congressman clyde's words that what happened at the capitol was a normal tourist visit? >> reporter: we talked to a lot of republicans today. precisely zero told me that a normal tourist visit was a good way to describe what happened. but a lot of people are still booef believe in various conspiracy theories about that day and sympathetic to donald trump in regards to his role about that day. but it does seem that most of the people we talked to do not feel that saying it was a tourist visit was a good thing to say. and it was a bit strange. >> gary, appreciate it. and we appreciate all the folks that talked to you. the news continues. let's go to chris for "cuomo prime time." >> appreciate it, coop. 35 members in the gop voted to tell the truth and have the january 6th commission. what does that mean that they voted for a commission to study the terrorist insurrection of january 6th? the democrats could have done it themselves.

they may wind up doing it themselves. what do these 35 out of 211 mean? i argue it's the result, not the ratio. the leadership in the party of trump, the p.o.t., is against it. mccarthy, who told trump to call off his dogs on january 6th, now says says there's no problem to hook at, says antifa is the real problem. and mcconnell, who also started by saying trump was at fault for the insurrection, is now scrambling to kill this bill in the senate. just listen to the then and now. >> i've made the decision to oppose the slanted proposal. by the house democrats. fellow americans beat and bloodied the police, stormed the house floor, tried to hunt down the speaker of the house.

they built a gallows and chanted about murdering the vice president. they did this because they had been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on earth. because he was angry he lost an election. mr. president, it's not at all clear what new facts an additional investigation could lay on top of existing efforts by law enforcement and congress. if president trump were still in office, i would have carefully considered whether the house managers proved their specific charge. >> same demeanor. same hair. you know why? he's just playing the same game. he says what he needs to say when he needs to say it.

and just so you know, on this commission, the right was given every concession they asked for except for one. they wanted as a condition of looking at january 6th and the groups that were involved to also investigate non-january 6th related events and non-related groups. like saying, sure, we'll look at 9/11, but only if we look at the oklahoma city bombing. mm-hmm. it's just a game. the reality remains. this is what they want you to believe never happened and shouldn't matter to you. two newly released videos from the fbi showing what it calls some of the most violent offenders in the january 6th insurrection because they remain on the loose and need to be found. the attacker tries to rip off an officer's gas mask, then grabs a baton and hits police.

blue lives matter. blue lives matter. right? forget about black lives matter. there's no reason to respect a minority. blue lives matter. these are the people who say it. then there's the guy who punched officers while wearing gloves with metal knuckles. you got to protect the police from the black lives matter savages. you see how they yell at the police, the way they touch them. savages, they don't respect us, they don't respect america. the same people who cheered trump at the rally when he talked about people fighting systemic inequality, fighting for rights, like they were animals. they were less than you. yeah, they were, on january 6th. so let's forget. let's forget. let's forget members of the right doing cops dirty like we've never seen.

now there's no need for answers. 90 people charged with assaulting 100-plus officers. you don't need to know, there's no new facts, no new questions, says mcconnell. tell the family of the late capitol police officer, tell the liebengoods, no need. he died by suicide after trying to protect the capitol. his family calls a thorough, nonpartisan investigation essential. do blue lives matter or not? this is the game. remember how different the gop felt about benghazi? two years, longer than congress probed 9/11, watergate, jfk's assassination, pearl harbor. found nothing, except opportunity. mccarthy said, remember how

strong hillary clinton was? did benghazi. now look at her numbers. the democrats are not forgetting that, either. especially now. >> holy cow. no idea what you're talking about. incoherence. benghazi, you chased the former secretary of state all over the country. spent millions of millions. we have people scaling the capitol, hitting the police with lead pipes across the head, and we can't get bipartisanship. what else has to happen in this country? >> i don't know if ryan is going to make it. he gets too upset by the game. i've had him on. you've seen him. this bothers him. he's in the wrong place at the wrong time because this is what it is all about until you ask for more. until you start ignoring the players, focusing on the game,

and changing it. hillary clinton was grilled for 11 hours on benghazi. i've never seen anybody stand up for a duration of questioning like she did. 11 hours, and they got nothing new on her. any kind of wrongdoing. here's what i think matters. the game has just changed. let's see how the trumpers fare. forget about the 35 votes. it's the need to take an oath when this commission happens. and to be held to account under oath about what is real and what is really disgusting about politics. the game changes under oath. mccarthy will have to testify. which version of his call with trump is he going to give, under oath? said today, no concern about being subpoenaed about that day. you know who else said that? trump. you ever see him sit? he's not worried about testifying on that profanity

filled call with trump, where lawmakers say, because that means they're going to be up there, too, that you told them that trump told you, well, kevin, i guess these people are more upset about the election than you are. you insisted, it was profanity laced. the rioters were trump supporters. call off your dogs, you said. then you said, no, no, no. he said he'd come and he'd help, and he did. the vote today is just more proof of the perfidy. but accountability will come. because it was real, it happened, it will never go away. if this fails in the senate, it might, speaker pelosi is signaling she's all but ready to let house democrats handle it themselves with a select committee. >> we will find the truth. it's not about the truth. you know the truth.

you can't avoid the truth. this is all going to be about time and money to see if they can get the party of trump to own that they're lying about the truth. it seems to me they'd rather do anything than that. who knows, maybe they'd even go to jail for it. if you're a senate party of trumper, the p.o.t., whatever you want to call it. you tell me. make a choice, vote for transparency and accountability, in a forum. or watch as democrats get the chance to do exactly what you fear most. ask all their questions, and take their time doing so, with all that evidence growing by the day. what does this mean? i see a tremendous waste of time coming. but maybe not. michael smerconish, when you see this, and what it's about, the 35 house members from the right

saying they want to see the commission, but it's not really about the 35. where does this lead, and what does it mean for your party, governor? >> 35 is a big deal. >> this is the first time we've seen this kind of a crack. they've stood against the leadership, mcconnell, against trump, it's a very big deal. it started when they started to kick liz cheney out, and people started to say, this is kind of getting ridiculous. for 35 of them to march out there. i'll tell you what happens next. and some members tomorrow, their staff will say, why didn't you vote for this? it's pretty simple, isn't it? it's a bipartisan investigation. and the republican who helped put it together said it was a bipartisan, non-political investigation. the staff will say why didn't you support this?

this 35 gives some super octane, as it moves to the senate. where senators will have to think, do i work for mitch mcconnell or do i answer to constituents? >> i hear you. >> it's a big deal. and one more point, the capitol police wrote a letter pleading with congress to have this investigation. they've never done anything like this. that i have been aware of, they said, investigate it, please. and that's powerful. >> the capitol police leadership haven't endorsed the letter. but the point stands. smerk, john says it's high octane. i say it's weak sauce. but it's going to happen anyway. you can't deny the reality. does any of this matter, mike? >> the 35 is higher than i thought it would be. i have to say that when your staff called me earlier today, i said it would be in the 20s. in fact, i may have said it

would be closer to 20. i think governor kasich is right when he says it's exceeded what the expectations were. i want to talk about the remainder of the 211 who didn't go along. because something i think that needs to be said is, i don't think they were seeking to do donald trump a solid. i don't think this is about fealty. i don't think they're compatriots. i think it's about fear. frankly, they probably wish they could be among the 35. but they don't want to incur his wrath. in the end, i hate to say it, today is all about an exercise in self-preservation. the paramount goal is to get re-elected. that's the cynicism i bring to the table. >> of course that's what it's about. it's not like trump is mr. charming. he might have won john kasich over if he had any bona fides to be in the position. the game is so obvious and so ugly.

you have mccarthy -- >> it is. >> saying one minute, trump called me, we had an "f"-bomb exchange. call off your dogs. and then and he said he's going to send help. i'm okay. mcconnell, saying if he were still in office, i would be thinking about this. now, no new questions. it's just a game. the question is, do the people ever demand that it stops being played? >> well, you know, you heard, as you were ready to do the handoff from anderson cooper, the people reacting to him saying it was like a tourist visit. they were fed up. >> i don't know that they were fed up. >> sounded like it to me. >> he seemed like he did pretty good. but go ahead. >> look, what happens is, once you have ten, then 12, then 20, then 35.

you see what is happening is people begin to realize, they can be their own people. they don't have to check their conscience at the doorway. they can go out there, defy the leadership, which is what they did today. they defied them, and they're going to live until tomorrow. and they're going to walk around, their staff will be proud of them. this is a growing change. that's what we've been looking for, cracks in the dam. an ability to stand up against the nonsense, and we're beginning to see it grow. and it started when they threw cheney out. this will be trouble for the house leadership. >> i got to leave it there. smerk, i owe you one. you'll have the whole show at one point. you'll get the time back and then some. michael is a blessing to the show, improving it on a regular basis now. one thing, governor, we don't know if they've lived another day.

let's see what happens, and what names join the scarlet letter crowd. thank you to you both. new developments in a widening criminal probe of the trump organization. the simple answer is, it's never good when something goes from civil to criminal or you see combining of assets between an attorney general in a state and a prosecutorial arm like the district attorney. it can't be good. the question is, why isn't it good? where is it going? what are the directions of exposure that are most likely to be discussed and soon? we have insight for you straight ahead. at panera, we make dinner easy... and cheesy. order our delicious mac and cheese for dinner tonight with delivery or pick-up. only at panera.

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it's no longer just potentially civil, but potentially criminal. the state is digging into allen weisselberg's documents is now a criminal investigation. in addition to the news the questions about trump lying about the value of property has moved from civil to criminal. is this just heat or is there going to be light? let go to somebody who knows about this, former assistant new york attorney general tristan snell. who did go after trump, effectively. good to see you. >> good to be back, chris. >> so, on the outside, when you look at this, it's, these white collar crime things. it's so hard to get anybody. so much paper, so many people in

between. you have to show intent. maybe there was none. maybe trump doesn't even know. how hard is this? >> this can be difficult, you obviously have the numerical misrepresentations allegedly that were made. and the defense to that is, we screwed up. it was an accident. somebody prepared one document, other people prepared the other. the right hand didn't know what the left was doing. showing that was a knowing or intentional act will bring it from civil to criminal. and the civil investigation is a big deal, too, it can have huge economic penalties, restitution paid to the people involved and to the state. if it goes criminal, we're talking imprisonment.

you need emails, testimony, something else to corroborate the numerical misrepresentations themselves. >> the outside theory is, the cfo always knows everything. you squeeze the cfo, and he or she has to give up the goods about the other people that you're asking about. in this case, the cfo was weisselberg. if you're on him too hard, trump could say, you're right, it was weisselberg, but it wasn't me. >> right. that's the risk. trump will just scapegoat weisselberg. allen did everything, i had nothing to do with it, he went rogue, i didn't know what he was thinking. he lost it. he was never that good to begin with. that would be the trump line. >> here's the one avenue of exposure. the only time people learned about weisselberg up to this point was about the payments to the women and how it was done. michael cohen, the former

bagman, always said weisselberg and trump knew. on this show, we got a piece of tape that certainly showed that he was right about trump. here it is. >> i need to open up a company for the transfer of all of that info regarding our friend david. i've actually come up -- >> give it to me. >> i've spoken to allen weisselberg about how to set the whole thing up, with funding. yes. and it's -- all the stuff, all the stuff. because you never know where he's going to be. >> he gets hit by a truck. >> correct. i'm all over that. i spoke to allen about it, when it comes time for the financing. >> what financing? >> i have to pay -- >> you don't pay with cash? >> no, no, no. >> check? >> this is about paying the enquirer guy.

trump is like, what financing? he says, we have to pay him. he says, you'll pay cash. weisselberg is not on that call, but trump is certainly aware of what is happening. but that's not enough. >> no, that's not enough. the kicker is, a lot of it is going to be, let's just say, things like meeting notes. and somebody took down notes about what trump said in a meeting, and you can prove when the notes were taken, there's a present sense impression. if you can show the notes were taking contemporaneously with the thing occurring, and somebody wrote down notes about what trump said, that in theory can be something that is admissible. but let's be clear about one thing here. if this is going criminal, if the a.g.'s office believes there is enough here to open a criminal probe, that is a tell that they have something that

they believe allows it to go criminal. they would not be wasting their time and the time of the people in the criminal division, which is a very small, elite unit of folks who focus on white collar crime and political corruption, you're not going to waste their time unless you have something that popped up. >> 0 to 10, what is the chance a charge comes down on trump? 10 is, yes. >> i'd say a 9. i just don't think it will be by christmas. i think it will be next year. but i might be wrong about that i think it will be '22. >> tristan snell, hopefully we'll still be alive. lord willing we'll have the conversation. dr. anthony fauci is back with us tonight, because he said something we need to understand more. when he says people are misinterpreting the mask guidance, what does that mean? next.

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i think it's fair to say that the mask thing is now a mess. a bunch of states lifted the mandate since the cdc said to. how do you keep them in place when the cdc said you don't have to? people will get upset at you. more have them in, they're re-evaluating, businesses are

doing it in all different ways. some never did it. it's all over the place. because the guidance has been all over the place. and now, what is our big concern? schools. younger kids won't be vaccinated in the fall. you could argue they don't really need to be the same way, because the case rates are so low. then what about the kawasaki? so few cases of that. but how many have died? 3 hundred. and what does that mean with the price and the kids getting left behind, and precious years and memories lost because of how stinky this school year was? states like texas, utah, they want to ban mask mandates in schools. it's clear the cdc did not consult with any of these folks. before changing guidance. odd, because here's the cdc director. on how they make decisions.

>> as a matter of practice, the cdc engages with stakeholders who use our guidance before it's finalized. to understand whether it addresses needs. for our school guidance, we did that with over 50 stakeholders. >> didn't happen this time. >> the cdc director said, wait and see. they changed the guidance the next morning. odd. my next guest has been asked about the rules. he's playing cleanup now. dr. anthony fauci, welcome back. it's good to have you, sir. you told axios people are misinterpreting the mask guidance, and you said, it's not their fault. i agree. not to be kind. but accurate. i think it's the cdc and the administration's fault. what do you think? >> i'm not going to place blame. but i think the source of the confusion, chris, is the fact that the cdc made the change in

guidelines purely to allow people who have been fully vaccinated to realize that the scientific data indicates that it is safe for them to go without a mask, not only outdoors, but also indoors. that was meant for those who are fully vaccinated. what happened is that that triggered an interpretation that we can now just throw masks away and nobody has to wear masks. which is obviously not the case. because for those who have not been vaccinated, their original guidelines stay exactly the same. >> right. there's no pressure on them now. the only problem is -- go ahead. finish your point, then i have a question. go ahead. >> no, no, the point i'm making is that that does lead to confusion, chris. you're absolutely right. and i think the people that are under particular stress are people who own establishments, since there's no passports to

show you're vaccinated, there's no way to prove that you have or have not been. so what happens if you have an establishment in which there will be vaccinated and unvaccinated people, people may come in who are infected who could infect someone else. the establishment owners said, the cdc recommendations were fine that people who are vaccinated don't have to wear masks. since i don't know if you're vaccinated or not, but if you come into my establishment, you still have to wear a mask. the confusion is, people saying, some are saying you don't have to wear masks, now you're telling me, when i go into an establishment, i have to wear a mask? and you're right, it is confusing. in fairness to the people trying to make heads and tails. >> i don't think it's confusing. i think it's simple. if you're vaccinated, you don't have to wear a mask. the science is there. could you be contagious, yes, but the chances are so low.

what about my kids at home? they're going to be fine. if you can get them vaccinated, do it. if you're not vaccinated, nothing has changed. but you will cheat. and the fix is something that has been studiously avoided by the administration, and i don't know why. except for just basic politics. you have to have a tracking mechanism. you have to have a vaccine passport. otherwise, this will never work. there's no other way to differentiate the vaccinated from the unvaccinated. why do they avoid the passport? >> it's a complex reason, i believe, chris. one of them is that if you in fact require a passport, you're going to be discriminating against people and putting people at a disadvantage and forcing them indirectly to get vaccinated. >> how so? it's one thing if you have the chance to get a vaccine.

but if the vaccine is available, everyone gets to make a choice. why wouldn't i get opportunities as vaccinated that you don't get as unvaccinated? >> right. chris, you make a reasonable point. what the administration is saying is that they're not going to mandate a passport for vaccines centrally. but you're going to see, i guarantee you, that there are going to be organizations, there already are, colleges that are saying, if you don't show proof of vaccination, you're not coming on campus. >> why not do it centrally? you have the most data, the most manpower. >> chris, i don't have the answer for you. >> fauci doesn't have the answer? holy cow. they call the vaccine a fauci ouchie. i know this is politics.

new york state has the pass. but you can't expect me to show you proof when i come into someplace that you've been vaccinated. i believe they got mixed up with science and politics here. if you want to preference people who are vaccinated, you have to give me a way to distinguish between those who are and those who aren't. >> i understand. i'm not arguing with you, but the policy is, they don't want to do it centrally. they don't want to have a central dictate that you have to have a passport, because they don't want to put people in a compromised position. i hear your argument. you're saying, well, then get vaccinated, period. >> i want to asking one other thing, because i've been hearing a lot about it. i hear the data on a booster shot, now i'm playing down the reason to get vaccinated, which is not my point. but i hear that the data on

booster shots is boffo. it's great. if you get a booster shot six months out from a vaccine, you get such multiples of antibodies, that could be the kill shot against the virus and really give you long term protection. is that true? >> well, well, what's true is, when you get a booster, you increase dramatically the level of antibodies that would be protective. the question is, will we be getting boosters? it's highly likely, that within a reasonable period of time, we're going to wind up requiring a booster. the reason is, when the level of protection starts to dwindle down, as happens over time, or breakthrough infections. you're going to see boosters. when you do get a booster, you're absolutely correct. what you're hearing is correct. there's a major increase in the level of antibodies. >> i bet you a slice of pizza, you know what problem you're going to have with the boosters?

we're going to need to have a way to track it. dr. anthony fauci, it's not your job to deal with the solution, but you have to deal with the fallout. thanks. >> good to be with you. the capitol riot, it was an act of terror and an insurrection. the congressional level. we're watching the court cases, including the so-called qanon shaman. his defense lawyer is trying something very interesting, in defense. looking at his brain as part of the case. and his lawyer's assessment is as unflattering of a client as anything i've ever heard. i smell a tactic. let's see what he's got, next.

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this is interesting. the attorney for the so-called qanon shaman is drawing fire for recent remarks he made in defending his client. al watkins is the lawyer's name. he says jacob's chansley's mental state made him more susceptible to trump's propaganda. he said a lot of these defendants are all f-ing short bus people.

with brain damage, they're retarded, on the goddamn spectrum. disparaging his client and millions of others. and the police. he's being offensive, which is clever, and then decided to defend it by pushing this. >> i was on chris cuomo when he decided the way to respond to my suggestion that these people needed compassion and patience and help was he called them crazy for five months. i acted professionally, talked to the people that needed to know, i made sure that the department of justice had the opportunity firsthand to meet with my client, not once, not twice, but multiple times. and i got nowhere. all i had to do was get vulgar.

>> there's a difference between being relevant and getting attention. let's bring the counselor in and see if we can divine the difference. counselor watkins, i will gladly buy you a tube of brylcreme if whatever you use to smooth your hair back, if you can find me calling your client or any of the insurrection people crazy. i never did. what i did was pick up on your own characterization that they're being deprogrammed for being in a cult. i'm not your excuse for what you've chosen to do here. we both know that. why are you doing this? what does this gain you, sir? >> i want to say a couple of things, first. i use 1040, it's an oil. it works well on the hair. >> it is summertime. you want a lightweight oil? >> let me know when your facial hair grows in. but the fact of the matter is, i

owe you an apology, i was critical of you on the air in january. i told you, it was not right. it was not appropriate to call these people anything. >> i never called them crazy. >> i'll tell you, my memory is -- >> i have the transcript. you're wrong. but i'll give it to you. >> you don't have to share anything with me. i'll share the following with you. i should have taken your tack early on. i should have been completely devoid of compassion and patience for our countrymen, who truly were vulnerable. by pointing that out, by trying to respectfully address the reality that we have people that are vulnerable, mentally infirm,

they do have issues that are currently being held in solitary confinement 23 hours a day. in my client's case, in the case of jacob chansley -- >> you think he's mentally ill? >> i think his mind is slipping away right now. >> no, no, no. do you have a diagnosis does he have a pre-existing illness that would give a reason for not just his appearance, but his behavior? >> you know the law. >> batd -- bad decision is is not illness. if you know the law -- whenever you're done pontificating. under law, you have a diagnosis, which requires an examination, and you can get an opinion. unfortunately, given covid, given the fact that my client is in solitary confinement, i'm not in a position as a counsel to garner access for a medical diagnosis.

i have garnered a medical opinion from an expert. i've also acquired from the government the military records that correspond to my client. which reflect, indicate, and demonstrate concern for the mental health and well-being of my client. >> but there's a difference between worrying about the mental health and well-being of the incarceration, and using it as a basis for behavior. having bad politics is not an excuse, and it's nothing to confuse with mental illness. >> there's no doubt about that. i agree. the reality is, these people, not all of them, a great number of people that walked down pennsylvania avenue had a vulnerability. and that put them in a position of being susceptible. susceptible to the words, to the

actions, and to this incessant drivel out of tweets, and out of the white house, and out of the mouth of our former president. and of course social media, and all that went with it. those people who are vulnerable are our family members, our colleagues. they're the people that we see every single day. they have no criminal history. they weren't violent or destructive. jacob chansley was helping law enforcement garner items that had been stolen from them. stopping a theft going on. >> he entered the capitol, he was there with his spear, he was saying obnoxious things. >> that's a mischaracterization. >> what was he doing in the capitol? >> i should show you the video presentation that we gave to the government. it shows jacob chansley all through his travels through the capitol.

>> this is why i had you on. this is what i don't understand. you want compassion for people. that's great. >> yes. >> but there has to be responsibility for the choices that you make. and unless you are under some diminished capacity, all the colorful language that caught the attention of other media, that's not what it's about. i don't care about the expressions that you used with political correctness. i'm talking about actual correctness. if they don't have an excuse for their behavior other than i believed trump, they should go to jail if they broke the law. do we agree? >> yes. you and i are absolutely on the same page. culpability is different than guilty. it requires assessment and all sorts of factors. what we don't need in this country is a gulag where we keep

people accused of a crime in solitary confinement for 131 days. when you know they have vulnerabilities. no doctor in the world, ask fa fauci, is going to say the best way to treat somebody is to put them in jail, alone, forever. >> i hear ya. you know which cases you should take? forget about your buddy with the painted face. and deal with generations of minorities, who have been incarcerated for nonviolent crimes and put in solitary and treated like animals. these people are the least of our problems. i know, but stick to them because these guys don't deserve the benefit of your perspective on that. but i appreciate you coming on. >> you and i disagree on that. we disagree on that. >> that's fine but let's just keep straight what i said, and then we'll be fine. >> we're good. congestion overw? breathe more freely with powerful claritin-d. claritin-d improves nasal airflow two times more than the leading allergy spray at hour one.

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a bolo that's out of this world. be on the lookout for former-president obama dishing new details on ufos. >> the truth is that, when i came into office, i asked, right? i was like, all right, you know, is there the lab, somewhere, where we're keeping the alien

sp specimens? they did a little bit of research, and the answer was no. >> look. ha-ha-ha. but, the president is acknowledging something, that the government has denied for decades, up until recently. this. >> what is true, and i'm -- i'm actually being serious here is, is that there are -- there's footage and records of objects in the skies, that we don't know, exactly, what they are. we can't explain how they moved, their trajectory. they -- they did not have an easily-explainable pattern. >> and, you know what? i think that's exactly the point. look, i'm open. i'm fine with you being open. okay. look, i believe in god.

i am open to things that can't be explained but ufos don't have to mean little, green men. okay? we are going to get answers from the government in a report, next month. we have to be wise to what the technology is from adversaries, before we have to pay for that price of ignorance with the blood of our best. okay? so, bolo. we'll get the answers. just be open minded. not too open. we'll be right back. advanced non-small cell lung cancer can change everything. but your first treatment could be a chemo-free combination of two immunotherapies that works differently. it could mean a chance to live longer.

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and get unlimited with 5g included for $30 on the nations fastest, most reliable network. time for the big show, "don lemon tonight." with don lemon. >> so, what do you want to talk about? ufos? you want to talk about the shaman insurrectionist? >> listen. shaman guy. that was his stunt to get attention. i just didn't want him to get it, on my back. i never called any of his people crazy. i tried very hard not to use that word, and i don't want to give him the excuse. it's one thing, if you are mentally ill. you have diminished capacity. that's vulnerability and susceptibility. that's not what these people have, until you prove to me otherwise. sure, there are lots of people, who are vulnerable and open to suggestion. it doesn't exempt you from the law. and if he's so worried about