all right. thank you very much for giving us the opportunity tonight. see the game that is at play in politics. that's the key. don lemon tonight with the upgrade as d. lemon tries to see if he could eat his weight in tacos, you get laura coats. >> i thought it was nachos. >> he may have no discipline, but he loves diversity in his diet. >> asi'll ask him, assuming he' sober enough to answer. let's take up the case. which side do you want on richardson, pro or on? >> i'm always on coats' side. >> you make pro because that's the right way to be on this

because rules are rules. here's my pushback on it. not all rules are the same. weed is not a performance enhancing drug. she did nothing to help herself gain any advantage of anything you could argue it would be a disadvantage for her. it serves no purpose as a policy to enforce this. and the united states should be doing a lot more to resist not to enable. >> well, you know, i got to tell you, it's hard to be fully pro or con because although the rules are the rules we have a patch work of rules when it comes to weed. even justice thomas spoke about this issue. having uniformity on the sh you, i can see the argument that says, look, in order to be an elite athlete, you have to have the discipline to abide by the rules. we want that to be the case. but, again, it is hard for people to understand that this is not somehow the united states of america selectively enforcing certain rules when it is convenient to do so, especially

when, frankly, the world stage does know the united states is not always consistent about its rule-abiding, is it? >> right. and dominique daws was just on. being underage is an advantage in gymnastic. why? they peak early. there is so much wear and tear on the body. there is an advantage. taking substances that allow you to heal and give you a different level of lax ity in your connective tissue. this is not one of those things. >> as the president said about it, maybe it is a time to look into changing the rules. but if they're going to do it for that, i suspect the federal government has to do it when it comes to what schedule they put on it. it's an ongoing conversation. i kind of went between pro and con, but i see both sides of an issue when you are talking about rules applied differently between states. >> i feel like i lost in that issue. >> it's funny how it happens.

>> laura, you are always an upgrade. i look forward to watching the show. >> thank you. i'm jealous you got to talk to dominique. fine, whatever. this is don lemon tonight. i'm laura coats in for don on the night of major developments on multiple big stories. new tonight rudy giuliani's law license is suspended in washington, d.c. after the president's former personal lawyer saw his license suspended in new york all for pushing the big law of non-existent election fraud. >> they only submitted 8,021 ballots from dead people, mail-in ballots for dead people. probably easier for dead people to submit mail-in ballots than it is to vote in person. we cannot allow these crooks, because that's what they are, to steal an election from the american people. >> let's have trial by combat! >> the appeals court in d.c. saying the man once known as america's mayor would be

suspended from working as an attorney in the city pending the outcome of the situation in new york. much more on that in just a moment. and it comes as on capitol hill, kevin mccarthy who has been doing everything he can to drag his feet and delay the investigation of the january 6th insurrection now is deciding to put the republicans on the committee. almost certainly to include some trump allies. meanwhile, a new book quotes the then president of the united states praising hitler while on a trip to paris to commemorate the end of world war i. according to the book, frankly, we did win this election. the inside story of how trump lost by michael bender, trump reportedly then told then white house keefe of staff john kelly, quote, well, hitler did a lot of good things. cnn has reached out to john kelly for comment. but the idea that the president of the united states, the leader of the free world would say anything, anything to praise the

man responsible for the death of six million jewist people in nazi concentration camps is despicable. hitler did not do a lot of good things, and is not just the former president. this is the undisputed leader of the gop. and his party clear hi has not learned that this is, and i'll say it again, despicable. but first, to rudy giuliani. his law license suspended in the nation's capitol. i want to bring in john avalon and kristin powers. these suspensions are a huge blow for the former manhattan attorney and mayor of new york. he actually ran for president. you actually worked for him, so how are you looking at the situation? >> i think it is a tragedy when you look at the ark of his career. leading the southern district of

new york and was revered in that office. to have the first insult by they raid his house and a blistering document by those judges and now washington d.c. is part of a pattern. but it shows how far he's fallen in some critical ways. this is somebody that used to say that a law is the search for the truth. he did not engage in anything resembling a search for the truth in his defense of donald trump by pushing the big lie. consistently in courts and other places. so you reap what you saw and there needs to be accountability for lies especially in court especially when the united states election is at stake and you call for trial by combat before an attack on our capitol. >> by the way, he knew better, right? the idea here that giuliani can claim that i didn't know better. he was the sdny u.s. attorney. he was the mayor of new york. he's somebody who is in a great deal of legal peril right now. liable lawsuits and all the like

based on it. and michael cohen who went to prison over the hush money payments to protect his boss, here is what he tweeted. he said, i warned rudy giuliani everything donald j. trump touches dies. what do you think about that? >> well, i think that rudy went into this with eyes wide open. you listed off all of the credentials that he had in terms of understanding the law, and he still chose to lie to courts. he chose to lie to the public. he chose to lie to lawmakers. and about some pretty important things. and, so, i think this is an appropriate, you know, punishment for him. he frankly, probably deserves more to have his license at least suspended for a period of time as this process is going on. yeah. i mean, it's just -- it's -- i

personally never was a huge rudy giuliani fan, but i have to say even in setting that aside, it still is, as john was saying, a real fall for this person. you know, even if you -- whatever critiques you have of him as mayor. this is so far removed from that person. and he made that choice. i think he understood what he was doing. >> and by the way, need not be a fan of the person. the courts are a fan of the truth, and that's what's owed to the courts, right? you go in there and try to bring in the court of public opinion and you say all these things not honest and you try to use the courts as a mechanism of this pulpit, it ought to not work. but let's go to the idea of how the big lie is not something confined to a discussion about rudy giuliani because, john, kevin mccarthy, you know he's finalizing his picks now for the democratic-led january 6th investigation. and he frankly is likely to tap lawmakers who he thinks can defend trump. i wonder is that tactic going to

work? especially after speaker pelosi, she included republican liz cheney as one of her picks. is that enough of a counter balance? >> i don't think this is about counter balance. there is no compromise with lies. the question is how many trolls he will try to stack the deck with. and the potential danger of blowback to fair minded americans watching the process. you know, at the very least, he should consider appointing at least one of the 35 republicans who voted for the bipartisan commission, but i wouldn't expect that from kevin mccarthy. do they want to make this a sideshow? well, they're going to look like the circuit. you will have to agree on basic facts. if they continue to push the big lie in this investigation, it will not be a good luck for them, but you shouldn't expect anything less. >> should pelosi use her veto power if mccarthy chooses a republican that's been complicit in the big lie? >> if he ends up choosing, which

i don't think that he will, but if he ended up choosing any of these, you know, like margery tailor green types then i think, yes, absolutely. there should be some deference in terms of who he appoints. she can't say no to anybody who doesn't fit her criteria. i think what they're trying to do is basically -- i think he's realized that just ignoring this isn't really an option because it is something that will play out in the media. without having people there to make the argument that he wants made, that donald trump wants made is just seeding all that ground to the democrats. but, you know, the way the republicans are approaching this, we just have never normalized it, you know, the idea that the way that they have opposed even having this investigation in the first place is highly problematic and the fact then that in choosing people to be on this committee he's only going to be thinking about what's good for him

politically versus if you look back at democrats with the benghazi committees how they actually treated it seriously and put serious people on, you know, with elijah cummings, people who could have relationships with people across the aisle and who would treat it seriously. the republican party just is not -- they're not even trying to govern in any way. and they certainly aren't living up to the standards that they held democrats to. >> thank you. >> thank you. good night. >> thank you. you know, i think on that point, we need to clear up a few things. a few things that for some inexplicable reason seem to be confusing to some of our elected officials and the so-called leader of the gop. and frankly, i can't understand how anyone could be confused by these facts and right versus wrong. yet, here we are. starting with a report out of a new book from michael bender that president trump told his chief of staff, general john kelly, that, quote, hitler did a

lot of good things. adofl hitler and the word "good" should never be in the same sentence. next, he led a genocide and any attempt at revisionist history to cast him in a favorable light is unconscionable. yet, revisionism appears to be par for the trump golf course. it's been adopted by his allies when it comes to the election and the insurrection. worse, a sitting member of congress, margery tailor green continues to be cavalier about anal guising that genocide. a few weeks ago she compared vaccine mandates and passports to yellow stars. remember, she went to the h holocaust museum in d.c. where she professed her newfound enlightenment on the issue. >> the holocaust is -- there is

nothing comparable to it. there is no comparison to the holocaust. >> and now it is totally obvious her words were empty. just look at what the congresswoman tweeted today. people have a choice. they don't need your medical brown shirts showing up at their door ordering vaccinations. you can't force people to be part of the human experiment. facts first on cnn. brown shirts refers to the para military group the storm troopers who helped facilitate hitler's rise to power, and she's comparing their role for targeted outreach to unvaccinated communities in the face of rising concern about the delta variant. i obviously can't believe we still need to say this, so i will keep it direct and clear. do not invoke the holocaust. that rhetoric is so dangerous. it's hurtful and it's counter productive, period.

full stop. seriously. stop. what has happened to the one-time party of lincoln? and what does all this say about their leadership? i will talk to former governor john kasich. that's next. you need an ecolab scientific clean here. and here. which is why the scientific expertise that helps operating rooms stay clean now helps the places you go too. look for the ecolab science certified seal.

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new allegations that president trump praised hitler as doing, quote, a lot of good things. now, trump reportedly made these comments to his chief of staff john kelly back in 2018. and a trump spokesperson is denying the report. joining me now former republican governor of ohio john kasich. he is now a cnn senior commentator. governor, nice to see you tonight. it is shocking that we're talking about this, the idea of a president of the united states praising hitler. this reporting has not been confirmed by cnn, but bender is quoting general john kelly. and we're talking about a former president that called white supremacists very fine people. what is your reaction to this new reporting? >> well, if, in fact, it's true, there isn't anything that a president of the united states would be more despicable.

and, laura, we have to look at the big picture here. the rise of anti-semitism not only in america but all across the world, 1,200 cases last year in the united states. and we know it's happening around the world. and when you have a president of the united states that says that, if he said this, that hitler did some good things, you see, it brings about loose talk. and we have just seen loose talk here out of this person you mentioned in the last segment, comparing people who want to give vaccines and knocking on doors to say would you like a vaccine. did she understand what the brown shirts did? did she understand how they went and grabbed people out because they were jews and sent them ultimately to their death camps? i built a holocaust memorial on the grounds of my state house when i was governor. i put it there so people would realize six million people slaughters systematically. and we have somebody who says,

allegedly says, well, you know, he did some good things. and this loose talk around brown shirts and the holocaust, laura, this is really, really bad. as you know, jews have been targeted throughout human history. and we see a rise of it now in this anti-semitism which i frankly do not understand is rearing its ugly head once again, and it must be stamped out. >> it is so incredibly dangerous for reasons you said and more and the idea that coming from people who are elected officials in positions of power, and extraordinary influence is all the more concerning and it emboldens the behavior. it is almost like it is being sanctioned, the loose talk, in that it's okay to say it if it's happening at the highest levels of our government, right? >> well, you know, it is unbelievable to me because you think about what happened. what happened to people as they were yanked out of their homes, mothers and fathers leaving children terrified.

put in boxcars, sent to death camps. i was in dacau, 41,000 people slaug slaughtered. this is an unbelievable situation. what i get concerned about is maybe people don't know enough about it. maybe these people who use these terms don't have any education in this. they don't understand what it is, that the history of what happens needs to be recognized because if we don't pay attention to history, we know what happens. things are likely to happen again and this kind of wholesale slaughter. to try to say, oh, there was some good things that were happening is just an outrage, laura. you know it. i know it and the people watching this know it. >> i remember as a child in minnesota growing up in saint paul and meeting with holocaust survivors and having them tell the story as they showed the numbers in their arms. that was sered into my mind of what they experienced. i can't imagine would be so

flippant to refer to it the way they do. i want to get your take as well on the author of "hill billy elgy." the author the running for senate in your state. he says he regrets calling donald trump reprehensible back in 2016. i wonder is kissing trump's ring and distancing from your thoughts of then, is that the prerequisite for republicans running in 2022? >> well, i don't really know much about this story. you know, it's been a holiday weekend. but what i can say is i think that people who make pilgrimages or sort of bow to donald trump, they got to wonder about their own soul. and, so, i think we got to be very careful. i mean, you get elected to stand for things. and if people decide, well, they got to kind of cow tell to somebody else in order to suck up the voters so they can win, that's not a good thing. and i don't know the details of what this gentleman has done or

any of the other people running. i've not paid a whole lot of attention to the senate race in this state. but across this country we see a pilgrimage of too many politicians going down there to support him. i'm pleased to see nancy pelosi will name liz cheney to the commission to find out what happened on january 6th. i can't believe we never got that through. look, we move on and see what happens here. but there is going to be change, laura. i'm going to tell you, i don't know exactly when it's going to come. but people are going to regret the fact that they are lining up for his approval. i don't agree with it. i don't think it's good politics, and it's certainly not good for the country. >> governor kasich, thank you. >> laura, thank you. he lied about the election over and over all for one man, donald trump. and now rudy giuliani may be facing the consequences. stay with us.

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presidents are surrounded by a team of official advisers and experts, but they're not the only relationships shaping presidential legacies, even history. in new books out with all the behind the scenes details, joining me now gary ginsburg, the author of "first friends: the powerful unsung and unelected people who shaped our presidents."

gary, welcome to the show. what a fascinating book. i want to start with the why. why did you write this book? it's certainly relevant if you look at the news tonight. i know you didn't include former president trump the president. but let's talk about the why you wrote this book. why? >> thank you for having me, laura. well, since i was a little kid, i have wibeen fascinated with t presidency. i worked in the clinton administration. i came to witness some really remarkable close friendship between leaders and their best friends. and i saw how this friend could speak more bluntly, act more naturally than any staffer or aid could and even in some cases how the meaningful impact on pretty consequential decisions. to my surprise, there's been little written about this dyn dynamic. there has been books about first wives, first pets, first butlers, but nothing about first

friends, so i decided to write the book. >> the confidant status, the idea that rapport is being build could shape our whole nation. i want to talk about this unique relationship between presidentd. i wonder how you see it based on your book and the close interactions that you have seen? >> i wanted to do a chapter on president trump and i engaged someone as close to trump as everybody to determine who that might be. we went around and around for more than two months until this person finally confessed that the president really doesn't have a first friend or really any close friends. he has people he speaks to frequently like the founder of marvel or the casino mogul. but in the end, his closest friend, just to shorthand it, really was his twitter feed before it was shut down, of course. all he really needs for

emotional sustenance and company is public affirmation, really at the adoration of his base. to he would bring family and so-called friends, and then he would closet himself in one of his cabins. that was his idea of relaxing with friends. calling his supporters, getting that affirmation. it all made me wonder whether the presence of a real friend during this presidency could have saved him from some of his worst moments. we'll never know, obviously, but it is an interesting question to speculate. >> that's fascinating, the idea of affirmation. and you write more about the aid and the council these first friends really provide. we often spoke about during the trump administration the idea of having an adult in the room. but this book talks about which adult would be in the room. i want to talk about the president that you know best, gary, because you served, as you mentioned, as an aid in the clinton white house. bill clinton may not have

actually been the president if not for a close friend of his, you write. >> that's right. i mean, what really intrigued me about this relationship was how much clinton relied on jordan throughout his life and then his presidency. without vernon we may not have had a bill clinton as president. when clinton lost his re-election for governor in 1980, he was really distraught. he called around to friends trying to get some sense of comfort, couldn't get it. vernon was watching from new york. he had become friends with clinton years earlier. he calls uphillry and says, you got any grits down there? because i'm going to come down and talk to you guys because he knew how upset bill was and how upset, in fact, how he was thinking about leaving politics for good as a result. he goes down to ark about and spends three hours in the kitchen of the clinton new house after they moved out of the mansion and he spoke really tough words to clinton. he said, get over it. you got too much talent to be giving this all up. clinton listened.

and two years later, he was taking the oath of office as arkansas governor in the beginning of 1983. >> that's a book title if i ever heard one. i hope you have grits down there. and then that leads to all this. that's not all that vernon jordan did. he was also a confidant when it came to clinton's biggest scandal monica lewinsky, right? >> what's interesting is he was, i would say, as pivotal to clinton's presidency as any chief of staff or senior aid. when he was elected president, clinton offered him the job of attorney general. he really wanted him in his cabinet. but vernon said straight out, i could be more valuable to you as your first friend. and jordan was right. any time clinton needed help, he would say call vernon and vernon was there. he was involved in every major personnel decision, most policy decisions and perhaps most importantly clinton's major course of relaxation, whether it was on the golf course, in meals

in the residence outside, he was his closest companion. one of the reasons why i think he relied on jordan so much is that he basically just had the best judgment and the best political intelligence of anyone around in washington. and, you know, when clinton was impeached later over lying about his affair with monica and vernon became a witness in that, he could have cut and run, but he didn't. he stood by his best friend. and the testimony he delivered before the grand jury really helped save clinton from conviction in the senate when he went before it for his impeachment trial. >> and making his passing, the late vernon jordan even more profound i'm sure of course for the clinton as it is for the whole nation. i want to ask you, gary, you also -- you have that president truman's friend and former business partner who was key in getting truman to recognize david israel, so a friend of the president not elected official is who changed the course of history here? >> i say that i think it's the

most powerful example of how a lifelong friendship can change the course of history. eddy jacobson and harry truman ran a has been dashry together in kansas city in the early 1920s. it failed but they stayed best friends. truman later became president. one day, eddy gets a phone call in 1948 saying, harry truman is not seeing the key to truman deciding whether to recognize an independent state of israel. he flies across the country. he walks into the oval office unannounced, uninvited and has a knock-down, drag-out fight with his best friend harry truman. he never asked for anything from harry truman before. he said you owe it to him to see him. you know what you have to do here. truman turns his back on him, ponders the question, swivels back around and says, all right, you bald headed son of a b, i'll

see him. he sees him. two months later, harry truman is the first foreign leader to recognize the independent foreign state of israel. what a remarkable story. >> really. it's all in this fascinating book. again, the book is called "first friends: the powerful unsung and unelected people who shaped our presidents." gary ginsburg, thank you so much. >> thank you for having me. he was sentenced to 60 years in prison. but he didn't commit the crime. one man's story from wrongful conviction to exoneration up next. lar movie night. but if you're a kid with diabetes, it's more. it's the simple act of enjoying time with friends, knowing you understand your glucose levels. ♪ at philadelphia, we know what makes the perfect schmear of cream cheese. you need only the freshest milk and cream. that one! and the world's best, and possibly only, schmelier.

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tonight, a bill in congress aims to increase the amount of federal compensation that's paid to americans wrongfully convicted of crimes. supporters looking to raise the current $50,000 per year of incarceration to $70,000 per

year of incarceration. an advocacy group says more than 2,800 americans have been wrongfully convicted. and that includes this man who spent nearly nine years behind bars. in a few moments we'll meet him and the two women who fought for his incarcerations. first, cnn's joe johns with the story. >> 19 years old at the time got stopped by police in the street of new orleans. november 2012. he's got a gun, and he starts to gun. the gun falls out of his pocket. he says he carries it for protection because he's had friends who got shot. turns out there has been a robbery in the same neighborhood 18 hours earlier and police think riley fits the description. riley says he didn't do it and he was nowhere close at the time. >> at the time of the robbery, i was in a hotel about eight miles from where it occurred. >> but police got the robbery

victim to take a look at him and only him. the victim identifies his gun as the weapon that was used. he gets locked up and because he has a previous conviction on a drug charge, he's classified as a repeat offender. at trial at 19 years old, he gets 60 years in prison with no parole, even though there were enormous flaws in his case. flaw number one, the way police single him out as a suspect. he is brought to a garage alone handcuffed where the victim waited in a car. during reported jailhouse telephone calls with his lawyer, he says police set him up and made him look guilty. >> with the identification, they had a light flash in my face for 15 minutes. >> plus, the victim is white. he is black. cross racial identifications of criminal defendants are notoriously unreliable. flaw number two in the case,

riley tells his lawyers again and again that security cameras at the hotel where he was staying could prove he was nowhere near the robbery. >> during the time the armed robbery occurred it was 4:00 in the morning. at this time i was on camera. >> his lawyers wait three weeks and don't get the recordings from the right time of day. ultimately they are recorded over. and maybe the biggest flaw of all. at trial, one of the jurors abstains from the vote. at the time, louisiana was one of only two states that allowed criminal convictions without a unanimous verdict. that rule has since been changed. all of which made the new new orleans parish district attorney see an unfair case with flimsy evidence that needed to be thrown out. previous prosecutors said no further review was required. >> it had all the things. it covered everything from the fragility of misidentification, cross racial identification.

it had failures of following best practices with regards to proper identifications that are reliable. it had excessive sentencing. it had the common place nature in which we throw away black men and boys with very little facts, very little evidence. >> almost everything that could have gone wrong for him did. and it took almost a miracle to overturn his conviction. it cost him nearly nine years of his life. laura? >> joe johns, thank you. we've got riley along with the two women who helped overturn his wrongful conviction, emily and laura. stay with us. they will tell us the rest of the story next. e talk to my manager." next, carvana's 100% online shopping experience. oh, man. carvana lets people buy a car-- get this-- from their couch. oh, how disruptive. no salesman there to help me

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the story of utico riley. he was freed after two women picked up the torch in fighting for his exoneration. joining me now, utico bradley and the writer about the case. and her sister. utico, emily, laura, i'm so glad you're here to share this story. utico i want to start with you. you fought nearly nine years for your innocence. the justice system failed you at every single turn. did you ever lose hope that you one day would be exonerated? >> i'm going to be honest with

you, laura. at times, the whole, it never was lost, clearly i never just gave up. >> what kept you going? >> it's just, i mean a number of things, but like just the most thing i can say, like,ki never get comfortable in that environment, like, like the environment that i was in. i could never fit in. like i always stuck out. >> well, you stuck out, yutico, because you did not commit the crime, right? the idea that you were there and just that profound statement of not being able to get used to. emily, yutico reached out to you for help in a letter that you may have missed, frankly, if it hadn't been flagged to you by a librarian. you get a lot of letters, i'm

assuming. what made you believe that yutico was innocent? >> i read this letter, and it was very clear, first what struck me was three got a 60 year sentence when he was 19 for an armed robbery in which no one was physically injured. that part of the case distressed me. and he was making a clak aim ab innocence, his conviction was based on an identification by one witness, a cross racial identification, a white person identifying a black person. those tend to be less reliable. here is someone who is trying so hard to be heard and somebody needs to look into this. i was incredibly lucky to be able to ask my sister, who has won an exoneration for someone before as an attorney to take a really close look at this case. >> i mean, amazing, laura, that you were the sister, right, you

took yuico's case. it raised the show-up identifications. yutico was handcuffed already. they were trying to get them to identify him. and at that time louisiana allowed criminal convictions without even a unanimous verdict. and then you had bad lawyering, as you've spoken about. was the justice system just totally stacked against yutico? >> it was 100% stacked, and you listed the trifecta of things that contributed to his wrongful conviction. when my sister asked me to look at this case, initially, i was reluctant, i'd never been there, i thought what could i possibly do? then i realized about ten minute no minutes into reviewing this case that he was innocent.

and i will say that his case is really a lot about the power of local elections. before a new lawyer and d.a., it wouldn't change. it's only that the people in power changed. >> yutico, your original lawyer never established your al ibi. getting the wrong video from the hotel where you were staying, you could have been cleared. the ball was dropped in not even finding the friend were you with at the hotel. they never pressed the prosecution witnesses about discrepancies in how you looked and how the actual robber looked? you had a beard at the time. you knew the truth here. when you looked at this and realized they weren't fighting for you in a way they should

have, what does that feel like? >> it, it's just, it makes me think, like, what is the importance of one person's life, like? you know, to the lawyer? or to the judge or, you know, like, what is the importance of the human life? cause when we look at the case, it's like, to say the stakes were so high, like look, look at the performance, look what happened to say that my life was on the line. >> do you that i racism played a part here? >> oh, of course. when my, when the judge loss to ms. harris, to judge harris, he made a remark, and he basically said that all you had to do was be black or be a woman to like

win the lelection, like basicaly saying ms. harris wasn't even qualified, you know, like, as i was standing as the judge that she is, all she had to do was be black, so that was the judge. so that's, you know. >> just the idea, yutico that they're making statements that demonstrated to you that you were not as valued as a human being, and you can just see the way in which, the way this case has played out, i mean year after year after year, it really is shocking, and i'm so grateful to have a chance to speak to each and every one of you. yutico, i'll let you have "the last word" here,. what do you want people to know about you, mr. briley? >> i want people to know that, i'm, you can't, you can't, one

of all, you can't judge a book by its cover. >> yeah. >> you can't judge a person of a record or a piece of paper or something that someone describes them as, like, you know, like, you got to get to know me. like for all those years i was judge the by what somebody said about me, or i was judged by how this judge described me when he sentenced me. and that's how i was treated. so with that being said, it's like, you know, everything is just so deeper than the surface. it's just so easy to look at the surface of something and judge it, you know, like you say, judging a book by its cover, when. >> yeah. >> you have to make your own judgment. >> well, yutico, mr. briley, we

see you, we see you now, and we always should have, and it was a pleasure speaking with you and all of you. i thank you for taking the time. and i thank all of you for watching. our coverage continues. . ♪ it's the easiest because it's the cheesiest. kraft. for the win win.

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