check. check. and check. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal; cancers, including lymphoma and skin cancer; death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older... with at least 1 heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq... as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. put uc in check and keep it there, with rinvoq. ask your gastroenterologist about rinvoq. and learn how abbvie could help you save. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com the news continues. i want to hand it over to laura coates and "cnn tonight." laura? >> thanks anderson. i'm laura coates and this is "cnn tonight." first on cnn, we now know the name of a new january 6th witness and what could be the final january 6th committee public hearing that's set for prime time thursday night.

we're learning that person is matthew pottinger. and he is set to testify, apparently this coming thursday. he served on then-president trump's national security council. but he decided to resign in the middle of the riot. >> one of my staff brought me a printout of a tweet by the president. and the tweet said something to the effect that mike pence, the vice president, didn't have the courage to do what should have been done. i -- i read that tweet and made a decision at that moment to resign. that's where i knew i was leaving that day once i read that tweet. >> a reminder of what that tweet said, quote, mike pence didn't have the courage to do what

should have been done to protect our country and our constitution, unquote. when trump was out of sight from the public during the riot, of course, he had time to slam his on vp on twitter and did nothing to lower the temperature anywhere across this country, let alone at the capitol. and for all the hours and hours and hours of video that we have seen from january 6th, from the rioters, to the evacuation of the vice president, we still didn't have any visual evidence in what the commander in chief was doing that day. and mind you, it's over three hours, 187 minutes worth of time. >> so, we're going to -- we're going to walk down pennsylvania avenue. i love pennsylvania. and we're going to the capitol. we have to have peace, so go home. we love you. you're very special. >> well, what happened in those special moments in between?

well, that's the main focus thursday night. >> we have filled in the blanks. i can't necessarily say that the motives behind every piece of information we know will be able to explain, but this is going to open people's eyes in a big way. the reality is -- i'll give you this preview -- the president didn't do much but gleefully watch television during this time frame. we're going to present a lot more than that. >> along with pottinger, former white house press secretary sara matthews, seen right there, is also set to testify. she also resigned the night of january 6th, after saying that she was, quote, deeply disturbed by what she saw. so, the question, of course, is just what exactly did you see that we did not see on our television screens that same day? so, what will we learn from matthews? and will it be additive or corroborative in some way? both?

neither? as a committee chair, bennie thompson might say, stay tuned. meanwhile, why is steve bannon smiling? that's him going into federal court today. and i repeat, federal court today, not as a spectator, as a defendant. with jury selection now under way in his contempt trial on charges to comply with the january 6th select committee. recall he just blew off their subpoena for testimony, never provided documents related to january 6th. and tonight, bannon is still angling, it seems, for an open mic as long as it's in front of the january 6th committee, that is. >> i really want to thank all the jurors for being truthful and blunt. i think that was great. i think it would have been more productive if we'd been on capitol hill with open mics addressing the nation with the nonsense, this show trial they've been putting up on capitol hill. it's time they start having other witness and give other

testimony other than what they've been putting up. >> don't worry. that happened on the hill as a legislative hearing. they won't have the same thing as your criminal trial. there will be opportunity for you to, of course, should you choose to, testify or anything else. keep in mind, steve bannon, who could spend at least 30 days and up to a year in jail if convicted, he's on trial because he refused to talk to that committee, the same one he's now wanting to listen to him. only this month, did bannon actually tell the committee he was willing to testify, ideally in public. that came after bannon said he got a letter from donald trump waiving executive privilege. federal prosecutors say even if that privilege applied here, it never gave him a carte blanche to ignore the subpoena and not answer a single question or hand over documents. but we are in the united states of america. there is a presumption of innocence, and prosecutors must carry and meet their burden. so, what if bannon is acquitted

in this trial? what if they don't, for jury's sake, actually convict. it's not that complicated a case in terms of whether he appeared or provided documents. but what might complicate is if bannon does walk. does that mean that others can then walk all over congress? could, say, a former president laugh off the idea, the very notion of testifying under oath to this panel or anyone else? how about a trump loyalist like peter navarro, who has his own deal, has just turned down a plea deal from the doj. if bannon were to walk, would he feel emboldened to keep quiet? we're joined by former chief of staff of the homeland security under trump. he knows the former official, matthew pottinger, who will testify this thursday. i want to talk to you first, but

i will not ignore everyone else in the panel. i will get your name right, ramesh. i know your name. listen. you know this person. i have to ask you, what do you expect the person to actually say? and what is your take on how he will be received? >> look, i think the ex-president is really sweating this because unlike other people that have testified, where ex-president trump has said this was a low-level aide, i've never seen this person -- let's be clear, matt pottinger was the deputy national security advise tore the president of the united states. he went on trips with him. he sat with him in the white house situation room. he was often where the president was when the national security adviser wasn't. he was on the calls with foreign leaders. this is a very close inside. trump cannot say he did not know matt pottinger. look, he's also worried because matt pottinger, the one i knew, the one i served with, is a very honest man, is respected for being very straightforward and

being very apolitical. matt's a former marine, he tells it like it is, and he's understated. he's not a show boat. she didn't try to get attention for his time before or after the administration. he's going to want to tell the truth. to the question of what he might have seen, i think we're going to find out matt was likely in the west wing of the white house the day this happened on january 6th and is the person that you would expect to be the one to want to pick up the phone for donald trump and call someone like the secretary of defense, like other people in law enforcement to try to get the attack to stop. in fact, i can think of few people better positioned to talk about being worried about the lapse of those 187 minutes. that would be matt's job to try to work on behalf of the president to stop that attack. and i think all of this time we've looked for a smoking gun in this case. and the closest thing to a smoking gun was already out there. it's the fact that the ex-president waited three hours to do something. and the question that i'm sure matt pottinger is going to get

asked is, why did trump not stop this? and i think we probably know the answer is that he didn't want it to be stopped. but those questions are going to be very interesting to hear from someone who should have been the person to place that phone call for trump if he had decided to make it stop. >> i think, again, who's in the room where it happens? who were the people who would have known what president trump was doing at the time or not doing at the time. i think a lot of people wonder this exppoint, a lot of people resigned on january 6th. obviously it stands in stark contrast to many of the other scandals that happened during the trump presidency. but will that undermine the notion that only now are we hearing from him? a lot of people have sort of criticized those who are -- i don't want to call them johnny-come-latelies, but the idea that the epiphanies are much more delayed for others. >> i think pottinger is an interesting case because he survived a lot of tumult at the

national security council. i think a lot of people who work for an administration, particularly for the trump administration who had serious misgivings about president trump, told themselves they were doing some good and avoiding some harm. and i think that is an easier justification to make if you're the deputy national security adviser than you are if you're in any number of other positions. >> the adult in the room. you're kind of smirking, i can't tell. >> yes and no. everybody knew who donald trump was back in 2015 when he announced for the presidency. so, it should have been a surprise to nobody what you got in 2020. >> but the direction is a shock, right? insurrection is a shock. >> in general you don't expect insurrections to happen. i will stipulate to that, counsel. however, i was a political appointee for eight years. i was in government for 15

years. and people serve for a lot of different reasons. and to some extent you've got to give people credit for trying to be the adult in the room. that said, you knew what you were getting and you shouldn't have been that surprised with what you got. >> i want to add i love my friend elliott but -- >> here comes a final -- sounds like, with all due respect. >> i have more angst than anyone about the fact that people didn't lead with others and join the campaign against donald trump. >> when did you leave? >> i left year two of the administration. >> okay. >> very, very frustrated that more people didn't do it the same time. matt pottinger, though, is one of the people i would give a pass to. i cannot tell you how many days after i left, i would actually say to people, i'm glad folks like matt are still in because we knew how volatile trump was, especially on foreign and defense policy issues. and matt was indeed one of the very last adults in the room in that white house and in a national security role, he needed to be one of those last adults. >> but there is a separate

question. it may have been the straw that led him to resign, but as is true of a lot of other figures in the administration, it wasn't enough for him to say publicly a lot of the things we are going to be hearing now. so, he needed to reach another threshold in order to be willing to talk. and i think that that is something that's been replicated by other members of that administration. >> subpoena, you're saying? >> i think that that's a legitimate question. if some of these things are of public import, that they're things that the public needed to know, i think that after you're out of government, you've got a responsibility to talk about some of those things. >> this is testimony under oath. you know, folks have their come to jesus moment, whether it's write a book, give a press conference, or whatever it is, there's something to be said for testifying under oath and putting their words on the record. you know, look, ramesh, i share some skepticism of, you know, folks who sort of knew what they were getting. but, again, it's complicated.

it's just far more comp lit kated. >> i think this is so discrediting for trump. we don't have to say anything. he's going to be off the national stage. he's going to be politically marginalized and that turned out not to be true. >> last i checked there were 435 members of congress who have the floor at any time to talk about what whatever they like to, including republicans and democrats, and even more who could come forward without a subpoena. stick around. we're going to focus in on the steve bannon trial as well. if he's so ready to tell his point publicly, should he testify in his own defense inside the courtroom? and how much is he willing to risk to remain loyal to donald trump? as if there was a ceiling. that's next. ♪ my name is austin james. as a musician living with diabetes, fingersticks can be a real challenge. that's why i use the freestyle libre 2 system.

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a very good first day. that's how steve bannon described the first day of his federal trial for criminal contempt for refusing to cooperate with the january 6th committee. 22 potential jurors were picked today. the jury is going to widdle down a little more and might be finalized as early as tomorrow. then you've got opening arguments underway. does bannon have any reason to think it was a really good day? back with me, elliott williams, miles taylor, and ramesh pa rue mu. there's an element of bravado, the person who said the misdemeanor from hell, challenged everyone from doing this, at one point tried to have pelosi subpoenaed and other members of the committee. is this bravado, or is he trying to say i'm a maga martyr here and look at me? or is there cause for him to

think, hey, might get off? >> he very well might. laura, this is really straightforward as far as crimes go. this isn't rico or racketeering or some sort of big, complicated statute. you've got to prove three things. was there a subpoena. did the guy know it was a subpoena? and did he intend to violate it? and you can do that in a day. it's really straightforward. it's why it's a misdemeanor. the question is, is the jury fooled into thinking somehow that there's something more complicated than this. but this is really, really straightforward. and it's rare to that -- look, you've been a prosecutor before too. most of the times it's much tougher than this. this is really straightforward. he did it in front of all of us. he talked about it. he ought to be convicted. >> he's the star witness. the calendar is the month of whatever i asked you to come in. there's still the touchy area of did i think i had a reason not to. >> the judge has disallowed a lot of the potential defenses, which means we could end up having a trial that is shorter

than the jury selection process was. what i think he is happy to do, what i think that that smile suggests, is that he wants to use this trial or a show trial, as he calls it, to burnish his martyrdom in the eyes of the people he wants to continue to grift from. that's what he has been doing for several years now. but he is a testimony that could be very interesting also, a very different way than pottinger because we do know that before the election, he was saying, if trump loses, he's just going to go out there and say that he won. so, that actually goes to the state of mind question, which has been kind of an open question in this investigation. how much did trump -- was trump diluted? and how much was he knowingly lying about the election? >> i wonder how much they'll open the door. if steve bannon goes on the stand, i can't imagine prosecutors are going to say, let's just focus on the contempt. nothing else matters.

you're going in and everything he might say. one thing i want to hear more about, miles, is there are deleted text messages from the secret service. as much as i want to know what steve bannon has to say, i really want to know how it can be that you've got secret service text messages after i asked you to keep them, poof, go away. what are your thoughts on this? i mean, it's a little bit confounding, a little bit nerve wracking to think this is happening if it's anything nefarious. >> the secret service agents themselves are well-meaning patriots. but this is an agency whose culture is absolutely, completely broken. i've seen that for ten years from capitol hill all the way to the department of homeland security. it's an agency that's broken. >> but broken how? >> it's become a magnet for misconduct because the agency has always prided itself in total independence. they protect the president of the united states.

trust us, let us do our thing. without the appropriate oversight, there's a lot of mismanagement that happens in that agencies. i dealt with this on a regular basis, agents that were trading positions to the vice president's detail or president's detail based on favoritism, not necessarily based on performance. we saw a lot happen in the secret service and it was worrying. worst still, donald trump exploited that by taking senior secret service employees and bringing them into positions that should be political. he take this is guy, tony ornato, and makes him the white house deputy chief of staff. >> the one cassidy hutchinson says was in the room talking about this display of grabbing the steering wheel on the way to the capitol. but, you know, again, what you just said, i mean, what's in those messages do you think? i mean, you're shaking your head like you don't want to know. i want to know what's in the messages. >> i think the explanation is incredibly fishy. >> yes. >> and when i see spokespeople for these agencies come out and give excuses, i actually feel bad for them because my response

is i worry you don't have the details. i've dealt with agencys that don't provide the details when you're in the middle of a crisis. right now i do not think we're to the bottom of it. >> if your phone records or my phone records are not subpoenaed, we cannot say, god help me, we have a device migration. >> step back. they had a device migration, quote, unquote, they were switching telephones and erasing data. why is a government agency erasing any data? there's all sorts of rules across the government. that's odd as it is. and the timing seems odd. at a minimum, both congress and the independent inspector general -- >> we're talking about this didn't happen on september 24th. it was january 5th and january 6th. these are consequential days that have happened. i'm wondering when you hear from, say, congresswoman zoe lofgren who seem to think we're

going to have these tomorrow, i wonder whose timeline she's on? i wonder if there are theings that are going to happen? >> this wouldn't be the first time in the investigation that the committee has had a witness that was not willing to provide the text mess sanls. the staff have done digital forensics in some cases to get information the witnesses were not providing. i suspect they'll rely on similar techniques and others to make sure they get to the bottom of this. >> there's a political importance here as well because the most gripping testimony we've had out of this committee so far is probably the cassidy hutchinson testimony. and then it was sort of left out there hanging because we didn't have corroboration, but we didn't -- we just had people raising questions in the press about it. but neobody's actually stepped forward and directly contradicted it. you could argue the committee shouldn't have gone to second-hand information that she was providing, but it has taken

on a life of its own. >> it's under oath. people can say what they want to reporters. people can say what they want to their friends. they have not come in and testified and they ought to. there's a difference between a sworn witness. she's worn and giving testimony that she's swearing is honest and others not. >> you described the legal term for that is -- i believe. we're talking about the idea of whether secret service or someone trying to take him to the capitol, the part no one contested was the president of the united states knew there were armed members of the cloud and said, let them in, they're going to the capitol next. to me, that was the story of cassidy hutchinson testimony. thank you so much. we'll turn to uvalde next. we took you through all 77 minutes of that leaked surveillance video as it happened in real time right here on friday night. but now, there's even more video out from police body cameras along with an extensive state

house report. there's new anger from the victims' families, and we all understand why. but do the findings get us closer to making sure this kind of response never happens again? that's coming up. wealth is breaking ground on your biggest project yet. worth is giving the people who build it a solid foundation.

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officers -- responded to the massacre in uvalde. and yet none of them, not one thought to take charge of the crisis at hand. it was a leaderless response, according to a preliminary report by a texas house investigative committee. just one of numerous consequential failures that very tragic day. we're learning this as new police body camera videos offer an even closer look at those horrible 77 long minutes of inaction. a warning, these scenes are very hard to watch. >> shots fired! get inside. go, go, go! >> one female shot. >> shots fired inside the building, uvalde .

>> careful, guys. shots fired. >> that was just two minutes after the gunman entered the school. the hallway full of the smoke from gunfire. we know that more shots would ring out, leading to the officers' retreat. the officer whose body cam you just watched then ran outside to issue a radio call, at one point telling dispatch that he believed the gunman was contained in an office, not inside of a classroom.

>> male subject's in the school on the west side of the building. he's contained. we got multiple officers inside the building at this time. we believe he's barricaded in one of the offices. there's still shooting. >> but it wasn't an office. it was a classroom, and more than one, with children and teachers inside. that was just one of the crucial pieces of misinformation that very day. it's part of what further moved what was such an urgent situation at first into this, officers standing around and waiting for more resources and backup. when roughly 20 minutes passed -- just think about how long that is for a child, for a person, for anyone. when roughly 20 minutes passed, one officer said this.

>> what are we doing here? >> what are we doing here? it's painful to hear knowing that the man who should have been incident commander at the scene, under school policy, mind you, was addressing this entire situation like it was a barricade situation, even looking for a key to a door that was likely unlocked. even as some officers at the scene were learning this. >> we have a child on the line. >> what was that? a child called 911? >> the shooter is still standing. >> the room is full of victims. >> victims in the room? >> child on the phone, multiple victims. a child just called. they have victims in there. >> they knew a child had called

911, and they were outside. the chief, for his part, kept his focus on negotiating with the shooter, even after a burst of more gunshots were heard. >> sir, if you can hear me, please put your firearms down, sir. we don't want anyone else hurt. >> that's what we're doing. we're trying to get him out. they're going to break the window. >> sir, if you can hear me, please put your gun down. we don't want anyone else hurt. >> the use of the word, sir, knowing what we know now is painful to hear. nearly a half hour would pass before officers would breach that door. and the why -- the why -- is still unfathomable. >> they could have rushed in. maybe not all of them were going to make it, but at least in their final moments to hold

their hand and comfort them, to let them know that they're with them. but they did the total opposite of that. they stood there as people bled out. they stood there as they took their final breath. >> we'll take all this new video and the findings to a former police commissioner and the cnn reporter who's been on this story from the very beginning. that's next. he's feeling it. yep, them too. it's an invigorating rush... ...zapping millions of germs inin seconds. for that one-of-a-kind whoa... ...which leaves you feeling... ahhhhhhh listerine. feel the whoa!

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tonight, uvalde shooting survivors and their families are demanding school district officials pay attention to their fears of trying to return to school. watch. >> i'm going to be a senior. how am i supposed to come back to this school? what are you guys going to do to make sure i don't have to watch my friends die? what are you going to do to make sure i don't have to wait 77 minutes bleeding out on my classroom floor just like my little sister did. >> my daughter has something to say. >> this was the last dress that all my friends saw me on. most of those kids were my friends. and that's not good. and i don't want to go to your guys' school if they don't have

protection. >> and she's encouraged for her friends not to go to school too. >> i feel like that's something my own daughter would say and hold up the dress. it's just -- what answers can they give? the school board meeting come just a day after texas lawmakers released a report outlying the multiple systemic failures and the, quote, egregious, unquote, poor decision making that day. that's the understatement of the century. i want to bring in shimon prokupecz, who is leading our fight for truth on the ground in uvalde, and veteran police commissioner, charles ramsey. we're seeing so much that's happening. i want to know, shimon, from where you are, you're on the ground in uvalde, pursuing the truth the families deserve. you've heard from the family

members. you've heard a little girl. you've heard an older sister of somebody that passed away in that classroom. what are the families, what's the community say sng. >> reporter: well, i will tell you one thing, laura, i'm certainly noticing a difference with the families is that they're becoming -- they're kind of finding their voice. they're starting to really speak out. they're starting to organize. they're starting to voice their opinions, their unhappiness. they want accountability. they want chief peter arredondo fired. he's the school police chief. he's been on administrative leave. but the central theme tonight was we want him fired. i've been to other meetings here with the parents. this is a school board meeting. they usually don't speak out as much. but, you know, the difference is noticeable. and i think it's this report that came out listing all of the problems, some of the deficiencies in the school security, and some of the failures on the part of the school. and i really do think seeing images now from inside the

school, the body camera footage that we obtained and that the mayor ultimately released as well as the other images from inside the school. they're starting to get information. they're starting to see things. and they're starting to become angier and angier. it's obvious why. they were not being told the truth, so they're starting to voice their opinions. they're scared. they're scared to send their children to school. so, the school has to come up with some solutions. the one thing people should know is that this community is starting to stand up for itself. this community is starting to have a voice. and that is a good thing because there was a time they didn't want to say anything. but now they're starting to speak. and it's impactful and i do believe it's going to make a difference. >> one of the sad realities is sometimes you learn to stand up for yourself when you know nobody is coming. nobody came. nobody helped.

nobody saved. nobody came as the hero and the savior. and that's one of the biggest tragedies we're seeing here. when you look at this, commissioner ramsey, based on your assessment, in the report we're seeing, the law enforcement response or lack thereof, now do you have more of a bird's eye view into what happened through body cam footage? what is your take now? >> well, i mean, it was just a chaotic scene. excuse me. a certain level of chaos you're going to find at any active scene like that. but there was absolutely no leadership, no direction. i mean, there was nothing that was taking place that should have been taking place during that period of time in order to stop the carnage taking place in those two classrooms. there's just no excuse for it, none at all. you look at the chief. he's there. he's fumbling with keys, as opposed to trying to organize some kind of tactical response to get to that shooter. you got 400 police officers responding. that's far too many.

that's too many people on a scene. it just creates more confusion. if you don't have a specific role, you don't need to be there. somebody's got to coordinate what's happening inside the building as well as outside. that's why you have incident command. that's why you have a command post established. none of that took place. so, you know, the resident of uvalde, i'm glad to hear that they are speaking up. they deserve answers, and they deserve action. i would have fired arredondo a long time ago. i don't know what's taking so long because clearly he's not a person that should lead anything, let alone a police force. >> thinking about if there's 400 officers on that scene, arredondo is the only name that comes up in that conversation. i want to put on the screen for everyone to see. these are the planned safety and security enhancements that are coming for the upcoming school year, 2022-2023. it includes new perimeter fencing, additional security cameras, upgrading doors and

locks, hiring police officers and campus personnel, and also training. shimon, when you see what their plan is in connection with what is being demanded tonight at the school board meeting, is this even close to sufficient for the families and communities in uvalde? do they believe so? >> no, no. no, they don't. they're talking about going back to virtual classes, right? they're asking if they could just keep their kids at home. they don't trust the folks here, and it's understandable. they shouldn't trust them. they were not told the truth. there have been a lot of meetings behind closed doors, a lot of parents raising that issue here tonight that your guys school board, you have these meetings. you're sitting behind closed doors, we don't know what you're talk about. last time they did this meeting, they gave parents three minutes to talk. smartly, finally, the school board decided we're fiat had going to put a time limit. the parents will come in and talk as long as they needed. at one point they were putting time limits -- and how many

people could speak. they've changed that. >> how about this, shimon, how do they give 400 parents 77 minutes to talk. those numbers sound right to me. >> right. right. >> it's unbelievable. >> you know, having been here -- >> real quick, chief ramsey, sorry. >> yes, just very quickly, i mentioned arredondo, he's not the only one that ought to be held accountable. there were a lot of people that failed in this response, and there needs to be a thorough investigation. i don't think the department of public safety ought to do it. much of the misinformation came from that agency. it needs to be an independent investigation. >> and that's happening now, shimon, i think at some point. you're on the ground giving us all the information. thank you for being here and there. thank you to both. now, i want you to try to imagine this. imagine trying to fill one of your prescriptions and getting

denied because the medicine that you rely on just so happens to also be used to end a pregnancy. that's what some patients across this country are dealing with, and i mean right now in the aftermath of roe v. wade. one of the patients at risk joins me next. it's an entire trading exexperience. with innovation that lets you customize interfaces, , charts and orders to your style of trading. personalized education to e expand your perspective. and a dedicated trade desk of expert-level support. that will push you to be even better. and just might change how you trade—forever. because once you experience thinkorswim® by td ameritrade ♪ there's no going back. before treating your chronic migraine— 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more you're not the only one with questions about box®. botox® prevents headaches in adultsith chronic migraine before they even start—th about 10 minutes of treatment once ery 3 months. so, ask your doctor if botox® ,

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yeah, i said that you should learn french because it makes you sound smart. i got you. you know what else is smart, alec? donating to shriners hospitals for children. i thought you'd say that. and you know what? you're right. just think what it would be like if people didn't support shriners hospitals for children every month. i don't even want to think about it. i know so many kids whose lives are completely different because of the specialized care shriners hospitals for children provides. yeah. like sebastian, who can stand now? yeah. and the best part is, it's so easy to become a monthly supporter. all you need to do is call the number on your screen or go to loveshriners.org your support will make sure our amazing doctors and nurses keep helping kids like us who need them now and in the future. alec, do you think i could try this part?

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the impact this supreme court decision to overturn roe's growing. now affecting people who aren't seeking an abortion. or even try to get pregnant. my next guest has crohn's disease. and to treat it she relies on a medication called mexico checked. it is used to treat everything from crohn's disease to arthritis, to certain cancers. but it also can and pregnancy. and from doctors have stopped prescribing it. that some pharmacist will no longer fill the prescription for that reason. sarah beholder towards me now, along with doctor zeke emanuel. thank you both for joining me tonight. sarah let me begin with you here. because for many people hearing this they may say i know that drug, or i take that drug. why would that be the type of drug that can be taken off the shelves? and you can't have access to. tell me how you learned that

you might be limited in your ability to get it. 20 >> yes so mexit trackside is known as a category x medication. which means that it has impacts on a potential fetus. such as fetal abnormalities. many patients who are put on mexico trucks that are canceled to be on birth control as was eyewitness but on the back in 2017. so it was certainly something that was on our radars whenever the dobbs decision came out that this could be something that would be a little bit more complex to get. it is also known for being a drug that can be used to treat ectopic pregnancy. i don't know if it is used to treat and used an actual miscarriages -- and abortions. but it is certainly used an ectopic pregnancies. so that's another reason it wasn't known as potentially being impactful. >> doctor emmanuel, when you think about that, again, there is no successful ectopic

pregnancy. it can lead to death of the mother, if it is not rated. it is not going to lead to impact in the uterus, the fetus will not survive. and so, the idea is being used for that, it is more commonly use for things unrelated to pregnancy. i mean a google search may have shown them that. >> yes. you have about 6 million prescriptions of methotrexate per year. that is not about abortion that is about rheumatoid arthritis, it's about crohn's disease, our patient has psoriasis. the texas legislator did not, when they drafted their law, do any research on it. what else might methotrexate be used for besides an abortion? because the first thing you do when you do a google search is, methotrexate for rheumatoid arthritis. it is used to treat a lot of people. it is an immunosuppressant and it works very effectively for those patients and now they are

going to suffer. doctors are not going to be able to practice medicine crackling and patients are going to be in pain and suffering because of that law. >> amina sarah, because you are one of the patients who have had this described. when you want the pharmacist to get it filled what happened? >> so i, luckily, was successful and refilling our prescription last friday. but that was certainly not a given. i know of at least one other patient in virginia, which was not a state with a trigger ban. so she was denied by her doctor. she was denied her medication. there have been many other patients in states with sugar bands that have been denied it. either by the pharmacy or by their doctors. and in a lot of cases of the doctors they are afraid of laws like in texas. where they can be held liable for an abortion. with regard to pharmacies there is guidance that came out last week from the department of health and human services that says that it is legal to deny people medications. but i'm not sure of those patients who were denied that,

were actually successful in getting their medications built after that. guidance >> doctors, besides ectopic pregnancies, many of the patients we outlined today effected both men and women. are we suggesting that only men can no longer access or is it a unique brand of women who cannot access this at all because of uterus is? >> if the reason that promises are not fulfilling prescription is because the world by using methotrexate for abortion. it would be preferential giving men the drug and not giving it to win it because they are worried about it being used for an abortion. it is just not very precise law that the texas legislator, and they are inflicting pain needlessly on people because they have been taught through the consequences of taking a medication out of doctors hands and out of prescriptions. i think, not putting their patients first, doctors are being fearful. and pharmacists are may be

worried about their own prosecution to. >> that sort of belies what we're thinking about when we talk about crucial care and what it would take. and not being able to practice as you see fit. especially for the benefit of the patients. doctor zeke emanuel, sarah beholding, thank you so much. everyone, we will be right back. n to actually do that. nonow i want to say congratulations, but it's also disappointing. what do you mean? that's it? i've g got nothing left. hey if i were you, i'd try warm milk. enough out of you! hi! oh go.. is this really helping? good days start with good nights, so you may want to talk to your doctor about both. [ sleep app ] i'm still here. oh boy. new astepro allergy.

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thanks for watching everyone, i'll be back tomorrow night. don lemon tonight starts right now. hey don lemon. >> how are you doing lower codes? great show. >> i was kobe first let's name. i don't know what it is about to. it's just don lemon has a special, je ne sais quoi, as they say. oh don't up french me. you know i don't speak french. how dare you, i'm trying to sound fancy? >> from louisiana, i pretend. but people do that a lot. it's always hate on them in. very few people just commented on. so -- >> all right don. >> now you do. all right laura coats i'll see tomorrow. >> oh boy. did i get it right? shoot, never mind, by. >>