out on having to pay u.s. taxes and then sending those same foreign-made drugs back to american consumers, all while raszi i raising their prices on prescription drugs that union families and working people have to rely on. and in the process, by the way, he's trying to do away with all health care in america. throughout the pandemic, we're seeing not only the inequity of this policy but the enormous vulnerability that this creates for our own health security, and our security requires us to have supply chains of the necessary drugs based here, not overseas, not overseas, in times of crisis. and what about trump's commitment to buy american? like the rest of president trump's promise, it has nothing to do with reality. it's all a bunch of hot air.

in fact, contracts awarded by u.s. governments to foreign companies using american tax dollars went up 30% since he's been president. so to recap. one, trump hasn't stopped companies from closing plants and sending jobs overseas. two, he's rewarding companies that have cut jobs and failed to invest here at home with billions of dollars in tax breaks. and, three, he's awarding more and more federal contracts to foreign companies. president trump has broken just about every promise he's ever made to the american worker, and he's failed. he's failed our economy and our country. but look. would you really expect anything different from this guy? from someone who called those of you and those who were serving in uniform, who have given their lives to the country losers and suckers? let me tell you something.

my son beau was an assistant u.s. attorney volunteered to go to kosovo to help them set up a government in the middle of a war. i know i'm being proud here, but he's the only foreigner who has a monument that they raised and built in service to him, thanking him for what he did. my son also then as attorney general volunteered to go to iraq for one year. he wasn't a loser or a sucker. no one who served this nation has been a loser or a sucker. they're all heroes. but would you expect anything different if someone could stand next to a father of a fallen soldier and say -- at a cemetery and say, i don't get it, what was it n it for them? what was in it for them? donald trump doesn't understand what it means to serve something bigger than yourself.

he doesn't understand duty, honor, country. he lives by a different code. lies, selfishness, greed. yes, donald trump and i have a pretty different philosophy when it comes to giving your word. mine means something. when i tell the american people i'm going to do something, i follow through. here in michigan you know that's true. when barack and i took office back in 2009 the economy was crashing. we inherited an economy in freefall, and millions of americans including so many right here in michigan lost their jobs, their homes, and their savings. with the help of debbie breaking her neck here, president obama and i worked hard. he put me in charge of the recovery act. i spent a lot of time here in michigan and in detroit working with you and senator stabenow

and thinking every single day about the folks on the factory line busting their necks just trying to put food on the table. a lot of folks were already to count detroit out as well as the auto american industry, to count it out, but i knew what debbie knew, i've known always. it's never a good bet to bet against the american worker. so when we promise to stand with the american auto industry, we deliver. we didn't do it topad paychecks and save ceos. we did it to save the iconic industry, to test the skills and ingenuity of american manufacturing, and the jobs of hundreds of thousands of american workers and the lifeblood of communities all across the midwest. it used to be in my state of delaware as well. when detroit dlared bankruptcy,

i was right here working alongside city leaders to get the lights turned back on, to revitalize the future of detroit. while 20,000 auto manufacturing jobs were lost, nearly 80,000 were creating during the obama/biden administration. i have a long history of not only talking about what i em going to do but delivering results for michiganders. now we need to do it again. we need to do the hard work not only to recover, but rebuild the economy back for the future once more. that's why my build back better agenda -- that's what it's all about -- starts right here with you and the union halls all across america. back in july i made the first plank of my agenda the plan to modernize american manufacturing and technology, to ensure that

the future is made in america by all of you. and today i'm announcing some additional steps to make this plank even stronger. first we're going to impose a tax penalty of companies that avoid paying u.s. taxes by offshoring jobs and manufacturing only to sell those goods back to the american consumer. if you're a big -- if your big corporate strategy is to boost your shareholders' profits and boost ceos pay by moving jobs out, we're going to make sure you not only pay full taxes on those profits, but we guarantee we're going to add 10% offshoring surtax to your bill. no more deductions or writing

off things. that could be here at home for qualified workers. i'm not looking to punish american business, but there's a better way. make it in michigan, make it in america, invest in our communities and the workers in places like warren. that's what this is about. uaw workers and others, you're the best craftsmen and women in the world, and you're right here. if you're trod make it in america, just like there are consequences for offshoring, there will be rewards and incentives for creating good jobs here at home. today i'm announcing my new american made in america tax credit, a 10% advanceable tax credit for companies that invest in the united states and american workers to help accelerate the recovery under our build back better agenda. so if your company revitalizes a

closing facility here in the united states like the transmission plant that got closed last year, we'll take care of 10% that that company makes if you reopen it. if you retool a manufacturing facility to make it more competitive, for example, by shifting to help build a new fleet of clean american vehicles made by uaw members, we'll make sure it's more than affordable for you. we'll make sure you get a tax credit. if you reshore jobs that have been sent overseas, expand your work in the united states or create manufacturing jobs, we'll make it easier for your company because we'll make sure you get a tax credit. you know, these two steps on top of my plans to close each and every one of the top trump loopholes he created in 2017

with his tax cut, to reward companies with big tax breaks for offshoring, that's going to end. if you're going to want to build things here in the united states because under our administration, you're going to buy american. it's been promised for almost a century, but we never lived up to it. the idea is simple. today the u.s. government spends about $600 billion of taxpayers' money on federal contracts annually, and that money should go to support american jobs and american businesses, but president trump has only ever treated it like it was a weak suggestion. the federal government can require -- can waive the requirement with explanations that trump doesn't bother to kick back on. we're going to change that when

i'm president. in my first week, aisle sign a series of executive actions to make sure we enforce buy american and direct the full purchasing power of the federal government to fulfill its promise starting by closing those waiver loopholes immediately. and i promise i'll use the full power of the defense production plan to buy america. roads, bridges, canals, airports. and i'm going to crack down on companies that label products as made in america even if they're coming from china and elsewhere. you know, we found out that on trump's watch, a company selling deployment bags to active duty troops being deployed falsely claimed its product was made in america when, in fact, it was really made mostly in china.

tr trump didn't do anything to respond. i'm not going to let that happen on my watch. we're going to have an office at the white house dedicated to making sure everyone is playing by the same "made in america" rules. and one more thing. when i say we're going to use the purchasing power of the federal government to reinvigorate domestic manufacturing, i mean it. we're going to do that with the american automobile industry as well. the united states government owns and maintains an enormous fleet of vehicles. we're going to convert those government vehicles into electric vehicles, made in america, sourced right here in the united states of america, with the government providing the demand and support to retool factories that are suggesting -- that are struggling to compete, the united states automobile industry will set up, expanding the capacity in the united

states, not china, to lead the world in clean energy vehicles. i can't wait to get us behind that all-electric corvette that goes 210 miles an hour. you all think i'm kidding. i mean it. last year that converted corvette set a speed record of 210.2 miles per hour, electric vehicle. so don't tell me we still don't make the best cars right here in the united states of america and trucks. we're going to make it easy to switch cars to electric vehicles. we're going to build all new infrastructure highways, charging staces across america, providing jobs for craftsmen all across the country. and by offering rebates and incentives to swap older fuel-efficient vehicles for newer cleaner american-made models, saving hundreds of millions of barrels of oil, and together this will mean --

listen to me now -- 1 million new jobs in the american automobile industry. 1 million. the supply chain as well as associated infrastructure. we can do this. we can do this. we can revitalize our industrial base as the heart of the american middle class. think about the worker in warren when the transmission plant closed he told a reporter, and i'm quoting him, getting a good gm job 23 years ago for me was like winning the lottery h e said. i was trying to start a family. i was able to buy a house. i went to disney world, all that. think about that. a job that felt like winning the lottery because it opened the door to a life you wanted for yourself, because it gave you

dignity dignity, allowed you to provide for your family. getting a good job in 2020 right here in america shouldn't be a lottery. it should be an absolute expectation for everyone. i don't accept the defeatist view that twe can't keep good jobs in america and keep paying for them. i don't buy for one second the vitality of american manufacturing is a thing of the past. we have the most qualified workers in the world. american manufacturing, it's the old exhibit you heard your grand pop or grandma say. guess what is it's going to be part of the engine of prosperity now in 2021. and we're going to make it happen with american grit, american determination, and american union workers.

look, folks. that's my promise to you. keep in mind, you know, back in the '30s they set up law relating to unions, it said not that you could have a union. it said the government should encourage unions. you're going to have the best, most friendly union president in the history of the united states of america when i'm in the white house. i want to thank you all for all you do. don't give up hope. don't give up hope. we can come back. we can come back stronger than we were before. i want to thank you all. i carry with me -- i don't have it -- i gave it to my staff. i carry it with me in my pocket a -- do i have that around?

anyone? where's my staff? i gave it away. anyway, i carry a schedule in my pocket that lists every single day the number of troops lost if there afghanistan and iraq, the number of wounded. this is my schedule. in the back of the schedule is always a black box. you can't really see it. the press may be able to. it says daily u.s. updates. troops died in iraq and afghanistan. 6,922. not over 6,000. 6,922 because every one of those women and men left behind an entire group of people who relied on them. u.s. troops wounded in iraq and afghanistan, 53,188.

not over 53,000. u.s. covid infected military -- excuse me. u.s. covid infected in america, 6,344,700. u.s. covid deaths, 1,-- 189,506. military covid infected, 118, 984. military covid deaths, 6,114. folks, every one of these lives matter. every one of these lives left somebody behind, grieving. you can't ever forget that, ever, ever forget it. i thank you all. god bless you. may god protect our troops. thank you. >> all right. i want to bring in chief

political correspondent dana bash and political correspondent abby phillips. so he was there in michigan. he's talking about the auto industry and talking about jobs. but very important was what he talked about at the top, abby, and we now know what the president said, and it's on tape to bob woodward. dana, what did you think about how the vice president row responded? >> it's about the life and death of american people is about as succinct as it gets. i think what's important is the way the vice president delivered it. he was trying to channel the anger and frustration of americans all across the country about the coronavirus, about the ripple effects from the coronavirus. all of those, you know, people who have died or have gotten sick, lost their jobs, parents who are home right now with their children trying to navigate virtual learning instead of sending them where

they should be, which is to school. so the fact that he is connecting, it goes back to the kind of candidate that they in the biden campaign and biden himself feels gives him an upper hand in these times, which is the empathy factor and leadership. he was also trying to say i can be a leader that he doesn't believe this president is. they believe, in the biden campaign -- i was texting with a source as he was speaking, that is one of the reasons that unlike other quotes and stories about the president that have, you know, gotten people very up in arms here in washington and in certain pockets of the country, that this is different because it is so relatable given how widespread the effects of this pandemic is. >> abby, he made a point of basically talking about how good is your word and how good is a promise, right? it matters if someone has

credibility. and he's saying that president trump doesn't and he does. and he also said -- he basically said president trump has cost many americans lives. said if he acted sooner, 56,000 would have been saved in march and april. >> and i think you saw actually in the way he ended, we talked about how he started, there talking about the woodward book. the way he ended that speech, pulling that card out that he says he carries with him in his pocket, a card that lists all the americans who are deployed currently in foreign lands, soldiers who are injured who were wounded in action, and also on that card, the number of americans dead from the coronavirus, the exact number. and he said that he doesn't round up those numbers, round down those numbers. he says the exact number. i think both of those things, those ideas, american military

deployed and wounded and killed in ak and also those killed from the coronavirus tie together these two devastating stories about president trump over the last week, "the atlantic" article about his disparaging remarks about the servicemembers killed in action. the woodward book, he wants this to be a referendum on donald trump. the speech was supposed to be about the economy wichlts about that. but it's about the whole picture. it's about his temperament. it's about his handling of the coronavirus, and it's also about this issue of jobs made in america. you know, i think it could not have been -- this moment could not have been more tailor-made for the biden message. it was clearly something that -- that last bit on the card, that wasn't in biden's speech. that was something he pulled out

of his pocket. it was an easy thing for him to do in that moment. that encapsulates how difficult it's going to be the next couple of months for president trump. >> dana and an ya, thabby, than much. breaking news, we have new details about president trump admitting he knew how dangerous coronavirus was even back in february. eve as he continued to downplay the coronavirus to the american people. bob woodward's book reveals explosive information about donald trump's handling of the coronavirus and there are recordings with what trump did for the book. it's on tape. our cnn correspondent is here. she has read the book. tell us what's in it, jamie. >> there are so many revelations in this book. his inner circle is just

scathing in their criticism of president trump. but there's no question that the headline is about coronavirus, and what woodward reports, and we have the audiotapes, the president in his own words, is much earlier than we had ever known, the president really had an understanding in striking detail of how dangerous coronavirus was. so the first audiotape i want to play for you is from the woodward/trump interview on february 7th. this is very early on when we're all thinking, oh, it's in china, it's not a problem, and you'll hear the president in his own words say it's airborne, it's highly contagious. here's the tape. >> and so what was president xi saying yesterday. >> well, we were talking mostly

about the virus, and i think he's going to have it in good shape, but, you know, it's very tricky situation. >> indeed it is. >> it goes through air, bob. that's always more difficult than the touch. you have to touch things. but the air, you just breathe the air, and that's how it's passed. that's a very tricky one. that's a very delicate one. it's also more deadly than your -- you know, even your strenuous news. you know, people don't realize. we lose 25,000, 30,000 people a year, right? >> i know. that's too much. what were you able to -- >> this is more deadly. this is five per -- you know, this is 5% versus 1% and less than 1%, eyou know, so this is deadly stuff. >> deadly stuff. and let's just remember this is from a president who to this day

mocks wearing a mask, but he knew on february 7 that it was airborne. the second part of the woodward interviews that we're going to play is from march 19th, and there are two critical parts. first, we know the president has repeatedly downplayed how dangerous this is for children and young people, even on august 5th. i think he said something like young children are immune. so the first part he's acknowledging, in fact, that he knows that young people are at risk, and in the second part, he admits that he is downplaying how dangerous the virus is. here's the tape. >> now it's starting out not just as old people, bob. yesterday and today startling facts came out. not just old people. >> yeah, exactly.

>> it's young people. >> give me a moment of talking to somebody going through this with fauci or somebody who kind of -- it caused a pivot in your this of, my god, the gravity is almost inexplicable and unexplainable. >> well, i think, bob, really, to be honest with you -- >> sure. i want you to be. >> -- i always wanted to play it down. i still want to play it down because i don't want to create a panic. >> you know, this wasn't just about panic. in the book, bob woodward asks president trump what he sees his most important role as president and he says to woodward, keeping the country safe and prosperous.

if he was keeping the country safe, he would have shared this with the american public. keep in mind, the american public dealt with 9/11, the american public dealt with pearl harbor. you wonder whether the prosperous part, whether he was more concerned about the economy and getting re-elected, and just in stark contrast, i think it's very important at the same time he's saying that to woodward, i want to remind everyone again what he's telling the public. >> and, again, when you have 15 people and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that's a pretty good job we've done. it's going to disappear. like a miracle, it will disappear. it will get worse before it gets better, maybe go away. we'll see what happens.

>> stay calm. it will go away. you know it's going away, and it will go away, and we're going to have a great victory. >> brianna, the book paints a devastating picture of a po betrayal of trust and leadership in woodward's words, and you have to wonder when you read it if president trump instead in early february had been decisive, had shut the country down, said, you know, wash hands, social distance, wear mask, how many tens of thousands of lives might have been saved. brianna? >> jamie, thank you so much for your excellent reporting today. i want to bring in jonathan reiner. dr. reiner, you heard what the president was saying public lly

and what he was saying privately. what's your reaction to all of this? >> well, it's stunning. many of us have wondered from the beginning how much of our pandemic response was incompetence and how much was malfe malfeasance, and now we know. the president basically knew from january this with as deadly virus, yet we didn't immediately ramp up testing. we didn't lay down ppe reserves. and time and time again the president told the public this was nothing, it was going away. he called it the flu. if there's a tornado coming toward town and you tell the people in that town that it's just a little bit of wind, people are going to die. so there was a tornado heading toward the united states at the end of january, and the president told us it was all

just going to blow away. so if you wonder why our response has been so poor, it's that the president of the united states had an irreconcilable conflict. he can choose his own electoral best practices, minimize the risk to the country, tell the country there was minimal risk, and maximize his chance of re-election, or he could do what jamie gengel just said, prepare the country early, close the country down early, insist everyone wear a mask and save lives. he choets nse not to do that. this is stunning. this is real stunning. >> i wonder. you say he was choosing basically between his political fortunes and health of the united states, but shouldn't it be one in the same. >> right. >> that the health reaction to

minimize lives d i mean you heard this cost american leaves. now the president knew. he had information. he knew at least previously. what does that mean for american lives that could have been saved and, quite frankly, for their loved ones who are hearing it? >> first of all, it's a false choice. when you talk to consultants, they tell you his history was to put the pandemic down, not to try. putting pandemic down was his true path go victory. the president knew this was a respiratory package. on january 28th, he was briefed by his national security adviser and the deputy national security adviser who told him that this

was a respiratory pathogen and it was being spread in china by asymptomatic people, yet the president still did not endorse wearing a mask. a month later his surgeon general scolded the country against wearing masks. until this day the president still tells reporters not to wear a mask. but he's known sense january this is a respiratory pathogen. he's placed his interests ahead of the country's. the deaths of tens of thousands of americans are on this man's hands. >> he said it. february 7th. you just breathe the air. dr. jonathan reiner, thank you so much. your words are powerful. we thank you.

>> thank you. >> this new book shows he's a danger to the country. bernstein who wrote the watergate scandal with bob woodward will join me next. managing type 2 diabetes? you're on it. staying fit and snacking light? yup, on it there too. you may think you're doing all you can to manage type 2 diabetes and heart disease... ...but could your medication do more to lower your heart risk? jardiance can reduce the risk of cardiovascular death for adults who also have known heart disease. so, it could help save your life from a heart attack or stroke. and it lowers a1c. jardiance can cause serious side effects including dehydration, ...genital yeast or urinary tract infections, and sudden kidney problems. ketoacidosis is a serious side effect that may be fatal. a rare but life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this bacterial infection, ketoacidosis,

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back now with stunning rev lags from bob woodward, the award-winning journalist revealing what top national security advisers really think of the president. here's how they describe him on the record. former secretary-general james mattis saying trump is, quote, dangerous and unfit and has no

moral compass. dan coats says, quote, president trump doesn't know the difference between a truth and a lie. joining me now is carl bernstein who, of course, broke the watergate scandal with bob woodward in a series of reports. carl, thank you so much for being with us today. tell us what your reactions are to the revelations we're learning of? >> it's stunning, and i think we all need to take a deep breath and understand exactly what it is we have learned. we are listening to the president of the united states on tape deliberately undermining the security -- national security of the united states, the health and well being of the people of the united states, and he's doing this knowingly, in realtime. it is the smoking gun of his negligence. and as those quotes you were talking about from mattis and

others, dem straight his unfitness to the president and more than anything, instead of leveling with the country, he covers up. we listen to him cover up this grave national emergency. this is one of the great presidential felonies of all time, maybe the greatest presidential felony. and we have the smoking gun tape of the president committing the felony. >> there are recordings like you said. there's a smoking gun tape. it will be hard for the president to deny what he said, but i think we already got a preview of what's going to happen coming from the white house press briefing today, has kayleigh mcenany lied and threw out information which was inaccurate, some of which was misleading. there's going to be a full asaumt coming from the white house on what is in this book. >> yes, there will be. it's up to republicans

especially to counter that lie. at this point if the republican leadership, mcconnell, mccarthy, and others try to contradict this obvious grave dereliction of duty by the president of the united states that is captured on tape, they, too, are responsible for what has happened here. look. let's talk about what this really is. this is a kind of homicidal negligence. thousands and thousands and thousands of people have lost their lives because the president put his own re-election interest. as we hear on the tapes and see throughout bob's book, he is putting his own narrow presidential re-election efforts in front of the safety, health, and well being of the people of the united states. we've never had a president who's done anything like this before. six days, seven days after he was told about the gravity of

this pandemic and its potential and pathogens and what has been unleashed in the air, he had a state-of-the-union address like roosevelt would have done, any other great american president, any other competent concerned american president would have gone before the state of the union and the congress and said, we have an enemy and such that we have never seen and we have a national emergency and we must join together and fight. and, instead, on tape, time after time after time and through the narrative of bob woodward's book, we've seen the president put his narrow own sel sel self-interest ahead of the country. it's a dereliction of duty records as no other dereliction of duty has been, even more so than the nixon tapes in this instance. so it's going to be very hard to see how this cannot be addressed by republicans in particular and

their candidate for president of the united states. the last time this happened during the end of nixon's presidency, the republican party went to the white house and told nixon he had to resign. and the facts here are even graver than in watergate. >> you are aware, of course, this is coming on the heels just a few days after this "atlantic" report, "the atlantic report" the president had callen the fallen american war heroes as losers and suckers and a bunch of other disparaging things that he said about those who served in the military. and in this book, woodward writes an aide to mattis, the defense secretary heard the president say my effing generals are a bunch of "p" words.

they care more about alliances than trade deal. heard this coming out from his defense officials, his military leaders as opposed to trying to cover his tracks with the rank-and-file military. but what's the revelations of this book being coupled with the revelations confirmed by numerous outlets of what trump has said about the military? >> bob woodward's book is the definitive account of donald trump's negligent presidency, and the negligence in terms of how he views the military leaders of this country, what we saw in "the atlantic" and what we see in bob's book combined is once again the big lie is donald trump and the con man front that he has put on all throughout his life and through his presidency page after page after page on tape after tape after tape. there's more than 20 hours of tape that bob has gotten here that can be listened to.

and what you hear time and time again is the president forgetting about the national interest, selling out the national interest, minimizing the national interest, and putting in his own interest, that of his family, that of his own finances. everything but the sake of the country itself and the well being of its people and its ininstitutions. he has undermined our well being. that is the text of this book, not a subtext. it's the text of those tapes, ujds mi undermining our well being deliberately for his own ends. it is stunning and as i say, a presidential felony unlike any we've known of in our history. and it's up to us in the press now to put this in the context of the press now and calling in the historians and calling in the republicans and say what about this, what happened here,

what did this president do that is captured on these tapes that are even more devastating than nixon's tapes. >> carl, thank you so much. carl bernstein, we really appreciate you being with us. >> thank you. we have breaking news, a whistle-blower coming forward where the president trump asked intel reports to match what he was saying publicly. once again president trump asked voters to break the law and vote twice. a famed lawyer will blow a hole in the president's claims of voter fraud.

one of the most pre-eminent republican lawyers is speaking. he's been an attorney for nearly 40 years and has represented gop candidates including both of

mitt romney's campaigns and played a central role in florida's re-election recount says trump's accusations are -- >> he wrote this. at long last they have a blatant example of a major politician urging his supporters to illegally vote twice. the only hitch is that the candidate is president trump. it was just last night at a campaign rally in north carolina that the president most recently encouraged his supporters to vote twice. >> they're going to send out millions of ballots to you, people that never really thought in terms of it. now, sometimes you'll ask for a ballot. that's a solicited ballot. that's okay. you have to go through a process, sign a form. sending out millions of unsolicited ballots, make sure you send a ballot and go to your polling place and make sure it

counts. make sure it counts. the only way they can win is by doing very bad things. that's the only way. >> now, this is something the president has suggested repeat udly in the last few weeks even after election officials pointed out it's illegal. >> you can mail that back, get it and mail it back. it's a much more fair way of doing it as you know. and then you can go to vote on election day and if the system is correct like they say, and it should be correct, they say it's correct, you go to vote, and if your ballots are in, if they counted, they will have counted your vote, and you won't be able to vote, which is good. >> let them send it in and let them go vote. and if their system is as good as they say it is, then obviously they won't be able to vote. >> sign your mail-in ballot, okay? you sign it and send it in, and then you have to follow it. and if on election day or early

voting that is not tabulated and counted, you go vote, and then if for some reason after that -- it shouldn't take that long -- it comes in, they're not going to be able to tabulate it because you will have voted. >> ben ginsburg is joining us. thanks for joining us. your columbia has ben has been important thing in setting up stras when it comes to mail-in and voter fraud. i should also mention you write in this column, ben, these were painful conclusions for you to reach, but here you are. tell us how you got here. >> well, they are painful conclusions to reach. i spent 38 years as part of republican election day operations being sure that there wasn't fraud and abuse at the polls and the ballots were counted as krechlkt we were very

vigilant inand to be sure every cycle there are random cases but not many. and all of this time, the lack of proof that elections are rigged or fraudulent should be what governs the parties policies and for the president's words and for the president to cast doubt on the credibility of the election, by saying that they're fraudulent or that the results are rigged is simply not backed up by what has been found by the legions of republican election lawyers in the polling places. >> so why do you think he's saying these things? why is he laying this groundwork repeatedly? >> i'm not sure i know the motivation behind it. i think there is some confusion on understanding the basic facts. there are nine states in the country that mail ballots to all registered voters.

live ballots. i think that is a bad policy because it can lead to doubts about the credibility of results, if there is a lot of random ballots around. people move and die, the voter rolls are not accurate and not uniformly maintained in all states. so, he's got a case in among the target states, nevada and colorado, that in all of the -- >> oh, no. let's try to re-establish ben's signal. we're going to get a quick break. and that is life in the middle of this pandemic. but we just re-established our connection with ben. i was trying to kill a little time in the hopes that worked out. thank goodness it did. so you were saying colorado and nevada. >> so colorado and nevada are two states that are target states that mail out ballots to

all registered voters. it is a problem because the voter rolls are not always completely accurate. people move and die. so there are live ballots in those states that could create problems. in other states, ab sent or mal-in balloting, the process is the same between states, is not subject to the same thing the president is talking about. so the rhetoric about cheating and ballots being sent out willy-nilly is not accurate under the facts of the laws of the different states. >> so, what happens if people take the president's advice and they vote twice? they mail in a ballot and they go and vote in person? >> well, anyone who decides to do that should look to the south of north carolina to georgia where the attorney general and trump ally announced today that they actually had caught people

who they believe voted twice. once by the polls and once through absentee balloting and the attorney general said he's going to prosecute them. typically these fall away where there are people who just get confused. but the fact that the georgia attorney general felt the need to prosecute the exact advice that the president has been giving to people should be pause for anyone who does want to follow the president's advice. >> so you mentioned in your column, you're talking about just how minuscule fraud is. 1,296 cases according to the conservative heritage foundation data base for all elections, not just presidential elections. this is all elections since 1982. i know you highlighted colorado and nevada and other places that are sending out mail-in votes. but what is your overall assessment of the risk of voter fraud here? >> well, what has been proven,

what is there would indicate it is pretty darn minimal. you have to assess the threat based on the facts that have actually been uncovered over the last four decades. and, again, you could look at the heritage site and it is really scant evidence upon which to base claims of wholesale voter fraud. and remember that trump impanelled a presidential commission to look for this fraud and abuse. he appointed the most vociferous advocates and the commission disbanded without being able to find anything at all. and so the opportunity to make the case that there is widespread fraud has been there over the years and in the specific commission and the proof has not been developed. >> ben, you were involved in the

2000 recount where we didn't know who the president was for weeks after the election. given the extra time counting remaining ballots this go around, how long would you anticipate it takes for the country to know who the next president is? >> well that obviously depends on the results on election night and how close things look on election night. states have varying deadlines on which absentee ballots could come in and be counted. they all have to be post marked by election day. but some states have three days, some states have a week. some states have more. just look at new york's congressional primary elections and how long they took. so that it is possible that the outcome will not be known for a long time. brianna, what you have to keep in mind is that once the results are known, that is where recounts -- >> how long do you think, then? do you have any sense of that? >> well, look, last election

cycle, on november 26th, hillary clinton's campaign intervened in the pennsylvania recount started by jill stein. so that four years ago hillary clinton's campaign thought there were still things to contest three weeks after the election. so i'm going to guess december 1st. >> december 1st, all light. ben ginsburg, thank you so much. >> thank you. breaking news now. serious allegations from a whistle-blower in the department of homeland security. he's accusing acting dhs secretary chad wolf and ken cuccinelli of repeatedly directing officials to alter intelligence reports to line up with the president's misleading public comments. both wolf and cuccinelli tried to alter a report to downplay the threat posed by white supremacists whilestering the threat that leftist groups pose out of concern how the initial language would reflect on the president. this is according to documents

that have been reviewed by cnn and a source familiar with the situation. i want to go to evan perez. who is this whistle-blower and what was he instructed to do. >> his name is brian murphy and he ran the homeland security intelligence section and what they do is they provide intelligence reports that get sent out to state and local governments to know what is happening across the country with regard to intelligence, the intelligence that they're getting. and one of the things that he says in this complaint that he's filed with the homeland security inspector general is that according to him chat wolf, ken kuchenely urged him to match what the president is saying outside on the campaign trail and what the president and the white house has been saying from the white house regarding the threat from antifa and anarchist groups that the intelligence reports should be coming, that

should match what the president has been saying, that there is a greater threat from these leftist groups and less of a threat from these white supremacist groups that the homeland security department was trying to issue a warning about. there is a separate allegation that he's made, he said that according to him the department was also instructed to downplay the threat from russia with regard to election interference and to emphasize the threat that was posed by china. now that also matched the rhetoric from the president who doesn't really want to hear, we've heard this repeatedly from officials who left the department and who left the administration, the president doesn't want to hear about the threat from russia. he wants to hear about the threat posed by china in part because the russians are trying to help his re-election according to the intelligence community. so these are now reported that are being filed by the homeland security inspector general and we expect that democrats at the

house intelligence committee are going to call brian murphy to testify to hear more about these allegations against that top officials were getting instructions on how to match the intelligence reports with what the president is saying. >> and who is he specifically saying gave him these instructions to alter these reports? >> he said these were instructions that were coming from the homeland security chief of staff, essentially, and in some of the arguments he was having them directly, according to him, with chad wolf as well as ken cuccinelli from homeland security. and he also said that according to some of his conversations with the homeland security officials, these were coming directly from robert o'brien who is the white house chief of staff, brianna. >> national security adviser. >> that is right. the national security adviser.

>> thaings change, but you neve know. evan perez, thank you so much. i appreciate it. and the president's former attorney michael cohen who wrote his own book will be interviewed by don lemon tonight at 10:00 eastern only on cnn. and our special coverage continues now with brooke baldwin. brianna, thank you so much. hi there, i'm brooke baldwin and you're watching cnn. we have a lot to talk about today. we're going to begin with stunning revelations about president and the handling of the coronavirus. more than seven months after the first confirmed case with 6 million americans infected and nearly 200,000 dead and after the president publicly downplayed the threat of covid as recently as this summer, we're now learning that he was telling veteran journalists bob woodward the exact opposite. back in february, shortly after that first case was