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so we have a big development tonight. secret service assistant director tony dawn arrow has left the agency, according to two sources. this coming two months after the a formal white house aide testified it ornado had told her then the president trump had told her then, president trump was irate when his security detail was wouldn't taken to the capitol on january six. when it turned to the panel here, special lottery watergate prosecutor neck nick akerman good evening to one at all. can't get my lips to work

tonight. are you guys doing. good to see you. i want to get your reaction that tony ornato was leaving the investigation for the january 6th. >> this figure is one who has been controversial within the secret service for sometime. i think his departure from the secret service comes just as the january six commission has him now in their sights. this is a moment of some transition for the secret service. just in the last couple of days, president biden has appointed a new director, director james murray is stepping down and retiring himself. so i think we are seeing a lot of questions about the role of the secret service right now. there are ties to president trump and sort of what's the loyalty of some of the agents within that agency has been and

was certainly in those hours around january six. >> nick, tony ornato is mentioned during a key part of cassidy hutchinson's testimony during january six. take a listen. >> president says something to the fact that, on the effing president, take me up to the capitol now. to which bobby responded, sir, we have to go back to the west wing. the president reached up to the front of the vehicle to grab the steering wheel. mr. engel grabbed his arm and said sir, we need to take your hand off the steering wheel. we are going back to the west wing. we are not going to the capital. mr. trump then used his free hand to lunge towards bobby engle and the stories were counted to me he motioned towards his -- >> before his testimony, ornato

met with the january six select committee behind closed doors. now that he has he is no longer with the secret service, can he be compelled to appear again? >> well, he certainly could be subpoenaed and compelled to appear again. i think the real question is whether or not he's going to cooperate and testify or assert his fifth amendment privilege against self incrimination. don't forget, the key piece that ornato really knows about is whether or not the secret service had set it up to take mike pence out of the capitol after the rioters came in. there was a request, there was a car that was in the back of the capital ready to take him away from the capital which is exactly what donald trump wanted to have happen in order to stop this vote from the electoral college to go forward. that is probably one of the most key pieces of evidence

that this individual can't provide, and the question is, once he's out on his own, is he going to get council and will council advise him to essentially assert's fifth amendment privilege. now on the other hand, he's also in a position where he can be provided with immunity, either by the committee or by the department of justice. so he could be forced to testify in, and that's where this all may end up at some point. >> ron, what about the relationship. what do you know about the relationship between ornato and trump? how much could he know? >> well look, i'm going to defer to nick's point. certainly he can know a lot and i think that to me as i was listening to this conversation -- we have been so focused on the issue of trump mishandling classified documents that the

revelations of the january six committee about the bereft of his effort to overturn the election, how much of the federal government was pulled into that from different agencies and departments. how far it's spread in other states, all of that as kind of receded into the background. but it will be back again in september with the committee. we are having this night after night debating whether trump can be indicted for his mishandling of classified documents. the original issue is is there an indictment for his broad role in trying to up and and a democratic small the election. so this is a reminder of how broad a range of legal challenges he faces and how stark a question it poses for the republican party. is there any behavior that would cause them to either, step away from him or will they

impose any constraints on him whether he was elected again? and so far the evidence appears to be no. >> we are learning tonight that the doj is prepared to give a 40-page response regarding these trump special master and taking the mar-a-lago documents. do you think he has a shot at this? >> i don't really think he has a shot at this -- >> you don't really think he has a shot? >> i don't. i know that everybody is hinging their belief on the judges initial reaction that she would appoint or might appoint a special master. but she also said at the end of her hearing that she hadn't decided to do it. -- what is the state of the surge that is been done already? the government responded today that they looked at everything at the they have segura to segregated certain documents

that could be attorney-client privilege. there's really nothing for a special master to do. the whole idea that he would be looking at executive privilege is complete nonsense. executive privilege belongs to the executive branch. it doesn't belong to trump after he leaves the office. he's lost that battle before the supreme court already. so it's kind of crazy, you have a lawyer today who filed something in that court with four individuals that he's recommending the special master because they have backgrounds in executive privilege. >> garrett, i want to play something. this is lindsey graham's comments. i want your response. >> if they try to prosecute president trump from mishandling classified information, after hillary clinton set up a server in her basement, they literally will be riots in the street. >> donald trump posted graham's

comments on social media, and then tonight graham followed up saying he rejected violence wasn't calling for violence. the thing is there's, real potential for violence especially after what we saw on january six. assist why the doj has to be so careful in all of this, but they are in a really dangerous position right now? >> yes, but also that's exactly what lindsey graham and the president trump supporters want us to think. they want this hesitation, that the idea of actually applying the law to former president trump would cause so much violence that donald trump should be allowed to escape without criminal penalty. it is an incredibly dangerous and corrosive action that they are pushing here. this is the equivalent of a mobster saying really nice country you've got here, shame if something happened to it.

i think we need to recognize that these threats of violence are not meant as a warning, they are meant as active intimidation of the normal rule of law, the normal process of the justice department here. >> that's my question to ron brownstein. what is the strategy behind graeme and trump putting out this message? is it a threat? is it in an acknowledgment that some of the presidents supporters would be inclined to define defy the rule of law and riot? why is that okay? are they essentially saying that trump supporters or republicans or whoever they're speaking to are inclined to break the law and violence? >> clearly, it is meant as a threat. for lindsey graham to pick violence without -- is essentially to invite it. we have seen in the trump area the bound boundaries between the republican coalition and far-right forces in the

society. they are anti-democratic and see violence is part of the way to advance their agenda. we've seen those boundaries erode and collapse in some cases. just think about the local public, school board officials, election officials, members of congress who voted to impeach. voted to impeach trump. all of them are now facing a drumbeat of threats of violence that were simply not part of the american experience in the past. as i have said to you before, the real group that this raises the almost pointed issue for is that roughly 20 to 25% of republicans who see all this as a dangerous direction for the country. you saw republicans reacting with umbrage when president biden said the maga movement and a specific to the maga movement was semi fascist. he should've said it was authoritarian. but the reality is that there is a part of the trump movement that is really willing to

subvert democracy that what it takes to impose their values on the rest of the country and the critical question remains, what do republicans who don't share those views do? do they continue to enable those forces and those voices or like liz cheney, do they basically say they are drawing the line and no longer supporting people who are clearly a threat to the basic democratic structure of american society? >> just a quick question. do you think the doj will take these potential threats or potential riots into consideration when filing charges? >> no, they will not take it into account. what they are going to do is act just as carefully as they have acted up until this point. they're gonna go by the facts, go by the law, it will continue the joint grand jury investigation and the facts warrant and indictment there will be an indictment. i don't see that this will

never stop this juggernaut from moving along, and directing donald trump and determining whether an indictment is warranted. >> i just have to ask acai nodding your head with what ron was saying over the fascism and semi fashion or whatever. did you want to respond? >> i think one of the things it's also important to look at here is the track record. these are, they are not warnings, they are intimidations. this movement -- >> hang on, this is beyond the presidents comments. you're talking about what lindsey graham is saying or with the president's posting? that we are? saying >> exactly, this is donald trump saying job on january six it will be wild. look, in the hours and days after the fbi search of mar-a-lago, it came out attacking the fbi. it led to one of those january six protesters attempting to

attack the fbi field office in cincinnati. they know the call and response here. this is proud boys stand back and stand by. i think we have to recognize this track record where they are directly inciting violence and that they know what these types of warnings and threats actually lead to, which is their supporters turning those threats into action. >> let's hope it doesn't come to that. thank you very much gentlemen. good to see you. the intel community doesn't know who might have viewed any the classified intel at mar-a-lago. so they have to assume everything is compromised? former national directors of intelligent james clapper's weighs in after the break.

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tonight we are learning the intelligence community has been viewing documents taken from mar-a-lago since may. these are the documents from the 15 boxes the former president handed over in january. the fbi found 184 documents with classification marking, 25 marked top secret according to the filing. this coming as the director of national intelligence notified lawmakers that her office will conduct a former formal damage assessment of the classified documents to trump's own. let's bring in the former director of national intelligence, james glop are, is it now a cnn national security analyst. thank you for joining us director. so the white house is reiterating that they had nothing to do with this assessment, it is up to the director of national intelligence. as somebody used to have that

job what can you tell us about this process? how long will it take out to find out the damage? >> well done first a couple of points i think i need to make. the first is we don't actually know the substantive content of any of these documents. we in for things based on the classification and help damaging these documents could be. now when the current dni is leading this damage assessment, the first thing i think they will have to be concerned with is kind of the chain of custody of these documents from the time he left the white house, how they were transported to mar-a-lago and where the conditions of retention's at mar-a-lago. who had access? the reason i say that is because the one determination will be who actually had access?

who saw these documents? who might have reproduced them? who might have photograph them? and then there is the potential damage. then you can render -- [inaudible] a case assumption that a sophisticated foreign intelligence service got ahold of these documents and what is it they could potentially glean. a damage assessment is a formal undertaking taking in under circumstances. now unfortunately, i've some personal experience from overseeing one that was done after edward snowden revelations, where there were thousands and thousands of highly classified documents that he purloined. we don't actually know in [inaudible] most cases how much of that actually found its way by example to the russians. was that the price of admissions for them harboring

him? so we will have a similar challenge here, but the population of documents is more fine, it is more limited than it was in the case of the damage assessment done in snowden's revelations. >> when i think i hear you saying before the snow part, is that the intelligence community may not know who have accessed assess these documents to mar-a-lago, they have to assess that everything's been compromised? >> to me yeah, you almost have to make a worst-case assumption. once these documents are out of government custody, where the government is protected and not, in the position of protecting these documents, there are areas that don't meet storage requirements for the production of highly censored i classic find information. that is the worst-case assumption that you have to make. what is the potential damage that could be done to u.s. intelligence capabilities?

that is, sources, methods, trade crowds compromised? that can get very personal in the case of human assets. we do know there were hcs, or human control system documents which by the way could of been or connery genetic control or no form. another point to be made to add to the complexity is that these caveats which are alphabet soup are not necessarily conclusive. so we can confer that if these fell into the wrong hands and sophisticated adversary intelligence service and what they might be able to glean from them. and what litigation steps need to be taken. >> you just said something that struck me because you said these documents are out of government protection. documents that need to be protected by our government or no longer being protected by the government. they are in the hands of the former president. the former president and his

allies say what's the big deal, the president as the document? but what you just said really hit home, they're out of government protection, they're no longer protected by anyone? >> that's right. and that is the challenge of rendering and damage assessment, when they're out of your control you have no real good chain of custody i bet there's no written records at mar-a-lago on who had access, potential access to these documents. who actually had them, we don't know that. perhaps an investigation will be able to determine that. but in the meantime, once they're out of custody, they are unprotected. in my view, you have to make the worst-case assumption. >> the u.s. works closely with some key allies on intelligence. how could the that impact those relationships do you think it will cower cannot? >> it could, just as it did

post snowden. first of all if allies and we have a close and makes, their confidence in their ability to keep their secrets shaky. we have many other intelligence relationships that are not as close but there could be a chilling effect on the willingness of foreign governments to share their intelligence secrets with us. >> director clapper always a pleasure thank you sir. >> thanks for having me don. >> voters turning out in support of reproductive rights since for roe v. wade was overturned. now some republicans have some who oppose abortion rights changing their tune. ♪ ♪ ♪ "shake your thang" by salt n pepa

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interview by cnn's kfile discovering arizona republican candidate blake masters has scrubbed his campaign website applied which saying the 2020 election was stolen. that is not all that is changed. also gone controversial language concerning abortion, masks is not the only republican changing the their tone now. several candidates are all turning now. they are talking about abortion with primary season showing the issue is a motivating factor for voters. here is cnn's keyon law. >> most people support common sense -- republican senate nominee blake master surrounded by his

children trying to reset the debate over abortion rights. >> i support a ban on very late term and partial birth abortions and most americans agree with that. >> just after the video dropped his campaign such stripped antiabortion language. before, masters wrote he is 100% pro-life. calling roe v. wade a horrible decision. then he listed a series of strict stances on abortion. now, a softer tote. row went from horrible to a bad decision. the words, 100% pro-life, removed from the section. that list of positions, is shorter. >> there is no getting around that abortion, in his particular rate, is a hot hot issue. for one of the swing coalitions. he has to speak to that issue. being pro-life, one hunted percent of the time, isn't going to get him there. so he has to attempt to make that debate. >> masters campaign says he remains 100% pro-life, but he is not the only one retool.

like >> in michigan seventh congressional district, challenger thom barrett fund-raiser in the republican primary as 100% pro-life. no exceptions. over the weekend, his website that listed a value section to protect life from conception, is now gone. barrett's campaign tell cnn, we regularly update the website. >> should all abortions be illegal in this country? >> in iowa's republican primary, to represent the third congressional district. >> all abortions, no exceptions. the man in the center, seconded, when the republican nomination. the incumbent democratic congresswomen, sydney axne, turned that primary debate moment into a campaign ad. >> even in the case of rape? even in the case of incest? even if a woman's life is in danger? >> lance campaign did not respond directly to cnn's request for comment on the democratic attacked. but he won in an editorial that the ad was false. he said while he opposes abortion. we must be compassionate

towards both women and unborn children. >> in minnesota's gubernatorial race republican nominee, scott johnson, said this in a radio interview before the primary. >> if a mother's life is in danger i think that would have to be a medical consideration. and in the area for potential exception. >> no exception for rape or incest. >> unless a mother's life is in danger, -- now in the general election he's calling his previous words, clumsy. if i've been unclear previously, i want to be clear now. rape and incest, along with endangering the mother's mental or physical health, are acceptable exceptions. >> it is an animating issue, particularly in very tight congressional and senate races. whether lots of college educated white women. but that is not every district in america. so, and select races, you are seeing the ships on abortion. the challenge is on some of these very hot issues.

the other campaign keeps receipts. meaning they have the website. they have the primary tv ads. >> too dangerous for arizona. >> those receipts now appearing in general election that's. democratic campaigns and groups have spent more than $15 million in ads referencing abortion since roe was overturned. sensing a chance to energize voters this november. >> pivots and politics are certainly not that unusual. whether or not it works, on wedge issue like abortion, is how convincing the candidate's. if the candidate is sincere. most importantly, whether or not voters believe it. don? >> all right, ken law, thank you very much. >> but joe the count is backing up at the abortion messages are they concerned it is going to be a losing issue for them? we will discuss next.

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oh my gosh. just ten weeks away. ten weeks. for the 2022 midterms and the postville political landscape may be changing the conventional wisdom. sources are telling cnn the republicans were recently hoping for a large majority in the house, are now adjusting their expectations. joining me now to discuss senior political correspondent, alex do it, and nationally alice. hello, hello, hello. alice, it is only early august,

republicans were so confident they were going to take everything. so they're still pretty confident that they're going to take the. house >> don't be so pessimistic. and look at a glass half full. okay? we look at it from the bright side. speaking with folks with the rnc. recent real clear politics show with regard to the republican momentum has gone up over the last two weeks. so there is a trend in the right direction. yes, favorable tea for joe biden have gone up with recent successes. yes there have been some polls that show that momentum by democrats, post roe v. wade being overturned is positive. but you have to look at other factors as well. in terms of where democrats spending their money. are they spending money. we just heard that the dccc has spent a multimillion dollar ad buy, and several, states they are concerned that they are not going to do well in places where joe biden has done

traditionary very well in the past. so, i'm not going to throw in the towel, whether or not there is a huge red wave or not. we have to do is pick up four seats and we will send nancy pelosi packing. i just call it four seats. i don't need a big red wave, a 24 seat, so we can take a run -- >> just finally 11,000 votes. what's say you? >> i think them said republicans should be really careful. then's can't get too confident right now. >> when a new day in age. anything can happen in the next ten weeks that could upset this totally. i've always thought that dems have a better shot of winning then a lot of people in politics. they thought were gonna get want overhead. now it's not happening that way. the reason why is that people are sick of washington and one thing to get done. it doesn't feel like the republican party has a party for anything. they just don't want anything

to get past. they just say no to everything. democrats are now by passing some bipartisan legislation. i think voters are excited about that. dobbs is playing a huge role in this. but it's also gun reform, gas prices are going down, democrats are meeting the needs of people. i'm not saying everything is perfect. that belied to voters. voters don't want belie to. but they aren't giving up. they are fighting for the american people. >> what is getting passed in washington right now are big spending packages. major multi billion dollars where historic inflation, they're entering a recession. republicans at least have the sense to realize we don't need to be continued to spend money. and if you look at the issues that really motivate voters. while abortion has been a top-of-the-line in the headlights. when it gets right down to. it in the next ten weeks. with drives people across middle america are the economic issues, crime, and inflation. those are what is going to motivate people. democrats are not doing well on any of those. >> and abortion.

and a democracy. >> i know that passing big spending bills but they are bills actually help people. there are bills to cap medical cast. their bills to lower the insulin. >> when you both are saying. you are talking at the issues that, you know, for a publicans. that motivate republicans. we talk about issues that moderate democrats. they should democrats as they were motivated. but now, joe biden, president biden i should say. and democrats are passing legislation that could be motivate democrats. republicans are saying, well, you know -- but it is helping a lot of people. there's a point here. to understand him saying? >> i hear what you're saying. but it is not going to pan out that way. the inflation reduction act, you ask economists across the board. this is not going to reduce inflation. when democrats are asked, house is going to reduce inflation? how this of but my bottom line

they have no answer for it. for the next ten weeks, you're going to see republicans tout how this package is nothing more than a bloated progressive spending package. it is not helping average everyday americans bottom lied. that is going to be the message moving forward. when they realize that americas people were so the bill of goods with this inflation reduction package, they're going to vote accordingly. >> when you go to middle america, when i got to visit my parents and i have to go to the pharmacy to pay for bills. the inflation reduction act is actually quite to help them. those are issues that policies that are going to help improve the quality of life. we know our health care system is out of control, it cause for the american way too much money. democrats did something to do it. i also will just say that it is not just the economic issues, people look at the issue of abortion, they want to know who's telling me the truth and who's lying to me. those supreme court justices, during their confirmation hearings, didn't just lie to the send birthday lie to the american people. now you have candidates on here

saying, i am pro-life all the way, but now scrubbing my website. they are lying to the potential voters, they are going to get called out on it. i think that is why democrats will also fare better. >> when people are skipping the website and they're saying, well, now they want to have this car about so to speak for the life of the mother and whatever. is that sign that this is a losing issue for republicans? >> keep in mind, those of us who are pro-life in those of us who have gotten advocated for roe v. wade for years. ever since roe v. wade was imposed, pro-life advocates have been fighting to overturn it. this is not a political issue. this is -- >> again, i know what you're going with that. but for the folks who are now scrubbing the websites. all of a sudden saying that they are changing their mind. this isn't something that was from their heart that they believed in. if it is an issue that is going to keep them from winning an office, then the go oh yeah i change my mind. >> exactly. again, this is not an issue about politics.

this is an issue about saving and protecting the sanctity of life. what we are seeing is many of them took too extreme of a position. i happen to believe there should be exceptions for rape,, incest and the life of the mother. but, the whole point is to protect the sanctity of life. many of those people -- why did that change? we caused him to change that? just because they're not going to be an office? >> they just want to win. it is about power. it is not about saving the life of an unborn child. it is about winning, it is about grabbing power so you can send nancy pelosi packing. they will do whatever, they will say whatever they need to to win. then when they get an office they will lie to their voters and go back and protect the statement. >> this is jim jordan. i wanted to know. gop congressman jim jordan tweeting this out today. he said, quote, in real america you work hard. you pay your bills. you provide for your family. you hear a lot of this real american rhetoric coming from republicans. they don't think someone is a

real american. unless you are saddled with debt? is that what is happening? >> i guess people rather him say in, biden america you work hard, pay after load, and joe settles you with someone else's loan. that is the reality of. it was jordan's trying to say is that what joe biden did with this student loan quote forgiveness. he took it to the backs of people, hardworking americans, the pay off the loans, now they're paying for someone else is known. most people in this country have a real problem with that. they don't like the fact that if you actually save for college and paid off, now you're paying for someone else's. that is the problem. that is the message that he was trying to get out there and a lot of people don't like that. >> i don't know who these people are. i am delighted with the people who have saved up so much money that you know you can't start college alyssa put your full payment for a whole year down. it is not like you can get a job, save up, the brothers

offices convict okay we'll let you pay later. no, that is not how it works. people have to take out loans. i am from jim jordan states. let me tell you something, i have student loan debt and i've worked very very hard. all my friends have worked very very hard. you know who else that that is also affecting? their parents. because their parents are aging, we are starting to be concerned about taking care of. them when you have that debt weighing over you, we are all working hard, nobody want to hand out but the way the loan system is set up, you can't get from under it because of the interest on it. >> where this conversation needs be continued but thank you both. i appreciate it. we'll be right back.

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attempt a lot of the artemis one moon rocket early friday afternoon. but it is still unclear if it will happen even then. today's launch was scrubbed to it's a problem with one of the rockets giant engines. here is cnn's, kristen fisher. >> mission and lift off of the spacial discovery. >> engine number 2058 has helped propel space shuttles into orbit, start with this flight back in 2006. >> the scrub of the attempt. the launch of artemis 1 >> but today this is my clothes that engine, was the primary culprit behind the scrub of the first test flight of the artemis moon rocket. >> we need the engine to be at the cryogenically cold temperature, such that when it starts it's not shocked by the cold few that flows through it. >> that's a set is too soon to determine when it will try again. but artemis mission manager mark serafin, gave a classic nafta response when addressing if the next notch opportunity on friday is still in play.

>> there is a non-zero chance will have a notch opportunity on friday. >> the artemis rocco, or sls, has been cobbled together for leftover parts from the shuttle program. the four engines on artemis 1 combined flew more than 20 shuttle missions. nasa had hoped that by recycling these old parts they'd be able to build this new rocket faster and more formidably. instead the sls rockets is six years behind schedule. and billions over budget. >> we know the shuttle parts are very finicky and expensive. social have been any surprise that putting them together differently was going to also be expensive and take longer than we hoped. still, this rocket's most powerful ever built. it is designed to return home runs to the moon by 2025. and someday go on to mars. thousands of people converged on the kennedy space center today and hopes of seeing it fly for the first time including vice president kamala

harris. >> today was a very important day and while a lot of folks might be disappointed that the law should not happen a lot of good work really happen today. >> that's administrator, bill nelson, whose own flight was scrubbed four times reminded that these kinds of delays are routine for any spaceflight. but especially a first test flight. >> this is a brand-new rocket it is not going to fly until it is ready. needless to say the complexity is daunting. when we bring it all in to the focus of a countdown. >> kristen fisher thank you so much. thank you for watching everyone. our coverage continues.

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new developments tonight in the battle over classified documents found at mar-a-lago. including a former security damage assessment getting underway right now. that's in addition to what we've just said tonight with a similar effort that began back in may on material handed over in january. at the same time, the former president, his supporters, and consequences if prosecutors pursue charges. ones adding that indictments will or might, will spark riding in the streets. john berman in for anderson and whatever you make of what some critics are calling a thinly veiled threat of political violence, you should note it becomes more republican member of the -- lindsey graham.