and good evening. thanks for joining us. we are focused, tonight, on two powerful lawmakers standing between president biden and virtually everything he hopes to accomplish in his presidency. one of them is senate republican leader, mitch mcconnell. thother is a democrat. in just a short time ago, he spoke with cnn. west virginia democratic senator, joe manchin, despite having many of the same goals as the president, is refusing to change the way the senate works to achieve them. not on infrastructure or voting rights or even a bipartisan commission to investigate the attack on the capitol. his deeply-held belief that giving the minority the power to block important legislation will bring compromise, and not paralysis, is why the bill to create a bipartisan commission to investigate the insurrection could get 54-yes votes and just 35-no votes, and still fail. yet, even in the face of that, senator manchin has stood firm against eliminating the

requirement that most legislation needs. 60 votes. in other words, ten-republican votes, to even reach the floor. it would take just 51 votes, to change the rules. this evening, under intense pressure to bend, he spoke with cnn's manu raju. >> just take it off the table and say, you'll never reduce the 60-vote threshold on the filibuster. >> let me just tell you one thing. we are going to make the senate work the way it was intended to work. where i'm -- i'm totally committed to that. i'm not throwing caution to the wind. i have never desired to do that. i have listened to everybody's point of view. but the bottom line is this country has got to unite. we can't divide it. it has to be united. and right now, there are people that want to divide it further. this -- it's useless. it can't work. well, i've never given up on our country. >> but what evidence do you have that mitch mcconnell wants to work with you? because last week, he blocked the commission bill. and you saying he wants to work with you. >> i'm not saying that one's dead, either. i was very disappointed. i think it was wrong, what he

did. and i have said that. he knows how i feel about that. i did not, from that standpoint. i look at it as our country coming back together. it was totally everything, they asked for. it was totally bipartisan. i think nancy pelosi was very gracious, in what she had offered. basically, making it totally bipartisan. chuck schumer said, okay, i'll do the same. they were able to come to a disagreement, they were able to have the same-staffing levels. everything was done in the most bipartisan way. >> because of the filibuster. >> well, one person blocked it on that. but the bottom line is we have seven people, six that voted, seven would, we need three more. let's give it another shot. >> you'll never reduce the 60-vote threshold. >> we are going to make the place work. >> you are not taking that off the table then. >> we're making it work. >> but you are not reducing the 60-vote threshold, off the table. >> we are going to make the place work. that's not a lot more else i can tell you. >> a good effort by manu.

so that's senator manchin. as for mitch mcconnell, he's made it perfectly clear where his party stands. he says so. >> 100% of my focus is on stopping this new administration. what we have in united states senate is totally from susan collins to ted cruz, in opposition to what the new-biden administration is trying to do to this country. >> not only does thatt not soun like the beginning of a friendship. quoting now, the single-most important thing we want to achieve is for president obama to be a one-term president. joe manchin knows this, of course, and to add in, he is a democratic senator in an overwhelmingly-republican state. a state, in which nearly 70% of people voted for donald trump in the last election. joining us now is bernie sanders. independent senator from vermont. senator sanders, we heard there from -- from senator manchin. very clear, about his intention to keep the -- the infrastructure talks bipartisan.

he, also, wouldn't totally rule out getting rid of the filibuster, either. he was saying we are going to make the senate work. do you hold out for hope that the -- he may, still, move on the filibuster? >> well, all i can say is i want to make the senate work. i think we, all, do. the american people do. what does that mean? what it means is you do what the american people want us to do, anderson. and the truth is that, for the last-four decades, wages in america, for workers, have been stagnant. we're seeing massive-income and wealth inequality. we are the only major country on earth, not to guarantee healthcare to all. or have paid-family leave. half of our people are working, paycheck to paycheck. to make the senate work, you got to start doing what the american people want us to do. and, that is, stand up for working families, and not just for the top 1%. and when you do that, that is called democracy.

it's called majority rule. it is making the senate work. and that's what we have got to do. >> so, you're for getting rid of the filibuster? >> at this particular moment, when you -- you had mitch mcconnell, right on your screen. mcconnell attempted to do everything he could to obstruct the obama agenda. and he has made it very clear. let's give the guy credit. he's out there. he's going to do everything he can to obstruct joe biden's agenda. so, our only alternative, now, is to use reconciliation, as we did for the american-rescue plan, which was so important to the american people getting direct payments. cutting childhood poverty in half. extending unemployment. and was a very popular program. we did that with 50 votes, plus the vice president. and it appears, to me, that's exactly what we're going to have to do, again, if we're going to be successful in creating the

millions of good-paying jobs that we desperately need. dealing with the dysfunctional childcare and pre-k system. dealing with healthcare. dealing with higher education. if we are going to stand up for working families, what we need to do is use reconciliation. and, of course, we need to get rid of the filibuster. >> senator manchin said that, you know, the senate was never designed for one party to go it alone. and manu, also, asked the senator if he was open to, you know, to -- to -- to creating just a limited, a carveout, essentially, to eliminate the filibuster just to pass voting legislation on a simple majority party line vote. he said he was not citing the concern that republicans would use that against democrats, when they are next in power. saying what goes around, comes around. doesn't he have a point? i mean, is manchin actually protecting democrats, for when the republicans are in control? >> i think not, anderson. and i will tell you something. maybe, the first test of this

whole thing will not be on a reconciliation bill in order to create the millions of jobs we need. and deal with so many of the infrastructure and climate issues that we have to deal with. the very first test of it may be as to whether or not we remain, for all intent and purposes, a democracy. i think, you are more than aware, the american people are more than aware that, in georgia, in texas, in states all over this country, what republicans are doing in an absolutely shameful, disgraceful, cowardly way, is making it harder for people of color, for poor people, for young people to vote. so, they understand, i suspect, that their agenda of tax breaks for billionaires. and cutting social security and medicare and medicaid. it's unpopular. so, instead of addressing the real issues facing working people, they are trying to make it hard for people, who might vote democratic, to vote. and what we are going to be bringing up, within the next

month, is the for the people act. which basically says, a very radical statement that, in america, if you are 18 years of age or older and a citizen, you have the right to vote. that we should not have the crazy, kind of, gerrymandering that we have in states around this country. and that we should not have the kind of dark money. billionaire-corporate money, which is doing so much harm without disclosure. so that's what we are fighting for. i suspect, we're going to get zero-republican support for that. and the only way we are going to go forward to protect american democracy. to give people in states all over this country, a fair shot at electing who they want. is by passing that bill. >> what do you say to the argument that, okay, you do that, this time. democrats are in control. it works for democrats. you know, two years from now, if the republicans retake the house, retake the senate. then, they use it. >> well, that's true. that is true. but, i think, where we are, you

know, what comes around, goes around. but i think, where we are right now. when we are dealing whether or not we remain a democracy. look. what republicans are trying to do, now, all over this country is stack the deck. to make it harder for people who will vote democratic to vote. and what that means is that it is going to be very hard to have a democratic senate. to have a democratic house. and, i think, when you are talking about fighting for basic-american democracy, you got to do what you got to do. >> senator sanders. >> and right now, that means, if we have no-republican support, doing it with 50 votes, plus the vice president. >> just finally, i know you have probably heard a lot of excuses, in your career in politics. have you ever heard a lamer excuse than the texas representative, who is saying that the bill that they were pushing in texas. to move the voting time, the voting on sundays couldn't start until 1:00 p.m. that was actually a scribner's

error or a typo. they really meant 11:00 a.m. in the legislature, they were arguing this, for days. nobody picked up that it was a typo? i mean, it's insane. >> well, that is what we're dealing with now. we are dealing -- you want to go into insanity? we still have people claiming that donald trump won the election. in fact, this whole voter suppression is based upon that big lie. so, these are tough times, anderson. and they require a tough response. we have got to pass the for the people act. and if no republican is prepared to support us, we've got to go it alone. >> senator sanders, i appreciate your time. thank you. perspective now from cnn's chief white house correspondent, kaitlan collins. also, cnn political commentator, former obama adviser, van jones. kaitlan, essentially, doesn't want to address that at all. he just says, you know, i want to make the senate work for the people, the way -- way it should. manu certainly gave him multiple chances to take it off the table. he made it a point not to.

how do you read that? >> yeah, he didn't. though, of course, on capitol hill several times he said i don't want to get rid of the filibuster. basically, stop asking me that question. but pointing to, several times, saying this 60-vote threshold. is that something that you are never, ever going to support changing? and you are right, he would not commit to that. which i do think is notable. but, of course, his comments, essentially, offering a warning about what happens if they do change it, do stand. and you saw senator sanders there, basically, acknowledging it. but saying that they do feel, and this is the feeling among some several prominent democrats, that voting rights and those voting rights legislation bills that have passed the house but stalled in the senate. they are worth it to get rid of the filibuster. even if it does come back around to haunt them. if republicans retake the majority because they were saying when it comes to elections, you know, that is really the basis for all of this. why we are here on capitol hill. and so, i do think it's notable that senator manchin would not rule it out. but we have to keep in mind, he is not the only democratic senator, who is not in favor of abolishing the filibuster. there are several others, that

the white house would have to get onboard. or that democrats would have to get onboard if that was a path that they are going to go down. >> van, what's your take? i mean, do you see some daylight there with manchin? >> well, i -- i was frustrated, with manchin tonight. and i think people are getting increasingly frustrated, just as it becomes more and more clear, to the american people, what the republicans are up to. their behavior just seems bizarre, until you put all the pieces together. what they're doing is this so-called big lie, it's actually a big excuse to set up a big heist for the next election. in other words, they -- they are, 100%, now, committed, it seems to me, as a party, to go down this dangerous pathway. of making it almost impossible for the majority to rule in america. look. the deck is, already, stacked for the red states. don't forget. the senate, already, gives, you know, little-bitty red states, as many votes as california in the senate. the house is, already,

gerrymandered up to wazoo. the electoral college gives, fur r if you are red states, an unfair advantage. and they have the filibuster, on top of that. you, already, have the game stacked for you, if you are republicans, and you still want to cheat even more. and so, there -- there's going to have to be thunder on the left. you have a -- a -- a -- a determined effort, on the republican party's side. i think people are then hoping, maybe, we'll have a nice summer. could we just go out and enjoy our families? and not have to worry about the pandemic. i tondon't think we are going t get that kind of summer. i think there is going to have to be a serious mobilization among progressives to save american democracy. and -- and -- and senator manchin. i understand his intentions and i understand his heart. but at some point, he's got to look at the facts. and at least, on the question of voting, line up with the majority of americans who want us to remain a democratic republic. that's not where we are headed. >> kaitlan, i want to play something else from manu's interview with senator manchin.

>> last question. joe biden, this week, he said that -- he said that you vote more with republicans than democrats. >> i don't think -- i think that's taken totally out of content. >> saying it was taken out of context. again, senator manchin comes from an overwhelmingly-republican state. i'm wondering what you made of -- of his -- his perception of that? >> well, saying it was taken out of context. i mean, we saw the full context of that comment from president biden. and yes, the white house did, later, try to walk it back saying it wasn't a criticism. but it's hard to see how it's not a criticism, when the president is saying that you are a moderate-democrat, who votes more with republicans, than you do with democrats. and we know that's not true. sinema and manchin do vote much more with democrats than they ever do with republicans. but it -- it was a noticeable dig because it showed the frustration that does emanate from the west wing with people, like manchin. and the way that they are involved with president biden's agenda. and how they can potentially thwart his agenda when it comes to major pieces of legislation. like, what we're looking at with

infrastructure. where manchin is one of increasingly-few democrats, who are saying keep these talks with republicans going. let's keep these negotiations happening. these counteroffers and offers. you are seeing other democrats saying, hey, it's time to move on. and without republican support because, clearly, they are never going to agree to what we are looking to pass here. >> yeah. >> squls a, i think seeing the concessions president biden is making. there are several progressive democrats, who aren't happy with that. and so, i think that is a notable part here. but saying it was taken out of context. it certainly wasn't. we all heard it for ourselves. >> van, what do you make of the argument, which senator manchin makes and others make which is, look. democrats, watch what you are fighting for because, you know, yes, maybe, the filibuster or getting rid of it will work for you, this time. but if, when republican -- not if -- when republicans take control, you know, two years, four years, whenever it is in the house or the senate, again. the shoe's going to be on the other foot. >> well, he's right. and we have to live with that. look. there, already, are protections

baked in for minority constituencies in our constitution. the filibuster is not in the constitution. so, here's the deal. right now, what's happened because of the abuse of the filibuster. the relentless abuse of the filibuster. when we win, we can't govern. and so, at some point, why do -- why should we even try to vote? so, i think we have to roll the dice. here's -- here's why democrats might feel a little bit more confident. we have a pathway, at least with this republican party, if we can have a fair election, to hold onto the presidency for a very long time. and so, you don't have the filibuster but you will have the veto. that can protect democrats for a very long time if we can have fair elections. if you don't have fair elections, though, then the whole game is over. and so, i would rather trade in the filibuster, and rely on our ability to veto if we can have fair elections. >> van jones, kaitlan collins, pressure it. thanks. coming up next. breaking news on two related fronts. what mike pence just said about the insurrection that his old boss fomented. and what his old boss is now asking about, somehow returning to office this year.

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more, breaking news, now. almost five months after former vice president mike pence had to be hurried out of the senate chamber with his family to safety, during the january 6th capitol riot. the day when some rioters were heard by those present to shout hang mike pence. the former vice president, took the opportunity at a speech in new hampshire to show some distance between himself and the former president about that day. >> as i said that day, january 6th was a dark day in the history of the united states capitol. but thanks to the swift action of the capitol police and federal-law enforcement, violence was quelled. the capitol was secured.

and that same day, we reconvened the congress, and did our duty under the constitution and the laws of the united states. you know, president trump and i have spoken, many times, since we left office. and i don't know if we'll ever see eye to eye, on that day. but i will always be proud of what we accomplished for the american people, over the last-four years. [ applause ] and i will not allow democrats, or their allies in the media, to use one tragic day to discredit the aspirations of millions of americans.

>> joined, now, by our chief domestic correspondent, jim acosta, who covered the previous administration. cnn chief white house correspondent, kaitlan collins, is back with us. there wasn't applause when the vice president had the line, you know, we went back and we did our duty. the applause was backing the, you know, i'm not going to let it, you know, basically, turn -- make me turn against the president. i'm so proud of what we did for the four years. what else did the vice president have to say? >> well, anderson, he was, also, talking about how he supports some of these -- what they call election-integrity efforts on the state level across the country. that those are code words for, essentially, trying to fix the next-election cycle for republicans. because republicans, by and large, have been driving this process at the statehouse level. you know, anderson, one of the things mike pence did not talk about during that speech. he did not talk about how his own president tried to st

strong arm him into overturning the election results. the disagreement that exists over january 6th is not just about january 6th. it is about what led up to january 6th and how donald trump, for days, was -- and -- and weeks really, trying to overturn the results of the election. calling various-state officials and so on. and then, trying to strong arm his own, vice president into going down to the capitol and overturning the election results. and so, the -- the vice president -- the former vice president there is just glossing over what happened around january 6th. and -- and it's just -- it's unfortunate to see. obviously, he wants to put that behind him because he thinks it's beneficial, to him, to get former-president trump before the 2024 cycle. >> yeah, kaitlan, one wonders how long it's going to be before he makes a pilgrimage to mar-a-lago for, you know, the same kevin mccarthy photo op with -- with the former president. >> though, i think it's even worse, for pence to say something like that. to try to really minimize that day with his comments, because

he was the one where they were chanting about hanging him. the rioters wearing -- carrying trump's flags, wearing shirts bearing his name. and so, it's stunning for pence to make these comments. it's not surprising, of course. this is a long-held pattern we have seen allies of the president take. lindsey graham, trump gave out his number one time at a press conference. of course, he is a close ally of the former president's. ben carson. trump, once, called him a liar. marco rubio. ted krocruz. i mean, the list goes on and on. of course, the situation where he was in, where he never got a phone call from the president that day while they were in office. the vice president never getting a phone call from him, as rioters were chanting haing mik pence. something that was well known on that day. and of course, he had to be escorted out by service. his staff was greatly concerned about this. staff here, at the white house, were begging the president to put out a statement. and to hear him minimize as just one, tragic day. and essentially, blaming democrats in the media for continuing to talk about it, even though it was a

history-making moment. just goes to show what this next race is going to look like. and the republican primary coming up. because, of course, you are going to see people, like pence, who we do expect to run, trying to square this. while saying, you know, they are not standing by what trump did that day. but they are saying, we need to move on from it. that is the words that you've heard from mitch mcconnell and those who voted against the january-6th commission. saying let's put this in the rear-view mirror and i think it's going to be a really difficult balance for them to try to maintain, going forward. because, of course, we know what trump expects and that's no criticism at all. >> jim, the former vice president's wife and daughters, if my memory serves me correctly, were there with him, that day. and scurried to safety. i mean, the idea that he, now, in order to run, you know, and to remain in the -- in good standing in the republican party -- has to kind of re-create or reinvent, you know, his feelings about that or what actually happened that day is -- is pretty sad.

i know, speaking to former president, you have some new reporting on what he's been saying to some of his closest advisers. >> yeah. we have been talking about this for a couple days, anderson. this idea that donald trump has been out there, talking to advisers about whether or not he could be reinstalled as president of the united states. i -- we were able to confirm it here at cnn. i talked to a trump adviser earlier today. a source familiar with these conversations. who said trump has been going around, and asking his advisers what do you think of this theory? referring to these far-fetched suggestions coming from far-right celebrities. people like mike lindell who owns the my pillow company and so on. and wondering whether or not he can, somehow, be reinstalled as president of the united states. if, somehow, these election results are overturned. this crazy notion that the election results might be overturned in arizona or wherever. and according to this source, familiar with these conversations, these advisers have had to talk donald trump off the ledge. and in the words of this source

that i spoke with earlier today. this talk coming from the former president is, quote, very dangerous. and so, anderson, you know, we can write this stuff off as trump just -- you know, he's just talking about of his back end and so on, he does this on a regular basis. it's this kind of nonsense and craziness that sparked the insurrection, on january 6th. and it sounds like, donald trump is so starved for attention, so starved for coverage, that he is willing to stoke this, once again. and the unfortunate thing is there are just so many millions of americans who believe this craziness, even though it's just that. >> yeah, jim acosta. kaitlan collins, thank you. next, the government still can't explain what navy pilots saw in the sky. they ever just come to perhaps the biggest single conclusion they can about these unexplained aerial phenomena. the new reporting, when we come back. oy) what's cyan mean? it means "cyanora," honor roll. (mimics missile dropping) the ink! dad!!! dad!!! i'm so hosed. yeah, you are.

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there is more breaking news. and the question that it speaks to could not be bigger. namely, are we alone? specifically, all the strange, other worldly objects, observed by naval aviators over recent years alien spacecraft? the government has been looking into it. tonight, "the new york times" learned the report's bottom line, julian barnes, shares the byline in the scoop. julian, what is the government saying? have they come to any, concrete conclusion? >> well, they found no evidence that these unexplained phenomenon are alien spacecraft. but they, still, can't explain what they are.

and that's going to be a big but. they have ruled out that these things that were seen by the navy pilots were some sort of secret american government program. that was out there, as one possibility. and that's been eliminated. but we don't have a definitive conclusion, on what it is. although, officials say there's no evidence it's aliens. >> have they -- what about the possibility of, you you know, secret programs belonging to some other government, some other country operating here? >> absolutely. and that remains a possibility. there's more than 120 different phenomenon that were investigated by the government. and reviewed as part of this soon-to-be-released report. and not all of them can be balloons or scientific-research

projects. some may, well, be, could possibly be, a technology by russia or china. both countries are researching hypersonic. but even there, we don't have lot of clarity because if -- if some of these things were hypersonic weapons or aircraft, that would suggest that the russians and chinese are far ahead of america, not just a little bit ahead. but -- but quite a bit. >> right. either way, it's concerning. you know, it -- it -- the fact that it's -- they can say that it's not u.s. military or u.s. spacecraft. then, if they can't say for sure, they say there is no evidence that it's alien. but that doesn't mean it's not alien. there's just no evidence of it. correct me if i'm wrong. and -- >> no, that's right. >> some other country's aircraft moving, in ways that we are not capable of or familiar with in our airspace.

>> right. there is also a possibility that this is some sort of visual artifact that, both, humans and cameras could see. there's some scientists, who push that theory. although, the -- the pilots are very certain they -- they saw something. and there were repeated incidents. so, it's a frustrating -- like so many of these intelligence issues, it's pretty frustrating. we -- there's more unknowns, than knowns. >> so, even though the -- the government says there's no evidence this is alien spacecraft. i mean, what happens now? going to stop people believing something is out there. you know, there are also all these stories about, maybe, they had material or recovered material. does this report address any of that? >> well, we don't know. but we don't know, for certain. but there's nothing, in this report, i'm told, my colleague is told, that presents evidence

that could point to an alien spacecraft. so, having other-worldly material, material that couldn't be explained. well, that would be a piece of evidence for an alien spacecraft. so that's not in this report. and it's not in the classified annex that will come out, later this month. >> and -- and is there going to be an unclassified version? >> oh, yeah. so, congress has required an unclassified report that's due by june 25th. and the public will be able to read that. there will, also, be a classified annex, that we won't be able to see. >> hmm. >> although, we're told, that in that annex, there's no evidence of alien there, either. >> it's fascinating. julian barnes, really appreciate it. thank you. coming up next. did pennsylvania state lawmakers running from cnn's kyung lah in phoenix run all the way home with new ideas for overturning election results there? we'll talk about it with the state's lieutenant governor. plus, new reporting on more sketchiness surrounding the arizona ballot review.

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when last we saw cnn's kyung

lah, she was chasing pennsylvania state lawmakers. not in pennsylvania but in phoenix, arizona. they were visiting bogus-ballot review going on there. apparently, intent on trying something similar back home. in a moment, we will joined by pennsylvania's lieutenant governor but first, fresh evidence that what democrats, even some republicans, are calling a sham is precisely that. it comes from arizona secretary of state, whose office has been documenting irregularities in the operation. once again, cnn's kyung lah. >> reporter: it's been a mystery, from the start. why, the so-called audit workers, all, wear color-coded t-shirts. the two are in pink shirts. the nonpartisan observers, representing the arizona secretary of state's office, told by the company leading the audit that they need to wear them. now, secretary of state katie hobbs thinks she's figured it out. >> what we've noticed is that they are using these shirts to label our observers as pink-o commies, that the shirt made him

look like a transgender, which i don't even know what that means. >> so, it's a joke? >> i don't -- i mean, i think this whole thing is a joke. >> the pink shirts are one of the more eye-popping details in a summary report from hobbs' office. detailing a slew of problems with this ballot review of maricopa county's 2020 ballots. observers noted more than a dozen serious problems, from an unattended and open security gate. errors with the software update used to examine ballots. so problematic, they ditched it and went back to the old soft wash. a software. and a cell phone brought to the floor. observers say that cell phone was carried by one of the leaders of the so-called audit, despite rules prohibiting them and security using what appears to been anti-spy detector daily on the coliseum floor. and then, there's this. >> there were two instances, where black pens were, again, on the counting floor. >> reporter: jen is an arizona republic reporter. pen color is a big deal because blue and black pens can be used to alter ballots during an

audit. she pointed out weeks ago, to cyber ninjas, the hired contractor. >> he went and checked came back to me and said, we're going to remove the blue pens. we are going to use green pens, instead. >> so you noticed the problem before cybernan jas did? >> i did. >> does this strike you as a reporter covering this, like a big deal? >> it strikes me as showing they may not have experience doing election audits before. >> reporter: the cyber ninjas are a little-known tech company ho h hired out of florida for the so-called audit. a third review run by the republican-controlled arizona senate, despite two previous audits conducted by maricopa county. in response, audit spokesman ken bennet tells cnn he, quote, laughed out loud when he read hobbs' report calling it quote untrue, to inconsequential, to a bunch of bs. he also called the observers bias, saying no one picked on them for the pink shirts. but hobbs says her report seeks to rebut what she expects will be the final report from the cyber ninjas and arizona-senate

republicans. the next chapter of the big lie. >> i saw karen fan say to you last week that we are setting the gold standard here in arizona. >> this will be the basis of a gold standard. >> there is nobody involved with any type of audit, in any industry, who would say that what's going on here is a gold standard. we know the truth about the 2020 election. and that the results we certified were an accurate reflection of the will of the voters. and this process is -- is not. >> and kyung, joins us now from phoenix. there are republicans, in maricopa county, that are trying to fight against the big lie. some are making the connection to the so-called audit and the former president's, you know, believing he will be reinstated in august. >> yeah. we are actually hearing from them, more and more. and we just saw this tweet from maricopa county's supervisor, bill gates. he's been really, one of the more active and vocal republicans, here, in the county. saying, look, this is -- this is a lie. and what he tweeted was that the audit is feeding into that

conspiracy theory for his desired quote/unquote reinstatement. this is the important part. he tweets that republicans must stand up to this madness, and defend the rule of law. silence is becoming complicity. it is something, that we keep hearing about, anderson, in this state. is it going to be fact? or fiction? with some republicans choosing fact and others continuing to follow this audit. anderson. >> kyung lah, appreciate it. joining us now, john fedderman, pennsylvania's threwlieutenant governor. there are obviously major problems what's going on in arizona. not only from, you know, an operational perspective. according to state representatives. but it's, also, based on the big lie that the election was fraudulent. and that there was widespread-voter fraud, which we know there was not. so, what goes through your mind when you see pennsylvania republicans visiting in maricopa county? and, i guess, wanting to do the same thing in your state? >> well, it doesn't surprise me.

that the three colleagues are -- are very much less tethered to reality than, even the other republicans' colleagues in the senate. these are fringe, among more of a fringe movement. so, i'm not surprised, and i -- i don't expect it to go anywhere. but really, the prime directive for republicans, at this point, is the former president because that waters the tree of liberty for the republican party, now. >> the -- the state senator of -- pennsylvania state senator, doug mastriano, who was one of the three pennsylvania lawmakers who travelled to arizona. he said, quote, i am not about overturning anything. i want just trying to find out what went right, what went wrong, and how do we have better elections in the future. unquote. you know, he was at january 6th. he said he left before any violence, and he renounced, you know, any violence. but the idea that visiting a privately-run, you know, audit. that doesn't, you know, is not really -- doesn't have to answer

anybody. they can announce results -- any results they want. and there is no way anyone can check what they -- they have done. do you trust that mastriano isn't about overturning anything? >> well, of course. they would -- they would love to. recall, mastriano and the others put on that snake-handling demonstration in the ballroom in gettysburg, late, in 2020 trying to evoverturn the election results. i mean, this is what they do. this is all they know and this is all they have to run on. and currying the former president's favor is their only play to be electorally viable, nowadays in the republican party. and that's a tragedy. if you tell the truth in the republican party, you lose your elective career in politics. we've seen it with my counterpart in georgia and across the country. the bottom line is this. no one, including the republicans, themselves, believe there was any fraud. they know, better than anybody, what the results are. and this is strictly about

simping for donald trump so he curries favor and they endorse him. he endorses them. and they, ultimately, would win in their respective primaries. >> you're confident, that there is not going to be a maricopa-style, you know, so-called audit in pennsylvania? >> i am. yeah. the -- the members that made that trip were fringy, even among the fringies. and i do not believe it would go any further than, again, the -- the -- the train wreck in the ramada ballroom in gettysburg did. it's just all for show and it is all just a pander to the fringe and the extremes. and it's not going to go anywhere. no one's getting reinstalled as president. it's all just part of this really bad performance art that they just won't let it go. because that's the only thing they have left to run on, because president biden and the democratic majorities have led this country out of this pandemic. and are getting people back to work. and getting people back to their

lives, pre-pandemic. >> lieutenant governor, really appreciate it. thank you so much. >> thank you. >> coming up next. there is new reporting on why congressman matt gaetz could, soon, be in even deeper legal trouble than he already is. that's ahead. a record 1.1 trillion transistors into this chip whoo! yeah! oh, hi i invested in invesco qqq a fund that invests in the innovators of the nasdaq 100 like you you don't have to be circuit design engineer to help push progress forward can i hold the chip? become an agent of innovation with invesco qqq they told me you can't make a boombox fly. so i built a boomboxasaurus... with code! can i hold the chip? and we did it together in our live online coding class. at byju's!

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new reporting tonight that only adds to the trouble florida congressman matt gaetz could find himself in. he's already under investigation for an alleged sexual relationship with a minor. his former friend and wingman is already cooperating in the investigation and now sources tell cnn the feds are looking into whether the congressman may have obstructed justice. more now from cnn's paula reid. >> reporter: a source tells cnn that investigators have been told about gaetz and an associate discussing a plan to visit gaetz' ex-girlfriend in october 2020. investigators have also been provided with material that suggests the woman may have been influenced related to the investigation. the woman is seen as a critical witness in a probe as she was linked to the congressman in the summer of 2017 when he allegedly had sexual contact with a different woman who was just 17 at the time.

politico, which first reported the obstruction investigation late wednesday, also says investigators are looking at a phone call gaetz had with a witness in the sex crimes investigation. the call reportedly originated between the witness and gaetz' ex-girlfriend and gaetz himself joined at some point. the outlet did not report when the call took place or what was said. the congressman has repeatedly denied wrongdoing. >> i'm being falsely accused of exchanging money for favors. >> reporter: in a statement in response to cnn's new reporting, a spokesman for the lawmaker said congressman gaetz pursues justice, he doesn't obstruct it. after two months, there is still not a single on-record accusation of misconduct and now the story is changing yet again. >> paula reid joins us now. how significant is the obstruction piece of this investigation? >> anderson, this certainly heightens the legal jeopardy for the congressman.

what we have to remember is at the heart of this investigation is a group of young women who are allegedly trafficked, some of them exchanged sex for money and gifts. one of them was even allegedly underage. i've spoken with some of them. some of them are savvy and some of them are not. some of them have told me they are very scared to be involved in a federal investigation. so the fact that they're looking at any pressure on them, very significant. >> appreciate it. still to come, we remember 40 years ago this week when the cdc issued their first report on a virus the world will come to know as hiv. cartridges are so... (buzzer) (vo) the epson ecotank. no more cartridges! it comes with an incredible amount of ink that can save you a lot of frustration. ♪ the epson ecotank. just fill and chill.

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on june 5th, 1981, the cdc reported for the first time on a rare pneumonia in five previously healthy young gay men in los angeles. this was the agency's first report on what the world would eventually know as hiv, the virus that causes aids. that was 40 years ago this week. according to the cdc, 730,000 people have died of aids-related illnesses in the country, in the u.s., and 32 million worldwide. at an event in december honoring his work fighting hiv, dr. anthony fauci spoke about those terrifying early days in which there were few answers, little compassion and widespread fear of and bigotry against those who were ill. fauci said he would be, quote, putting band-aids on hemorrhages with no drugs available watching literally all of my patients die. today the cdc says hiv infections have decreased about 73% thanks in large part to life-saving drugs, better care and testing.