a few minutes. two visions separated by, well, reality. john berman here, in for anderson. there is breaking news, tonight. the president's pardon of michael flynn, who admitted lying to the fbi. more on that, in a moment. but first, president-elect joe biden and president donald trump both addressed the public today, and they both breathe air. that's pretty much where the similarities end. they events, barely a couple hours drive from each other but they might as well have been on different planets. joe biden spoke about the pandemic. the sickness afflicting the nation. donald trump, also, focused on affliction but it was his own. the election he lost, he, somehow, won. and his determination to overturn the results. first, biden on coronavirus. >> it's divided us. angered us. set us against one another. i know the country's grown weary of the fight. but we need to remember, we're at war with the virus, not with

one another. not with each other. >> just today, more than 2,100 new deaths reported, again. that's the most since early may and we're not done counting tonight, yet. hospitalizations just set another, new high. almost 90,000. i think actually higher than 90,000. the 16th consecutive day in a row of new highs. also, more than 168,000 cases, and that's just so far, today. this is the fundamental challenge facing the nation, now that the election is over, which it is. >> our democracy was tested this year. and what we learned is this. the people of this nation are up to the task. in america, we have full and fair and free elections. and then, we honor the results. >> now, president joe biden will be judged on how he handles the p pandemic, what he actually does. but for now, at least he's

actually talking about it. talking about your pain. donald trump is not. he is focused only on his pain, the pain of defeat. quite literally, phoning it into a group of pennsylvania republicans, who were investigating, and i use that term loosely, the voter fraud that trump desperately wants americans to believe is true. this took place at a hotel in gettie gettysburg, but really, might as well have been fantasy land. oddly, though, not giuliani's. and among giuliani's many baseless, melting claims was that trump didn't just actually win all the battleground states that counts and recounts have awarded to biden. he said trump actually won virginia, too. now, keeping them honest, if he -- if by won, rudy means lost by ten points, then yeah. like the thing you fear most on thanksgiving, it was a turkey that just won't cook. and that claim was the event in a nutshell, wild statements, no evidence, fantasy land. now, as i indicated, trump did

phone into the event and, out loud, he voiced what was already abundantly clear. he wants to overturn the election. >> this election was rigged and we can't let that happen. we can't let it happen for our country, and this election has to be turned around. >> turn the election around. ignore the results. throw them out. forget democracy. happy thanksgiving. but, it's no joke when a president tries to, literally, subvert democracy, out loud. and not only that. some of the pennsylvania republicans at that event. the one where the president wanted the election overturned. some of them have been invited to the white house, tonight, and still there, according to our latest reports. for more of the president's alternate facts and alternate reality, and maybe cranberry sauce. perspective now from david gergen, former adviser to presidents nixon, reagan, ford.

and also, cnn senior political analyst. and rick santorum, a former republican senator from pennsylvania and a senior political commentator. kirsten, i want to start with you. just the difference between those two events where, on a day when there are 2,100 new deaths reported, on a day where there are record hospitalizations for the 16th day, in a row, the president's talking about the election he lost, weeks ago. how do you explain it? >> well, i mean, he -- president trump has basically checked out, in terms of even trying to be president. and is just out, you know, spreading conspiracy theories, and further dividing the country. the country's already so divided. the last thing that we need right now is to have somebody claiming that an election was stolen. when it clearly wasn't. so, he seems to be trying to save face for the fact that he lost. meanwhile, you know, joe biden is acting, you know, like a president acts.

sort of, you know, what we remember from the past. whether it's republicans or democrats preceding donald trump trying to unite people when we are facing a pandemic. trying to encourage people. showing empathy. the kinds of things that we traditionally associate with a president. >> david gergen, each message, each distinct, very distinct message that we heard today, what do they send to the world? what message do they send to the world? >> well, i'm afraid for -- there are many people around the world who have been so discouraged by the last four years, that they're not quite sure what to believe anymore. but even so, i think that the biden message is probably playing better and having more impact overseas than here because people have been so eager overseas to figure out what in the heck's going on in the united states? are you really withdrawing from leadership? are you in permanent decline? and i think, biden coming in the

way he has, a very successful start to his presidency, sending a good message. here, we're so divided that i'm not sure that a lot of trump voters are willing to listen, yet. but i think the contrast between the two candidates today, was clearly stark. on one hand, trump, who is like a wounded animal. he's angry. lashing out. and on the other hand, here's biden, who is calm, comforting, you know, very reassuring, we're going to make it through this. let's be realistic about what we face. it's difficult. we've made it before. i think that will not persuade many trump voters but is extremely reassuring to a whole lot of biden voters and a whole lot of people who are in the middle. >> we have a trump voter with us and that's senator rick santorum. senator, just as an american, for a moment, the message that joe biden delivered today about the pandemic and where we are, on this day before thanksgiving, and the pain that many americans

feel tonight. what did you make of it? >> you know, i -- rhetorically, i think joe biden has -- has hit the notes very, very well. substantively, as you can imagine, i'm not particularly excited about many of the things he is talking about doing. but i think his tone has been very, very good. i prefer donald trump's tone of announcing a third vaccine that's getting very good results, as a result of work that he and operation warp speed have done. so, trump hasn't just been talking about the election. he's actually been talking about the pandemic, too. and he's actually delivered very, very well for the american public in getting a record -- a vaccine, in record time, you know, ready to -- to -- to begin to confront this virus. >> well, he talked about the vaccine briefly. briefly. yesterday. he didn't today. right? i mean, today, he chose to ignore it completely on the eve of thanksgiving. and i know faith and family are very important to you. and i also know you have been critical of the president's tone

over the last four years. you just have. wouldn't it have been better, wouldn't it have been a good day to address the pain people are feeling today? >> you know, the president issued a thanksgiving proclamation and -- and did address those -- those issues and the pain, and the people who have been dealing with the pandemic, all across this country. but, you're right, he didn't -- he didn't go out and -- and do that in pennsylvania. but, look. the president and -- and joe biden are two very different places. joe biden is preparing to take control. and -- and donald trump is fighting to -- to hold onto what he thinks is election he won. so obviously, they're going to be different modes. >> we'll talk about the proclamation or the statement the president released today because it actually calls on people to gather on thanksgiving. and we're going to talk to the doctors about -- about that message, and the potential dangers of it. kirsten, on the subject of dangers, i just don't think we can get beyond the effort, the

overt, the out-loud effort, that the president is making to overturn the results of the election. he tried it in michigan, where he wanted legislators to overturn the votes of the people there and appoint pro-trump electors. he is trying something like it now in pennsylvania. it will be harder, given where we are. i mean, it will be impossible, given where we are. but just that message, itself. the message, three weeks after the election, that i want to overturn it. how dangerous? >> it's extremely dangerous. and, you know, rick just said that the president believes that he -- that he won the election. i really do have to question that. you know, i don't know how he could believe that, unless he's completely and utterly delusional. and it's just -- there's nothing -- there's no information, whatsoever, to back it up. there's no legal case to be made. you know, it, by all appearances, he is just telling people something that he has to know is not true.

in order to save face. in order to preserve his future in politics. with no regard, whatsoever, to the damage that he's doing to the country. that, how he is causing people who trust him to not trust the democratic process, and the -- you just -- it's impossible to overstate the damage that that causes. >> david, it is interesting. the contrast, again, just presented itself today. and it was so incredibly striking. and i do wonder, as -- as troubling and potentially dangerous in places as it may be, if it does present an opportunity for president-elect biden. you know, he doesn't have to say things directly. he doesn't have to say, look at this guy. but, is sort of obvious and allows him to present himself in a different way. what do you think? >> very good point, john. i keep wondering. he's much more active this week than i would have expected. he's been in front of cameras, behind microphones a lot.

and whether they're already trying to create that contrast in a lasting way because on tv a lot. and i think as rick santorum just said. and i think that's been helpful to him. i think people who are -- who voted for biden but weren't quite sure how he would be in a presidential role are much reassured simply by what he is doing in the last few days. if he has another two weeks like this, he's going to be in great shape. what we don't know, there are so many surprises that could come from donald trump on the pardoning front. is he going to pardon his kids? is he going to pardon himself? there are a lot of different ways he could be distracting again. but in the meantime, i think joe biden has made very wise use of the time he's had. >> david gergen, kirsten powers, rick santorum. rick, i've seen you so much this week, i feel like we're having thanksgiving together. >> we had breakfast together. great. >> i really hope the three of you all have a wonderful holiday. >> take care. >> ahead. the latest from the white house

on the flynn pardon. is this just the start of many pardons we could see between now and when president trump leaves office in january? and could one of those pardons have the last name trump? but, first, the plea from dr. anthony fauci, as holiday travelers ignore the advice to stay home as the u.s. passes 2,000 coronavirus deaths for a second day, in a row. and hospitalizations just hit a new high. ♪ (children laughing) ♪ (music swells) (dog barking) ♪ (music fades) (exhales) experience the power of sanctuary at the lincoln wish list sales event. sign and drive off in a new lincoln with zero down, zero due at signing, and a complimentary first month's payment. the coronavirus isn't waiting.

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program, there are new, grim coronavirus milestones. for the second day in a row, the u.s. death toll has topped 2,000. so far, tonight, at least 2,155 deaths reported. that's the most since early may. nearly 90,000 people will spend thanksgiving in a hospital. as the u.s. setting a new record for hospitalizations for the 16th day, in a row. with millions of people ignoring cdc guidance and flying to a destination to celebrate thanksgiving, dr. anthony fauci has this message for all of us. >> keep the gatherings, the indoor gatherings, as small as you possibly can. we all know how difficult that is because this is such a beautiful, traditional holiday. but, by making that sacrifice, you're going to be -- prevent people from getting infected because we know, for sure, that people who are without symptoms, innocently, with no malintention, at all, goes to a party or goes to a gathering. gets together, indoor.

you let your guard down. you obviously have to take a mask off, if you're eating or drinking. try to avoid that, as much as possible. a sacrifice now could save lives and illness, and make the future much brighter as we get through this. >> that's dr. fauci with a plea, almost a desperate plea. you can hear it in his voice. for all americans. seems the white house didn't get tat message, though. this afternoon, president trump released his annual thanksgiving proclamation. we read it, talked about it just a short time ago. this is what the last line says. quote, i encourage all americans to gather in homes and places of worship to offer a prayer of thanks to god for our many blessings. joining us to discuss, dr. celine gounder, infectious specialist diseases. and at george washington university in the nation's capital. and, doctor, that message from the president, calling on americans to gather. i'm not talking about places of worship.

churches are one thing that have their own set of issues. but calling on people to gather in homes, which is the opposite of what dr. anthony fauci and the cdc have been saying. they're saying don't. don't do it. stay with your insulary family. what do you make of it? >> it's hard to find the words. just another example of the absolute, abject failure of leadership that this president has displayed throughout this pandemic. and as a medical professional, as an emergency physician, who is on the front lines every day over the last two weeks, has seen more and more covid in our emergency departments. it's a slap in the face. how dare him, in that same statement, give credit and say thanks to the doctors and nurses who have been working, tirelessly, over the last nine months to try to save lives? and then, at the very end, to just make a statement that flies in the face of science and

medicine. and tell people the exact opposite of what everybody with a qualifying degree/education has been saying for the last few months, to stay home, not gather. it's the only way we're going to flatten the curve and save lives. people are going to die because there are choosing to go home for thanksgiving and that's insane to me. and if we'd have had proper messaging from the top, from the very beginning, more lives would have been saved. >> dr. gounder, i'm sure you hear it. i hear it all the time. people are confused. they get conflicting messages. they hear the opposite things on the same day, from people who are in authority. how much more difficult does this make it for frontline medical workers? >> well, look. people listen to the advice that fits their world view, that is most convenient to them. you know, if you want to go home for the holidays and someone who is an expert says, oh, this is how you can make it happen. or, yes, that's okay. you're going to be incliepned t

listen to that. and i think it's really unfortunate that we do not have better leadership from the top to help us cut through this. i will say, i agree with dr. phillips, you know, this is a very difficult time for all of us. many of us have been working on the front lines for months. we are burned out. we're exhausted. i promised my husband that tomorrow would be my first day off since february. and, you know, a lot of us are just really burned out. and i -- i just -- i don't even know how to express how frustrating it is to see people taking actions that are, frankly, dangerous to themselves, to their families. and knowing, you know, i'm not sure when dr. phillips, you know, caring for patients in the er. but i know i'm going to be on call. i'm going to be in the hospital over new year's. and to know that this is going to be what we're facing is just really, very sad. >> take the day off tomorrow, if you can. i know you and your husband are great cooks and there's some good soccer on tv. dr. gounder, it's not just

republicans. i want to make clear that mixed messages aren't specific to one party. the mayor of denver had to apologize, today, and cancel a trip to mississippi after it went against his own advice on traveling. look. governors newsom in california, governor cuomo, here, in new york, have faced backlashes for their behavior or plans not matching some of their prescriptions. it gets to a bigger issue, i think, dr. gounder, which is that everyone thinks i have one cheat. or maybe, i know better, in this one case, than the science is telling me. >> well, i think this is a great point. i think this is a test to a couple things. one, we're all human. we all want to be with our families. i know i want to be with my family right now. i have two young nieces. one is 5. one is 1. i have missed out on so much amazing time with them this year. and i know a lot of families feel that way. and i think there is a bit of denial. i think this idea of, well, i'm

different, somehow, this won't happen to me. and i think the combination of the two leads to this kind of behavior. and it really crosses party lines. this is not a partisan issue. this is a human issue. >> so, dr. phillips, given where we are right now in these new numbers that we saw just released moments ago, and given what we're seeing in terms of the traveling today and sunday, which will probably be the busiest travel day of the year, to date. how much worse do you think it might get, as the weather gets colder? >> i wish i could give you an upbeat answer. i wish i could provide reassurance that our hospitals are ready and prepared for the surge of patients we're going to see. but i can't guarantee it. we look at a three-week period, essentially, to see the lag between diagnosis of cases and deaths. and if you look back three weeks ago, from today, there were 93,000 new cases diagnosed. today, there was at least 178,000 or yesterday. and 2,000 people, plus, died

today. now, double that. and add in thanksgiving and that's where we're going to be in three weeks. we could be seeing 4 to 5,000 people dead, per day. every few seconds, an american dying. and all it takes to help prevent that is some sacrifice. as dr. gounder was saying, you know, i have a 6-month-old son who has never met his grandparents. i have a two and a half-year-old who hasn't seen grandpa in a really long time. we're making sacrifices not just for ourselves. we're young, we're healthy, we'd probably be okay. but we're doing that to prevent spread throughout the rest of the united states. and if everyone would take at least a small amount of that responsibility, we could -- we could flatten the curve, and we could really start to make a difference in this virus. and i hope people pay attention to that, come christmas time. >> i hope kids are talking about it next year or in a few years and they can look back at this time as something very much in the past.

happy thanksgiving to both of you. >> happy thanksgiving. >> just ahead. more breaking news on that pardon for former national security adviser michael flynn, announced hours before the thanksgiving holiday. we'll discuss the drama that led up to it, and who else in the white house may be next for a pardon. and is their last name trump? no uh uh, no way come on, no no n-n-n-no-no only discover has no annual fee on any card.

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more, now, on the breaking news we mentioned at the top of the broadcast. president trump's pardon to former national security adviser, michael flynn. the pardon was unsurprising, as president trump long suggested it was coming. equally unsurprising, the manner of the announcement. which, like so many presidential statements, was put out without

warning over twitter. quote. it is my great honor to announce that general michael t. flynn has been granted a full pardon. congratulations to general flynn and his wonderful family. i know you will now have a truly fantastic thanksgiving. kaitlan collins joins us from the white house, with the latest. kaitlan, what more are we learning about this pardon and what the white house is saying about it? >> well, john, this is a pardon that was expected. the president had been telegraphing that he would do it since earlier this year when he was saying that he felt really badly for what happened to general flynn. as you saw people in the president's orbit really try to rewrite what happened with him. and of course, he was fired in 2017, right off the bat, for lying to the vice president, the president said, about his contacts with the person who was then the russian ambassador during that presidential transition period. though, of course, he later pleaded guilty to lying to the fbi, twice, about those same contacts during that investigation into russian interference in the election. but then, he disavowed his guilty plea, and tried to get his case thrown out.

and, of course, that was that shocking moment, earlier this year, when the justice department trying to drop their own case into this. and had really been in this kind of legal limbo for the last few months, until the president is now ending this saga, by granting him this pardon, tonight. >> you know, flynn's actions, right, his phone calls, and then his lies, truly, alter the course of the trump presidency. >> they really did. he was only the national security adviser for 24 days. but he had a lasting effect on what happened in this white house because it was the real, true, first moment of chaos in trump world. if you talk to people who worked here, at the time, because, of course, the president fired him. then, it was that meeting that the president had with james comey, who was the fbi director in the oval office, when he told comey he wanted him to let the investigation into flynn go. of course, it was just a few months later, the president fired james comey. that led to the appointment of the special counsel, robert mueller, and that whole investigation that played out for so many years. so, it truly did alter the --

the -- donald trump's time in office. you know, it's coming to a close and as you are looking back on it and seeing, really, what were massive moments in a chaos-filled presidency. this is one of them that jump started so many others that we've seen play out. >> so, the president, tonight, still trying to overturn the results of the election. but you think this pardon is a sign that he knows that he is leaving office in 56 days? >> that's exactly how i read it when the president sent it out. and it's not just michael flynn. we're expecting other pardons. potentially, other people, to get their sentences commuted, like roger stone did. maybe, even a pardon for roger stone. we know he is trying to get one of those as well. and so, i think what the president is saying publicly and telling his supporters that he's not giving up, that it's won this race, and he's continuing to fund raise off it. look at his actions. he is doing something that someone does when they know they're on their way out the door, and he is trying to use this pardon power while he still can. >> kaitlan collins, thanks so much for being with us. so we want to read that tweet from 2017 that kaitlan referred to. trump's explanation of why he

forced flynn out of office. quote. i had to fire general flynn because he lied to the vice president and the fbi. he has pled guilty to those lies. it is a shame because his actions during the transition were lawful. there was nothing to hide. perspective, now, from former impeachment counsel for democrats. and author of the recently released book, a case for the american people, the united states versus donald trump. and jim sciutto, cnn's chief national security correspondent, who's reported on michael flynn for years. ambassador izen, i want to start with you. you tweeted that the president's actions could, quote, wreak of obstruction. what's your reaction to it through your lenses of your former government jobs? >> thanks for having me back on the program. and my reaction is that the

trump presidency has been a nonstop assault on the rule of law. and this shameful pardon of one of the president's cronies, mr. flynn, who twice admitted in federal court, john, that he had lied. is a -- a -- a fitting coda -- there will be more -- to a president who, himself, has engaged in obstruction of justice. one of the ten episodes that we studied in impeachment, in the mueller report, that mueller focused on, was obstruction and pardon dangling with none other than michael flynn. so, the saga of criminal behavior and lying continues. and i'm afraid we'll see more, before this presidency is over. >> of course, what supporters of the president, michael flynn, will say is that the president has the power to pardon. so, how could it be a crime to use the power that he has?

>> well, the president does have broad and really unchallenged authority to issue pardons. he knows that. and so, he is going to use this authority robustly. when i think about the -- and i agree that this is just the beginning of the pardons that we're probably going to see, between now and january 20th. when i think about the pardons he might give, i tend to put them into three different categories. there's the category that michael flynn falls into, which is those who fell under special counsel mueller's investigation. which, the president has been unhappy with, severely, for his entire presidency. and that, he will try to unravel as much of that investigation as he can, through pardoning many of the individuals who have been investigated or convicted as part of that investigation. the second category is, i think, he'll look to favors.

potential pardons that associates or celebrities recommend to him, that he'll just do on the way out. and then, the third category is the friends-and-family category, which would be the prospective pardons that he might issue to protect friends and family from what might be perceived as potential criminal, federal exposure. >> i'll come back to that in just a moment because i think that's a really interesting area to delve into. but, first, jim, i want to bring you in on the idea of the russia investigation. which again, your reporting was so key from the beginning here. and in a sense, i guess, the president is trying to rewrite history or reframe history, which he's been doing from the very beginning. what message do you think this sends, this pardon sends, to the career justice department officials, the national security community? fbi investigators who depend on honesty? >> let's remember who michael flynn lied about. michael flynn lied about speaking to the russians. specifically, the russian

ambassador, during the transition about sanctions imposed on russia for interfering in the 2016 election. the obama administration imposed those sanctions, understandably. russia had violated american politics. and michael flynn communicated to them, hang on, there's a new sheriff in town. the president, you know, is going to handle things differently. don't overreact. so, undermining america's response to an attack on american democracy. that -- that -- you know, that is -- does damage to u.s. national security. two, by lying to a russian. by speaking to a russian, and then lying about it, you expose yourself to national-security risk because the russians know you're lying. and, therefore, that is a potential use of compromising information against you. right? another weakening of u.s. national security from the national security adviser. you know, these were lies with

consequence. you and i, john, have heard this phrase process crimes, often, from trump allies. saying, you know, this is just something that happens in the midst of, you know, investigations. he lies about things of consequence, right? and -- and put the country's national security in danger, as a result. and now, the president has pardoned him. and that's something that americans have to remember, here, because it's not just a legal issue or a political issue. it's an issue of national security. >> carrie, let me come back to you on the issue you brought up moments ago. sort of a prophylactic pardon, right? a pardon before an investigation might start or at least become public. how does that work? i mean, how can the -- the president pardon a family member for an investigation we might not even know about, yet? >> well, on one hand, there might be investigations that the president might know about. there's other -- also, been public reports about, for example, possible investigations of rudy giuliani, his friend and

lawyer. and so, there -- he -- he can issue a pardon. he could just issue a statement, like he did tonight. and he could say i'm pardoning the -- you know, these individuals. and it can be as broad as he wants. again, the pardon authority is one of the constitutional authorities the president has, that is extraordinary -- extraordinarily broad and can't be reviewed. so, we don't know exactly how he is going to use that. but i would just urge americans to kind of settle in, and expect that we are going to see more of this between now and -- and the inauguration of president-elect biden. >> just so people know, some of the names that are still out there who are under investigation, in various different ways or stages. you know, steve bannon. rudy giuliani. roger stone had his sentence commuted but not pardoned. so, a lot of these names you ever heard for some time, still possible. ambassador isen, you briefly brought up, you think there is still a possibility of this pardon counts as obstruction of

justice. explain that, very quickly, if you can. how the power the president has and using it could, somehow, be illegal. >> as carrie notes, the pardon power in the constitution is very broad. but, it's not unlimited. the president could not take a bribe to issue a pardon. he would be subject to prosecution for that. the same is true with obstruction of justice. so, in this list of pardons that -- of perhaps some of the individuals you listed, john. some of those that others have named. if there is a quid pro quo, and that was what was so striking about jim's description of that conversation with the russian ambassador. the implication, quid pro quo, lies, crimes, all of the things that characterize the trump administration. and then, of course, the big question at the end. will the president try to do something that's never been done with the pardon power, be a

judge in his own case and pardon himself? that would be the biggest offense of all. >> and the jury, no pun intended, is out on whether that is a legal thing. jim, i have to let you all go here. very quickly, which people are you watching most closely as possible candidates for pardons? >> listen. we should be prepared for the president to pardon people who can help him, right? folks who might have knowledge of his own, potential wrongdoing. and therefore, a pardon is a quid pro quo, right? whether it's a roger stone or michael flynn who might have been called in to investigations, after the fact. listen. i don't -- i don't make comments like that unduly. just saying, we've watched this president for four years. we know the way he's operated. that's a thing to look out for. does he give pardons not just because he thinks those aren't

guilty of the crimes they've done? >> thanks for being with us tonight. happy thanksgiving to all of you. >> happy thanksgiving. >> you, too. >> coming up. the two crucial runoff races in georgia just over a month away. control of the senate is at stake. what the candidates need to do and how important voter turnout is, when "360" continues. at fidelity, you get personalized wealth planning and unmatched overall value. together with a dedicated advisor, you'll make a plan that can adjust as your life changes, with access to tax-smart investing strategies that help you keep more of what you earn. and with brokerage accounts, you see what you'll pay before you trade. personalized advice. unmatched value. at fidelity, you can have both. ♪ more than this

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tonight, as president trump pardons his former national security adviser and president-elect biden plans his transition, the focus is also very much on georgia. that's where the balance of power is, in the u.s. senate, totally up for grabs. no one is forgetting that two georg georgia races set for january will control if democrats take over and have a majority in both chambers on capitol hill. so a whole lot riding on these two races. joining me now, eric ericsson, and democratic strategist, a veteran of the clinton white house, who also has deep, political roots in georgia having worked for zell miller there for years. i want to start with you. the path for victory for either

of these democrats, vastly different, than it was for bill clinton or miller in '92 when you worked for them. what do you think their chances are? >> well, it's all about motivating your base. and the democrats usually do a very bad job in runoffs, especially in georgia, of motivating two constituencies in their base. young people and african-americans. well, guess what? their two candidates are a young person and an african-american. so, good for the democrats. meanwhile, they're so divided. eric can fill us in more. i worked for zell all those years. but as i see it, fighting the neanderthals and the -- the -- the -- you know, fighting the vandals. and the flat-earthers are fighting the sasquatchers. by the way, i am one of those. >> eric ericsson, first of all, great to see you.

haven't seen you in ages. but you have been writing a lot about that infighting. the republican secretary of state says that president trump threw him under the bus in terms of all the complaints about the election process in georgia. so, what do you think the impact of all that will be? >> look. i think there's a real impact for republicans here. particularly, it's notable, david perdue has been one of the president's staunchest allies in the senate. and it actually would help him, i think, in middle georgia and north georgia. turn out republicans. but they are fighting. there is a contingent of the republican base that really is a trump base, not a republican base. they came out for the president. they didn't necessarily come out for anyone else, even if they voted republican down ballot. and if they think the race was stolen and the president doesn't reassure them they need to vote, they probably won't. that being said, the democrats do have a little bit of a problem as well because, when you look at the turnout up in the north metro atlanta area, you got a lot of republicans that went against donald trump, they voted for joe biden.

but then, in south georgia, you had a number of precincts that skipped the ossoff race, altogether. so you've got this strange dynamic across the state. but it's all over the north metro area, mostly. and by the way, those people tends to be the ones who turn out in the runoff. so, will they turn out? going to take the president coming, trying to convince them. >> how much do you think the race will be, eric, about the four candidates, whose names are on the ballot? or how much it will be about national politics, joe biden, donald trump, or even mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer? >> if you look at the exit polling in georgia, they actually did ask a question about divided government. and predominantly, overwhelmingly, moderate, independent republican voters they all liked the idea of divided government. so, that is a message i think plays well with republicans across the state right now. if you add up all the votes cast, republicans got 51 in

congressional. so they've got a slight edge if they stop fighting with each other. >> so, paul, one of the really interesting things about georgia runoffs is that presidents don't like to go campaign there. one of the reasons is because it's, often, you know, a week or two before your inauguration. you don't want to risk losing just before you start the new job. it looks bad. you know, if president-elect joe biden goes and campaigns for these two races, and neither of them win, it doesn't look good for him. so what are the chances are that we do see president-elect biden or president trump campaign there? >> well, they have different jobs. the president-elect joe biden is putting together his cabinet. he's putting together his covid plan. he is putting together his economic plan. president trump is golfing, griping, and pardoning criminals. so, neither of them have very much free time. but, i have to say, president trump, i think eric's right, he can motivate that base. but imagine the scene at the

airport. does the governor greet him, who trump has attacked? does the secretary of state and other high-ranking republican greet him? it's a terrible mess for those folks. on the democratic side, barack obama had a huge impact going into that state for joe biden. . >> he didn't go in a runoff in 2009. that's the analogy i'm drawing here. >> right. it is very difficult to transfer that authority. we all want to make it about trump or about joe. but i think -- and eric is seeing this. you had some people splitting tickets and i think mostly what voters are going to want is the party that's more unified and more mainstream. and the republicans have already decided they're going to be more divided. can the democrats be more mainstream? that's going to be their challenge. i think they can. >> erick erickson, you want to make a prediction here? >> i actually think the republicans do win both seats. i think the dynamics on the ground favor the gop. remember, they've got really good ground games in georgia.

they've been knocking on doors for six months, and the democrats are just starting. >> i know from your writing you think it's going to be painful. >> a very painful fight. i'm tired of it already. >> happy thanksgiving to both of you. >> thank you. earlier this week, president trump touted the stock market surge but forgot to mention another surge in the u.s. millions of americans relying on food pantries to feed their families. the strain from the pandemic has forced many to wait in long lines lasting several hours. the disparity between wall street and main street when we continue. when panera's chef claes makes a pizza, he doesn't just make a pizza. he uses fresh, clean ingredients to make a masterpiece. taste our delicious new flatbread pizzas today.

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on this thanksgiving eve, here's another sign this holiday's a whole lot different than last year's. sadly the economic fallout from the pandemic is forcing millions of americans to get help from food banks for the first time. well, president trump was busy touting the historic high for the dow this week, plenty of americans were trying to figure out how to get food on their table for thanksgiving and every day. the nonprofit feeding america has seen a 60% increase in the need for food assistance since march. you may have seen the long lines for food in your own town. the need for help is growing across the country. here's cnn's vanessa your kay vich. >> reporter: the journey to get food through the cold and covid-19 has been long and hard for regina statice.

>> got to take it one day at a time. and as long as you have for today, you save for tomorrow. when tomorrow get here, something's going to happen. >> and it did. just in time. >> thank you. >> no problem. >> reporter: days before thanksgiving, agatha house foundation, a local food pantry in the bronx, new york, made a special thanksgiving delivery, filled with everything she needs for her and her two teenage daughters. >> it's just a relief that i don't have to purchase all of that. >> reporter: over 50 million americans like regina won't have enough to eat in 2020, in part because of the pandemic. feeding america, the largest hunger relief group in the u.s., projects that 8 billion meals will be needed in the next year to feed food-insecure americans. >> 40% of the people who right now are turning to food banks for help around the country are people who never before relied upon the charitable foods systems. >> reporter: regina is out of a job. her car was totaled months ago,

and she's not receiving unemployment. she now relies on a once-a-week delivery from the food pantry. >> day to day, is your pantry stocked, or what does it look like day to day? >> just surviving. that's all i can say. you just have to survive it. >> reporter: the 15th congressional district here in the bronx has the highest food insecurity rate among children in the country. at agatha house, they're hoping to take the stigma out of leading a little extra help. >> we have to look and try to imagine ourselves in the position, what we would want for ourselves, no the just to give them a cardboard box but to make them feel loved, special. >> reporter: this small operation says it's seen a 100% increase in need. >> even with the little that they get, hopefully there's someone in their building or their neighbors that they can invite for a plate of food. >> reporter: despite her

struggles to put food on the table -- >> you're welcome, miss mamie. >> reporter: regina is sharing what she has with her neighbor and remains grateful for this thanksgiving. >> even if we didn't get the agatha house or we was just having regular chicken every day, just to say that you was alive to eat it, that's a blessing in itself. >> so much need. vanessa your kay vich joins us now. these organizations have been able to meet the need. how concerned are they about having supplies for the next few months? >> reporter: john, the food banks that we've spoken to that are large and small say up until now they have been able to meet that need. they've received funding from the government, from the state. but largely in part from everyday americans who have donated over this time. but there is a concern that as the holidays pass, americans will forget about this need. and, john, also volunteers are so critical to getting these large food distributions off the

ground and into the hands of everyday americans as covid cases continue to rise in the u.s. there is a concern that volunteers won't turn out in the ways that they have been when they are so critically needed right now, john. >> so much need. everyone step up if you can. vanessia yurk vich, thank you so much for that report tonight. happy thanksgiving. a reminder, don't miss full circle, you can catch it streaming at 6:00 p.m. the news continues. let's hand it over to chris for cuo cuomo prime time. >> happy thanksgiving, you turkey. i gave you that tie, and it still looks better on you. i love you. all the best to you and your family. i am chris cuomo and welcome to "prime time." let's talk turkey. very few, if any, have it easy right now. too many are sick, starving, suffering. this reality should