as mentioned, president biden makes his first trip to milwaukee for cnn town hall. it's at 9:00 p.m. not 8:00 p.m. when i am usually on. we are flip flopping. he will start at 8:00. tonight he is on at 9:00, which starts right now. >> happy to switch it up. it will be really an event to watch. see you then. right now, i am chris cuomo. welcome to "prime time." we need to be real about where things stand. so, let's get after it. and today is perfect timing, especially for president's day. as you know this holiday started

as a memorial of president washington's birthday. let us remember his warning, right now, together, because clearly been forgotten in d.c. washington warned us about letting parties get too partisan, because cunning, ambitious and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people. could he describe our current state of political rest any more directly? he was talking about senator mitch mcconnell. a guy who may resemble the bearing of the washington era, but he is the poster boy for the partisan poisoning our very first president warned about. mcconnell is everything when it comes to what ails us. he says after january 6th, as most of his party is saying

little or nothing, okay? remember. after a summer of raging about every act of political violence they could find and some they made up. but he steps up and says trump fed people lies. yes, mcconnell suggesting trump had a role in the insurrection of january 6th. then he begs to move the trial -- not to rethink it. not to question it. he never suggests that. but to move it to give it the time it warranted. then comes the bait and switch. the trial he apparently, mitch mcconnell, saw as legitimate when he asked to move it was now not constitutional. and there is then suddenly no need to hold trump to account. then mcconnell says, this should be a vote of conscience and is not sure which way he will go. then he acquits trump, despite the obvious and obnoxious role in seeding, sensationalizing and

springing the attack. conscience? more like conscious of some darker motivation. >> mr. mcconnell? >> not guilty. >> mr. mcconnell, not guilty. >> then, after that vote to acquit, he has the unmitigated gall to pull this. >> they did this because they had been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on earth. president trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. the leader of the free world cannot spend weeks thundering that shadowy forces are stealing

our country and then feign surprise when people believe him and do reckless things. as an ordinary citizen unless the statute of limitations has run, still libel for everything he did in office. didn't get away with anything yet. >> he did, and he got away with it thanks to you. everything you just said is exactly why the founders put in this process for political, political correction. for politicians to police their own. they knew there was a separate criminal justice system. what you just heard from mcconnell is clear proof of doing the wrong thing repeatedly when you know what the right thing to do is. that is a metaphor. it is a perfect description of what too much of the right side of the aisle is about.

that party -- i don't even know what to call them anymore. either you're all about what trump wants or you're an outcast. an outcast, like the 17 representatives and senators who sided with the obvious right move here. look what they have now said was okay. look who they have celebrating now. cnn obtained this newly released video showing coordination by groups of rioters, nine seen in matching tactical gear, moving as a unit. others waving in reinforcements to come around the corner, flanking police, left to fight them without reinforcements of their own, and a president who mocked pleas for help from his ally, who thanked the rioters, thanked organized extremists. they are some of those flying that trump flag. look, the democrats, they did what they could to keep these types from gaining momentum.

but the gop all but sold out the country for the sake of the worst among us. the extremists that attract as terror threats. how is it not too far for them to go? before you say no, you're going too far. i am? then explain this. >> this didn't seem like an armed insurrection to me. armed, when you think and hear armed, don't you think of firearms? >> did you ever hear senators say that last summer? why? why does he and these other whatever on the right want to own these bad guys and groups? because he can't be serious. what do you consider someone walking towards you with a bat or blinding sprays, or spear, or an ax handle or a fire

extinguisher. the law punishes each of those things as a deadly weapon because it's all how you're trying to use it. if you use it to try to hurt or kill someone, it's a deadly weapon. anything can be, as we are learning in real time, including politicians' mouths. where are we? do we have two parties or three emerging? can the mcconnell mixed message madness on one side and super sized mentality of those like senator lindsey graham stay together? listen to this. >> i'm going to go down to talk with him next week, play a little golf in florida and i said mr. president, this maga movement needs to continue. the most potent force in the republican party is president trump. we need trump plus. >> trump plus? why? so we can have the capitols of every state attacked at once? let get a read on what's going to happen over there, because it means something to everybody, especially in a pandemic.

we have a former campaign adviser to mitch mcconnell tonight, scott jennings, along with michael smerconish. good to have you, michael. scott, thanks for stepping up tonight. appreciate it. how are we to understand how the senator arrived at the ability to make that statement after voting to acquit? >> well, he had made it pretty clear since his speech after the electoral college had met that he didn't approve of what donald trump was doing. and i think the issue for him, though, was is one more vote to acquit worth it when the real politics of the republican party are going to be sorted out in the 2022 and 2024 midterms? as the head of the party i think he might have been thinking about the future politics and not wanting to become trump versus mcconnell in these primaries because he wants to win back the senate majority. you heard his speech. you know how he feels about what donald trump did. he has responsibilities to win back the senate majority and i think that factored into his decision.

you may not like it, that politics factors into these decisions but that's the truth. >> is that it? is it just politics, mike, or is it something more malignant? >> i think mitch mcconnell is for mitch mcconnell. he wants to resume his leadership position and it's all about self preservation. the net effect about all of this is that if donald trump stays healthy, financially afloat and unindicted, and those are three big ifs, he will continue to be the dominant force of this republican party whether he's the candidate in 2024 or not. >> so, let's be clear, though, scott, that was no vote of conscience. that was a vote of calculation, period. >> well, it was a vote that he had to cast, i think he believes, because he thinks the future politics of the party will be sorted out in these primaries. i think mike is right, that donald trump is the dominant figure in the party. and, obviously, this will spill over into the senate primaries and the presidential primary in 2024. >> i hear you.

>> so the question is, are we going to nominate candidates who can't win, like donald trump didn't win this last presidential election or are we going to nominate candidates who appeal for a broader base? >> that's not the time for it. that's not what this duty is about. there's nothing in the articles, there's nothing anywhere about how look when making this vote, let alone if you call it a vote of conscience. make sure you get all the calculations in there about what happens in the next midterm. it's a complete perversion of the duty, michael. now that it's all okay because we can understand it, of what it ugly and obviously is, what does it say about the state of play in that party? >> well, i would like the final line of that lead editorial in the wall street journal today, condemning donald trump for his behavior and in the end saying that unless the gop puts some distance between the party and the former president, they will remain in the wilderness. the most stunning statistic of the last several weeks, to me, is the fact that only three

house republicans, just three, both voted to impeach donald trump and to strip marjorie taylor greene of her committee assignments. that really tells you that the arguments that you're making, chris, respectfully fall on deaf ears with regard to the gop. >> i'm not saying it for them, but here is the issue. did you see the letter that adam kinzinger -- he talked about it here on the show. from his own family members. not like his brother and sister, but cousins wrote to him. the kinds of things they said about their own blood on the basis of trump. what did you think about it, mike? >> i'm so glad you brought it up. i happen to have it right here. >> i was supposed to have it also. i don't know if they have it to put up. but go ahead. >> here is what's most stunning to me. these family members who are disgusted. it's worded so strongly, with kinzinger. you know, they are seeking and receiving direction from donald trump, from god and then the

third leg of that stool, which i think is most telling is that they tell kinzinger he has now lost the respect of lou dobbs, tucker carlson, sean hannity, greg klly and most important mark levin and rush limbaugh, the very people who profit by perpetuating the polarization that exists in this country. honestly, this is like a lab experiment for what happens gone wrong in this country. >> and this is his family. they should be so proud of him. i guess, scott, at the end of the day, it has to not be okay with people like you and party people and people who will be part of the infrastructure and teams of candidates to come. isn't that what it -- it can't just be about the voters, because you can sell them anything. and in the moment you never know what's going to happen. as long as you tear me down enough you always have a shot at winning. don't people who call themselves republicans and or conservatives

have to demand better than what you're getting right now? >> yeah, we should demand better. you bringing up that letter reminded me of a letter i got i do a fair amount of writing and appear on here. i get a lot of letters, too. a person was very upset at me for criticizing trump and said why is it that republicans always have to be the adults in the room. i've had that letter sitting on my desk for the last month because i'm like, wait, is your alternative that we present ourselves as the american people as a gang of irresponsible children that can't control their emotions and can't tell the truth? that's not a governing philosophy. if we're going to decide that we're going to have a party that is built around one simple idea. we exist to win elections, or are we going to have the self grandizement of a person, donald trump, a club where we kick out people we don't like and having cultural grievances instead of focusing on elections? that's the competing vision for

the future of the party. i'm happy to discuss policy but at the end of the day, trump has redefined the purpose of party. the purpose is not to win elections. the purpose is to be in charge of a party so we can punish the people we don't like. i exist to win elections. and that's what i think mitch mcconnell and other folks want to do in the future. >> michael, i'll give you the last word on this. senator burr, a legend, was just censured by the state party in north carolina. we heard that senator cassidy had been censured already by his state party. i want to read you a statement, if i can get it for you here. nope, i don't have it. where did you send it to me, vaughn? production value. ah. text. here it is. no, i don't have it. okay. but this is the thing. he got censured. the statement doesn't really matter. where wha does that tell you about the statement of where that party is and if it can stay together? >> i think you can also add to your list a number of gop county chairmen here in pennsylvania

who are doing likewise with pat toomey. the answer to your question is this. there's such a tendency to focus all of our energy and attention on donald trump, but the forces that gave rise to donald trump will still be with us, even if he's no longer a viable, political figure. so don't think that the moment he's gone from the landscape that all is well with the country and everybody gets along. >> fair point. michael, thank you. scott, thank you. i know you think i was just going to jump on you this entire time. that's not what it's about for me. i'm very much -- i appreciate you coming on. and i'm in love and light mode, i've got to be honest. i don't see any other way right now. there's too much fear in this country about what's going to come next, especially when we have these organized savages from these extremist groups hunting us down now. let's find a better way, brother. thanks to both of you for being part of that. now here is senator burr's statement. it's truly a sad day for north

carolina republicans. my party's leadership has chosen loyalty to one man over the core principles of the republican party and the founders of our great nation. you may have never heard of stacey -- anyway, look, that's senator burr. and that takes us right back to washington's warning. this is out-of-control, partisan poison. no, not on both sides. the state of play is firmly on the right. they have a bigger hand in dictating how things go forward than the left, because they only have one choice right now, which is to just get things through. now let's talk about how we arrived here and really what was the best of this process. had you ever heard of stasy plaskett until last week? gladwell -- delegate. man, was she strong.

she helped convince seven republican senators to convict trump with a standout presentation. she had a winning case that was destined to lose. she used to be a republican. what did she think when she heard mcconnell? and what does she fear january 6th was really about? next. as a retired weatherman, i like things i can predict. that's why i chose an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare. it's the kind of plan with predictable out-of-pocket costs. plus the plan i chose has a low to zero percent chance of copays. it's a sunny day for me. -honey you're doing it again. -i'll stop. the only medicare supplement plans with the aarp name. medicare supplement plans have no networks and no referrals so you can take charge.

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this attack is not about one speech. most of you men would not have your wives with one attempt at talking to her. it took numerous tries. you had to build it up. that's what the president did as well. he put together the group that would do what he wanted, and that was to stop the certification of the election so that he could retain power to be

president of the united states. >> house impeachment managers made that argument numerous times and in very different ways, all of them incredibly supported by fact and circumstance. but none did it, arguably, as well as stacey plaskett. after her team ultimately failed to get a conviction what does she make of mitch mcconnell's acquittal but more what he said after it? the delegate from the virgin islands joins us now. congresswoman, thank you so much for joining us on prime time. >> thank you. thanks for having me. >> so if you can, please take me to where your head and your heart were, as you heard mitch mcconnell's statement after the acquittal of donald trump about his full-throated condemnation

of the man, his conduct and betrayal of the office. how did that hit you? >> it enraged me and also just made me think, just so typical of what i had seen in that chamber, on that side of the aisle for the past almost four years. so i was not surprised, but enraged as well that he could basically give our argument and still acquit the former president. >> what do you think it was about for him? why do you think he said that? >> you know, i've thought about that and what could go into his thinking to not convict. and i wonder if at the end of the day it was because he knew that a conviction -- his voting for conviction without the majority of his caucus voting with him could potentially mean

that he would no longer be the minority leader. and it appears to me from his other actions that being the minority leader is probably and hopefully the majority leader is what drives most of his decision making. >> do you see mcconnell as a metaphor for the state of that party right now? >> the audience should know you were a member of that party in 2008. do you see him as a metaphor for what that party is now? >> there's so many factions within that party. i think he is representative of one of them. i do believe that there are full-throated trumpers that are part of that party now. i also believe that there are very, very strong, hard-right conservatives who see trump as a vehicle by which they can meet the means that they have always wanted. i see individuals like mitch

mcconnell somewhere in between. just a little to the left of those far righters, who see a means to an end, to keep power within their party. and then there are those few, what i call patriots, who believe in what the party used to stand for and their duty to their country is much stronger. >> what do you think the chance is that any of those faction also combine in a way that allows the democrats to have a bipartisan deal on anything? >> you know, we'll see. i try not to think too much about that. i'm just trying to get past my own colleagues in the house who continue to vote for, to object to the electoral college and the certification even after the january 6th insurrection and trying to come to grips with how can i work with people that i thought were reasonable in the past.

so to determine how the republican party is going to re-create itself is not something that i can think that far ahead for at this time. >> what do you do now when you're in that chamber and look to the left and the right and see that there are people there who were fine empowering a mob that came hunting you guys? >> right. it's been called the enemy within. as we say in new york, you keep your head on a swivel, right, wondering what's going to happen with those individuals, and praying and fighting for those members of congress who are eventually, i believe, going to unseat them. because, chris, at the end of the day, i don't believe that what we saw among those people are what is the majority of americans. and remember that we had 57 senators who voted to convict

the president, and those 57 senators represent even more than 57% of the population of this country. those states that they represent are much broader than a 57% coalition. those 43 individuals who believe that their party and the president was more important than their oath, who believe that a seat in the senate was more important than their constitutional duty, i think represents a much smaller number of americans that are out there. and so i try to take comfort in individuals like the 10 republicans on the house side, those 7 republicans on the senate side who voted with their conscience and really believed in upholding their oath, and saw facts for truth and believed that they needed to speak up for truth as what we should be working with. and those are the individuals that i'll reach out to and try to bring along. >> it's a low bar, but i guess you'll need something to hope on if you're going to do the job.

>> yeah. >> so -- >> listen, i had senators, even after we presented, who stopped me in the hallway. republicans who said that we had made the case, yet they were going to vote to acquit the president. and when i would even offer them, you know, potentially get-out-of-jail free card saying vote to convict in the first instance and then not vote to disqualify him, which only requires a majority? the response was, well, i don't think you'll get to 17 so i'll never get to that second disqualification vote and i don't want to stand out on a limb by myself. >> that sounds exactly what's echoed all through their ranks. lastly, and thank you for the time tonight, what was your experience and takeaway from january 6th itself that made it so important for you to be one of those house managers and bring the case against the president?

>> right. well, as a history student, i really saw what happened in january 6th and even the impeachment trial as a second act after the civil war. when we had individuals who were seditionists, who were treasonist against our union. and in the past after the civil war, during our reconstruction, we just let them go back. we just let them go back to the south and rebuild their lives, as if nothing happened. go back to their plantations. begin jim crow. begin the absolute terrorization of african-americans in this country. and i believe that january 6th was, in effect, a second kind of civil war. and it was necessary for us to have a reckoning. and for those individuals who made war against our democracy would be brought to justice, and that they needed to be held account for. that's what i saw as my duty and

my service to my country. i believe that we were on the front lines, to save our union and our republic. but i do believe even though we lost that case that we have shown who donald trump is. we've shown the enemy that was among us, that was attempting to lead us, that was using us for his own greed and power and that he will not have the same power he had should he ever attempt to run again. >> i think it's an interesting question about the difference between what is gone with donald trump and what still remains that presents that danger. >> yep. >> representative, congresswoman, thank you so much. nobody can say you didn't make the case well. >> thank you. >> because you did. >> thank you, sir. >> thank you for being with us. plaskett made a strong case. i'm sure it's not going to be last we hear about her in a position of leadership within that party. it's interesting. one of the things to take way from mitch mcconnell other than

the shameless degree of double speak is the possibility of accountability looming over the ex-president. mcconnell has nothing to do with that. that's why it was easy for him to say. those who do have a say are making noise. d.c.'s attorney general warned that trump could face charges under district laws. while the top federal prosecutor made it a point not to rule out charging the then president. can you? we'll discuss. in georgia, you have the republican secretary of state looking into trump's call to, quote, find votes. can they move on him criminally on the state level there? we'll discuss. meanwhile, fulton county d.a. did open a criminal investigation specifically targeting trump. will it stand? there's still the criminal investigation in new york, into whether the trump organization committed insurance or tax fraud. could trump go the way of michael cohen? the state ag, the attorney

general is looking into whether trump's businesses lied to get loans. how real is that? there is a pair of defamation suits that were held up because of the protections trump got as president. are they still going forward? trump's even facing a lawsuit now in florida, where the palm beach council has to decide if he's legally allowed to live at mar-a-lago. do you care? me either. but it is something that will be on his plate. the volume of legal problems is nothing new to trump. the guy got sued all the time. more importantly, he used it as a sword and a shield all the time. rarely won but often sued. what matters now, however, is the severity. let's bring in someone who knows about prosecuting big cases from his time as a federal prosecutor, preet bharara. thank you for doing this. >> absolutely. >> what does it mean to you that it ist isn't just the doj looking at the president?

what seems most menacing? >> well, i've said all along that given how far along we are, and given the criminal nature of the investigation and the fact that it's not really political, what the manhattan d.a. is look at with respect to potential bank fraud or tax regularities. a case that could be proven by documents. i think that presents the most jeopardy because it's furthest along and they're a serious group of folks who are taking a hard look at what donald trump's financial records show and they're going to get them very soon. >> that would be outside the presidency. how much of this goes away because it happened during the presidency? how much protection does he get after the fact? >> well, he can make arguments, right? in connection with some investigation of the president relating to conduct as the president, prosecutors want to get testimony from someone who was a close adviser to the president.

as we know from congressional hearings, impeachment and other processes as well, they can assert the claim of executive privilege. whether it stands up in particular circumstances, it's hard to know. this president, i think uniquely -- not unique in that he asserted the privilege. he and his lawyers were unique in how broad he asserted the privilege in every instance i'm aware of in federal court. there's obstacles that relate to donald trump's time in office. people will try hard. the easier thing to do is look at financial issues he has had outside the presidency where he can claim no special prifl of privilege of the president. >> this will be ongoing for sure. we'll track it. preet bharara, you are invaluable. thank you. someone in this much potential trouble shouldn't have members of congress clawing for their affection, right? but it's his gop queue. should the few republicans or what used to be republicans who have broken off, should they have their own party?

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my blood pressure is borderline. garlique healthy blood pressure formula helps maintain healthy blood pressure with a custom blend of ingredients. i'm taking charge, with garlique. this was trump today, greeted by his supporters in palm beach, florida, post-insurrection and impeachment trial. confederate flags, trump flags. what we know is trump support remains strong. what we don't know is where the fractured gop, or whatever they are, is headed. my next guest says for america to live, this party has to die. let's bring in "new york times" columnist tom friedman, author of best seller "beirut to jerusalem." just using the word "die" will have the whole righty fringe throwing you under the bus as the real person asking for violence. two have you evers and what do

they mean? the first have you ever, have you ever seen somebody make a political move the way mcconnell did in voting to acquit and then following it up with the exact rationale as for why he should have convicted? >> well, chris, i think everyone has pretty well covered the fact that the hypocrisy of mitch mcconnell was as big as all outdoors. >> with no shame, tom. that's what i'm saying. no shame. >> yeah. i think that from the very beginning we've had a president without shame, backed by a party without spine, amplified by network without integrity. that's been the problem. what i'm focused on right now, what is the important question is will this party split in a way that 10 to 15% are hived off so the trump rump party is

unable to win a national election, to retake the house, to retake the senate, let alone retake the presidency. that's what i think is the most important question before the country. because this party has proven it is not a governing party. it's not a governing party in two ways. one, it puts its leader, cult leader, ahead of the constitution. and second, going back to the campaign, it had a convention in which it had no platform. it had no platform. stop and think about that. trump, all he talked about was how much he wanted to get back into power but he never really said why. you really have to ask, is this a party of health care plans or conspiracy theories, jewish space lasers or space program, tearing down the capitol or building up infrastructure? i think the most important thing for the country right now is that this version of the republican party led by donald trump not be able to get back in power again until the party transforms itself.

it's in that sense that i think this party, as it's presently constituted, has to turn into something else. it cannot be allowed back in power again. >> well, by allowance, though, that's about popularity and persuasion. look at this kinzinger letter, adam kinzinger, representative from illinois. this came from his cousins, tom, okay? they made it public. put up the letter. or i'll just read it. president trump is not perfect, but neither are you or any of us for that matter. it is not for us to judge or be judged. he is a christian. it's more embarrassing to us that we are related to you. they go on to say you will now never have the respect of, and names like every fire-breathing dragon on the right fringe. their own family doesn't matter as much as trump does. how? in what universe? and he's a christian?

>> i don't know his family, chris. i would simply say this. our country is going through one of its biggest transitions in our history going from a white christian majority country to a minority/majority country. and that transition has a certain part of the country frightened, unnerved. and what you're seeing is that they have latched on to donald trump to try to prevent that. and you're going to get these kinds of letters in that context. i think the most important thing right now, given where they are, chris, is that joe biden succeed. he succeed in his stimulus program. he succeed in getting the vaccine out. he succeed in getting teachers vaccinated. one of your guests earlier in the night on cnn talked about that. and reviving the economy. if joe biden can just keep doing what he's doing. wake up every day, go to the office, do his job, move this thing down the road, we're going

to be okay as a country. this thing will eventually burn itself out. but the problem with the party right now, and you see it in that letter -- you know, princess di famously said there are three people in my marriage. and in the case of the republican party, there are three people. there's trump, there's the base and there's the information ecosystem led by fox. and people are now trapped in that closed loop. in that closed loop you're going to get those kinds of letters. the only way you break that is when the party is out of power for a long time and if biden succeeds. >> tom friedman, appreciate the intelligence, brother. thank you. so the trial is over. but only in that one context, right? the trial is still on for all of us as a society. washington has to be focused on the pandemic, right? new covid guidance from the cdc for schools. it makes no sense. let's bring in dr. sanjay gupta and figure out where things

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now, good news when it comes

to coronavirus. we've had the best week we've seen so far in terms of getting people vaccinated. and every week since new year's, the rate has only improved. we need to build on the good while continuing to try and address the bad. when it comes to the pandemic. example. case counts way down in the last few weeks. not just a few places either. rates are dropping all over the country. when you stop making a mask a political statement, more people start wearing them. and it helps. good for us. this really demonstrates how we let it get out of hand around the holidays. there was a huge spike because we did the wrong thing. now it's starting to even out. we're still double where we were the start of the summer. perspective is reality on this. more than 90,000 americans a day are still getting sick with this.

we need to be at about half of that for everything to be up and normal. until you start building a prophylaxis through the vaccine. we're testing less. why? well, we're still really, only, you know, trying to figure it out, without really diving all in. and the resources are tough, and a lot of places don't want to test. so, a lot of the focus, on the infrastructure, is, therefore, going to the vaccine. which means, now there is not even the same emphasis on testing. the reality is, we need to be looking harder, than ever. okay? antibody testing, to see how much of this country has been exposed, already. who is getting it, and where? we've got to operate off data. they say the science. they really mean the facts. okay? because we also now have to factor in, which version of the disease do you have? because, when some of these, new strains become dominant, then

we're in a whole, new ball game. we are starting to see that the vaccine may work against some, but we're not completely sure. it's especially worrisome because we haven't figured out the key question. this schools thing is driving me and my family crazy, and i know it is with you, also. nothing about what we're told seems to be consistent, and consistently making sense. let's bring in the chief doctor, sanjay gupta. now, am i just not getting it, with schools? because it's like, everybody wants schools to open, right, everybody with kids. they have not made giving the vaccine to teachers a priority. you know -- you know, tom friedman just said biden's getting teachers vaccinated. that's not the policy of the federal government, that all teachers should get vaccinated. it should be. and cdc says, can't open. yes, you can. but in 89% of the places they are looking at, schools don't

qualify. but maybe, you can, for certain groups. but the schools haven't been given what they need to prepare in a way to qualify for what the c cdc wants them to meet. it just seems like it doesn't make any sense. >> yeah, it -- it -- it -- it's superconfusing, chris. and it's so personal. i have gone through the same thing. i know you have, with your kids. you have to become an amateur epidemiologist. what the cdc laid out, basically, was a bunch of criteria by which they think schools can -- can open. and i think, it's worth stating, that there's studies out there that show that schools could reopen, safely. and in fact, have lower transmission, than the surrounding community. that's true. but, not all schools have all those resources. you know, when you talk about the masks. do you have the square footage to be able to physically distance? do you have adequate ventilation? all the things that we've been talking about. so, therein lies the conundrum. what the cdc added into it, is just what you mentioned, chris. in addition to, do you have the

things on the screen now, what is the status of your community? that is the 89% number you are talking about and they find if you are living in a community, where you have greater than 100 per 100,000 new cases, so one in a thousand people, are -- are being diagnosed. that's considered in the -- in the red zone. and the recommendation, at that point, is that, either, you don't open or you are in some sort of bifurcated-hybrid schedule or something like that. >> but that's like most schools. >> that's where most schools stand now. >> so, why are they saying -- why send any message, about reopening, when you don't know about the variants and 89% of the schools in question can't open, by your own standard. why suggest they can? >> yeah. no. i -- that -- that's the confusing part. i mean, there's two things and i talked to a lot of people about this over the weekend. including, people who are coming up with some of these recommendations. the numbers will come down, and -- and that's good. they have been coming down. the variants could, potentially, throw that off. but the other thing, chris, you know, the wisconsin study that everyone quotes, right?

you heard about that. 17 schools, in wisconsin. they had 37% lower transmission than the surrounding community. that was last fall. we went back, and looked at that data. and in fact, they would have qualified of having been in a red zone, the community, at that point. and they were still able to open, and open safely. out of 5,300 people, there were only seven-documented cases of in-school transmission. so, look, it can be done. chris, this is a subjective thing. i think, the science, people often expect absolute certainty. and what you are having here, i think, is what is your tolerance of risk? that's fundamentally what this is coming down to. and -- and i think, you know, the -- that -- that's where it gets a little squishy around the edges. >> i, also, think that it's a metaphor, for where we are in our collective mentality. people had it. they will embrace the risk. there are not enough stories about kids being sick or really messing up entire families. there are a few, but not enough, anymore, to balance out the

hardship. and i think people have had enough. dr. gupta, i can never have enough of you. thank you for helping us see it straight. be well. >> anytime. >> we'll be right back. >> see ya, brother. to see more? at morgan stanley, a global collective of thought leaders offers investors a broader view. ♪ we see companies protecting the bottom line by putting people first. we see a bright future, still hungry for the ingenuity of those ready for the next challenge. today, we are translating decades of experience into strategies for the road ahead. we are morgan stanley.

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got a special note for you, for tomorrow night. you, my friends, are getting a huge come up. instead of this show, you're going to have a town hall, with president biden, live, from milwaukee, wisconsin, at 9:00 p.m. eastern. the president's first, official trip, since being sworn in, and the man is the moderator. anderson cooper. so, just before that, i'll take anderson's place. and we will have an early edition of "prime time," at 8:00 p.m. eastern, because anderson just can't do it all. so thank you for watching. "cnn tonight." the big show, with the big star, d lemon, right now. >> wow. cnn shuffle, tomorrow. you are going to be doing the

shuffle. >> they are getting a come-up, my audience. >> right? >> they are getting a come-up. >> so i got to ask you. why don't you ever go ice-skating with me? >> i'm not a big ice skater. neither are you, from what i have seen on instagram. but i don't love the cold. i don't love being on the ice, in case i have to protect myself because you never know who is out there with you. especially, where we live. >> that's -- well, with the masks and everything. i know. that's the only exercise i get. i have been hiebernating. >> we have not gotten together, as much. you guys have been living, very cautiously. i have the kids. it's hard to live as cautiously. it is chaotic. that's why this school stuff matters so much, to people like me. and, you know, we don't want to get people sick. so, you know, i miss you. but hopefully, better days will come. one prediction. >> yes? >> i don't even know why. i had one of those moments, tonight, that only people, who do tv, can really identify with. which, as the word