tv Navalny CNN April 24, 2022 8:00pm-10:00pm PDT
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true story of the man who took on putin and lived to tell the tale. >> putin tried to kill him. >> come on, poisoned? >> we are creating a coalition to fight this regime. >> i don't want corruption in russian. i ant to try to change it. >> "navalny," next on cnn. rolling. >> we're rolling. >> okay, we're going, guys? >> yeah. >> alexei, i want to talk about something we sort of touched on this morning. and you might hate this, but i really want you to think about it. if you are killed, if this does happen, what message do you
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leave behind to the russian people? >> oh come on, daniel, no. no way. like you're making movie for the case of my death. like again, i'm ready to answer your question, but let it be another movie, movie number two, like let's make a trailer out of this movie and in the case i would be killed, let's make a boring movie of memory. ♪ [ speaking foreign language ] ♪
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>> unexpectedly vladimir putin has a genuine challenger, a handsome 41-year-old lawyer alexei navalny who has chosen one of the most dangerous occupations in the world, running against the man who controls the kremlin. >> more than any other opposition figure in russia, alexei navalny gets ordinary people out to protest.
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i realized i can do a lot on my own with the support of my wife yulia, just small group of people i can rely on. zero money, a lot of work, internet and that's it. >> his youngest fans have turned to tiktok which has been crucial in spreading the word. >> navalny's posted hundreds of videos about his corruption investigations and they are wildly popular. >> the kremlin hates navalny so much that they literally refuse to say his name. [ speaking foreign language ]
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>> so we went to siberia to make a nice movie about local corruption. i expected a lot of police. i expected a lot of people who tried to prevent our filming, confiscate our camera os just break our cameras or try to beat us. i expected that sort of thing, and i was very surprised like, hmm. why is nobody here? why is there a -- i even have the strange feeling like -- like a lack of respect. seriously, i'm here. where's my police? the whole trip was the smoothest trip i ever had. i'm the kind a slave of thursdays because on thursday i
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have my online youtube show and then weekend i can spend with my family before another trip to another region. i was going home, and then i died. >> passengers on his flight from siberia heard alexei navalny cry out in agony. >> other passengers filming just after the plane makes an emergency landing in siberia. navalny then rushed to the hospital where he was put on a ventilator. his spokeswoman saying navalny was poisoned. >> his wife raced to be by his side.
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were no poisons found in his blood or other biological materials he has a metabolic disorder, lowering of blood sugar levels to be specific. >> we're hearing state news agencies here that are backed by the kremlin suggesting that hallucinogenic drugs may be involved but not poisoning. [ speaking foreign language ]
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the moment when i heard the news that navalny was poisoned, my first thought was can this be the kremlin? would they be so dumb to try to kill an opposition figure, the main opposition figure? i was thinking maybe it's one of the many oligarchs on whose feet he has stepped. either it's a state-ordered attack, or it's somebody who is trying to assassinate opposition figures in order to appease putin. >> the closest anyone has come to tracing a poisoning to vladimir putin, the 2018 attack in salisbury, england. a defiant kremlin insisting again that they had nothing to do with a brazen assassination attempt of former russian spy sergei skripal. >> skripal was poisoned by the
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military grade nerve agent novichok. >> the seriousness of novichok is it actually starts switching off your nerve connectors in your body one by one. if it goes properly it will turn you off as a body and then within hours any trace will disappear so it will always look like it was a natural death. >> this is why it appears to be the preferred form of killing for people whose death will be in the public scrutiny such as navalny. there was a lot of pressure for us to start investigating. media partners in russia reached out to us and said can you help? we looked at it and we thought there's no hope in hell we can investigate a crime that happened in russia, in the remote corners of siberia, sitting here comfortably in europe. we didn't even try in the
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>> to have your dad, an opposition leader, being poisoned by we don't know what, we don't know how, we don't know when, and just be in a random hospital. it was just -- it was surreal. it was literally like a book. >> hello. >> the doctors can't say anything about his brain. to which extent he will recover, even if they manage to wake him up. many millions of navalny supporters are trying to figure out how to help.
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we in berlin are a small team. we have to dive into actually like getting things done. >> we all were very skeptical about investigating alexei's poisoning. as opposed to previous cases this poisoning took place on russian soil so no one is going to share ctv footage with us. we're not going to have fancy videos from the airport where they poisoned his flight in and out. and as much as it hurts to admit, while putin is in power, we'll never find out the truth. >> yulia, how is your husband this morning? [ speaking foreign language ] >> it was so crazy, like it's
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putin's signature poison. >> we were actually so shocked that he didn't just decide to murder him but to poison and not just to poison but exactly the novichok is really like leaving his signature on a crime scene. when you come to room of a comatose patient, you're starting to just telling him some news, telling him his story. alexei, don't worry. your poisoning was a murder attempt. putin tried to kill you through novichok, and he opened his like blue eyes wide and looked at me and said very clear -- come on, poisoned? i don't believe it. like he is back. this is alexei.
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putin is supposed to be not so stupid to use this novichok. his wording, his expletive. his intonation. if you want to kill someone, just shoot him, jesus christ, like real alexei. it's impossible to believe it. it's kind of stupid. the whole idea of poisoning with a chemical weapon. what the [ bleep ]? this is why it's so smart because even reasonable people refuse to believe. what? come on, poisoned. seriously. [ speaking foreign language ]
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>> traditional journalism implies you meeting with a source and that source telling you a story. in today's world of fake news, we don't trust sources because we don't trust humans. we trust data. berlin cat is an organization of traditional nerds. most of us with an almost autistic-like fascination with numbers. every time you use your email, your your phone, make a doctor's appointment, take a train or a plane, every time you take a look at the atm or look at the
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screen of your phone, that leaves a trace. in a place like russia imagine the person who works at the travel agency that has access to the five manifests, getting $25 a day as a salary and then for another 25 they would be able to sell that flight manifest to anybody who asks for it. just because they will double their income for the day. this is a whole industry. data brokers are on the dark web. you negotiate a price and within a few minutes they say, yeah, i can get that data for you by tomorrow, and then you have to sent bitcoin. now bellingcat can pay for that data because it's a foundation. so i have to pay for that data myself. overly the last five years of working on data journalism i've spent hundreds of 50,000s of dollars. my wife has no idea of this. my wife thinks i spent 2,000 or 3,000 and if she knew she wouldn't be my wife. >> and she's not watching. >> she's not watching. i'm absolutely sure. she's not watching this movie
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>> for the longest time i wasn't sure what to make of navalny. i had always wondered how much of an independent figure he is, or is he one of the many fake opposition figure created by the kremlin? i criticized him on twitter, but he was known for having flirted with the extreme right in the early days of his career. he walked side by side with some pretty nasty nationalists and racists. had he moved beyond that? had he actually become a reverse dark knight? >> alexei navalny!
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>> within all my career i've been asked the same 15 questions all the time. are you afraid? are you working for kremlin? what is your family doing? you have a responsibility for your family when if it's foreign journalists they are asking about nationalism and russian march, and every one of them, jesus christ, just watch previous interviews. >> hold on.
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were there not a couple of sieg heilers at that thing. >> sorry? >> were there not a couple sieg heilers at that march? certainly would not be a different category you would not want to associate with. >> in the normal world, in the normal political system of course i would never be in the same political party with them, but we are creating coalition, broader coalition to fight the regime just to achieve the situation where everyone can participate in election. >> there's a lot of politicians that would be uncomfortable even associating or being in the same photograph as one of these guys. you're not uncomfortable about that? >> i'm okay with that and i consider it as my political superpower. i can talk to everyone. anyway, they -- the citizen of russian federation and if i want to fight putin, if i want to be leader of a country i can -- i cannot just ignore the huge part of it. well, there are a lot of people who call themselves nationalists. okay. let's discuss it. we're living in a country where
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[ speaking foreign language ] the russian media didn't find anything, and german investigators didn't have the jurisdiction, so we realized there's nobody was going to actually actively investigate this. unless we jump into this. we knew that the poison was novichok, and novichok we had proven in the previous investigation is only manufactured in this facility called the signal institute. the signal institute in moscow works under the guise of a r&d center that works in advance form of sports nutrition drinks. that's the legend, and yet they
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employ for this work 12 scientists whose only experience and background is in chemical weapons. our hypothesis, this is the entity that actually provides the poison for the killers which travel around the world poisoning people with novichok. so what we did is we bought from the russian black market. the phone records for the head of the signal institute. we looked at numbers that only appear just before the poisoning of navalny, and those were suspicious, but once we have a suspicious number, you go through a number of russian apps that allow you to see how that phone number is listed in other people's phone books, so, for example, i put in my number, and it would show up as kristol the journalist from bellingcat because somebody would have put my name into their phone book and that description would be shared.
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first number i looked up showed up as alexei, doctor from fsb. that was interesting, doctor from fsb, alexei. couldn't place a real person behind this name and looked to see if that number shows up in a car registration. that alexey owns a car and then this number was listed for contacting that person. so then you have a real person with a birthday. then you look up his passport file. you see his face. you repeat that many times with the other suspicious numbers. and then you have a short list of interesting people. and these became our prime suspects. now we knew when navalny had traveled to siberia. we had the actual passenger manifests of six different flights that had flown where into novosibirsk where navalny flew from moscow on the day before, during and after the day
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on which he arrived there. so we wanted to see if any of those suspicious people traveled to siberia at the time of the poisoning and we found an overlaps. we found a nest of wasps we didn't know existed. it's a domestic assassination machine on an industrial scale. i was absolutely shocked that this was so fast and the whole plot disentangled so quickly so i reached out via twitter and said alexei, i think we may have found who poisoned you. >> after i went out of the hospital, i decided to move into the black forest and live in some small village. you can just walk for hours an and not meet any person at all. these are my friends, little pony is my friend and donkey is yulia's friend. and this is routine of our walk.
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come here, my little pony. isn't he sweet? better than your donkey. >> everybody likes a small pony. it's like usual. but donkeys. >> come to me. you're scaring him. go away. go away. poor guy. donkey, hi. of course you like me. oh, come on. this is a very edible woman. come on, road carrots. you will grow big. they are cute but not very smart so they decided for their fence not to provide electricity. >> don't do it. [ speaking foreign language ]
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>> yulia wanted an apple and asked me to take it but it's germany so it's someone's apple, and there is a police over there. >> i'll cam there when it will be dark. >> and there's no police. >> so you're a russian criminal who arrived to germany. >> no, it's like a game. it belongs to the village. >> how do you know? how do you know it is the village? >> this is a very russian style, you know, thinking about property like it belongs to everyone because an open place. just come and get it. >> the story of this guy who
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lives in vienna but is bulgarian and worked in russia, and he has a lot of money and spends them on investigation of russian crimes, he just sounded too suspicious, too good to be true. capable? he sounded, you know, a bit made up. >> are you confident that he is not mi-6 or cia? >> i'm pretty confident. i wouldn't say i rule it out, but i'm pretty confident that he's not. >> i was suspicious about this guy from twitter. i just saw his old laptop, and all these tables with the data. it turns out, and i was very surprised, that the whole thing about bellingcat is just one smart guy. no cia involved, no mi-6. he's just a nice and very kind bulgarian nerd with a laptop.
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getting through to maria took much longer. she was very tough. she never smiled. she was the one vetting me whether i'm a spy or not. [ speaking foreign language ] >> but we needed information that only his team would be privy to. so we found a very workable arrangement, which was completely ethical and acceptable to us. we agreed that maria would be working as part of our team and she would not be sharing with alexei all the information in realtime so that we wouldn't be influenced by the bias of the victim. [ speaking foreign language ] ♪
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♪ >> when we discovered that clandestine operation, it was so shocking that even to us it looked unbelievable. i mean, come on. the government is paying a whole team of 20-plus people whose only job is to poison other russians? that sounds improbable. so we needed other journalists to look at it. >> i would like to share the limelight with some local media. >> yeah. >> so it is validated by more than just us. so cnn, d"der spiegel." >> that means we need to film exactly a week from now. [ speaking foreign language ]
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>> we had a nightmare trying to get everybody to stick to the same time. it's all time for simultaneous release. all the media channels are going to drop the bombshell simultaneously. >> there's a huge debate as whether this was intended to incapacitate or kill. >> incapacitate or kill. >> yeah. i would say kill, 100% kill. >> if, for example, navalny had laundry returned to him while he was staying at the tomsk hotel the afternoon before he left. >> yeah. >> would that be a point of access? >> it's definitely a possibility. the question is how well he can dose the agent that way. you put, say, ten times the deadly dose on the clothing. you have to be sure at least one lethal dose gets into the body.
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>> tomorrow we'll set up a phone with fake i.d. so if we can call them through this number. >> yes. >> we can try to confront them. >> yes, of course. >> navalny will call personally these poisoners one by one. and we will record this. >> hi, this is navalny. you may remember me from trying to kill me. >> [ speaking foreign language ]. >> they say great to see you. thanks for coming. >> is it your contention that vladimir putin must have been aware of this? >> of course. 100%. it could have not happened without --
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>> [ speaking foreign language ]. >> who's the most stupid? >> most stupid of them? >> yeah p. >> well, definitely spetznaz guys with no training. i think it makes sense to try to prank stupid guys and maybe these non-military guy. you guys blend right in. the world needs you back. i'm retired greg, you know this. people have their money just sitting around doing nothing... that's bad, they shouldn't do that. they're getting crushed by inflation. well, i feel for them. they're taking financial advice from memes. [baby spits out milk] i'll get my onesies®. ♪ “baby one more time” by britney spears ♪ good to have you back, old friend. yeah, eyes on the road, benny. welcome to a new chapter in investing. [ding] e*trade now from morgan stanley.
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chernobyl disaster because actually my father and his family, they are from chernobyl, from the small village two kilometers away, i would say, ten kilometers away from the nuclear station. everyone knows that it was an explosion of the nuclear station, but news keeping silence. and so all this nuclear and radioactive dust was on these fields, and they were forced to go to plant potatoes just to prevent rumors, just to explain population that everything is fine, everything is okay, go and work to the fields. and with the first appearance of putin on the screen i just felt it. i have this same feeling, like i am watching teaching and i'm watching political leader and he's looking in my eyes and lying to me.
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>> this is the biggest challenge for me. i try to practice juggling about a month. and because of coordination and balancing, because you need some balance here, it's -- i'm very bad in it. one, two, three. >> i think he wants to make sure this hits home in russian media. that's based on if he does it. so we're not being journalists reporting about some politician but we're reporting about a politician who has his own y youtube show with over 30 million followers and who considers himself half a journalist. >> yeah! >> actually, this first time you're lucky. >> that's a very unusual situation and it doesn't make things easier. >> mom, is this yours?
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>> hold my beer while i make -- >> no, no, no. >> just the second one? >> filming me and i'm asking how bizarre. ♪ ♪ how bizarre ♪ again. ♪ how bizarre ♪ you should remove the second one. >> we can do that? >> yes, of course. >> i don't know how to do that. >> who's 19? >> you apparently. ♪ ♪ funky ♪ ♪ how bizarre ♪ ♪ how bizarre, how bizarre ♪ >> you know that christo called it moscow 4. you know what is moscow 4?
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>> no, what is that? >> well, the e-mail of the very top brass guy from intelligence was hacked several times. and his first password was moscow 1, and they hacked him. so second his password was moscow 2. and they hacked him as well. and so the third time he had password moscow3. and just guess what was his fourth password. so moscow4 is explanation of the stupidity of the system. >> dasha, do you take my phone and we'll be at the kitchen pretending you're general bogdanov. >> i have no idea. >> [ speaking fon language ].
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>> tomorrow we will make these calls. honestly, i don't think it will work because, well, fsb guys, they're supposed to be resistant to pranks. but moscow4. >> moscow4. >> yes. and then we're ready to push the button and everything will be published exactly at 12:00. and also i will publish my tiktok. i record it today. and we will have a kind of 15 minutes of shame with it. okay. see you tomorrow.
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>> i think you will be president after this. >> we will definitely kill. >> poor kudryavtsev. >> let's offer him to defect. let's arrange for him the whole thing. >> seriously. >> because i think that's a humanitarian thing to do. >> but he will be in a ditch by tomorrow. they will kill him. >> they will kill him. they will kill him. okay. "der spiegel" had been begging me to call them. since the morning. can i tell them about this already? >> let's decide. are we going to publish this conversation? i think we should wait. >> for the press conference at the very least. >> sorry? >> putin's press conference at the very least. >> yes. it is on thursday? yes, 17th. [ speaking foreign language ]
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>> high five. >> high five. >> okay. >> good. good, good, good. let's go. >> now an exclusive investigation can reveal a top secret mission. >> an elite team of operatives has been tracking navalny's every move for more than three years. >> [ speaking foreign language ]. >> thank you very much. it's an honor for me to be on such a big television of spain, and i'm very pleased that you are paying attention to this situation. so thank you very much. this scheme which looks like it's from the movies, but in this particular case it's a real scheme with real people. putin on the very top. >> in mid-august, navalny and his team traveled to siberia. at least five members of the fsb unit make the same journey on different flights.
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tayakin lives. >> my name is clarissa ward. i work for cnn. can i ask you a couple of questions? [ speaking foreign language ] was it your team -- so you've said you want to go back to russia. you're aware of the risks of going back. >> definitely. >> why do you want to go back? >> i don't want these group of killer exist in russia. i don't want putin being president. i don't want him being czar of russia. i want to go back and try to change it. >> that's a fantastic piece. >> yeah. [ speaking foreign language ] >> [ speaking foreign language ] .
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>> he opens his mouth with american songs on tiktok. by the way -- [ speaking foreign language ] >> the airlines. >> yes. >> crazy funny stuff like who's he? >> [ speaking foreign language ]. >> think about it. they're talking about this all the time. they're talking about you. >> in their version it's ha, ha, ha, this is very funny. >> but the main point is they have a big problem, otherwise they would not launch it. >> right, right, right.
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>> she plays chess. >> better than all others in our family. >> better than everyone in our family. and because of this series -- >> "queen's gambit." >> "queen's gam.." gambit." she is demanding that everyone should play chess. >> but nobody is playing. that's why i'm playing with the phone. >> i definitely prefer "call of duty". >> i definitely prefer chess. >> i prefer shopping.
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do if my dad was killed. whenever i had like the talk, you know, it's not anything that you can like sit at the table and discuss. >> so it's a nice opportunity for you, dasha, to see the snow, so much snow before you go to l.a., right? >> there is snow in california. >> there was a point a year ago where my dad was almost not there for my high school graduation. he was in jail once again. and like the whole day i was just thinking about how my dad would have been -- i'm sorry. my dad would have been proud to see me walk on the stage and get my certificate. and he wouldn't get that option because he was in jail for doing the right thing.
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poison him of course we would have poisoned him. i mean, just we will -- i mean, the whole argumentation, we will smash it with kudryavtsev. >> i'm just very curious how people will react to it, whether they will be as astonished as we are hopefully. because nothing like that has ever happened to anyone. . >> [ speaking foreign language ].
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>> it's totally unbelievable. i would never believe it if i wasn't part of it. 300 -- 300,000 views for 20 minutes. >> one hour later, one million views. maria. >> the poisoning of russian dissident alexei navalny has taken an even more bizarre turn. >> if this was a hollywood movie, you would say it was over the top. but this is not. this is real. and boy, does this conversation punch a giant hole in the kremlin's narrative. >> surely this is hugely embarrassing for the kremlin and for the fsb. >> oh, absolutely.
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it's embarrassing for mr. kudriavtsev. it's embarrassing for the fsb. it's embarrassing for the kremlin. >> the fsb has said the video of the conversation posted on navalny's youtube channel was fake, and that the phone call was a provocation aimed at discrediting the agency. >> navalny is suffering from delusion of persecution. otherwise, there is a freudian fixation on his own crotch area. this is probably how all this should be treated. >> [ speaking foreign language ]. control of my health, so i do what i can.
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♪ ♪ nice suits, you guys blend right in. the world needs you back. i'm retired greg, you know this. people are taking financial advice from memes. [baby spits out milk] i'll get my onesies®. ♪ “baby one more time” by britney spears ♪ e*trade now from morgan stanley. stuff. we love stuff. and there's some really great stuff out there. but i doubt that any of us will look back on our lives and think, "i wish i'd bought an even thinner tv, found a lighter light beer, or had an even smarter smartphone." do you think any of us will look back on our lives and regret the things we didn't buy? or the places we didn't go? ♪ i'd go the whole wide world ♪ ♪ i'd go the whole wide world ♪
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pro authoritarian leader or you're against authoritarian leader. so we're in more primitive politics like human rights, freedom of speech, fair election. the power and money, tax money, they supposed to belong to the local communities. and in russia everything decided in moscow. so being a president, i just have this big pie of my power, and i will cut it for the future of russia. ♪ >> [ speaking foreign language ].
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>> i apologize. i'm sorry for the record, but just five minutes ago told daniel to get the [ bleep ] out of here with his camera. so like i apologize for that because, well, it's -- everything is like -- everything is happening in the last ten minutes and i have to make like a millions of e-mails. have a seat. maria, have a seat. you make me nervous because you're standing there. i'm sorry.
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>> the anti-riot police started arresting everybody, including journalists, live on the air. this is crazy. jesus. jesus. i've never seen anything like this. [ screaming ] there is no way they're not going to arrest him. >> i do not think they will let him come to the front. >> i think they're going to yank him away before anybody else is let off the plane. ♪
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hello, welcome to our viewers in the united states and around the world. in paris. where a high profile victory here in france has been welcomed by american and european allies amid russia's war in ukraine. macron pulls off a dramatic reelection. and the u.s. secretary of state and defense complete a visit to president zelenskyy in kyiv. now, despite macron'
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