the damage from this occur contain and the damage on the ground from the last one. martin savage. please stay safe. be sure and watch a special saturday issue of cnn's global town hall. around will anchor the program along with dr. sanjay dube that. the news continues let are hand it to chris for "cuomo primetime." >> i'm chris cuomo and welcome to prime time. the proposition before us is clear. trump needs to put up or stay put. the president won't show you a negative covid test. he just gave an interview where he said things that make no sense about his condition. he is clear from covid, but when he hear his had explanation, you will know it is a bunk. now, is there a good roeason fo him to not toe you test results? no, but there's a lot of bad reasons. mainly he wants to have another white house event after the last

one became a super spreader event that took down a good part of his team. not to mention his wife. and before you feign ignorance of the reality -- we don't know -- yes, we do. doctors fauci and birx said clearly, fauci said the rode garden event was a super spreader, just look at the data. birx said the only way to avoid more is to take the right measures. or you can double down on dumb. guess what trump did? he is actually inviting 2,000 guests to the white house the scene of the covid contagion tomorrow. there's a case cluster there. 2,000 people. they are supposed to bring masks. not required to wear them. and will be subject to temperature checks, though not all covid cases involve fever. can you imagine going to a tightly packed event where masks

are not on everyone and the guy talking at you is likely contagious in a place that just had a case outbreak? and he won't even show you any proof that he is okay? we just learned today from minnesota's health department that nine people who attended his rally in that state a few weeks ago have tested positive. i know he said in the debate no one has gotten sick at his events. he lied. he also told you that he took a test before the debate, he lied. fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. how many times must some of you be pooled before you get that this president puts nothing before his own interests? respect and love for the families he said tonight. the families who suffered with covid, respect and love. how does he show it? by saying this affects no one? that it goes away magic alabaal?

when you catch it you magically get better? he has never held a moment of silence for them that did not get better at any rallies. conversely, he talks about how they died and the virus that killed them as if it was no big deal. they are dead on his watch. and many are suffering for the long haul. they don't get the medicines that you got and they have to deal with the truth. and they don't get to lie about their condition and life goes back to normal. they should have known the reality when you knew it. he should the tell them you will get better testing and you will get more testing for them had and their kids in the schools. you say you learn so much from having covid. you learned what? how to lie about it. there will be no second presidential debate next week. it has officially been cancelled, why? the president refuses to do a

virtual debate and he won't show proof that he is okay on. where's the negative test? where is it? where is even his temperature? where is it? have the cdc clear you. put up or stay put. you literally could be making more people sick. but trump does have a third option and of course, he took it. and instead of put up, or shut up, he went for the kiss-up on fox. a doctor at fox interviewed him. not even an exam, no covid expertise. this is the same guy who said the worst case scenario is that covid will be like the flu. covid has killed more than the flu has in the past five years. the interview was done on a show that fox's own lawyers said in court is not to be taken

seriously. it is not a credible source of news. that's where he did the interview. with a guy who doesn't know what he is talking about, didn't even examine him. that's the best he can do, and he said, yeah, i was tested today. i don't have the numbers yet but i'm either really low or clear. that make-s no sense. there's no such measure when it comes to being tested for covid. you want the proof? here's the real doctor, who knows the testing and knows the epidemiology. knows the symptomology and knows what it looks like when somebody is well. we can tell that right now before you hear from a real doctor. there's a diagnosis my brothers and sisters, this president has a case of deadly derraliction of duty. let's bring in sanjay gupta and

van jones, what the did you hear that gave you any cause for confidence? well, there was not a lot of information that was given there really at all. i mean, you know, most of it we have heard before and obviously it was not an exam, so, it's, it's -- you cannot really make much of it. the president did say that he had congestion in his lungs. mark siegel asked the president if he had scans and said this he all sorts of scans and didn't say what they were, but said that it seemed to show congestion in his lungs and that was the first time we heard that. the president's doctors said there were findings. it's all purposely vague, we are left to look at bread crumbs, sounds like the president is off of medications, he said that initially and later in the interview, he said should be off shortly or something to that affect.

again, there was three medications. he received the antibodies as you well know. remdesivir, the anti-viral and the steroid medication, dexamethasone is typically a ten-day course. if they are doing the proper course, he should still be on it. again, i couldn't tell from the interview if he was or wasn't. didn't get a lot out of that. >> they said he tolerated it well. we don't know if that's true. the biggest thing to discuss is he said, i was just tested. i don't have the numbers yet. i'm either very at the bottom or cleared. i have been tested a bunch of times, a bunch of ways. i have never seen any kind of reading or scale or anything. even when i get the lab report, it's still a bunch of gibberish or yes or no, positive or negative. what is he talking about? >> well, first of all, let me just say, it doesn't really

matterer th ethat much, when yo covid, as you well know, chris, you are not cleared until ten days after you have first had symptoms and that is regardless of what the testing shows because the testing can be false negative and sometimes the test can continue to pick up viral fragments even though somebody is, you know, not shedding the virus anymore. what he seems to be talking about, and again, it's not totally clear to me is, and they talk about these, these trajectories of the diagnostics in a letter, in the language that is not clear. they seem to have to figure out what the viral load is. you do the pcr tests -- >> supposed to be 2pcr at the times of 35 cycles or more, that should know live virus. or if you do that many cycles, no virus load almost at all, sanjay. >> that's right. you are exactly right. >> he clearly doesn't have that, or he would have a nice easy answer. here, take a look, i'm fine. >> yep, he would say that, if he

was truly negative with a few cycles of a pcr machine, he would say that. i think what they are doing, he is still positive but they are doing more and more cycles and seeing basically is, at what point does he seem like the viral load is low. i'm -- look, we don't know. they are not, they are purposely being vague on this. but i had think they are trying to track his viral load it sounds skpliek usound s like, and using that as an indication that if it's going down, he should be clear by pick a day. it's a guess, it's conjecture to do that. if you are going to do testing to figure out if somebody is not contagious, you have to have two pcr tests separated by a day and they have to both come back negative. >> i want to bring in van real quick. i want to tell people at home. if that was the standard when i was sick. i had fever for almost, certainly over two weeks, real

fever. real symptoms. so, this standard is already crazy generous. van, so, the strategy here i'm clear i'm strong, i'm back. i'm doing more rallies. what should be the democratic response to the recklessness in of the president in the instance. >> well, i mean, at this point the democrats just have to watch this train crash happen. the president is drowning and he just threw himself an anvil. you know, refusing to debate, he needs to get in front of the american people, the biggest audience that he can have, which is the debate audience and i just whiffed it and decided that he didn't want to do it. now he is going to do a crazy cult-like event, it's like a death cult. who is going to go to the white house this weekend when people have been, you know, dropping like flies in terms of getting the diagnosis. it's nuts. at this point, democrats have to

almost watch the speck cal. >> you know, look, if he wanted to debate, all he has to do is show the pcr test that he is clear and the commission would be in a box and they would be able to do it. one plus minus on this. so, with all this goi ining pel and others doing the 25th amendment thing. it's obvious it's about trump. i had jamie raskin and respect for the congressman, but it's all about trump. he was like, it's not about trump. why mess with the 25th amendment, why do that right now? >> they are trying to find as many ways as possible to raise the concern that i think a lot of americans have. this behavior doesn't make sense. listen, if you had a relative who is acting this way, who came home from the doctor, who came home from the hospital and said is, they gave me stuff, now i'm cured of covid, i want everyone to come over to the house, i will give a big speech to everyone. you would say something is wrong

with grand pa. something is wrong with uncle donald. you would not say, here's somebody who should be the leader of the country. so, that's -- in some ways, is it a stunt? yes. is it about trump, yes. but it's a way for people in congresses to continue to raise the issue that there's something way off here. this is not, you know, there's a lot of shenanigans from donald trump that you have gotten used to. this, being the super spreader in chief. and i'm going to literally call people to me in a time when i should be by myself is a whole different level of disturbing behavior for the president. >> it will be interesting to see who shows up tomorrow. sanjay, 46,000 cases were up 12 the %. in like the last week, ten, 12 days. we are hearing all over the state that people are having new cases pop up. some of that was expected. as things reopen, as kids are back in school. but hospitalizations are popping up also, you are more worried about that and how do you read

this in terms of expected verse not expected? >> yeah, i think it's a really crucial point, chris. two things. one is that you know, there's been a belief that, accurately that the young people are a lot less likely to get sick i. we know that. as schools reopen. we are seeing hospitalization rates go up. which means that vulnerable populations are still being affected as a result of younger people's increased mobility. so, just remember that. even if it's just younger people increasingly mobile, it does affect the vulnerable populations, we don't always know how. tough to contract trace, that's the line there on the graph and that's the expectation on hospital beds going in to the winter season. i found this buried, problem is, we don't have the beds to meet the demand. the darker the color, the fuller the hospitals in the states. some of the hospitals, some of the states have over 70% of

their hospital beds full. right now, and we are not even fully in flu season. this is the problem, chris. we talk about number of people infected and number of people who died, but the process of trying the care for people when you suddenly have the huge surges is really, tough work. right? right now, as your brother did in new york back in april. many states are now looking at buildings. >> right. >> saying it's going to be too cold november and december. we have to find a conference center and other large buildings right now that can accept hospital patients and this is starting to happen in many states. >> this is around the corner. governors like my brother. andrew speaks for himself. but, you know, they are concerned. because the margins are always smaller. the beds are almost always filled in the hospitals. they expanded capacity, but not enough. you have homeless people and mentally ill people on the streets because they don't have the capacity to keep them pt t. and the problems will get more

as they go forward. we will keep it straight for people, i know you can promise. that or i can promise you, you can deliver on it. van, can your team capitalize on it? is the last question here. this election is going to be straight up referendum covid time by the time november rolls around. we are going to hear bad things. this president will likely be lying about those same things. what must joe biden and kamala harris do to win an election in this environment? and before you answer, they can't just sit back and watch, people are desperate for leadership. >> they are showing the leadership. and it's two things. one is where regard to the president's behavior, you create the contrast, it's not just what to do with the virus, the problem is the president's behavior under mines the good recommendations that came even

from his administration. the other things they can do and need to do for the younger voters is talk about what they are going to do once he is no longer the subject of conversation. how do you deliver jobs and help and relief to people. you have people who are literally in food lines right now in this country. who have been sitting in a car for a couple of hours waiting to get a little box of food to take home that has to last for a week. that is not what anybody signed up for. you have to talk about how you are going to deliver on the jobs. i think, honestly, trump is now a self indicting document. you have an opportunity if you are biden, if you are harris to talk about a future beyond trump that works for a lot more people and i think, you know, you are going to be able to find an audience, a much big wither audience now than two weeks ago. >> sanjay coupe that, van jones, thank you very much, your families, be healthy and be well, i will see you tomorrow night. we have new information. >> you got it. >> and troubling questions

surrounding the foiled plot to allegedly kidnap the governor of michigan. i've never heard of anything like that. let alone that being ignored by the commander and chief. we still don't know if more are being planned. an attorney for one of the 13 domestic terror suspects are here, what does he have to say, next. your journey requires liberty mutual. they customize your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. liberty power! wow. that will save me lots of money. you're insured! this game's boring. let's get tacos. only pay for what you need. liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.

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i want to show you the alleged enemies among us. a faces of the men facing charges in an alleged domestic terror plot to kidnap the governor of michigan. i will put the faces up. here we go. authorities say the plot involved scouting the governor's vacation house. prepping explosives and they were holding secret meetings beneath a trap door. you are looking at that right now t criminal complaint from an agent suggests the man who lived in basement, adam fox was of leading the charge.

cnn talked to his employer. what was he getting from amazon? >> like mres, food. stuff like that. >> so survival stuff? >> yeah, and attachments for an ar-50 and he was buying like food. he was not stupid i was in the marine corp, i told him he had to go. >> that guy is not involved. he owns the vacuum store. he knew fox, let him stay in the basement to help him out, started to see suspicious things and told him he had to go. that is his story. the man that was charged is harris. the attorney said he was not really involved, council canner thank you. >> first, let's do personal and then facts and law. on the personal side, can you give us some kind of picture of who this guy is, what his family

life is like, what his psychological profile is like. you know, just what kind of person is this? >> i can give you as much as i was able to garner in a little over an hour talking to him. i saw the complaint for the first time yesterday and talked to mr. harris for the first time today for about an hour. you -- what i would say is that he is a young man. he was in the marines. he went in after high school when he was 18. he got out when he was 22. that was a year ago june. and he has been on out since a year ago june. he has been living with his parents. he works as a, as a basically -- working for a subcontractor, mostly putting in decks and lives with his had parents and his dog. half sheppard, half lab. >> did you talk to his parents? >> i did not. i haven't yet. but i hope to talk to them tomorrow. >> and any discussion if he is

on any medications, if he is expressing any extreme beliefs or fears? >> we didn't talk about medication and i don't think i ka talk about that ifhe did tell me something. whether he was lucid, clear, etcetera. he was all of those things. he was concerned as anybody would be facing allegations that are, you know, set forth in the complaint. >> he was not proud of what he was connected to? >> well, he had some confusion. and he, he certainly is not happy to be connected with what he is connected to. but even reading through the complaint i'm not sure how much what he is connected to yet. and i think that you know, what we have is a complaint that is, you know, sworn complaint by one

agent that details some movements some text messaging some calls. sometimes it's unclear who's party to which calls and i don't mean to sound like a lawyer parsing things. >> that's your job. everybody deserves a defense of course. i'm an officer of the court as well, i'm a lawyer as well, i get that. >> i know that. >> this is early on in the process. they say they have a lot of investigative material. i will ask you one more thing andthen we will get to what is in the record right now. did he express any strong views of ideologies to you that would explain animus toward the governor? >> absolutely not. in fact, the only thing he said to me was that he is a person who like s his privacy and spaurpt supports the bill of of rights and he did not find that he belongs in one party or the other. and in that sense he sounded a

lot like me to tell you the truth. >> that's fine. all right. now let's get to what we understand. was he ever, was he able to tell you in your conversation how he can explain hanging around with a group of guys and having rounds of conversation like he as attested to in the affidavit and the supporting affidavit to the complaint, and as we both know, and anybody who will read it will know, it's a clear expression of animus, of planning and hurt had, knock on the door and when she appears cap her. that is unambiguous in intention. i don't know what he is confused about. >> that, that statement is

unambig unambiguous in intention, but he said it was incomplete and he was not sure if they transcribed it completely. >> what is missing? ha, ha, ha, i'm just kidding. i hope nobody is recording this? >> he said that what was missed was things that were said before that and after. >> what could that be that would make him not threaten to kill the governor while? conversations with people who were planning just that for weeks? >> well, one with, , he did not said those things for one. i don't knowthe transcription is accurate. >> may not be him. that is his best defense. bu but he can did not say to you that he did not say it? >> we didn't talk about the statements. we talked about who the other people might have been wit, howg he might have known them.

>> here's the men question at this point. i welcome you back as we drop more of the record. that is a genuine offer. if he did not have anything to do with this, as we heard from the guy who owns the vacuum place where fox was living in his basement as a favor, it was obvious there were things going on. it should have been obvious to your client. if he wanted nothing to do with it. if he was not about that. not a member of this group. why didn't he go to authorities? >> we didn't talk about that at all. and it's -- >> it's a good conversation to have, counselor. >> i know, and i had an hour long conversation with him today. and i'm surely going to have more. but as far as, you know, you're talking about groups. you know, the group of five people that were arrested with him, it's unclear if they are related to the other groups arrested today. when i talked to him whether he knew anything about the other groups, he did not indicate to me that he did.

>> right, but he is also identified as being at another meeting at this house on lake orion, you know, that was very specific in intent and it's a direction. obviously what we want to hear from the guy if he had nothing to do with it is how he can explain that, and what he, why he did not do anything about it. but you have only had one conversation as we develop moreof the record, you are welcome back to make the case and i appreciate it. it does not get more serious than had this in our country, this is allegedly domestic terrorism against a sitting governor. as you know, very serious conspiracy and kidnapping and terror charges could still be coming and are coming. absolutely. and we take them very seriously. >> counselor, thank you for taking the opportunity. and i hope to speak to you again. >> hope to speak with you too. thanks for having me. >> now, look, i know it's not getting a lot of attention from our president, but it's about

m malfeesance, so we are going to stay on it. we are also going to ballance i with the other thing, the virus. a huge thing is getting kids fwhak school. i know you hear me all the time talk about it. we have a different angle. a really must see segment. is the mistake that we made with kids in school that we made it too complicated and too hard? what do we know about how much the virus spreads in schools? a must see segment, next. look at that scuffed up wall. embarrassing you. that wall is your everest. but not any more. today let's paint. behr. exclusively at the home depot. it would be for me to discover all of these things that i found through ancestry. i discovered my great aunt ruth signed up as a nursing cadet for world war ii. you see this scanned-in, handwritten document.

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not good news. the united states is now averaging more than 46,000 new covid infections each day. it's up about 12% from last week. more than double from where we were in june. why? places started to open back up.

and now we have kids in school. we expected more cases. but it has a lot of leaders and people in communities all over the country spooked especially when it comes to schools. now, i, full disclosure, i have argued here we did our kids dir dirty. we didn't put the resources in to the contact tracing and the testing that would give us a comfort level that would put our kids where they belong in school. and part of the proof of my theory is there's no federal effort to track kids with covid across the country. think about that. of course it adds to the uncertainty and it's intentional. why wouldn't the president want us to know how many kids a s ha cases so we can get our kids back in schools. we have a expert that said, the

fears about schools are over blown and she can prove it. but can she do it to others satisfaction? emily oster is an economist and dr. lena we know, thank you and emily, thank you. emily, begin. and i want as little to do here because i want to learn as much as i want to lead. what do you see in the data that gives you confidence about kids being back in school? >> so let me just first, chris, amplify the first thing that you said, it's shameful that the people collecting the data are people on my team and not the federal government. what we are doing is we are going in to schools and asking had them how many kids do you have, we are tracking their covid cases. and what we are seeing early on is i think somewhat reassuring so in our last two weeks of september data, looking at a couple hundred thousand kids in, in person school we are seeing rates that are like 1.5 cases in

a school of a thousand, of that two week period. now, this data is very early and so i'm not really sure that i you can convince dr. wen, but i think it does start to suggest that maybe particularly lower prevalence places, we should be more aggressive about opening, perhaps especially with elementary school kids who are suffering from being home and distance learning is not a great solution. >> give us context on the data. you know, how many schools, how many states, what kind of sample? >> so, it's covering almost every state, i think we are missing data from alabama. it's about 600,000 total enrolled kids of which 200,000 are in person, and 60,000 in person satisfy. we have both public schools, district public schools and charters and private schools. and about 75% of the schools in the sample have at least some inperson learning it's 1100 schools. >> a case and a half per thousand. doctor, what is your reaction to the data and what are your questions as a result?

>> well, my first reaction is that i'm very glad that professor oster and her colleagues are doing this. it shows when there's failure on the part of the federal government that there's great people stepping in, in to the void. i am somewhat reassured by the data but i'm a bit concerned because it seems like we have the cases of the reported cases in schools for students and teachers. but, i wonder from professor oster is there a way to track for parents and care-givers and others that live in the household had of students and teachers too? >> yeah, i this that that would be great and we don't currently ask that. although it's something that we can add and i don't know if the schools will know. what i think we need to do is start looking at the counties where the schools are and trying to link school opens to what is happening overall in the community. and that is something that i think we can in principal do with otherer data, of course, people have not done that yet. but i think that concern and the concern about the staff in

particular is kind of really central to the, to these questions. >> and let's and discuss why it's central in a second. first, one step sideways, dr. wen, remind people why you are worried about kids, because what we were told is, don't be. largely asymptomatic. come through it, you have a few hundred that have died, that is terrible but nothing compared to the rest of us and until they are 10 or so, they don't spread like the rest of us. they are really not our problem population which is why people say the old, the weak, people like me, they have to be in quarantine. all the young strong people like you and our kids they can be out and live normal life. that's the best way to do it. what is your take on that premise, doctor? >> well, so it is true, that children tend to get less severely ill than adults do, the mortality rate among children is very low. but that said, some children do get severely ill. and by the way, the same

disparities that we see in adults is mirrored in children. that sadly and tragically 3/4 of the kids that died are black and brown children who bear the brunt of disparities again. we know for children that old er children 10 and older probably transmit coronavirus as much as adults do. children under 10, probably most studies suggest that they transmit it less but they transmit it. there was a study that found that an 8 month old child transmitted covid to the family and a recent study found that one 13-year-old transmitted covid to 13 family members. we can't just think of walling off a portion of society. actually, other studies suggested that the surges are driven by young people. that you have young people in their teens and 20s who first become infected and then, a couple weeks after that, that spreads immediately to those who are 60, 70 and 80, so what

starts with the young doesn't stay in the young. >> one follow on that and we will discuss the main point what they call, a interstitial spread, they don't have a bad case, but they bring it to vulnerable people and you have to account for multiple generational households, which is prevalent as you move down in the economic ladder. has any community spread happened because of a school, doctor? >> there are certainly cases, although it's very difficult for us to prove. >> right. >> looking around the country. those health departments that collected. >> right. >> 50% of cases or more are from community spread and we just don't know. >> that's the problem, and that's why we need the testing. emily will, i want to be clear to you, you are among friends. you are doing research that nobody is doing for us. you know what i mean? you are not brought here out of a set up for a bad guy, quite the opposite, we are desperate for answers. that's the last variable that you have to build in if possible, all right, they give you the right number, let's say

nobody lies. the teachers, the people living at home. the grandma who is raising the kid, and how do you account for that and understanding the impact of kids in school who get sick? >> yeah, i mean, i think we need to try to account for that and look at what is happening in the community. i think the other piece that we need to account for that we have not talked about is what are the precautions that they are taking in schools. in is kind of the other piece of the data, are the schools wearing masks? are they distancing, thinking of how we do safe reopen? that intersects with the safe reopen and they are less likely to spread in schools. it's not going to come out in to the, in to the community. so, i think, you know, we really need to understand this problem better. because i think we all want to get kids back in school. and yet none of us want their grandparents to get coronavirus and somehow, we have to figure out how to get enough information to make it happen. >> last point to people at home

saying, it's like one case, the whole school shuts down. you are not having a lot of kids get sick. it's panic when anybody does, they should be back in school. your answer? >> i agree, that kids should be back in school. but that is something that we as a society have to prioritize. we have been talking about this choice of bars verse schools and this in some ways it's an easy choice for a lot of us. but i think that we as a society have to figure out that we can't do it all. we can't have schools open and everything open and cases surging out of control. so, if schools are going to be a priority. we as a society, as people have to determine what are the other things that we have to give up. which it might include limit-- limiting playdates. it has to be priorities. >> i completely agree with that. >> emily, look, as you get more info, let me know. you have a forum to share it with millions people. >> i would love to come back. >> schools or bars, okay, i'm

just fixing my hair. schools are a priority for everyone. i argue it all the time. my three kids are a mess, the schedules are all different. the learning is not optimal, it's hard on the teachers. it's hard on the family. we have to do better. hopefully emily your data can point us in the right direction and dr. wen i know you will keep us straight on what time and evidence shows us in terms of keeping the community safe. have a good weekend. look at that scuffed up wall. embarrassing you. that wall is your everest. but not any more. today let's paint. behr. exclusively at the home depot. 20 associate cart pusher.urly the different positions i've had

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♪ nothing is everything ask your dermatologist about skyrizi. ♪ taking california for a ride. companies like uber, lyft, doordash. breaking state employment laws for years. now these multi-billion-dollar companies wrote deceptive prop 22 to buy themselves a new law. to deny drivers the rights they deserve. no sick leave. no workers' comp. no unemployment benefits. vote no on the deceptive uber, lyft, doordash prop 22. one ride california doesn't want to take. doordash prop 22. when was the last time your property tawhat?l went down? never. are you kidding me?

for years, the residential burden has gone up. while the corporate burden has gone down. prop 15 reverses that. it closes corporate loopholes and invests in schools, small business, and firefighters. and when the big corporations pay more, your tax bill goes down. that's right. a savings of a hundred twenty-one dollars a year for the average home. give homeowners a break. vote yes on 15. we have seen long line this is week for early voting all over the country. our leaders should be doing everything to ensure that those people are safe. and they feel encouraged to go there, and that they will be safe. yet the same president who claims to be mr. law and order is openly telling domestic terror groups like the one in michigan to break the law. >> i'm urging my supporters to

go in to the polls and watch very carefully, because that's what has to happen. i am urging them to do it. >> yeah, can also be called a felony. especially the man that is sworn to protect the constitution cannot be trusted to do. election officials and you, let's focus on the last one. we have mary mccord, of course, working to arm all of us with the best tool, the facts. mary, thank you for joining us. >> my pleasure, chris. >> so a couple of my rough neck buddies and i are going to go watch people like you vote, try to get as close to you as we can in the booth. is that legal? >> it depends on what you mean by rough neck buddies. vote r intimidation is illegal and under federal law. and armed vigilante militia activity is illegal in all 50 states. >> you are not allowed to go in

and watch people vote, right? >> there are poll watch ers who are allowed can -- >> official poll watchers. >> right. not watch people cast their ballots but watch the voting process. right, to make sure that things are >> right, but you can't self-appoint yourself to that? >> no, no. every state has different laws that apply to that. in some cases only certain people can be poll watchers. sometimes they're called election observers. it's different state to state. but it requires some sort of registration with the state or some sort of recording of your presence there under authority of the election officials. it's not just anyone, and certainly not, you know, armed groups of individuals certainly wouldn't be permitted to be inside the voting booth watching people vote. >> what do you want people to know about what should be the case when they get to the polls? >> so i'm not really worried about armed, unlawful militias going inside the polls.

i don't think they'll be able to get in there. what i am worried about is that armed groups might go out and take it upon themselves to respond to trump's statements about election mail-in ballots being susceptible to fraud and the election potentially being rigged and any delay in tabulating the ballots being rigged. these are dog whistles to these self-professed militia organizations, unlawful militia organizations, to deploy to protect the vote or protect against election fraud the same way they have deployed across america to protect property against false rumors of violent anarchists coming during racial justice rallies. these groups are lawful, they're not thosed under federal or state law. militias refer to lawful state militias like the national guard. there's no authority for people to deploy on their own. they're not protected by the second amendment. the supreme court's been very clear about that.

states may and must be able to prohibit private paramilitary organizations. they said in 1886, they said it again in 2008, and in fact, all 50 states prohibit this type of armed, coordinated, organized use of force or projection of the ability to use force. really it's the usurpation of law enforcement, under what circumstances they will deploy lethal force, ar-15s. >> you say dog whistle, i say fog horn. the president called those guys good people. they wound up combining in their efforts to try to kidnap the governor of michigan. they want to do it near the election. they're bad guys out there. it is a weird time when we have a president who seems to be giving them overt confidence. now most people don't know the laws. how do they arm themselves with the information they need to be effective at the polls? >> so i'm at georgetown university now running -- helping run the institute for

constitutional advocacy and protection. we have put out fact sheets for all 50 states that talk about what the laws are in each state against these armed groups of individuals. they also give sort of a q&a what you do when you see armed groups of individuals near a polling place. and we're distributing these not just to voters and to election officials, but to law enforcement, to state and local officials. because it really is on state and local officials this year to make sure that voters can safely vote. and that's what they all want. and i'm seeing people coming together. i've been spending the last couple of weeks talking to mayors, talking to chiefs of police, talking to district attorneys, voting rights organizations, state attorneys general. they need to get together with their communities, make it clear that they're not going to tolerate voter intimidation, they're not going to tolerate armed groups of individuals intimidating people before the polls, during election day or afterwards. and unite with their communities to make sure that everyone can

actually exercise their right to choose the next president and then other elected officials based on ideas and policies and not based on threats and intimidation. >> mary mccord, a lifetime of public service and you've got a long way to go. thank you for what you're doing. the website is on your screen, and i will tweet it from my personal and the show account. mary mccord, thank you very much. >> thank you, chris.

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here's something you're not hearing on fox. trump didn't win the nobel peace prize today. wonder why. maybe it was failing to call out domestic terror, like the 13 suspects who may have been acting on his insurrection calls to liberate michigan. they were all charged in a kidnapping plot against michigan's governor and trying to overthrow government. not very "peacy." trump paint nominated for any do-gooding in this country because he's too busy dividing and inflaming. i wonder if that impressed the judges. by the way, he was nominated by this far-right norwegian lawmaker who put his name in for

working on the uae/israel peace deal. there was a swedish parliament member who nominated him for helping secure an economic deal between serbia and kosovo. the world food program for its efforts to combat hunger, they won. by the way, we may need them here soon, an ever-increasing number are waiting in line for food in america. in an economy this president calls the greatest of all time, despite the worst unemployment rate since the 1940s. maybe trump would win a prize for peace if he didn't empower hate. maybe he would be called peaceful if he didn't call the quest for social justice racist and call black lives matter a symbol of hate. maybe if he fought domestic terror instead of encouraging it, people would see him as peaceful. maybe he'd win a peace prize if he didn't threaten that he might not peacefully leave the white house if he loses.

maybe he'd win one if he didn't berate his cabinet members for not prosecuting political enemies. peace would be a much better fit if he were about peace, and not hate. i wish you all peace this weekend. the best blessings for your head and hearts and your families. thank you for watching. "cnn tonight" with the man, d. lemon. >> that is a tall order that you're asking, come on, really? >> stop asking people to overthrow the country. >> isn't that amazing? isn't that amazing? and asking people, what did he call today, black lives matter racists? and he said, black lives matter was bad for black people. >> yes. >> earlier i was on with breonna and i was he was black 'splaining. i got that wrong, he was whitesplaining what's good for black people. >> key distinction. >> a key distinction. you can't tell lately, have you seen the makeup? he's