c 300 sedan for just $449 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. have you ever seen this before? she's so beautiful. janie, check this out. >come here. >>let me see. (chuckles) she looks...kind of like me. yeah. that's because it's your grandma when she was your age.

oh wow. that's... that's amazing. oh and she was on the debate team. yeah, that's probably why you're the debate queen. >i'll take that. >>look at that smile. i have the same dimples as her. (laughter) yeah. >same placements and everything. >>unbelievable. this is rebecca from michigan. coming at you live from the operating room. i'm an er nurse. and i absolutely love what i do. i knew that i wanted to do something meaningful with my life. ♪ ♪ i was over half a million dollars in debt from medical school until i found sofi. now i'm able to live out my dream and know i won't spend the rest of my life paying off those student loans, thanks to sofi. ♪ ♪ the john deere z365r ztrak mower,

cuts the hassle out of yardwork. ♪ ♪ run with us, because the best job is the one that's easily done. nothing runs like a deere. search john deere z365r for more. if you watch the late night comedians on television these days, you'd assume they have been part of the national landscape for a long time and you'd be right. but the story of how the programs began and what they have evolved into is a pretty remarkable journey itself. it will be explored this sunday. here's a quick preview of "the story of late night." >> steve allen was the generator of a lot of ideas that were way ahead of its time. >> several critics through the years called my father the most imitated man in television because many of the early experiments he made were often used and developed by other comedians to great effect. >> and here he is now, the question man. >> like the question man, where

he would provide the question to an answer. >> buffalo bill. the question? when you buy a buffalo, what do you get at the first of the month? >> johnny did a later version. >> sis boom bah. describe the sound made when a sheep explodes. >> "the story of late night" premieres sunday at 9:00 p.m. cuomo "prime time" starts now. i am not chris cuomo. i'm michael smerconish in for chris who is off tonight, excited to be here, welcome to "prime time." a load to tackle this hour. in our fight to crush this pandemic amid all our recent gains against the virus, a new major travel ban is about to go into effect starting tuesday. the biden administration will be restricting travel to the u.s. from india where cases are

absolutely exploding. this won't apply to permanent u.s. citizens or humanitarian workers. but on may 4th at midnight, non-u.s. citizens won't be able to come to america from india until this ban is lifted. the country is in dire straits, reporting more than 300,000 covid cases for the ninth day in a row. crematoriums are overflowing with bodies. hospitals are out of oxygen for patients and multiple variants are circulating there. only about 2% of india is vaccinated right now. here in america, we can't afford any more setbacks. we're so close to some semblance of normalcy. the white house just announced today 100 million americans are now fully vaccinated. that's 30% of the u.s., which is amazing. but what would be more amazing is if the other 70% would join in or even 50% more to achieve herd immunity. 26% of americans right now say they will not get the vaccine.

among republicans that number is 44%. so how do you change minds of folks like this? >> are you getting vaccinated? >> no. i don't need a vaccine. i had covid last march. sick for all of five hours. i don't need a vaccine for that. >> we're the independent freedom people of america and we make our own decisions. >> we're at a tipping point now. at our lowest number of cases daily since october, but now comes the hard part, convincing the vaccine hesitant to go and get their shots. supply is now outweighing demand in many parts of the country. on thursday in my hometown of philadelphia at a mass vaccination site there were 4,000 extra doses. the same situation exists on the opposite coast in los angeles. l.a. county has more vaccine than people who want it. they're down at least 50% in filling appointments at all county sites. so what do we do about those we need to help us stay safe who aren't joining the fight.

an interesting opinion today for a former federal prosecutor, michael stern. it was published in "usa today" in which he says it's time to start shunning the vaccine hesitant. they're blocking covid herd immunity. and also, quote, businesses should make vaccination a requirement for employment. a covid outbreak can shut down a business and be financially devastating and failure to enforce basic health and safety measures is not fair to employees who have to work in offices, factories and stores where close contact is required. things should get personal too. people should require friends to be vaccinated to attending the barbecues and birthday parties they host. friends don't let friends spread covid. i think he's right. let the shunning begin. but i'm concerned not even that would reach people in rural areas. they're already leading their lives as if the pandemic never happened. and i have to say this, while

well intentioned the president's messaging of late is not incentivizing. conflicting messages -- this week he announced the new cdc guidelines that if you've been fully vaccinated, you can take your masks off outdoors unless you're in a big crowd. and if you're indoors with others fully vaccinated, the same. but even when the president himself is outdoors, we still sometimes see him in a mask like today. and i can't help but think that he missed a great teachable moment. imagine if at the beginning of the speech wednesday to a joint session of congress with some dramatic flair, he turned to the speaker of the house and the vice president and they all removed their masks in unison assuming that the others in the room were all vaccinated. in other words, maybe the way to reach the unvaccinated is to show them those who are protected and returning to our normal lives. the president was asked in a new interview if he'll take his mask off more often. here was his answer.

>> sure. sure. i mean but what i'm going to do, though, because the likelihood of my being able to be outside and people not come up to me is not very high. so it's like, look, you and i took our masks off when i came in because look at the distance we are. but if we were sitting close, i'd have my mask on and you'd have a mask even though we've both been vaccinated. and so it's a small precaution to take that has a profound impact. it's a patriotic responsibility, for god sake. >> bottom line, it's time to close this out. maybe we need a better carrot and a bigger stick. joining me now, cnn medical analyst, former baltimore health commissioner, dr. lena wen. she has a brand now op-ed on what the vaccinated should be able to do now. doctor, let me cut to the chase. are we getting to herd immunity in 2021?

>> i am very concerned that that's not going to happen. i mean it's great that we now have 40% of adults in america who are fully vaccinated. that's fantastic and credit to the biden administration for doing that. but those are the people who are really eager to be vaccinated. there are a lot of people who i think will still get vaccinated. we need to convince them. we need to help make sure they understand the incentives for vaccination. when you look at the numbers, they are 30% of americans who say they're not going to get vaccinated. given that children are not yet eligible, at least children under 16 are not able to receive the vaccine, i don't see us reaching the numbers we need to to get to herd immunity this year. that said i think we'll see a decline in the level of infection over the summer. >> so can we sell this? and if so, how? >> i think there is this pervasive narrative that we have to overcome, and that narrative is why should i get vaccinated? what's in it for me?

and to some people who were so eager to get the vaccine, they can't understand that question because they said the vaccine saves your life. there are a lot of people who don't think covid poses that much of a threat to them. maybe they're younger or healthy, maybe they have had covid before and survived it. they don't quite see why they need to be vaccinated. we need to address their concerns but we also as a country starting with the president need to do a lot better job at demonstrating these are the things you can now do as a result of being vaccinated. you can see your friends, your family. if you so choose, you can remove your mask and go to indoor settings and do these things that you couldn't have done before. we need to do a lot better at selling those incentives. >> i'm parroting you when i say that there was a missed opportunity earlier this week when perhaps that address to a joint session of congress could have been delivered with no one wearing a mask inside the well of the house of representatives. now, of course that would presuppose that everyone who's

in there had been vaccinated. speak to that issue. >> yeah, i think that president biden could have decided, and i recognize there is political risk here involved too. but he could have decided that he was only going to have fully vaccinated people who had proof of vaccination attend that joint session, and then in return they could enter, by the way, they could also get a negative test to be extra sure. but in return they could go into the chamber, take off their mask, have no distancing, hug one another and essentially return to 2019. and then imagine if president biden had started his address that way and said look at where we are now. this is where the country can be at too. let's please get vaccinated. i think that would have sent such a strong signal because, frankly, presidents of role model. they role model good public health behavior. the former president trump really did a poor job of this and i wonder if president biden is trying to overcorrect and be overly cautious here.

but i think overcaution also has a price and that masks somehow become a performative act rather than a life-saving act when it's really needed. also, it's really underselling the power of the vaccine. >> so let me go back to that provocative essay in "usa today" this morning. do you believe that shunning is an option? >> i don't think we are there yet. so there are a lot of people who are still unable to be vaccinated. they actually want to be. but we need to make vaccination the easy and convenient choice for them, including having vaccinations be distributed from mass vaccination sites that aren't being used as much to doctors' offices, to churches, to schools, to workplaces. we need to find people who want to be vaccinated. then i think we can add a lot more incentives. i do think personal incentives are appropriate.

i'm having a wedding that's indoors and the only way to do that safely is to make sure everybody is vaccinated. personal incentives i think can also be really of help. and maybe instead of asking for a vaccine passport, which has all kinds of negative connotations, we can see proof of vaccination as an extension of a health screen. other people have to do symptom questionnaires and testing, but if you're vaccinated, you can bypass that so it's like an e-z pass or car pool lane. you can do the things you want to a lot faster. >> quick final question. is the cdc communicating with appropriate clarity? >> i think the cdc is in a tough place, but, no, i don't think that they have been as clear and practical -- >> what should they be doing? what should they be saying? >> i think they should be telling people at this point if you're vaccinated, you are extremely well protected from

getting coronavirus yourself and from spreading it. how you go about things at this point is up to you. there actually is no right or wrong answer. there are some people who will say i still want to be really cautious and hunker down. i don't want to take any risks at all. other people will say i want to go back to all of my pre-pandemic life and i actually think that's fine. we should focus our energy on the unvaccinated. the people who are vaccinated are not a major public health threat. let them do what they want to do to regain normalcy in their lives. that's what's going to give incentive for those who are not yet vaccinated. >> dr. leana wen, thank you so much for that expertise. >> thank you, michael. great to join you. >> you too. coming up, the new concern in trump world over the rudy giuliani raid, plus those new allegations against congressman matt gaetz. how seriously will prosecutors take the word of his indicted friend? we'll discuss with former fbi insider, andrew mccabe, next.

i have a convenience store delivery for super grover? oh, yeah, he said just put it there. [super grover] ahhhhh ah! perfect timing. get more from your neighborhood. ahhh, so soft! doordash.

our newest reporting tonight is that allies of president trump were worried rudy giuliani could look to cut a deal. a trump advisor tells cnn that with regard to the raid on giuliani's home and office this week, it was a show of force that sent a strong message to a lot of people in trump's world that other things may be coming down the pipeline. they see the same pictures you see of the fbi taking things out of giuliani's apartment and office. as for what the feds have, well, the former mayor himself answered that question on his radio program. >> they went all the way back to the day i started representing the president. so they basically took all my files regarding my representation of president donald j. trump. >> here to help us sort out what the fbi is looking for, former fbi deputy director andrew mccabe. andrew, what does this mean for donald trump? >> well, first, michael, welcome to friday night.

it's good to see you here. >> thank you. >> it's a very serious development certainly for rudy giuliani and anyone that rudy giuliani may have been involved with in activities that could have crossed the border into illegality. if the former president is one of those folks, he should be concerned. i think there's no question that the federal agents and prosecutors likely had a very, very strong case to make on the fara charge that we heard about from the search warrant. they would never have gotten authorization to search his office and home without that. it is what they get from the search warrant that's the big question for rudy giuliani and literally for everyone else who's come within his orbit over the last few years. >> to your last point, i would think that in order to be able to execute, to get permission to execute a search warrant on an attorney, an attorney who was at the time representing a sitting president of the united states,

you would have to document probable cause times six. >> at least, michael, at least. it's an incredibly serious to execute a search warrant at an attorney's office, any attorney's office. and for that attorney to be the attorney for the former president of the united states, it's hard to imagine a scenario where the leadership in the justice department would have required a higher level of, you know, really substantial allegations, solid evidence in a case that is undeniable. so i have to imagine that the case going into that search warrant was probably pretty strong. >> if the focus of the investigation, andrew, is whether former mayor giuliani was acting as an unregistered agent, is that a failure to check a box and fill out a form, or something much more nefarious? >> listen, it's certainly -- it's a serious issue.

the united states government has a strong interest in understanding who exactly is representing the interests of foreign governments when they come and lobby the u.s. government. so it's a serious thing. but it is typically handled in a very administrative way. so normally if doj finds out that someone may be representing the interests of a foreign government and hasn't registered, they'll typically send them a letter and bring that to their attention and those are generally resolved without criminal prosecution. in this case the doj must have some reason to believe that there was a flagrant violation or a particularly important one to pursue it with a criminal investigation. >> let me turn your attention to another federal investigation, the gaetz/greenberg case. the question all political observers are wondering, if true, that reporting from "the daily beast," why would greenberg have put in writing the story of what occurred and

in multiple drafts? >> you know, that's a great question, michael. i think we can only speculate as to what greenberg was thinking when he drafted that letter. but from my perspective as an experienced investigator, from my time in the fbi, this looks a lot like an individual who is desperately trying to negotiate his way into a plea and who knows that on his own, he probably isn't worth it, isn't high enough profile, isn't important enough to generate that sort of interest, certainly from the president of the united states. so throwing matt gaetz' name in there in the context of, hey, this is someone who was involved in the criminal activity i've been charged with and, therefore, someone who i can take down with me is a way to increase the pressure on granting him a pardon. that's my guess as to what greenberg was trying to accomplish here. looks like it probably was not successful.

>> don't you think that the feds, however, in looking at greenberg and that which is in the public domain are saying to themselves we've got to have more than just this guy's word? >> absolutely. greenberg is not a guy that you wolf comfortable going to trial with and putting the success or failure of your case on his shoulders. you have got to corroborate everything that greenberg tells you, which is one of the ways that this letter is significant. it is a consistent recitation of his culpability that took place before he was cooperating with the investigators. so, in other words, he told this story to roger stone long before he was trying to attract the attention of prosecutors and agents and, therefore, could be seen as a consistent prior statement. so it could actually be used to bolster his credibility in that way. >> andrew mccabe, thanks so much. >> thanks, michael.

almost six months since the election. there are new numbers out on how many americans actually still believe the big lie. harry enton, the wizard of odds, has the numbers. charlie dent unpacks. they're next. uick. the fast way to bring it up to speed... is scotts turf builder rapid grass. it grows two times faster than seed alone for full, green grass. everything else just seems... slow. it's lawn season. let's get to the yard. hi guys! check out this side right here. what'd you do? - tell me know you did it. - yeah. get a little closer. that's insane. that's a different car. -that's the same car. - no! yeah, that's before, that's after. oh, that's awesome. make it nu with nu finish.

keeping your oysters business growing has you swamped. you need to hire. i need indeed indeed you do. the moment you sponsor a job on indeed you get a shortlist of quality candidates from a resume data base claim your seventy-five-dollar credit when you post your first job at indeed.com/promo today let's paint with behr ultra scuff defense... so that you can live that scuff-free life. honey, i'm home! honey! scuff defense. i love our scuff-free life. behr ultra scuff defense. exclusively at the home depot.

(text chime) (text chime) (text chime) (sighs) (text chime) (chuckles) (text chime) it's the biggest week in television. watchathon week is your chance to finally watch shows you missed for free. now you get to talk about them with your friends, no matter what time it is. say "watchathon" into your voice remote and watch for free

new cnn polling is bringing to light major divides among americans on everything from

covid vaccine hesitancy to whether president biden actually won the election fair and square. it shows a major gap between democrats and republicans but among members of the grand ole party itself. for a deeper dive let's bring in the wizard of odds, harry enton, and cnn political commentator and former republican congressman charlie dent. harry, do you initially. even with all those lost court cases there's a huge divide on whether joe biden won legitimately. three in ten americans. what do the numbers tell us? >> exactly what you said is that nearly one out of every three americans do not believe that biden legitimately won this election. 30% say he didn't. you know, i have the mendoza line in my mind. you can get 10% of people to believe basically anything, right? 10% of people believe that we didn't actually land on the moon and that's false. we're well above that now.

30% of americans believe that joe biden didn't win this election? my goodness gracious, what the heck is wrong with some people? the evidence is so clear. of course i'm an optimistic guy and will note that still two-thirds of americans won that biden won legitimately so i guess that's something to hang your hat on. >> harry, a follow-up to you. when you look at those numbers and look specifically at the gop and see how many believe that biden didn't win fair and square, doesn't that alone tell you it is still donald trump's party? >> yeah. to me it definitely does. i mean this is a crazy number. put it up on the screen right now. 70% of republicans do not believe that joe biden legitimately won the election with enough votes. that is nuts. that is insane. and it shouldn't be surprising, although we don't have these numbers for you, that when you ask who's your favorite for the

2024 republican nomination, donald trump is the overwhelming leader among republicans right now. this is still donald trump's party. that doesn't mean it will be a year from now, two years, three years when they ultimately hold the republican primary in 2020, but the fact that 70% of republicans do not believe the election results from six months ago is honestly one of the scariest statistics i've ever seen, and i've seen many of them. >> okay. charlie dent, a question for you. i want to put on the screen something that former house speaker paul ryan just said. it's totally at odds with what i was just describing with harry. the either/or debate over feel tee to donald trump is going to fade. they laid this out in an interview with the associated press. i think circumstances, ideas and new candidates are going to overshadow that whole conversation. is he right, charlie? >> well, i do think he's right that donald trump llecome a more diminished figure over time.

that said, donald trump can cause a lot of problems in the 2022 midterms and the presidential election in 2024. he can still cause a lot of problems even though -- he's not on social media anymore, we're hearing a lot less from him. if you're a republican and running in the midterm in 2022, the last thing you want is for donald trump to be making a lot of noise because you want this election to be a referendum on joe biden and the democrats, not a choice election between the democrats and trump republicans. but trump is going to cause problems, but he will be more diminished. >> charlie, a question about the way in which president biden is being perceived in your old congressional district. "the wall street journal" just conducted dozens of interviews in the great northampton county and they found feelings with regard to the president are only warm or very cold.

in other words, they don't find a lot of real love for him. it's largely, though, one extreme or the other. are you surprised by that? >> no, i'm not. the reason why, northampton county is a classic swing county. i represented it. but remember, many people voted for joe biden because they did not like donald trump. they wanted joe biden to stabilize the functioning of government, to bring some sense of normalcy back to the way the white house was running and to deal with the covid virus, which he's done. but i think this agenda of the president's is very big. there's a lot of sticker shock. and i think many believe that the president has misread that mandate. i don't think a lot of voters voted for this kind of transformational change, at least with respect to the role of government in people's lives after the pandemic has abated. >> harry enton, you know the history. the president's party usually

loses in a midterm election. so here we are in these first hundred days. the biden administration are going big or going home. do you think that the go big mentality is to enliven the base for the midterm election or is it premised on the belief, hey, we might not have control of the congress for those next two years, we better shoot for the moon now? >> why can't it be both, right? the idea being that, look, historically the president's party almost always loses in midterm elections. there's been three, i believe, in the last century and a half where the president's party has not lost seats in the house of representatives, so why not go big now? you have majorities. they're thin majorities but workable majorities, so put forth the legislation you want, go big. maybe as a wonderful side effect you may in fact be able to get more of your voters to turn out in the midterm election. if you're a democrat, you definitely welcome donald trump because that will only pump up the base even more. >> charlie dent, quick final question. do republicans care about debt anymore?

>> i think they do. i think most americans do. sure, republicans have a problem on fiscal issues right now in terms of their credibility. but that doesn't necessarily justify a democratic spending blowout either. you're hearing even some democratic members of congress who are concerned about the sticker shock of some of these proposals. so i do think it matters. there is risk associated with this level of expenditure. we still talk about inflation from time to time. laws of economics are still alive and well. i don't think they can be ignored. >> harry enton, chicken is in short supply. on a different night we'll get you to talk about that. >> that's awful news. don't bring that up, you're going to make me sad. i thought we had a wonderful segment, now you're making me sad, michael. >> thank you, harry. thank you, charlie. appreciate you both. so this is interesting. up ahead they helped convict the

murderer of george floyd, and now money appears to be pouring in for some of the witnesses who testified at the chauvin trial. how come? and could it have wider implications for the justice system? a former top federal prosecutor takes it on, next.

more than 23 million people watched a jury find derek

chauvin guilty in the murder of george floyd. it was the first trial in minnesota ever televised. the witnesses in the case became known all around the globe. we're now seeing multiple online fund-raising efforts for folks darnella frazier who shot the video of george floyd's death or charles mcmillan, or donald williams who told you that he wasn't going to let prosecutors present him as an angry black man. the go fund me page set up by his cousin which has raised more than 15 grand says its mission is to help him, quote, get his life back on track. frazier's page with almost $700,000 raised says this fund is support the healing and restoration for darnella frazier. whatever that means to her. former federal prosecutor elliot williams is here with us. counselor, this is what i would

call a case of first impression. i've never seen it before and i'm trying to wrap my head around it. i get that they provided an invaluable service. they stood up, they took note, they were willing to testify. but are we somehow setting a dangerous precedent here ?

misbehavior but really isn't. it's just people engaging in almost a new kind of economy. like you said, it's a case of first impression. we're just beginning to see it for the first time. >> well, i fully acknowledge that if you were to say it's a problem, i don't know how we'd police it. i don't know how you prevent it. but i'm worried about the future high-profile case where maybe there's a witness who's going to offer testimony that is against popular sentiment. and now they think to themselves, boy, that could ruin a later payday. i get it, if they lie and you can prove it, you can charge them with perjury, but that's a hard thing to prove in many instances.s. >> the issue here is crowd funding. the issue here is not crowd funding in trials, right? it's this new unpoliceable mechanism that exists in society. we just don't know how to deal with it. but here's the thing. look, you can draw a pretty clear line. if somebody says to somebody else i'll raise $50,000 for you if you get on this jury and d acquit this individual, now that's obviously a crime. if somebody says here's $50,000 because of the fact that you're a juror and this is the outcome, of course that's a crime too. but merely the act of raising funds for a person, even though that's tied to their having engaged in this important civic act, you're just -- you're not going to be able to find anything unlawful or even police it unless, again, somebody is directing someone to engage in funny business with respect to their own testimony. >> okay. let me come at it from one different angle. does it matter to your opinion

whether the go fund me page is set up before or after the trial? what if it's a high-profile case, the whole world knows that this witness's testimony is going to be key, and, boom, there all of a sudden is the page maybe because people totally independent of that witness want to keep them honest and on the side of popular sentiment? >> no, see, this is my -- talking to michael smerconish is fun because this is a very first year law school kind of debate where you dig into what the hypothetical might be. you would have to look at the facts of it. why are they raising money, right? look, there's no question that someone's life is significantly upended by being on a jury, life is significantly upended being on what's now 21 years in the trial of the century. so the expenses that this person is going to lose by being a juror might be something that could be perfectly lawful to raise funds about. if it's let's put him on the jury, and you're going to have to gather evidence to find this out, but let's put him on the jury so he can convict this horrible defendant, then of course that's going to be unlawful. but it's just going to be

something that you'd have to take case by case. as in, look, any other crowd funding matter, merely raising $50,000 for someone because they lost their job isn't unlawful. raising $50,000 for someone so -- because they lost their job so that they can then use that money to buy, i don't know, a sherman tank and take up arms against the government, then that's unlawful.l. >> eliot, we're each being awarded two cle credits for this conversation, so thank you for participating. >> love it my really important job! scuff defense.

honey! scuff defense. [ chuckles ] scuff! -defense! i love our scuff-free life. you too, scruff defense. today let's paint with the interior paint that's too tough to scuff. behr. exclusively at the home depot.

that's why at america's beverage companies, our bottles are made to be re-made. not all plastic is the same. we're carefully designing our bottles to be one hundred percent recyclable, including the caps. they're collected and separated from other plastics, so they can be turned back into material that we use to make new bottles. that completes the circle, and reduces plastic waste. please help us get every bottle back.

hi guys! check out this side right here. that cwhat'd you do?ircle, and reduces plastic waste. - tell me know you did it. - yeah. get a little closer. that's insane. that's a different car. -that's the same car. - no! yeah, that's before, that's after. oh, that's awesome. make it nu with nu finish. my grandfather had an amazing life, but ancestry showed me so much more than i could have imagined. my grandfather was born in a shack in pennsylvania, his father was a miner, they were immigrants from italy and somewhere along the way that man changed his name and transformed himself into a successful mid-century american man. he had a whole life that i didn't know anything about. he was just my beloved grandpa. bring your family history to life like never before.

get started for free at ancestry.com today for ma'khia bryant. the black 16-year-old girl, shot and killed by a police officer, during an april-20th confrontation in columbus, ohio, after she was spotted lunging at another, young woman with a knife. you saw the police body-cam video, in that case. but the public, still, hasn't seen the body cams from this

month's deadly shooting of andrew brown jr., by deputies in north carolina. so far, two family members say they've gotten to see only-20 seconds of just one of the four body cameras. and another relative, who was at the scene of the shooting, disputes the prosecutor's claim that brown hit deputies, with his car. the tension in america, over policing and race is something that kamau bell explores sunday night in the season premiere of "united shades of america" in his hometown of oakland, where some activists are pushing the controversial, defund-the-police idea. >> wait a minute. why don't we take some of that money back? and like, give it to people who are, you know, qualified to deal with those issues without killing folks in the process. at the same time, why don't we put money back into systems that build long-term, sustainable public safety and build economies for everyone. that's defund 101. >> you know, if this was a business and we are giving 50% of our budget to one department that was failing across the

board, and killing people while they did so. >> yeah. >> you know, we would defund them, immediately. >> yes. >> defund the police means we are taking money away from this current system where it's failing. and investing in other systems that we think will succeed. >> kamau bell joins me, now, to discuss. thanks so much for being here. good luck on the new season. is there a messaging issue, with defund the police? in other words, i love that chart. i love that explanation. but -- but do folks need to take a lesson from frank lunz, who said to the republicans, estate tax? no. got to be the death tax because, then you can sell it. >> well, i think, a lot of these slogans come from out of just trying to get people's attention, initially. so, i think, you know, a lot of times, black people in this country, believing me. we have tried to be polite about things like, please, stop being racist to us. please, stop killing us and that hasn't worked. let's be honest. martin luther king jr. was

basically advocating we should all get along and he was assassinated. now, having said that, call it powdered doughnuts, for all you want. that -- that chart that you just showed, is hard to argue against. >> the thing is, when you say defund the police, i think that it conjures up an image, in some people's minds, that you are going to send folks out there with a badge, and not-much-more support to do a very deadly job. i thought of one during the commercial break. you ready for this? how about, unburden the police? because what you are really saying is like -- like -- here is -- here is a mental-health crisis that's unfolding. why send somebody out there with a gun, if a gun isn't necessary, in that case? i think we could sell that. we are trying to unburden the police. and empower a mental-health professional. >> yeah. i mean, i think, when you do this, like, people -- just be clear. black people had lots of different ways to say pay attention to what the police are doing in our communities. and we tried reform the police.

we have tried community policing. there have been lots of different slogans. the fact that defund is getting so much attention is a good thing. and the fact is, once you get past your fear of it, as i say in the episode, at one point, i was nervous about it. and just pay attention to it. but i think a lot of us love to get caught up in the argument about the rhetoric. and don't actually want to talk about ways, in which we can create a safer society for our black and latino communities. >> i know. but you're -- you're giving folks a talking point. it becomes just like, you know, the border issue. is it a crisis? is it not a crisis? i don't want to -- i don't want to, you know, beat it to death. i'm just saying that it's always struck me that the word choice, defund the police, as inspiring as it might be who want to reign in cops. i think it also fuels those who want to be supportive of law enforcement. tell me about the first episode of this season's show. >> we can do that. but also, i want to say, unburden the police is a thing that is about the police, not about the community. so, i understand what you are

saying. but as a black person, unburden -- unburden the police may sound like bringing more tanks to my neighborhood so they don't have to do as much work. which perspective are you looking at? the perspective of the impacted community? or the perspective of the community that's not impacted and wants to get involved? the first episode is about talking about the history of policing and how the -- the origins of policing, as i'm sure you know, come from the barbados slave code. which it's a slave code so we know that's racist. and the report which in 1968 said racism has led to division in america and a lot of that goes to law enforcement. few years later, nixon starts war war on drugs which is targeting black and brown folks. but it ends with police getting more power, more-military equipment, and -- and less community control. >> final question. how confident are you that, in the tragic aftermath the killing/the murder of george floyd, there has now been monumental change? >> zero.

we know that, since george floyd, since derek chauvin was found guilty, more black and latino people have been killed by cops. that happened even in brooklyn park with daunte wright. there is no confidence until we actually have the bravery to look at the system and say how do we fix the system of policing in america and redo it, completely, from the ground up? because we cannot just keep talks about these things around the edges. let's actually redo the system. >> kamau, best of luck with the new season. >> thank you. >> and catch the season premiere of "united shades of america," sunday night, 10:00 eastern, right here on cnn. we'll be right back.

(man) eye contact. elbow pump. very nice, andrew. very nice. good job. next, apparently carvana doesn't have any "bogus" fees. bogus?! now we work hard for those fees. no hundred-dollar fuel fee? pumping gas makes me woozy. thank you. no $600 doc fee? ugh, the printing, the organizing. no $200 cleaning fees. microfiber, that chaps my hands. you know, we should go over there right now and show 'em how fees are done. (vo) never pay a dealer fee. with carvana.

new projects means new project managers. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. the moment you sponsor a job on indeed you get a short list of quality candidates from our resume database. claim your seventy five dollar credit, when you post your first job at indeed.com/home.

(text chime) (text chime) (text chime) (sighs) (text chime) (chuckles) (text chime) it's the biggest week in television. watchathon week is your chance to finally watch shows you missed for free. now you get to talk about them with your friends, no matter what time it is. say "watchathon" into your voice remote and watch for free

big weekend here on cnn, including the premiere of the original series "the story of late night." you are going to learn all about the comic greats, who reshaped tv through generations. beginning, of course, with the tonight show, names like steve alan and johnny carson. here is a preview and one of the

unforgettable-carson moments. >> keep your arm extended and put only one revolution. only once around, on the leg. >> the classic ed ames. the fact that it was live, unexpected. >> right in the nuts. spectacular. it was spectacular. >> and as ames goes to retrieve t t the tomahawk, carson grabs him by the arm, pulls him back. when ed ames threw that tomahawk and johnny wouldn't let him. to watch how he works with ed ames to keep him in the moment, and extend the laugh is just great stuff. >> he just milks the laughter. he just waits.