thanks for being with us, tonight. it's time for the big show, "don lemon tonight," with its big star, don lemon. i'll tell you, the pictures look bad. >> yep. >> there's no question about it. >> wait, hold on, hold on, hold on, before we get to that. i -- i -- this is when i usually tell you happy birthday and whatever and joke around. and i want to say happy birthday. i cannot joke around with you tonight because there is so much serious news going on. so i will just say happy birthday. it's great to have you back. you're a partner here, and i'm just happy to have you back cause nobody bounces off each other, between shows, like you and i do. now, go on. >> i love you, d lemon. >> i love you, brother. >> um, i don't think that it is usually our position to put pressure on the administration to do certain things. however, -- >> right. >> -- every read from the ground is consistent. if the biden administration does not find a way to fix the problem of abandoning people, who put their lives on the line

for american-fighting men and women, it will be a stain on this administration, forever. >> i don't disagree with that. >> i know that there's some political pushback. and there's some people on the trumpy fringe trying to make it, like, look at the people he wants to bring here. these are men and women. talk to our veterans. listen to our veterans, about what they did for this country and for our fighting men and women. and now, they're going to be left there and they are going to be hunted down like dogs. >> i think it's -- i -- i agree with what you said. but i think it's too early to judge what's going to happen. we don't know what's going to happen. the exit? yeah. those pictures are horrific. no one can deny the situation that happened at the airport there. and the -- the -- the pictures that we're seeing and what we're hearing from our folks who are there, happening on the ground. but i think, let's see. it's going to take some time to figure out if it was a right move, at the right time. but no one can deny, this has been through four administrations. and um, you know, he said he

didn't want a fifth administration to inherit this. so, the -- before this happened, about 70% of americans, and even folks who were enlisted, wanted us to get out of afghanistan. so, i -- i -- i think most people think it was the right move. it -- the execution may be wrong but, i think, over time, we will see what the fallout is. and that's -- you know, we can't do that until we keep moving and living. >> look, we've lived it. you and i have been there for the whole course of it. i've been there. i've been to every place in the region that we've been. um, i think it's a completely separate decision. leaving, the way we did and leaving those people behind, if we don't find a way to get them out, and it should have been done, first. he has to fix that part. it is the only american thing to do. it will last a generation, don. we've made this mistake, before. >> yeah. >> we've left that place worse, before. and we can't do it, again. you have to take care of the people, who take care of you. >> you play the sound byte of

that with john mccain and barack obama when they were running against each other. and now, we see what happened. it got us in deeper, as you said. i got to run. i got a lot of news, as you know. good to have you back. i love you. happy birthday. i will see you later. >> i love you, d lemon. >> this is "don lemon tonight." and you know what? there's no way to put it. sugarcoat it. the words are harsh and they should be. they should be harsh. words like chaos, debacle, disaster, even comparisons to the fall of saigon, for those of you who are old enough to remember that. that is the only way to describe what we are seeing, right now, in afghanistan. and what we have seen. gut wrenching. that's the word that president joe biden used, today. gut wrenching. scenes at kabul's airports, as crowds of people risked their lives trying to climb onto planes, and planes going anywhere, trying to escape the taliban. look at the pictures. it's undeniable. it's an awful spectacle, this fall of kabul. and the political firestorm at home as the president defends

his decision to end america's longest war. >> i stand squarely behind my decision. after 20 years, i've learned, the hard way, that there was never a good time to withdraw u.s. forces. that's why we're, still, there. we were clear eyed about the risks. we planned for every contingency. but i always promised the american people that i will be straight with you. the truth is this did unfold more quickly than we had anticipated. so, what's happened? afghanistan political leaders gave up and fled the country. the afghan military collapsed. sometime, without trying to fight. if anything, the developments of the past week reinforce that any

u.s. m ending u.s. military involvement in afghanistan now was the right decision. >> now, the fact is, this is a case where multiple things can be true, at the same time. the president can be making the right decision about ending the war, but executing that decision in the wrong way. >> i will not mislead the american people by claiming that just a little more time in afghanistan will make all the difference. nor, will i shrink from my share of responsibility for where we are today and how we must move forward from here. i am president of the united states of america and the buck stops with me. >> the buck stops here. he says the buck stops with him. taking responsibility. that's important, except you can't really say the buck stops with me, if you don't really take the blame. president biden pointed the finger at afghans, themselves. he said didn't want to leave earlier and that afghan -- the afghan government, he said, wanted to avoid a crisis of

confidence. afghan-political leaders, who fled the country. the afghan military. >> i know there are concerns about why we did not begin evacuating afghans civilians sooner. part of the answer is some of the aftghans did not want to leave earlier. still, hopeful for their country. and part of it because the afghan government and its supporters discouraged us from organizing a mass exodus to avoid triggering, as they said, a crisis of confidence. >> okay. so, let's say all that is true. even if -- if all of that is true, the big question is, now what? now what? what happens, now? the president says that he's going to evacuate thousands of people, through the kabul airport. he says that he's going to use devastating force against the taliban, if necessary. so, how is he going to do that without combat? how is he going to save thousands of people? these are real questions.

thousands of people, like these, in images that are becoming the face of the fall of afghanistan. crowds on the tarmac, actually, trying to hold onto a u.s. air force cargo plane trying to take off. and the terrible and disturbing videos of what may be people falling to the ground, as the plane takes off. remember those images that we had to stop showing? people said they were too harsh from 9/11 of people falling from buildings. you cannot help be reminded of those images of people falling from those buildings, the world trade center, nearly 20 years ago. that's what started all of this. and i -- i just want you to look at this. okay? it's another image of the death, of the chaos in afghanistan, and what is driving desperate people -- what it's driving people to do. they're desperate. this is a photo. it's inside a u.s. air force c17 from defense one. you can see the cargo plane is

absolutely jammed with some-640 men, women, children. even what, it looks like, some of them babies. defense one reports that the crew didn't intend to take on so many people. but instead of trying to force them off the plane, they decided to take them with them. 640 people on a plane that is designed to seat only 134 soldiers with their equipment. that's how desperate people in afghanistan are. and like i said, it can be the right decision, but executed the wrong way. executed in a way that threw the country and its people into chaos. just listen to what president biden said, only a few weeks ago. >> the likelihood there's going to be a taliban overrunning everything and owning the whole country is highly unlikely. >> that was only-six weeks ago. that's how fast afghanistan fell.

and it was only six weeks ago, the president was insisting that this would be nothing like the fall of saigon. >> the taliban is not the -- the north vietnamese army. they're not -- they're not remotely comparable, in terms of capability. there's going to be no circumstance where you are going to see people being lifted off the roof of a embassy of the united states from afghanistan. it is not, at all, comparable. >> so, you -- you need to see saigon, right, to see the comparison. more iconic images. saigon, on the left. kabul, on the right. leave 'em up, for a minute. saigon, on the left. kabul, on the right. just last month, in our "cnn town hall," president joe biden said bringing afghans here, who helped the american military, is the decent thing to do. >> what i do say is the one place you may heard that i am

talking about more immigrants coming in are those folks from afghanistan, who help the american soldiers. who will be -- they and their family will be victimized, very badly, as a consequence of what happens if they're left behind. and so, we're providing for them to be able to see whether they qualify to meet the special requirement to be able to come to the united states as a refugee and as, ultimately, earning citizenship here. it seems to me, it's the only decent thing that we can do. >> okay. so, listen. just to -- to go back to what chris and i were talking about. here is the fact. joe biden's not the only one. he is not the first-american president to be tripped up by afghanistan. plenty of blame to go around. it has been 20 years. it is america's longest war. a war that bedeviled four presidents. >> in afghanistan, we removed an oppressive regime that harbored the terrorists who planned the

attacks that killed 3,000 folks on september the 11th, 2001. because of our men and women in uniform, more than 25 million afghans are free. afghanistan is a democracy. an ally in the war on terror. and as a result of your courage, the american people are safer. >> this month, after more than 13 years, our combat mission in afghanistan will be over. this month, america's war in afghanistan will come to a responsible end. now, that doesn't mean everything's great in afghanistan. afghanistan's still a very dangerous place. but i want you and every american who has served in afghanistan to be proud of what you've accomplished there. >> but we're talking about 19 years, we've been there. 19 years. and other presidents have tried to do this. the taliban has given a pledge

and a very strong pledge and we'll see how that all works out. we hope it's going to work out very well. >> well, the next year, joe biden's predecessor signed a peace treaty with the taliban. and his secretary of state met with the taliban leader, who is now the face of afghanistan's leaders. funny, some people don't seem to remember that, do they? like, the republican national committee slamming president joe biden, today, for withdrawing from afghanistan when it was the former guy, who made the deal to pull american troops out, in may. like i said, there is plenty of blame to go around here. the words i said at the beginning. chaos, debacle, disaster. the exit? those words, still, apply. we'll see what happens, after this. you can make the right decision, but you can execute it the wrong way.

and the question is, as we say in the vernacular, now what? or as some would say, what happens now? so, we are going to get the latest on the ground now, in afghanistan, from cnn's international security editor, nick paton walsh, who is in kabul for us. nick. >> don, the pentagon really doubled down today on the idea they can get maybe 30,000, 20,000 afghans who have worked with u.s. forces here, out of the country. in some, frankly, miraculous evacuation effort. the scenes i saw today at the airport, i think it's going to be an incredibly difficult, if not impossible, task. the taliban are actually at the main-airport entrance doing what you might call crowd control. pushing people back. using vehicles that they have taken off the afghan security forces, paid for by america, to try and keep people away from the number of gates. but there are hundreds of afghans, we saw, surging towards gates. some trying to climb over the walls. utter chaos and not much better inside the airfield.

videos we have seen there of people running across the tarmac trying to grab c17 cargo aircraft in the hope that, perhaps, they could cling on altitude long enough to reach destination. shocking scenes, really, at the place that defined america's billions of investment in kabul. they used so frequently by american staff to be overrun by so many afghans desperate just to try and get a flight out. civilian flights cancelled. though, it's the u.s. military that are running things, at the moment. and we hear them in the skies, above us. but it's going to be an exceptionally difficult task, don, in the weeks ahead for the u.s. to fulfill its promise, given the chaos we have seen there. unless they get some sort of deal, frankly, with the taliban who run kabul, at this stage, and manage to get those afghans who, probably, the taliban have a grudge against because they were assisting the u.s. presence. and somehow, get them out of the city to the airport. i can't see how those targets can get met, don. >> thank you very much. i appreciate that. president biden is not backing down tonight from his decision to withdrawal american

troops from afghanistan, despite the chaos of the fall of kabul. what will happen, now? >> here's what i believe to my core. it is wrong to order american troops to step up when afghanistan's own armed forces would not.

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so, president joe biden addressing the nation, today, about the chaos in afghanistan. saying that he stands squarely behind his decision to withdraw u.s. troops but, also, admitting the collapse of the afghan government and the taliban easily retaking control of the country. it happened a lot faster than the administration anticipated. so i want to bring in, now, cnn's pentagon correspondent, oren liebermann, and white house correspondent, jeremy diamond. gentlemen, good evening to you. jeremy, let's start with you. you are at the white house tonight to give us the latest with the president. he is defiant. standing by his decision to withdraw. but what we didn't hear is how his administration fails to anticipate the fiasco in kabul. and then, breaking tonight, he is now issuing an executive order on resettling afghan refugees. update us on this, please. >> yeah, that's right, don. president biden, this evening, authorizing the use of up to

$500 million in funds for the united states emergency refugee and migration assistance fund. and this is to help with the migration of many of those afghans, who are desperately trying to leave kabul right now. to, ultimately, resettle here, in the united states. we do know that there are tens of thousands of prospective special immigrant visa applicants, who are waiting and hoping to try and get to the united states. this includes some of those interpreters, who have worked with the united states over those nearly-two decades of the u.s.'s war effort in afghanistan. and listen. that was what we heard from president biden, today. was talking about the fact that that is going to be the sole focus of the u.s. mission in afghanistan, right now, where about-6,000 troops are soon to be on the ground. several thousand of those have, already, arrived in country. focus on holding that airport in kabul. and getting those afghans to the airport and onto planes, off to the united states. some of them, potentially, to third-party countries. but you're right, don.

in terms of what we heard -- the united states missed how quickly the taliban would advance. we, still, have not heard, from president biden, um, why, exactly, that is. what was the failure here? we have had officials here at the white house tell us this was not an intelligence failure. you heard something very similar from the pentagon spokesman, john kirby, today. but ultimately, you know, those are the questions that -- that remain unanswered here and president biden is going to have to answer for that, at some point. we, certainly, will be able to pose those questions to the national security adviser, jake sullivan, tomorrow as he is set to brief reporters from the white house. >> jeremy, perhaps, that is his answer, though. that -- that the afghan forces just didn't hold up? is that -- could that just be the answer for -- for the president? >> the question then becomes why didn't the u.s. realize that was going to be the case, right? and i think that there's,

obviously, a lot of experts who didn't see this coming. but there are, also, some experts who did see this coming. some people who served in the military who said, of course, this was going to happen. of course, the willpower was going to disappear, especially once they lost that critical-u.s. air support, as well as those u.s. defense contractors who have been helping to maintain the afghan air force once the united states wound down its presence there. >> let's bring oren in, from the pentagon. oren, you can weigh in on this and also as we are talking, i want to bring up this photo of the more than 600 afghans inside a military cargo plane. it's an extraordinary event. extraordinary picture to look at. they represent just a fraction of the afghans trying to evade the brutal regime there. what is the pentagon saying, tonight, about their efforts to keep people -- to get people out and this crisis happening in kabul? >> well, first, let's take a look at that photo because it speaks so much to the despair, the panic, the -- the utter chaos of afghan civilians now trying to flee what is no longer just afghanistan but is soon to be the islamic emirate afghanistan under the taliban. the flag that we have known for

20 years as the flag of afghanistan, very much, possibly, no longer the flag of that country and that is what these people are fleeing. cramming onto an airplane. men, women, and children. just to try to get the heck out of there. out of kabul international airport which is, probably, the most valuable piece of real estate in the country right now because it's, pretty much, the only way in and out of the airport. and as that was happening, just on one u.s. c17, there were thousands-more afghans outside the airplane, at the -- at the airport, itself, trying to get out of the country. for the u.s., the primary mission here is to secure the airport. it requires security. a stable situation at the airport to get flights going in and out. although this is, certainly, an international airport, this isn't something like a newark or atlanta with two runways and plenty of space on the ground to move airplanes around. there is limited space. it is the key, perhaps the only limiting faster on how fast the u.s. can get people in and out. at maximum capacity, it will be 5,000 people a day. the problem is the u.s. isn't at that capacity, yet. and until it gets there, moving

people becomes incredibly difficult. first, of course, it's u.s. embassy personnel. is and then, all the afghan interpreters and their families, who are desperate to get out of afghanistan right now. >> yeah. much more rudimentary airport. not as sophisticated as the airports here, certainly not as much space and they can't facilitate it as quickly. oren, appreciate your reporting. jeremy, you as well. thank you, gentlemen. scenes of desperation. taliban fighters in control of american-military equipment. my next guest, a former-u.s. ambassador to afghanistan, says what's happened is an absolute disaster.

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tonight, president biden facing heavy criticism for how his administration has handled the withdrawal of u.s. troops from afghanistan. the country, now, enveloped in chaos, with the collapse of the government and the taliban reestablishing control. joining me, now, is ronald neumann, a former u.s. ambassador to afghanistan. ambassador, thank you for joining us. important subject. and the pivotal time in our history here. you called the execution of this withdrawal an absolute disaster. how precarious is the situation there, right now, for u.s. forces? because this feels like it could go sideways, at any moment. >> well, it's a very, very bad situation, right now.

you know, we're not going to reestablish ourselves in afghanistan. we have a very large commitment to a variety of afghans, interpreters. i think we, also, need to focus on the fact that there are a lot of embassy people, there are a lot of people who worked for usaid, for -- contractors for aid, they also need to be gotten out. you were talking, earlier in the program, about the limited capacity of kabul airport. >> uh-huh. >> so, it's pretty clear that, to meet the commitments that president biden has, already, made, we are going to have to have an operation that extends beyond the end of the month. and we need a clear policy. we need, obviously, to be a part of getting kabul airport functioning, again, so that commercial aircraft can get in and take off some of the load. so, there's -- there are some big questions that are, still,

unanswered. president biden spent a lot of time in his speech with his defense of his policies. some of which, i agree with. some of which, i don't. but -- um -- he was very short on details about how we were going to implement his policy. he, also, has not -- and nobody in the administration has said anything about our contacts with the taliban, recently, that were led by the ambassador. what is it we have agreed with them? have we agreed to anything? are we -- punches because of this or not? i think the american people deserve an answer to whether or not we have agreements with the taliban. >> let's -- let's talk about practicalities. let's be practical here because you were saying some of what you agreed with, some of which you were not. okay. you don't agree with. understandable. but the question is, right, how -- how are we gonna get the afghan friends out? and i understand that you have gotten calls from afghan friends trying to get out. what are they saying to you, sir? >> well, they're pretty

desperate. of course, people are very afraid. we'll see -- i hope we won't see, over time, that their fears are justified. right now, there is a huge problem that the airport is surrounded by a mixture of crowds and taliban. and so, a lot of people that are on our list to get out cannot get to the airport. now, that, we cannot wholly solve, by ourselves. we're gonna have to work with afghans. maybe, even with the taliban. in order to control that situation. i hope the taliban will see it as in their interest to let a lot of people, who don't want to be there, go out. we'll find out about that. in terms of kabul airport, i think there is going to need to be a u.n.-led effort to control the airport. very few people are -- who want out -- are going to trust the taliban. >> uh-huh. >> and frankly, we don't want to be the only security force at the airport. so, that, to me, says the u.n.

is going to have to have a role. it needs to be an international role in keeping the airport open and getting people out. and i hope we will move toward that. >> i think the most obvious question is, ambassador neumann, is, you know, the president said they couldn't anticipate -- they didn't anticipate the afghan -- the taliban's ability to sweep the country. if they couldn't anticipate that, to do in just over a week, how will we have eyes on any, potential terror activity when we have pulled out, completely? >> well, i don't think we will. i mean, we'll have some intelligence sources. remember, it was only a couple of years ago that we found that al qaeda base that had been established for six months, when we were there with a lot of people and a lot of intelligence resources and drones and everything. so, even when we were there, in force, there were limits to our intelligence capacity. i think, now, those limits are going to be much, much higher. and recently, you had reports by

the u.n., by as well as by our own intelligence agencies that al qaeda is still there in the country. the administration is, pretty much, silent on those reports. it doesn't want to talk about them. >> so, americans evacuated the -- the u.s. embassy. russia and china, still, have presence there. what does that say to you about the future? what does that bode for the future? >> well, i think, the first thing it says is that our threats, the taliban saying, you know, if you don't cooperate, you won't have international recognition, are going to be seen by the taliban as pretty toothless. we may not recognize them. the chinese, clearly, will do so. probably, the russians. the iranians. variety of other powers. so, i don't think we have a lot of leverage. we've given up most of our leverage, and so it's a little feckless to talk about how we're

going to have this strong-diplomatic effort, after we give away most of the elements that would make any diplomatic effort strong. >> you -- you wrote something, last month, about how ousted-afghan president ashraf ghani told you that he had a strategy for supporting and leading the resistance to the taliban. but then, he cut and ran. should the u.s. government have seen that coming? >> i think we could have seen some of it coming. i -- you know, this is a long, complicated subject. probably, more than you got time for. but i think, you know, let's -- let's step back, a second. the bumper sticker is the afghan army wouldn't fight. now, the afghan army's been carrying the burden of the fight for at least the last-three years. we have not been engaged, on the ground. the afghans have had thousands of casualties. we had 12, 15 last couple of years. the last year, we had none. so the afghan army was fighting. not all of them, well.

question is why they quit fighting. and some of that is, clearly, the problems of kabul, the infighting, the corruption. but i think there is, also, a big piece of that, which is the collapse of morale. and we were a big part of that, really, over a lengthy period. first, with the peace agreement where many afghans felt we were, already, giving up on the country. pushed the afghan government to release 5,000 prisoners, many of who returned to the battlefield. excluded them from the agreement in doha. and then, decided on a troop withdrawal. and remember, when president biden gave his speech about the withdrawal, he talked about two other elements. one of which was really key, and that was continuing support for the afghan military. >> right. >> we had no plan for that. and then, we proceeded to pull out not the 2,500 or 3,000 troops but, also, about 15,000

contractors who are absolutely key to keeping the afghan air force functioning, the supply system functioning. so that the -- what the afghans were seeing was abandonment. and i think that's not the only reason for the collapse of morale. but it's a big piece of it. and i wrote about this in several of my colleagues, former ambassadors wrote about this in the last weeks. saying that we needed to take a number of actions that we described, in order to give credibility to the sense that we would continue to provide the support president biden promised. we did not take any of those actions. so, the collapse of afghan morale is an afghan phenomenon but it's, also, a responsibility of the u.s., one which i think the administration is continuing to dodge. >> ambassador neumann, thank you. you have given us some great insight. thac thank you so much. i appreciate it. >> you are most welcome. president biden says that he doesn't regret his decision to leave afghanistan.

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the president, today, unapologetic about the u.s. withdrawal from afghanistan. today, he says staying isn't in the national interest. >> so, i'm left, again, to ask of those who argue that we should stay, how many more generations of americans' daughters and sons would you have me send to fight afghans -- afghanistan's civil war? when afghan troops will not. i will not repeat the mistakes we've made, in the past. mistake of staying and fighting, indefinitely, in a conflict that is not in the national interest of the united states.

>> matthew dowd is here. he is the former-chief strategist for president george w. bush and the author of "revelations on the river." matthew, i appreciate you joining me to talk about this. thousands of american lives have been lost. trillions of dollars, spent, in this conflict. as of just a few weeks ago, 55% of americans, 55% said that they approved of biden's handling of the withdrawal. and even before that, just getting out, the numbers were higher than that for people who approved us getting out of afghanistan. do you think that's still going to be the case, after today? >> um, well, i think, on -- on -- on -- on the whether or not we should have gotten out, it'll still be 70% plus and i think it will cross republican, democrat, and independent. that will stay true because, i think, the american public is exhausted by this. and they were sold a bill of goods, as you know, from the very beginning, under bush, who i worked for, about why we were going in there. and 20 years later, we were still in there. so, i think, they still want to see us out of here.

i think he'll probably -- i mean, not to look at this politically, in the midst of this crisis situation in afghanistan. he -- he will, probably, drop some just because of the pictures and everything they're seeing on -- on his ability to handle this. but do i think this will be an issue, in a potential re-election for him? or even in the midterms? absolutely not. the american public wanted us out of there. and we're getting out of there, actually, way later than the american public wanted us. >> you know, the president spoke about the people of afghanistan needing to fight for their country. do you think trying to install democracy, top-down, in that country was ever going to work? was that ever, really, our mission? was to restore democracy, top down? >> well, don, that's -- i think that's a great question and if you look at the expansive history, it never works. democracies and building a country up only works, from the bottom up. we've seen it in our country, in the revolution. we've seen it throughout history in vietnam, it didn't work when we went in there.

and instant -- in iraq, it hasn't worked when we have gone in there thinking we're going to put in place a regime or a nation and build a nation around democracy. if the people there aren't asking for it and demanding it, and actually fighting for it, you're never going to be able to do it from outside. and that's why we get in these situations where when we go and force our way -- our way -- our way of government on another country who is, either, not ready for it, or whose citizens aren't hungry enough and demanding it enough, then it's not gonna work and that's why we are where we are at today. >> look. i guess, i don't know if you can still call it a budding democracy but afghan -- afghanistan's budding democracy is in tatters, now. but january 6th proved ours isn't as strong as we had hoped or we thought. house speaker nancy pelosi, hinting today to sitting congressmen could be investigated. watch this. >> two of them were outrageous. i mean, they -- they probably -- well, we'll see what the committee finds out about them.

but they are not going to be on the committee. there would be antics and claims and not serious about this. and still, participants in the big lie. >> so, look. we know she is talking about. about trump allies gjim banks ad jim jordan. both of whom, she rejected on serving on the committee that could be investigated them. what does this say about our democracy? >> well, that's the point i have been trying to make over the last 48 hours is, is yes, what's happening in afghanistan is tragic. but what's even more tragic is our inability to preserve the democracy we have here. we are trying to install a democracy and we have been trying to install a democracy in a place that doesn't, necessarily, want it. and obviously, their leaders weren't even willing to stay in the country and fight for it. but here, we are fighting over our own democracy that is at a fragile point in our country's history. and what we need to do to preserve it. and i would just say, people that are putting up pictures of the taliban in certain, you know, meeting rooms or whatever. i still remember and it's still visceral, to me, the confederate

flag being -- being raised at the u.s. capitol, not many months ago. so, i think, we should keep our eye on the ball. we should focus on it because, if the most tragic thing that could happen to the world, to our country, and to all of us is not what's happening in afghanistan. but is losing our democracy, here, that will have a much more profound effect on the world than what is happening in afghanistan. and that's, i think, where we fundamentally need to keep the focus on. >> well, look. and you said, the people inside the capitol and with their feet up on the speaker's desk and on and on. listen. and also, on that -- on this subject, of keeping -- keeping us together. the pandemic is surging, again. the way, you know, in a way that seemed unthinkable just two months ago. the department of homeland security is warning of violence here, at home, within the next few weeks. and much of the president's agenda has been slow going through congress. is president biden better off focused on issues here, at home, right now? >> well, i think president biden

and i actually thought his speech was well done, today. i think there was some logistical problems that, obviously, weren't orchestrated well. and i think they're going to have to figure out how to fix those to make sure they can save as many lives as possible and us leaving. but i think joe biden understands that what is most -- of most concern to the world, don, is that our democracy here and what's happening here, including our public-health problem. we have lost more people today, yesterday, and the day before, because of the pandemic and because of bad decisions by political leaders. almost all, exclusively, gop-political leaders, than we have lost in afghanistan over the last year or the last year and a half. so let us not forget that. and the other thing i will say is, seven presidents have been involved in this afghanistan thing in modern times, dating back to ronald reagan. seven presidents. the person least responsible for what is happening, today, is joe biden. the other six presidents, primarily george w. bush, is responsible for what we're

facing in afghanistan, today, not joe biden. >> and you were an adviser to -- >> president george w. bush. >> matthew dowd, thank you, sir. i appreciate you joining. thank you. >> thank you. i want to make sure that you know about "we love new york city." it is the homecoming concert. so make sure you join me. this is a once-in-a-lifetime concert event. it's this saturday, starting at 5:00 p.m., exclusively on cnn. we'll be right back. icy hot. ice works fast. heat makes it last. feel the power of contrast therapy, so you can rise from pain. - that moment you walk in the office and people are wearing the same gear, you feel a sense of connectedness and belonging right away. and our shirts from custom ink help bring us together. - [narrator] custom ink has hundreds of products to help you feel connected. upload your logo or start your design today at customink.com

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so we have got some breaking news tonight on covid booster shots and when you should get one. this is coming tonight just now from the white house, so let's get to our white house correspondent. kaitlan collins joins us by phone. what are you learning about these covid vaccine boosters for most americans? >> reporter: hi, don. this is something of course that many people have been waiting to final o-- find out.

so far officials have said americans do not need a booster at this point. but we are learning now as soon as this week, top health officials in the biden administration could announce they are recommending boosters for most americans. and the way this would work and the ideas they're coalescing around right now is americans should get a booster shot eight months after becoming fully vaccinated. and currently this guidance is revolving around those of us who got two-dose vaccine shots. they are still compiling data for the johnson & johnson vaccine and whether those people need booster shots. but right now we are expecting this week that they could recommend most americans to get a booster shot eight months after becoming fully vaccinated. and, don, we should note that the plan right now would start in mid to late september, but all of thi