isn't as warm as you have to be in places like iowa to get the nomination. what i will say is that republicans just don't like party leaders who screw up midterm elections. i remember newt gingrich, the great titan and somebody who really reshaped the republican party, he was a dominant speaker. he screwed up in the 1998 midterms by getting fewer folks elected than he promised, and he was gone. i think something about this republican party, if you're the party leader and you don't have a great midterm performance, people start moving away. and i think you might actually see that happening now. i just think trump is weaker than he's ever been before, and i think tomorrow, you would expect people to rally for trump. i think you're going to see something quite different tomorrow. you're not going to see people rushing to the party. people standing back and criticizing. >> van jones, governor john kasich, i appreciate it, thank you. a programming note, cnn is going to host a town hall with mike

pence, a live studio audience. jake tapper will be asking the vice president questions starting at 9:00 p.m. eastern. we are going to reset at the top of the hour. if you're joining us, thanks very much. another hour of "ac 360." i want to go to kyung lah who's standing by in maricopa county with the latest vote count in the governor's race. what is it, kyung? >> reporter: the very latest vote count we're getting from maricopa county which is -- and i just want to point this out to people if they're just joining us. maricopa county is the largest county in the state of arizona. often you have to win in maricopa if you want to win in the state. that's why we are here. that's why the candidates pay so much attention to it. and tonight this latest batch, we did see kari lake do slightly better, but she needed to do even better according to people from within her campaign. and so what we see right now coming out of maricopa county is that katie hobbs, the democrat, remains at 51%.

kari lake is at 49%. that is very close. but then you size that up through the state, and those numbers then continue to show that katie hobbs remains in the lead. we are hearing from a source from within the kari lake campaign, someone we've been talking to for many days, who characterizes tonight a vote dump that the lake campaign had been riding on to break in their favor, that all of their math showed that they needed to win this. that source is characterizing this as, quote, a massive disappointment, that this batch they anticipated would be very republican, and it just didn't happen. they were anticipating that 66% of this batch needed to be won by kari lake, and that number is far higher -- it's a bit higher than what it actually ended up being. i'm also, anderson, getting a lot of reactions from republicans within the state.

there was quite a battle between moderate republicans, mccain republicans, who really make up the fabric, have judicially made up the fabric of republicans in this state. a long history dating from john mccain all the way to barry goldwater, and they are reacting. one person who i want to quote -- who worked for blake masters during the primary said he hopes kari lake will, quote, graciously concede. and he says that the lesson of this election tells us one thing. this lesson tells us one thing. following trump over the cliff will not win elections. and then i was just talking about that battle between the mccain republicans and the trump republicans, a fierce battle we've seen over a couple of different cycles. one of the republicans in this state said that kari lake told a legion of john mccain supporters across arizona that they could go to hell. tonight they returned the favor. so, this sort of angst, what we

see is that republicans, those mccain republicans, they ended up fundraising for katie hobbs. we talked to a number of them, many on camera, who said that they simply couldn't stomach the trump republicans, that what they wanted was what mccain represented, decency, honesty, and conservative values, which they feel is the real fabric of arizona. and that they did not feel that a future with kari lake would deliver that. anderson? >> i want to check in with john king at the magic wall. john, what else can you tell us about these latest ballots from arizona? >> just that the math is getting near impossible for kari lake. let's walk through it, anderson. here's where we are and here's the challenge for kari lake. we are running out of available votes. the pool of votes has now shrunk almost to the point of where katie hobbs' lead is. katie hobbs is 50.4 to 49.6%.

that is a very, very, very close race. here's the challenge. kari lake needed to get 60% or more of the new votes in maricopa county. these are the new votes that came in the last hour. yes, finally she got more votes than katie hobbs in the vote installment. there were five previous vote installment that came in today from arizona. kari lake was on the bottom of all of them. finally she comes out on top in this new installment in maricopa county. that's 57%. that's a big number, but not when you need 60% or more. that was the challenge. that's why kyung lah is saying from her sources inside the lake warroom, they knew this was disapoingt. you think 57% in a county -- let me bring up the county where katie hobbs has led throughout the race. it's the blue county. so, you see these numbers, kari lake ub sho encouraged, except it is so late in the race. and the universe of available votes is so small.

this was the biggest pool left of available votes. she needed 66%. she got 70%. now she's losing maricopa county. she's losing state-wide. and the challenge is and the pressure on her tonight is to acknowledge the math and bow out gracefully. we also know she surrounds herself with trump lawyers, trump acolytes, steve bannon, and others. this is going to be fascinating to watch. they can do the math if they want. the number of outstanding votes is not terribly much higher than 20,481, the katie hobbs lead. so, what we've seen so far and consistently over the last six days, can you expect kari lake to get 70% or 80% or maybe more of that of the remaining vote? that's pretty unrealistic. >> john, stand by. with us is ally bone, arizona assistant secretary of state. appreciate you joining us. after tonight's drop, how many total votes are left in arizona? >> good evening. it looks like we have about

60,000 ballots left state-wide, with 20,000 both in maricopa and pima county. and -- county has a chunk left, and apache county. but for the most part we're looking at very few ballots still outstanding. >> o 60,000, you said. >> that's right. >> and do you believe the arizona governor's race will go to a recount? >> so, the recount statute right now says if the margin is within .5%. right now secretary hobbs is outside of that recount margin. so, it's as long as the vote totals continue to come in around what they have been, we are likely to see that. but if we see anything different, a change, then it would be within the recount margin. we're tracking a couple races right now, state legislative races, as well as other state races that are within the recount margin, like the attorney general's race and the superintendent of public instruction. >> kari lake just tonight has raised questions on fox about

katie hobbs, secretary of state, overseeing the elections, essentially counting all the votes. is katie hobbs there counting all the votes? is she the one determining the count? >> no. anderson, no. in arizona, the elections are highly decentralized, and the counties are responsible for administering the elections and tabulating the votes. so, secretary hobbs has not been involved in that tabulation process. our office doesn't touch ballots at all after the logic and accuracy testing. once early voting starts, our office is out of any administration and it's the counties that do that work. so, there has been no reason that the secretary would have to recuse herself for any reason at this point. there isn't necessarily a conflict of interest that has presented itself that is causing us to have any concern about that. >> "the washington post" reported kari lake set up a warroom to plan out her next move if the results of the election don't go her way. if a candidate contests the results, can you walk us through

the process in which arizona verifies its count? >> it will start with the counties will do a certification or canvass of the election. they have 20 days after the election to perform that canvass. and then those results will come to the state. and then that is signed off on at the state canvass by the secretary but also has to be signed off by the governor, the attorney general, and the chief justice of the arizona supreme court. so, it is a process that, you know, gets reviewed by each county board of supervisors, as well as the top officers in the state. >> john king, i know, has a question for you. john? >> madam secretary, i want to follow up with a point anderson made because i suspect this is going to come up in the days ahead. kari lake was on fox earlier saying that katie hobbs was going to certify her own election. i want in very plain language, the counties report the votes. is there any certification in your office? if so, will she have anything to do with it? or does it go to the governor? >> so, the certification -- all

15 counties will report their results to the state, to the secretary of state's office. and the secretary compiles all of those results or the secretary's office will compile those results and put together the state-wide canvass. the secretary does sign off on that. but it is also going to be signed off on my governor ducey, attorney general mark bern vich, and the arizona chief justice of the supreme court. it's not secretary hobbs is doing this on her own. this is how it operates every four years in every state across the country where the secretary of state is on the ballot and they're certifying their election win or election loss. this is nothing new. again, the administration of the election itself occurs at the county level. >> so, if you can, help me with the conversation. you could make an argument in today's politics, given all the -- i get it -- no facts behind them questions raised about election integrity, wouldn't it be best for katie hobbs to just recuse herself,

say because of those questions, i'm not going to be in the room. my good deputy is going to sign these for me. that's one argument. the other argument is no, they're wrong, they've been lying for years. i'm going to do my job and sign it. which one? >> again, if there is no reason that there is any kind of conflict or we aren't in recount territory, there doesn't make any sense for the secretary to not perform what is a mi ministerial act in signing the canvass. our position has been unless there is a conflict related to the governor's race, there's no reason for the secretary to recuse herself. and you all know -- you've seen me here the last five days. i've been talking to you. we have not had the secretary talking about anything related to the processing of this election. and, again, the counties are handling the administration of the election at the local level. >> i appreciate your time tonight. thank you very much. we're going to continue to follow the count and the gov noer's race throughout the hour. also tonight, how the former president shaped the midterms.

harry hill ha ha harry enten is going to break it down for us. what the acting police chief in uvalde, texas, failed to after he was directly told the children were trapped with the gunman and needed rescue. . soci. ♪ shop legendary deals at amamazon. when moderate to severe ulcerative colitis persists... put it in check with rinvoq, a once-daily pill. when uc got unpredictable,... i got rapid sympto relief with rinvoq. chk. when uc he me back... i got lasting, steroid-free remission with rinvoq. check. and when uc got the upper hand... rinvoq helped visibly repair the colon lining. check. rapid symptom relief. lasting, steroid-free remission. and a chance to visibly repair the colon lining. check. check. and check. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots,

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with nelson, a volunteer who puts care into everything he does. it's a deodorant that really protects my skin. it's comfortable and lasts a long time. dove men. goes on dry. clean feel all day. we have a cnn projection to bring you. and cnn can now project the winner in the arizona governor's race is democrat katie hobbs, defeating republican kari lake. i want to go right to our panel, david axelrod, scott jennings. audi, what's your reaction to this? >> this is a great example of a race where abortion inadvertently came into play. in september a federal judge residenc resurrected a ban from the 1860s that would have banned abortions across the board and hobbs really jumped on it and talked

about her own miscarriage, et cetera. she took a lot of criticism for being lackluster, for not kind of punching back against kari lake and for not speaking about the economy. but she did focus a lot on this election denial of democracy and did talk about abortion in ways that may have connected with voters. and i think it sort of fits into some of the story line we've been hearing. >> i want to play some of the things kari lake has been saying throughout the campaign and get your reaction. >> it is not impossible to protect our kids at school. they act like it is. nancy pelosi, well, she's got protection when she's in -- apparently her house doesn't have a lot of protection. >> thank god your ratings are in the toilet. that's exactly where they deserve to be. start being journalists. stop spreading the garbage. i'm going to be your worst freaking nightmare for eight years. these bastards back there don't want us talking about stolen

elections. well, it doesn't matter. we have november 3, 2020. that was called incompetency 101. they've got to fix this problem. this is incompetency. that is absolutely absurd. are you guys buying that? are you really buying that? this sounds like a jessie smollett part 2. i don't know where her campaign office is. i'm assuming it's in a basement somewhere. i'm going to win the election and i will accept that result. the people of arizona will not support and vote for a coward like katie hobbs. >> david, of all the sort of trumpian or trump acolytes, she was sort of the apex predator of all of them. what do you -- her loss, what is the impact of that? what does it say about trumpism? >> well, i think it says a lot. you know, steve bannon was camping out in arizona and holding her up as an exemplar of trumpism. you know, she really is a more

sort of polished performer. but speaking from the same script. and she thought that would get her to where she wanted to go. it was enough to win a primary. but she's alienated the middle in that state, and they walked away from her. and i think it's much -- you know, as i said earlier, it's a -- she is the most flamboyant example of the election deniers, of the trump acolytes. they've been beaten all over the country, and tonight this is -- this is the exclamation point on it. and you know, i think there's a lot of interest in this race because she's been so flamboyant. but there's no gauze lens that can change the numbers that the voters of arizona have rendered in this race. >> what effect do you think this governor's race and others like it are going to have on gop primaries going forward. >> well, i think the republicans

need to ask themselves wh, what the purpose of a political party. late in the campaign, kari lake had an event and she asked, is anyone here a john mccain republican, and a few people raised their hands. and as the story goes, she told them to get out of her event. i've never seen a group of people who think the purpose of the party is to make it smaller. arizona has a heavy dose of independent voters. they've voted republican in the past. they love their current governor, doug ducey, for instance. when you're trying to make your party smaller, make yourself feel better, but not thinking of the electoral implications of that, it's a problem. but you had a number of candidates who think it's a badge of honor to try to shrink the republican party. you need bush, mccain, romney, trump, mcconnell, whatever. you need all the kinds of flavors of republicanism together. because when you start to eject people, it makes it really hard to win in states that are

purple, like arizona and others, pennsylvania, georgia, you name it. >> i want to go back to john king at the magic wall. how did hobbs win. kari lake said, was she even out campaigning? she certainly wasn't walking around with a constant incredible lighting and microphone on her at all times trying to create drama. how did she get it? >> i think your guests have made the point. i'll go through the numbers in arizona and give national perspective. whether it's trumpism, whether it's election denial, abortion restrictions wlrks it's something else, a lot of voters just decided, we don't want that spicy. we will take normal. we will take maybe a little bit more dull. katie hobbs won by 20,481 votes. that's not a final number. we still need to figure that out. but she will be the next governor of arizona, a democratic governor of arizona, replacing yet another republican governor. she won again, 20,000 votes. that's not a lot. that's twice what joe biden won

arizona by two years ago. this is a purple state, but it's a state in transz igs. she's going to win with 20,400 votes. senator mark kelly just one re-election by 126,000 votes. senator sinema is on the ballot in two years. we will watch the struggle for arizona continue, anderson, as this plays out. it is a state now that democrats have just won the presidential election, they won the governorship, took it away. that's a pickup this time, kept their senate seat. so, democrats are happy in arizona. plus they won secretary of state, a huge race in arizona. that's arizona. let's pull up nationally. i just want to show you something. republican governor who did not run for re-election replaced by a democrat, where they nominated a trump-backed candidate. massachusetts, a republican governor replaced by a democrat, replaced with a nominated trump-backed candidate. replaced by a democrat in a state they nominated a trump-backed candidate. on top of that, democrats keep michigan, win pennsylvania, pick

up arizona. the democrats had a good year when it comes to governors' races, especially in the battleground states, especially against trump-backed nominees heading into 2024. they did well down ballot in many of these states, including michigan. when you look at a state level, democrats are quite happy, including tonight in arizona. >> fascinating. incredible race. john king, thanks so much. thanks to our panel. audi, thanks for being with us. in the midterms and a look ahead to tomorrow, when he's expected to announce a presidential run. easy-to-use tools, and paper r trading to help sharpen your skills, you cacan stay on top of the market from wherever you are. hi! need new glasses? get more from your benefits at visionworks! how can you see me squinting? i can't! i'm just telling everyone! hey! use your vion benefits before they expire. sionworks. see the difference.

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kari lake down in defeat in arizona's governor race. the former president could dominate headlines tomorrow. he is expected to announce he's running for president again, as republicans wait for that shoe to drop, some in the party appear to be edging away from him. josh hawley, for one, who raised a fist in solidarity with a crowded january 6th. here's what he said today. >> i think this election was the funeral for the republican party as we know it. the republican party as we have known it is dead. and voters have made that clear. i like a lot of what president trump did as president, but we need to have a conversation about our core convictions as a party. and this party is going to have to be different. we're not going to be a majority party in this country. >> also today, charlie baker,

the republican governor of massachusetts, told jake tapper the former president hurt the party this year. the question is how much. for that, we turn to harry enten. what do the midterms reveal about the former president? >> that his political brand is poison. you look, his favorable rating in the exit poll was under 40%. donald trump was neither a popular fig you are in 2018 or 2020, but he was never this unpopular. keep in mind, joe biden's approval rating was just in the mid 40s. but the fact is those voters who had an unfavorable view or not a favorable view basically split their tickets evenly between the democratic and republican congress. you should be voting against that party but because trump was out there, these voters split their ticket. >> you're yelling at me. >> i'm just really excited. >> i know. how did swing state candidates that attach themselves to trump and election denial, how did they do? >> we saw the projection that

kari lake lost. all the election deniers who were running in the states that biden won less than 5 points, we have projected all of them to lose. election denialism doesn't work, and it didn't work last tuesday. and that was why republicans did worse than a lot of us expected. >> does this open the door for ron desantis on a national level? >> i believe it does. just in the state of florida where those two candidates, desantis and trump, are equally well known. if you ask republican voters whether or not these two guys should run, more republicans say ron desantis should run than donald trump. i think once republican voters get to know ron desantis nationwide better, it could make for a interesting race. >> what did work for republicans who got elected or recollected. >> issues, talking about issues like crime, immigration, inflation, foreign policy. republicans lead on all of that. it was just the personality of trump combined with the abortion decision took away from a very strong midterm for republicans. they should be talking about the

issues that are strong for them, not talking about the 2020 election and talking about donald trump. >> it's going to be hard to tomorrow. >> it's going to be hard for tomorrow, but this is why we have primaries. it should be very interesting to see what happens. republicans are going to have an interesting choice ahead of them. >> previous administration, also cnn senior political analyst and usa today columnist, kristen powers. a lot over the last few years, is it time for the republican party to move on from him? >> i think it's clear folks are coalescing behind candidates at this point. i think it's time we move on as a party. he hand picked mehmet oz in pennsylvania. mehmet oz got stoked by john fetterman by all historical figures in terms of what a landslide election looks like in pennsylvania. and his endorsed candidate, doug mastriano, lost by double digit points. you can't have those kinds of results. and i think those results lie right at the feet of donald

trump. >> kirsten, the former president continues to complain that the 2020 election was stolen from him, which it was not. we've now seen that is not a winning message with independent voters. i mean, i know he's not capable of actually changing that message. given what we saw now with kari lake in arizona, who was, you know, just a glossier version of him with better make-up and lighting, is election denying, is any election denying candidate going to lose their election? >> it seems to be something that most voters are not buying. but, you know, donald trump, i think, is mostly -- if i'm going to guess what shhe's thinking, he's probably thinking, i wasn't on the ballot. they just couldn't do it, but i could do it. i think that's how he thinks about things. because he has a history of bringing the republican party to heel. you know, after the january 6th attack on the capitol, you had people coming out and decrying

him. and then of course he brought them to heel. he probably thinks he's going to be able to do that again. but i think what he may be mising -- but i also will just say i don't know what's going to happen because i think a lot of people need to wait and see what's going to happen with the base voters. but, you know, i think he's looking to see whether or not he can create chaos and bring these people back into the fold. and even if he doesn't, he's shown that he doesn't care about the republican party. and the republican party, if they leave him, will be leaving him because he's not giving them the wins that they want. and i think that that's what we've seen. we've seen they'll put up with almost anything except losing. >> jim, how is this different than the days after january 6? you know, january 6, that night, you know, mccarthy, lindsey graham, were saying, you know, he was quitting donald trump. then he gets yelled at in the airport the next day by a mob, and suddenly he's down at mar-a-lago again.

how is this any different? >> because i think you're seeing the electorate start to shift. the electorate, his base, didn't shift after january 6th. hard to believe, but it didn't shift after january 6th. and you're starting to see now the electorate start to shift. and you're going to see guys like desantis and pence and others start, you know, nikki haley, start gaining some momentum. chris christie gaining momentum here and kind of taking the spotlight away from trump. and you're going to see the numbers start to coalesce behind them. you've seen it with desantis. his numbers are tremendous in those early states. we saw polling come out today that had him far ahead of trump compared to where they were in august. >> kyrsten, i want to play you what former vice president said. >> are you considering running for 2024? >> we're giving it consideration in my house, powerful

consideration. >> do you believe you can beat donald trump? >> that would be for others to say, and it would be for us to decide whether or not we want to test that. >> jim talked about nikki haley. he talked about desantis, and others. do you think mike pence could unite the republican party behind him? all of these are pretty regular candidates who play, have a sense of decency and a sense of where the guardrails may be. i don't know that they've ever been against somebody like the former president, who's clearly not wanting to leave the ring. >> yeah, i mean, we saw what happened last time, right? a lot of people came in, a lot of people who were pretty popular before they got into the race, the jeb bushes and the marco rubios. they came out bruised and battered and in a much worse place. the question is, you know, does donald trump still have that kind of power? do people still want to hear that from him? i think the other thing is there is a ron desantis now. there wasn't a ron desantis. i don't really see mike pence as the alternative, at least to

these core trump voters, the maga voters. ron desantis has more of the trump vibe, right? that's -- and that's what they're really looking for. they're looking at that more than they're looking at policies. they're looking for somebody who -- if you really look at what they say, they say donald trump fights for them and donald trump pushes back against the liberal establishment, you know, and the elites, and that's what we want. we want somebody who's willing to get down and dirty and nasty, and that's what ron desantis does. coming up, never before heard audio from the day of the mass shooting from uvalde, texas, that we warn you now may be unsettling. but it's stunning to hear, combined with other video from that day presents a portrait of the actions and lack of actions the acting police chief of uvalde, after he learned of the 911 call from a 10-year-old trapped in the classroom with the shooter.

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we have new audio we want to share with you tonight that shines light on the actions of the individual acting as chief of police in uvalde, texas, and what he did about a 10-year-old child calling trapped with the shooter. we will warn you it is hard to watch and may be upsetting. that's why before we went to on air, we invited families of

children who were injured or killed that day on a conference call. parents were briefed on the story. families have supported the release of audio and video because they say it is the only way they are learning any information. same goes for local and city officials who say they haven't been able to access it any way. shimon prokupecz has the story. what you're about to see is difficult to watch. >> so, how many are still alive? >> 18 are still alive. >> reporter: new audio or a recorded phone conversation shows the acting uvalde police chief was directly told that children were trapped with the gunman and needed rescue. >> subject with an ar. >> reporter: and still he failed to take direct ax to save them. cnn has pieced together multiple body cameras and new security footage from inside the school hallway along with this never

before heard phone call to show how a failure of leadership allowed 77 minutes to tick by before police killed the gunman. acting uvalde police chief mariano par gas was one of the first police officers to enter robb elementary may 24th. the chief of uvalde police was on vacation, which left pargas in charge of city police. he arrives just three minutes after the gunman fires his first shots. his officers run in ahead of him and make an initial attempt to breach the classroom. they quickly retreat when shots are fired in their direction. cnn has chosen to mute the sound of those gunshots. >> am i bleeding? am i bleeding? >> reporter: minutes later, uvalde school district police officer, ruben ruiz, whose wife is a teacher at robb elementary, delivers critical information to pargas. the shooter is located inside his wife's classroom.

>> pargas, who was suspended by the city of uvalde in july and placed on paid leave while they investigate his role as a commanding officer during the shooting, is walking in and out of the hallway taking cover next to a wall, failing to organize a response. even when ruben ruiz barrels back into the hallway, telling his colleagues that his wife, eva morales, called him from inside the room and says she's dying. >> hey, hey, hey, hey, ruben, ruben. >> she says she's shot. >> reporter: it's pargas, the acting chief, who comes and removes ruiz from the hallway. as time goes by, the police on the scene can be heard looking to pargas, asking him for direction. they want to know what the plan is. pargas tells them he's waiting on the texas department of public safety. >> are we just waiting for more tech or what's going on?

>> reporter: at 12:10 p.m., nearly 30 minutes after police first arrived, 10-year-old chloe torrez, a fourth grader trapped inside the room with the gunman, is on the phone with a 911 dispatcher. >> i'm in the classroom 112. 112, yes, ma'am. >> what's your name. >> chloe torrez. please help me. there's a lot of dead bodies. >> cnn obtained that call and published it with the approval of her parents. par gas said other police on scene are immediately informed. >> she is in the room full of victims. >> one of the victims, a child called 911. the room is full of victims. child 911 call. >> pargas, who didn't have a

radio with him, takes one from a detective and enters the hallway. he tells the men inside -- >> a child just called. they have victims in there. >> reporter: but then pargas steps back. he places a phone call directly to the uvalde dispatcher. cnn has obtained this call. >> okay. in the call from one of the students, what did they say? >> chloe, she is in 112. she's with eight or nine students. >> how many are still alive? >> she's not too sure how many are. >> okay. thank you. >> the recorded phone call proves for the first time that a senior officer at the scene was directly made aware of the

horrors happening inside the classroom. pargas walks back in the hallway one more time. a few seconds later, the acting police chief turns his back and walks out. in the doorway, pargas can be seen talking to the texas ranger, who, as cnn has previously reported, is currently suspended and under investigation for failing to organize a response that day. but pargas doesn't appear to tell him about the 911 information he received. cnn has learned from sources familiar with the investigation that a number of law enforcement officials on scene, including high-ranking officers with the texas department of public safety, say they did not know about the 911 call. a few minutes later, at 12:20 p.m., pargas can be seen walking away from the school, away from the hallway where dozens of officers from several law enforcement agencies remained,

debates, at times confused and seemingly uncertain about what to do. they wouldn't breach the classroom for another 30 minutes. cnn analysis of a new never before made public angle of the hallway security camera shows that pargas never steps foot back inside this hallway. in interviews with investigators obtained by cnn, pargas says he didn't believe he was in charge and officers from the uvalde city police were there only to assist the school police until the texas department of public safety took over. the texas department of public safety, which placed seven of its officers who were at the scene under further investigation, labelled uvalde school police chief pete arradondo as the on-scene commander. arradondo, who was fired in august, maintains he wasn't in charge either. cnn reached pargas by phone. he said, quote, he would love to defend himself, but he's been

told not to speak to the media. adding, quote, it's not that we're afraid because there's nothing to be afraid of. we did what we could, but the thing is that we've been told that we can't. in interviews with texas rangers, he was asked why officers didn't force their way into the classroom sooner, as active shooter training clearly indicates. >> the room was extremely dark, and we didn't know where he was or is kids were standing, they were by him or not knowing what was behind the door. >> pargas didn't tell the investigators about his direct call with the dispatcher and claimed he didn't remember hearing radio traffic about the 911 calls. >> we had heard all those shots. we know there were kids in there. there were kids alive. there were kids -- we have no idea. >> but pargas did know. he knew ruben ruiz's wife called and said she was inside dying. and he knew a child called 911 and said she was in room 112

surrounded by victims. as the acting uvalde police chief mariano pargas was a commanding officer on scene and could have done something about it. >> shimon prokupecz joins us now. shimon, this is so stunning. i mean, this is such incredible work you've done. you spoke with the families about what you found. i can't imagine what their feelings are. >> i mean, you know, it's just, anderson, in all honesty, it's just disappointment after disappointment for them because they feel, again, they're not getting this full account of what's happening. and certainly they're very thankful to us for bringing this information to them. it's one of the hardest things to do in this story, really, besides trying to get all this information. but reaching out to these family members, every time we do this story and having to provide this information to them. and there's always the silence on the phone from them. then it takes a little while and they start to ask questions.

and in some cases they don't know what to ask because no one's been telling them anything. what's also happening is in week, anderson, many of the family members of the children who died are going to be meeting with the district attorney to talk about the autopsy reports. it's going to be a rough week for these family members. next week marks the six-month period since this happened on thanksgiving day. so, we're looking at two weeks of just really tough moments for these families, which, you know -- >> the fact that you were the one having to call these families to give them information that the police should be giving them, i mean, there should be -- these families deserve to know everything. and the fact that we're finding it -- you're finding it out. you and your team are finding it out, is incredible. but the fact that these families are not being informed is just -- it's outrageous. what is this guy pargas' status

with the police department? is he still being paid? >> he's still being paid. he's on administrative leave. he was suspended of administrative leave back in july. he's still getting paid. i've been talking to city officials here in uvalde, and they want him gone. they want him fired. so, that process is going to take some time. there are certainly individuals inside the city that want him fired. he's also an elected official, as a city commissioner. he was elected just last week back to that position. we'll see what happens with that. but certainly the family members, after having this information, they feel it's time for him to go, anderson. >> shimon prokupecz, thank you so much for the work you're doing. keep at it. we'll be right back. >> thanks anderson. w, even when you're not wororkin. a plan that includes alall your accounts so you can enjnjoy whatever comes next. that's the planning effect.. from fidelity. hold on... you're a night manager and mom. and the bill payer, baker, annightlight maker?

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good evening everyone, laura coates. this is cnn tonight. our breaking news, cnn protecting democrat, katie hobbs, will win arizona's race. defeating republican, carry. like one of the most prominent the fenders of