a lot on the debate, but we begin with breaking news. it's huge in its own right. shortly before we came to air, a piece of investigate reporting hit the "new york times" website. the subject is president trump's taxes. donald trump paid $750 in federal income taxes the year he won the presidency. in his first year in the white house, he paid another $750. not 750,000. $750. he paid no income taxes at all in ten of the previous 15 years according to the "new york times." largely because he reported losing much more money than he made, they said. "the times" report is headlined long-concealed records show losses and years of tax avoidance. they write, the "new york times" has obtained data extending over more than two decades for mr.

trump and the hundreds of companies that make up his business organization including detailed information from his first two years in office, it does not include his personal returns for 2018 or 2019. "the times" continue, his reports to the irs portray a businessman who takes in hundreds of millions of dollars a year, yet racks up losses. the financial disclosures he makes is a public official versus what he told the irs for the same time period. i'm quoting from "the times," in 2018, for example, mr. trump announced in his disclosure that he had made at least $434.9 million. the tax records deliver a different portrait of his bottom line, $47.4 million in losses. the reporting paints a picture of a man under sharp financial pressure, details a string of other moves. that said as "the times" report concedes it does not reveal the president's wealth and it does

not reveal any previously unreported connections to russia. it does reach a conclusion quoting the authors again from "the times," ultimately they write mr. trump has been more successful playing a business mogul than being one in real life. joining us now is tim o'brien author of "trump nation." as someone who is familiar with president trump and how he likes to present his wealth and you worked on the bloomberg campaign as well, what was your reaction when you saw this "new york times" story? does it square with the donald trump you profiled and tangled with in court? >> it absolutely does, anderson. this is the donald trump who is portrayed and these tax returns is someone who engineered a massive tax cut for corporate america and for the most affluent americans while avoiding paying anything in taxes, literally almost anything.

$750 the year he was elected president at a time when he was saying he was worth $10 billion which i can assure you he's lying when he says he's worth $10 billion. he's worth a small fraction of that at best. i think the tax return shows that he's deeply indebted, i expect. he's always been much more indebted than he's disclosed publicly. the taxes show that he's a bad businessman and deal maker, but someone who is not shy about bending the tax code to the point that the irs is now auditing him. in order to keep preserving as much money as he can for himself. there's no president in the modern era who comes close to donald trump in terms of rigging his own finances while taking his hand -- or putting his hand constantly in the public till and not doing anything properly in terms of public policy that

would make the tax system more equitable. i think reporters have known this about donald trump for decades. i think the beauty of what the "new york times" did tonight, they put numeric clothing on it. trump can't deny what he's written in his own tax return. >> this is all based on what -- on trump's presentation to tax authorities, not on what the irs themselves found in any investigations or audits that are going on or maybe going on or have. there's one long-term one that "the times" talked about. ivanka trump was being paid as a member of the trump administration, as an employee, she also was getting consulting fees for a whole variety of stuff which allowed him, i guess, to deduct money -- even more money that he didn't have to pay in taxes and according to the report, president trump personally has guaranteed hundreds of million dollars of dollars in loans many of which are coming due in the next four

years. it certainly -- for anybody who thinks, this doesn't really matter, we all know he was a fabulous -- he wasn't as wealthy as he said and has been hiding his taxes. if there's another four years, it does kind of raise the specter of what -- if he's in bad financial shape, what he has to do to make money and earn more money while he's still in office. >> and how ready and willing he would be to i think corrupt the white house even further in order to pad his own wallet. he's never separated himself from his businesses when he came on as president, his longtime accountant and two sons run the business. i can guarantee you there's no meaningful distance between him and them when it comes to money and the business. i think some of the other details that are important in the tax returns are the extent to which he writes off absurd

expenses against his business accounts including paying for things like getting his hair done. i try to list some of these things without laughing -- >> $70,000 it was for a year on the "the apprentice." >> right. and the children will say things like their golf estate north of new york city is a family residence when they're promoting it. but they then treat it like a business expense when tax time comes. there's a lot of fodder here for the irs to dig into. i think what's really important amid all of the numbers and everything that's coming out in this is, you have in the numbers a portrait of a president as a con man and a long-term drifter. donald trump is probably the most successful con man in modern history and he's wound up in the white house and he's been

perverting public policy and corrupting people around him including members of his own cabinet and his own children in service of that. when you see what's in the numbers, that can't be denied any longer. >> you know, when the whole -- whether it's years from now or whenever the whole truth comes out, what a tale this is of our times that we have been riding along in. ti tim o'brien, thank you. what did the president have to say when asked about this? >> reporter: he said exactly what you would expect. he didn't address the specifics in this massive "new york times" expose. he deflected, said, well, i paid a lot of state taxes. he criticized the "new york times," said they were going after him because he was a conservative republican. he said the entire thing was fake news. >> basically -- first of all, i paid a lot and i paid a lot of state income taxes too. the new york state charges a lot and i paid a lot of money to the

state. it will all be revealed. it's going to come out after the audit -- i'm being -- they're doing their assessment. we've been negotiating for a long time. things get settled like in the irs. but right now when you're under audit, you don't do that. so we're under audit. but the story is a total fake and all of this -- we had the same exact questions usually asked by the same people and that took place four years ago. you remember. >> reporter: it's important to remember, anderson, that this is not the first time this issue has come up. it came up four years ago. in fact, we're two days from the first debate. four years ago in the debate, hillary clinton discussed this precise issue and the president bragged about it. >> the only years that anybody has ever seen were a couple of years when he had to turn them over to state authorities when he was trying to get a casino license and they showed he didn't pay any federal income

tax. so -- >> that makes me smart. >> reporter: now the question is going to be, do all of those voters and taxpayers who have paid a lot more than $750 over the last several years, are they going to look at this after four years of the trump presidency and say, donald trump paid that little because he's smarter than me or was it for some other reason? is he compromised in some way in the performance of his duties because of this financial pressure and you can bet that joe biden in the first of these four presidential debates is going to bring that up on tuesday night. >> appreciate it. the debate, how joe biden is preparing and our political professionals on what to expect and what role this may play. later, what it's like to go up against donald trump on the debate stage. someone who has, john casic. ♪ don't know what it is ♪ ♪ get a dozen double crunch shrimp for one dollar with any steak entrée. only at applebee's.

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which has taken 205,000 lives in this country on his watch or americans losing health insurance, it's likely to factor into tuesday night's debate. has the biden campaign responded to "the times" story about president trump's taxes? >> reporter: joe biden's campaign has not responded yet to this story about the president's taxes. bu but biden has pressed president trump to release his tax returns. he said the president should release them or shut up. even earlier this week when he was campaigning, biden talked about the fact that the president hasn't released those tax returns. he suggested that the reason the president hasn't done so, he doesn't want americans to know how much he paid. this was all part of biden's pitch as he's tried to lean into his own working class roots as one between scranton, pennsylvania, and park avenue, talking about president trump. and biden has released a lot of

tax returns, more than two decades back in 2008 when he ran for vice president, he released ten years, and then he released all of those tax returns while he was still in office and even two years after he left office. we're still waiting to hear exactly how biden will respond to this. but it has been common for him to push for the president's tax returns out on the campaign trail. >> do you know how the biden campaign is preparing for the debates? how joe biden is preparing for the debates? >> reporter: we know that joe biden has been meeting with his top advisers and one thing we'll be waiting to see is how they might incorporate this story and this report into their debate strategy. biden has been huddling with his top advisers and preparing for what he believes will be personal attacks for the president. a long time biden adviser is running it who ran hillary clinton's debate prep back in

2016. bob bower, a former white house counsel in the obama administration has played president trump in one of the debate prep sessions. right now, his campaign and his advisers, they're trying to hone in in these final days on how they're going to respond to the president in this debate as biden himself as said he believes it will turn very personal. >> one of the things that former vice president biden has said is that he will be fact-checking the president on the stage. obviously, there's a lot of -- a lot that can go wrong with that and most of which is you can eat up all of your time talking about what the other person just said as opposed to talking about what you would be doing. >> reporter: yeah, that's right. that's something that they're going to have to consider as they're heading into tuesday night. they have acknowledged that it's not going to be possible for biden to fact-check every claim from the president. now, the biden campaign has suggested that's the job of the moderator, the commission has

said, that's not the moderator's job, that's up to the candidate to fact-check their opponents in the debate. but they will have to deal with that heading forward. and biden has said that the president doesn't know how to debate on the facts. biden says he doesn't understand domestic and foreign policy and biden's people acknowledge that he's very well versed in policy having served in the senate for many years as well as the white house. but as he heads into that debate, he's going to be looking for how to not just go after president trump, but also lay out his own clear vision for the country going forward. >> thank you very much. let's get perspective from david axelrod and abby phillip. the president's refusal to release his tax returns has been one of his longest-running controversies. he says he's still under audit. his attorneys put out a statement saying his returns prior to 2008 are not being audited. still he hasn't released anything.

how damaging do you think this "new york times" report might be? >> well, look, it's voluminous and there are so many different angles, some of which are legal. if you were making representations on your tax reform -- on your tax forms that that speak to great losses and you inflate your revenues in order to get loans or insurance, that creates fraud and that is apparently what the core of the district attorney in manhattan is looking at and that's why they've asked for the president's tax returns and presumably it's why the president has fought so vigorously not to have him get those tax returns. what effect it has on this race, i really don't know. the president has abysmal ratings in terms of honesty and integrity. many people assume he doesn't want people to see how much he

has or hasn't paid. you were a witness at the cnn town hall with joe biden to a strategic shift on his part where he was really emphasizing his roots in scranton -- >> scranton people versus park avenue. >> right. i think this feeds into that and my guess is that, you know, he will hold trump up as an example of someone who has had great privilege and has scammed the system while people in scranton, work hard, pay their taxes and do what's expected with them and he'll identify himself with that and that can be very powerful. >> according to the "new york times," donald trump started technically getting money from his dad when he was 3 years old and there were hundreds of millions of dollars that he ultimately inherited from his father in various schemes that they did in terms of avoiding taxes and shifting it over to baby donald trump at that time.

it's interesting, though, abby, do you think the -- do you foresee the biden campaign trying to focus on this a lot? again, it's not clear if it may have an immediate impact? >> yeah, i think that's the biggest question that i have about all of this as much of a bombshell as this report is, i do think it seems to confirm a lot of people that people already felt about donald trump or perceived about him over time and even what you just described that the president basically inherited virtually everything has, got a multimillion dollar head start into entrepreneurship, that's something that played into the 2016 race as well. that would not necessarily be new information to voters but i think what we found four years ago was that many voters simply didn't believe that. his brand as the sort of the "the apprentice" figure was

something that a lot of voters felt like they believed. so i don't know that this is going to change people on either side of the equation. those who want to believe that donald trump is a successful businessman and those who believe he's a con man. on the other hand, i do think that this is just one other thing that trump has to now deal with and i think his explanations are growing increasingly thin. there's so much documentation now that seems to suggest that he's hiding his tax returns because he doesn't want to show he's not paying taxes and just the sort of deceptive part is part of the picture that the biden campaign might want to paint. by and large, they have a bigger challenge which is showing the american people what joe biden is going to do for them and i think all of this is going to be in the atmosphere around that as well. >> david, this does have real-world ramifications especially if president trump gets a second term. if he's beholden and has personal loans, you know, that he's guaranteed for hundreds of million dollar of dollars that are going to be coming due, "the

times" says that he's received money from the philippines, from turkey, as well as other places during the time he's been in office, is that the reason he constantly praises erdogan and allowed him to move into syria and move the kurds out and try to wipe out the kurds. >> you have autocrats in the philippines and india as well. one of the things that was stunning in the piece was that while he was not paying taxes, apparently not paying taxes to the u.s. government, he was paying taxes to the philippines, to india and panama for licensing deals. yeah, i think the -- you know, the story does detail ways in which the president has monetized his office to his own benefit and it does raise the question of what would happen if he was unbridled by the need to run for re-election, if he was

so brazen in his first four years. but, again, i think abby is saying the same thing, so much of this is baked in the cake with donald trump. so much of it is known or suspected his loyal followers will i'm sure accept his word that this is all fake news even though he could release his tax returns at any time. his own irs commissioner said there's no prohibition against releasing your tax returns even if you're under audit. that's just a diversion. i'm not sure that it changes the basic structure of things. one of the things joe biden has to be careful about in this debate is not to just chase rabbits down the hole. he needs to focus on how this election impacts on americans and their lives and, you know, i think he's going to want to talk about, for example, pre-existing conditions and the affordable care act and the thread that it's hanging by now with the supreme court appointment. that is a more valuable way to spend your time than getting la

economic picture of donald trump. >> during the debate, the president will say that all people in his position, you know, try to do everything they can to avoid paying taxes. what's interesting in "the times," i think they said of the -- it's not even the top 1%. it's like of the 0.0001% people, the richest of the rich, pay about 24% -- i think according to "the times" -- where president trump is radically paying nothing for years and years and years. even among super, superwealthy people, if indeed the president is among that group, he's not doing it. >> yeah. it is a really extraordinary. there's a part in this article that really boils it down to this which is, how they basically say that he made a lot of money off of his name and his brand and then avoided paying taxes by writing off losses on

all of his business dealings over years and years and years and i thought it was fascinating that we've been talking about this sort of magical audit that this president has been under for so long and we actually got a lot of details about what that audit is and "the times" indicates that he's under audit because the irs is challenging the president's seeking of an 80 million tax refund which is an extraordinary amount of money and so i think it really does open up a little bit more of the book of what is really going on here with his finances. >> thank you -- >> let me just say if i could -- >> i got to go. >> i was going to say, you know, this ties into -- he feels that people who served in the military are suckers and he feels like people who pay taxes are suckers and there's a lot of people who pay taxes and a lot of people who serve their country who may resent that. >> david, abby, thanks.

what citizen donald trump said about president barack obama's taxes. there's a tweet for everything. yet again, it is proven. and ree moment that things, for one strange time in our lives, got very quiet. some lost work and invented new ways to get by. others were busier than ever, and found strength they never knew they had. we sheltered with the people who matter most, sometimes finding how far apart we'd drifted. we worried over loved ones, over money, over our planet. and over take-out. and we found a voice one the noise out there had kept quiet. when the world starts spinning again, let's remember this time where none of us felt secure, and fight for a future where everyone can. because when the world seems like it's standing still...

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a book that you're ready to share with the world? get published now, call for your free publisher kit today! breaking news tonight, the "new york times" is reporting on president trump's tax returns, according to "the times," the president paid just $750 in federal income tax in 2017 and 2016. the year he took office. "the times" report paints a picture of a businessman who is struggling to keep his businesses afloat and was reporting millions in losses as he was campaigning about president even boasting about his financial success. take a look at this tweet from citizen trump in 2012 by

president obama. quote, barack obama only pays 20.5% on his salary. do as i say, not as i do. perspective now from rick santorum and van jones. the president is still claiming audits for not releasing his tax returns even the ones his attorneys have pointed out are not being audited. would it behoove him just to release them or not? >> i don't think it would. just makes more news. he's decided maybe for the reasons the "new york times" laid out that they would not necessarily be good news for him and so it's better to stonewall. i don't think it's -- it doesn't seem to have cost him anything in popularity to not release those reports. so i think there's very, very little chance he's going to do

so. >> right. for the american people, though, trying to figure out if somebody should be re-elected and serve as president, doesn't this raise the stakes and raise, again, the issue of though it's not required, everybody has done this, releasing their tax returns to know who this president owes tens of millions or hundreds of millions of dollars too? >> yeah, again, i think david was right in the previous segment. i think a lot of people sort of baked it into the cake that the president is -- you know, has some dealings that are -- let's just say not ordinary and that those are things that they've sort of already figured out. as it is with a lot of the traits of donald trump that are -- let's just say less than desirable. people have looked at that and say, okay, fine, but look at what he's doing, look at the policies he's putting forward, look what he's doing for the country and the economy and in

trade and a whole bunch of other things that they believe are important. the court, et cetera, and i think that's what they're going to vote on, not personal things that are problematic for him. >> van, on the side of the menu, i don't know it's the side of the menu of not ordinary. it seems to be the unsavory items on the menu that the president is concerned about. he blasted of course the reporting for the "new york times." i'm sure it's what he'll say on the debate stage. i'm wondering what your reaction is. >> first of all, you can see now why he did not want this stuff to come out. the poorest person i know paid more in taxes than donald trump. i think that's just shocking to anybody. and i do think that some stuff is baked into the cake, but there is something here that i think is new and is different and it's concerning. i think people say, listen, he's a smart business guy, he gets away with paying fewer taxes, that's great. you feel people who feel that way. others will feel differently. that's already out there. here's what's new, his brand is,

i'm strong. his brand is, i'm independent. his brand is, nobody can tell me what to do. if it turns out he's a weak loser who is in hoc to other countries, not in office trying to solve your financial problems, he's trying to solve his own and he's vulnerable to anybody who can call these loans in? that's a very different discussion. that is a very different deal. i think people are going to have to take this on board. this isn't shenanigans as usual for donald trump. this dude is in desperate need for money and you got the paperwork to show it. >> van, the only thing i would say to that -- sorry, anderson. there's a credibility issue. there's a credibility issue from the "new york times" and from the mainstream media to the people who are voting for donald trump or considering voting for donald trump. and so, you know, here it is, a

month before the election, october surprise, the timing of it, and it's very suspect. i think most people are going to write it off for what they believe it is and what the president will call it. he'll call it fake news. he'll say it's not true and they're going to believe him. not the "new york times." >> senator, do you believe -- i know lots of people like the fake news thing. do you really believe that people think in the balance of ethical behavior, ethical standards, "new york times" versus donald trump, are there people on the planet -- i get people who support him and, you know, don't really care about it. but i don't know of people who really honestly believe -- i'm sure there are lots of them, that his ethics are actually better than anybody? >> well, you look at barry wise and some of the things that are going on. here's what i would say, maybe, overall, no.

but with respect to the "new york times" and how they street donald trump, i think the answer might be yes. there's such a rage against trump by many in the media that anything they say about him just is completely suspect. in fact, every bit as suspect as the thing donald trump says about everybody else. >> senator santorum, van jones, appreciate it. up next, president trump's debate style. what to look for when he faces questions including some on this report from the "new york times" on his tax returns. (groans) hmph... (food grunting menacingly) when the food you love doesn't love you back, stay smooth and fight heartburn fast with tums smoothies. ♪ tum tum-tum tum tums try garnier micellar water rose. with rose water and micelles that work like a magnet to gently cleanse and remove oils and makeup. and now, even hydrates skin. it's cleansing, reinvented. micellar waters

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trump's first republican presidential debate in 2015. >> you called women you don't like fat pigs, dogs, slobs, and disgusting animals. your twitter -- >> only rosie o'donnell. >> reporter: that was the beginning of his one liners. >> relax. >> i'm relaxed. you're the basket case. >> it's good that someone with the temperament of donald trump is not in charge of the law in our country. >> because you'd be in jail. >> reporter: on the debate stage, it's classic trump. there's bravado. >> my strongest asset is my temperament. i have a winning temperament. >> reporter: and plenty of insults. this was trump after hillary clinton suggested he'd try to get out of contributing more to social security. >> such a nasty woman. >> reporter: and when rand paul pointed out trump's tendency to mock people's appearance -- >> i never attacked him on his look and there's plenty of subject matter right there. >> reporter: trump's debate performances are also full of

falsehoods like when he blasted hillary clinton for wraanting t raise taxes on everyone. trump lied about the iraq war. >> i did not support the war in iraq. that is a mainstream media nonsense. >> reporter: trump did support the war. he blamed clinton for starting the birther controversy when it was trump himself. >> now everybody in mainstream is going to say that's not true. it's true. >> reporter: despite his own lies on stage, trump is quick to say, hey, it's not me, it's them. >> you are the single biggest liar. you're probably worse than jeb bush. this little guy has lied so much about my record. >> here we go. >> he's lied so much about my record. >> reporter: and when hillary clinton leaned on abraham lincoln in one of her answers -- >> honest abe, never lied. that's the difference between abraham lincoln and you. >> reporter: keeping trump on

topic can be a challenge. >> he hit my hands. look at those hands. are they small hands? and he referred to my hands, if they're small, something else must be small. i guarantee you, there's no problem. i guarantee you. two days ago he said he would take his pants off and moon everybody and that's fine. nobody reports that. >> reporter: on stage he likes to paint his opponents as weak. >> marco is not a negotiator. i watched him melt down and it was one of the saddest things i've seen. are you talking? you can go back. you interrupted me. are you going to apology, jeb? no. >> one at a time. >> am i allowed to finish? >> go ahead, mr. trump -- >> build up your energy, but it's not working very well. >> reporter: and lacking stamina. >> i've been all over the place. you decided to stay home and that's okay.

>> reporter: even the debate moderators are a target for trump. >> first of all, i don't believe anything telemundo says. >> do you still believe -- >> reporter: and it should come as no surprise, poll numbers are one of his favorite debate stage topics. >> i'm at 42 and you're at 3, so so far i'm doing better. i'm beating him badly in the polls. first of all, rand paul shouldn't be on the stage. he's number 11. he's got 1% in the polls. >> reporter: no matter his opponent, make no mistake about it, on debate night, donald trump likes to control the conversation. >> let me talk, quiet. a lot of times -- >> reporter: randi kaye, cnn, miami. i'll talk to john kasich on what it's like to share a debate stage with president trump and he would or wouldn't use this new report about the president's taxes if he were debating against him. we'll be right back. it's a reason to come together.

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the unfair money bail system. he, accused of rape. while he, accused of stealing $5. the stanford rapist could afford bail; got out the same day. the senior citizen could not; forced to wait in jail nearly a year. voting yes on prop 25 ends this failed system, replacing it with one based on public safety.

because the size of your wallet shouldn't determine whether or not you're in jail. vote yes on prop 25 to end money bail. we showed how candidate trump performed in previous debates. and looking at how little the president has paid in taxes might factor into this one. joining us now, someone who has debated the president himself, here is a moment from october of 2015. >> he was so nice. he was such a nice guy. and he said, i'm never going to attack. but then his poll numbers tanked, he's got -- that's why he's on the end. >> folks we got to wake up. we cannot elect somebody who doesn't know how joining us now cnn political commentator john kasich who has

endorsed joe biden and the author of "bringing about change. "governor kasich, if you were bringing advice to anybody debating president trump on a stage what would you advise? it is unlike any other debate opponent. >> you don't go into the gutter. you get down in the gutter and start throwing mud, you'll lose. you saw how the other guys did it, they had to drop out. i took the high road and you never thought you should take the low road to the highest office in the land. there's three things joe biden has to be aware of when he debates. be aware of the camera. that's something i had to learn because there are cameras on you all the time and they watch every reaction you have. number two, you have to finish your sentences strong, anderson. you can't meander or wander around.

you have to finish, almost think about it with an exclamation point. i think that's really important. for joe biden it's a matter of stamina. we see a lot of senior citizens moving from trump towards biden. if he has a good performance and comes across strong, then i think he can win them and that's what's really important. >> and, of course, it's inevitable the discussion about his paying these taxes will come up. i mean, look, i heard some of the other guests but i will tell you this, if you're trying to win blue collar voters, people who were sort of on the margin and you find out he paid $750 -- not $750,000, but $750 and a bunch of years didn't pay anything, that doesn't pass the smell test. it takes donald trump off his most important core message which is the economy. i've said a lot here. sorry. >> well, it also points to joe biden was sort of testing this

idea of scranton versus park avenue. he's the guy from scranton. donald trump is the guy from park avenue or fifth avenue is where he now lives. this certainly plays into -- this tax news certainly plays into that. >> it does. >> especially because "the times" points out and if the reporting is accurate even people in that upper echelon tax bracket of .0001%, usually pay, i think "the times" said on average 24% in federal taxes even with all their schemes to dodge taxes. even if the president is saying it's what all people would do in my position, it's actually not. it seems like it's really rare and extreme what he's doing. >> i talked to a friend of mine very involved in real estate. there are a lot of things you have to look at when it comes to when you pay, how you pay depreciation schedules, many things. to pay $750, anderson, $750 --

>> and nothing for a couple years. that's important. >> i think it's almost better to pay nothing than to pay $750. and then to say you had deductions that included your ability to take care of your hair. i mean, i'm telling you there are people out there, and i know, i come interest blue collar, hard working, these people are scraping to make a living and they're waking up to find this incredible mogul paid $750. i don't care what his excuses are. it doesn't pass the smell test. it won't disrupt. it's not going to disrupt those people who were for him totally. it's those people on the fence. >> he's also roped in his daughter, ivanka trump, apparently $100,000 to some hairstylist she liked and then she was already employed by the trump organization. he's now then paying her as a

consultant on all these projects and is able to deduct that from his taxes because that's a business expense of paying somebody who is already an employee and a family member additionally as a consultant. he ropes in everybody he can. >> anderson, let me tell you something, when you're running for office and something like this comes up, it just completely changes everything. all of a sudden you have to deal with that. and the things that you want to talk about, you're not talking about. and, look, we just went through him saying this election would be a hoax and all that other stuff. got him off target. got him off message. even the court in a funny sort of way has gotten him off the most important message which is the message about jobs and the economy. now you have this thing and you have people saying, what are you kidding me? can you imagine the signs that are going to be put up about him paying $750 in taxes. anderson, i'll bet you paid more than $750 in taxes. >> yes, i can guarantee you.

yeah. i was reading this article, i was unaware of all these schemes and it's incredible. he's been able to take losses from years ago and i guess somehow have them cover -- to deduct -- i don't know how it works. >> anderson, what's going to happen is the reporters are going to dig, dig, dig, and there will be things that will come out that will appear to normal people as just crazy. and if that's the tax system we have, we'd better take a look at what we're doing. there are legitimate deductions, business deductions, you just watch the things that come out by these reporters who came upon this. if you're a trump supporter you're saying it's fake news. it's those people who are up there in these elections. anderson, thank you. >> thank you, good to see you.

up next, more on our breaking news on president trump and taxes. ♪ i do what i want when i want it i'm a celebrate ♪ ♪ this feeling watch me while i break the ceiling ♪ ♪ yeah i do it right cuz i'm a diamond... ♪ did you know that you can shop online with a virtual consultant? ask about special financing with the diamond credit card. sprinting past every leak in our softest, smoothest fabric. she's confident, protected, her strength respected.

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trump spent nearly ten times more money getting his hair styled on "the apprentice" than in taxes. $70,000 on hair. a lot of work. one item from a massive piece of investigating on how little the president has paid and how financially strapped he is. long concealed records show trump's kronks lochronic losses avoidance. paid $750. i keep wanting to say $750,000 but it's not. he paid $750 in federal income taxes the year he won the presidency. in his first year in the white house he paid another $750.