inaction is what we're seeing happen now, which is really disturbing. >> yeah. rick bright, i appreciate your time. thank you. >> thank you. a reminder don't miss "full circle," our digital news show. you can have in-depth conversations. you can catch it live at cnn.com/fullcircle or any time on on demand. let's hand it over to chris. >> thanks, anderson. there are very heavy matters on our watch. once again, trump party leaders are standing by silently as the man they fear most revenge fires yet another top staffer protecting our country. why? for telling the truth. that person's name is chris crips. he's the director of cybersecurity and infrastructure security agency, fired for saying there was no widespread fraud in this election. trump says there was massive i

am p-- improprieties and fraud. chris crips said the election was done in proof because they had security. president trump has no proof. what makes this a grave night for us, no pushback from any gop member of congress. please, remember this. remember how these men and women were silent. when they pretend to be something else down the road, remember who they were in this moment. law and order, they say they're about. to them it seems to me that the law is that trump orders them when to speak. chris cribbs took to twitter after the firing. honor, serve, we did it right. defend today, secure tomorrow.

#2020. of course trump has the right to remove cribbs, but that doesn't make it right and the gop knows it did it wrong. but just like the rest of trumpery surrounding this fraud, they refuse to admit they did something wrong. >> when we go through this process, we'll have an orderly transfer from this administration to the next one. what we all say about it is, frankly, irrelevant. >> so this is what usually happens, that you don't allow the transition in the middle of a pandemic when we have a vaccine that needs to be distributed by the administration that's coming in, and the administration that's there right now won't let them learn what's happening? that's what's normal? how can mcconnell serve in the senate if he thinks it's irrelevant to speak right now? that it's irrelevant to speak

truth to power. he knows this isn't normal. he knows holding up this transition with no proof of election issues is the opposite of what's normal. just like his holding up aid while people around this country wait on food lines is not normal. watching businesses fold by the hundreds and waiting to act is not normal. again, remember what he just said and is failing to say and do. he did nothing in this moment. so my proposal. let's you and me do what he won't. let's get to the truth and call it out. let's get after it. the root of the ruse this time is a partisan play in detroit-based wayne county. the board of canvassers there deadlocked along partisan lines on this critical vote, and

therefore we're unable to certify the county's presidential results before the deadline. the statement from the michigan gop party chair makes clear what this is about. rank partisanship. giving trump something he can point to to suggest he was a victim of some wrongdoing. here's the quote. due to the efforts of the michigan republican party, the republican national committee and the trump campaign, enough evidence of irregularities and potential voter fraud was uncovered resulting in the wayne county board of canvassers refusing to certify their election results. this action will allow more time to get to the bottom of these deeply troubling irregularities. to deeply troubling that he could mention them? show the proof? say something about it? describe it? go to court? no. so, then, what is it really? is it about proof of fraud, or is this more proof of the tortured two-party system that

has subjugated our politics. the michigan official overseeing all election results in the state, secretary of state jocelyn benson. secretary of state, thank you for joining us once again. >> thank you for having me, chris. >> have you been presented with proof that there is a material problem/irregularity/fraud in the vote canvassing in that county? >> no. absolutely not. there is no evidence of irregularities, no evidence of widespread fraud that had become evident at any point in this process nor were there any presented today to the wayne board of canvassers. if anything, it showed less clerical errors there had been in years past, although we believe this was more about partisan politics, and frankly, an effort to suppress and invalidate the otherwise very valid votes of our state's largest african-american jurisdiction. and so recognizing that, as you

mentioned, we're going to continue to respond with the truth and recognize that we'll continue the work now at the state to finish this canvass, to hand it over to the board of canvassers and clarify that, indeed, every valid vote is and will be counted and every voice will be heard in the city of detroit and throughout michigan. >> we're aware right now that biden has perhaps his biggest lead in the disputed states of almost 150,000, right, 148-some-thousand odd votes at the latest count. we know there are more counts that need to be done, the certification needs to be done. but let's look at the counties because that's what they want us to do in the republican party, so let's give them what they want. they had to have this vote. didn't they need to have some kind of hearing or make show of cause or proof to have a basis for their vote that they didn't want to certify? >> yes, technically that's what happened today. and interestingly, in 2016, and this happens after every election, the board meets and

reviews the canvass and reviews an audit of the process and certifies the vote. they certified the vote in 2016 with 80% of vote precincts out of balance. and yet today 42% were out of balance and yet it didn't get certified, so clearly there is no valid point here, it's truly just partisan politics. but importantly, chris, the state has a protocol for when this happens. it simply now then goes to our bureau of elections within the department of state. they will then complete the canvass, address any clerical or bookkeeping errors and in the next ten days hand it over to the state board of canvassers to review and perform their ministerial functioning of the vote. >> i get that it's happened before, i get that there's a protocol. i get it. but the issue is what you just said. in 2016, so ostensibly, the issue here is that there isn't a match among a certain number of precincts that is now troubling to the board in its republican

membership such that they couldn't vote to certify. but you're saying that the number of precincts that have a mismatch, as you said now, is 42%. but in 2016, they did certify or vote to certify when the mismatched number of precinct percentage was much higher? >> yes, it was nearly twice that. 80% of precincts were out of balance in 2016, and yet the board of canvassers had no problem certifying it then. they shouldn't have, it's a matter of processing if someone shows up and leaves perhaps without voting or there is a spoiled ballot or something like that. so the job of the state is to essentially explain any of these imbalances. but it's notable that these imbalances occur across the state, it's actually quite common. it's not a reflection of any irregularity and certainly not an opportunity to invalidate any valid votes.

so we're in a position to address any kind of clerical errors that were unaddressed today. we'll continue cleaning up those bookkeeping errors, and at the same time move forward with the full certification of the votes throughout the state that will include every jurisdiction including detroit. >> and the reason i harp on the number of precincts involved, and i'm not saying 42% is a small number. i think 2016 is an important analogy because they were very tolerant of a much higher number of mismatches. why? because a large number end up being clerical and otherwise not counted. they didn't show you there was a real problem. they didn't say, look at these real problems, secretary of state, how can we certify? none of that. >> truly, and if they had, we certainly would have looked at them. but what we know and as everyone in this process knows, the closer you look, this is actually a more well run county

in the state of michigan. >> biden actually got a thousand fewer votes in detroit than hillary clinton did. trump got nearly 5,000 more votes, a 65% increase for the president this election that he's saying was rigged versus the last one. so that's for context. they are suing, the campaign, in federal court. to your knowledge, have they shown proof of any kind of widespread and substantial voter fraud? >> they have not. they have not today, they have not in past cases, they have not through multiple different attempts and calls to try to do so. and the reason why is because the truth is what it is and there is no irregularity, there are no widespread fraud in the city of detroit or throughout the state of michigan, and, you know, again, the truth will continue to show that. what this also is is an effort to prolong the certification process to create more seeds of doubt amongst the voters and erode the public's confidence in what is actually, again, a

well-run election. we'll continue to push back with the facts, with the data, and again note that this was a really disappointing move by the two republican members of the county board today to choose partisan politics over doing the right thing in certifying the vote and the will of the people. >> it's easy to play politics in the court of public opinion. it is harder in the court of law. not impossible, but harder. is it true that in the pending litigation right now that the judge, janet niff, ordered the trump campaign to serve the complaint and summons on your office to stop the canvass in wayne county if they believed they had an actionable claim thereupon, and they were supposed to do it by 5:00 p.m. today or potentially face dismissal, quote, for failure to diligently prosecute this case, unquote? did they serve you with such complaint and subpoena? >> not to my knowledge, no. but again, that only underscores

what this really is, which is an attempt to use the legal system to further, a pr campaign to erode the public's confidence in what was actually a very well-run election. >> all right. now, secretary of state, i want to ask your indulgence, okay? we are trying to chase down some news in the county right now. we're working the phones literally as we speak. let me take a break right now. can you hang with me across the break, and let's see if i can chase something down and ask you about it, because i think it's going to make a difference in this story, okay? if we can get it reported. let's do that. this matters, everybody. it's not just about michigan. because he just got rid of the person who was charged with keeping our election safe at the federal level, because he doesn't want to take the truth for an answer. and if we want this to end, we have to put out everything that is smoking everywhere, okay? so let's take a quick break. we're tracking something down.

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there's breaking news on our watch. timing is everything. we're looking at michigan specifically, one county that is part of detroit where there had been a vote along partisan lines not to certify the presidential votes in that county. we're joined now by secretary of state benson from michigan. just a few moments ago, the president of the united states for now tweeted, wow. michigan just refused to certify the election results. having courage is a beautiful thing. the usa stands proud. no, the usa does not stand proud, it stands divided, and this is not courage. that's not what this was. this was a curiosity of politics. and now in realtime it has been rectified. secretary of state, what did you

learn while we were on break? >> well, while we were talking, the wayne county board of canvassers actually reversed their past decision and voted 4-0 to certify the full results, including the city of detroit, for wayne county. >> now, why would they do that? >> well, it appears that the truth won in this scenario. basically the evidence is clear there were no irregularities, there was no evidence of widespread fraud, and, in fact, they were simply minor clerical errors than we were discussing, actually less clerical errors than in past elections, and that really isn't a valid reason in my view, and apparently ultimately the board, to invalidate and silence the voices of voters in the state's largest county. i think they did the right thing, they performed their duty, and they certified the election for voters in wayne county. >> they also asked that you would perform an audit of the errors. to me that sounds like a hitch, a little bit of a cia action.

but is that something your office will undertake? >> we'll certainly look into that. we want everything to be valid, we want everything to be clear, and we want voters to have confidence in the process, and we're going to continue to do everything we can within my authority to ensure that that's the case, and also prepare our clerks at every jurisdiction to ensure they have the tools and resources they need to move forward into the next set of elections and assure the public that these elections were indeed accurate and a reflection of the will of the people. >> just to button it up with one fine point, did they provide to your office any proof of the need for an audit? >> well, there has been no proof presented to our office or to the board of canvassers today of any irregularities, any widespread fraud, and any suggestion that there was is an effort to misinform the public and falsely erode the public's confidence in, again, what was a very well-run election which i'm gratified that the board of canvassers in wayne county ultimately saw, ultimately was

convinced of. and now we can move forward with the full statewide certification in the days ahead. >> secretary of state, thank you for making it through all this in realtime with us. i appreciate your indulgence and the opportunity. >> my pleasure, chris. and i should also mention we actually were indeed served by that other legal case we were talking about earlier, so the fight will continue. that's not over yet. but, again, i'm confident that the legal system will continue to do what it's done, which is verify that there is no evidence of widespread fraud or irregularities in the system and we'll continue to prove that everywhere we have to in the days ahead. >> all right. we look forward to how these things play out in court as well. you know we're always a phone call away. thank you very much. >> thanks, chris, i appreciate it. so far, mr. president, that's strike 30. let's bring in david gregory and anthony scaramucci. anthony, the question becomes on the political side, when is your party going to realize that it stands for something other than trump? >> well, when the money stops

coming into the parties, so they're raising money off this. so when they squeeze the last piece of orange out of that orange rind, chris, that will be the moment that they stop doing it. listen, it's disgusting, it's unbelievably transparent. i think they're all befuddled at the lindsey graham thing as well. i think their befuddled at every turn. >> i think they're trying to make them all happy. very interesting that we see county level people on the canvassing board undoing what seemed like a faithless act. and now voting 4-0 to certify the results. we do not see any type of courage like that, to use the president's word, from the senators and members of congress who are just sitting by and

watching this president lie and try his best to undermine the democracy. >> right, because that story hasn't changed. you know, they're waiting for this to just slowly burn out, which it's doing. you know, the president has made a show of saying that any setback in his life is the result of a rigged process. it's not true, it's not true in this case, and republicans who are around him who fear him, who fear for the party in georgia, who fear what a president trump out of office means for 2024, maybe he's a candidate. they won't go against him. so we've been talking about that for a week. that hasn't changed. what's important to understand is that this process is not on the level. this is not on the level. there were not widespread irregularities. we should be celebrating the fact that there was not outside interference, that this went off so well in a pandemic. there are always things to look at in terms of irregularities in

an election, but there was nothing widespread. this is not on a level. there are trial lawyers who are hacks and there are good ones. do you know how i know the difference? in this case the good lawyers are getting out of this litigation. they don't want to be any part of it. it's the rudy giulianis and others who are involved and they're not getting anywhere. you saw that play out tonight in michigan. >> you know what, you're right, and therefore i amend my previous statement. when i said the usa does not stand proud, it stands divided, which is true, but it is impressive, anthony, that the system has withstood a president lying his ass off about things that went wrong with no proof. you know, that's a big hammer that he swings. and he's got an entire half of the political system saying nothing no matter how far afield his claims. that's a lot to withstand, but so far the courts have stood to be blind to anything but law and fact. >> well, when you were

interviewing the secretary of state of michigan, i was thinking about my patriotism and her call to patriotism, and i was thinking about our system, and i was literally feeling so optimistic about the country in 2021 and beyond, but what i will say to both of you which i'm super worried about is because of the republican party and the way they're acting, we could be potentially one election away from hungarian style authoritarianism. these guys have somehow decided that the signal that they're hearing from the president's voters is that they should act more like the president and they should fall more in line with the president, and i'm hoping on july 21st, chris -- i'm sorry, january 21st, that we can decimate him and we can sort of roll back trumpism and, frankly, crush demagogue trumpism. >> the point for the party in power and your point as well is to find ways to connect with

people other than just massaging the madness and making it about their anger and their animus. address their needs. give them a better message. have a better idea when. my concern here, david, is that this isn't just happening in a vacu vacuum. biden has to distribute that vaccine. we're in whenowhere on that bece doesn't know and his team doesn't know what's going on. you have food lines that we haven't seen since the great depression. and today's dilatory nature of what's happening in congress is literally going to make people starve. >> it's shameful. in the middle of this crisis, it makes you wonder why the transition is so long, which is an argument for a different day. i'm still optimistic. i think the health teams can get together quickly and that work can move at pace. we've got bigger problems culturally in the country about response to covid state by state versus a uniform plan. but i think the pressure has to be brought to bear when it comes to managing the virus.

there's been great work done on these vaccines. it's great for the country, it's great for our fight against covid. and the president-elect is ready to move and has the team to do it. and you have existing professionals who are part of this administration and part of the bureaucracy who are ready to help. there is no excuse for it. >> what happens after trump is gone, okay? just after the inauguration. do you believe that the culture of opposition becomes even more fierce among republicans, they try to do obama times two in terms of juxtaposing everything, or do you think there is a shift, anthony? >> i think there is a shift. i think his half life, he'll start decaying as a power product, and i think he'll be long gone by the midterm elections. and i think the republicans, the smart ones, are going to do everything they can to snuff him out and snuff out the nonsense of trumpism. and so this idea that he's

running in 2024, i'll take the under on that times ten. the process of his power expiating, if you will, will happen very quickly, chris, and it's going to astonish people, because down deep the republicans don't want it, they're just fearful for some reason that someday we'll have to figure out why, but he shouldn't be. he's only as powerful as his acolytes, and hopefully the president-elect will hire back mr. krebs, and that will be a sign that the system is really working. >> i'm not sure i agree with that. i don't think trumpism is so easily extinguished. i think it can be peeled back and his character can be removed from it, but i think trumpism is a force of consequence within the republican party. 71 million people voted for him. yeah, a lot of opposition to the democratic party or even to biden, but also love for him,

support for him and support of his brand of where the republican party goes, even the conservative movement goes. i don't think we know the answer to that. i think there is a lot of opposition and a lot of fear of a democratic party, and the direction it's going. and so my jury is still out on the extent to which they'll separate from this brand of trumpism, especially if he's out in the wings just making mischief. i think people will still be afraid. >> i changed my mind again. last word to me. >> we're working on it, though. >> i'm going to borrow your point. that's the point. what people want, whether they're trumpers or whether they're biden people or whether they're just confused like the majority in this country about what to believe in, because they have no reason to believe, is that they want something better. they don't want to be angry. they don't just want to have hostility. that doesn't get them anywhere and they know it. there's not more money in their wallet, there's not better

dreams for their kids, there's not a different set of options for them to create their own future the way they dreamed it. that's what has to be the focus. who will do it? they'll be the winner. david gregory, anthony scaramucci, thank you both in realtime for hanging with me tonight. why does this also matter? because we can't have a political opera right now. we're in the middle of a pandemic. the average covid positivity rate is now more than 10%. now, look, i know that number doesn't mean anything. look at it this way. it's many times higher than seen as an acceptable rate. another top senator, chuck grassley from iowa, just tested positive. he was just on the floor yesterday without a mask. he created this whole kerfuffle here. we have one of his colleagues, senator brown. he got mocked for asking a different republican to put on his mask. he will continue to make his case for safety, but also the state of play right now. how do we get to a better place, next. ♪

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politicians aren't going to save us. not from the pandemic, certainly not from ourselves. together as one. if you and i wear a mask, socially distance, wait for the vaccine, get it, do what we're asked to do, we'll get to a better place. what happens in the meantime? chaos. we just learned tonight that senator chuck grassley of iowa is covid positive. i wish him well. i hope the rest of his family doesn't get it. covid is no joke, especially at his age. i hope everything is fine. he's the president pro tem of the senate. he's the senior-most president in the chamber. he's strong, and i hope that carries him through easily. he says he's feeling well and working from home. thank god. he was on the senate floor yesterday, had his mask off when

he spoke. the same senate floor where this happened. >> senator from ohio. >> i would start by asking the presiding officer to please wear a mask as he speaks and people below him, i can't tell you what to do, but i know that the behavior -- >> i don't wear a mask when i'm speaking like most senators. i don't need your instruction. >> i know you don't need my instruction, but there clearly isn't much interest in this body in public health. >> little interest is an understatement, with senator ted cruz following that moment up with his own ass backwards. he wears a mask as a sign of face virtue. dan sullivan was 50 feet away, presiding. you are a covidiot, senator

cruz. i know you went to harvard, you just really try not to act that way too often, especially where president trump is involved. the senator from alaska wasn't 50 feet away. he was right there with people under his nose. you would think cruz would have a lot more sense about how bad this virus is. you see what's happening in his state of texas? it just became the first to surpass a million cases. he doesn't say that often. not to mention the hunger pandemic that is there. thousands waiting in food lines in north texas this weekend, cars as far as you can see filled with americans in need when they shouldn't be. we tried to reach out to the senator, get him to take it off twitter, bring it here, talk civilized, see if there's a better way forward. he said he was occupied. maybe he has another book to sell. >> the reality and truth is more than he has.

>> tit for tat aside, what do you see in senator cruz's that the instinct to attack the idea of mask as safety and to call you out as some kind of false virtue signaler? >> well, what senator cruz -- i mean, senator cruz doesn't have an intimate relationship with the truth in much of his public life. i don't know him personally well enough to know beyond that, but the fact is that every time a senator stands up and speaks, there is a senate stenographer about six feet away, and senators that don't wear masks are putting them at risk. i know ted cruz doesn't see the senate stenographer because she is -- it's always a she in these cases -- one of those essential workers that really doesn't get paid a lot of money and exposes themselves as an essential worker to the public and goes

exposed to home and potentially infects their families. that's what i'm in the senate for, the dignity of work and fighting for those workers. that's why i said that. they were six feet away. but more importantly is these people who work in the senate and people who work in the senate, bus drivers, people that prepare food, people that change hospital linen, grocery store workers, those are pretty much the forgotten people in this pandemic. congress isn't looking out for them. no $600 a week when they're laid off, no help for their homes, no help for their kids in public schools. instead it's prolific that wearing a mask is some political statement that only the far left does. history will look pretty badly on this whole mask thing, that it's dividing the parties. it makes no sense. >> let's talk about the current state of play of need and who is doing what. to be fair to senator cruz, he

says, you know, the republicans voted twice on very big dollar amount bills for relief for people dealing with covid and that the democrats filibustered and stopped it. this was his response to my saying, don't worry about taking me on on twitter, take on all the hungry people you have waiting in line for food in your state. did they vote on two bills that would have helped that need of all those long lines in his state and states all over this country? >> they would have helped a tiny bit, but here's the real story. back in march we voted unanimously for a generous package that made a big difference. according to the pew foundation, it kept 12 million americans out of poverty. it essentially expired in july and august. congress did nothing. mitch mcconnell, ted cruz, president trump said they didn't see any -- they didn't feel any urgency to do anything. every day in ohio and texas and

everywhere in between and around the country, thousands of people followed to poverty. speaker pelosi wanted to do a big package, then she said, okay, a little smaller, then a little smaller. republicans offered very little. nothing close to $600 a week, keeping people out of poverty, nothing for emergency rental assistance, very little for public schools so they could open in person, nothing more local governments, something for small business but not enough. then they simply adjourned and said, sorry, no. we want to come back. instead of coming back to vote on a hack for the federal reserve which the senate actually defeated today and a bunch more judges, that's what mcconnell brings us back for, exposing workers to this virus, instead we should be quickly negotiating a package that will matter to get people through this cold winter, to get people through this pandemic so they have a fighting chance. >> why are the democrats to blame for not accepting something rather than nothing with so many people in need?

>> because something was so little. something was a little bit, but we were always hopeful that the pressure of the election on president trump -- trump said let's do something bigger, then he changed his mind and he was back and forth. but we were hoping and still do for something significant enough to make a real impact the way it did back in march. it made a huge impact. 12 million people out of poverty, and since then it's gotten worse and worse and worse, and republicans don't want -- half the republican caucus has said they don't want to do one dollar. they want to do zero. so we know that republicans want to do just the minimal amount to get through the lekds and then essentially nothing. we hope they'll do something now. if they don't, we come back with something significant with the new biden administration, but we hope they do it now. we ought to be in session right now doing that instead of voting to put a political hack on the federal reserve, another trumpster. >> every day that it continues without something being given to

the american people is another day people have food insecurity, which i guess is some pc way of saying going hungry. i don't know -- sometimes we kind of err on the side of gentle language that doesn't do justice to reality. that's your worst political point here, is every day that goes on without something is a day that people are hurting too much. at what point do you have to take the deal that's on the table just so something can get done? >> absolutely. there is no deal on the table now. i mean, mcconnell has put no deal on the table. >> what about those two votes? was that a mistake? >> those two votes back in october, they were called emaciated. they were that skinny -- that's a funny way of talking in the senate. but they did such a minimal amount. anything is better than nothing, i accept that, but they wanted to just do a minimal amount at nothing close to 600 a week, nothing for emergency rental

assistance, nothing for local governments, then they would say, see, we did something, we're done. the public wants to keep the pressure on them so they actually do something consequential that matters to the american public. what they offered mattered so little that we thought and still think that we have to get something more significant. if mcconnell would talk to us now guenin steagain instead of wanting to do justice, pelosi tried and half the senate and the caucus said no. >> the senator is in ohio, for those of you who don't know, but that's pretty significant. one in ten people in his state said they don't have enough to eat because of difficulty of getting food. that's why i harp on it. >> which you should. >> covid is not going anywhere, and it seems like it's going to get worse in part because of our politics. governor dewine, republican in your state, has been right on

the forefront dealing with speaking truth about and getting a state to a better place. the political pushback and resistance to wearing a mask, social distancing, having scott atlas, that guy advising the president even though he is denying the pandemic, resist. are we going to reach the worst before it gets better? >> we're still seeing this fight about masks. you saw it on the senate floor with the senator from alaska, that it's just an amazing thing that not wearing a mask has become a sign of being republican. wearing a mask means you're a democrat. it's insane. every public health official -- imagine if trump tried ten months ago, nine months ago and said, this is serious. i'm going to treat you like adults. i'm wearing a mask every day,

i'm urging you to. imagine how different the world would be today. 10,000 more people would be alive, kids would be back in school, businesses would not be shut down, most would be working. we would have dealt with this virus better. we're still seeing republicans refuse to wear masks on the senate floor and on the house floor in columbus and all kinds of places in between as if that's a sign of strength and manliness and freedom to not wear a mask and protect your fellow men and women. >> well, you said one thing that is definitely true no matter what party you're with. in time will be remembered. and what people said and didn't say and did and didn't do will be scrutinized in depth. senator sherrod brown, good luck to you and the people in your state. the republican campaign never put through any type of truth to you that this election

is worth delaying the transition. no gop-er has who said that's the way it has to go. it's not stopping rudy giuliani, though. he's pleading the president's case in a state that put biden over the top: pennsylvania. we have the top prosecutor from pennsylvania with a look at why these last-minute battles appear doomed, next. how about no no uh uh, no way come on, no no n-n-n-no-no only discover has no annual fee on any card. ♪ you know limu,g after all these years n-n-n-no-no it's the ones that got away that haunt me the most. [ squawks ]

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about the covid-19 virus. it's real. and it's dangerous. so, on behalf of all of us working on the front lines, please take it seriously.

and while we don't yet have a cure or a vaccine, we do know how to keep you and your loved ones safe. wear a mask. wash your hands. stay six feet apart. do your best to stay out of crowded spaces. and get a flu shot, it's even more important this year. we can do this. if we do it together. look, if you have proof of a problem, you go to court. none of it happened in a way that compelled anybody but the other members of the trump party. however, we will see. now, is the president's campaign willing to put up $8 million in wisconsin? that is what they have to do, prepay if they want a recount there. meanwhile in pennsylvania, it proves the absurdity of anyone

that tells you the president could still win. at the same time the state supreme court ruled against the trump campaign that anything improper was done in terms of letting them observe ballot counters, rudy giuliani was personally pushing the same conspiracy theory in federal court, even though the campaign dropped the claim from the same case he is now arguing. if that does not make sense to you, it shouldn't. to help create perspective, josh shapiro, pennsylvania's attorney general joins us now. good to see you a.g. >> good to be with you. >> what is the status of the legitimacy of claims by the trump campaign against your state? >> chris, i have been telling you for months that they were going to file a bunch of lawsuits and lose a bunch of lawsuits. that is exactly what happened here in pennsylvania. right now, you know, they have a last ditch effort in federal court here in pennsylvania on a

relatively narrow issue. i will tell you that there is no merit for their claims. there is nothing on fraud. there is nothing on legal votes. they don't even have standing to bring the claims, sort of law school 101. you would think rudy giuliani would know that. yet here they are, trying to manufacture fact to fit a narrative that pleases the president. frankly it is not going to work as i have been telling you for months. it cannot work and it will not work to overturn the will of the people in pennsylvania. >> do you see any proof that is being echoed in federal court that might lead the case to the supreme court? >> no. you use the word proof. proof does not come in tweets or conspiracy theories or in press conferences from rudy giuliani. proof comes from introducing evidence into a court of law, something they have failed to do

at every single turn. that is why they either lost in court or have had cases dismissed in court over and over and over again. it seems like rudy giuliani and the gang of sick faone. that is trump and they are trying to please him. we have serious issues in the country to deal with. people are literally dying. we need to move forward. we need to drop this manufactured crisis, the manufactured, you know, game of fraud that the president wants to play and allow us to get back to the real work that has to happen in the united states of america today. i would say to rudy and the gang that it is just time to move on. >> jake tapper had a clever phrase, the gang that couldn't sue straight, a play on the gang that couldn't shoot straight. from playing the line of laugh to cry, when you are in court

and you see rudy giuliani doing what he is doing here. the mayor for america, after 9/11. what is your perspective on that? >> it is sad. it is sad to watch someone who america looked to at a time of need descend into this type of lunacy and fearmongering that is not helping the country in any way and it is again, speaking to an audience of one. i see a man who is sad. i see a man who clearly forgot what he learned in law school and a man with absolutely no evidence to back up the ridiculous claims his client makes on twitter every day. >> a.g. shapiro, thank you very much for taking time to talk to us. best to the family. we are always here as a platform

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the turbulent times, there is really only one man's voice you need to hear and it comes next. cnn tonight with d-lemon, truth speaker. >> i thought you were going to say that while holding up a mirror. are you trying to get me in trouble? every night you get me a little earlier and earlier. you know i am always running up those stairs. >> i don't want to owe you anything. i don't want one second of time to have been taken from your precious show. we have a lot of news falling on the watch tonight. >> the michigan thing. can we talk about that? >> michigan just refused to certify the election results. >> i don't know if you got a chance to watch all of the michiganers and detroiters on a zoom council meeting or election

board meeting. they were letting them have it one after another after another. it was live for a while. the outrage the two republicas s who refused to certify the election got an earful. i am wondering when they report back to us how much of an influence they have. >> i love that politicals is local. you do the job the right way or get them the hell out. but we have half of our political culture in washington sitting by and saying nothing. what if it hadn't been for the michiganers and detroiters who decided t