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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  August 24, 2021 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT

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kate? >> nick, it is one horrific story on top of another. each story is worse. i really can't even believe it coming out of tennessee. thank you for your reporting and your compassion. i really appreciate it. >> you bet. thank you so much for being with us tonight. i'm kate bolduan. 360 starts now. rescuing afghans and european afghans from kabul. this afternoon more than 70,000 people have been airlifted out in just the last ten days. that is an extraordinary number and a far cry from how this began in utter chaos. by the same token, it's also just seven days from the president's self-imposed deadline which he recommitted to this evening. >> we are currently on a pace to finish by august the 31st. the sooner we can finish, the better. each day of operations brings added risk to our troops, but
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the completion by august 31st depends on the taliban continuing to cooperate, allowing access to the airport for those who were transporting out and no disruptions to our operations. in addition, i've asked the pentagon and the state department for contingency plans to adjust the timetable should that become necessary. >> as for what would make that necessary to stay longer, the president did not elaborate. he did, however, warn that each day on the ground increases the risk to americans and american forces, including isis-k militants who are targeting the airport. he did not say that it was blocking afghans who wanted to flee from getting to the airport. nor did he do what lawmakers on both sides of the aisle wanted. he did not commit to stay until they all got out. he did not say how many remained, but instead said
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antony blinken would supply that information tomorrow. he additionally said that the number when the evacuation began was probably lower than most people believe because, quote, a lot left in the final few weeks. we also learned late today that even as the race to get others out goes on, the pullout of american troops has already begun, a defense official telling cnn this isn't affecting the mission, that official adding that the local commander can decide which personnel are no longer required based on the number of gates open at the airport, the number of people coming through and a number of other factors. we have more now from kaitlan collins who joins us from the white house. do you know what went on behind the scenes that led to this decision by the president? >> anderson, there were very few who think they can meet the deadline to get them out of afghanistan. that presence is going to get a lot smaller than the thousands of troops that it is right now with this drawdown and they're
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trying to meet this deadline a week from today, essentially. president biden said today the longer the troops stay there, the higher the threat of a potential terrorist attack by isis-k, by another organization becomes. that was really the driving force by president biden wanting to meet this august 31st deadline. he is also concerned about the location of the taliban. it seems surprising but that's what's so critical about getting those 70,000 people you were talking about out, because they're at the checkpoint, even though a lot of people going to the checkpoint in days past have been fleeing the taliban. that was the attitude inside the white house. they did not want to extend this deadline. it's certainly not what we heard from world leaders, including some of the ones president biden spoke with today or even some democratic lawmakers. democrats like jason crow, a former army ranger, who says he doesn't think this is enough time to get those afghan allies who helped the u.s. out in time. he just thinks it's enough time
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to get americans out which, of course, we know is the president's number one priority. >> what do we know about the people left behind? >> they are allies for a part of two decades. i think the concern is, yes, we have a deadline of seven days from now when the u.s. has to be out of afghanistan, but jen psaki said the actual deadline of when those evacuations are going to start is actually much sooner than that. they have a period where they can start these evacuations and then they have to start on the thousands of troops that are still there, the machines, the weaponry that's still there, and that could likely take several days. that's a factor in it. it's a question of once those u.s. troops are out, is anyone else going to get out? that seems to be a massive concern by these lawmakers of what it's going to look like if
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the u.s. is able to get out. we still don't know who is going to run kabul when they get out by august 31st. a lot of big questions in these last seven days. >> the plan when the taliban took over was that turkey would maintain troops to keep the airport open. obviously it's unclear to me that is going to continue. it seems highly unlikely at this point. but i think you made an important point that hasn't gotten a lot of attention, that just getting the u.s. troops who are currently at the airport and the equipment. i mean, there's helicopters, there's vehicles, getting that equipment out, that may take days. >> right. and the threat gets higher the fewer troops are there. that's a big concern for the white house. and they're also worried a sense of panic could set in among the afghans who are still there and see that window for getting out closing as they know the united states is leaving. so i think it could be a precarious few days here, so it's getting about 6,000 troops out of there, getting all of
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their machinery and weaponry out of there or destroying it, because the taliban has already got a lot of weapons from the united states as they overtook afghanistan. we saw that happen. maybe it was from the afghan security services or whatnot that they got this from, so what they can get from the united states in their hands. the next few days there are a lot of critical factors that go into what the end of the u.s.' time in kabul is going to look like. >> kaitlan collins, thank you. when we left last night there was a fire fight going on at the kabul airport. he joins us here tonight. what reaction has there been from people you're talking to from what president biden said this afternoon? >> this was in a way consistent with what they had been planning
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for, which was an evacuation of all u.s. forces and the end of the evacuation by august 31st. but the atmosphere has cranked up a level because any kind of extension to that has now been ruled out, particularly in the face of the taliban announcement today saying, anderson, that no more afghans can come to the airport. the afghans are now forbidden by the taliban to join the evacuation process. the extent to which they choose to dreirectly apply that remain to be seen, but certainly people arriving at the outside perimeter of the airport are significantly lower. there is a possibility in a sense, almost, that they will run out here of people to evacuate because there is not enough people able to get here in order to seek evacuation. that said, the numbers as of sunset last night, just before sunrise now, were around 4,000 people still waiting to be vac waited, but in all probability,
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those people have already probably been moved through. whether they've been replenished by new people remains to be seen. but the atmosphere is very much soured now because of the taliban decision to stop afghans from escaping the country, the taliban saying they don't see any need to leave. they also fear a brain drain, and part of it may be they recognize the more people that the u.s. has to evacuate, the less likelihood there is of meeting that deadline, and therefore the greater chance of friction with the united states. they are trying to integrate themselves with international community, anderson. >> the taliban perspective, like you said, there is the brain drain aspect, and also they want the u.s. out, and one way to get the u.s. out quicker is to cut off the flow of afghans who were able to actually leave. >> reporter: yeah, i think it's clearly a pretty cynical move. it does trap people in
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afghanistan who might otherwise have been hoping to get out. the process for getting out had become profoundly fraught. there were deaths associated with it, crash deaths, which was also used as a reason why the taliban were stopping it, and, of course, it's an appalling look for them to come to power amidst a mass exodus of some of the best educated people in the country. it's an appalling political beginning, and they recognize that, i think, and they're trying to prevent it. but ultimately, really, what they're trying to do is bring this chapter to a close so they can continue with their efforts to try to pacify the country. they've only got 75,000 men under arms, it's a big country and it's highly fractured, anderson. >> i appreciate you being there, thank you. operational major overseas military operations, leon panetta joins us as well as
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military analyst mark huertling. do you think sticking to the august 31 timeline is smart? >> i think the president made a point that he obviously is trying to meet that deadline, but he's also asked the pentagon and the state department to develop contingency plans. and i think that's important to do, because, frankly, we made a promise. we made a promise to united states citizens who are in afghanistan and to the afghans who fought alongside of us that we would do everything we could to evacuate them. i think we've got to still keep that promise. >> joe hertling, from your point of view, does president biden have a choice to stick to the deadline? >> he doesn't have a choice, anderson. we talked about neo a couple times, the noncombat aevacuatio
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operations are ongoing. the first phase is always disastrous, the second phase is when things start flowing. that's what we're in right now and seeing good stuff. especially in a contested neo, the third and fourth phase is very difficult. the third phase is when the army gets a vote. when they're saying, here's what we want you to do or here's what we're going to force you to do, it becomes problematic. we also then eventually will have to talk about the fourth phase which is the time when the commander on the ground starts turning the rheostat a little bit and starts talking about what forces he allows to leave, what forces he keeps in defense of the airfield, and what forces he keeps in terms of potential contingency operations which the president talked about today. those are all very sporty propositions, and we're seeing those right now. but i just go back to the fact right now the enemy, the taliban and others, are getting a vote, and the commander on the ground and the president has to be wary
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of that. >> secretary panetta, it's interesting to watch this from afar, because it does seem like both the white house and the taliban are making public pron pronouncements to -- they're kind of sending messages to each other through public pronouncements. the president is saying there are contingency plans being developed if they need to stay longer. it sort of sends a message to the taliban that, well, there are other options potentially, and yes, we want to stick to this, but don't push too hard because we have other options. the taliban is saying we're cutting off the road. we can stop afghans from actually getting to the airport. that might actually, you know, help the u.s. in terms of reaching the -- sticking to the 31st deadline -- in a sick way, because if they stop afghans from getting to the airport, then there's going to be nobody to take out other than u.s. citizens and european allies.
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>> look, there's no question that signals are being sent from one side to the other. because the reality is that the taliban is now in control of afghanistan. and in many ways, whether the taliban cooperate or not could determine the fate of those u.s. citizens who are remaining as well as those afghans who fought alongside of us. so i understand the need to try to continue, to try to coordinate with the taliban. but the united states is also committed to standing by our word here. we've got to do everything we can to uphold our work to those people who are there. if we just kind of cut and run a and leave them to the taliban to
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determine what happens to them, i think that will further undermine our credibility in the world. >> president biden said they've helped more than 70,000 people be vac evacuated from afghanist since august 14. i'm certainly not an expert on this stuff, but to me that seems like a remarkably high number of people. a senior administration official said tonight that a lot of deserving -- their term -- afghans will be left behind. you've studied this kind of thing. 70,000 in that time, is that a remarkable number? >> it is -- remarkable is a great word, anderson. it is incredible to me. i didn't think it would get to that high of a number, and if the numbers continue to go as they've been over the last couple of days, we could get upwards of 130 to 150,000 out. that would be almost magical, in my view. but the problem is, what we're talking about is the connection
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between the numbers with the individuals. the siv applicants and the special evacuees are the ones we're most concerned with. the numbers seem high, i would suggest, because many of the siv applicants are getting through, but they're also bringing a large number of family members. so the planning factors in any neo have to do with, first of all, how many american citizens do you have, the ex-pats, and then you start counting the others you have to include in the evacuation. one of the numbers i had to execute was we went in with plan x. we found that factor quadrupled, quin quintupled, because someone comes in with more family members and your numbers triple. the president is saying, i'm
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trying to get all the siv and the special evacuees out, but they're seeing people on the ground say, hey, i'm still not at the airport and i'm not getting out, what's going on? so there is a disconnect. >> secretary panetta, the cia director traveled to afghanistan this beak to meet with the taliban leader as the u.s. is seeking a clear understanding on where the taliban stands on a number of issues as the clock ticks toward this deadline. that would have been a fascinating meeting to be a fly on the wall for? as a former cia director yourself, how does something like that go, and how much leverage does the u.s. have? >> there's nobody better to send in that kind of meeting than bill burns. he's someone who is probably the most experienced diplomat in the administration, and he's had to deal with all kinds of adversaries. so it was a good move to send bill burns in to talk to the
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taliban. and when the cia director shows up and talks to the taliban, i think he brings some authority to the table, because one thing that the taliban does remember very well is the role of the cia in going after the taliban. so i think bill had some leverage here. i hope he was able to get them to understand that it is in their interest to cooperate at this point. the last thing they want to do is get into another war in the united states. >> general hertling, i appreciate your time. thank you both. will afghanistan be able to evacuate in a couple days? we talked to someone who is out and she hopes the rest will be able to do it in due time.
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even as the evacuation of afghanistan ramps up for what could be the final seven days, we spoke to americans who made it out, people such as salma kajimy. she and her mom made it out. they are back in colorado springs, and after the ordeal, hiding from the taliban, salma tells her story. >> so the day we had landed, there was apparently a news statement that came out that the taliban wanted everyone who was a citizen to get out of america. so learning the first day, we were kind of nervous. it was maybe after two weeks that we realized they had taken over three cities, which was herat and two other ones. then we realized they were close to palmo m, and the next day thy
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were in kabul. >> i talked to critics the day before they got to kabul, and there was a thought that maybe it would be a fight or maybe it would be weeks from now. i know your brother back in colorado was trying to help get you out. when you realized that the taliban were already in the city, what did you do? did you just stay inside? >> yeah, we were staying inside and we were trying to contact my family. we were trying to get tickets as soon as possible. tickets were twice the price, and then after a few hours, we found out the airport had completely closed. so we felt we were completely stuck and had no choice of leaving. we had no other opportunities. we literally felt hopeless and that's when my family was freaking out as well and wondered if we would ever be able to come back home. >> your brother-in-law works at hewlett-packard and they were able to dget a charter which helped you aim for something to get to the airport. what was it like just trying to get to the airport?
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>> it's actually hpe, he works for them, and getting to the airport, it was pretty scary. so we first actually went to the wrong gate, and we were waiting for hours. so many people were just together, and then after a while -- >> was getting to the gate itself, getting to the airport, the road, were you able to just drive there? i know there were taliban checkpoints. >> yes. so first of all, there was curfews, right? we had to leave like at 5:00 in the morning after the curfew was over. we went to the wrong gate and i got out of the car to show them that i had an american passport. after i got out, there was a laser on me and they shot a gun a little while ago to scare us off, and someone told me that gate had not opened for three days. i talked to the congressman and whatnot, and he told me you need to go to abi gate. as i got to abi gate, there were
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so many people around us. it was pretty easy to get up, but once we got there, there was taliban lined up against the airport. >> we've seen the crowds outside. what was that like to try to manage that? >> it was so scary. we were scared they might try to open car doors and try to take our stuff and whatnot. we didn't feel safe going there, but when it's necessary, you have to go through it, right? once we got closer, we got out of the car and we passed the taliban and they had actually stopped us. once they stopped us, they took my mom's passport. when they saw we were americans, they actually let us through. >> then what happened? >> we kept walking forward, and when we got to the top, we just see a whole crowd of people pushing and pulling each other, and like, all we could think about was, is this what we'll have to go through? maybe if we can tell them we're citizens, we can go around these people. no, we had to fight just as much. some people had no paperwork,
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some were from germany, turkey. we were all in the same mess and there were kids just crying -- sorry, i'm really emotional -- they were crying and fainting and there were people all bloody and having strokes, and it was probably something i would never expect to see. >> how long were you in that crowd? >> we were probably there for about four hours. we were pushing and pulling, and then, like, i got the attention of one of the british soldiers telling them we had an e-mail from the congress and that we have to get on a charter flight, that we might actually miss it. he told me to get closer to the gate. there was, like, barbed wire, and like my mom's clothes tore, her hand was bleeding, and we had to help her get above those barbed wires. >> you finally did get through. >> yes. >> and i know that whole process of flying out and then not knowing where you're going and you're staying in bunk beds, a
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lot of fafacilities, all of tha was he can tropical storm herminely t-- was extremely exhausting. do you think they'll be able to get everyone out to the u.s.? >> they'll probably have to take people out in helicopters or something. it was getting very bad. people are coming in every day trying to get past those gates. those gates are so hard to get through, and they might have to find a different way. >> when you finally did get back to the united states, how are you doing? what was that like? >> honestly, like, i felt relieved but i still feel sadness. like, i feel like there's still so many people trapped in danger and i can't do anything about it. this is why i'm doing this interview, i want to bring awareness to the situation that there are so many people stuck
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who need help. i feel like nobody is doing anything about it. we're doing what we can, but i feel like we can do more. >> salma, i'm sorry for all you went through and thank you for talking to us tonight. >> yes, thank you so much. bodies en masse at florida schools. what the governor says about the push to not have a mask mandate. advil targets pain. acetaminophen blocks it. advil dual action. fast pain relief that lasts 8 hours.
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the deaths from covid in florida are at an all-time high. 212 people died every day last week, which means one out of every five covid deaths this america last week was in florida. from governor ron desantis, there is more bad news, at least politically, his position to mask mandates doesn't seem popular. according to quinnipiac university, 60% support requiring students and teachers to wear masks.
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36% oppose it. there are sometimes physical confrontations happening in florida over masks mandates in schools. >> reporter: in lake county, florida, tempers flared over mask mandates. >> this is my kid, this is my choice, this is my freedom. >> reporter: hundreds on both sides of the issue turned out to protest, even though masks are still optional in this district. the issue wasn't even on the school board's agenda. but that didn't stop parents from speaking out. >> i really feel as though the only way you'll get control is to close it down for a month. >> no. >> shut up! >> reporter: in jacksonville, florida, more anger over masks. >> your job is to educate my child. that means reading, writing, math, a game of dodgeball at p.e. would be great. but not a mask. not a medical decision. it is not your decision to put a medical device on my child. >> it seems like a no-brainer. a universal mask mandate is the minimum we can do to keep our children safe. >> reporter: after heated
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debate, the duval county school board voted for a mask mandate for all students. only those with a note from a licensed health care provider can opt out. in northern california, the mask debate prompted a 49-year-old father to aldlegedly assault a child's teacher in her school. he is now charged with a misdemeanor. >> there is part of me that's shocked, but to everyone's defense, emotions are just high right now. >> it happened at sutter creek elementary. the district has a no mask mandate, but students can opt out. parents clashed at the protest. >> we know who you are! we know who you are. you can leave but we'll find you and we know who you are. >> reporter: it got so heated,
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police stepped in. in the end, the board of ed approved a temporary mask requirement. and in panellas county, florida, parents wanted it to be their choice. >> it's our choice. it's our choice. i don't care if these kids are wearing masks. we're pulling our kids out. we don't want these decisions to be made for us. > >> wear a mask to prevent covid-19. come on. >> you are finished. thank you. time's up. let's move on. next speaker. don't make me ask you to be removed. >> reporter: randi kaye, cnn, palm beach county, florida. >> let's get the advice of dr.
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marty, infectious disease doctor. dr. marty, according to a recent analysis, there have been 70,000 covid cases and only 30,000 quarantined sibefore the start the school year. what do you think about the governor telling districts they aren't allowed to opt out? >> quite frankly, the entire thing breaks my heart. we're doing everything we can to stop transmission of this horrific virus. and the governor and everyone else, all leaders, should be working with us to do everything possible to slow down transmission. if there is a concern about masks being clean, remember, we have to change our underwear every day, we have to take baths every day. you change these things, you make sure that what you're using is appropriate, that it fits, that it's comfortable and that it works. and when you do it that way,
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when you do things properly, you're going to have a reduction in transmission. this is well known. that's why we use masks in hospitals and have done for tens of years. i mean, it's really known to be an effective control method. and the fact that it's been turned into something emotional instead of rational and a good understanding of the science simply breaks my heart, because what we're seeing is outrageous numbers of people in our hospitals right now. we're running out of oxygen, we're running out of staff. we've had to hire people from the outside already to make up. hundreds of people had to be hired to come into our hospitals. we're placing patients in situations that are unusual. it's terrible. >> do you think from a medical standpoint, purely on a medical standpoint, kids above the age
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of 12, should there be mandatory vaccinations for them to go to school? should teachers have mandatory vaccinations? >> well, we have a proud tradition in florida of demanding vaccinations of people to go to school. we've done very well with it in previous years. here now we have a fully licensed vaccine that is among the safest and most efficacious that has ever been developed of any vaccine, and i think florida ought to follow its own tradition and absolutely mandate vaccines for all eligible individuals, particularly in settings where people are going to be close together in indoor spaces as they are in schools. >> the polling that we mentioned, does it reflect what you've experienced? for example, 63% of floridians, according to this poll, said they considered the issue of wearing masks to be about public
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health, not political freedom. 70% said they thought masks were effective to help in slowing the spread. have you seen mask wearing increase? >> in different places. we're not seeing as much use of masks as really ought to be happening, which is -- and this is contributing to the problems that we're seeing in our hospitals. but there hads been a little bit of improvement. not as much as there ought to be. but i will tell you that every day i receive grateful parents sending me letters saying, keep it up, please, we need our children to be safe in schools. and they're right. we need our children to be able to go to school and be safe. there's many things that are mandated by the government that have always bienemann dated that are appropriate to mandate in schools. you don't go there naked, and
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right there you shouldn't be going to school without a mask. the pfizer vaccine has full fda approval, as you know. the question is will people who were holding out finally going to roll up their sleeve? ed -- a top official shares some information, next. a top officia information, next. debt free! thanks to sofi. ♪ over the years, mercedes-benz has patented thousands of safety innovations. crash-tested so many cars we've stopped counting. and built our most punishing test facility yet, in our effort to build the world's safest cars. we've created crumple zones and autonomous braking. active lane keeping assist and blind spot assist. we've introduced airbags, side curtain airbags, and now the first-ever rear-mounted front-impact airbags.
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. there's new polling out tonight on covid. more than 900 unvaccinated people found that some would get the vaccine if it got fda approval. but over the weekend where the former president had a rally and he got some boo s when he told them to get the vaccine may have gone too far. >> reporter: have you gotten the vaccine? >> no. >> reporter: why not? >> they haven't tested it enough, in my opinion. >> reporter: the pfizer shot is about to get fda approval. would that change your opinion at all? >> not until they do a whole lot of investigating on it.
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nothing is going in my arm until then. >> reporter: do you think that would take a long time? >> about ten years or so. >> i watch news max and maybe a little fox, that's it. i don't want i want to hear what god is doing, that's all i'm interested in. i think there is a time when god is separating the sheep from the goats. >> what are you? >> i'm a goat because i ain't a sheep. i'm not doing what they tell me to do. i'm fighting against it. >> frank ments joins me now. you must hear a lot of folks with opinions like that. >> it used to break my heart and now it just breaks my brain. it causes my head to explode because i know how dangerous the covid is and the delta variant,
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and i know how much more dangerous that is than the vaccine. the key moment, and this is a key moment right now, and we've got about 30 days. number one, the delta variant, the public knows it, understands it, finds it more serious than covid. number two, our kids are going back to school right now and in the next 30 days, and everyone wants to keep their children safe. and number three, the fda full approval, which is the number one factoid, the number one truth point that the public has been looking for. those three combined means that over the next 30 days, this is where we'll have the biggest impact in getting people vaccinated. the good news is that those three together will convince about half of those that haven't been vaccinated to get the jab. here's the bad news, anderson. it means that when we are done, we can project that we will reach about 75% vaccinated, 75% toward herd immunity. i'm not a scientist, i'm not a medical expert. i know that the number should be
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85%, so it makes me nervous that we're never going to get there. >> you made the comment that parents you polled on this issue who didn't want their child to wear a mask think they're actually protecting their child. is the vaccine the same thing? do people think they're protecting themselves by not getting the vaccine? i guess the argument would be they're vaxx nagt themselves or the government or just don't want it. >> 55% of those who have not been vaccinated don't trust the government. when you have anthony fauci making the case, he's not a doctor to them. he's not a scientist to them. he's a bureaucrat, or even worse, inconsistent, flip-flopping. anderson, i try to do a straightforward approach on your show, and i'm grateful for the time that you provide. in the end, it's going to be pediatricians who are going to make the difference for kids in school. it's going to be scientists who
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emphasize that now the fda has made the decision, and in the end, we need to poll people who know individuals who have not been vaccinated. if you want to get everyone safe, if you want to make everyone comply, it's not going to come from television news, it's not going to come from efforts from the government or advertisements. get a pediatrician in every school. in fact, if you're a pediatrician, you should be getting in touch with your show. pediatricians need to adopt a school. parents will trust their teachers and so will the kids. that's how you get vaccinations. >> you said a poll shows who hasn't been vaccinated. one poll shows 24% of full fda
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approval would get people to get the vaccine. this moves the needle only so far. >> the fda has the responsibility to provide the american people with the facts and the truth. and, anderson, that's the phrase they're looking for right now. they want no exceptions, no excuses. our job is to save lives. that is our only mission. that's our only mission. that's what the fda needs to be talking about right now. for those unvaccinated, they're too nervous that these rules and regulations have been charged. they say one thing at one point and then they change it. it it's not a mandate. in the end it seems like a protocol. >> frank luntz, appreciate it as always. thank you. >> thank you. democrats arerallying to
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pass a key item by president biden. how long will they continue their infighting? they're trying to get this resolution to his desk.
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more breaking news. just before his remarks on afghanistan, president biden vowed to keep hope for house democrats, passing a $3.5 trillion budget resolution. but it still is a long way from his desk and it is a combative divided democratic party. a lot is going on. the house voted to pass the $3.5 trillion budget framework. what concessions did speaker pelosi have to make with the ten moderates to get this deal done? >> basically what she did, anderson, was promise them there would be a vote on the $1.2 trillion deal that already has been passed by the senate and that that vote would come as early as september 27th, and she put it in writing. that means a lot of work has to be done in a relatively short period of time, because what
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democrats would prefer to see is the budget resolution they passed today, the $3.5 trillion, filled out and ready to go and passed at the same time they pass a bipartisan infrastructure deal. that's a lot of work that has to be done and they'll begin that process in the beginning of september. but what this illustrates, this illustrates how delicate this process is and how something simple by a relatively small group of members of congress could derail the whole process. >> just to be clear this is not a vote on the bill itself. this is a vote to move forward. >> that's right. this is essentially voting on the framework. this is members of congress agreeing they're willing to spend $3.5 trillion on the budget plan. there's no specifics how that money will be spent yet, and that's the real hard work going to be now over the next couple of weeks, work that has to be done essentially before
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september 27th. they're going to separate, take all these different pots of money and decide specifically where they're going to go. there's got to be a lot of horse trading over here the next couple of weeks. they've really been talking about this in big, grand numbers. it's the granular details where this entire thing could come apart. and that's why even though they've made a lot of progress, there's still a long way to go. >> ryan nobles, appreciate it. thank you. van, this is one of president biden's key domestic policy proposals. >> i think they're both breathing a sigh of relief. never bet against nancy pelosi. you're going to lose your money, but she's had to work very, very hard. and it's because you have two pressures on this democratic party. on the one hand you be
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progressives saying, listen, we're probably going to have one shot here, let's do something big, let's do something memorable. republicans could be in charge in a couple of years so they want to go big. when you say republicans might take over you mean i might lose. i'm in these tough seats and i'm telling you i've got certain needs and you've got to take me seriously. i am the margin of victory and defeat if you take me for granted i am going stoostomp on the brakes. never bet on nancy pelosi when it comes to dealing with her caucus. >> as you said the win did not come easy for democrats. getting these ten moderates onboard was certainly an uphill battle and i think surprised a lot of democrats. just last night there was explicit language, f-bombs being dropped apparently as house democrats were meeting behind closed doors. speaker pelosi is known as you pointed out being a master of kind of whipping her party into line, getting what he wants.
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did she underestimate the power of the moderates? >> i think that clearly she must have misread something because it's not that the moderates changed their position. they were pretty clear early on what their fears were, what their concerns were. she must have missed something because a lot of this stuff could are been worked out in advance. and you have the deb occul i think in afghanistan is demoralizing the base and divisions in the caucus is giving people some real heartburn, she had to really step up and make it happen. but she did step up and make it happen and she can be counted onto do that. you have a very tiny majority to work with. which means any group that gets together, and the moderates said you have to take us seriously. we're your margin of victory in the fall and we have real needs and you've got to hear from us. >> we know they don't generate the party in power.
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biden's approval ratings is below 50%. they seem disjointed with disagreement. as a democrat how concerned are you infighting is going to have an impact on the 2022 mid-term? >> look, we're having a tough summer but we've got more than a year to get this thing turned around. i don't think anybody expected for a president as empathetic as this president to have sounded as tone-deaf early on with what's going on in afghanistan. i think he's beginning to right the ship there, but this is a tough summer. you can't deny it. this party has got to pass these bills, got to see the results, and then we've got to get ready for a tough mid-term election. >> do you think he was tone duff early on in this, in afghanistan? >> his initial statements i thought missed the mark when it came to just showing the empathy he's known for. he's there because of his empathy and because of peoples trust in his competence.
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he hit his first air pocket and he didn't sound like himself. i think he now sounds like himself, but i think it shocked a lot of people. and look, everybody gets a chance to make mistakes and learn on the job even someone with as much experience as president biden gets to learn on the job. this has been a tough summer for this party. >> do you think -- you know, the american public has not been paying much attention to afghanistan over the last many years. people have kind of didn't want to hear about it, didn't watch stories about it. it just dropped off the radar for a lot of people. do you think democrats are going to -- do you think this has resonance? though there's a lot of people who support withdrawing but obviously the images what's happened the last couple of weeks we've seen the president's poll numbers drop. >> look, a lot of people say he did the right thing he just didn't do it the right way. and so, you know, that then has to be worked out politically.
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think about benghazi. you know, it was a tragedy but a relatively small board tragedy and republicans just beat the crap out of us for that for years. so you know what politically your opponents can do with any foreign policy mistake. you just don't want to hand them this kind of thing. obviously you don't want to let down our allies but also politically don't want to hand this kind of stuff because you're going to have to pay for it when the mid-term election comes around. up next more on our breaking news from afghanistan. president biden sticking with his withdrawal deadline, a week away. also a request from the pentagon and state department. the latest on that coming up.
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