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breaking news to report on the attack on the capitol last month. sources tell cnn it has been recommended that prosecutors decline to bring charges against a capitol police officer in the shooting of a rioter. the shooting remains under investigation. no final decision has been made. the justice department could make one in the coming days. now to a separate investigation by cnn state election data shows at least eight people facing criminal charges for their involvement did not actually vote. donovan crowl is a member of a self-styled militia and was removed from ohio rolls in 2020 for never voting. there is also no record of him voting in illinois where he was once registered. jack griffith faces a number of charges. including violent entry. court documents state that he posted on the facebook the cavalry is coming.

election data from two states showed he voted in 2018 but he did not vote in 2020. there you go. they were saying the election was a fraud. votes were stolen. they didn't even bother to vote. news continues. handing it over to chris for "cuomo primetime." >> all right, coop. one of your biggest fans has a big day today. cha cha is 11 and not only is she 11 years old today going on 19 but she let me leave to get ahead of the storm and come to the city even though that meant i would miss her actual birthday. >> oh, wow. >> good thing we had a couple days of preshopping. i should have pulled uncle anderson into that. she likes you better than me. >> happy birthday. that's awesome. >> all right, cha cha. doesn't get better than that. the man himself. i love you, cha cha. anderson, i love you too. thank you brother. i am chris cuomo. welcome to "primetime." family first, right? but your family as well and i have new insight for you.

we are in a two front conflict right now. all right? the first front is the battle within the gop. i say it's first because it has a huge impact on the second front. so the party of lincoln is looking more like the gang of wilks booth right now. right? why can't senator cruz or rubio or house minority leader mccarthy lead and say this? loony lies, conspiracy theories are cancer for the republican party and our country. somebody that suggested perhaps no airplane hit the pentagon on 9/11, that horrifying school shootings were prestaged, that the clintons crashed jfk jr.'s airplane is not living in reality. this has nothing to do with the challenges facing american families or the robust debates on substance that can strengthen the party. now, i would wager every one of you agrees with what i just said.

but you have not heard this from the majority of gopers in congress. here is the question. is that about to change? why might it change? because i just read a quote from senator mitch mcconnell. he's the guy who just said that. he just said it. the media is amazed at his amazing candor. seriously? one, he is stating the obvious. two, the only amazing thing is how long it took. and, yet, relatively, he is ahead of the curve. because what is truly amazing is there is a re-trumplican who actually thinks democrats drink the blood of babies and that k non-kook got put on multiple committees as a reward. then this taylor greene speaks with the ousted former president and comes out emboldened saying she'll never apologize for conspiracy craziness. the question is, will mcconnell win this time? will he cause a move in the caucus to reject the radical and reintroduce reality?

the bad news is, he tried that and lost on impeachment. and he turned tail as he will do. when i say pet the snake i mean it. this is the wileyest of the wiley. if he is saying this maybe he sees advantage in it. then again let's see if he starts saying, not all baby blood conspiracies are bad and then we'll know the festering continues. we have to examine it. because what's happening in that party is key to the second front that president biden is fostering. he is trying to move some republicans back to reality tonight himself. he had a big meeting at the white house tonight, and he did ten gop senators a solid just now. it was his first office meet in the oval and it was with them. and it was for two hours. now, many came away reporting, well, but there is no deal, so i think it is the wrong analysis. okay? i'm told by both sides they knew they weren't going to get a deal. biden wants 1.9 trillion.

the gop may get close to half that number. the meeting was about something else. senator susan collins put her finger on it. >> it was a very good exchange of views. i wouldn't say that we came together on a package tonight. no one expected that in a two-hour meeting. but what we did agree to do is to follow up and talk further. >> look, i know everybody is tired of talk. but we've got to get to a better place, right? here is the if. if biden can get ten or more real republicans to do deals the senate can keep the filibuster, right, which why is that good? look, i'll talk about that another night. okay? i have very distinct analysis on where the filibuster came from, why it's always been a malignant force in that senate and why it certainly is now. but a lot of the democrats want to keep it and certainly the republicans do.

so if you get this group of republicans open to doing deals you can keep the filibuster and you maybe avoid all out opposition again. and maybe, just maybe biden can move the culture. two problems for him. an identity crisis as i've been saying on the right. and promises to go big on the left. on his own flank you got schumer and pelosi laying out the groundwork today for passing relief without any republican votes using a budget reconciliation short cut. i get the strong move on that but i must discuss the cost to making that move that could make a big difference and no one has told you about it. it could mean cuts to your own health care. i'll tell you why. but also the democrats move unilaterally today on that poisoned influence on the right. the house rules committee announced plans to consider a resolution on wednesday to kick this head conspiracy qanon kook taylor greene off her committees, education and

budget, since gop leader kevin mccarthy and the house still haven't taken any action. by the way taylor-greene heard what mcconnell said tonight and rejected it. here is what she says you need to know. >> these are not red flag incidents. they are not fake. it's terrible, the loss that these families go through and their friends as well. >> first of all, yeah. we all know that. the truth isn't in question. you are. now apologize. say how wrong it was to spread lies. lies you knew you were spreading. you in the videos cooling these kooks patriots, reveling in the radical nature of it all. jews with lasers drinking baby blood. if mcconnell the wileyest of the wiley knows this must be put down, where are the rest of you in that party? how can you have silence be your presence on this issue?

is truly adam kinzinger the only one among you willing to stand up for his own party? and i must insist, there is a price to what you're doing. what one of your own, once called that back in the nixon days. not only are you hurting the ability to deal with the pandemic crisis but may have created another, my brothers and sisters. you released the kracken. you opened pandora's box. pick your metaphor. you now have extremists that are in the mix and they have access online to rank and file righties and they are radicalizing them. that is what that woman is. she is a radical. she's been radicalized. the numbers are growing. as are the threats. and here is more proof for you that this is just for them about the hate of america. not the love of trump. all right? cnn has breaking news just moments ago that some of the rioters who stormed the capitol

on behalf of trump didn't even vote for him. there are at least eight facing criminal charges who didn't vote at all in the election because they're not about us. they're about hate and them. okay? they're arguing to overturn the election. why? chaos. let's bring in the better minds to speak to the state of play. you got david gregory and michael smerconish. good to have you both. michael, good to have you. i want to test david's connection and make sure it's strong. he had wi-fi issues. david, let me start with you. what do you make of biden's big meeting tonight with the senators and what that is supposed to project? >> that he wants to try. that he wants to try to negotiate with republicans in good faith. i think he is speaking to the american public right now that wants to see government work better, that wants agreeable disagreement if there is going to be disagreement. but there's a bigger game here. the president wants to try to bring republicans along knowing that if they don't come along he

can go his own way because he feels like he's really in sync with the american public that wants a big deal. he also knows if there is an improvement in the economy, which ultimately there will be when the virus is under control, he wants to be on the right side of that bet. and if republicans don't get onboard and do something big, they're going to be on the wrong side. so he has learned from, back in 2008, this is the thinking that they were too afraid politically. he doesn't want to be afraid here. he thinks bigger is better when it comes to helping people out in the country and the bigger reward will be when it starts to pay off in the economy even if he gets some niks here for going his own way and leaving republicans behind. >> what is the chance, michael, that this works and you get some phalanx of somewhere between 10 and 12 republicans who want to make deals and separate from the toxic part of the caucus? >> i am encouraged that 10 went to meet him in the oval office. i am disappointed the overlap between those who voted against

that rand paul measure pertaining to impeachment and those who showed up in the oval office today total a grand number of three. in other words three supportive of both meeting with the president and being willing to vote against rand paul. that doesn't speak well for cooperation long term but i think it is in the president's best interests to do exactly what he did today, to be perceived as fulfilling that campaign pledge of unity. i'd love to see something come from it. >> david, how does biden make the left happy? they want big. they want muscular politics. they're tired of the oppression and the toxicity and they can go on their own. that's what schumer and pelosi are kind of preparing to do. >> yeah, look. they want to go big. i think liberals -- liberal democrats feel like their leadership has gotten played. that they don't play power politics the way the republicans do, the way mitch mcconnell does.

and they believe, you know, as an ideological matter in the full power of the federal government to help the most people particularly during a pandemic. that's what the left wants. biden is delivering. not only on this package but on executive orders, on his -- the ordering, the sequencing of issues, on equity, climate change, down the list. he is delivering for the left in terms of what they think are priorities. he wants to be seen as trying to do what he knows how to do, which is negotiate with republicans. but on this one i think he won't hesitate. i think, again, the bigger play here is that when the economy gets better, he will be seen as having done something big. because he's willing to negotiate on some of the margins here. maybe even on the minimum wage. maybe on who gets checks. what the threshold is. but i think he's being told, we know this, by his treasury secretary and others, the economy needs stimulus of such a

magnitude to make a real difference. >> there is a problem, michael. i'm sure you're aware of it though i'd love to catch you not aware of it. if they do it by reconciliation there is other legislation that triggers automatic cuts for any spending that will increase the deficit. so if the democrats push it through by reconciliation, some of those automatic cuts happen to medicaid and medicare. there will be a price for forcing it through that way. how does that play? >> well, i think that's the reason why you saw the president go the extra mile and spend so much time with the ten folks who came over to meet with him today. i would add to what david said by saying that any risk of alienating some on his left flank for the reason you've just articulated is outweighed by the president cutting a deal and trying to play kate the ten republicans. he is far better served and the country is if he can get it done through a conventional vote than for reconciliation for the reason you've identified.

>> the old expression hoisted on your own petard where your own bomb blows you up, i love the power move. i didn't like the way they were negotiating with mcconnell on the power deal. i thought it made him look stronger than he should be. however, there is a price to going it alone in this situation. now, david, what do we make of mcconnell? he comes up and throws the only straight punch at a qanon person we've seen from the party leadership and he says liz cheney was brave for what she did with her vote on impeachment. he says nothing by accident. what is the play? >> you know, i'm going to stick to where i've been the last time on this program. i think he is trying to lead with some example. you know, he's not going -- this is not the hill he is going to die on, you know, politically. but he is going to set an example that he hopes other people will follow. he is not going to take part in

trashing liz cheney, a conservative and, again, the notion john king pointed this out on our air earlier today, that republicans are spending more time trashing liz cheney than they are this qanon congresswoman. that's ridiculous. that makes no sense. and so mcconnell wants to show some adult leadership where he can. and hope that some others might follow because he does not want trump to play this king role or king maker role out of office. >> that's why, look, the former president gave him an opening, michael. last word to you. but her meeting with him, the qanon lady, coming out of there afterwards emboldened, you know, i get why certain people on the right and certain things that play to white fear republicans have to be careful about alienating but qanon can't fit in that mix, can it? >> she is a symptom. she's not the problem. i think you've got to go deeper here and say, what is it about the 14th congressional district in northwest georgia that would

cause people to vote for her? and, chris, there was not a jekyll and hyde that took place here. >> true. >> she ran as the person that she is. and consequently we've got to say what the hell is it about that constituency that would know these things about her and vote for her nonetheless? >> you had a good interview by the way with the guy who ran against her. can they see that? can people go online? >> yeah, they can. listen, dr. john cowan, christian, conservative, pro life, for the borders, for donald trump. it wasn't enough to get him elected. she beat him, 57/42. when i said, how come? he said, i think the voters wanted a grenade like her in washington. and that was an attribute. >> back to the expression hoisted on your own petard. she is going to blow up right in the middle of their caucus. great talk. appreciate it. michael smerconish, david gregory, appreciate you both. all right. now, another urgent matter for us. the nation's top infectious

disease expert is sounding like a weather forecaster. okay? did you hear what his covid prediction is for the near term future? listen to this. >> i see that hurricane 5, category 5 or higher 450 miles offshore. and, you know, telling people to evacuate on that nice, blue sky day is going to be hard. i can also tell you that hurricane is coming. >> what is he talking about? what is the hurricane? who needs to pay attention? we have the chief doctor with answers about what our future is going to look like and why, next. since suzie's got goals, she'll want a plan to reach them. so she'll get some help from fidelity, and she'll feel so good about her plan, she can focus on living it. that's the planning effect, from fidelity.

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you and i are sitting on this beach where it is 70 degrees, perfectly blue skies, gentle breeze. but i see that hurricane 5, category 5 or higher 450 miles offshore. and, you know, telling people to evacuate in that nice, blue sky day, is going to be hard but i can also tell you that hurricane is coming. so i think we have to understand that because of this surge, we do have to call an audible. >> that's michael osterholm, an epidemiologist who advised the biden transition team on the covid-19 threat. now, i got to play with this metaphor. i think he means to say we're in the eye of a hurricane. we had the front wall come through. all the cases, all this disaster. but now is there a back side? and we know in every hurricane there is. it's about how strong it is. is that true here?

is it an apt metaphor that we're facing a huge surge of viruses from what's called these variants? and on that score did you hear about the news from south africa? that's bad for all of us, even people like me. let's get some perspective from chief dr. sanjay gupta. doc, do you agree with dr. osterholm? do you believe there is something of that kind of scale coming because of the variants? >> yeah. i mean, i think we'll see a lot more cases because you have a lot more, just a much more transmissible variant here. many more people will become infected. the question is going to become, is that going to lead to the corresponding few week later uptick in hospitalizations and the corresponding few week uptick after that in deaths? i don't know that we know that yet. it is certainly clear if it is more transmissible more vulnerable people may get infected. that could lead to a problem. but it is not clear that this is overall that the variants are

any more lethal. that's what we're playing with. you got the vaccines out there, a lot of hope around that. we got to get those people vaccinated as quickly as possible. could it lead to the situation where even if people are getting infected maybe they're just developing more mild or moderate disease but not the more severe disease. so that is really going to be the big question. >> good news/bad news. good news is you wear a mask. you are careful about where you go. you play on the safe side. the risk goes down tremendously. it really is in our control. it always has been. and we've been failing all along. the bad news the idea that we're a vaccine away from even this south africa variant going away is not helpful from the numbers. you have a full screen for us of what we're learning about how stubborn this variant is even to vaccine. >> yeah. so we can put up those numbers. and let me just emphasize the point you made about the masks as well, chris. you're right. we talk about the vaccines.

we've always put all our eggs in the vaccine basket. that is our culture. masks would make a huge difference and i would say especially high filtration or n 95 masks if we wore those regularly whenever we're out in public we'd have a much quicker impact on the pandemic. this sort of tells the story. the vaccines are still effective against these variants but not as effective as against the more dominant coronavirus circulating right now. novavax, we see that data starting to come out 60% effective against the south africa variant. we'll see a bigger data set. the johnson & johnson the one we're really paying attention to. across the board in the united states 72% effective against moderate disease but 57% against south african variant disease. the good news there is that if you look against severe disease overall, whether it's the variant from south africa, the uk, brazil, or what is circulating predominantly here

in the united states it was 85% protective against people getting really sick, going to the hospital, and dying. what is the real metric we're looking at here ultimately? how many people are becoming infected or actually getting sick and requiring hospitalization? i think we could still potentially see a significant impact on hospitalization and severe disease if we can get people vaccinated fast enough. that's still been a little bit of the issue. >> last point. fauci spoke about people in south africa experiencing high rates of reinfection. meaning even someone like me. i got to tell you i heard this from people in france, too. i just out of nowhere had a number of guys who i met during all the terror stuff from france saying they got covid twice and i had heard that was like, you know, an aberration. is that changing that even people like me who had it and still have antibodies you can get sick from the variant?

>> yeah, i'm sorry to say, chris, that does seem to be increasingly likely. still maybe not common but increasingly likely. here's why. what they've done is they've done these studies where they look at convelescent plasma. like yours. you've had covid. you got antibodies. they take your plasma and they're testing that now in the lab against this south african variant. what they're finding is those antibodies aren't as effective against the variant from south africa as they are against the circulating coronavirus now. so they are seeing reinfections in places around the world. they saw it in brazil. they're seeing some of that in south africa. and in europe as you mentioned. so that's the concern. chris, it also makes the case that someone like you should get vaccinated when you can. because a lot of people say, look. i had it. i'm good to go. i don't need to get vaccinated. not the case. you still need to get vaccinated and this is why. >> this is scary news and i know it's going all over the place in the long haul community.

the last group of people. i'm one of the lucky ones but the last thing they need is to know they could go into that hole again. dr. sanjay gupta, as we figure out what the administration will do to adjust to these realities we have to talk about it and see what makes sense and what doesn't. thank you, brother. all right. >> any time, chris. vaccine versus variant. all about how quickly the federal government can get to those in need. all right? we showed you the president meeting with a group of republican senators at the white house tonight in an effort to get help to come faster by doing it together. the group is backing a smaller covid relief plan than what the white house wants. let's bring in white house senior adviser cedric richmond. good to see you. >> good to see you, chris. >> so how do you see the state of play here? nobody expected a deal tonight. but where are the democrats' heads in terms of the best way forward? muscle it through, through reconciliation, and let the republicans make the show of trust. let the republicans come forward and show they can do a deal.

but let's get done what you have to get done now especially for the pandemic. >> well, chris, exactly what you said. the president is focused on making sure that he gets the best results for the american people. we didn't pull 1.9 trillion out of the sky. we went line by line to figure out how to meet the challenges the public is facing. at the end of the day when we met all of the challenges it added up to 1.9. look, we are very grateful the ten republican senators came over. we are looking for ways to enhance and strengthen the american rescue plan. we're looking for areas where we can compromise. so one thing about this president and the vice president is they are always going to put the american people first. but this plan meets those challenges. and that's where we want people to end up. >> what about urgency? and the word is and you can tell me if i have it wrong, that

they'll give you pandemic funding right now. that they'll make a deal at the numbers that you like for what you need for vaccinations, for unemployment, that they'll even work with checks with people who need it. they just don't want to all go in on this big thing because there is too much from the left that isn't related to the pandemic in it. is that something you are considering? >> well, that's just something that's not true. everything in this package is designed to help people who are suffering from the pandemic whether it's child care, the earned income tax credit, child tax credits which would lift 4 million kids out of poverty this year. it's all based on the pandemic. we are more than willing to keep engaging but at the end of the day what the president and vice president won't do is compromise their values or let the american people down. the fear here, and i want to be crystal clear, the fear here is not going too big. it's going too small. even when i was in congress we did too little too late.

and we never got our hands around this pandemic. and so now we have sh pandemic. we have an economic crisis. what the president is saying is let's grab and handle both of them because that's what i promised the american people. >> how long can you wait? >> well, i think that's why we had the republicans in here today because we don't want to wait. the truth is families can't afford to wait. even those families that they are saying, make enough, those families are holding money because they know that come march the foreclosure moratorium, the eviction moratorium, that ends. and all those bills become due. so we're headed to a cliff. it's a race to a cliff. we want to help the american people before they hit that cliff. and so that's our sense of urgency. that's why we're proceeding with the process that we are. but there is no rule that republicans cannot join us in helping the american people in the path we're choosing. >> what is the most aggressive stance you guys would take in

terms of making a deal right now? what are the areas where there could be a different state of play than there is right now that might get you a bipartisan agreement? >> look, one i'm not going to negotiate on cnn although i love cnn. >> not enough evidently. not enough. >> i'm not going to negotiate on cnn. but what i will tell you is at the end of the day this is not about this administration. we're not trying to get kudos. we are terrified of the future facing america if we don't act now. 4 million less jobs this year if we don't pass this american rescue plan. so i'm not just saying that. bush and trump economists agree. over 400 mayors republican and democrat are asking us to help and help right now. we don't have the luxury to wait. that is the sense of urgency we're trying to press upon the republicans and our members of congress. >> a couple more things. i'm 90% joking about you not negotiating here. the 10% pushback that is serious

is the more you people are transparent with what is going on, what the issues are, and who wants what i think the better served you'll be. people are so tired of it being a small group, you know, who knows things and everybody else finds out later within congress let alone the country. the more they know the better. there is a price tag to doing it through reconciliation. as you know, cedric, but for the people at home, there are some automatic cost cutting maneuvers to any spending bill that goes threw this mechanism that increases the deficit which this certainly would. some of those cuts go to entitlements. how do you get around that? >> chris, you are partially right but it's only on permanent measures that affect the budget. this is emergency spending. everything in this bill is sunset. so even if you talk about the child tax credits, if you talk about the enhanced earned income tax credits. >> medicaid. >> all of that sunsets after a portion of time.

because it is not permanent it would not trigger those automatic cuts. >> even the minimum wage stuff? >> minimum wage doesn't affect the budget. in a sense it will not deplete from the budget. it will actually add money to the economy and put money in the hands of people that are busting their rear ends to keep a roof over their head, food on the table, and clothes on their back. that would not be a negative to the budget. so we've looked at it, chris, and i know what you're saying. but because these are not permanent, because it is emergency spending it would not hit those triggers. >> all right. that's an important issue. now, one other quick point of politics. so the vice president goes to west virginia. the reporting is that senator manchin wasn't informed or asked to collaborate and it looked like you went into his back yard and went after one of your own. is that the message that the administration wanted to send to the senator? >> absolutely not. our vice president is an absolute rock star and we send her everywhere we can.

>> west virginia? you lost by a million points in west virginia. >> that doesn't mean we quit, chris. what it means is we have to go take this message to the american people. and part of it is taking it to people who generally don't support democrats. because we have such a great vice president, she is volunteering to make sure people understand the message of what families are going through, what hard working americans are going through, and so, no. we didn't just send her to west virginia. she's going everywhere because this is important to the american people. and so, look, everybody knows the respect we have for senator manchin. this is not playing politics as though people would want to say, this is us putting our best foot and our best people forward and the vice president is absolutely one of them. >> cedric richmond, i appreciate you coming here and making the case to my audience. you have an open invitation. the more we hear from you guys directly the more people know what they're dealing with the more we can test power. people can get to a better place.

appreciate you for taking the opportunity. >> thank you, chris. >> be well. good luck doing the people's business. so one of the biggest obstacles to cedric richmond and everybody else in the white house trying to get stuff done on the pandemic, etcetera, is the impeachment. they didn't cause the problem but they have to deal with it. the trial is creeping up and the defendant's legal team literally just fell apart. they literally just left. once again as when it comes to trump we've never seen anything like it. now what matters to us and why i would even bother talking about it is the why. why did they leave? what does that suggest that this trial is really going to be about? i have a former trump white house lawyer who understands the problems that his party and this country are headed toward in this trial. next.

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we're learning more about what this trial is going to be about. just remember it's the second impeachment trial. the case for why he is the worst is on display. a source close to the case tells cnn that the ex-president's newly assembled legal team will focus on the constitutionality of the case. democrats plan to go back months to argue how trump incited the capitol riot. trump's case is notable because five lawyers left this week in part it appears because they refused to push his lies about election fraud. let's talk trump strategy with one of his former white house lawyers jim schultz. good to see you on "primetime." question, counselor. if you got a call from the former president and he said i need you jimmy, come help me, would you take this case? >> chris, you know the answer to this. i'm not taking this case nor would any lawyer that -- that is the problem he's had from the beginning. we saw butch bowers who is an

incredibly talented lawyer just leave the legal team from south carolina. this new team now is signaling it isn't about election fraud but the constitution and the constitutionality of the proceeding. i'm heartened to hear that is the argument and they're not going to perpetuate this false narrative of election fraud. >> what does it mean that men and women who get paid to make arguments walked away but that the elected leaders from your party in congress who raised their hand and take an oath will not go after the arguments about the election fraud the same way? >> look, i think everybody should be looking at the election fraud issue through the lens of, look, it was a false narrative and we should be moving away from that and toward the things we need to do for this country. i think paid lawyers are going to stand up and make -- i hope bruce castor from pennsylvania

is getting a good retainer up front because i think it is very important that people have counsel. and bruce has decided to take on this case and i understand that. but i'll tell you it's not something i'd want to take on. >> do you really believe on the relatively the eve of this trial that the former president met with that qanon kook and she came out of there emboldened saying trump's got my back? why would he send that signal to a party that is in complete disarray because of that element? >> look, the one thing he has going for him going into this trial is that he had 45 folks say that we don't believe -- they don't believe this proceeding is constitutional. you start getting into things like that, people start scratching their head and thinking about how they're actually going to vote. you start talking about false narratives and election fraud people are going to start thinking about how they're going to vote. when folks start asking what did you know and when did you know it people are going to be questioning their votes. i think as it stands today the president stands to be acquitted and not convicted before the senate but that could change on a dime depending how this narrative plays out.

remember this is a political proceeding not a legal proceeding. so the politicians are going to do what they feel is in the interests of how it is going to play back home for them and how, and the political implications of what they'll hear during this trial. so i wouldn't be so sure and so confident if i were former president trump going into this trial and having, pulling stunts like he did this week. >> what do you think happens in the near term with your party in terms of how it deals with what's within the ranks right now? >> look, i think the party -- i've always said i am bullish on this party. i think we've got a bright future ahead of us. the best thing we have going for us is the agenda of the democrats coming in, that just came in, and come into this congress. they have everything now. the house, the senate. the presidency. it's on them. i feel good about 2022 and taking back the house in 2022. we only have a five-vote margin. so, look. i think this party has to really look back and learn from mistakes that it made over the

last number of years of this presidency and move on and get back to lower taxes, good government, taking on china, all of the things that -- all the policy initiatives quite frankly that were taken on during this administration that americans voted for donald trump to begin with in 2016 and voted again for him a lot of them in 2020. >> i don't think they voted for a lady saying jews are shooting lasers from space. >> they certainly did not. >> i can't believe how quiet mccarthy has been on this. mcconnell spoke up. let's see if they follow suit. people in your party, angry about everything except qanon. jimmy schultz, thank you for the legal analysis. appreciate you brother. >> take care. all right. gamestop. gamestop is a metaphor right? little guy vs. the big guy. how the system will protect itself and who is going to pay? that's going to apply in a lot of different levels. all right? this is getting into very precarious territory, stretching into a second week. much bigger than a business story.

my next guest thinks that this is all about wall street chaos as a crime story. he says what's happening on the street is a robbery. who is it? the founder of bar stool sports. why he is so fired up, next. sfx: [sounds of everyday life events, seen and heard in reverse] ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ sfx: [sounds of fedex planes and vehicles engines] ♪ sfx: [sounds of children laughing and running, life moving forward]

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gamestop shares fell more than 30% today. trading was halted briefly. now it's still up more than a thousand percent from a month ago. and we'll have to see. it moves very quickly. it could move a lot. we'll see. robinhood, the trading app platform that we had the guy on last week, they are continuing to limit how much of the stock people can buy. the reason why, certainly an outrage, right, you got a mixture of passion and fights over profits, but look. it has to be that robinhood had liquidity issues. i know the guy said here he didn't. that he had enough money. it was okay. it can't be true. and we're going to have to see what regulators say. but there are bigger questions emerging about how this is going to end.

now, one guy who is absolutely putting his money where his mouth is or really put his money there first, so he's putting his mouth where his money has been, is the founder of barstool sports. dave portnoy. good to have you on the show. >> thanks for having me. >> why is this resonating way beyond a business story? >> it's beyond business because you had -- this story went viral, the gamestop stock went viral and the others around amc so everyday people were investing. it wasn't just wall street. it wasn't even just day traders. this is the general public. we were getting e-mails from people who have nothing to do with the stock market investing money to get on this trend and right when they got on it, is when it plummeted because robinhood stopped it. so a lot of people lost a lot of money and people who weren't used to being in the stock market and people who i guess weren't expecting it to go down that way. it was a much bigger story because it involved everybody not just traders. >> let's talk about the good guys and the bad guys here. i saw you on another program

you were heated up. you were talking about the anger toward the elites and the big shots and the wall street types. and that is catchy. people are angry. and i watched now on these chat rooms, you know, a lot of followers of yours. that's working for them. what is your message about the anger and people seeing going and investing in big groups to fight off the elites? what is the message there? >> well, i mean, my main message has not changed, and i've heard what everybody said, and i saw the interview you had with vlad and the interview you had with elon the other night and his tune has changed. he went from saying not validity, no outside pressure to, you know, now it was a liquidity issue. >> it had to be a liquidity issue. it had to be. it had to be couldn't make the call on covering the margin accounts. he didn't have the bandwidth. he didn't have the personnel, and he decided to play it safe. but nobody told him to do it. he wasn't forced to do it. so that was always going to be

his problem. but it's how it resonated. speak to that. >> yeah. well, he should have said that in the beginning. but it makes it seem like he wasn't telling the truth in the beginning. >> yes. >> the fact of the matter is anybody who looks at the people involved, you have the melvin capital, you have the citadel, you have steve cohen. anybody when you look and connect dots, if you are a rationally thinking human being, you think i got screwed, and you think the little guy got screwed. and if it was the reverse and the big guy and the hedge funds were making millions, nobody presses the pause button. that's what everybody thinks. that's what i think, and that's what i still think because it's just rationally how you expect it. nobody's protecting -- i've never heard, oh, the big guys are making too much money too quickly, so we've got to stop. i also still haven't been answered why you couldn't buy the stock or are you allowed to sell it? what i read in the interview and heard with elon is vlad said, well, people get angry and upset if they have to hold a stock and can't sell it.

what do you think they're going to do when you cratered it? there's a lot of things to me that just don't add up. again, using logic and reason, they'll never add up. >> here's my concern. you have a lot of followers, and i think it's good that you've put money into a fund that people can see online, that you're donating to small businesses. i think you put up like 400, 500 grand, and now it's at like 34 million when i checked before the show. good to help small businesses. they follow you. you take a hit. you've taken them before. you know the risk. you've got the capital behind you. you can take a big hit. a lot of these people are putting a lot of money that they need on the line. are you worried about them? >> no, because here's the thing. everybody's putting -- everybody knows the risk. when you say things like that, i've heard it many times. we're treating these people like infants. i mean it's very straightforward that the stock market can go up and down. what is different here, and i didn't know this to be honest either, i didn't know you could stop trading like how they did. i don't anybody knew that you

could do that. so for a lot of people the rules changed. we're fine doing risk. we're fine putting the money in. but we think we're playing under a set of rules that exist one way, and in reality, they didn't. we didn't know that. i didn't know that. but as far as people risking their money, i've been doing this for almost a year. and i've heard every old-school trader and old wall street say it's going to end in tears and you're leading these people to doom. facts are we've been more right than anybody else. so you know, it's a risk. you have to know. i always say in the same breath, don't put in more than you can lose. never do that. that's rule one of trading, gambling, investing, anything. >> but it's intox kating, right? that's when it gets risky, is that it seems like it's going up. look at where the stock is right now. we both know there's no argument on the fundamentals. there's not even any rational p/e ratio argument to be made. what happens when it comes down if the investors that, you know, you're rallying up don't have the timing or the wherewithal to get out before the big guys can?

>> well, and that's exactly what happened because they pressed pause. but the rally is already coming. when it comes to my attention, it's already coming, and the internet is a new age where everybody already hears this stuff. but i have just a different fundamental belief. it's not my job. i can say my opinion, and i believe that people listen to me have minds that work and can decide -- >> no, but you're persuasive. dave, you're persuasive. when people talk about you, you're not just another guy mouthing off. they listen to you. they believe in what you're telling them. you're giving them a sense of cause. i'm not saying this as a criticism. i'm offering it as a word of caution because they are going on what you say, and in a way, that's what you should want. but, you know, you know they're playing with pros out there now, and somebody's going to lose because this stock can't stay where it is. >> well, it only didn't stay where it is because there was devious behavior involved. i think it would have. if you look at my profile on twitter, the number one thing it says, i'm not an adviser.

don't take anything -- i'm pretty clear with that. but if people want to follow what i'm doing, if i wake up and i see a deer outside my door and i say i'm going to buy john deere because i saw a deer and i think it's a sign and somebody wants to jump in on that, well, then you're a moron if that's truly why you believe that's going up. i think people are smarter and they can make decisions for themselves. >> i hope you're right and we can always bet on people. let me ask you something, what are you doing right now? are you staying in those stocks? did you make this move to silver that was all over the chat boards? >> i didn't do silver. i still have the others. i actually said today i think i'm paying the highest price just to make memes. i like saying i'm holding it and it's going to the moon and meanwhile it's going down and i don't know what's going on. i still have amc. i still have nokia. i've gotten killed on those. i've gotten absolutely murdered. >> so why do you have them? >> because i'm not going to get rid of -- i like being part of the movement right now and i like making memes about it. >> you can do that. not everybody can.

dave portnoy, thank you for tracking this story with us. i appreciate it. >> thanks. >> all right. we'll be right back. ooh, have you looked on the bright side? discover never holds you responsible for unauthorized purchases on your card. (giggling) that's my turtle. fraud protection. discover. something brighter. your grooming business is booming. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. the moment you sponsor a job on indeed you get a shortlist of quality candidates from a resume data base. claim your seventy-five-dollar credit when you post your first job at indeed.com/groomer