good evening. even as we are digesting the news tonight that more than 82,000 people have now been airlifted out of afghanistan, which is, however you look at it, a remarkable number. we're being reminded of how dangerous it is and how difficult things could turn. right now, as we speak, americans waiting to get into the airport in kabul and, eventually, on to flights out of afghanistan, are being told to leave the airport area for their own safety. the u.s. embassy now based at the airport issued the warning shortly before airtime advising americans who still have yet to actually enter the airport, who might be outside among the crowds outside the airport's east, north, and abby gates to, quote, leave immediately.

the embassy further cautions against traveling to the airport, unless specifically instructed to by a u.s. government representative. now, this follows cnn reporting earlier of a, quote, very specific threat stream from isis k against crowds. cnn's oren liebermann joins us now with the latest on this. so what do we know about this warning? >> this is a specific warning to get away from three gates to karzai international airport. the north gate, east gate, and the abby gate. citing a security threat. we know, having spoken about the threat isis k poses to that area that the pentagon believes they could well target the crowds around there as a tempting target for them. whether that would be through suicide bombings or vehicle-born improvised explosive devices. the pentagon, u.s. government, the biden administration views this as a threat and now we very much see how seriously as the u.s. races to get people out as quickly as possible. in the span of ten days, the u.s. and its allies have moved nearly the equivalent of a packed giant stadium oh ut of afghanistan.

flights leaving kabul international airport every 39 minutes but there are possibly as many as 1,500 americans who remain in the country. the biden administration still working to keep its solemn promise to evacuate every american who wants out but also saying it's difficult to track, in real-time, every u.s. citizen in afghanistan. but how the u.s. will ensure passage for afghans after the last u.s. plane leaves remains a question. >> they will not be forgotten. we certainly have -- um -- points of incentive and points of leverage with a future afghan government to help make sure that that happens. but i can tell you, again, from -- from -- from my perspective, from the president's perspective, this effort does not end on august 31st. >> reporter: when asked whose shoulders the blame for this frantic effort up to the deadline? he said this. >> i take responsibility. i know the president has said he takes responsibility. there will be plenty of time to look back at the last six or

seven months, to look back at the last 20 years. and to look to see what we might've done differently. >> reporter: the taliban now imposing even tighter restrictions on afghanistan. one day after warning it wouldn't allow afghans to reach the airport, in this video shared on social media, this man says he was beaten by the taliban. his face bloodied. he says they hit me bad and this happened to me when i was crossing to the airport. now, the taliban telling working women to stay home until security is in place for them. they say their fighters don't know how to treat women, yet. >> translator: we want to make sure women are not treated in a disrespectful way or, god forbid, hurt. so we would like them to stay at home until security is in place for them in the offices. >> reporter: the founder of afghan girl's school burning school records for her students' protection. she fled with her students to rwanda. taliban checkpoints limiting movement in kabul and beyond. in the crowds outside the airport, one afghan woman tried about a dozen times to get

through so she could join her husband in the united states, he told cnn's kylie atwood. finally, she dressed her baby in yellow and managed to send a photo through to marines who were able to spot the baby in the crowd. the family made it in. on tuesday, the first u.s. troops began leaving afghanistan. a mix of headquarters staff and maintenance no longer required in kabul. >> those last couple of days, we will begin to prioritize military capabilities and military resources to -- to move out. >> reporter: for now, the mission remains focused on the evacuation but with time racing down, it'll soon transition to the withdrawal of u.s. forces and equipment before the august-31st deadline. so, oren, the pentagon's acknowledged three separate helicopter operations to pick up u.s. citizens in kabul. is it possible to do that for every american who can't make it inside the airport? that would seem to be very difficult. >> incredibly difficult. if not, perhaps, nearly impossible. pentagon press secretary, john kish kirby pointed out those three helicopters missions were

both short distance and duration. those americans were very close to where they needed to be to kabul international airport. to go deeper into kabul and certainly to go deeper in afghanistan, that may be too much with the clock winding down here. which opens up the question and that's a question we will keep on asking. how is the u.s. going to get potentially 1,500 people out of the country? >> oren liebermann, appreciate it. let's go next to doha, qatar. cnn's sam kiley has just arrived there on a flight out of kabul. you obviously know that airport well. how concerning is it? >> well, it's very deeply concerning. it's been something that's been top of everybody's minds, in terms of the intelligence community and the security of the airport. these enormous crowds pose or present an absolutely delicious target for the vicious sort of tactics that are employed by isis-k. in the past, they have gone in for the sort of spectacular

murders that we've seen isis are notorious for in northern syria. but this poses an absolutely catastrophic threat because it could utterly stymie efforts not just by the american-led coalition to get people out. but also, the taliban efforts to get a level of security at least around the airport. yes, they have been very brutal, recently, towards afghan citizens whom they've said should not be leaving. but those crowds are still there. they are still pressing up against those three gates, and they still present a target. now, we have specific intelligence being an urgent messages going out from the united states and the united kingdom. urging their citizens to get away from those gates. in the case of the united kingdom, get away from the airport, all together. so this is a very unusual level of anxiety to -- to -- to have such specific intelligence. and then, to appear to be relatively powerless, at this stage anyway, to do something

about it. so the only thing that they can really do is to get people away so that the target, itself, the mass murder potential of innocent civilians is not being presented to isis-k. and -- and they -- and i can tell you that the taliban have been working to try and catch people. and they claim to have arrested four just the other day, anderson. >> sam, how would american citizens who were outside the gates trying to get in or in the crowds, how would they find out about this warning from -- from the u.s.? >> there is a network. a -- a -- a warning system a kind of sophisticated system in place with the state department that have been able to reach out to all of those american citizens who have reached in to them or whose -- whose location they already knew. or were -- who had been preregistered with the u.s. embassy. and they are being communicated with verbally and by text message and e-mail. not just on this matter but on all of the other issues associated with trying to get them out of the country.

but it is fraught. and ultimately, even though they might know where groups of individual americans are, now the issue, obviously, as oren was pointing out is how on earth do you get them from where they are not just through taliban checkpoints which for american citizens are reasonably benign but away from this terrorist threat. which at the moment means all the ways in -- the official ways into the airport are now blocked. and there still are people there. there are still people so desperate that they will ignore afghans i mean afghans will be ignoring, in large numbers, these threats from isis-k because they are already so fearful of the taliban, anderson. >> and, sam, what about your journey out of afghanistan? >> well, it was long and hot. i was on an american c-17 with 451 other passengers. almost all of them, afghans or -- or americans being flown

here to qatar. they were shepherded on -- i mean, and now, the -- the systems are pretty well understood. so they -- we all move on in a great mass of people. and then, we line up in pretty neat rows. and then, asked to sit down because of the takeoff and landing. there are no seatbelts or anything. you are just sitting on the floor like being in a school gymnasium, except for this thing flies. an awful lot of people were very, very afraid on takeoff. there was a little bit of cheering and clapping at the beginning. the sense of relief, when the aircraft actually took the air. but these are people at their whit's end, anyways. and yes they are relieved to be getting out. but they are also very fearful. the afghans among them, those without american passports. many of them with american visas so they know where they are going to end up, as in what country. but they don't know where in that country where they are going to be able to find food, jobs, accommodation, all of the strains and stresses of -- of -- of a refugee population now

weighing on their minds for the next stage in this very arduous journey. but the staff of the -- the servicemen and women on the aircraft are extremely kind and gentle with them. very, very respectful. there isn't what you see so often, actually, when you are dealing -- when people are dealing with refugees. there is something horrible that happens to a refugee. they become a kind of nonperson almost. they get herded around like cattle almost. i see this all over the world. but in this instance, they are being treated with great respect, great manners. i have seen similar things on a qatari flight. so at least that stage of them, they are still hanging on to their dignity as tight as they are hanging onto the very small bags that they are able to carry with them on this long and lot flight. anderson. >> sam kiley, appreciate your remarkable reporting. thank you just before air irkts i spoke with a permanent resident of the u.s. who is trying to leave kabul right now. he says he traveled to afghanistan for his father's funeral. we should say we do not know that much about him.

but to help verify his identity, he did provide us his driver's license. we looked at his linkedin and facebook pages as well and did a background check as well. it seems to line up. again, i spoke to him just before airtime. >> you are heading to the airport now. what's the situation? >> well, um, there are thousands of people are -- around the airport. they are trying to get in, and there is no evacuation right now. they don't let anybody inside the airport. so there are thousands of thousands people here. women, kids. >> have you -- have you been there -- have you been there before? have you tried to get -- get into the airport before? >> since -- since -- since 16th august, i'm coming every day. every day.

three times, four times a day. >> what is the difficulty? >> the difficult -- the first difficulty is the rush of people. you can see, you know, hundreds of people all standing there. they are making, you know, fake documents. >> so -- so let me -- so your -- what documents do you have? >> i'm a permanent resident of united states. i have my -- my documents in my hand. the problem is twice i got close to the gate. i talked to the international forces. once i talked to british -- to british force. they said we are -- we are sorry we cannot get you in. only american, they can get you in. we know that you have -- you have documents but we can't get you inside the airport.

>> how long have you lived in the u.s.? >> six years. >> and -- and i understand your mom is in afghanistan. did -- why did you go back this time? >> my father. my -- my father died -- um -- and i came here for funeral. i have no one here. so i have to be here because my mom, she was alone here. so i came to attend the funeral and -- >> so, if you get to the airport and you are able to -- to -- to find somebody, will you just try to -- will you go to the airport -- will you go into the airport now and -- and -- and try to get on a plane if they let you in? >> of course, yeah. once i get inside the airport, they will check my documents. i believe that the -- some of my friends that they work with the u.s. organizations here, they

got in. they say that there are three checkpoints. obviously, you know, the first checkpoint is, what, taliban. the second checkpoint is what the afghan -- afghan force. previous, you know, afghan force. and the third checkpoint is international forces. so they check your document and they get you inside. this is what they say. so there are thousands of people inside the airport. um -- some of them, as you guys can see also in media, they don't have documents. i don't know how they got inside and how they -- they put them in the plane. so we have documents. we -- we filled the form. you know? evacuation form, also. i haven't heard anything back from u.s. embassy to contact me

and ask. but there are some alternative -- um -- ways that they are picking up, you know, u.s. citizens. >> and is it just you trying to -- to get out? or is your mom trying to get out, as well? >> it's not only me that i have, you know, documents. i know -- i know a few people that they came from u.s. to visit their families, and they stuck here. my flight was on -- on august 15. exactly, you know, the date that taliban entered kabul city. so my flight was cancelled because of, you know, the rush inside the airport. you know, people were running away. you know, especially the politicians. so, they block the airport. you know? >> what happens if you aren't able to get in right now? today.

>> well -- well, today -- well, what happens, we're concerned about the -- you know, the target which is 31st august. so obviously, we don't know what is going to happen. every time, every second, you know, change, you know, everything here. >> you -- you said that you tried to reach out to the embassy. have you heard at all from -- from the u.s. government? >> i -- i did heard. they called me in 48 hours to i.c.e. and they were just asking me, you know, if i'm safe, in a safe place. well actually, you know, everywhere is not safe in kabul. >> and did they give you any advice about how to get to the airport? >> well, the advice -- the only -- the only way that they are doing right now which is very good idea is -- is calling

people when -- they are calling people, and they are picking them up from a specific, you know, places. that's the only and best way, you know, for -- for people to get out of, you know, this crowded people. because these -- these buses are coming, you know, through the gate. and they get escorted, you know, some of these buses are escorted by taliban because they want to -- they want to bring them safe, you know, to the airport. >> i -- i wish you the best. i appreciate you talking to us. and good luck to you. >> well, thank you so much. god bless you. and we are trying to get in. we'll see. >> all right. i -- i hope you do. thank you. well, next, more on this embassy warning to americans outside kabul airport. by the way, we have not heard back from him to see how he did.

we'll be joined by two experts on the region and the people that are looking to hurt americans and what this means for the rest of the evacuation. and later, how the covid pandemic's unfolding in one of the most vaccinated countries on earth.

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here, things work the way you wish they would. and better protection costs a whole lot less. you're in good hands with allstate. click or call for a lower auto rate today. more on our breaking news. the warning within the hour to americans waiting outside kabul airport. the embassy in kabul telling them to, quote, leave immediately. those not there yet to stay away, unless otherwise instructed. the danger not specified but for now, the stated concern from the president on down has been a potential attacks on crowds by groups like the local isis affiliate. joining us now is cnn national security analyst, peter bergen. author of "the rise and fall of s osama bin laden." so, peter, given what we have already heard from u.s. officials about the threat from isis-k and their desire to create mayhem in the airport. does a warning like this surprise you? >> not really. and yeah, this is a sort of

hos hostage crisis of the biden administration's own making where, on the one side, you have the august 31st. and -- and now, you have this credible threat of -- of violence which could be from isis-k. but we can't also discount al qaeda which has presence in 19 of the 34 provinces of afghanistan according to the u.n. the u.n. is also reporting last several months, ten -- thousands of foreign fighters have poured in to support the taliban or al qaeda. isis-k has an ability to strike at will in kabul. it bombed a girls' school. dozens of -- of kids died in may. so unfortunately, it's not simply isis-k but others that would love to carry out an attack that would embarrass and -- the united states and also kill americans. >> bob, how difficult is it for the u.s. now to -- to kind of gather information about potential threats in -- in a timely manner, given they're now isolated at the airport and

it's -- there is no longer an afghan government that they're dealing with? >> well, anderson, there's no way to meet agents right now in kabul or any part of afghanistan. so that's what we're left with are airplanes and intercepts. and so, undoubtedly, what the biden administration is picking up. the national security agency's intercept of phone calls where you got people calling each other looking for americans. and they know what the isis numbers are. and this is what has alarmed them, at this point. because taliban is not a unified movement. it doesn't have full control of kabul. and one of these radical zealot groups very easily could grab an american, take 'em hostage, or worse. >> peter, i think what -- what -- bob raised an interesting point and it's an important one. i was talking to a reporter on the ground who has spent a lot of time with the taliban over the years. there are a lot of divisions within the taliban. we imagine them as sort of this monolithic organization. this reporter yesterday had been

talking about talibs from the east, as opposed to this from helmand province. those who have spent time in doha with foreigners and -- and women. um, and that they are kind of competing groups and factions inside the organization. >> that's all true. i mean, there is the douha taliban. who met with cia director, william burns, according to "the washington post." that's the kind of acceptable face of the taliban. and there is a real power. who by the way, right now, has got an american hostage in his -- in his, you know, his group have taken an american who's been held for some period of time. you know, he is a designated foreign terrorist. he has a $5 million bounty on his head. he has just orchestrated one of the great military victories of all time which is the taliban taking over the country in two weeks. and i think he is the real power behind the throne here. we still don't have a government in afghanistan. but i think whatever the -- the -- the acceptable political

face of the taliban in that government behind him will be people like who have a long record, also, by the way of carrying out terrorist attacks in kabul. >> bob, how credible do you think a threat has to be for the u.s. embassy, which is based at the airport, to issue a warning to any americans outside the airport to leave? >> well, like peter was saying, for the administration to make a public announcement like this, it has to be very serious because they don't want to panic people. so they picked up something extremely, you know, substantive. and, you know, they can pick up the islamic state. the haqqani network, on the other hand, is rarely spikes but they're extremely dangerous, as peter said. and right now, nothing they'd love to grab a couple of americans because they would have -- it's a hostage crisis and they would have a lot of control over what the administration -- you know, what can -- what it can do and what

it can't. >> peter, this all comes on the heels of more than 100 prison inmates loyal to -- to isis-k escaping from two prisons near -- near kabul. um, is that -- how significant do you think that is potentially? >> i think it's hugely significant. i mean, it's not just isis-k people who got out. um, it's a lot of taliban. it's a lot of al qaeda. i mean, i've been in the prisons. it's an enormous prison that has the capacity to house thousands of prisoners and also, there were prisoners at bagram air base just to the north of kabul. so this is going to replenish -- you know, every jihadi group is going to be replenished by these prison breaks. very similar to in iraq. released prisoners who then joined either al qaeda in iraq or isis. >> peter bergen, bob, appreciate it thank you. coming up next, the question of how we got to this point. i will speak with a columnist who asks what a better afghan policy might have looked like.

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along with tonight's security warning to americans outside kabul airport or waiting to get there, there is also the unqualified good news that more than 82,000 people have now been airlifted out of kabul. there was also qualified admission of responsibility from secretary of state blinken for the shortcoming so far, especially at the outset of evacuations. alluded to the months and years of decades of mistakes leading up to this moment. "new york times" columnist has been exploring the subject. the complexities of it as well in a fascinating new piece titled a better afghan policy, what would it have been? he joins us now. david, thanks so much for being with us. so, in your piece, you argued that while the biden administration deserves blame for mistakes, there probably was no clean way for the u.s. to get out. why do you say that? >> so if you -- if you think through here what's the big

problem? the big problem. the immediate problem is that we're not evacuating not only americans but also the afghans who worked with the united states military and ngos and the media. um, in recent years. and you say well we should have evacuated them before the military withdrawal. but actually, when you think that through, you realize it was just absolutely impossible. in fact, it was a request of the afghan government that we not evacuate them. if the biden administration had begun evacuating thousands or tens of thousands of afghans before the government fell, it would have led the government to fell -- fall. and we would all be saying president biden caused the afghan government to collapse. and so, i think as you said, biden made mistakes here but i think when we think through the actual choices that they faced, i don't think there was an exit from afghanistan that wasn't messy. >> one of the criticisms has been, frankly, that the prior administration as well as, i assume, this administration kind of was slow walking or -- or at

least the prior administration was slow walking and this administration didn't really pick it up. the speed of processing the applications because i -- you talked to republican and democratic congresspeople who say, look, we have been working for years to try to get certain people visas, special immigrant visas. um, so that certainly -- you know, the other criticism from -- which we have on the show from ryan crocker, has been that -- um -- that essentially, the -- the -- the process was undercut by the previous administration dealing directly with the taliban which undercut the afghan government and the biden administration continued that policy, essentially. >> i think that's a fair criticism. but -- but i also think it's worth remembering we were never going to get out everyone who deserved to get out before the government fell. um, i mean, there is sort of a catch 22 here, right? the united states and the afghan government, obviously, wanted the afghan government to survive. there is no way for it to survive if we are simultaneously

airlifting out the thousands of people who are running that government. and so, so long as the u.s. and afghanistan wanted to take a shot at an aftghanistan that wasn't run by the taliban, there was no way to accomplish most of the air lift in advance. >> i'm so struck just how, you know, we, the united states, and -- and, you know, countries like to believe that they know what the effects of their involvement in another place is going to be. you think you're doing one thing. but it can have ripple effects that you don't really anticipate. um, you know, just the corruption that exploded in afghanistan with all the money that was being poured into it by -- by the u.s. and the regime, itself, which we were supporting was known for its corruption. >> i think -- i mean, i think, anderson, that's the key point here which is if you look at history, look at the united in veet yam. look at france in algeria. look at the soviet union in

afghanistan. um, it is full of instances of big -- um -- big powers going into small, poorer countries and thinking that they can overhaul them and run them and put in the government they want. and, you know, this is exaggerating only slightly. it never works, ever. and so, the u.s., i think, had to attack afghanistan in order to go after al qaeda in 2001. the question is why didn't the united states, which is really the george w. bush administration at the time, have a plan that was something other than we're going to remake this entire society? why didn't they accept the surrender of the taliban when it was offered to them? why didn't they see that a permanent war that seeks total victory is actually more likely to end in defeat, as we have just seen, than a more limited mission in afghanistan. >> to the point that the afghan government which as you talked about this earlier and you have written about this. the afghan government asked the u.s. don't start pulling these

people out because it's going to just make -- it's going to totally collapse our government. i mean, it's a tricky situation for the u.s. and they decided to -- i mean, after essentially cutting the afghan government off at the knees by negotiating directly with the taliban. they decided to listen to the afghan government on this one. >> yes. and so, the reason they decided to listen to them was that u.s. intelligence said that the afghan government would likely survive for months. and i think one of the key mistakes here of the biden administration was they took that forecast as gospel. they said, oh, um, our experts say the afghan government is going to survive for months. well, then that's what's going to happen. they didn't -- they didn't do enough contingency planning. they didn't say to themselves, well, wait a second. what are the chances that actually the government's going to collapse within weeks? or as happened, days? and what's our plan for that? and i think if they had taken seriously the possibility that the government would collapse within days, and they had reasons to take it seriously.

i mean, as you have talked about, there were people saying, look, this -- this government is not going to survive. it's too weak. they weren't the consensus but there were people saying that. if they had taken that seriously, i think they would have sped up the visa processing, as you were just talking about. i think the u.s. would have maybe not been quite so certain about the date that we were leaving. knowing that we might have had to leave troops there for a few weeks longer to oversee an evacuation process that was going to need to be much more rapid. >> good point. david, appreciate it. thank you so much. >> thanks, anderson. still to come. covid surge but with far fewer icu patients and no fatalities in months. take a look at why that is, next. discover card i just got my cashback match is this for real? yup! we match all the cash back new card members earn at the end of their first year automatically woo! i got my mo-ney! it's hard to contain yourself isn't it? uh- huh! well let it go! woooo! get a dollar for dollar match at the end of your first year. only from discover.

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a troubling trend in this nation's covid surge. more than a million new confirmed cases in the u.s. this past week. the most of any country and more than 1,000 people dying every day. cases in the u.s. are up nearly 10% when compared to one week -- to one week earlier. deaths surging more than 55%. some good news, though, however, of course, vaccine doses up 15%. still, another concern. the biden administration says

hospitalizations have nearly tripled in the past month. with more than 100,000 people now hospitalized with covid and that's a level we have not seen since january. of course, it doesn't have to be this way if more people got vaccinated, all those numbers will be much, much lower. and if you want to know what that would actually look like, look no further than iceland. iceland, the country like the u.s. is in the middle of its fourth covid surge. but the differences, they are really staggering and they are instructive. gary tuchman went to find out. >> reporter: come to iceland for the splendor and for the vivid proof of the effectiveness of covid-19 vaccines. how many people have died in this country during this wave from covid? >> none. >> zero? >> zero. >> reporter: this doctor is iceland's chief epidemiologist. >> i think the -- the widespread vaccination in iceland has, for sure, prevented serious consequences of the infection. i feel grateful and i think it's -- it's a testimony to t the -- this population.

>> reporter: the ceo of the largest hospital in iceland. national university hospital. he says a nightmare scenario during this fourth and worst wave of covid has been averted because of his fellow icelanders. >> if it hadn't been for the vaccinations in our population, i think it would have been catastrophic. >> reporter: health officials say nobody has died from covid in the small country since may. 30 died before that. almost all before the vaccine was available. and just how vaccinated is this nation now? >> if you look at the age bracket 16 years and older, it's about just above 90%. if you take from 12 and over, that's 84%. >> reporter: superlative percentages. finding people in the u.s. who haven't gotten the vaccine is easy. # here? not so easy. have you gotten vaccines? >> yes, of course. >> yes. >> of course? why do you say of course? >> just because it's, like, our duty to get vaccinated. >> your civic duty.

do you have friends who haven't gotten vaccinated? >> no. >> reporter: we go into the hospital's icelandic ward for intensive care unit because the high number of vaccinations also means fewer patients despite the surge of infections. >> last year, before the covid vaccines were available to the icelandic public, they were typically between 65 and 75 covid patients in this hospital. on this day, there are 18 covid patients. some are very ill. three of them are in the section of the icu behind this black and yellow tape. but patient numbers do continue to drop. notably, the u.s. state department issued its most serious covid advisory earlier this month. stating do not travel to iceland. iceland's covid surge is for real. but so is the sense of optimism. >> i think we are -- we are sort of a proof of -- of this principle that -- that the

vaccination is working wonders. >> and gary joins us now from iceland. gary, i think i know the answer to this question but what -- do health authorities in iceland know what caused this latest covid surge? >> well, they are not 100% sure, anderson. but what we do know is this. back in june, they lifted covid restrictions here in the nation of iceland because things had gotten better but just a few weeks after that, things got worse again and a few weeks, they brought back the restrictions. the rest of iceland, bars have to close at 11:00 p.m. this is a party city so people have nowhere to go when the bars close so they are just hanging out with us right now. but they don't want those bars to be crowded after 11:00 p.m. also, there are no longer allowed to be any public gatherings of more than 200 people. one very important thing to point out, anderson. excuse me, gentlemen. bars close, like i said. give me a break, my friend. be respectful. one very important thing to point out, anderson, is that not one person in the country of iceland has died from covid

after getting vaccinated. >> i mean, how great was it to hear that lady say, oh, it -- it's our civic duty? as if like duh, it's our civic duty. the number of people i just wish that was just something that people said everywhere. yeah. i mean, this is what you do to be a good citizen. gary, appreciate you going there. thank you very much. perspective on iceland and new details on vaccines in this country now from cnn chief medical correspondent, dr. sanjay gupta. um, sanjay, i'm sure you had the same thoughts. civic duty. i mean, that's -- is what it is all about. i want to get to the latest news on the vaccines in a moment. what do you make of -- of what's gone on in iceland? >> um, yeah, that was -- that was -- that was a great piece because it sort of shows what life can be like if, you know, we had higher vaccination rates. it's interesting, anderson, because you go to a place like vermont and i think vermont's probably about twice the population of -- of iceland. just small -- i think iceland's like 350,000 people. vermont is pretty similar. in terms of vaccination rates.

16 plus, you know, getting close to 90% vaccination rates. so you got these pockets of that sort of civic duty, as you and gary were talking about. but -- but obviously, if you look at overall the status in the country, we got about 52% that are fully vaccinated. 9% more that are partially vaccinated. and it's that red in the upper-left corner. the eligible unvaccinated. that %epercentage is just too high, anderson and that's the problem. 98% of people in the hospital in with covid from june and july, are that red part of the pie graph there. >> by the way, how is vermont doing in terms of covid? >> well, they -- you know, it's interesting because they still have higher spread than they did a couple of weeks ago or about three or four weeks ago now. but the overall hospitalizations and deaths are quite low. i mean, that -- that's the thing. we look at cases and then we look at hospitalizations and deaths. i think this is going to be a

big topic of conversation if we focus on cases alone, we realize we are dealing with a very transmissible virus. but overall, in terms of protecting against hospitalization and death, if you have a higher vaccinated population, you are going to have a much lower hospitalization rate as they saw in iceland, as they see in vermont and connecticut and maine and other states like that. >> so let's talk vaccines. according to cdc, more than half of those fully vaccinated against covid in the u.s. received pfizer. and today, they started submitting an application for their booster dose. at the same time, the almost 14 million people who have received the johnson & johnson vaccine, they have been waiting for news about a booster. they got some news today. what happened? >> yeah. i mean, the 14 million people, i mean, they're frustrated. i think i have probably heard from just about every one of them through e-mail or social media. it's -- it's understandable. i mean, because -- but because they were -- they were authorized later. because it's a smaller segment of the population. there's less data. let me show you what they -- what they talked about today. this -- these are small studies basically looking at what happened if they got a -- a booster of the -- of the johnson & johnson vaccine.

they found, first of all, that it's pretty effective against moderate and severe disease. when they got the booster six months later, they found that antibody levels went up about ninefold compared to after the first shot. the big question, anderson, and this is going to be a question, i think we are going to be asking for some time is what does that translate to? get more antibodies. does it actually equate to people doing better, more protection against hospitalizations and deaths? more protection even against severe illness? i don't know that we can say that, yet. and i think that's going to be a topic of discussion. with all the boosters. johnson & johnson. up next, the search for the covid origin. the latest on a federal report exploring the question and why some experts are worried time is running out to get any kind of meaningful answer. new customers get our best deals on all smartphones. that's right. but what if i'm already a customer? oh, no problem. hey, cam...? ah, same deal! yeah, it's kind of our thing.

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given that president biden has already gotten the long anticipated intelligence report on the origins of covid and that it reportedly reached no clear conclusion the question now is what we could learn when the unclassified version comes out. the white house says it should be released soon but investigators are not even confident they'll ever know for sure whether the virus came from the wuhan lab or from animal to human transmission. joining me for more perspective is a world health organization advisory committee member and former national security staffer in the clinton administration.

jamie, we haven't seen the full contents of the report yet. what we've seen even after 90 days of review by the nation's intelligence experts say it is still unclear how the virus started. what does that tell you? >> it doesn't tell us much. this was a very important first step but this review was always a first step. now we need a full investigation to get to the bottom of this. there is a lot of evidence fully available and should be in china but even if the chinese government continues to not participate and prevent any kind of investigation inside of china there are many other resources which we need access to and that is why this is a first step and we need to authorize the continuation of the biden intelligence review, a national covid, a bipartisan commission, and need to ramp up international efforts to have the kind of full investigation that has never been mandated to date. >> isn't the bottom line if china doesn't cooperate unless

there is human intelligence connections or signals intelligence it doesn't seem -- is it possible to actually learn the truth, what happened? >> it definitely makes everybody's job harder. but i don't think necessarily impossible. because there are a lot of things we can do, resources available outside of china. there are materials that were submitted for example to scientific journals before the chinese iron curtain went down early last year that could be accessed. there are whistle-blower provisions. i'm guessing there are hundreds of people inside of china who have highly relevant information about the origins of the pandemic who i'm guessing are probably afraid for their lives. they've seen people in prison for asking basic questions. we need to do that. the core point is no international investigation has ever been mandated. we can't not have an investigation and then say we'll

never find something. let's have the best possible investigation and see what we can get. >> why hasn't that been mandated? >> the big issue is last year, it is a little technical, the world health assembly, which is the governing body of the world health organization, the australian government proposed a full investigation. china punished australia with trade sanctions and a chinese supported resolution eventually passed that essentially did not authorize a full investigation into the origins of the pandemic but mandated a chinese controlled joint study into one single hypothesis that it jumped from animals to humans in the wild, not associated with any kind of laboratory research. so that is what has been done. that is where the real fight is. the w.h.o. director general has been incredibly courageous calling for a full audit of chinese labs, calling for the chinese authorities to share raw data, and china has flatly refused. they've attacked dr. tedros in the media. that is why again this is the

beginning of a process and we all, the united states government, governments around the world, need to be pushing for the best possible investigation and, again, we don't have one. we need one. >> since early last week you've talked about your belief that a lab incident is the most likely origin of the pandemic versus the other theory that it naturally jumped from animals to humans. if the intelligence experts are inconclusive, what is it that makes you believe the lab theory? oh, we just lost the guest. we'll try to get him back although we are at the end of the program so another time. always great to have him. we'll continue following that. up next, a baby born to afghan refugee parents on an evacuation flight out of kabul. wait till you hear the name that they chose. we'll be right back. if you have this... consider adding this. an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare. medicare supplement plans help by paying some of what medicare doesn't...

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