people, you know, behaving, or at least wearing a

mask. >> well, i think that, in many states, and i am fortunate to live in one where our governor has been excellent. every step along the way, we have a wonderful secretary of health and environment, who gives very clear, daily briefings, who believes in science. we follow the science and we're going to do that. the principal ioblem is, you kns the border, we have a governor who is not paying so much attention, and we have a big bi-state kansas city area where half the people are in missouri and half the people in kansas. we, desperately, need federal guidance. i'm terrified by the fact, now, that i hear that the administration, not only blocked dr. fauci from testifying in the house as requested on friday but, now, they're going to block task force members. and i'm really interested in the scientists. i'm not so interested in the politicians. i want the scientists to talk, clearly, to the american public about what is going on. i want cdc to put out federal

guidance on how contact tracing should be done. what are the cry tiiteria? how fast it should be done. and i'm hope donna and her colleagues in the house, as they have provided such terrific leadership, demand transparency on what is going on, and demand that the federal government step up with one voice. because, until we have some kind of confidence that we are getting a message, no one is going to leave their own neighborhood or their own block. you can rely on what you can see around you, until you have some confidence that there is some pattern of similarity, nobody's going anywhere. >> well, congresswoman, what happened? president talked about liberate michigan. liberate the scientists. if the president doesn't want to do coronavirus task force anymore, i get why he wouldn't want to after the last

performance. but why aren't we hearing from the cdc every day and national institutes of health? the cdc used to be a really respected organization. it seems like they have been muzzled or knee capped. >> in fact, they've muzzled lots of people including firing the ig at hhs, who put out a report that was so evenhanded, they literally must not have read it. and the idea of firing someone who has oversight is really outrageous. but the idea of telling tony fauci, one of the world's greatest scientists, that he can testify at the senate but not at the house because they don't want him to spend the time, after they have tied him up in -- in briefings and in meetings for, literally, two months, is really unacceptable. and it's unacceptable to muzzle

any scientist because we need clear information, as my colleague has just said. >> yeah. congresswoman, i appreciate your time. secretary, as well. up next, i will talk to ohio governor mike dewine about his state slowly reopening against the stark backdrop of a big jump in the projected death rates nationwide.

breaking news tonight, a key modeling projection, with the number of estimated deaths caused by the pam. 134,000 by early august, nearly double the last projection due in part to the lack of social distancing. this as dozens of states start to reopen.

mark dewine, ohio governor, joins us now. thanks for joining us. i know how busy you are. how concerned are you that your state, about the pace of opening, obviously always a balance, you're in a difficult position. how do you balance the new projections, with the modeling for the increases and the need to have people work and get back to their lives? >> that is the balance. and we think we can do two things at once. but obviously the news out today is very concerning. it should be concerning to every american. we're trying to balance it this way, you know. we've seen for about three weeks, a slight downward trend in hospitalizations, which we think it's good, we would like for it to be much, much more downward, and you know, we now have something we didn't have a couple of weeks ago, and that is a real capacity, in regard to testing. and we dramatically increased testing but with a contract, and

with ohio manufacturers making a lot of swabs, so we're going to have really a very vigorous tracing program, about 1800 people around the state of ohio, so that's one thing that we think that we can stay on top of this. but you're right. i watched your program tonight, and look, people, it's warmer weather, people want to get out, there is certainly more movement in ohio than we have seen before, and i think all of that is, it is natural, but what we're trying to get people to do is wear the masks when they go out and keep the social distancing, it is very, very important. >> so you said you have 1800 people for contact tracing. do you know what the number was prior to this? >> we don't have them yet. >> okay. >> that's the plan. we don't have them yet. >> what is -- >> we probably have 660, something like that now, which

is more than a third, to ramp that up, we have a crash program, to do that, but it's not going to come overnight. we know that. but it's just very important that we do that. the other thing we've done is we have slowly started to roll out, and gone into different industries, for example, we've got, we're talking about looking at restaurants, and bars, we have not done them yet, but we put together business working group, to work alongside health people, to come up with the best practices for everyone in the industry so it is not only about when we are going to do it but it is about how we're going to do it and we think with that business help, we've got the how down as well as we can get it down. >> >> you are talking about masks worn by people in stores, correct me if i'm wrong, there was a backlash to that, so you went back on that, and i wonder,

what is wrong with the idea of people wearing masks in stores, in a closed space, it is not even for them, it is for everybody else in the store, if that's not law, can a business still insist that people wear masks and if not, they don't come in. >> yes. no, absolutely, a business can do that. we are trying to change the course of wearing masks. and to show that it is exactly what you said it was, and that is, you're wearing it for someone else, is the right thing to do. what we came back with, though, is a mandate for every employee would have to wear masks. and as you pointed out, we wanted to mandate that for people who would go into a restaurant or people who would go into retail, the pushback we got was pretty hard. it became clear to me thats this this was just something that was a bridge too far, people were not going to accept a mandate from the government. what we're now doing is i'm

talking a lot about it, and we really you know, hope, that people, when they think about this, will understand that this is a very important thing to do. >> i want to play something that former new jersey governor chris christie said to dana bash today. >> of course everyone wants to save every life they, can but the question is, towards what end ultimately? are there ways that we can thread the middle here, because there are going to be deaths and there are going to be deaths no matter what, and if we can keep people in the mode of wearing dasks, wearing gloves, of distancing where appropriate, we've got to let some of these folks get back to work, because if we don't, we are going to destroy the american way of life and these families and it will be years and years before we can recover. >> well, i think what it boils down to, do you agree with what he's saying? >> well, i think that it's absolutely true that there are a

lot of costs, for high unemployment, and a huge crash in the economy that we have seen, and it is not all, it is social costs and obviously the economic costs but also medical costs, in the sense of health costs. you know, we generally, when the economy goes down, you see domestic abuse, for example, go up, you see depression go up, so there are in fact, a lot of costs. and so we're trying to do two things in ohio at once. and we're trying to do it very, very carefully. but i think that, you know, you are trying to do both of those things. but the bottom line really is ohioans have been great about distancing, they got us this far, they flattened the curve, they got us to the point where we are today and they're going to have to continue to do that if we're going to avoid a big spike in the number of cases, and see a dramatic increase in the number of deaths.

i have confidence that they can do that. but really, with the health director and what i do, it's really what people do in their own lives every day that has ultimately a huge effect across the state. >> i'm sure that you and the folks working with you are agonizing over these decisions. there is no easy answer. governor dewine, i appreciate your time. thank you. >> congratulations on the baby. >> thanks very much. appreciate it. more breaking news ahead, new reporting on what the american allies are saying about the origin of the virus. we'll be right back. the biggest week in television is almost here.

starting may 11, enjoy free access to the best shows and movies from favorites like hbo, showtime, starz and, for the first time ever, hulu and peacock! catch the show someone on twitter says is "omg cray," exclamation mark. don't look at me. or the one with the character with the eccentric name. (whispers to himself) oh, so that's who offred is. hi. even the one that's inspired all those memes. there they are! everyone's got a show to recommend. get ready to watch the best for free during watchathon week. a master'sdgren, youin chemical engineering., and you're technically a genius... and it appears you're quite the investor. i like to trade. well, td ameritrade has pros ready if you need help, say talking through a new strategy... ... just in case things, you know, get a little rocky? i'm sorry on the upside i think that's waterproof.

maybe not... ♪ breaking news tonight, the origins of the coronavirus, our national security news conference joins us. >> anderson, what we're hearing now is the trump administration pushing this line that the virus came out of a lab in wuhan is really at odds with some of the closest intelligence partners. there have been two main theories. it came out of a lab or it came out of the market. and i spoke with a western diplomatic official who says

that the intelligence assessment, this official has seen the intelligence, says that it is highly unlikely that this was a lab accident at the wuhan institute of virology, and rather highly likely that it was a natural occurrence, that the virus was passed from an animal, to a human. this is, according to this official, the growing assessment of the so-called intelligence chair, a crucial intelligence sharing coalition that the united states is part of along with canada and the united kingdom and australia and new zealand and i spoke with another official who concurred that this is their assessment, this is what makes the most sense. this is i should caution, anderson is an assessment. it is 100% there is no smoking gun according to the greater intelligence community. this, anderson, is not just a theory being pushed by the trump administration. sources have told us that senior officials like secretary of state mike pompeo has asked the intelligence agencies, including the cia, to find evidence that

lines up with this theory, that the virus came out of a lab. so far, the u.s. intelligence community has not given their own assessment. in fact, in a remarkable statement last week, they came out saying that they are still looking into both of those theories, that it either came from the lab, or it came from the market. anderson? >> alexander, appreciate it. thanks. president trump and secretary of state mike pompeo have been blaming china for causing the virus and chief white house correspondent jim accosta. what have the president and pompeo been saying about it? >> as alex was saying a few moments ago, they have been pushing this theory that it came out of a lab somehow. they have been pushing the line that it probably was more of a mistake in that lab in wuhan china and not a vial weapon. we heard the secretary of state on one of the sunday talk shows over the weekend saying there was enormous evidence that this came out of a lab and we heard the president at that town hall on fox say that he believes that this was some kind of terrible mistake on the part are of the

chinese and that they are embarrassed by it, and that they are embarrassed by it and covering it up. anderson, lacking at this point is any evidence to back up these claims. in addition to the skepticism that was expressed by the other intelligence communities for the u.s. partners, that alex was just talking about, a few moments ago, there are reservations about this theory inside the public health community. i can tell you a source close to the coronavirus task force has told me, that it is still the belief among some members on that task force that this started with an animal to human infection and not out of that lab and in the words of the source, every time one of these outbreaks occurs, there is a theory that it started in a lab in china, and it sometimes, it just doesn't pan out, that theory just doesn't pan out and you're seeing the administration try mightily to lean in that direction but they haven't presented the evidence to back it up yet. >> jim, appreciate it. i want to bring in david culver who has reported extensively on the virus, and gloria borger.

david, do you believe that china was stockpiling supplies and hiding the seriousness of the virus. does that align with your reporting? >> mishandling, coverup, some of the underreporting, balancing of whistle-blowers this is some of the many things that we highlighted early on in this, and to suggest though that this coverup was also coexisting with a stockpiling of some of these badly-needed ppe, doesn't really align. and those on the front lines early in january and february, there was a dire need. it wasn't that they were able to stockpile. they couldn't even meet the demand at the time because we knew medical personnel were getting infected, some in one hospital by the dozens and many losing their lives. it also became highly politicized. you will recall when one of the first evacuation flights took off january 29th there was a week delay to then evacuate more

american diplomatic from wuhan and what we learned shortly thereafter, there was a back and forth between the chinese and the u.s. government, over ppe. essentially, the aircraft coming into wuhan was coming in empty and that angered the aircraft. we need to have south korea and japan bringing in medical supplies. it was something that was very sensitive early on. it was badly needed here. that said, we are now at point where certainly the time to ramp up production, there is a surplus. >> gloria, china is certainly, there is a lot to point the finger out, there is a lot to be concerned about, their lack of transparency, a whole host of things, it certainly though also plays into president trump's favor, in terms of the election, in terms of making china the enemy, downplaying his own wasting valuable time, the lost month of february that this

nation had when the president was, you know pushing the idea that this was all going to disappear by april. >> well, they're looking for an easy scapegoat. and they clearly found one, i think, in china. china is not very popular in this country and internal republican polls show that china can be an easy scapegoat for them. but i think the problem they have here, anderson, is that this raises more questions. for example, if the president was so convinced that china's to blame, why did he consistently praise president xi more than a dozen times in january, february, even into march? why did he continue to communicate with him and say, you know, they've got it under control? was the president asleep at the switch here? was the president nor interested, for example, in getting a trade deal with china at this point, than getting at the truth? was the president not briefed?

was he not paying attention to his intelligence briefings? these are all questions that have to be answered and one day after the president said he was briefed on january 23rd, it wasn't a really scary briefing about coronavirus, he said that he had spoken with xi, and he said that they had been working very hard to contain the coronavirus, and we appreciate their effort, and their transparency. and he then went on to thank the president. >> yeah, and jim, obviously, transparency is something that they weren't being, the president said they were, and now the president, i assume, has talked to other people and realized the benefit of going after china and using that to dissuade people, or kind of shield his own failures. >> absolutely, anderson. i tried to press the president on this late last week and he

suggested that one of the reasons why he was praising china and praising president xi earlier this year because he was in the middle of the trade negotiations, trying to get the trade deal with china and you talk to trump surrogates, you look at republican memos handed out to candidates up on capitol hill, lawmakers were trying to keep their seat up on capitol hill, a lot of these internal strategy memos say blame china, defend or don't defend the president, but definitely blame china so it is a recurring theme inside the republican party at this point where the president has not adequately answered two things. one was why was he praising president xi, calling them transparent for months and months and months, and where is the evidence this is all china's fault? obviously there is a lot to criticize about china, they're a not the most transparent, they're a communist totalitarian regime and so on. it doesn't get the president out of the situation he is in now.

in many ways the president was asleep at the switch, he was downplaying this for weeks, and now there is a very catastrophic death toll in the making, anderson. >> thank you very much. up next, we remember those who died in this pandemic, including a five-month-old. we'll be right back. motor? nope. not motor? it's pronounced "motaur." for those who were born to ride, there's progressive. for those who were born to ride, [anthony] hey mama, what's up? [mama] i'm confused. confused about what, everything ok? yeah, i only see one price on my phone bill. that doesn't sound confusing mama. you're on t-mobile, taxes and fees are included. oh come on, there's always extra fees! not on t-mobile mama. why can't all my bills be like this?